Are we near to having a vaccine and returning to Thailand?

[Jellybean]

Are you perhaps thinking along these lines?

Tempting though your question is StevieWonders, I better play it safe and would refer you to the answer I gave some moments ago.

I am staggered there is some form of rationing and it is necessary to have an appointment to get a flu vaccine. In Bangkok I walked into a hospital and got it in ten minutes.

As I alluded to in my earlier reply, Armando, this year is very different, caused by the pressure on our health service and the extra protective measures required due to Covid-19. The flu vaccination would normally be given at my local general practitioner practice and several days set aside during which eligible patients can attend at any time during the allotted days and obtain their flu vaccination. From memory, this usually takes around 15-20 minutes with a steady stream of patients being vaccinated in an efficient conveyor belt manner. But this year, due to Covid-19, my local surgery will not be carrying out the vaccination programme and I am required to attend during a one hour time slot at a designated local medical centre.

When I lived in Bangkok, due to a recurring problem with my left eye, I had regular experience of two local hospitals, the BNH Hospital on Convent Road and the Bangkok Christian Hospital on Silom Road (BCH). What struck me the most was that I could attend either hospital as a walk-in patient without an appointment. In the case of the BNH, which is the more expensive of the two hospitals, on average I could register at reception, see a nurse, see a doctor, pay the bill and collect my prescription within 30-40 minutes. The timescale at BCH was somewhat longer at one to two hours from start to finish.

In the UK, when I lived in London, my primary ophthalmology consultant was at King’s College Hospital in Camberwell (KCH). I was seen annually, but when an issue arose, an appointment could take many weeks if not months to obtain. And once there, with an appointment, it could take one to two hours before I was seen, then a further hour or more as I was dealt with by a nurse, a doctor then finally seen by the consultant. I was treated at KCH over a 15 year period and the above is typical of my experience. So yes, I am envious of the efficiency I experienced at the Bangkok hospitals I attended but, of course, I had to pay directly for my treatment and not through my taxes and a national insurance scheme (although I no longer contribute to the scheme). And lastly, apologies for the length of my reply.

[gerefan2]

A month or so ago I had a message from my GP telling me to book a flu jab and giving me two dates.

I rang them (15 minutes to get through) and they said 0915 for the first date. “Too early” I said I have things to do every morning. What about the next date?

0930 they said. “Sorry cannot. Can you do me in the afternoon?”.
No, they told me ...”We have to issue bookings in strict order...blah blah.

So I was in Tesco's and they gave me a leaflet. Booked on line for a time I wanted the following week. All done in 5 minutes.

Welcome to the wonderful UK NHS !

[Armando]

As I alluded to in my earlier reply, Armando, this year is very different, caused by the pressure on our health service and the extra protective measures required due to Covid-19. The flu vaccination would normally be given at my local general practitioner practice and several days set aside during which eligible patients can attend at any time during the allotted days and obtain their flu vaccination. From memory, this usually takes around 15-20 minutes with a steady stream of patients being vaccinated in an efficient conveyor belt manner. But this year, due to Covid-19, my local surgery will not be carrying out the vaccination programme and I am required to attend during a one hour time slot at a designated local medical centre.

When I lived in Bangkok, due to a recurring problem with my left eye, I had regular experience of two local hospitals, the BNH Hospital on Convent Road and the Bangkok Christian Hospital on Silom Road (BCH). What struck me the most was that I could attend either hospital as a walk-in patient without an appointment. In the case of the BNH, which is the more expensive of the two hospitals, on average I could register at reception, see a nurse, see a doctor, pay the bill and collect my prescription within 30-40 minutes. The timescale at BCH was somewhat longer at one to two hours from start to finish.

In the UK, when I lived in London, my primary ophthalmology consultant was at King’s College Hospital in Camberwell (KCH). I was seen annually, but when an issue arose, an appointment could take many weeks if not months to obtain. And once there, with an appointment, it could take one to two hours before I was seen, then a further hour or more as I was dealt with by a nurse, a doctor then finally seen by the consultant. I was treated at KCH over a 15 year period and the above is typical of my experience. So yes, I am envious of the efficiency I experienced at the Bangkok hospitals I attended but, of course, I had to pay directly for my treatment and not through my taxes and a national insurance scheme (although I no longer contribute to the scheme). And lastly, apologies for the length of my reply.

I assure you no apologies necessary. The Bangkok private hospitals are great. But then they are also pricey The public hospitals like Ramathibodi and Chulalongkorn are perhaps one fifth of the cost but very similar to your NHS treatment. Both are enormous with many buildings spread over a huge area. At Ramathibodi you'd better read Thai as there is no English anywhere.

