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Re: New bar opened in old Topman,the Scotland Discussion
Why do Union supporters have this obsession with trying to drive a non-existent wedge between Scotland and the Shetland Islands - couldn't be the oil, could it?
I'd be far more convinced if they also publicised and supported the situation of Cornwall - but I guess getting their hands on Clotted Cream is somewhat less financially attractive to them
:))
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Re: New bar opened in old Topman,the Scotland Discussion
It will be interesting to analyse the referendum results area by area. You are, by the way, mistaken in assuming that I am a Union supporter simply because I am mocking you and pointing out the inevitability of the defeat of the question. Politically I incline to the Swiss model of government, where almost everything is put to a referendum. Acknowledging reality is something that seems ATFH for people like you and Salmonella.
I'm still deeply interested in the contortions you may come up with to justify your moral superiority over Tony Blair while at the same time (possibly contemporaneously?) exploiting the Third World poor for your own sexual gratification.
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Re: New bar opened in old Topman,the Scotland Discussion
Quote:
Originally Posted by kommentariat
I'm still deeply interested in the contortions you may come up with to justify your moral superiority over Tony Blair while at the same time (possibly contemporaneously?) exploiting the Third World poor for your own sexual gratification.
That's a bit harsh. Scottish-guy hasn't done anything like that for about 5 years now.
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Re: New bar opened in old Topman,the Scotland Discussion
MiniMee - you only ever seem to post about Scottish-guy's travels to Thailand - what's that about? Nothing else of interest to contribute to the forum, like details of your own travels?
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Re: New bar opened in old Topman,the Scotland Discussion
Re the issue of the pound sterling surviving independence in Scotland I went -huntin' and 'chasin' for info.
Low and behold I found that S . Ireland -left the union in 1922- kept sterling until the early 70's when it voluntarily withdrew. I didn't know that so I stand corrected Mr Scottish guy.
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Re: New bar opened in old Topman,the Scotland Discussion
Quote:
Originally Posted by kommentariat
....I'm still deeply interested in the contortions you may come up with to justify your moral superiority over Tony Blair while at the same time (possibly contemporaneously?) exploiting the Third World poor for your own sexual gratification.
No "contortions" necessary - I simply don't see the validity in conflating the murder of hundreds of thousands of civilians with paying a Thai rentboy 1000B for a wank.
I'd imagine few others would see the validity either, but .... up to them.
Meantime, for MiniMee's benefit - I'm in Tunisia.
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Re: New bar opened in old Topman,the Scotland Discussion
Quote:
Originally Posted by thaiguest
Re the issue of the pound sterling surviving independence in Scotland I went -huntin' and 'chasin' for info.
Low and behold I found that S . Ireland -left the union in 1922- kept sterling until the early 70's when it voluntarily withdrew. I didn't know that so I stand corrected Mr Scottish guy.
No problem Thaiguest, and I admire your willingness to do your own research
If only others would do likewise - instead of readily swallowing the bilge from the British mainstream media
:ymhug:
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Re: New bar opened in old Topman,the Scotland Discussion
Quote:
Originally Posted by scottish-guy
I simply don't see the validity in conflating the murder of hundreds of thousands of civilians with paying a Thai rentboy 1000B for a wank.
Ah yes, your Catholic upbringing shining through. Tony Blair has committed mortal sin; your peccadilloes are minor in comparison. It's the morality of the speeding driver - "I wasn't going as fast as the other guy". Hypocrisy is something other people do, isn't it!
Besides the issue isn't about Tony Blair but the Scottish Nationalists in-built assumption that they, somehow, are more moral than the rest of the UK, and regaining independence will return them to a state of moral perfection somewhat akin to Before the Fall of Man.
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Re: New bar opened in old Topman,the Scotland Discussion
Except I'm not a Catholic - never have been, never will be. So, that part of your argument is as specious as the rest.
I know of no-one in the official YES campaign who has said that Scots are any better people than anyone else - what we reject is the suggestion that we are any worse than anyone else, and somehow uniquely incapable of running our own country. However, if you can provide quotes from such people to support your case, I'll be most interested to see them.
You know, from all these adverse comments you make, it's looking more and more that you have a bit of a chip on your shoulder, Kommie. I'm no psychologist but I think people who boast of being "sexual predators" often have issues they need to work out via professional intervention. Now, don't take offence - I'm only trying to help :x
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Re: New bar opened in old Topman,the Scotland Discussion
Quote:
Originally Posted by scottish-guy
I'm no psychologist but I think people who boast of being "sexual predators" often have issues they need to work out via professional intervention.
Agreed, you are no psychologist. I'll go further - guys who like Asians do so because Asians look younger. There's an obvious inference there about what forbidden desires they may be sublimating. As for Scotland's moral superiority, it's implicit in every comment you make about why would Scots want to be "stuck" with politicians like Blair. An independent Scotland would, of course, never produce a politician of his like.
