President Obama?

Can Obama win? I'm not sure - and so (for the record) today I bet against him being President on the betting site Intrade. He's just not American enough for that parochial nation. So far it's been a clean sweep - Bush for President in 2004, Rudd for Australian PM in 2007, neither Clinton nor Edwards will be president in 2008 (well, the last two have a way to go, in theory)

[Khor tose]

You should have asked the board first before betting. I would love to take some of your money away. Not only will Obama win, but by 5% at least. I will be in Thailand during the election and would be glad to have a dinner bet on it with anyone who feels the way you do. The losers treats to a fine meal at one of the better restaurants?

You should have asked the board first before betting.The last time "the Board" expressed an opinion most were adamant the Democratic nomination* would go to Bill Clitoris' wife. Listening to what most people have to say won't make you a fortune. Most people in the finance industry did not believe there would be a financial crisis in the mortgage market. The favourite in horse-racing only wins one-third of the time. As we get closer to the election these political betting contests have a pretty good record of predicting the eventual winner - they are, after all, a two-horse race. However I bet against Mrs Clitoris before I'd even heard the name "Barack Obama", for the same reason I've bet against Obama now - on the balance of probabilities, she wouldn't win - too divisive. That John McCain probably will win fills me with horror, frankly. The fellow's experience in the armed forces, after all, is as a prisoner and he's even older than me. President Hopalong aside (and look how he ended up), the US presidency is a younger man's job

*or, as WhiteDesire would have it, "become the leader of the Democratic Party"

I think Obama will win and win big. The poles are way off for many reasons. Poles are based of past voting pattern data, and many things have changed in this election that poles have not, and are not, taking into account. Here are 3 huge reasons that the poles are way off. 1) Many, many people now have cell phones only. They tend to be younger and better educated that the general population and these are Obama people. Poles do not use cell phones to gather data; they only call hard wired home phones. 2) Younger people are going to be voting in much larger numbers that ever before, and they are very ready to move on to a post racial America and a post Bush America. They are very excited to vote for a black man as a statement of personal comittment to a post racial America....and to vote against their old dotering Grandfather McCain. Talking to young folks about McCain being a prisoner of war and a war hero is like telling them about the Roman Empire. Poles are based on past voting treads and do not include young people in the numbers that they will vote. 3) Vertually every black American over the age of 18 is now regestered to vote and will vote for Obama. Blacks have tipically had a low voter turn out and poles plan for a low black voter turn out.

I think Obama will win and win big. The poles are way off for many reasons. Poles are based of past voting pattern dataI didn't realise the natives of Poland were able to vote in this election. I guess Bush must have extended that right to them once they'd agreed to install his new missile defences in their country

[Khor tose]

Bush doesn't want a smarter man to succeed him, and make him look bad. After a long hard search he found some real dummies in the Kaczyński twins, who agreed to run for president if the Poles could vote in our election. If they win we will all have to polish our Polish.

However, Soi 10 Tom has done a great job of laying out what is going to occur in our next election.

The only sure bet in US elections (as in many other elections around the world) is that the least suitable person will end up in the White House. Is Terminator Arnie eligible to run in the future? Or does his Austrian birth preclude it?

His Austrian birth prevents him from running for President, although moves are already under way to get this clause in the constitution changed. Don't bet against this being done in order for him to be able to run in the 2012 election, especially if Obama wins in November.


George.

[Lunchtime O'Booze]

can he win ?..yes he most definitely will win..just as Al Gore won and John Kerry won..but lets face it..those voting machines by Diebold will fix the vote anyway and that creepy old McCain will probably romp in.

Doesn't matter though..the Neocon fantasy days are well and truly over and it's the end of the Republican era either now or the next 4 years..They are over , finished for decades to come.

Whatever happens..if Obama does win ( if they can nip the crooked voting machines in the bud ) I concur with the oracle..Gore Vidal..it's going to be a sad day when he is assisinated..

NB a bet on intrade ehh. I must bet the opposite if your track record is anything to go by.

.... Is Terminator Arnie eligible to run in the future? Or does his Austrian birth preclude it?

His Austrian birth prevents him from running for President, although moves are already under way to get this clause in the constitution changed. Don't bet against this being done in order for him to be able to run in the 2012 election, especially if Obama wins in November.


George.

Forget it.
There was "talk" about that a few years ago but it was just idle speculation fueled by a bored Press corps. Its not that easy to change the Constitution.
Besides, he's not (and never was) that popular in California. Right now he's in the middle of a big budget mess and his poll numbers are dropping as things drag on.

