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Thread: The Brink of War?

  1. #2151
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    Re: The Brink of War?

    I am also curious as to why you never mention that various elements of the mercenary Wagner Group (members of which are currently visiting Russian prisons to recruit convicts to fight in Ukraine) have had Neo-Nazi and far right-wing ties (e.g., "Russian mercenaries in Ukraine linked to far-right extremists," https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...t-extremists)? Or that Dimitry Utkin, who many consider Wagner’s operational commander, has tattoos of Nazi “SS” epaulets along his collar bones (https://time.com/6180611/white-power...he-lost-cause/).

    Or that their logo includes a death's head (https://www.npr.org/2022/06/06/11026...ia-ukraine-war, and https://news.yahoo.com/what-is-the-w...163313813.html).

    Or that "Many founding members of Wagner also belong to the ultra-nationalist and white supremacist group known as the Russian Imperial Movement, which the U.S. State Department has declared a terrorist organization" (https://time.com/6180611/white-power...-lost-cause/)?

    Or the fact that other Russian Neo-Nazi groups, some affiliated with the Wagner Group are aiding Putin's fight (https://www.themoscowtimes.com/2022/...spiegel-a77762, and https://www.rferl.org/a/russian-neo-...1871760.html)?

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  3. #2152
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    Re: The Brink of War?

    I wonder why you are so stubbornly trying to justify Ukraine, instead of recognizing the obvious facts - the current government came to power after a coup committed by nationalists, the state of Ukraine recognizes nationalism and Nazism as part of its policy, Nazis and nationalists sit in parliament and the government. Nationalism and Nazism are the foundations of the state policy of Ukraine.

    Just admit it, instead of making clumsy attempts to explain why Nazis in Ukraine are good.

    Once again "Nationalism is our religion". Central street of Kiev, every year on Jan 1st:

    1690116_original.jpg

    5e0ce50f02e8bd1e8239c3f5.jpg
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  4. #2153
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    Re: The Brink of War?

    Quote Originally Posted by Moses View Post
    I wonder why you are so stubbornly trying to justify Ukraine, instead of recognizing the obvious facts - the current government came to power after a coup committed by nationalists, the state of Ukraine recognizes nationalism and Nazism as part of its policy, Nazis and nationalists sit in parliament and the government. Nationalism and Nazism are the foundations of the state policy of Ukraine.

    Just admit it, instead of making clumsy attempts to explain why Nazis in Ukraine are good.

    Once again "Nationalism is our religion". Central street of Kiev, every year on Jan 1st:

    1690116_original.jpg

    5e0ce50f02e8bd1e8239c3f5.jpg
    I wonder why you keep twisting what I write to justify you own views on the justification of Russia's invasion of Ukraine?

    The current president did not come to power as a result of a coup but as the result of a landslide victory in the country's presidential election, receiving in the run-off vote more than 73% of the vote while the incumbent, Petro Poroshenko, trailed at 24%.

    As I understand the Ukrainian situation, it is little different in terms of promoting nationalism than the nationalism promoted in Russia, which promotes Russian cultural identity and unity.

    You claim that Nazis are in the Ukrainian government. I cannot find on listed, so please name one or more Nazis in the Ukrainian government.

    As I said in my previous posting, I have never said anything in any of my postings that claims that Nazis in Ukraine are good. Again, you resort to twisting what I've written.

    Again, you post pictures without citing their source so that your claims can be checked.

    More examples of your resort of logical fallacy.

    I note, though, that you did not respond to my comments about Neo-Nazis on the Russian side.

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  6. #2154
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    Re: The Brink of War?

    ==== I note, though, that you did not respond to my comments about Neo-Nazis on the Russian side. ===
    just look at prev. page - you will see destiny of Nazi in Russia - prison.

    And speaking about Wagner group - they are private company. They are hired by Donetsk republic and Lugansk republic, not by Russia. Also they are serving contracts in Iran, Syria, Libya, Mali and so on.

    Feel the difference: Nazi battalions like "Azov" and others are incorporated into state army, are part of state military structure. State Ukraine recognizes them and cooperates with them. Wagner group is private company with own policy, it isn't part of Russian army.

    NeoNazis.jpg
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  7. #2155
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    Re: The Brink of War?

