Three years' jail for Thai royal insult by an Australian

Just keep reminding yourself - Thailand is a democracy. "A Thai court on Monday sentenced an Australian writer to three years in jail after finding him guilty of insulting Thailand's revered royal family in a novel, a judge said."
http://www.bangkokpost.com/breakingnews ... yal-family (http://www.bangkokpost.com/breakingnews/135922/writer-jailed-for-insulting-royal-family)

isnt obeying the law part of democracy?

[elephantspike]

I bet he gets pardoned and released within a month.

[lonelywombat]

Three years' jail for Thai royal insult Australian

* January 19, 2009 - 6:42PM AEDT



Sentenced ... Australian author Harry Nicolaides.

An Australian writer who says he's endured "unspeakable suffering'' in a Thai prison has been jailed for three years after pleading guilty to criminal charges of insulting the country's royal family.

But the family of Harry Nicolaides, 41, is hopeful a direct appeal for a pardon from the royal family may get the Melbourne-born author home.

A shackled Nicolaides was led into Bangkok's Criminal Court for the opening of his trial on Monday, and told reporters he would plead guilty.

Nicolaides' brother, Forde, said his brother would have been sentenced to six years in jail but his sentence was halved because of the guilty plea.

"We're devastated. You might be able to hear my mother crying in the background. It's quite devastating for us,'' he told AAP at home in Melbourne.

"The whole case has been a massive emotional ordeal that has consumed our entire family. It's beyond belief.

"We never expected him to be freed, but this is just the icing on the cake.''

Nicolaides was arrested last year under Thailand's severe lese majeste laws, mandating a jail term of three to 15 years for defaming, insulting or threatening the Royal family, over his 2005 novel Verisimilitude.

According to the Nicolaides family, only 50 copies of the book were published and less than 10 sold.

Nicolaides, a Melbourne resident who lived in the constitutional monarchy from 2003 to 2005 where he taught at the Mae Fah Luang University, has described his novel as a commentary on political and social life of contemporary Thailand.

"Tell my family I am very concerned,'' he told reporters as he entered the court, breaking down in tears.

He said he had endured "unspeakable suffering'' during his pre-trial detention since his arrest in August last year but did not elaborate.

Forde Nicolaides said his brother would not appeal the sentence.

"It is not Harry's intention to appeal, but he is considering a pardon application, which can occur through a mechanism directly with the palace,'' he said.

Diplomatic efforts to free Nicolaides had been "beefed up'' since last month, when his family criticised the Australian government's efforts in the case, Forde said.

Successive Thai governments have in recent months intensified the policing of laws against insulting the royal family. The country's lese majeste laws are some of the harshest in the world.

Thai authorities have banned nearly 4,000 websites in recent months for allegedly insulting the monarchy. Police said last week that more than 17 criminal cases of insulting the royal family are currently active.

AAP

[lonelywombat]

Well it will only be a short time before we get a response from you know who, in latin

Whats this got to do with gay Thailand?

isnt obeying the law part of democracy?Yes, if everyone does it - high and low.

[Hmmm]

Harry was jailed for referring briefly to the activities of the CP, something every Thai knows.

Anyone interested in learning more could usefully google ""Thai people know about the prince very well."

.... a certain canine birthday party .... au naturel ...

isnt obeying the law part of democracy?Yes, if everyone does it - high and low.

If you are imagining a place where everyone obeys the law, that's all you're doing -- imaging.

Democracy is in fact nothing more than a system of government in which the people hold power in a free election system. It has nothing to do with what percentage of the population obeys the law, and it does not preclude limitations on free speech (which the lese majeste law is). All democracies that I know of have limitations on free speech.

All democracies that I know of have limitations on free speech.And which of those democracies have a state-sponsored personality cult supported by a limitation on free speech?

[Khor tose]

All democracies that I know of have limitations on free speech.And which of those democracies have a state-sponsored personality cult supported by a limitation on free speech?


Iran and Turkey to name two.

[quote="Beach Bunny":2zpvzgyi]All democracies that I know of have limitations on free speech.And which of those democracies have a state-sponsored personality cult supported by a limitation on free speech?Iran and Turkey to name two.[/quote:2zpvzgyi]I'm very happy to agree that Thailand is a democracy in the same way Iran is a democracy

Many democracies have similar laws in regard to religion -- disrespect to Islam and all that jazz. Malaysia is only one example. The monarchy is in effect Thailand's state religion -- the only difference being that Thailand's deities are humans currently walking the earth with us.

This is not to say that I support the lese-majeste law. I don't. Not even close. I think it serves no purpose, is wide open to abuse for political (or other) gain, and should be abolished forthright. Undoubtedly, it will some day.

I am simply stating that the law's existence is not without parallel among the world's "democracies", and does not preclude Thailand from being counted among their ranks.

