Bangkok report April 2018

[christianpfc]

Given the huge traffic jam on the freeway - it took close to 2 hours to get to Suwanaphumi - I now think that 500 baht is acceptable.

The attitude of the drivers is not.

Traffic jam is priced in at 2 THB per minute that the car is going slower than 6 km/h.

A447, you really should know better than involving a bellboy to call you a taxi! The more people are involved, the longer it takes, the more expensive it will be, and fewer are the chances that you get what you want.

[sglad]

It's all about making money. The bellboy, taxi and in some cases the reception desk. They are all at it...

Nothing is free in Thailand.

To be fair, nothing is free anywhere; everything comes at a price or with an opportunity cost. People want good service; they want to be treated like maharajahs but they don't want to pay maharajah prices. Well, it doesn't really work that way, does it? Something's gotta give. Service staff in Thailand, at least the ones at mid range type of places, don't make much money. In fact, they barely make ends meet. So they have to resort to corruption. In Singapore, we have low levels of corruption because we are paid fairly and in many instances (particularly our public servants) - highly. Hence our law enforcement officials, by far and large, serve with integrity, which in turn further reduces the level of corruption.

That said, I think the majority of Thai service staff are quite honest and very helpful considering the pittance that they're paid. The people who have been subjected to the kind of mini cons described above have more often than not deserved them through their sheer ignorance, gullibility or as payback for their generally unpleasant personalities. When you use words like dickhead to describe some humble service staff who haven't had the kind of life opportunities that you've had or paint an entire population of people as dumb or mock those who choose to build romantic relationships with Thai people by calling them stupid, you are generally projecting a deep-seated unhappiness within yourself. And when you don't love yourself, you can't have love for others. You get a false sense of superiority by putting down others who haven't had the same advantages that you've had and the only thing you can cope with emotionally is paid for one-night stands. And thus, for all her faults, you go back to Thailand year after year after year after year...sometimes two or three times a year.

[christianpfc]

Service staff in Thailand, at least the ones at mid range type of places, don't make much money. In fact, they barely make ends meet.

Oh no, not again! How comes that people in Kalasin make ends meet on their wage, in Minburi make ends meet on their wage, but as soon as they come to central Bangkok or Pattaya where tourists are around, the Great Whine starts?

My theory is that it's not that the money barely lasts to the end of the month, it's that rather that they have it down to a fine art spending all money that comes in.

[sglad]

Oh no, not again! How comes that people in Kalasin make ends meet on their wage, in Minburi make ends meet on their wage, but as soon as they come to central Bangkok or Pattaya where tourists are around, the Great Whine starts?

Then stop whining.

Firstly, let's say we believe your random statement that people in Kalasin and Minburi are able to make ends meet - and I don't - but we'll go with it for now for the sake of argument. Secondly, most people don't just want to "make ends meet" but want to save and have a bit of fun every now and then. Thirdly, the cost of living in touristy areas is much higher than in rural and suburban areas. Most people working in these areas are renting and not living with family as they do in rural Kalasin or suburban Minburi. While they may have the occasional support of friends, they're pretty much on their own. Everything in the big city is consumer-driven and has to be paid for; they don't have the benefit of having pigs, chickens, rice and fruit from the farm. But we all know that is not enough and people don't just want to make ends meet. Some are truly poor and others just want to better their living conditions and those of their families. Hence millions flock to the big cities every year. and thousands end up in the red light districts servicing pigs who whine about the 20Bt tip they "have" to give the housekeeper.

[a447]

I'm sorry to say that the joke, yet again, is on you.

Your post is based on pure speculation.

And it's wrong. You have totally misunderstood the situation; hardly surprising as :

A) you weren't there, and

B) you don't know the guy involved

1. The young guy is not a bellboy. He's a security guard and wears a guard's uniform. It isn't his job to get taxis for clients. He only offered because "you my friend. Teach me English."

