You still think Thailand is a gay paradise?

[Armando]

Maybe Thailand isn't currently the gay paradise as it used to be, but for gay holiday makers if there is somewhere better than Thailand to go these days, where would that be?

That really seems to be a comment from someone who has not travelled much in search of other places which could also be called a gay paradise. What about the South American cities which many rave about? Closer to Thailand, what about Tokyo? What about Taipei? What about some of the islands in the Philippines? If you know where to go, the gay tourist can have a great time. There are certainly loads of willing local guys.

What about Singapore? This may seem an odd choice given the colonial A377 article in the criminal code. But the government has said it will not use it and seems to have stuck to its word. There are still gay bars, gay saunas, great cruising and a lot more - although obviously pricier than Thailand.

The main difference between these places and Thailand seems to be a lack of gay gogo bars. But then we have no idea for how much longer these bars are likely to operate. Hopefully many more years, but we have seen how so much of the gay scene has gone way downhill in the last decade or even more. The gay scene in Chiang Mai is a mere shadow of its former self. Phuket is worse. Unless you stick to Bangkok and Pattaya you are certainly not in any form of gay paradise. Even in Bangkok quite a few central saunas and massage spas have closed for good, including the much missed Babylon. So gay tourists have to travel further out to find the smorgasbord of gay activities in which they could previously indulge in the city centre.

[Gaybutton]

That really seems to be a comment from someone who has not travelled much in search of other places which could also be called a gay paradise.

That is true. It has been many years since I have been to any of the places you mentioned. But I didn't ask whether there are other places for gays to go. I asked if anyone knows of a place better than Thailand to go.

If there is such a place, I'd like to know where and what about it makes it better than Thailand.

[goji]

I've not yet seen a credible alternative to Thailand.

The boys on the apps in The Philippines are very good and have more modest financial requirements. However, the bars are spread all over the place, are reportedly expensive and the pictures imply they are full of muscle guys. So I didn't bother with the bars.

Cambodia has some nice lads and several bars, but only Toolbox is one I'd be keen to return to.

Yangon has some very nice massage services. However, things like food and hotels are of a far lower standard than in Thailand.

[vnman]

The boys on the apps in The Philippines are very good and have more modest financial requirements. However, the bars are spread all over the place, are reportedly expensive and the pictures imply they are full of muscle guys. So I didn't bother with the bars.

Metro Manila has a few spots for the gay crowd that sadly have diminished to single venues. Metro Manila has many cities and traffic is horrible, even at night time. But if you look at Ortigas, Cubao and Quezon City in General, you see that the gay venues there are relatively near each other. You just have to see it in the context of how big the Metro area is. The days that there were 4 or 5 places within 50 square meters is no longer.

I lived in the Philippines for a few years and I can tell you that the bars are overflowing with twinkies. You just need to go to the right places and that can be a problem to find if you are only in town for a week. For example, you could go to O bar in Ortigas, pay an arm and a leg and find the more privileged crowd. Or you could drive a little further and go to Cubao. There used to be a few places within a few meters from each other, now only Starlite might be left. A place with cheap beer, cheap decore, cringe-worthy shows, but full with cute and willing twinks.

Disclaimer: it's been a few years since I've been in the Philippines.

Let me add that the Philippines couldn't even get close to a Thai experience, but I guess it is all about what you are looking for.

[Oliver2]

In comparing Thailand with other countries, there are some questions that need answering.

Can I walk with my boyfriend safely in cities and towns without being stared at, either in surprise or hostility?
Will hotels accept us and restaurants serve us with pleasure?
Have gay people anything to fear regarding their sexuality from policemen?
Are there sections of cities- even a few roads- which can be described as gay?

There are certainly places to which I have been attracted as a gay visitor, but some of them (specifically the non-Asian ones) seem unlikely to answer these questions positively.

And if I may throw in a more controversial observation, are the guys on the scene predominantly "gay for pay"? If so, I wouldn't be interested.

[Manforallseasons]

And if I may throw in a more controversial observation, are the guys on the scene predominantly "gay for pay"? If so, I wouldn't be interested.

“Gay for pay” you honestly believe a boy 30+ your junior is anxious to do to bed with you? Stop fooling yourself, regardless of what you want to believe you are simply a friend with benefits.

[vnman]

“Gay for pay” you honestly believe a boy 30+ your junior is anxious to do to bed with you? Stop fooling yourself, regardless of what you want to believe you are simply a friend with benefits.

In general, you might be right, but I'm guessing you've been looking in gogo bars and apps around Thailand. There is a whole wide world out there with boys interested in a wide range of men. You not experiencing this doesn't mean it does not exist. It just means that you didn't get any.

[bkkguy]

I asked if anyone knows of a place better than Thailand to go.

If there is such a place, I'd like to know where and what about it makes it better than Thailand.

better means many different things to different people so anyone else's answer may not seem better to you

a lot of the discussion here seems to include the availability of cheap commercial sex as a requisite for a "gay paradise" but is that really still the primary selection criteria for gay tourists these days?

I am not that much of a beach person but I find it hard to believe that among all of the visitors to this forum none have found a better gay beach community than Jomtien anywhere else in the world

while there are a selection of restaurants in Pattaya or Bangkok that I like, even I have found a wider selection of restaurants in many European and other Asian cities that are better, still reasonably priced and either gay operated or comfortable for a gay couple or single tourist to enjoy in citiesI have visited like London, Amsterdam, Paris, Barcelona, Taipei, Singapore, etc

Can I walk with my boyfriend safely in cities and towns without being stared at, either in surprise or hostility?

in Thailand this is because of tolerance or fake Thai smiles at best, certainly not acceptance, and yes it is better than being poofter bashed but in many areas in many European and Asian cities this is just not an issue

Are there sections of cities- even a few roads- which can be described as gay?

having a few gay venues in easy walking distance may be a convenience, but with decent transport options do we really need gay ghettos any more?

And if I may throw in a more controversial observation, are the guys on the scene predominantly "gay for pay"? If so, I wouldn't be interested.

so you would not recommend Thailand to first time visitors now?

I have lived in Bangkok, and visited Pattaya regularly, for the past 25 years, and in that time have visited, once or a few times, many European and Asian cities, and while I still think Bangkok is a great city to live in - still relatively cheap, lots of entertainment and restaurant choices, easy to travel from, easy to get a long term stay (despite Immigration's best efforts), I have never considered it a "gay paradise" just because of the (no longer that cheap) commercial sex!

[Gaybutton]

anyone else's answer may not seem better to you

Especially yours. Now, if you're through with your long-winded lecture, are you going to answer my question and tell me of a place better than Thailand for gays to go - no matter whose idea of 'better' might be?

[Armando]

having a few gay venues in easy walking distance may be a convenience, but with decent transport options do we really need gay ghettos any more?

My answer to that question is a definite 'yes'. Having a group of gay venues in very close proximity creates a special vibe that you just do not get if those venues require transport between them. That's why Soi Twilight worked, why Silom Soi 4 works, why Shinjuku ni-chome works, why the Red House in Taipei works.