DONATIONS TO THIS FORUM

[Brad the Impala]

For me the principle is simple. I enjoy SGT and have enjoyed itтАЩs predecessors. It costs money and time to run, and it is therefore only fair that regular and long term users, and that includes those who read but not post, should contribute a little financial support.

This forum has already gone тАЬoff airтАЭ several times due to payments not made, and I think that those who place some value on this forum should try to make sure that this doesnтАЩt happen again, short or long term, and that the running of this forum remains worthwhile for ES and jinks. Frankly none of the other gay Thailand forums are worth a dime in comparison!

Since the system of making donations by Paypal was introduced, two and a half years ago, a grand total of USD 2,900 has been raised by donation. This total hardly makes SGT a profitable operation!

By six month period this breaks down as:

Last six months(including the period when I have made an issue of contributions) from April 2008: USD 1,325

Six months from November 2007: USD 350

Six months from April 2007: USD 250

Six months from November 2006: USD 130

Six months(including the period when donations were first asked for) from April 2006: USD 850.

Congratulations to MARK for the largest single contribution of USD 400, recently made.

These totals are rough figures, anyone else is welcome to get their calculator out, I donтАЩt have THAT much time on my hands!

Anyone wanting to make a contribution can do so here, scroll down to the PAYPAL sign at the bottom of the page.

www.sawatdee-gay-thailand.com/forum/index.html (http://www.sawatdee-gay-thailand.com/forum/index.html)


I have made PAYPAL payments to a variety of sites for many years without any security issue.

Anyone wanting to see a list of donors can do so here.

www.sawatdee-gay-thailand.com/forum/lwdonors.php (http://www.sawatdee-gay-thailand.com/forum/lwdonors.php)


It is possible to have your donation recorded either in your posting name or anonymously.

Thanks to ES and jinks for keeping this forum running.

Here we go again.

It costs money to run,




I thought it had already been established that the board paid for itself in advertising. Please correct me if I am wrong, but if I am right your whole article is based on non-existent foundations.

... your whole article is based on non-existent foundations.May I interest you in The Doris O'Booze Foundation for Long Lunches? Contributions are always welcome

[Brad the Impala]

It costs money to run,




I thought it had already been established that the board paid for itself in advertising. Please correct me if I am wrong, but if I am right your whole article is based on non-existent foundations.

As anyone who scrolls to the top of the page can see, I actually wrote that "it costs money and time to run."

As ES wrote:

Anyway, Beachlover is correct that it doesn't cost much out of my pocket to pay the hosting fees, although his estimation of adsense revenue is optimistic to say the least. Other than that, according to the agreement I have with google, I'm not allowed to discuss what I make from adsense.

Beachlover is also correct that the time and effort is a substantial part of the true cost of running this board. Between maintaining and updating the software, moderating the board and lending tech support to users, this is very nearly a full time job. One that I do in addition to (usually) another full-time job. Currently I am between real jobs again.

And as Beachlover, who seems to know something about these things, replied:


Totally right... running this board would be a nightmare, unless you really locked down processes it would be on your head all the time. All the little software stuff, fixing, monitoring and improving that needs to be done and working out how to do things takes up a lot of time unless you outsource it to someone to manage it all for you

We regularly see posts from people who appreciate the information gained here, and I think that a donation from time to time is appropriate, and usefully also gets rid of the ads between posts. $1,000 dollars a year, which is what Spike receives from donations to cover his expenses and time from members, doesn't seem much of an appreciation from us.

Up to you!

$1,000 dollars a year, which is what Spike receives from donations to cover his expenses and time from members, doesn't seem much of an appreciation from us.

Up to you!

Exactly; not up to you!



G.

[elephantspike]

Thanks to everyone who has kicked-in so far.

Thanks also to Brad for (in addition to his donations) a very well meaning plea on my behalf.