He may make a run for Senator against Boxer in 2010.

So what are the bookies odds that Obama will make First Lady, oops, President?Go and look at www.intrade.com (http://www.intrade.com)

[Lunchtime O'Booze]

can Obama win ?

if the impossible happens..which I hope it will and he does..what about that extraordinary slip of the tongue..introducing Biden as the "next president !"..people sometimes have portents of their own death and I feel something horrible will happen.

can you bet on intrade on an assasination ?..perhaps I'll bet on my death as well while I'm there.

So what are the bookies odds that Obama will make First Lady, oops, President?Go and look at www.intrade.com (http://www.intrade.com)

Put your money in it (and lose it) or your shoe in it again, wHaTEveR, no one cares what you do with your mouth. Cause everyone else already knows that Obama, first lady or not, is already a SHOO-in.

I've got some tar sand in Alberta stock I'll sell ya.

They may have pulled it while I was 2/3's way through but here it is (was?), Hitler, Mugabwe, and ...


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bgEorUhFllk

[Wesley]

The word here is, most people want to be politically correct in the polling and will not admit they are not willing to vote for a black guy. Some say when behind the curtian they wont be able to pll the lever for a black man. Hillary did nto do him any favors tonight and some say if elected he will not live out his term if he lives to get there. The old Klu Klux Clan mentality is still strong in some of the most southern states. If I were to bet it would be that he will not be president by defalt or by a lack of honesty in the polling process. I think America is more ready for a woman than a black guy IMHO. If he Secert service is watching this forum. I attest I am not involved in any conspiracy. Its just my opnion and what I hear in soime circles. persoanlly. I would have preferred Hillary. I understand if they have a full vote on the floor that may not be impossible.


Wes

[Wesley]

can he win ?..yes he most definitely will win..just as Al Gore won and John Kerry won..but lets face it..those voting machines by Diebold will fix the vote anyway and that creepy old McCain will probably romp in.

Doesn't matter though..the Neocon fantasy days are well and truly over and it's the end of the Republican era either now or the next 4 years..They are over , finished for decades to come.

Whatever happens..if Obama does win ( if they can nip the crooked voting machines in the bud ) I concur with the oracle..Gore Vidal..it's going to be a sad day when he is assisinated..

NB a bet on intrade ehh. I must bet the opposite if your track record is anything to go by.

I know the guy who runs Diebold, he is voting Obamma. as he goes so goes his staff.

Wes

At least, the next two weeks should see the death of the persistent rumor that the McCain team has some truly devastating information about Obama. The "explanation" for them not using the information is simple and cunning: if they destroyed Obama now, they would throw the nomination to Hillary, a much tougher item to defeat. So they are waiting for Obama to be "safely nominated" before destroying him.

I don't put much credence in rumors, but at least this one should die a quiet death in the next few weeks -- unless it's true. Then we'll find out whether there really is a damning video of Michelle.

By the way, another thought that occurs to me: this is a gay forum, and we talk light-heartedly about Obama being a shoo-in as the next "First Lady." But if somebody in America produced real evidence that Obama was gay, and his wife was a lesbian, I suspect this would sink his campaign.

My own opinion ONLY: Obama just made a huge mistake in choosing what's-his-name as Vice President. After all, an "Obama/Clinton" campaign would have some real zing to it, while an "Obama/Biden" campaign already smells like champagne left out overnight.

[Lunchtime O'Booze]

crikey Henry-I certainly know enough about Joe Biden to think he was an excellent choice and I'm not too taken by Hillary-given that Bill was really just an extension of the Bush Snr/ Reagan years.

Are there rumours they are gay ?..haven't heard that one yet but who cares-Michelle gave a wonderful speech and what a fab First Lady she would make.

Anyway-they deserve to win after the wondeful Ted Kennedy's speech.

Anyway-they deserve to win after the wondeful Ted Kennedy's speech.

With all due respect ---- "Huh?" If Person X gives a nice speech, that settles that?

Not for me. I'd rather have some crafty, cunning, pro-American old fart in the White House, who would do the right things and keep his mouth zipped. Someone like...Calvin Coolidge.

Spell-binding speeches have been a huge problem since the time of the ancient Greeks. Have a look here:

http://watchmanswords.blogspot.com/2008/07/dorwin-award.html

[Bob]

Someone like...Calvin Coolidge.

Even a dead guy would have done a better job than GW!

[Khor tose]

Someone like...Calvin Coolidge.