    It's very kind of Putin to help with the Nazi problem in Ukraine. But don't you think we're burning down the house to fry eggs? In fact, both houses?..

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  9. #2156
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    Re: The Brink of War?

    Quote Originally Posted by Andy View Post
    It's very kind of Putin to help with the Nazi problem in Ukraine. But don't you think we're burning down the house to fry eggs? In fact, both houses?..
    Year 2014



    By the way, "burning both houses" is more global than you think. Today economical report from EU: inflation in Estonia 25,2%, Latvia 21,4%, Lithuania 21,1% .
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  10. #2157
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    Re: The Brink of War?

    Quote Originally Posted by Moses View Post
    ==== I note, though, that you did not respond to my comments about Neo-Nazis on the Russian side. ===
    just look at prev. page - you will see destiny of Nazi in Russia - prison.

    And speaking about Wagner group - they are private company. They are hired by Donetsk republic and Lugansk republic, not by Russia. Also they are serving contracts in Iran, Syria, Libya, Mali and so on.

    Feel the difference: Nazi battalions like "Azov" and others are incorporated into state army, are part of state military structure. State Ukraine recognizes them and cooperates with them. Wagner group is private company with own policy, it isn't part of Russian army.

    NeoNazis.jpg
    Showing a few photos of alleged Russian Nazis in court without indicating dates, without text that can be checked, and without giving the URLs for your sources is hardly sufficient evidence of your claim that Russian Nazis end up in prison.

    I am aware that the Wagner Group is a mercenary firm that has operated on Russia's behalf in the countries you mentioned. I am also aware that the Group is reportedly trained on installations belonging to the Russian Ministry of Defense and that it is widely considered to be an arm's-length unit of either the MoD or of Russia's military intelligence agency. Moreover, I am also aware that the Group is widely believed to be owned or financed by Yevgeny Prigozhin, a businessman with close links to Putin and widely known as "Putin's Chef."

    I am also of the difference between the Azov Battalion and the Wagner Group (and that the Kremlin always officially denies any relationship with the Wagner Group) is because the use of mercenaries is forbidden by the Russian Constitution. This difference allows Putin and the Kremlin to use "plausible deniability" in certain conflicts, and to obscure the number of casualties and financial costs of Russia's foreign interventions from the public.

    However, their role in Ukraine has been openly celebrated on Russian state media. The group has been praised as heroes of President Vladimir Putin’s "special military operation." Moreover, they use attention-grabbing advertising across Russia to sign up new members. The group's efforts currently include recruitment campaigns in prisons, with their backer promising murderers and sex offenders that they "will be pardoned if they survive six months" but "killed if they run," and telling them that they should commit suicide rather than be taken prisoner (see, e.g., https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...s-Ukraine.html, https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2022/...ssias-military, and https://www.businessinsider.com/ukra...-prison-2022-9).

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  12. #2158
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    Re: The Brink of War?

    Quote Originally Posted by Moses View Post
    Year 2014



    By the way, "burning both houses" is more global than you think. Today economical report from EU: inflation in Estonia 25,2%, Latvia 21,4%, Lithuania 21,1% .
    The video you posted is titled "A Night in Luhansk," and is on the website of "Kreosan." More recent videos on the website come from Pripyat and Chernobyl, which are in northern Ukraine, with one captioned "I've decided to stay in the abandoned city of Pripyat in the Chernobyl Exclusion Zone. We've repaired the abandoned flat, restored electricity, heating, and water. Yes, it wasn't easy, but we have made a decision. We are carefully exanimating Pripyat for radiation with a dosimeter" (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tMCLs_b9oXw). So I wonder if the video you posted really refers to the Russian invasion of Luhansk in 2014?

  13. User who gave Like to post:

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  14. #2159
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    Re: The Brink of War?

    Putin is soon to be a man on an island. An island that he himself created.

    Even Xi in China and Modi in India are snuffing Putin by delivering verbal body-slams and making concerted efforts to distance themselves from him on the global stage, at the same time as reports are circulating almost by the minute of top-ranking Russian figures starting to ask for his resignation.

    https://edition.cnn.com/2022/09/17/w...hnk/index.html

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  16. #2160
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    Re: The Brink of War?

    i honestly feel sorry for the ordinary Russuan, trapped in that alternative universe....putin has wrecked the country....wrecked the future of its people...

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