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A question for retirees
I won't be in a position to retire for about 7 years, but I wonder what made you choose Thailand as your retirement destination. Food. temples, boys, cheap living costs? What would be your best piece of advice to someone thinking about retiring there?
Just to clarify, I don't work anymore - I'm a full time carer for my mother who is 93. My mention of retirement refers to receiving the State Pension of about тВм240 per week.
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Re: A question for retirees
Only reason to retire there is the Boyz. As for advice, don't burn your bridges back to home.
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Re: A question for retirees
Don't forget the cheap but disgusting wine, francois :)
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Re: A question for retirees
I'm not retired but living here for almost 3 years now. there's a big 'digital nomad' group here in thailand...
a lot of location-independent / self employed guys and gals in Bangkok and Chiang Mai. that's a big
draw for me. a low cost of living while building a business and living a bit of adventure.
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Re: A question for retirees
I've never heard that phrase "digital nomad" before. I assume that's what cdnmatt considers himself to be?
Btw, is a digital nomad a person who works online, and can do so from almost any location?
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Re: A question for retirees
It's an unanswerable question really. The short answer is that I chose Thailand because that is what I wanted to do. After spending 6 months of each of the last two years in Chiang Mai, I will, all being well, shortly be moving to Thailand permanently.
Which raises my best piece of advice. It's obviously difficult for you with your responsibility for your mother, but before you make a permanent move, try to spend at least one or two extended periods of 3 months or more in Thailand. It's not the same as being on holiday.
There are as many reasons for living in Thailand as there are expats. Don't concern yourself with why others have done it. Check out whether it works for you, on your terms, for your own reasons and if you are really, really, sure that it does, go for it.
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Re: A question for retirees
I'm assuming the 240 Euros is not your only income? If so ... good bloody luck. :-o
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Re: A question for retirees
Quote:
Originally Posted by joe552
What would be your best piece of advice to someone thinking about retiring there?
Make sure that you fulfill the requirements for the retirement visa extension and get it, if you wish to stay in Thailand continuously.
Make sure that you can (always) return home, if need be.
That's about it, I think. :)
(I'm not retired yet, too, that's just some general advice.)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by joe552
" ... is a digital nomad a person who works online (?) ... "
... also very much describes my Urologist, who is always interested in my prostate, digitally-wise.
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Off topic again! Joe, I promise I shall try and actually address your original question when I have thunk about it at length.
Meanwhile, you cannot but admit that you certainly leave a lot of 'entry points' within your posts which are difficult to ~ like Soi dogs ~ let lie.
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Re: A question for retirees
Smiles, happy to banter with you. I won't have the funds required for a retirement visa when the time comes (800,000Bt in the bank?). My brother lives quite happily in Cambodia on his state pension of тВм240 per week. I was just initiating a conversation about why people chose Thailand to retire to, rather than some place else.
Sorry that you are of an age where a urologist gets to finger your prostate - I have a few more years before that happens (I hope) :)
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Re: A question for retirees
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Originally Posted by francois
Only reason to retire there is the Boyz. As for advice, don't burn your bridges back to home.
Agree wholeheartedly. Is the 240 Euros on top of owning your accommodation? If so could you rent it out while you're in Thailand without affecting how much you get with the pension? 240 Euros doesn't sound enough if you propose continuing anything like the way of life you pursue while on holiday, especially as the likelihood of more medical costs increases with age and you won't have affordable health insurance in Thailand.
A friend of mine is thinking about selling his house which will give him roughly 12 million baht, buying something in Thailand for say four million baht, and living as far as possible on his pension which is the same as yours. He reckons that's "do-able" but he doesn't go to the bars that much, doesn't have or want a regular boyfriend, and has plenty of things that can occupy his time without having to spend lots of time with "friends".
Cambodia would be an even worse proposition than Thailand if you have health problems. Anything more than dandruff and you're medivaced to Thailand or Singapore. Didn't Fat Boy propose moving to Siem Reap once?
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Re: A question for retirees
joe:
Why did I retire to Thailand?
= The availability 24/7 of loads of nubile young adult males; plus the general absence on the whole here of "ageism".
Best advice to someone thinking of retirement?:
= Make sure you have sufficient income to live in Thailand comfortably and generously. Not enjoyable having to live the life of a 'cheap charlie'.