Even a dead guy would have done a better job than GW!

There is no doubt in my mind that the dead guy would have made fewer mistakes.

... or at least the Democratic Convention, there's my second-favourite New York Times columnist (after the conservative David Brooks http://www.nytimes.com/2008/08/26/opinion/26brooks.html ), Maureen Dowd - http://www.nytimes.com/2008/08/27/opinion/27dowd.html

... and Monica

[Khor tose]

Glad to see that you read the NYT. I have always enjoyed Brooks, but Dowd? I still stand by my prediction, and still willing to take bets. An easy win for Obama.

I still stand by my prediction, and still willing to take bets. An easy win for Obama. www.intrade.com (http://www.intrade.com) - although it may be banned for Americans

crikey Henry-I certainly know enough about Joe Biden to think he was an excellent choice and I'm not too taken by Hillary-given that Bill was really just an extension of the Bush Snr/ Reagan years.

Are there rumours they are gay ?..haven't heard that one yet but who cares-Michelle gave a wonderful speech and what a fab First Lady she would make.

Anyway-they deserve to win after the wondeful Ted Kennedy's speech.

I hate to be logical with you, Mr. O'Booze, but are you aware that Joe Biden enthusiatically supported the Jimmy Carter foreign policy -- of loving the Khomeini Revolution?

Are you aware of that?

And are you aware that Joe Biden has always and only stood for "dialogue" with the Iranians?

Are you aware that Joe Biden could BARELY get himself and his wig to support the UN war driving Iraq out of Kuwait?

And do you realize that Joe Biden's "Iraq solution" -- well, can you tell me what that was? Do tell me!

A "foreign-policy expert." Don't make me laugh any harder. Or I will appoint you as Secretary of State!

(That is, the moment I am elected President..) :-)

[Bob]

Some strange political beliefs, Henry.

Whether you recognize Biden as a foreign policy expert or not, both sides of the Senate aisle do here in the States. And both Republican and Democrat analysts seem to acknowledge his expertise in that area. I'm not sure how you know more about that unless you've been reading the Chiangmai Mail! (just joking on the last part).

Your characterization of Carter's foreign policy toward Iran is bizarre, unfair, and inaccurate.

I'm only guessing here but is your spirit house out front decorated with photos of Rush Limbaugh?


P.S. He has no wig, just a goofy look from an old hair transplant procedure (when they used to do the plugs with 25-30 hairs in a clump).

Some strange political beliefs, Henry.Strange? You can see Henry's reliance on logic when he goes for the ad hominem attack (on a non-existent wig) rather than stick to the facts to support his argument - of which there seem to be few. For some really good anti-Biden material from a left-wing perspective, go and look at the Counter Punch site - they have no time for Biden. And they don't waste time on the ad hominem, unlike poor old Henry. What's it been so far this week?
1 Henry doesn't know Eurasian geography
2 Henry doesn't believe in the First Amendment
3 Henry doesn't understand domestic US politics
4 Henry doesn't know how effective street protests were in toppling the Marcos government
5 Henry "overlooks" Malaysia and Singapore as members of SE Asia when it doesn't suit his argument

Oh, and:
6 Henry asserts homintern is a racist (another ad hominem remark. Doesn't he like me pointing out his (and everyone else's inconsistencies))? That leads to
7 Henry doesn't understand Jane Austen

Maybe he should go back to his former posting name - "justanarab"

http://www.counterpunch.org/

....And are you aware that Joe Biden has always and only stood for "dialogue" with the Iranians?...

Gee whiz.

Sounds good to me! :cheers:

Iran - the Persians - are, and always have been, one of the lynchpins of Middle East geopolitics.
If Nixon could go to China maybe we can send Old Joe to Tehran and start a new dialogue.

Wouldn't it be nice to get them on our side and tell the Wahabi-Saudis and their Bin Laden cousin to stick their oil up their a$$et$?

(sorry Allieb, but I just need to stick it to my pal Henry a bit)

The word here is, most people want to be politically correct in the polling and will not admit they are not willing to vote for a black guy. ....

That old chestnut has long been discounted after more research. It first surfaced in California when (black) L.A. mayor Tom Bradley was running for governor back in the 80's.

There is a long Wiki entry that will tell you more than you ever wanted to know about it at "en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bradley_effect (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bradley_effect)

Including this chestnut :
"One of the more ardent critics of the acceptance of the Bradley effect as an accurate explanation for observed polling errors is Gary Langer, who serves as the director of polling for ABC News. Langer has described the Bradley effect as "a theory in search of data." He has argued that inconsistency of its appearance, particularly in more recent elections, casts doubt upon its validity as a theory."

