So, what is happening at Soi Twilight?

[paborn]

Rumours and innuendo are what we do here. Once hard and fast facts stick their unwelcome nose in we all soon lose interest.

True, but his comment is, also, true.

[paborn]

I assure you that speaking as a tourist things in some places in Thailand are gettting really pricey for us too ! Indeed I can spend twice as long and spend half as much and get laid three times more in other places in SE asia than I do in Thailand now and that ( for me anyway) is and was a fact. I still go to Thailand for old time sake and yes still many cute guys about etc, but you are correct pricing in some venues now is getting prohibitive - and not because I can't afford it, just that I'm conciously choosing NOT to pay "any price they think of" to enjoy their establishments any longer. I think the last go go bar I walked out of in Soi twlight two weeks ago quoted me 500 or 550 baht for entry - before I bought a beer ! - screw that - show or not - and I told them so as I turned around and left without entering. They told me they could charge that as the Chinese DID pay it, I told them to look inside the bar, the place was empty at 10.30pm on a Friday night ! That should tell them all they need to know. But Thai logic at platy of course, no customers, put prices up to pay bar ! Good luck with that.

I used to say that even the most costly off in Bangkok could not compare with Europe and America ( rent boys ) ; but as age brings less urgency and the rising cost of air and hotel stays tourists are paying a great deal for the "cheap" sex.

Nirish - how about a report as to where you are better served? I have been searching the boards and find no good or compelling information about other places.

[Nirish guy]

...........the business was combating all the rumours and innuendo which are disasterous for any business..

Perhaps the businesses should inform their own staff of the party line they wish given out then to kill and rumours as I know I talked to several different bar guys in the Soi and got (roughly) the same answers from them all about moves and timelines for same ( all said at least a year away) - I actually doubt whether they even know any more than the rest of us as I'm guessing they too are working from the same rumour mill, but if the bars want a consistent party line put out then their own serving staff might be a good place to start perhaps.

[Nirish guy]

I used to say that even the most costly off in Bangkok could not compare with Europe and America ( rent boys ) ; but as age brings less urgency and the rising cost of air and hotel stays tourists are paying a great deal for the "cheap" sex.

Nirish - how about a report as to where you are better served? I have been searching the boards and find no good or compelling information about other places.

A) You're spot on re the "cheap" sex thing there - as once you get home and add up the bills a "cheap" holiday thailand aint anymore !

B) I purposefully don't / didn't bother with any formal trip reports anymore for a variety of reasons as I found you're damned if you do and damned if you dont. Also I'm aware that my BF (who is FULLY aware of who and what I am) also reads the Board sometimes for fun too ( with my full knowledge as he sits beside me when doing so as he reads in amazement - and disgust - some of the stuff farang write here) I feel it's better perhaps not to give too literal a running commentary on my (busy) pastimes in other Countries.

But in answer to your question, quite simply, one word - BALI. This trip I was also travelling with a friend who also has plently of experience right across Asia and he also concurs with me - and this is and was all for FREE I should add - for both of us so it;s not just either "me" or a one off thing it seems!. However as I said I've no wish to get into much more detail that that and risk having to listen to others posters opinions on my life and choices here so I'll leave that at that - suffice to say though that while they're busy commenting I'm just busy quietly gettting on with it - at a pace !

[paborn]

Interesting. Somehow, I never think of Bali as part of SE Asia. I believe that Bali has the highest Hindu population in Indonesia, still I have a fear of gay activities in a Muslim country. I hasten to add that I'm not a Islamaphobe; it is the horror stories coming from areas where a fundamentalist- even a local govenor - gains power and starts a reign of terror.

[arsenal]

Paborn wrote.
"the rising cost of air and hotel stays tourists are paying a great deal for the "cheap" sex."