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Re: New bar opened in old Topman,the Scotland Discussion
Quote:
guys who like Asians do so because Asians look younger.
Really? I didn't know that. Are you taking it upon yourself to speak for all "guys" in general, or do you have some statistics to back up that ridiculous claim?
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Re: New bar opened in old Topman,the Scotland DiscussionA
a447 - Kommie is clearly talking for and about himself. He boasts he's a sexual predator after all
I'm sure I read very similar comments, snide remarks, and thinly veiled accusations, over on another (now defunct) board.
How sad.
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Re: New bar opened in old Topman,the Scotland Discussion
You're not wrong, SG.
Anyway, let's just sit back and wait for him to post his statistics. I mean, he wouldn't post such dribble with all it's nasty innuendo if he didn't have figures to back it up, would he?
Well, would he??
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Re: New bar opened in old Topman,the Scotland Discussion
Quote:
Originally Posted by thaiguest
Re the issue of the pound sterling surviving independence in Scotland I went -huntin' and 'chasin' for info.
Just back from casting my pro-Scotland vote.......in the NO box of course! A self-governing Scotland being run by SNP with Alex Salmond as leader within the UK is the perfect scenario for any true Scot. But sorry you went through that pointless exercise 'thaiguest', as everyone in Scotland was already aware....... that there is, and never was any chance whatsoever of a YES vote winning from day one of the build up to the referendum.
I imagine a landslide NO will be the result, I have yet to meet anyone up in my neck of the woods (north of Perth) or among my family and circle of friends who have indicated they will be voting yes.
I am a long standing supporter of SNP and was even a party activist in my late teens, that early naivety thankfully now replaced with a balanced understanding of what actually makes Scotland and the great benefits Alex Salmond's inspirational leadership has given to Scotland with a now much fairer society, as it was he who managed to break the stranglehold of the "West of Scotland/Central Belt Bias" which held back the country for so long. Many outside Scotland have not taken the "West/Central Belt Bias" issue into consideration, but that will be a huge relevance for many outwith that area in their voting decision. While Salmond is in charge that fairness throughout Scotland will remain in place, however if, or rather when, he finally goes....who will follow him with strength of character to stand up to the bullying and self-interest of the "West Coast bias". Within the UK it can be dealt with, under a free Scotland with no political ties to the rest of the UK it would have been more of an issue and that is why there will be a huge % turnout throughout the whole of Scotland.
I hope Alex continues his leadership of Scotland within UK we will still be part of from tomorrow onwards, and enjoy the benefits of being a nation within the UK following our own agendas with a strong leader yet with the benefits of belonging to the UK, the Kingdom we Scots set up when our king invited England to join us a few years ago.
The only chance of a YES win would have been NO voters taking a win for granted and not bothering to make the effort to get to the ballot on the day, by all accounts that won't be happening with a huge turnout predicted.
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Re: New bar opened in old Topman,the Scotland Discussion
What a load of self-serving pish.
Had Newalanna's card marked already - no surprise, nothing to see - just one more so-called "proud Scot" who has betrayed his country today. Congratulations.
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Re: New bar opened in old Topman,the Scotland Discussion
Quote:
Originally Posted by scottish-guy
I'm no psychologist but I think people who boast of being "sexual predators" often have issues they need to work out via professional intervention. Now, don't take offence - I'm only trying to help.
While it takes a lot to offend me, I am reminded that various national Psychological Associations for many years classified homosexuality as an illness. It's not surprising therefore to find someone like you using the same tactics against those whose ideas you find dangerous.
As for rice queens and other lovers of Asians sublimating their "forbidden desire" I suggest you and AK47 discover a handy little tool called "the Internet search engine". I should hate to run foul of Surfcrest's paranoia about discussing such things.
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Re: New bar opened in old Topman,the Scotland Discussion
Quote:
Originally Posted by scottish-guy
Why do Union supporters have this obsession with trying to drive a non-existent wedge between Scotland and the Shetland Islands.
The first three results are all from the outer regions (formerly part of the old Kingdom of Norway??) - a very convincing No vote. Mind you, their percentages - almost 60/40 to the No side - may yet turn out to be in line with the rest of Scotland so scottish-guy could well prove to be correct - the wedge between the Shetland Islands and Scotland may well be non-existent. Anyone know where I can get Interflora to send a wreath to Salmonella?
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Remembrance of things past
Quote:
Originally Posted by scottish-guy
It's important to understand two things: 1) the genie is out of the bottle, and 2) we shall never give up.
Based on yon results, here's a wee thought for ye, laddie - The People's Republic O' Glasgow.
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Re: New bar opened in old Topman,the Scotland Discussion
Well, it seems we have lost by around 10% and I guess Kommie and others are entitled to gloat, as I would surely (and magnificently) have done had my view prevailed.