Its amazing all the crap the Republicans are pulling out of the hat to try to make people think Obama doesn't have a chance.

Next up - Numerology.

I trust honourable members will be rushing these tasteful items of apparel

"What's it been so far this week?
1 Henry doesn't know Eurasian geography
2 Henry doesn't believe in the First Amendment
3 Henry doesn't understand domestic US politics
4 Henry doesn't know how effective street protests were in toppling the Marcos government
5 Henry "overlooks" Malaysia and Singapore as members of SE Asia when it doesn't suit his argument

Oh, and:
6 Henry asserts homintern is a racist (another ad hominem remark. Doesn't he like me pointing out his (and everyone else's inconsistencies))? That leads to
7 Henry doesn't understand Jane Austen"

No.7 must be by far the worst for you Colonel?

"What's it been so far this week?
1 Henry doesn't know Eurasian geography
2 Henry doesn't believe in the First Amendment
3 Henry doesn't understand domestic US politics
4 Henry doesn't know how effective street protests were in toppling the Marcos government
5 Henry "overlooks" Malaysia and Singapore as members of SE Asia when it doesn't suit his argument

Oh, and:
6 Henry asserts homintern is a racist (another ad hominem remark. Doesn't he like me pointing out his (and everyone else's inconsistencies))? That leads to
7 Henry doesn't understand Jane Austen"

No.7 must be by far the worst for you Colonel?

1. I know some "Eurasian geography," Mr. Curious. "Eurasia" denotes a huge area of the globe. I know where England, China, Japan, and Korea are. Duh.
2. I don't believe in the First Amendment? Huh? Where does that come from? From suggesting that this forum be moderated? If you don't know it now, Curious, then I will explain it to you: everyone has a right to speak his opinion, but NO ONE has a right to express that opinion at the expense of someone else who doesn't want to carry that opinion. A lot of liberals have a problem understanding this idea. So I'll say it again: you have a right to your opinion, but you have no right at all to insist that The New York Times print up a full-page ad trumpeting your beliefs. The same goes, believe it or not, with blogs and websites.
3. I don't understand domestic US politics. I think that I will translate that to read, more accurately, "Henry is not a raving Obama-phile."
4. Henry doesn't know about street politics in the Philippines. Why should I? (By the way, Curious, do you find everything wonderfully improved after the departure of Marcos? It's an irrelevant question -- except for the small detail that I calmly suggest that "mob rule" may be even WORSE than democracy.)
5. OK, so Malaysia and Singapore are SE Asia. I was thinking mostly about big countries on the SE Asian mainland. Not teeny little states like Singapore (long ruled by authoritarian Chinese) -- and not the huge nation of Malaysia, which warns visitors that Jews are not allowed in Malaysia.
6. Homintern a racist? Search...search...search....search...try to find him saying anything positive about the Thai.
7. I don't UNDERSTAND JANE AUSTEN? Where in the name of God did that come from? Is that because Jane is the only author Homiturd has ever read? Anyway, credentials don't count: BA and MA in English Literature. And (God forbid) Jane Austen is actually NOT my favorite author! She is very funny, very witty, and very slight. My tastes run more to Proust and Shakespeare -- Tolstoy and Chekhov. Of course, Homiturd could hardly DARE to read Chekhov.

As for ad hominem attacks, I must bow to the master. "Boring sex life," "doesn't understand Jane Austen," "American." Not to mention "complete idiot."

It strikes me, Mr. "Curious," that you are actually not curious about anything at all, but determined to jump into the bitch-fights on this board.

Enjoy your swim!

It strikes me, Mr. "Curious," that you are actually not curious about anything at all, but determined to jump into the bitch-fights on this board.

Bravo Henry, your analysis of Mr "Curious" is spot on and 100 per cent totally accurate. Take the advice of someone that has more knowledge of him than most and don't waste any more of your words on him. Cowardly Joderalll Banker's such as him are not worth your time or energy of even acknowledging. They just arn't worth it.


Choc Dee Henry,


George.

....And are you aware that Joe Biden has always and only stood for "dialogue" with the Iranians?...

Gee whiz.

Sounds good to me! :cheers:

Iran - the Persians - are, and always have been, one of the lynchpins of Middle East geopolitics.
If Nixon could go to China maybe we can send Old Joe to Tehran and start a new dialogue.