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Re: A question for retirees
Sooner you move,
sooner you can be "rebound guy"
for when Scottish Guy is next available... :ymhug:
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Re: A question for retirees
Although not retired, moving here was a no brainer after living for more than 2 decades in South-East Asia - for all the reasons mentioned above. Basically, I did not want to return to the west. Whilst I considered Kuala Lumpur quite seriously - KL was a very cruisy city in the 90s! - there was never much doubt in my mind that it would be Bangkok.
I'd emphasise three things. Spend a lengthy period here before you make the decision to move - already highlighted. Remember that under present UK regulations, if you live abroad your pension is frozen once you start to draw it down. Official inflation figures are low at present but prices of many goods are rising faster here in Thailand. Lastly - and most important in my view - is health insurance. Some expats leave it too late and end up having to self-insure. That's fine if you have a lot of spare cash. If not, make sure you lock into a policy that will be suitable for you in Thailand before you depart. Certainly before you are 65 and preferably before you are 60.
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Re: A question for retirees
I agree with the replies so far...
except...I would NOT recommend you buy in Thailand...
Leases of beautiful condos are readily available...at deep discount prices at the present...
Gives you control of your $$$ and freedom to change locations without worry of having to sell.
Also quite concerned for the 240 BP weekly pension from UK you quoted...and possibility it will
not increase for inflation...per fountainhall's comment above.
Your ability to access the British health care system may be denied as an expat living in Thailand...or outside the UK.
Again, do your research...and I can assure you when fountainhall speaks on that subject he knows what he is talking about!
Good luck to you...
tj
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Re: A question for retirees
The boards have quite a variety of opinions re buying v. renting. I decided to buy almost 15 years ago. I now have an asset that will sell for more than I paid and have lived rent free (apart from management fees and a small amount of maintenance) for all my time in Bangkok. At the same age, I would try to do the same. Renting probably makes more sense the older one is. On the other hand, you are then subject to often unquantifiable market forces. I know one expat on a small budget who got a great rental deal on a condo unit. Two years later he now has to move because the rent has been jacked up beyond his ability to pay. Pattaya may be different, though.
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Re: A question for retirees
Quote:
Originally Posted by travelerjim
Leases of beautiful condos are readily available...at deep discount prices at the present...
Gives you control of your $$$ and freedom to change locations without worry of having to sell.
Yeah Jim is write but many of these condos are down side streets with few passing taxis so to the smart arse who responded to my taxi Apps post that is the reason why you would use them Apps.
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Re: A question for retirees
Just to clarify - I'm Irish so the figure of 240 pension per week is in Euro. I have no plans personally to retire to Thailand as I won't the 800,000Bt needed for a retirement visa. I was simply starting a conversation about why people chose Thailand as their retirement destination. Thanks for all the interesting replies.
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Re: A question for retirees
240 Euros = 10,562 Thai baht weekly...
IF that is the sum total of your retirement funds...
You are short of the sum to live in Thailand as a retiree comfortably.
And IF NO inflation increases in your pension, you will become squeezed in years ahead from Thai inflation.
I have seen many such a expat retiree who are now experiencing that squeeze...as they retired 20 years ago.
Be careful...and prudent in your decision.
Of course...trying to retire on those Euros in your home country will also be a challenge for you.
Best to you...Good Luck!
tj
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Re: A question for retirees
I will also have a small pension pot of about тВм25,000 - but as I said, I have no plans to retire in Thailand. My likely destination is Tenerife in the Canary Islands, where I can live more cheaply than Ireland, and avail of free medical care.
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Re: A question for retirees
Pardon me Joe552...
I clearly misunderstood your original question...and am confused.
Why would you ask your question IF you had NO intention to retire in Thailand?
" but I wonder what made you choose Thailand as your retirement destination.
Food. temples, boys, cheap living costs?
What would be your best piece of advice to someone thinking about retiring there?"
You even brought up the 240 Euros pension...in your post.
Several board members were kind to reply postings to your OP...
but actually it was exercise all for nothing, In my humble opinion.
Oh well...
Good luck...
tj
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Re: A question for retirees
Quote:
Originally Posted by travelerjim
Pardon me Joe552...