Alas, it did not - and although Glasgow and Dundee voted YES, it seems Edinburgh and the country bumpkins were unconvinced.
As for myself - profoundly ashamed to be Scottish this morning. We are now (deservedly) the laughing stock of the world and the Scottish people deserve every bit of the derision, and every bit of the English backlash which will now be landed on them.
Had our chance, and blew it. Shitebags at the end. Hell mend us.
Will the last-minute offer of a package of powers be delivered - well, let's see - but I strongly suspect the only gains for any Scots will be knighthoods for the quislings named Darling and Brown.
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Re: New bar opened in old Topman,the Scotland Discussion
What a sad post by what appears to be a very embittered SG. As a Scot I was a proud one yesterday and remain one today. I am overjoyed that the majority of the Scottish electorate voted NO and the Union remains intact today.
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Re: New bar opened in old Topman,the Scotland Discussion
Well I'm just saying what I feel at this time Pennyboy. I appreciate you feel differently, but I'm not sure exactly what it is you're "proud" of.
For 15 hours yesterday, and irrespective of which side people were on, you must agree that ordinary Scots for the first time ever held their own sovereignty in their own hands. They voted to give it away forever.
In my view that deserves no respect, no sympathy, and no future support. I therefore opt out - and when they get fucked in the arse as I fully expect - too bad, they have bent over and can take what's coming. I completely disown them.
I could have just slunk away, disappeared from this forum, and never commented again (no cheering please!) - but I'd much rather just call it as I see it. If that's sad and embittered, so be it.
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Re: New bar opened in old Topman,the Scotland Discussion
The result clearly show a nation divided. How that divide can be healed (if it can) will take better politicians than I've seen evidence of.
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Re: New bar opened in old Topman,the Scotland Discussion
It must be frustrating for those who supported the No vote.
However, the results are what the majority wants.
Because of the referendum Scots will not suddenly become 2 nations in one, so both camps need to find a way forward.
At any rate if the UK gov to be believed, the result will still be much more powers to the Scots.
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Re: New bar opened in old Topman,the Scotland Discussion
I see Salmonella has done the honourable thing and resigned. Quiet satisfaction at High Table that another Scots troublemaker has been seen off.
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Re: New bar opened in old Topman,the Scotland Discussion
Quote:
Originally Posted by joe552
The result clearly show a nation divided. How that divide can be healed (if it can) will take better politicians than I've seen evidence of.
I suggest everyone relax. If one is free from cancer and is not otherwise terminally ill what matters politics?
Scotland has been a complex place for a long time what with picts, scots(irish), norse(danes/norwegians) lowland english with their cheviots, asians, americans and so on adding their genes to the Albanach pool.
The almost total destruction of highland society during the infamous clearances was partly due to the GAELIC chiefs putting profit before the welfare of their loyal tenants. That secession turned out to be a step too far for this complex country doesn't surprise me.
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Re: New bar opened in old Topman,the Scotland Discussion
Nothing to be ashamed of Scottish-guy. I wanted a "no" only because of the pound as I live in Thailand. Had I been a Scot and entitled to vote I would have said "yes".
And had "yes' prevailed it would of been that arse-hole Cameron resigning and not Salmon.
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Re: New bar opened in old Topman,the Scotland Discussion
Surprisingly all I am going to say on the result is if the no vote won with Alistair Darling and Gordon Brown running the campaign it might have well been a landslide with a couple of decent politicians.
I've just been reading some of the things Scotty has said on this topic and he was a bit nasty to our Australian contributors but he was right about one thing, after the vote Scotland will be keeping the pound.
LATEST NEWS...... BP as just found another oil field in the North Sea estimated to hold 80 billion barrels of oil. What are the chances of that 2 days after the no result.
Oh well, that other tower of Scotland, Jim Dobbin as just died and its all of to Heywood and Middleton. Isn't that where the Pakistani grooming gang and the satanic abuse started ?
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Re: New bar opened in old Topman,the Scotland Discussion
I am very thrilled by the Scottish decision against independence if for no other reason than it is shoved up Scottish guy's "know it all" ass.
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Re: New bar opened in old Topman,the Scotland Discussion
Oooooohh thanks, Marti - it's been a long time since I had it shoved up my arse for free!
If only you'd been a bit bigger dear ......
:-*
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Re: New bar opened in old Topman,the Scotland Discussion
I think the Scottish electorate has demonstrated common sense and deserves some praise. Not coming from the UK (including Scotland) myself, I think both the high level of participation in the referendum and the outcome as such are laudable. On the one hand, breaking away from the UK is fraught with risk and uncertainties, so it's not surprising to me that most Scots (and the older ones in particular) didn't want to take a chance. On the other hand, to achieve a higher level of autonomy from Westminster - a vision that many NO voters seem to share - it was probably necessary to stage a credible threat of separation.