Wouldn't it be nice to get them on our side and tell the Wahabi-Saudis and their Bin Laden cousin to stick their oil up their a$$et$?

(sorry Allieb, but I just need to stick it to my pal Henry a bit)

Yeah, but FIRST you have to snap your fingers and believe that Persians do honest dialogue. Go back and read your ancient history: they DON'T DO THAT. Persians are manipulators from the get-go.

Of course, if reading books is not your thing, then you can always trust @MyWord: "The first Persian I met cheated me, and so did the last Persian I met."

The First Persian was a guy who said he was from the Embassy, in 1970. I was leaving Tunisia, and had no further use for my short-wave radio (which never did much anyway). But this dude showed up and offered me $50 today, and another $50 next week.

Alas, I trusted the bastard.

Persians are INTO betrayal. They stink of it. Try to find an Arab who disagrees. MUSH KAWAYYIS.

The Anointed One, Obama, made a serious mistake in ignoring Hillary Clinton.

He just got a huge face-slapping wake-up call from the McCain camp. Palin is not only cuter (which does not count) but she seems to be a real conservative, as well.

In other words, I would MUCH RATHER have Palin than Hillary in the White House, not to mention that total non-entity -- what's his name? -- Harold Stassen?

Yeah, that's the ticket: Obama/Stassen.

Wait for the breaking news on Obama's non-stop association with terrorists.

Sure, Obama would make a GREAT President. An unusual one: a racist, anti-American Socialist. But who da fuk cares? He has warm eyes.

Bravo Henry, your analysis of Mr "Curious" is spot on and 100 per cent totally accurate. And all the poor fellow did was quote me

[Khor tose]

It strikes me, Mr. "Curious," that you are actually not curious about anything at all, but determined to jump into the bitch-fights on this board.

Bravo Henry, your analysis of Mr "Curious" is spot on and 100 per cent totally accurate. Take the advice of someone that has more knowledge of him than most and don't waste any more of your words on him. Cowardly Joderalll Banker's such as him are not worth your time or energy of even acknowledging. They just arn't worth it.


Choc Dee Henry,


George.

For the record George, I think you are letting your dislike of Homi and Curious get the better of your intellect. I happen to think they are both correct in this case. I live on the West Coast, Bob lives in the midwest and we are both very familar with Joe Biden. He has been a senator for 29 years and a very important one. I do not believe in calling names, but Homi and Curious have made some very good points about Henry's contributions, and frankly I agree with them. Secondly, it is not hard at all to figure out the Jane Austin Quote. Homi's main problem on this board is that he is usually right. Like it or not.

With Luv :love9: If you decide I need an answer keep it to 1/2 page

....In other words, I would MUCH RATHER have Palin than Hillary in the White House, not to mention that total non-entity -- what's his name? -- Harold Stassen? ....

But Henry, Harold Stassen was a perennial Republican "non-entity" candidate for president. What is your Freudian Slip trying to tell us about Palin?
Honestly, do you really think the Democratic supporters of Hillary Clinton are going to flock to McCain because of this right wing anti abortionist nobody from Nowhere Alaska?


....Sure, Obama would make a GREAT President. An unusual one: a racist, anti-American Socialist. .....

Oh Henry, you're just a nut.

Either that or your having great fun pulling everyone's chain.

[Wesley]

Certainly a read of War and Peace by Tolstoy is worth anyons time.

Wes

Oh Henry, you're just a nut. Either that or your having great fun pulling everyone's chain.First impressions are often the best

[cottmann]

[quote="Henry Cate"].... -- and not the huge nation of Malaysia, which warns visitors that Jews are not allowed in Malaysia.
.../quote]

Actually, that is not true. It is Israeli citizens, not Jews in general, who are not allowed to enter Malaysia, and there is presently a Jewish community of about 100 there, mostly Russian emigrants. Malaysia doesn't recognize the existence of Israel so won't allow Israelis to visit nor allow Malaysians to visit Israel.

.... -- and not the huge nation of Malaysia, which warns visitors that Jews are not allowed in MalaysiaActually, that is not true. It is Israeli citizens, not Jews in general, who are not allowed to enter Malaysia, and there is presently a Jewish community of about 100 there, mostly Russian emigrants. Malaysia doesn't recognize the existence of Israel so won't allow Israelis to visit nor allow Malaysians to visit Israel.You're surely not expecting factual accuracy from Henry?

