Essential to wear condom, even for oral sex

[fountainhall]

Just by the nature of the HIV virus, the likelihood that it could be passed from person to person through oral sex, kissing or anything involving the mouth is unlikely.

The key word here is surely "unlikely" - meaning not impossible but highly improbable if you take the necessary precautions. The US Centers for Disease Control says this about oral sex amongst msm –

• The risk of HIV transmission through oral sex is much less than that from anal or vaginal sex—but it is not zero.
• Performing oral sex on an HIV-infected man, with ejaculation in the mouth, is the riskiest oral sex activity.
• Factors that may increase the risk of HIV transmission through oral sex are oral ulcers, bleeding gums, genital sores, and the presence of other sexually transmitted diseases.

So, leaving aside the possibility of being infected with other nasty STDs, having an HIV+ guy ejaculate in your mouth is the riskiest oral sex activity. But we will rarely if ever know if that cute guy we are with is HIV+ or not – and if he knows, it is unlikely he will tell us.

The AVERT organisation also provides some recent facts about Thailand –

• 90% of new adult infections are transmitted via unprotected sex.
• Of all new infections, 41% were among msm, male sex workers and transgender people.
• in Bangkok, HIV prevalence (amongst msm) was 24.4% compared to the national HIV prevalence of 7% for this population across all of Thailand.
• Surveys show that people under the age of 25 have lower levels of HIV knowledge and HIV testing and counselling than those over age 25.

The fourth point is surely illustrated by the low level of condom usage in many of the relatively new saunas away from the centre of the city aimed at younger Thais for Thais.

Taking risks is part of all our lives. The problem with msn sex here in Thailand - as I am sure is true in some other countries - is that too many of the guys we are likely to meet (younger Thais, Vietnamese, Lao, Cambodians, Burmese etc.) are just not fully aware of the risks, and at least some of the tourists with whom they will have sex openly advertise they seek partners for very risky sexual behaviour. And that of course increases the risk for all the future partners of those guys. But we are not monks and this is Thailand - so we just have to protect ourselves as best we can.

http://www.cdc.gov/hiv/risk/oralsex.html
http://www.avert.org/professionals/h...cific/thailand

[Surfcrest]

I think if there was evidence of people becoming infected with HIV through oral sex or something related, that they would have documented case studies and oral sex would be part of the strategy, as it is with Gonorrhea. Not that I'm saying there absolutely isn't, but there's not a lot of medical evidence of it.

The HIV virus has a very limited life span outside of the host. It's virulence is not in the transmission phase. It's how it mutates in the body and both the mouth and digestive system are harsh environments for the HIV virus to survive in outside the bloodstream.

I worry, especially for Thailand when I read some of the risks some young gay Thais take with "Hi Sex", a culture that's not something you hear of safe sex being practiced in. I'm sure anyone who has had sex with a Thai outside of the commercial sex scene may have encountered no thought on the Thai's part about safe sex at least once, if not a lot more.

I see the same thing back home as I sometimes go to the bathhouse. I don't see a lot of people taking the effort to reach for a condom. Whether this is because they're already infected, whether they're undetectable and think they're safe again or because getting HIV is no big deal anymore, given how many are infected and how easy the treatment is in some countries.

If anything, I'm surprised that they think only 90% of new infections are from unprotected sex. Where else would they become infected, given the amount of screening being done on the blood supply in 2016?

Surfcrest

[fountainhall]

. . . or because getting HIV is no big deal anymore, given how many are infected and how easy the treatment is in some countries.

That's my guess. Most us recall how shit scared we were decades ago when we realised this virus would kill us - end of story. And as the death toll mounted the more concerned we became. Even using condoms and taking precautions, there was always the fear: when will we get it? Now, detected early and with proper treatment, it's just another chronic illness that, hopefully, will have a vaccine and a cure sooner rather than later.

For most of us, the fear element - played up so effectively in national governments' anti-HIV PR campaigns in the early days - has now all but disappeared. But for the young Thai and Vietnamese boys mentioned in earlier threads it has been replaced by another fear: dreams of good jobs shattered along with being shunned by most of their friends. When a guy in his mid-twenties considers suicide as a serious option, it's a sobering lesson on how this dreadful virus continues to take its toll on human suffering.

[homeseeker]

Some very useful posts above so the more the better.

Another reason to use condoms for oral sex is the danger of the STD chlamydia amongst other things. An acquaintance of mine in BKK previously contracted this infection; he says he believes he knows who gave it to him, and he says they used condoms except for oral sex.
Luckily the infection cleared up with one dosage but the doctor told him chlamydia is rife in Thailand as well as other parts of the world.

[fountainhall]

It's common on forums like this one to focus on the Thais and other nationalities here with whom we have sex and from whom we might pick up some disease. Not often do we talk about ourselves and the effect that collective "we" might have on these guys. Gaybutton's site presently has some bug issue and so I cannot access it to find the results of a poll conducted about 5 years ago. However, there is a summary thread about it on gaythailand. The following excerpt from a post makes this point -

Gaybuttonthai forum held a poll a few months ago asking posters a series of questions about their last HIV tests. Out of a total of 62 responses, 12 had tested negative in the previous year. A further 25 had tested negative in the previous 1 and 10 years. Astonishingly (at least in my view – although I admire the posters honesty), 13 had never once been tested and a further 12 had tested positive. Despite msm being advised to have regular testing, less than 20% had been tested within the last 12 months. Of the remaining 80% - discounting those who had tested positive – it can reasonably be assumed that some were in fact HIV positive at the time the poll was taken.

Since this group is likely to have reasonably regular sexual encounters in Thailand, taken together with the growing lack of condom use, the possibilities of transmission to Thais and vice-versa could at the very least be higher than average.

We have a responsibility to protect not only our own health but that of all our partners.

[cdnmatt]

Not to state the obvious or anything, but maybe not fucking 5 different people a week would prove to be beneficial?

Then again, I'm hardly one to talk. Little while ago I had pubic lice running around in my eyes.

[fountainhall]

. . . maybe not fucking 5 different people a week would prove to be beneficial?

I'll win the lottery before most gay visitors stop fucking around!

[francois]

And let's not forget infection from HPV (Human papillomavirus) which is quite common. Good news is that there is an effective vaccine; bad news is that most people don't get the vaccine. HPV was the cause of death of the beloved LMTU who often proclaimed his taste for cock sucking.

[fountainhall]

Whilst of the subject of protecting oneself, please don't forget to get vaccinated against shingles. Over dinner at Dick's two friends who had suffered from it explained the pain and discomfort, to say nothing of the danger to your sight it you are unlucky enough to have it strike you on the forehead. The vaccine has only recently become available in Thailand and I had the shot at BNH in Bangkok the next day. It was expensive, Bt. 6,000 plus a consultation fee. But the doctor said it is extremely effective and protects you for about 10 years.

[francois]

Yes, good idea to get Shingles vaccine but not 100% effective, even so, it can reduce severity of an occurrence as I have experienced.The bf recently had his grandmother vaccinated at a Clinic even though she has had shingles; cost 6000 Baht as reported above.

I read there is a newer version of the vaccine but not readily available.