I clearly misunderstood your original question...and am confused.
Why would you ask your question IF you had NO intention to retire in Thailand?
" but I wonder what made you choose Thailand as your retirement destination.
Food. temples, boys, cheap living costs?
What would be your best piece of advice to someone thinking about retiring there?"
You even brought up the 240 Euros pension...in your post.
Several board members were kind to reply postings to your OP...
but actually it was exercise all for nothing, In my humble opinion.
Oh well...
Good luck...
tj
-I agree with tj. The way you phrased the questions suggested you were considering retirement here not merely starting a conversation. A lot of us do not like our time being wasted.
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Re: A question for retirees
Thailand is so different today than it was when I retired here 11 years ago that I can"t comprehend what it will be like 7 from now. If I was to retire today it wouldn't be in Thailand . When I did retire it wasn't for the temples or the food!
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Re: A question for retirees
A sincere apology for my original post. I was merely trying to start a conversation rather than looking for personal advice. Thanks to all who contributed. I'm sure the information provided will be useful to someone who may be considering a move.
Again, really sorry guys, I didn't intend to mislead.
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Re: A question for retirees
No problem Joe...
From past experiences here when someone poses a question..
many members will happily reply...
Many times the reply takes time to be well thought out...
and thus a good thread is developed to assist the OP and others as well.
Again..
Good Luck in your future retirement plans in the Antarctica...
lol
tj
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Re: A question for retirees
hello manforallseasons,
you wrote, "if I was to retire today it would not be in Thailand"....
please tell us why - as I am interested in retiring in Thailand. I want to make sure that I don't make a big mistake - so any feedback is greatly appreciated.
thanks,
m.
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Re: A question for retirees
Quote:
Originally Posted by Manforallseasons
Thailand is so different today than it was when I retired here 11 years ago that I can"t comprehend what it will be like 7 from now.
That remark as piqued my interest! What's so different now, in your opinion? The past 11 years are pretty much the time I've covered in Thailand (first as a frequent visitor, then as a resident), and my own impressions are best summarized as, "The more things change, the more they stay the same". Compared to all the other countries I've kept track of in the same period, Thailand hasn't really changed all that much from my personal experience. That's why I'm interested in which BIG changes others see, I might have simply missed them.
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Re: A question for retirees
I decided not to retire to Thailand. Mostly because I was unsure of the political stability, the economy and, sadly , a difficult tonal language that I have failed to make real headway with. the idea of growing old surrounded by people who I could not really communicate with sounded like a very bad idea. Recently, as I considered spending more time there I read this e book from Amazon: Thailand: Why You Shouldn't Retire To Thailand [Kindle Edition]
The Blether (Author), Zart CG (Illustrator).
I think he lays out some of the very real costs, the healthcare issues and much more, It was a very cheap book - and a quick read by what I take to be an honest man who has experienced the reality of retiring abroad, away from native support systems and examines the TRUE costs. BY the way, the boys may be cheaper than in New York or London but that is relative to how much disposable cash you have left each month.
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Re: A question for retirees
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Originally Posted by lego
"That remark as piqued my interest! What's so different now, in your opinion? ... "
In a nutshell: progress.
The most distinctive observation which I remember having on my first holiday in Thailand back in 2000, was ~ during the taxi ride from the airport to a hotel in Bangkok ~ the incredible numbers of large empty shells of buildings which lined the motorway. Already crumbling, covered in black mold and vines, they were the detritus of the economic crash of 1997, three years before I arrived.
In Canada, I had already seen TV news shows of Thai multimillionaires now selling noodles on the streets, and later Suphot told me stories of~ during that time ~ how he had shunted from job to job only to see his employers shut down their businesses one by one.
None of that anymore: Army coups ~ two of them since I've been around ~ ridiculous politics and endemic corruption notwithstanding, Thailand grows. Although there are a few skeletons from 1997 still decaying upright in Bangkok like forgotten war memorials, most of them have been torn down now, replaced by condos, high rises, malls, more traffic, more skytrain stations, never-ending Tescos, and IKEA. The gentle little Bangkok neighbourhood of On Nut that I remember ~ not so long ago it was the last skytrain station on the Sukhumvit Line ~ is now swimming in huge condos and my favourite old traditional Bangkok night market is being squeezed smaller and smaller from all sides. It won't be there much longer, sadly.