My fellow Americans, it is an honor to address the Democratic National Convention at this defining moment in history. We stand at a crossroads at a pivot point, near a fork in the road on the edge of a precipice in the midst of the most consequential election since last year's "American Idol."

One path before us leads to the past, and the extinction of the human race. The other path leads to the future, when we will all be dead. We must choose wisely.

We must close the book on the bleeding wounds of the old politics of division and sail our ship up a mountain of hope and plant our flag on the sunrise of a thousand tomorrows with an American promise that will never die! For this election isn't about the past or the present, or even the pluperfect conditional. It's about the future, and Barack Obama loves the future because that's where all his accomplishments are.

We meet today to pass the torch to a new generation of Americans, a generation that came of age amidst iced chais and mocha strawberry Frappuccinos, a generation with a historical memory that doesn't extend back past Coke Zero.

We meet today to heal the divisions that have torn this country. For we are all one country and one American family, whether we are caring and thoughtful Democrats or hate-filled and war-crazed Republicans. We must bring together left and right, marinara and carbonara, John and Elizabeth Edwards. On United we stand, on US Airways, there's a 25-minute delay.

Ladies and gentleman, I never expected to be speaking before you today. Like so many of our speakers at this convention, I come from a hard-working, middle-class family. I was leading a miserable little life, but, nevertheless, overcame great odds to live the American Dream. My great-grandfather fought in Patton's army, along with Barack Obama's great-grand uncles' fourth cousin once removed.

As a child, I was abandoned by my parents and lived with a colony of ants. We didn't have much in the way of material possession, but we did have each other and the ability to carry far more than our own body weights. When I was young, I was temporarily paralyzed in a horrible anteater accident, but I never gave up my dream: the dream of speaking at a national political convention so my speech could be talked over by Wolf Blitzer and a gang of pundits.

And today we Democrats meet in Denver, a suburb of Boulder, a city whose motto is, "A Taxi? You Must be Dreaming." And in Denver, we Democrats showed America that we have cute daughters who will someday provide us with prestigious car-window stickers. We heard Hillary Clinton's ringing endorsement of "the weak-looking thin guy who's bound to lose."

We heard from Joe Biden, whose 643 years in the Senate make him uniquely qualified to pander to the middle class, whose family has been riding the Acela and before that the Metroliner for generations, who has been given a lifetime ban from the quiet car and who is himself a verbal train wreck waiting to happen.

We got to know Barack and Michelle Obama, two tall, thin, rich, beautiful people who don't perspire, but who nonetheless feel compassion for their squatter and smellier fellow citizens. We know that Barack could have gone to a prestigious law firm, like his big donors in the luxury boxes, but he chose to put his ego aside to become a professional politician, president of the United States and redeemer of the human race. We heard about his time as a community organizer, the three most fulfilling months of his life.

We were thrilled by his speech in front of the Greek columns, which were conscientiously recycled from the concert, "Yanni, Live at the Acropolis." We were honored by his pledge, that if elected president, he will serve at least four months before running for higher office. We were moved by his campaign slogan, "Vote Obama: He's better than you'll ever be." We were inspired by dozens of Democratic senators who declared their lifelong love of John McCain before denouncing him as a reactionary opportunist who would destroy the country.

No, this country cannot afford to elect John Bushmccain. Under Republican rule, locusts have stripped the land, adults wear crocs in public and M&M's have lost their flavor. We must instead ride to the uplands of hope!

For as Barack Obama suggested Thursday night, wherever there is a president who needs to tap America's natural-gas reserves, I'll be there. Wherever there is a need for a capital-gains readjustment for targeted small businesses, I'll be there. Wherever there is a president committed to direct diplomacy with nuclear proliferators, I'll be there, too! God bless the Democrats, and God Bless America!

[quote=Henry Cate]....In other words, I would MUCH RATHER have Palin than Hillary in the White House, not to mention that total non-entity -- what's his name? -- Harold Stassen? ....

But Henry, Harold Stassen was a perennial Republican "non-entity" candidate for president. What is your Freudian Slip trying to tell us about Palin?
Honestly, do you really think the Democratic supporters of Hillary Clinton are going to flock to McCain because of this right wing anti abortionist nobody from Nowhere Alaska?


....Sure, Obama would make a GREAT President. An unusual one: a racist, anti-American Socialist. .....

Oh Henry, you're just a nut.

Either that or your having great fun pulling everyone's chain.[/quote:bg5zwckz]

No, I'm as serious as I want to be. Joe Biden is a non-entity politically, so I automatically equate him with that other perennial Presidential candidate, Harold Stassen. Both completely hopeless.

