Monthly Allowances - "Sponsorship Doesn't Work"

Stickman has an interesting story on a falang who was sponsoring a young lady.

Relevant to a gay board? As you read, just substitute "bar boy" every time you see bar girl.

www.stickmanweekly.com/StickMarkII/BargirlSponsorshipDoesntWork.htm (http://www.stickmanweekly.com/StickMarkII/BargirlSponsorshipDoesntWork.htm)

I think that this article illustrates one of the predominate business models for many bar workers (boy or girl).

Are you sponsoring a boy?

Stickman has an interesting story on a falang who was sponsoring a young lady.A rather generous use of the word "lady"

anybody surprised? Good story but that's the life in Thailand. I know a boy he received 6 times 42.000 Baht from his 6 different sponsors to buy a new motorbike. He was able to show everybody on his next visit the new motorbike with paper and his name in.
Every year I waiting that a Thai is winning the "Oscar" as best actor or actress.

anybody surprised? Good story but that's the life in Thailand. I know a boy he received 6 times 42.000 Baht from his 6 different sponsors to buy a new motorbike. He was able to show everybody on his next visit the new motorbike with paper and his name in.
Every year I waiting that a Thai is winning the "Oscar" as best actor or actress.

If you've watched much television, you'd know that Thais can't act worth shit.

It's their farangs who should win an Oscar for "most gullible schmuck".

I'm waiting for the chorus of "But MY boy wouldn't act like that"

Over to you ... anyone with a 'RELATIONSHIP' (to be said in a whiney American accent)

I mean more the actors we dealing with daily. The shows, the plaid mood, the tears on demand etc.
But maybe we creating a new trophy - "The most stupid falang" of the year. You can apply for a friend or someones story you know. Ones a year we make a big party and jury will decide who will be the one.
Guess we need a stadium so all candidates will get a seat.

[markie1]

I Know one he's in Hua Hin ,because he actually came out very late in life , He truly belives the young thai's do truly love him ,its quite sad really ,but this guy actually buys cars for them and i mean brand new ones ,they get any thing they want ,his current boy friend , and his close thai friend both drive around in new cars ,Gold that would weigh you down ,all designer wear , from shoes to shirts T shirts trousers , i could not tell you how much money this guy has spent in the last 4 years but it would be enough to keep me going fora good few years ,But i suppose hes happy sometimes ,and proberly gets what he wants ,i just see these young guys bleeding him though and its rather said to watch it .
I am not saying a young guy can not love a older guy because they can ,But in this particular case it all comes down to money ,the more money they get the more they want . I supose he can not take it with him when he leeves this world,so maybe hes just trying to spend it before the time comes.

But maybe we creating a new trophy - "The most stupid falang" of the year. You can apply for a friend or someones story you know. Ones a year we make a big party and jury will decide who will be the one.
Guess we need a stadium so all candidates will get a seat.

Many of the farang here are so desperate that as soon as they meet a boy and it last more than an hour and a half - it automatically becomes my "Boy Friend". If you are foolish enough to believe that a long term relationship can be established in such a short period of time, then you definitely apply to the same "A fool and his money are soon parted".

Nothing new, nothing really interesting, and nothing unique to Thailand - would these same people do the same with the equivalent boys/girls in their own countries?

Probably not and, if not, why should they think Thais should be any different?

Keep it simple all round and no-one gets hurt. Long Distance Relationships are for boys who want them to remain that way, while Long Term Relationships (when both live together 24/7/etc) are something totally different and, like all such relationships, some work and some don't. Of all the gay farang I know living here, and all those posting on SGF, I know of only one LDR which has developed into a LTR and that is still in relatively early days.

[markie1]

WEll i ahve been having a long term relationship with my B/F for 18 montsh now ,and i Trust him 100%, although i speak with him every day on the phone and get to see him at least every 3 months, he lives in the country ,stays with mama and papa when i am not there in a small village ,helping his family on the farm ,so hes away from any temptation in the gay areas, Not that hes ever really been interested in them,even when studying in bangsaan ,he never set foot in pataya.Untill i actually took him there . So i like to think i have a bright future ahead ,and hopefully bring him over to the UK Next year Vias permitting, and we will take it from there .

Hahaha...don't you know that there's ample opportunity for a boy to get fucked back home on the farm? You don't have to travel to the big city, you know.

as to whether you want to give or not to give. You have a choice as to whether you want to be with a Thai guy or not. At the end of the day, a falang has the brains to buy an air ticket to Thailand and organise his hotel etc, you don't mean to tell me that a falang doesn't know what he or she is up against when the arrive in Thailand. Even trailer trash know what to expect when going to Thailand.