Even if, as a security guard, this particular individual had somehow made some arrangements with taxi drivers, you would have no possible way of not knowing that. Nor would I.

2. I didn't ask reception to call a taxi to the hotel itself. The taxis concerned don't frequent the hotel - you got that wrong, too. They are out on Suriwong road in the middle of a traffic jam . Not much use being "parked somewhere" if you have to join a traffic jam!

Your scenario would not work in a busy area of Bangkok. Outside, in a smaller city, it may well do.

And when hotels or other establishments offer to call you a taxi, who knows? Maybe they are getting a kickback, reflected in a higher charge. Afterall, this is hardly an uncommon practice.

But if the customer refuses to pay the charge, any kickback suddenly disappears. As I insisted on a meter taxi and refused to get into one that would not use a meter, what's in it for the security guard? Or a bellboy? Your logic is all wrong.

Your scenario would only work if the client just asked for any taxi and did not specify the use of a meter. Otherwise, It makes no sense at all.

3. If he wasn't interested in the ones driving by, why did he try to flag them down? He didn't have his back turned to the road the entire time - when I saw him he was looking into the window of a massage shop, adjusting his uniform.

So the joke is actually on you for, once again, going on the attack without knowing all the facts, or thinking the situation through.

You have jumped to conclusions yet again.

[a447]

A447, you really should know better than involving a bellboy to call you a taxi! The more people are involved, the longer it takes, the more expensive it will be, and fewer are the chances that you get what you want.

How is it possible for the fare to be more expensive if I insist on using the meter?

If, on the other hand, I just ask someone to call me a taxi, they'll obviously give me an inflated price. Normally, it's a flat rate.
There has to be something in it for them

[a447]

To be fair, nothing is free anywhere; everything comes at a price or with an opportunity cost. People want good service; they want to be treated like maharajahs but they don't want to pay maharajah prices. Well, it doesn't really work that way, does it? Something's gotta give. Service staff in Thailand, at least the ones at mid range type of places, don't make much money. In fact, they barely make ends meet. So they have to resort to corruption. In Singapore, we have low levels of corruption because we are paid fairly and in many instances (particularly our public servants) - highly. Hence our law enforcement officials, by far and large, serve with integrity, which in turn further reduces the level of corruption.

That said, I think the majority of Thai service staff are quite honest and very helpful considering the pittance that they're paid. The people who have been subjected to the kind of mini cons described above have more often than not deserved them through their sheer ignorance, gullibility or as payback for their generally unpleasant personalities. When you use words like dickhead to describe some humble service staff who haven't had the kind of life opportunities that you've had or paint an entire population of people as dumb or mock those who choose to build romantic relationships with Thai people by calling them stupid, you are generally projecting a deep-seated unhappiness within yourself. And when you don't love yourself, you can't have love for others. You get a false sense of superiority by putting down others who haven't had the same advantages that you've had and the only thing you can cope with emotionally is paid for one-night stands. And thus, for all her faults, you go back to Thailand year after year after year after year...sometimes two or three times a year.

Weren't you just today accusing me of making "blanket statements?". Lol

And so much insight from one who purports to be of the tender age of 24! You display knowledge way beyond your tender years!

Incredible, really.

[sglad]

And so much insight from one who purports to be of the tender age of 24! You display knowledge way beyond your tender years!

Incredible, really.

Thank you. Nah, nothing incredible. It's been a lot of hard work and loads of curiosity, love and respect for the people and country that I'm studying. Yes, I study a lot of Thai history, society and urban geography. But my real 'classroom' has been the experiences shared with me by many Thai friends and contemporaries for which I am continually grateful.

[paborn]

Then stop whining.

