Giles fights back

[Hmmm]

One senses that the powers-that-be may have bitten off more than they can chew in charging academic Giles Ji Ungpakorn with lese majeste. Having fled to the UK, he is being given, and taking, every opportunity to publicise the state of play in Thailand as he sees it.

This Wednesday's piece in the Guardian - the last two paras in particular - is one of the most scathing by a Thai that I've read in the English language press ...
http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree ... -democracy (http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/libertycentral/2009/feb/17/thailand-democracy)

[Aunty]

Well, I guess he's not planning on going back any time soon!

[krobbie]

Well, I guess he's not planning on going back any time soon!

Well, Aunty, you'd be right there. I guess he's a brave man with no family in Thailand.

krobbie

Maybe there is a future for Giles among the Red Shirts in Chiang Mai helping to break up the gay parade there?

[Khor tose]

Maybe there is a future for Giles among the Red Shirts in Chiang Mai helping to break up the gay parade there?

You have a very good point here Annan. I've been on the side of the red shirt, even though the original party name was Thailand for Thais. As a supporter of the red shirts, I am very mad at their antics at the pride parade. It almost makes me want to change sides. The red shirts may be on the right side of democracy Thailand style, but they have demonstrated both xenophobia and homophobia with this action, and they really need to get their shit together. If they think Thailand can be a viable country without foreign money and tourist, (both gay and straight) they are sadly mistaken.
Right now I am hoping this is just a blip by a few red necked red shirts, due to a lack of a strong in country party leadership and no cohesive party platform, but I am backing off from my support. This, in spite of the fact, that everything Giles says in that article is all too true.

Maybe there is a future for Giles among the Red Shirts in Chiang Mai helping to break up the gay parade there?


You have a very good point here Annan.

No, Khor tose, he has a totally bad point which is totally unfounded.

Under no circumstances would Giles Ungpakorn be involved with the "Red Shirts" as they stand now - he has made his dislike of Thaksin very clear ("I hate Thaksin").

Both the red and the yellow shirts have demonstrated homophobia openly, as routinely reported in the Thai press but seldom reported in the English language media, and thus largely unnoticed by Westerners. An article in the Nation reported on this today: http://www.nationmultimedia.com/2009/02 ... 096659.php (http://www.nationmultimedia.com/2009/02/26/politics/politics_30096659.php)

"Homophobic attacks by any groups must be condemned
By Pravit Rojanaphruk
The Nation
Published on February 26, 2009

Last Saturday's threat of violence against the Chiang Mai Gay Pride parade by the red-shirt pro-Thaksin Shinawatra "Rak Chiang Mai 51" group was not just deplorable but also a reminder that homosexuals have become silent victims to the on-going political conflict - and not just by red shirts but by the yellow shirt People's Alliance for Democracy (PAD) as well.
Homophobia has been used as a political tool by key elements in both camps on different occasions, casting doubt on how democratic and pluralistic some of these people truly are....."

The presumption that Thailand is a "gay friendly" country, without discrimination, as many foreigners wrongly presume just because it appears so to them is a false one.

[anakot]

The presumption that Thailand is a "gay friendly" country, without discrimination, as many foreigners wrongly presume just because it appears so to them is a false one.

Just so

[Hmmm]

Here's a report on Gile's talk at Oxford:
http://rspas.anu.edu.au/rmap/newmandala ... democracy/ (http://rspas.anu.edu.au/rmap/newmandala/2009/02/27/lese-majeste-in-thailand-the-enemy-of-democracy/)

Some snippets ...
"redshirts ... autonomous, self-organising and -financing groups are now starkly apparent among a relatively incoherent mass movement of over 100,000 people. Many of these groups have backward ideas, attacking lesbians and gays, for instance. But, Giles suggested, this was not reflective of the whole and merely reinforced the argument for people to join forces with the redshirts to help them develop in a more progressive direction."

"He continued to reject HandleyтАЩs suggestion that the king is тАШthe most powerful person in ThailandтАЩ, depicting him as a weak figure manipulated by more powerful forces."

Some of the most interesting stuff came from the reactions of the audience, seemingly mainly UK-based Thais, including students. But my overwhelming impression in reading the report was "why can't all these issues regarding the future post-HMK be discussed in Thailand, where they are critical to the future of the country?". That's a rhetorical question. I already know the answer.

The presumption that Thailand is a "gay friendly" country, without discrimination, as many foreigners wrongly presume just because it appears so to them is a false one.

Mmm Yes and no..... all the neighbours are very friendly ......

However, I suspect that they may not be too keen on the idea of upfront displays of gay pride etc.

Fatts,

I think we are probably in agreement and I was not being clear. I, similarly, have never found encountered any discrimination on a personal basis wherever we have been in Thailand. The "discrimination" I was referring to was a lack of treatment, acceptance and recognition (particularly legally and officially) on a strictly equal basis to heterosexuals and heterosexual couples.
While I agree that gays are accepted on a personal basis far more than in many countries, including those that have gay marriage/civil partnership/equal rights legislation, etc, there is still no suggestion of such legislation here and gays are often seen as "different" in much the same way as those who are disabled/handicapped but accepted - I am not just talking about the legal classification of homosexuality as a mental disorder here until only seven years ago, but about the more obvious view of homosexuals as being a source of either amusement or sympathy in virtually every Thai TV soap and in every Thai "joker" group - the only "jokers" more popular than gays are those with Down syndrome. Many Thais also see homosexuality as a punishment for sins in a former life, similar to other disabilities.
Personally I find "acceptance" to be more important, and it is certainly preferable to "gay-bashing", but I don't think that means that they are any less discriminatory in regards to seeing gays as "different".