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Thread: The Brink of War?

  1. #2261
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    Re: The Brink of War?

    Quote Originally Posted by Moses View Post
    And how many of them were Russian Secretary-General of the National Security Council or President's senior adviser just 30 years ago????
    Obviously you do not understand the difference between being sent somewhere by your father, on the one hand, and volunteering to do something (note the word "volunteer" in the extract above) on the other. Perhaps logic and rational thinking are not taught in Russian educational systems?

    His brother, Chiang Ching-kuo, studied in Moscow. After his father, CKS, purged leftist elements from the Kuomintang in response to the rise of the Communist party, the USSR imprisoned Ching-kuo. For more than 10 years, Ching-kuo remained in Moscow. During this time, Chiang Kai-shek refused to negotiate a prisoner swap. He firmly believed that compromising China’s future was not worth his son’s life. In 1937, Ching-kuo returned to China with a Belarusian wife. With both sons at home, Chiang Kai-shek decided to send Wei-kuo to receive a military education in Germany. Later, CKS ordered Chiang Wei-kuo to travel to the United States for further military training. Chiang Ching-kuo didn't decided himself to go to either Germany or the USA, but went where his father sent him - in accordance with the Confucian concept of filial piety I noted earler.

    The fact that he became Secretary-General of the National Security Council or President's senior adviser later was because he was his father's son at a time when the KMT controlled Taiwan under martial law. His brother, Chiang Ching-kuo was the ROC President who ended martial law - after having the experience of being imprisoned in the Soviet Union because of what his father had done.

  2. #2262
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    Re: The Brink of War?

    Quote Originally Posted by Dragonman View Post
    Obviously you do not understand the difference between being sent somewhere by your father, on the one hand, and volunteering to do something (note the word "volunteer" in the extract above) on the other. Perhaps logic and rational thinking are not taught in Russian educational systems?

    His brother, Chiang Ching-kuo, studied in Moscow. After his father, CKS, purged leftist elements from the Kuomintang in response to the rise of the Communist party, the USSR imprisoned Ching-kuo. For more than 10 years, Ching-kuo remained in Moscow. During this time, Chiang Kai-shek refused to negotiate a prisoner swap. He firmly believed that compromising China’s future was not worth his son’s life. In 1937, Ching-kuo returned to China with a Belarusian wife. With both sons at home, Chiang Kai-shek decided to send Wei-kuo to receive a military education in Germany. Later, CKS ordered Chiang Wei-kuo to travel to the United States for further military training. Chiang Ching-kuo didn't decided himself to go to either Germany or the USA, but went where his father sent him - in accordance with the Confucian concept of filial piety I noted earler.

    The fact that he became Secretary-General of the National Security Council or President's senior adviser later was because he was his father's son at a time when the KMT controlled Taiwan under martial law. His brother, Chiang Ching-kuo was the ROC President who ended martial law - after having the experience of being imprisoned in the Soviet Union because of what his father had done.
    after 18 y.o. person has personal responsibility for own actions... was he below 18? no? what are you talking about then?

    "father send me" sounds like "god send me" from the mouth of serial killer-maniac
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  3. #2263
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    Re: The Brink of War?

    Quote Originally Posted by Moses View Post
    after 18 y.o. person has personal responsibility for own actions... was he below 18? no? what are you talking about then?

    "father send me" sounds like "god send me" from the mouth of serial killer-maniac
    1. If you are referring to a legal age of majority at 18 years of age, the current legal age of majority in the Republic of China/ Taiwan is 21 years of age, as it will be until January 1, 2023 when it is lowered to 18. You are attempting to apply the situation in other countries which does not yet apply here.
    2. There is no evidence that Chiang Wei-kuo was a serial killer-maniac, if that is what you intended to imply.
    3. In Confucianism, the attitude of obedience, devotion, and care toward one's parents and elder family members was, and to a great extent still is, the basis of individual moral conduct and social harmony in society. Chiang Kai-shek embraced a form that is now known as Confucian fascism, however, and his sons did as they were told.
    4. The standards of the early 21st century Russia did not apply in the ROC at the time Chiang Wei-kuo was sent to Germany, just as it did not apply when his brother was sent to the Soviet Union - perhaps you missed the point of the comment that CKS "firmly believed that compromising China’s future was not worth his son’s life," i..e., he would not trade his elder son's life for the ROC's future.
    5. You may not agree with CKS's moral standards, but at least he had some.
    6. Presumably, given your comments about people above 18 years of age being responsible for their own actions, you will understand why so many Russian men are fleeing the "partial mobilization," as they understand the illegality and immorality of the "special military operation"?

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  5. #2264
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    Re: The Brink of War?

    Quote Originally Posted by Dragonman View Post
    6. Presumably, given your comments about people above 18 years of age being responsible for their own actions, you will understand why so many Russian men are fleeing the "partial mobilization," as they understand the illegality and immorality of the "special military operation"?
    Despite gossips and rumors Russia is country of freedom in choice of place to travel and to live. So these who want to move, have option to move. Your call "flee" is propaganda. They just choose to travel or to move to another country. Why not? Nobody stops them, all borders are opened (at least these what Western "democracies" didn't lock yet by "sanctions").