... does not preclude Thailand from being counted among their ranks.I guess that's part of the rich fantasy life that apologists for Thailand must enjoy

... does not preclude Thailand from being counted among their ranks.I guess that's part of the rich fantasy life that apologists for Thailand must enjoy

OK, then. If Thailand is not a democracy, what is it? What are all those people doing when they go to those polls. You know, on the days you complain bitterly about not being able to buy a drink at a bar.

What are all those people doing when they go to those polls.Hoping like hell the King doesn't suggest to the army behind his hand that they mount another coup when someone he doesn't like gets elected? To answer your question, I suggest you get out more. You could start with this
The premise that elections in themselves constitute democracy is deeply flawed for a start. Many countries have the vote, yet not many are truly democratic. And ballots have on occasion delivered despots. A narrow procedural interpretation of democracy misses out on what the real substance of democracy is. The essence of democracy resides in the institutions that uphold and protect human rights and the principles of freedom, fairness and order. As my brother Joe puts it, voting makes you only 20% democratic, the other four prerequisites for democracy being: a credible opposition; checks and balances; a free press; and the rule of law free from intimidation. When democracy is abused, it is often these four aspects that are attacked, not the peopleтАЩs right to vote http://www.globaldashboard.org/2008/12/ ... -thailand/ (http://www.globaldashboard.org/2008/12/02/democracy-in-thailand/)
OR
http://rspas.anu.edu.au/rmap/newmandala ... democracy/ (http://rspas.anu.edu.au/rmap/newmandala/2008/12/08/does-thailand-need-democracy/)

This is a guy who, as I recall, wrote a novel that was so abysmal that he couldn't find a publisher so "self-published". He then sent a copy to be lodged in the Thai central library. "Common sense" is not that "common", obviously

[elephantspike]

I don't know. For some reason I feel like this case is a little bit different than other recent high profile cases of lese majeste in Thailand.

There was the youtube thing last year that got youtube banned in Thailand for about five minutes. That had the unfortunate timing (for me) of appearing within a week or so of when I installed the youtube inbed application on this board. Someone tried to post the video in question here, and it was immediately deleted (by me).

We do have a long term board policy here of showing respect to the Thai Royal Family, and that youtube video (besides being stupid and lacking any socially redeeming value whatsoever) was obviously done for the sole purpose of denigrating and insulting Thai people, and, as such, could be considered in the category of "hate speech" (one common Western Democracy limitation on free speech). It's not so much like spray-painting a swastika directly on a synagogue (where it would be considered, at the very least, "vandalism"), but more like erecting a huge billboard of a swastika adjacent to a Jewish neighborhood.

This case reminds me more of the Salmon Rushdie case from the '80's, where the author was accused of heresy and sentenced to death for some vague allusion he made in his novel "The Satanic Verses" that was perceived as being an insult to Islam.

In both cases, there seems to be politicians that are eager to interpret passages in works of fiction and to use their own interpretation as a means to persecute the author to make an example of them for their own political ends.

[TrongpaiExpat]

According to the Nicolaides family, only 50 copies of the book were published and less than 10 sold

He would have got higher readership posting on Sawatdee Gay Thailand.

I guess there was an outstanding warrant on him. In USA warrants are for the most part open public record, I wonder how it works in Thailand? Can one determine if there are outstanding arrest warrants? He seems not to have know that there was a warrant. Is there one on record for Paul M. Handley? Was there ever one one Rogers, Hammerstine or Yul Brynner?

[elephantspike]

He would have got higher readership posting on Sawatdee Gay Thailand.


And wasted less paper, too.

There was the youtube thing last year that got youtube banned in Thailand for about five minutes. That had the unfortunate timing (for me) of appearing within a week or so of when I installed the youtube inbed application on this board. Someone tried to post the video in question here, and it was immediately deleted (by me).

Ah yes, that was my 15 minutes of fame, and NO I was not the ass posting any derogatory videos about the Royal Family - quite the opposite in fact. See if you any of you can find me on YT. :salute:

р╕зр╕┤р╕Чр╕вр╣М

[elephantspike]

There was the youtube thing last year that got youtube banned in Thailand for about five minutes. That had the unfortunate timing (for me) of appearing within a week or so of when I installed the youtube inbed application on this board. Someone tried to post the video in question here, and it was immediately deleted (by me).

Ah yes, that was my 15 minutes of fame, and NO I was not the ass posting any derogatory videos about the Royal Family - quite the opposite in fact. See if you any of you can find me on YT. :salute:

р╕зр╕┤р╕Чр╕вр╣М

Whoever put that video on youtube had an undeserved 5 minuets of fame. Whoever posted it here was denied the nanosecond of fame they were trying to achieve.