Both air fares and hotels are considerably cheaper (in.real terms) than they were 20 years ago and you can still get sex in Thailand for 1000 baht if you use the apps. Not to mention a really nice three course dinner for the price of a large bucket of cinema popcorn in New York or London. It's really only the go go bars where prices have gone up and even then I don't find 260 baht for a beer (X-Boys) particularly excessive considering they have a show and don't charge an entrance fee. A motorbike still only costs 150 baht a day, plenty of 3 star hotels for 1000 baht per night or less.

As for the Chinese well assuming they follow the European model what you'll get is package tourists first (check) then normal independent travellers (more and more) and then ex-pats owning businesses (beginning) so there is the possibility that a new tranche of foreigners will rejuvenate the gay scene in Pattaya.

[Oliver2]

I've been to Bali on four occasions, twice in late 1990s on my own and twice in recent years with P. I've stayed each time in Seminyak, apparently the centre of gay life. And "Seminyak, you ain't no Pattaya", though it has its positives. There is no equivalent to the go-go/offing scene with only a handful of gay bars available, nor are there host bars open from 1700 while the apps we explored out of curiosity didn't come close to offering the numbers of guys that Thailand's do.
Don't misunderstand me; I love Bali as a destination with P, even if the clogged-roads are a major problem if you wish to explore. Nor am I saying that there is no gay commercial sex available. It's just that the ease and comfort of participating in Thailand sets it apart.
By the way, hotels are cheaper in Thailand in each category from cheap to luxury. I cannot comment on the ease of entertaining visitors but the massage joints we tried (twice) were nowhere near the standard of Pattaya's either in terms of facilities, nor of available masseurs....but they were cheaper.
Despite all this, Bali is a remarkable destination and I recommend it. A boyfriend helps!

[arsenal]

Oliver wrote.
"Despite all this, Bali is a remarkable destination and I recommend it. A boyfriend helps!"

Do you mean by taking him with you or leaving.him at home? I believe both are practiced.

[paborn]

Paborn wrote.
"the rising cost of air and hotel stays tourists are paying a great deal for the "cheap" sex."

Both air fares and hotels are considerably cheaper (in.real terms) than they were 20 years ago and you can still get sex in Thailand for 1000 baht if you use the apps. Not to mention a really nice three course dinner for the price of a large bucket of cinema popcorn in New York or London. It's really only the go go bars where prices have gone up and even then I don't find 260 baht for a beer (X-Boys) particularly excessive considering they have a show and don't charge an entrance fee. A motorbike still only costs 150 baht a day, plenty of 3 star hotels for 1000 baht per night or less.

As for the Chinese well assuming they follow the European model what you'll get is package tourists first (check) then normal independent travellers (more and more) and then ex-pats owning businesses (beginning) so there is the possibility that a new tranche of foreigners will rejuvenate the gay scene in Pattaya.

The Chinese influx is, I suspect, what is keeping the bars alive and I'm grateful.

Of course, your right. in " real terms" But wages are stagnant in much of the developed world and retired people ( a good portion of the Pattaya visitors) are living off their savings. I live well, want for nothing and , while not wealthy, I can afford the trip. Yet, I use "rising" probably too losely as I meant that the airfare and hotels are set against a fixed or lower income than before.

I paid $1,500 USD for my emirates ticket and this is roughly the same amount I have paid for a decade. Trouble is a decade ago my income was rising, bonuses could be earned and I did not have to consider that I was selling capital to draw for my needs.

[Nirish guy]

...... "Seminyak, you ain't no Pattaya", though it has its positives. There is no equivalent to the go-go/offing scene with only a handful of gay bars available,!

Oliver it's weird as everything you've said is 100% correct and I've no doubt that that was your experience. Alternatively I can safely say that I'd a blast in the two main bars ( as you say not a patch on Patts but I found the fun was way more), likewise I found no need for the usual bar pick up routine as to be frank there was no shortage of willing victims either in the bars or online, but I guess if one decided not to use those avenues or the beach to pick up then I could see how it might appear that there's less action easily available there, but I can assure all that that most certainly is not the case.

Aside from that I agree with you too that Bali in general is a lovely place and has a lovely vibe - in my case though bringing a / my BF is the LAST thing I might want to do there perhaps !