Please, though, let's not turn this into a negative standoff. Donation is, by its very definition, voluntary. If you have a few baht to throw in, by all means you are encouraged to do so, and if you don't, that's fine, too. Just pass the hat along and there is no need to mention whether or not you contributed.

I'll post the next Paypal-a-thon thread in April, but anytime anyone wants to help, the button is there.

Thanks again, guys!

[Beachlover]

... your whole article is based on non-existent foundations.May I interest you in The Doris O'Booze Foundation for Long Lunches? Contributions are always welcome

lol

Homintern, quick, jump on the bandwagon as it passes by!

[Beachlover]

btw, to offer a bit of background, this is how these websites usually work:

Owner generates revenue from advertising. The more visitors/users there are, the more revenue the site makes. It's a bit of a cycle:


A site can attract more users/visitors (ie. increase ad revenue) by:

- being well designed, appealing to navigate and pleasing to the eye

- being well positioned in the market and having a clear purpose

- HAVING lots of useful/entertaining content

- improving search engine optimisation (better search rankings = more traffic)

- possibly undertaking a paid advertising campaign to attract traffic


The site can have lots of useful/entertaining content by:

- Encouraging USERS to post, contribute and participate

- Attracting more traffic


The site can achieve better search rankings (ie. more traffic) by:

- having lots of content

- having lots of new content (generated by USERS)


As you can see, a lot of it comes back to the users. If the users like the site and participate, they generate more content (posts), which in turn improves search rankings and attracts even more traffic, which is the converted into users because of the useful content and etc etc. the cycle goes on...

Obviously, there are other factors like competitor strength, how much demand there is from advertisers to reach this target market and how good the site owner or media agency is at attracting advertisers but basically, this is how a site like this makes money.

It comes back to attracting users who participate and contribute. Therefore, site owners are usually quite grateful for users who participate a lot. They generate content and stimulate others to generate content, which gets more visitors and increases ad revenue.

Really, the BEST way you can help a site you like is to contribute and participate (nicely).

If you're a business owner and can achieve a good ROI then sponsor the site. If you're a user and really love the site and want to thank the forum owners, then by all means, make a donation.

But at the end of the day, the owners have made it clear the donations are up to you! (not up to some high and mighty wanker)

[Beachlover]

Geez, Brad... you really have a twitchy axe to grind don't you?

I mean, you're like a priest or a PTA member jumping up and down saying "right, who hasn't donated? That's atrocious. Aren't you ashamed of yourself?". It's perfectly fine for someone to jump up and down encouraging donations in a positive manner, but you really cross the line when you start saying who SHOULD donate and start singling out people who haven't donated, no matter how worthy the cause.

At the end of the day, donations are voluntary. That's the way the owners have made it.

You remind me of a certain type of school Mum. This kind of school Mum volunteers for everything and tirelessly helps in every way possible. This alone is fantastic - she should be liked and well respected. However occasionally one of these "tireless Mums" subtly or un-subtly makes all the other Mums feel guilty/unworthy/bad for not contributing or not contributing as much as she does to what is essentially VOLUNTARY work.

If the owner thought this site could survive and generate more revenue by being a paid-membership only site, I'm sure he would make it so (unless he was particularly generous and community-minded). But he hasn't.

A couple of comments:

1. I couldn't give a toss about the ads. They are not intrusive or annoying. In fact, I think there could be MORE ads (without increasing their intrusiveness) and the placement of ads could be made more effective to generate more revenue. I prefer an advertising-supported model to a user-pays model for this sort of site.

As long as the ads aren't too intrusive, everybody wins. Businesses get an avenue to promote their products, users get to use the site/facilities free and the owner makes a nice profit.

2. Most websites like these are supported by ad revenue. The better/more useful/more entertaining the site is, the more people use/visit and the more ad revenue the site generates. Some sites are sustainable, others aren't.

Where the site isn't sustainable, the owner/users decide whether charitable donations of time/money are worthwhile. This is really up to each individual. Not up to some "name and shame" loving wanker.

