No country for old men?

[TaoR]

I set up and run an employer sponsored self funded insurance plan for 10 years and it amazes me how Americans (I am one) let their preconceived notions color their opinions. All health care involves pools some pools collect their income from employee paychecks and employer contributions and others from taxes. The idea that by paying a monthly invoice one is showing "individual responsibility" does not take into consideration that your monthly premiums are still pooled and that your premiums are going to pay the healthcare expenses of someone else. If your insurance is provided by an employer and if one of your coworkers has a serious illness and you are perfectly healthy then when renewal roles around your insurance premiums are going to increase; thus your premiums have nothing to do with your health and your healthcare costs at any given point in your life. Its all a pool, a pool of risk. Whether the cost of that risk is borne by an employer and its employees or by a nation as a whole is a concept Americans cannot understand. Americans are big on "individual responsibility" but still they refuse to allow healthcare providers to refuse treatment to those who cannot pay. Yes, I always loved the argument about "personal responsibility" like anyone actually is personally responsible for their true healthcare costs...its all a pool and it doesn't take a real serious medical emergency to make your paltry monthly premium look pathetic in light of the EOBS coming in showing tens of thousands of dollars in costs.

[frequent]

I set up and run an employer sponsored self funded insurance plan for 10 years and it amazes me how Americans (I am one) let their preconceived notions color their opinions. All health care involves pools some pools collect their income from employee paychecks and employer contributions and others from taxes. The idea that by paying a monthly invoice one is showing "individual responsibility" does not take into consideration that your monthly premiums are still pooled and that your premiums are going to pay the healthcare expenses of someone else. If your insurance is provided by an employer and if one of your coworkers has a serious illness and you are perfectly healthy then when renewal roles around your insurance premiums are going to increase; thus your premiums have nothing to do with your health and your healthcare costs at any given point in your life. Its all a pool, a pool of risk. Whether the cost of that risk is borne by an employer and its employees or by a nation as a whole is a concept Americans cannot understand. Americans are big on "individual responsibility" but still they refuse to allow healthcare providers to refuse treatment to those who cannot pay. Yes, I always loved the argument about "personal responsibility" like anyone actually is personally responsible for their true healthcare costs...its all a pool and it doesn't take a real serious medical emergency to make your paltry monthly premium look pathetic in light of the EOBS coming in showing tens of thousands of dollars in costs.

I offer up this link for an assessment of what's wrong with American health insurance

[TaoR]

The trouble is those are facts and everyone in the United States can give a whole litany of examples of what is wrong with our system. But when you bring up "healthcare for all" you get hit with "I believe in personal responsibility." When you bring up how we could implement something like the Swiss Healthcare system (which is the only option I see that cannot be called "socialized medicine" then you hear nothing but comments about Europe and how we have the best healthcare in the world.

The reality is even with health insurance, even with the high cost for insurance policies, with the cost of copays, maximum out of pocket limits, and all the other fees and penalties healthcare, even for those with insurance, is still the number one reason for people declaring bankruptcy in the United States.

[paborn]

The trouble is those are facts and everyone in the United States can give a whole litany of examples of what is wrong with our system. But when you bring up "healthcare for all" you get hit with "I believe in personal responsibility." When you bring up how we could implement something like the Swiss Healthcare system (which is the only option I see that cannot be called "socialized medicine" then you hear nothing but comments about Europe and how we have the best healthcare in the world.

The reality is even with health insurance, even with the high cost for insurance policies, with the cost of copays, maximum out of pocket limits, and all the other fees and penalties healthcare, even for those with insurance, is still the number one reason for people declaring bankruptcy in the United States.

Absolutely, a substantial portion of the credit card debt in the US is for medicne and medical services

[kittyboy]

I understand many people have tried to fix the system. I asked if you personally have made the effort? If so, then I applaud you. If not, the point you are trying to make is moot. Do not complain about a system if you are not willing to be an agent of change.

And what would you consider a personal effort to change the system? Should I appoint myself healthcare czar and rile the healthcare world by fiat?
I worked I. Healthcare for many years and volunteered as an hiv counselor for 15 years. I lobbied my elected resmpresentarives for years for national healthcare. I lobby my insurance company, doctor, family and friends at all opportunities. I am lobbying on this board for a sensible approach to healthcare on the USA. Ahh...do I pass your test?
Have you personally tried to fix the USA?

[NitNoi]

I am shocked that citizens in first world countries can't quickly see a GP. The Australian Medicare system does seem like a Utopia by comparison. Sure, elective surgery like hip replacements will see you on a waiting list but the wait for a GP consultation in Sydney will be less than an hour - and many practices "bulk bill" so there is no charge.

Here in the Philippines, I live in a provincial town. I know several people who have died because they (and their family) can't afford dialysis. I would be surprised if this is common in the US or other countries that are being denigrated here.

[frequent]

I am shocked that citizens in first world countries can't quickly see a GP. The Australian Medicare system does seem like a Utopia by comparison. Sure, elective surgery like hip replacements will see you on a waiting list but the wait for a GP consultation in Sydney will be less than an hour - and many practices "bulk bill" so there is no charge.

Here in the Philippines, I live in a provincial town. I know several people who have died because they (and their family) can't afford dialysis. I would be surprised if this is common in the US or other countries that are being denigrated here.

My favourite Australian health-related advertisement is this one. I'm sure it will resonate with many of our members

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QTIWjR2GpFo

[kittyboy]

I am shocked that citizens in first world countries can't quickly see a GP. The Australian Medicare system does seem like a Utopia by comparison. Sure, elective surgery like hip replacements will see you on a waiting list but the wait for a GP consultation in Sydney will be less than an hour - and many practices "bulk bill" so there is no charge.

Here in the Philippines, I live in a provincial town. I know several people who have died because they (and their family) can't afford dialysis. I would be surprised if this is common in the US or other countries that are being denigrated here.

In the USA if you can not provide proof of insurance a gp will turn you away from the office. No insurance no doctor visit unless you pay cash upfront.
People resort to going to the emergency room at hospitals but will get turned away for non emergencies.

[paborn]

I can't understand why people find the concept of insurance so difficult to understand. When I first moved to South Florida from New York I was informed that my house was in a flood zone ( from the canals that regulate the waters ) , later, I was informed that a determination was made that it is not. I still pay the insurance in case the new information is wrong. Just as I pay fire insurance and hurricane insurance and an umbrella policy to protect mny assets. All the while hoping I never have to use them and fully aware that my money will help to reimburse those not so fortunate. For God's sake it's called "insurance" to insure that coverage is there. It has nothing to do with anyone's self rightous feelings about how hard they worked.

[arsenal]

Healthcare, free at the point of delivery is a standard within western Europe. However it comes with a very hefty price tag both in monetary and social terms. In The UK people use the media to get what they feel is their entitlement while others use the same media to stoke up anger at immigrants receiving free treatment despite having paid nothing in. Norway is usually touted as being the Utopia for such matters but the cost of living is eye wateringly expensive with a Big Mac meal costing 11 euros and anti-biotics 24 euros. No easy answers to healthcare.

https://www.expatistan.com/cost-of-living/country/norway?currency=EUR