The way I'm reading it, the result of the vote is reflecting just that. Promises can be broken, but I think the Scots have shown that they're prepared to go all the way in case that happens. It will be interesting to see how the negotiations will go, and more likely than not, the YES supporters will have achieved something in the end.
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Re: New bar opened in old Topman,the Scotland Discussion
I see the rivalry between Glasgow and Edinburgh still exist , Glasgow voting yes and Edinburgh voting no .
Which brings me to Royal Bank of Scotland (owned by Lloyds of London ) and Standard Life Ins....and the NO voters
reminds me of the Scottish Nobles who betrayed Wallace for .."30 pieces of silver " and estates and land in England
to secure there loyalty for a better future !!
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Re: New bar opened in old Topman,the Scotland Discussion
Quote:
Originally Posted by lego
I think the Scottish electorate has demonstrated common sense and deserves some praise. Not coming from the UK (including Scotland) myself, I think both the high level of participation in the referendum and the outcome as such are laudable.
Ah yes, in your mind democracy is a Good Thing for white people, it's the Asians who aren't up to it?
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Re: New bar opened in old Topman,the Scotland Discussion
Promises made to secure NO vote, already falling apart.
Gordon Brown appoints himself unelected Governor General, and with no power whatsoever, expects us to believe Westminster will dance to his tune.
Scots voted freely to give their sovereignty away - hell mend them
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Re: New bar opened in old Topman,the Scotland Discussion
Quote:
Originally Posted by scottish-guy
Promises made to secure NO vote, already falling apart.
Gordon Brown appoints himself unelected Governor General, and with no power whatsoever, expects us to believe Westminster will dance to his tune.
Scots voted freely to give their sovereignty away - hell mend them
Oh no! Back to Business As Usual?!!
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Re: New bar opened in old Topman,the Scotland Discussion
Not quite - the victors have the opportunity to deliver on their promises. If they do that, nobody can validly complain.
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Re: New bar opened in old Topman,the Scotland Discussion
I think it doesn't make sense to expect results within days after the referendum. As much as I understand that the YES camp is disappointed, now there's really no need to rush anything. Wait and see what will happen, and if it isn't satisfactory, hold another referendum in 10 years.
Quote:
Originally Posted by kommentariat
Ah yes, in your mind democracy is a Good Thing for white people, it's the Asians who aren't up to it?
One thing is for sure, when I'll need to hire another spokesperson you don't need to apply. I've had nothing but praise for Indonesia's latest presidential election. That's an Asian country I think, with a large Asian electorate. They didn't give me the impression they weren't up to it.
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Re: New bar opened in old Topman,the Scotland Discussion
I don't disagree Lego, but here's the thing - the referendum momentum swung when the 3 Unionist party leaders raced up to Scotland about 10 days ago and published an agreed "Vow" of future, additional powers which they guaranteed to introduce. There was even questions asked at the time (and I think I referred to it) as to whether this was even legal given that both Govts had entered a period of purdah and were prevented from making new policy announcements.
Anyway - Within that signed document was a specific timetable of events that were guaranteed to happen at certain times along the devolution timeline.
Aware that they would be challenged on their intention to deliver (since the UK Govt reneged on promises in 1979) and to demonstrate good faith - they STRESSED that immediately after the referendum - and they stated the date - 19th September - the process would begin by a Parliamentary motion being introduced on that day by former UK PM Gordon Brown. It's important also to be aware that whilst Brown is still an ordinary, backbench MP, he holds no position in either the UK or Scottish Govts - and the means by which he can guarantee anything is anybody's guess.
This Vow and the timetable are credited with turning the YES momentum back, at a time when YES had drawn level and even taken the lead in 2 polls.
Now, following the victory for NO, the timetable has already been broken - no Parliamentary motion was lodged on the very day they guaranteed to do so. The labour leader, Milliband, has now refused to sign up to Cameron's plan altogether, and the wheels seem to be falling off the wagon already. It's far from a good start and people are naturally asking questions since the campaign swung on this intitiative.
So, whilst they MAY still deliver the goods, and whilst you may well be right in what you say about being patient - I think if you take into account what was explicitly guaranteed in terms of timescale, you'll perhaps see where the anxiety in some quarters is arising from. If you choose to make an explicit and time-sensitive guarantee, you better deliver on it - no ifs, no buts.
However, time will tell.
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Re: New bar opened in old Topman,the Scotland Discussion
u couldnt seriously have been looking forward to having an inbred toad like salmond as your "leader".
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Re: New bar opened in old Topman,the Scotland Discussion
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Re: New bar opened in old Topman,the Scotland Discussion
The people were asked and the people have spoken, it's time to be quiet for a while Scotty and wait and see what Westminster proposes. That is the problem with democracy, sometimes those darned voters just won't do as they're told.