Where the site IS sustainable, the owner must decide whether the time spent running the site is worthwhile. If it's highly profitable, then there's no doubt it's worthwhile.

3. There are forum sites, which make $20k+ per month in ad revenue. This is the Web 2.0 revolution. User-generated content sites are big business. Youtube is one successful example of a user-generated content site.

I'm not saying this site could make $20k/month... but it certainly has plenty of potential and shouldn't be making a loss. Obviously, any site's potential is dependent on target market and competitor landscape... and every situation is different

4. I really don't care how much the owners are making from the site. It's not going to elicit envy or sympathy from me. I do like the site, so I would be happy if they made a good profit from it. Them making a loss would simply indicate the site isn't economically viable on the strategy being followed.

If they were really desperate or keen enough to make more money from the site, they would FIND a way to do it and put in the time/energy/risk required to make it happen.

I'd take an uneducated guess at saying this site could probably generate enough revenue to make a decent living if the right skills/effort/strategy were put to use.

Some other points:

5. I agree Paypal etc is secure enough. Personally, I have no problem buying stuff online. However, some people do. As much as I feel they are slightly foolish, you shouldn't attack them for this. If someone wants a product badly enough, they'll overcome their fears/concerns. Otherwise, they're not a customer.

Perhaps some gentle coaxing/explaining might help. But, calling them idiots isn't going to win them over. Whoever did that is pretty unintelligent.

6. Some people may feel uncomfortable about leaving a paper trail associated with a website like this. Make of that what you will. It's up to them. I respect this and wouldn't attack someone for feeling that way.

At the end of the day, donations are voluntary. I think your approach to increasing DONATIONS is pretty unintelligent, offensive and untactful.

You just could not stand it could you.
Yiou had to make a comment
Just but out

You just could not stand it could you.
Yiou had to make a comment
Just but out

skeet, members minding their own business as to what other members here do, goes for you as well. If I wish to make a comment I will, OK? So my advice is for you to but out. Get it? Got it? Good!


G.

I have already explained why I am not (and, following Brad's boring and boorish posts will not) make any contribution to the moderators. End of my interest in that particular subject.

What I find mildly amusing is how Brad has ingratiated himself with the moderators over this subject in order to pat himself continually and publicly on the back and at the same time use it as a stick with which to beat others. His current view of the moderators' qualities hardly matches the view he held less than 5 months ago, when he wrote about another poster (who is best left unnamed) that "the man is the worst kind of expatriate cunt. Unfortunately I am not sure that the moderator and some of the other posters, particularly expats in Pattaya are much better." With friends like that acting on their "behalf", the moderators really do not need any enemies!!!
.

Beachlover,

My apolgies for misappropriating your very appropriate comment. I think you have made a series of totally valid, fair and reasonable points. I have no fears of Paypal per se, however for personal reasons I see no point in not taking what to me are simple security precautions - even my bank and credit card statements and accounts are sent to a PO Box address! As Henry Kissinger said, "even a paranoid can have enemies"!

[giggsy]

At the impala foundation in a fairly small town a volunteer worker noticed that the most successful lawyer in the whole town hadn't made a contribution. This guy was making about B600,000 a year so the volunteer thought, "Why not call him up?"

He calls up the lawyer.

"Sir, according to our research you haven't made a contribution to the impala foundation, would you like to do so?"

The lawyer responds, "A contribution? Does your research show that I have an invalid mother who requires expensive surgery once a year just to stay alive?"

The worker is feeling a bit embarrassed and says, "Well, no sir, I'm..."

"Does your research show that my sister's husband was killed in a car accident? She has three kids and no means of support!"

The worker is feeling quite embarrassed at this point. "I'm terribly sorry..."

"Does your research show that my brother broke his neck on the job and now requires a full time nurse to have any kind of normal life?"

The worker is completely humiliated at this point. "I am sorry sir, please forgive me..."