This is one of the most famous decaying memorials, you can see it from Sathorn Rd. Thais think it is filled with ghosts, so, naturally, no one will pull it down!
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v1...s96d7d8bb.jpeg
Hua Hin ~ our home ~ is going the same way. There used to be what I would characterise as a 'green zone' between the end of the town buildup and the overpass on the road to Pranburi. Nothing left of it now, and that's only since 2007.
On the positive side of that: Thai national parks are much better kept than they used to be. Huge numbers of Thai folks are slowly dragging themselves into the middle class . . . and the importance of that one single economic trend cannot be overstated.
But the Thai genes for Party/Sanook Time and "mai bphen rai" and familial loyalty has not diminished. A general sense of good old fashioned joie de vivre and a healthy sprinkle of Cosmic Acceptance regarding life-itself shared by Thais was one of the main drawing cards ~ a magnet if you will ~ for me to end up retiring in Thailand right from the get-go, then I'll be sticking around, probably until I croak. (Aside: whatever you may think at this point ... rose coloured glasses are not in my wardrobe).
I'm not ~ never will be ~ one of these rather unimaginative farangs who think dragging their Thai boyfriends off to greener pastures in N America or Europe is the Holy Grail. My guy at least, would probably shrivel up and die ... his genes stolen.
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Re: A question for retirees
is 4,000 eur per month ok to get by on in retirement in Thailand?
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Re: A question for retirees
Absolutely in my opinion.
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Re: A question for retirees
Quote:
Originally Posted by bkkmfj2648
hello manforallseasons,
you wrote, "if I was to retire today it would not be in Thailand"....
please tell us why - as I am interested in retiring in Thailand. I want to make sure that I don't make a big mistake - so any feedback is greatly appreciated.
thanks,
m.
I've noticed you have 42 posts and I assume you are familiar with Thailand of recent, when it retired here it was a wonderland of sleepy sex joints and many many bar boys and Fillininesque farangs , elephants etc. there is no way to discribed how wonderful it was, every evening was an adventure, one only has to see it now if they knew it then to see that Thailand is much lesser of a gay destination, the present government has stated the image of Thailand as a sex heaven must change I'm not sure how much more it will change but I take the current government at their word. Nothing lasts forever and it's been in decline for years if sex is of little interest to you it might work for you, things also cost about double than they did when I retired.
You should however keep visiting Bangkok, Pattaya , Chiangmai and Phuket and judge if anywhere suites you.
I am trying to sell my condo and leave, 2 of my friends have left already, a third is looking for an alternative.
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Re: A question for retirees
So where would be your alternative?
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Re: A question for retirees
I think Smiles has a great point about the progress in Thailand. It has a lot of catching up to do compared to other countries in the area. That means higher prices for just about everything. Look at South Korea. In fact they developed with such enthusiasm they covered a river in Their Capitol with concrete and now are trying to undo it and bring some green back.
Middle class on the way. I bought a condo in anticipation of higher prices in the future as I plan on retiring in LO S at some point. A bit too early as there's a glut right now.
The evenings of exciting sexual adventure may come to an end at some point if not already. But seriously, there will always be plenty of bois to be had , if not from bars from the internet. And even if they shut GR down there will always be cruise areas.
Too much gloom and doom c'mon.
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Re: A question for retirees
Quote:
Originally Posted by joe552
So where would be your alternative?
Uruguay! heh, I have no idea, but will let you know how it is there.
Ummm, as for Thailand, I don't think I'd retire here. Then again, I'm way too young (and poor) to be worrying about retirement.
I'm one of those typical cases who says, once you live here for so many years, the rose tinted glasses fall off, and blah, blah, blah... you've heard it before, but it is true. I am glad I ended up in Thailand for the time I did though, as I think it bettered me as an individual in many ways. I'm more confident in my own skin now, and I don't sweat the small stuff as much, both of which I think I can thank Thai society in general for.
What they say about the rose tinted glasses is true though. When you come from the West, society here seems so polite and respectful you almost have to pinch yourself, right? Give it a few years, and you realize it's not genuine. Thais are brought up to be very selfish, greedy, and nationalistic which causes xenophobia. You even know these things after just being here a few times as a tourist, but you don't admit them to yourself. Give it a few years though, and it does get tiresome.