At Chula you first have to queue up between 5 and 7 in the morning to register. With your registration card in hand, you queue at a nurses station to get an appointment. This will usually be with a young doctor (mine was very cute!) who is a GP on the 13th floor. After a discussion and examination he wanted an x-ray done. This was on another floor. It did not take long but had to be paid for in advance. Back on the 13th floor he was slightly concerned at one indication on the x-ray. So in addition to the procedure I had gone in for he wanted me to see a specialist about the x ray. He gave me a document to take down to another floor. More queuing for a new number. Eventually I was given two pieces of paper rather surprisingly in English. Both were for appointments several weeks later. For the first appointment I waited for 3 1/2 hours. This time I saw a young lady specialist. The only reason for this appointment was for her to give me a new form for the second x-ray. That appointment was three weeks away.

The second x-ray showed there was in fact no problem. I realised the second specialist appointment would merely be a chat before yet anther appointment would be made for the procedure I wanted in the first lplace. As I was in discomfort, I gave up and coughed up for a private hospital. My turn for apologies over length.

[StevieWonders]

I assure you no apologies necessary. The Bangkok private hospitals are great. But then they are also pricey The public hospitals like Ramathibodi and Chulalongkorn are perhaps one fifth of the cost but very similar to your NHS treatment. Both are enormous with many buildings spread over a huge area. At Ramathibodi you'd better read Thai as there is no English anywhere.

You seem to have overlooked completely the not-for-profit private hospitals run by various Christian churches. My go-to hospital is Saint Louis on Sathorn - the prices are a fraction of those charged by BNH and many of their doctors shuttle between the two. The other one is nearby Patpong - Bangkok Christian - and many a money boy’s treatment I’ve paid for there, including vaccinations. I’ve also ex-pat friends who go there and swear by it.

Interesting that these are Christian-sponsored hospitals in Thailand. I’m not sure if any Buddhist-sponsored not-for-profit private hospitals exist although I expect our Resident Apologist For All Things Thailand will be along any tick of the clock to correct my ignorance.

[Patanawet]

CNN is still reporting the Oxford/ Astra Zenica vaccine as being paused.
They don't mention that it is only paused in the U.S. It paused for only a few days in all testing countries and was resumed (except U.S.) when it was revealed that the deceased Brazilan patient had been given the placebo.
And news today that it is proving in phase 3 testing as very effective in protecting against future infections.
Oxford has insisted that the vaccine will be provided at a no-profit policy whilst the pandemic lasts. Let us hope that all countries follow the same policy for their vaccines.

[Old git]

Amongst all the doom and gloom, some very encouraging green shoots can be seen.

The first is the vanishingly small number of reported cases of people getting this bug twice. Given that it is usually asymptomatic amongst children, it looks likely to vanish into the background, and join the many bugs we get when young, but barely notice.

The second is the growing evidence that we don't all have to get this bug to get over it. Populations with 15% antibody rates are showing infection attenuations that equate to more than 50% resistance. For every person who gets this bug, several more are becoming immune through low level exposure - building resistance without infection.

Third is that despite the onset of the northern hemisphere winter season, with a resultant spike in cases, we are probably very close now to 'peak Covid' with many badly affected countries showing a steady reduction in cases. Once the number of infections globally heads into decline, nations will start to focus on becoming 'post-Covid' and normality will return.

Fourth is that something called a vaccine is likely to become available. Whether it works or not is another matter, but it will give tourist dependant nations like Thailand, that are otherwise way behind the curve when it comes to getting over this bug, an excuse to re-open.

Reading between the lines, I expect vaccines to appear in the second quarter of next year, by which time the bug is likely to have fully run its course in most of the world's cities - but not in Thailand..

[goji]

For every person who gets this bug, several more are becoming immune through low level exposure - building resistance without infection.

Whilst I agree with most of what you are writing, do you have a link to a source of evidence to support this particular point ?

[Philex]

Many vaccinations will be ready next month. All of them already proven to be effective and safe. Too many trumps here causing panic and fake news. Stop it and get ready for the world to open.

[Moses]

building resistance without infection

For any modern doctor it sounds like "I got pregnant from holy spirit and I am still virgin"... no infection (+ no vaccination) = no antibodies = zero immunity... period.

[Marc K]

It's amazing how we have all suddenly become qualified infectious disease experts and virologists and epidemiologists. What a transformation! Come on, guys, none of us has the foggiest idea about the future course of this disease. Nor when an effective vaccine is likely to be pumped into our arms. But we can all hope for the best!