Its Official..US Embassy no longer providing income verification letters for Thai Immigration Jan1.

[travelerjim]

Attention Americans in Thailand...
Message from US Embassy Bangkok

U.S. Mission in Thailand to Cease Providing Income Affidavit

October 26, 2018

Bangkok, THAILAND

As of January 1, 2019, the U.S. Embassy in Bangkok and the U.S. Consulate General in Chiang Mai will cease to provide the income affidavit for the purpose of applying for Thai retirement and family visas and will not notarize previous versions of the income affidavit.

The Royal Thai Government requires actual verification of income to certify visa applicants meet financial requirements for long-stay visas.

The U.S. government cannot provide this verification and will no longer issue the affidavits.

Please consult the Royal Thai Embassy in Washington, D.C. and Royal Thai Immigration Bureau websites for information on how to meet the requirements for a Thai retirement visa or extension

Tj

Similar Threads:

• British Embassy to STOP issuing income certifications
• Thai Immigration Chiang Mai requiring proof of income
• Hnmmm??? Has Jomtien Immigration changed rule re Income Affidavit?
• US Embassy Notary Letter for Income, Deadline
• British Embassy and income for Retirement Visa

[Smiles]

Thats two down (UK and USA) and of course many are wondering whether the contagion will go further.
Right now at least the Canadian Embassy's notary services regarding the income letter are as they always were: i.e. no changes.

One might surmise that the process of receiving a notorised income letter might well be the stumbling block here.
Although I am not familiar with the UK Embassy's process, I know for sure about the USA Embassy's: for many years now the USA Embassy has not required the receiver to show actual proof of income. Instead the receiver is asked only what their annual income is, and then they are asked to swear ~ on the bible? ~ that what they say is true. Thats it! Theoretically one can tell them any old figure on or over the amount the Thai Immigration asks for.

The Canadian Embassy asks for actual proof. For myself, once a year I make a Bangkok run to the Embassy and take with me my tax return . . . they told me many years ago that the return is the Best Proof.
Question is, would that difference be the key to one country being accepting to the income letter (i.e. a "real" notorisation), and another being rejected (i.e. a "flawed" notorisation)?

Who knows? But if the Canadian Embassy keeps on with asking for income proof before notorising and then being accepted by Thai Immigration it's possible that that's whats happening.

I'd certainly like to know whether the UK income letter process is the same as the USA.

[arsenal]

Cue the Americans here, on GB and GayThailand going into cataclysmic meltdown mode. Civilisation has ended.

[DoubleDutch]

This is going to end living in Thailand for many US expats.
How many really have 64k THB coming in every months? I'm guessing less than half. Few retired Americans who I know well over the years get around $1000 every months, that's about half required, but more than enough to live here.

Imagine if some UK or Americsn guy's pension is 55k THB, he is now fucked, because some bureocrat, in some cubicle, some years ago was chewing on a pen on a lazy afternoon, and came up with the 64k figure. That is nearly 5 times more than Thai average monthly 12.000 income.

What will happen to expats who own condos? Second and third round condo market is dead, Thais and Chinese only but new, it is already very difficult to sell older condo, and now?

[bkkguy]

The Canadian Embassy asks for actual proof. For myself, once a year I make a Bangkok run to the Embassy and take with me my tax return

but does the Canadian Embassy actually verify (not notorise) the contents of the tax return document is true and correct from other sources, eg contact the tax department in Canada? Otherwise this is unlikely to satisfy the Thai authorities requirement for "actual verification of income".

Question is, would that difference be the key to one country being accepting to the income letter (i.e. a "real" notorisation), and another being rejected (i.e. a "flawed" notorisation)?

there is nothing more "flawed" about the way the US or British embassies are doing their notarisation - notarisation has never been about a document's contents or the correctness or truth of that content in any western country - even Canada

each country has their own terminology but generally a notary public, a commissioner of oaths or a consular official etc can witness a signature on a statutory declaration or affidavit, but it is not their role to go beyond that

and in most countries it is a serious offense for a citizen to make a false declaration, but again it is not the role of the notary to prove that

as the Thai authorities are now enforcing a requirement for "actual verification of income" the UK and US embassies are no longer notarising such "income declarations" as their consular officials are not by definition able to provide a document that satisfies the requirements, and to extend consular duties to provide such proof would be difficult given the many and various different sources of income in these countries, privacy laws, etc, and I would expect most other embassies to follow suit

but as usual the actual decision of what exactly they require for "actual verification of income" is not set in stone so once the dust settles it may turn out that there are still reasonable ways to "prove" income and that may or may not require involvement of your embassy

bkkguy

[DragonMaster]

This is going to end living in Thailand for many US expats.

Imagine if some UK or Americsn guy's pension is 55k THB, he is now fucked, because some bureocrat, in some cubicle, some years ago was chewing on a pen on a lazy afternoon, and came up with the 64k figure. That is nearly 5 times more than Thai average monthly 12.000 income.

A couple of points to note;

1. You can meet the 800,000 Baht requirement with a mix of pension and a savings deposit in a Thai bank account. It doesn't have to be all one or the other.
2. This requirement has been around for many years and if you multiply 65,000 Baht by 12, you get 780,000 Baht which is close to the 800,000 figure for a deposit.

It's really hard to have too much sympathy for anyone who has repeatedly lied about their income to remain in the kingdom in violation of Thai law. There are cases where situations may have changed since the original retirement, but for those who have knowingly lied to the embassy yearly without trying to comply with the rules need to either comply or leave the kingdom and go back home.

The argument that the amount is 5 times what the average monthly income of a Thai has no relevance. Foreigners who come to live in the kingdom are guests here not Thai citizens and the government has set rules for the privilege to live here. You can choose to follow the rules or leave, it's pretty simple really. I really doubt that many retirees living here would enjoy or even entertain the idea in living a typical Thai existence based on 12,000 Baht/month. I know a lot of Thais and I certainly wouldn't want to live in a small one room apartment with no air conditioning and have to skip meals to survive. I know many Thais who do both but still manage to make it. It's not easy!

[scottish-guy]

It’s quite something to be lectured on legalities and ethics by someone who ran a sleaze pit.

Is it draughty up there on your high horse?

[christianpfc]

I know a lot of Thais and I certainly wouldn't want to live in a small one room apartment with no air conditioning and have to skip meals to survive. I know many Thais who do both but still manage to make it. It's not easy!

I don't know anyone who has to skip meals.

[dinagam]

They don't normally skip meals. Some of them have eating patterns and meal times different from yours. I try to keep my diurnal rhythms even during holidays. Even the Khmer lads in Jomtian have their two square meals in a day whenever they are hungry.

[latintopxxx]

what a sad report...and here i was led to believe that all retirees lived like pashas...