What makes things particularly entertaining is that The One (Speak His Name With Awe) selected Joe Biden for his foreign policy expertise. Yeah, that foreign policy expert Joe Biden, who backed the Carter administration 100% in welcoming the Ayatollah. That Biden, who was BARELY convinced to join the UN effort to kick Saddam Hussein out of Kuwait. That Biden, who declared the Iraq war "lost" and called for the partition of Iraq into three separate countries -- not just once but many times.

Has it occurred to you that someone can hold a job for thirty years and make nothing but mistakes (a la Joe Biden, with vast experience but no correct judgments) and that someone else can hold a job for two years and make nothing but enormously popular and correct decisions? ("Little experience.")

I particularly loved the video of Palin today, responding to the charge of inexperience WHILE SHOPPING. All she really said was, "I've been in elective office for 13 years, and that should give me the experience I need to be Vice-President." The video was 13 seconds long.

Or, as Maverick said, "If Obama had as much experience as Palin, he would be well-qualified for the VP slot."

As to whether the Hillary supporters will flock to the McCain-Palin ticket, let's wait and see. I think the effect will be quite visible.

But of course Democrats don't like any of this. Suddenly the Democrats appear to be the sexist party, and Obama is seen as a woman-hater.

Ouch!

See you in November, sweetheart! :-)

....Sure, Obama would make a GREAT President. An unusual one: a racist, anti-American Socialist.

kenc replied by calling me a "nut." That does not deal with the issues I raised.

Is Obama a racist? I mean to say, if you don't follow the current party-line which says that blacks cannot be racists, is Obama a racist?

If not, why did he go to church for 20 years (!) with the racist Jeremiah Wright? "Well, he has put that behind him as a distraction and moved on."

Bad answer.

Is Obama anti-American? How else can you explain his very long association with William Ayers, the unrepentant terrorist from the Weather Underground? Why else would his wife Michelle say that "Now, for the first time, I am proud of America?" Doesn't that really, and strongly, imply that, before "now," she didn't think much of America at all?

Is Obama a Socialist? What do you think? He wants to raise taxes, and he's never met a Huge Government Program that he didn't like.

Just a note from a libertarian...and if you expect me to come out in favor of Creation Science, don't hold your breath. These American elections are almost always about holding your nose and voting for the lesser of two evils. The number of people who attack me for voting for Bush is legion, but the number of people who say that I should have voted for John Kerry was (at last count) ONE.

Everyone knows what socialism is.

It's a perfect platform to lose elections in America.

Therefore, they choose other words, such as "social justice" and "equality."

What I am saying is, Americans accuse some of their own politicians of being Socialists.You are wasting your time trying to reason with Henry. He's already told us that he's a Libertarian ie. his thought processes are driven by ideology, not logic

Sure looks as if the good ole US of A is shaping up for another four lame duck years. Putin must be plotting his next invasion. Estonia, I suspect.

I have never met an American who knows what a Socialist is.

Or a liberal.

.... -- and not the huge nation of Malaysia, which warns visitors that Jews are not allowed in Malaysia.
.../quote]

Actually, that is not true. It is Israeli citizens, not Jews in general, who are not allowed to enter Malaysia, and there is presently a Jewish community of about 100 there, mostly Russian emigrants. Malaysia doesn't recognize the existence of Israel so won't allow Israelis to visit nor allow Malaysians to visit Israel.

Well, that completely establishes their religious tolerance, does it not? They aren't against dem Jews, they're only against dem Jews in Israel..

Who else do you make excuses for, cottman?

....And are you aware that Joe Biden has always and only stood for "dialogue" with the Iranians?...

Gee whiz.

Sounds good to me! :cheers:

Iran - the Persians - are, and always have been, one of the lynchpins of Middle East geopolitics.
If Nixon could go to China maybe we can send Old Joe to Tehran and start a new dialogue.

Wouldn't it be nice to get them on our side and tell the Wahabi-Saudis and their Bin Laden cousin to stick their oil up their a$$et$?

(sorry Allieb, but I just need to stick it to my pal Henry a bit)

And wouldn't it be nice if wishes came true?

What I am saying is, Americans accuse some of their own politicians of being Socialists. But that accusation does not stand; someone who advocates a public health system, for example, is not necessarily as Socialist. The definition goes much deeper and the only Americans who are true socialists (that I am aware of) are those in the American Socialist Party. Obama, McCain and the rest of the US political duopoly are Conservatives of varying degrees by the standards of most European nations.