"The gall of you people! I don't give them anything, so why should I give it to you

... your whole article is based on non-existent foundations.May I interest you in The Doris O'Booze Foundation for Long Lunches? Contributions are always welcome

Now that's one of the most interesting things you've said for a long time, Homi

[Brad the Impala]

His current view of the moderators' qualities hardly matches the view he held less than 5 months ago, when he wrote about another poster (who is best left unnamed) that "the man is the worst kind of expatriate cunt. Unfortunately I am not sure that the moderator and some of the other posters, particularly expats in Pattaya are much better.



Would you be able to supply a link? Unfortunately the search facility can only find this exact juxtaposition of words in this thread!

I certainly had harsh words to say at the time, but I have a feeling that they weren't quite these.

Still anything is possible, back then I even thought that jinks was wrong to call you an idiot!

[Beachlover]

Beachlover,

My apolgies for misappropriating your very appropriate comment.!

You haven't really misappropriated anything!

[Beachlover]

At the impala foundation in a fairly small town a volunteer worker noticed that the most successful lawyer in the whole town hadn't made a contribution. This guy was making about B600,000 a year so the volunteer thought, "Why not call him up?"

He calls up the lawyer.

"Sir, according to our research you haven't made a contribution to the impala foundation, would you like to do so?"

The lawyer responds, "A contribution? Does your research show that I have an invalid mother who requires expensive surgery once a year just to stay alive?"

The worker is feeling a bit embarrassed and says, "Well, no sir, I'm..."

"Does your research show that my sister's husband was killed in a car accident? She has three kids and no means of support!"

The worker is feeling quite embarrassed at this point. "I'm terribly sorry..."

"Does your research show that my brother broke his neck on the job and now requires a full time nurse to have any kind of normal life?"

The worker is completely humiliated at this point. "I am sorry sir, please forgive me..."

"The gall of you people! I don't give them anything, so why should I give it to you

haha... nice anaology

[quote="Gone Fishing":2850mwl0] His current view of the moderators' qualities hardly matches the view he held less than 5 months ago, when he wrote about another poster (who is best left unnamed) that "the man is the worst kind of expatriate cunt. Unfortunately I am not sure that the moderator and some of the other posters, particularly expats in Pattaya are much better.

Would you be able to supply a link? .... I have a feeling that they weren't quite these. [/quote:2850mwl0]

They were exactly these, word for word, sent to me by you in a PM (hence a link is not available).

If you claim that I am quoting you out of context, I will be happy to paste the complete message (less the name of the third party, which is not relevant).

If you deny sending it I will be happy for either Jinks or ES to access my PM box and confirm it for you. Should my password be required for this I will be happy to send it to either Jinks or ES (or a neutral third party, such as Smiles) so they can read and confirm what was written. Since I do not know which of the two you consider "the worst kind of expatriate cunt" (and a poll on this would probably not be appropriate!) I am quite happy to take the word of whichever you prefer - presumably not the "cunt".

[Lunchtime O'Booze]

... your whole article is based on non-existent foundations.May I interest you in The Doris O'Booze Foundation for Long Lunches? Contributions are always welcome

Now that's one of the most interesting things you've said for a long time, Homi

does that mean gwm4asian you will be contributing to the O'Booze Lunch Foundation ? If so I declare now that 10% (minus incidental expenses )will go to Sawatdee . Even better-I'll invite you to join us for lunch..now have you had a better offer than that lately ?

Hell. I'm feeling pretty generous at the moment and I promise, come my next pension cheque, I will splash out and make my promised donation.

After all-it's an investment and lunch invitations are bound to flow in like they never have before. Actually, they never have before.

[does that mean gwm4asian you will be contributing to the O'Booze Lunch Foundation ? If so I declare now that 10% (minus incidental expenses )will go to Sawatdee . Even better-I'll invite you to join us for lunch..now have you had a better offer than that lately ?



I certainly haven't.