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know its off topic but a study needs to be carried out on the Thai mindset...why is it only ( as far as I know) in Thailand that one finds male gogo bars where just about everyone is available..why has this wonderfjul customer centric business model not taken off elsewhere...sure there is the odd place that may pop up Costa Rica and north east Brazil spring to mind from personal experience) & provide similar services but nothing as widespread & organised as in Thailand.
Fascinating question! Manila certainly had gogo bars where almost everything was avaliable in the late 1970s/early 1980s. I believe the legendary Coco Bananas was Asia's first gay club although it did not have gogo boys. But there were several bars with gogo boys nearby. Then there was the huge barn that was 690 Retiro Strip with I believe over 100 boys, catwalks, frequent nudity and short time rooms.Quote:
Originally Posted by latintopxxx
I think it's interesting that both Manila and Bangkok were major centres where the American GIs enjoyed their Vietnam R&R breaks (or as was often stated I&I - Intoxication and Intercourse). Randy young men with fat pay checks ready to find first girls. Local entrepreneurs then jumped on the bandwagon by opening gay bars on the same model. But which came first? I think Manila, but it's a guess. Now I think Manila is basically dead as the gogo bars seem much less raunchy than those in Thailand.
Dont think it has much to do with mindset, more with what is allowed legally (though of course we all know this touchy subject has its special regulations and convenient by-passes to the BiBs) and if there is sufficient demand and nr of guys even willing to do this.Quote:
Originally Posted by latintopxxx
Bars/shops with guys for rent, directly and perhaps even with space on the premises are far more widespread, but as a very general rough idea I think the nr is declining.
The Thai sex-for-sale scene is modelled at the str8 version-and this is/was mostly modelled at the Japanese offer. From what I understand there still is such a scene-but without gox2 in Nihon. Perhaps real historians might even be able to follow the lines of where US-GIs had to stay for quite a while-others might only state this made that trade flourish and open it to westerners/farang (gwailo).
Another factor might be -or at least in the past more- that such guys willing to do this type of work would ask for some form of protection, in-house security or even just regular food+clothes (in the very distant past). It was also well known that both the girls and the guys started with a big debt to the ´boss´ and thus were kind of forced to stay there till this was paid off. But that would also apply to al those Isany teeners who reached big city in whatever small job. Which led to them doing whatever what was asked-and if some extra would be paid our, great! (a theme even very recently still pursued in a Thai por movie on onlyfans- kuay super)
ON a rather far perspective one might see it was a happy coincidence of 2 demographic factors: a large supply of eager young teeners looking for a job and a larger willing audience willing to pay and travel far to get it, as @ home it would not be readily available.
But this is all far too theoretic and boring-latin, you are curious enough and know what and where to look for-when do we finally get a few more of your new discoveries?
this sort of activity is legal in many countries, puchos in costs rica has naked strippers on a stage (that you can film with your mobile) and once off the stage will mingle with the crowd in exchange for tips allow themselves to be groped/fondled/every orifice explored....& if u retreat into a dark corned do more....brazil too has sex shows/orgies in bars/clubs....but nobody does gogo bars with guys on stages on display all available...in the afore mentioned venues there may be 1/2 dozen guys available for rent but in no way is it as organised & easy like Thailand.
...american GIs...the common thread....shuld convince dementiua joe to open up more bases around the world....excellent unintended consequences
Because the cops are more corrupt in Thailand than other places, and actually allow the gay go-go bars to be open. Other places are all pissy about religion, conservative values, blah, blah.
That, and Thais are by nature just very entreprenurial. This is a place where you can literally just grab a bunch of oranges from a farm, spread some newspaper on a street corner somewhere, sit down and start selling oranges.
When I was younger, the male equivalent was present in USA big cities (NYC, Boston, Atlanta, Miami, Ft Lauderdale, orlando, Philadelphia) now largely or completely gone. pushed out by local laws/religion (I mean NYC in the 70's was awesome sleeze, now is disney and starbucks). Stripper, whores, sex shows... orgies in adult book store dark areas, sauna that were awesome. I saw it all. now largely gone.