Firstly, let's say we believe your random statement that people in Kalasin and Minburi are able to make ends meet - and I don't - but we'll go with it for now for the sake of argument. Secondly, most people don't just want to "make ends meet" but want to save and have a bit of fun every now and then. Thirdly, the cost of living in touristy areas is much higher than in rural and suburban areas. Most people working in these areas are renting and not living with family as they do in rural Kalasin or suburban Minburi. While they may have the occasional support of friends, they're pretty much on their own. Everything in the big city is consumer-driven and has to be paid for; they don't have the benefit of having pigs, chickens, rice and fruit from the farm. But we all know that is not enough and people don't just want to make ends meet. Some are truly poor and others just want to better their living conditions and those of their families. Hence millions flock to the big cities every year. and thousands end up in the red light districts servicing pigs who whine about the 20Bt tip they "have" to give the housekeeper.

Christian I have followed your blog for years and respect your opinion. My confusion, over years, has been limited to only your discussions of skin temperature - never got that and attributed it to my lack of understanding, But, really - this is damn silly. You can not, in any society - compare cost of living in remote areas with the big city. It simply costs far more to live in New York City than Billings Montana. Forward thinking corporations scale pay in Geo. areas to allow for that - how can you not understand that?

[a447]

To be fair, nothing is free anywhere; everything comes at a price or with an opportunity cost. People want good service; they want to be treated like maharajahs but they don't want to pay maharajah prices. Well, it doesn't really work that way, does it? Something's gotta give. Service staff in Thailand, at least the ones at mid range type of places, don't make much money. In fact, they barely make ends meet. So they have to resort to corruption. In Singapore, we have low levels of corruption because we are paid fairly and in many instances (particularly our public servants) - highly. Hence our law enforcement officials, by far and large, serve with integrity, which in turn further reduces the level of corruption.

That said, I think the majority of Thai service staff are quite honest and very helpful considering the pittance that they're paid. The people who have been subjected to the kind of mini cons described above have more often than not deserved them through their sheer ignorance, gullibility or as payback for their generally unpleasant personalities. When you use words like dickhead to describe some humble service staff who haven't had the kind of life opportunities that you've had or paint an entire population of people as dumb or mock those who choose to build romantic relationships with Thai people by calling them stupid, you are generally projecting a deep-seated unhappiness within yourself. And when you don't love yourself, you can't have love for others. You get a false sense of superiority by putting down others who haven't had the same advantages that you've had and the only thing you can cope with emotionally is paid for one-night stands. And thus, for all her faults, you go back to Thailand year after year after year after year...sometimes two or three times a year.

Service staff in Thailand, at least the ones at mid range type of places, don't make much money. In fact, they barely make ends meet. So they have to resort to corruption.

So, you're now accusing all service staff in "mid-range type of places" (whatever they are) in Thailand of being corrupt.

Nice one!

That's as bad as someone you mentioned in paragraph 2 who "paint(s) an entire population of people as dumb."

I don't know who did that. It couldn't have been me, as I intentionally inserted the word "somehow" so as not to do that. The fact that you didn't pick up on that is your fault, not mine. You need to read posts slowly and with more care.

Oh, and it's best not to leave yourself so wide open to accusations of gross hypocrisy. You make it too easy!

When you use words like dickhead to describe some humble service staff

In case you haven't noticed, humble service staff can also be incompetent and lazy.

mock those who choose to build romantic relationships with Thai people by calling them stupid

Again, I don't know who did that. If you think it was me, then you should get your facts right before you comment. I didn't even mention "romantic relationships."

My posts are open to criticism and I have no problem with that at all. What I do have a problem with is people like you who bear a grudge and immediately pounce whenever they can in order to score points, before reading my comments carefully and making sure they've got their facts right.

And give us a break from that "when you don't love yourself, you can't have love for others" and the rest that followed. It sounds like something you've heard in a third-rate family TV drama.

And while I'm at it, can you also please give this "I'm a 24 year old student from Singapore " bullshit a break?

As was shown conclusively last year on a number of occasions, you are not young and not from Singapore.

Your other handle from last year - sugargrandpa - described who you really are. You're an old Aussie like me, in Asia for the same reason - to pay to get laid. So get over it!

Sugargrandpa was a very foolish choice for a board name, don't you think?