I am repeating myself, and so are you. Any Presidential candidate (in America) who overtly and publicly states that he is a Socialist will lose.

From this, if you think VERY HARD, you may conclude that America is not a Socialist nation. And frankly, YES: "Any politician who advocates a public health system" is a socialist. Once that passes, we move on to public life insurance, public car insurance, public EVERYTHING. Maybe even government-provided "sex-workers." I don't know about you, and your apparently vastly appreciative view of government, but I would expect the government-provided "sex-workers" to be of the wrong sex, in the first place! :-)

Gosh, I thought liberals were in favor of Diversity -- but, it seems, when push comes to shove, it's just like Mao's "Let A Hundred Flowers Bloom" campaign. He let the fools opposed to him speak for several weeks, and then Lowered The Boom.

So let's agree on this, perhaps: America is not socialist. We like "one man, one vote." We like the idea that hard work should be rewarded. We aren't very big on the welfare state.

And we have so many (non-Muslim) immigrants that we don't know quite what to do.

Let me try to offer you a clue: people don't LIKE socialism. When they are stuck with it (as in Europe), they simply die out.

There are no children in Italy. Oriana Fallaci pointed that out. Don't you find such "news" disturbing? (To be precise, Italians are having very few children, compared with the Muslim population in Italy. If you removed the Muslims from the equation, Italy would still be a desert in a few centuries. If you put them back in, get ready for a Muslim Florence.)

What a horrible thought to conclude with....

I suggest you also check the population statistics in Russia.

[cottmann]

[quote="Henry Cate":3ttf13m2].... -- and not the huge nation of Malaysia, which warns visitors that Jews are not allowed in Malaysia.
.../quote]

Actually, that is not true. It is Israeli citizens, not Jews in general, who are not allowed to enter Malaysia, and there is presently a Jewish community of about 100 there, mostly Russian emigrants. Malaysia doesn't recognize the existence of Israel so won't allow Israelis to visit nor allow Malaysians to visit Israel.

Well, that completely establishes their religious tolerance, does it not? They aren't against dem Jews, they're only against dem Jews in Israel..

Who else do you make excuses for, cottman?[/quote:3ttf13m2]

Well, if you take your blinkers off, Henry, you'll realize that the Malaysian ban on Israeli CITIZENS applies not only to Jews but also to Israeli Christians, Muslims, Buddhists, atheists, agnostics, etc. Of course, however, please don't let facts get in the way of your bigotry

[thrillbill]

(I wrote this on another forum but it fits here also...) Since the polls between McCain and Obama are close I think Grizzly Palin, known as Alaska's Governor Palin, will probably tip the scale in the close U.S. elections for the Republicans to be in another 4 long, drastic years. Though the career, educated American woman who is well read will not vote for her just because she is a female, there ARE many American women that will vote Republican just because there is a woman on the ticket. But also the conservative Bible thumpers (and there are many of them in the US) and the pro- gun NRA folks will also find her appealing over the democratic ticket. She was giving her "credentials"the other night.... soccer mom, PTA president, mayor of some podunk Alaskan town, and now governor of Alaska. Alaska does not have the problems similar to other states such as California, Illinois, ...well all the rest of them. Alaska is financially well off (due to oil) and a low population. She has no challenges of unemployment, decaying infrastruture, run down schools like other governors would have in the more populated states. (Well, she does have to worry about hunting regulations and how to expand oil expansion.) She believes that Creation Science should be taught in the classrooms but not evolution; she is against teaching sex education to teenagers in schools believing that it should be taught at home. (She sure did a good job with her 17 year daughter that is now 5 months pregnate from some guy named Levi.) I am sure Palin doesn't know the difference between Thailand and Taiwan, Zambia and Zimbabwee; or Austria and Australia... But most Americans aren't capable of making independent decisions unless it is preached to them on Fox News or on conservative talk radio. It is obvious to many of us Americans living overseas that Obama would make a better president, but we are "outside the box."

I "sold" President Obama for $61.60 last week on www.intrade.com (http://www.intrade.com) - and he's now rated a $52.80 chance. McCain's price has increased commensurately. In The Spectator Taki is tipping that Dubya will encourage the Israelis to bomb Iran before the election; the better Obama is looking the earlier that's likely to be. I haven't bet on that likelihood, but for those who fancy taking a punt, the price for it happening before the end of this month is $5.10 to win $100; before the end of the year $17.50 to win $100 (down $4 since yesterday). Henry Cate is probably buying up as we speak