When I lived in Budapest from 2009 through 2011 - there was a male go-go bar (Action Bar) for us gays.
When I returned to live in Budapest again, from 2016 - the last remaining male go-go bar for us gays had already closed.
I do not know why it closed.
In the 2009 - 2011 years - it was quite busy on the weekend when they had their shows, "Live Fuck Show" on Friday night and "Oral Academy" on Saturday night.
The strippers/performers would eventually come down off of the stage into the audience so you could have a feel and touch. On Oral Academy night you could also suck the models.
On Thursday nights, was Escort Night - where you could meet and drink with the local escort guys - get their info and even go home with them.
Those were the good old days....Now onto Thailand...
You wonder why it’s gone? Ask Viktor Orban.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Uranus
If we should ask Orban about Hungary, then we should ask Biden about USA?Quote:
Originally Posted by maump
we went off topic!Quote:
Originally Posted by Moses
The presidents are a result of the populous and cycles in human history. we are in a populist cycle, dissatisfied people, power hungry politicians, clumsy ineffective government - perhaps the last one ever.
new technologies will enable future authoritarians to control us completely in the future. i fear even American privately held guns will not stop it. Only incompetency has prevented it so far in USA. 1984 is upon us. we are doomed. stupid sheep. democracies get the government they deserve.
USA is a Plutocracy. Big media and corporate interests control us. Murdock hastened the destruction. the people running our plutocracy will not be happy with the dictator they finally get. desantis? Biden is too ineffective to stop it. the people are frustrated and so easy to control. identify some enemies to hate: fags, trans, immigrants, jews, blacks.... " believe only me!, only I can fix it!" same old playbook. works great. "the quest hangs on the edge of a knife, stray but a little and it will fail - to the ruin of us all" America will fall..
I believe some even owned bars - Classic Boys was one example. Others own girlie barsQuote:
Originally Posted by cdnmatt
There are many male go-go bars in Canada.Quote:
Originally Posted by cdnmatt
please explain...stock bar?? what does an off cost?
i also believe that the definition of gogo bar differs...dont think that in Canada one can order a gogo off thge stage....have him sit next to you while you stick half your hand up his butt...pay a super low off fee....and then once you have him in your room ride him all night ....
At go-go bars in Montreal, much the same as in Thailand. Can have them sit with you or can do a private dance at the club. Cannot off them until after closing hours but no off fee at that time. Some like a finger in their butt; I doubt a hand.Quote:
Originally Posted by latintopxxx
Delightful thoughts.Quote:
Originally Posted by maump
You must be a lot of fun at parties.
dunno dodger....the latest revelatuons by must woukd indicate that big bro now conbtrols what u see, filtering out negative comments or differiung oipinioins...
Only talk politics to interested participants....Quote:
Originally Posted by Dodger
If workers from Laos and Cambodia could no longer come to Thailand, I wonder if the go go scene would survive? or the commercial sex scene generally?
Yeah, even as a foreigner living there in the 2000s it was pretty dismal. Or wonderfully safe and livable for a big American city, depending on which side of the debate you fall on. I found it awful - Starbucks, D'Agostinos, Kinko on every other block. Haven't been back since I left the country; apparently it's all million-dollar condos in Park Slope now. (???) When I hear stories like maump's, I get nostalgic for times I never had the pleasure to experience.Quote:
Originally Posted by maump
An interesting question that I missed earlier. We know that in the 1970s, 80s and 90s, gogo boys in Thailand came almost without exception from within the country. Most unskilled boys seemed to come from Isaan where it was either work on the farm, in the rice paddies or go without an income. The Asian Economic crisis which started in Thailand in July 1997 only made everything worse, thereby hastening a flood of boys from the countryside desperate for bar work.Quote:
Originally Posted by Oliver2
The Thaksin government re-energised the economy which had been staggering as a result of crippling IMF sanctions. After all, the corrupt and incompetent Chavalit government had spent all the country's foreign exchange reserves fighting off an earlier attack on the baht by speculators in the spring of 1997. Thaksin ensured cash went to each town. How much was creamed off in corruption can only be guesswork, but presumably some found its way to the villagers and townsfolk. With the economy starting to boom, not even the 2008 world financial crisis had much effect on employment and I assume this was because the tourist sector had really started to take off in a big way.