Thailand is a great country with great people, but don't think I'd ever retire here. Not to mention, it's not all that cheap anyway. I'm living very frugally these days saving for my Uruguay move, and I still manage to blow through 60,000/month somehow, and that's just me and the dogs -- no giks, nights out, nothing. Plus I could be wrong, but I'd say it's becoming more difficult as the years tick by to tell whether you're in Asia or out West.
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Re: A question for retirees
Quote:
Originally Posted by Smiles
The gentle little Bangkok neighbourhood of On Nut that I remember ~ not so long ago it was the last skytrain station on the Sukhumvit Line ~ is now swimming in huge condos and my favourite old traditional Bangkok night market is being squeezed smaller and smaller from all sides. It won't be there much longer, sadly.
This is one of the most famous decaying memorials, you can see it from Sathorn Rd. Thais think it is filled with ghosts, so, naturally, no one will pull it down!
I'm not so sure this is a ghost issue, but rather as you alluded to earlier....the fact that so much has built up around everything so quickly, that there are few ways to pull this building down now without taking out the surrounding neighbourhood or worse...falling into the river.
Christianpfc posted a facinating article on his adventures with the building on Gay Thailand a year or so back.
http://www.gaythailand.com/forums/to...ictures-taken/
[youtube:3o2olcfc]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vX_3ABo7AoU[/youtube:3o2olcfc]
Quote:
Originally Posted by joe552
A sincere apology for my original post. I was merely trying to start a conversation rather than looking for personal advice. Thanks to all who contributed. I'm sure the information provided will be useful to someone who may be considering a move.
I think it's a great question, one I've struggled with myself these past years. Property ownership here in Thailand has been a roller coaster ride from the very beginning and when I retire, I'm going to be looking for something quite a bit more stable than this. I don't want to plan on settling down somewhere, where I might have to pick up and go...possibly in a hurry. Thailand, for me has become one of those kind of countries since this crisis and like Smiles said, this is the second coup...remembering 2006.
I look at my own aging mother and know that at her age and condition, she could never just pick up and move and so I have to think of myself when I'm that age and not as mobile. I prefer to set my roots in deep.
Like you Joe, I'm looking after my mother and I think about how comfortable I've been able to make her in the house in Guatemala these past few years and how I could easily live the same lifestyle myself when I'm at that age. Hopefully I'll be as mobile as she is now, but the help that we've arranged to look after both her and the house has been with us for years and is like family to us. The older I get the more things like this, being closer to home and being able to enjoy a good bottle of wine are important for me.
I'll keep coming to Thailand as long as I can suffer the 12 plus 2 hour flight which hopefully will continue for another 20 years or more.
Surfcrest
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Re: A question for retirees
If you haven't worked it out yet there's another 1997 on the way for Thailand so I wouldn't be all doom and gloom about the cost of living in Thailand - I just wouldn't keep any money there, certainly nothing tied up long term like a condo. As for the 800,000 baht qualification for a retirement visa, do what all my friends do - lie to their embassy and get a declaration "confirming" their income. The one worry is the exorbitant cost of anything that comes close to decent health care especially if you've got a chronic disease requiring regular medication.
http://www.forbes.com/sites/jessecolomb ... e-crash/3/
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Re: A question for retirees
Quote:
Originally Posted by fountainhall
I now have an asset that will sell for more than I paid.
You will only know that for sure when you do sell it.
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Re: A question for retirees
Quote:
Originally Posted by Surfcrest
Like you Joe, I'm looking after my mother too and I think about how comfortable I've been able to make her in the house in Guatemala these past few years and how I could easily live the same lifestyle when I'm at that age.
She has rent boys dropping by? Wow!
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Re: A question for retirees
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Originally Posted by kommentariat
You will only know that for sure when you do sell it.
Perfectly valid point. But even if it sold for nothing (which, being the centre of Bangkok, would require some sort of massive calamity), I am still better off - and will continue to be so - than if I had rented for so many years. I fully accept, though, that for anyone who is not 100% certain that this is where they want to live, renting makes far more sense until they are in a better position to decide.