    And partial mobilization means exactly that - partial, below 300K from 25 mln. Most regions already reported what they have finished it. About 45K come voluntary, rest were drafted.

    And by the way: for Russian govt is very important to keep borders opened - on this way opponents of military operation are going out of country, so here will be even less meetings and demonstrations.
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  6. #2265
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    Re: The Brink of War?

    Quote Originally Posted by Moses View Post
    Despite gossips and rumors Russia is country of freedom in choice of place to travel and to live. So these who want to move, have option to move. Your call "flee" is propaganda. They just choose to travel or to move to another country. Why not? Nobody stops them, all borders are opened (at least these what Western "democracies" didn't lock yet by "sanctions").

    And partial mobilization means exactly that - partial, below 300K from 25 mln. Most regions already reported what they have finished it. About 45K come voluntary, rest were drafted.

    And by the way: for Russian govt is very important to keep borders opened - on this way opponents of military operation are going out of country, so here will be even less meetings and demonstrations.
    "As Russians Flee, Some Find Draft Notices Waiting at the Border. The Kremlin dispatched federal security forces to frontier border crossings packed with Russian men trying to escape the draft by entering countries like Georgia, Kazakhstan and Mongolia.

    The Kremlin has dispatched still more forces to shore up its faltering war effort, but the units are headed not to Ukraine but to Russia’s borders with other countries, where on Tuesday they were confronting young Russian men trying to join an exodus out of the country.

    As the avenues for Russians to escape a draft order issued last week narrowed, the Federal Security Service sent armored vehicles to the frontiers, where some men waiting to flee were being served military call-up papers, the state news media reported" (https://www.nytimes.com/2022/09/27/w...ferendums.html).

  7. #2266
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    Re: The Brink of War?

    Quote Originally Posted by Dragonman View Post
    "As Russians Flee, Some Find Draft Notices Waiting at the Border. The Kremlin dispatched federal security forces to frontier border crossings packed with Russian men trying to escape the draft by entering countries like Georgia, Kazakhstan and Mongolia.

    The Kremlin has dispatched still more forces to shore up its faltering war effort, but the units are headed not to Ukraine but to Russia’s borders with other countries, where on Tuesday they were confronting young Russian men trying to join an exodus out of the country.

    As the avenues for Russians to escape a draft order issued last week narrowed, the Federal Security Service sent armored vehicles to the frontiers, where some men waiting to flee were being served military call-up papers, the state news media reported" (https://www.nytimes.com/2022/09/27/w...ferendums.html).
    Propaganda.

    Friend of mine crossed border with Kazakhstan 3 days ago. Travel has been planned months ago - he has sister there to visit. He spend in line on the border about 3 hours. No questions from border guards even he had no tickets back to Russia on hands and he had Military ID with him.

    I was watching his Live Location:

    1664549502040.jpg

    Son of my oldest friends flew to Armenia just today - his wife is from Armenia and they went to visit her relatives as he has vacations. Also no questions from border guards in Moscow airport.

    Yes, in both cases guards check list of mobilized (these "below 300K") and if person isn't in list - person is free to go.
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  8. #2267
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    Re: The Brink of War?

    Hmmm... Ukraine made a new bid for NATO membership. Maybe I'm naive, but I'm assuming there's more to this than just showmanship and there were discussions had behind the scenes before they put that new bid in.

    Let's see what happens.

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  10. #2268
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    Re: The Brink of War?

    Quote Originally Posted by cdnmatt View Post
    Hmmm... Ukraine made a new bid for NATO membership. Maybe I'm naive, but I'm assuming there's more to this than just showmanship and there were discussions had behind the scenes before they put that new bid in.

    Let's see what happens.
    I don't know what NATO will say, but UK gas got +38% in price after that news.

    1664551274316.png
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  11. #2269
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    Re: The Brink of War?

    I quite obviously am not part of the NATO intelligence community, but it strikes me as odd that Ukraine would just throw in another bid for NATO membership like this. I'm assuming they didn't do it blindly or just for showmanship / publicity. There's a chance there's been discussions behind the scenes letting Ukraine know, "go ahead and submit another bid, we'll ensure it gets fast tracked and approved".

    That kind of makes sense. If Russia is going to be assholes and straight up steal 18% of Ukraine and say "this is now Russian territory", there's a chance NATO will respond with, "ok, then the other 82% of Ukraine is now under NATO protection, what you gonna do bitch?".

    See what happens....

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  13. #2270
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    Re: The Brink of War?

    Oh, and sure enough, now it's showing up in the news. Ukraine has submitted a "fast track" bid to become a NATO member:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FJValMImWP4

    I'm assuming there's been discussions behind the scenes before they pulled the trigger and submitted this bid. Let's see what happens. There's a chance this is the West's response to Russia straight up stealing 18% of Ukraine.

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