Add to that the quite severe fall in the birth rate which dropped by around 35% between 1985 to 2000, improved education, a much improved awareness of the effect of HIV/AIDS and greater work opportunities, and a significant reduction in the supply of boys to work in the bars was inevitable. Take away those from neighbouring countries now working in bars and what is left? A vastly reduced bar scene for sure.
I get the impression that there has been no such fall in the number of girls working in the straight gogo scene. Add in the rise of better quality gentlemen's clubs where the ambience is more like a VIP Club, the girls as attractive if not more so, entertainment is more professional, and like Japanese geisha the girls are better conversationalists if only because most will speak reasonably good English.
https://bangkoknightlife.com/best-gentlemen-clubs/
Would such clubs for gay men work economically? For all I know, they already do exist but only for Thais. So my guess is there will always be a commercial gay sex scene but it is likely to be far less for expats and tourists. The halcyon days of the 1980s and 1990s are never going to return, sadly.
IMHO its mostly the stark falling birth nrs plus also the stark rising level of education that minimizes the nr of Thai working guys in the scene. And its also not just this branch of work-many others of low paid work now also rely a lot on foreign workers. Same-same as f.e. here in Germany where I happen to be now.
Back to original Q: I think it should be best frased as: why has this branch of economy survived in TH and died in other countries? Amsterdam/NL once has at least 2 well-known such venues. And again Germany must also have had several.
And as so very often the gay scene simply mirrors the str8 such: gogo places with females also survive a lot in TH. I have no idea how they cope with probably also falling nrs of females wanting to work there.
An excellent analysis, Amando.
When families were trying raise six or seven children, the levels of poverty were extraordinarily high. It was , in all likelihood, the last couple of children born who made the journey to Bangkok or Pattaya.
Widely-available birth control changed all that. And there was no Catholic Church or deranged US evangelicals to stop it.
Thaksin had his critics but I changed my views about him when I met my future partner. It was Thaksin's administration that produced improvements in health, education and the environment. Many homes did not even have electricity before this. P remembers trying to do his homework by candle-light.
The right-wing/military/royalist coups, ironically, also benefited from Thaksin's premiership in that it had prevented possible civil unrest that may have threatened the generals. Just as the Red shirts did until the Bangkok massacre.
I have watched with interest the changes though the prism of his family. Material progress yes ,but also the advancement of life chances. For example his nephew, now twenty, is at university and living in Kampaeng Phaet. I compare that to P, trying to do his homework in a leaky, wooden hut, and despite being a good student, finding only menial labouring jobs. Including rice-farming.
Until Pattaya in 2002....but that's another story.
You could be right, but I haven't the foggiest clue what you're talking about.Quote:
Originally Posted by pong
Too many nrs's and nr's.
I blame MTV and the associated globalisation...omce the locals have seen how we live and tasted McDonalds & coke...no way was life knee deep in a paddy field the future...
I di miss soi twilight in BKK, on a good night there would have been at least 300 "dancers" to choose from and full on sex shows in every venue...and lots of eye candy...could while the evening away sitting outside watching the activities...
But as with everything progress marches on...and online shopping has crept into our world...there is a huge variety available online...but somehow its a bit like drinking aloine...not as vibrant as drinking with friends in a crowded bar heaving with talent.
Tawan bar in BKK I believe....enjoyed lots of good shows there...not really porn so hopefully the moderators will not ban......
The link in this post was removed under rule 3.2.3 (5). An unexpurgated copy of the post can be found in the members’ only Holding Room by clicking on the following link: https://sawatdeenetwork.com/v4/showt...ale-go-go-bars
Jellybean
Moderator
i need to find this holding room
I think he may referring to numbers? Why make it easy when you can make it difficult?Quote:
Originally Posted by Dodger
It is easy to find, latintopxxx, it is located below the Feedback, How To, forum's FAQ forum. See photo below:Quote:
Originally Posted by latintopxxx
Attachment 13185
Or just click on the link!