However, on the flip side of the coin, a lot of Thais think we are rich, well in comparison, I suppose we are, but my point behind that is they actually believe that genuinely, unless you are part of the "elite" that have a decent education and are a little more "worldly" than your average Thai.

[markie1]

Hahaha...don't you know that there's ample opportunity for a boy to get fucked back home on the farm? You don't have to travel to the big city, you know.I am sure there proberly is but having visited my b/f family and village i can assure you there is not a lot to choose from, i dont think every thai is a slut cos there not ,there is genuine guys also maybe you havent meet one yet
:bounce: :bounce:

Hahaha...don't you know that there's ample opportunity for a boy to get fucked back home on the farm? You don't have to travel to the big city, you know.


Please provide directions to this farm - it sounds great!!

[markie1]

Yes it is great it you want peace and Quiet and yes its really nice to get away from the sleezy side of things sometimes .Thailand has a lot to offer if you just venture out of those cities,and seea bit of traditional culture.
Every body does not want to party every night and hang around those bars ,we all have choice you know, and getting away time to time in the country pleases me .
And well you want to know where the farm is well maybe one day iw ill tell you ,But at the moment daer i will keep that one to my self .hahah
have a good night

Markie1 how old are you and how old is your bf?
Let me guess: You are 50-55 and he (yourbf is 21-24.
Markie1, how much money you send every month? Believe me all this what are you wrote here I listen now 10 years long in Thailand. How about the renovation of the farm house? Did your bf ask or talked about that already or did you paid for the sick buffalo already? Please answer the question and you will learn and save a lot of money.
I guess you will be the first candidate for the new trophy of gaydestination.

[markie1]

YOur so funny ,You dont evan know me or my boy friend come to that,and no i dont send money ,and no i did not help build the house or buy cattle ,they managed to do that alone without my help,is family are very successful,they own many land and do many farming,they also own a shop,and own lots of animals they dont need my money nor dose my boy friend , not every body was born to go through life with nothing,some people did get an education and know how to succeed.
i not sure what type of people you have mixed with in your past 10 years ,but it clearly was not me.
If your looking for a job maybe i can find you one ,

[markie1]

[quote="markie1"]YOur so funny ,You dont evan know me or my boy friend come to that,and no i dont send money ,and no i did not help build the house or buy cattle ,they managed to do that alone without my help,is family are very successful,they own many land and do many farming,they also own a shop,and own lots of animals they dont need my money nor dose my boy friend , not every body was born to go through life with nothing,some people did get an education and know how to succeed.
i not sure what type of people you have mixed with in your past 10 years ,but it clearly was not me.If you needa jhob let me know ,i may beable to find you one

lwhoops sorry i forgot to give you my age well you were a few yeras over i am actually 42 ,and my boy friend is 25

YOur so funny ,You dont evan know me or my boy friend come to that,and no i dont send money ,and no i did not help build the house or buy cattle ,they managed to do that alone without my help,is family are very successful,they own many land and ,

your nose is getting longerrrrrrr.... pinoch....errr Markie......... :bom: :cherry:

Hahaha...don't you know that there's ample opportunity for a boy to get fucked back home on the farm? You don't have to travel to the big city, you know.I am sure there proberly is but having visited my b/f family and village i can assure you there is not a lot to choose from, i dont think every thai is a slut cos there not ,there is genuine guys also maybe you havent meet one yet
:bounce: :bounce:

hahaha...maybe you haven't realized it, but "genuine" Thai guys also like to fuck. Trust me, your boyfriend has got his legs up and his ass in the air in those paddy fields.

[markie1]

[quote="Chao Na":qxhfjanp]Hahaha...don't you know that there's ample opportunity for a boy to get fucked back home on the farm? You don't have to travel to the big city, you know.I am sure there proberly is but having visited my b/f family and village i can assure you there is not a lot to choose from, i dont think every thai is a slut cos there not ,there is genuine guys also maybe you havent meet one yet
:bounce: :bounce:

hahaha...maybe you haven't realized it, but "genuine" Thai guys also like to fuck. Trust me, your boyfriend has got his legs up and his ass in the air in those paddy fields.[/quote:qxhfjanp]


of caurse they like sex dont you? you can keep dreaming darling about my boy friend in the paddy fields ,so long has it gives you pleasure thats fine with me .Enjoy it .

Oh, I will. Thank you.

And you carry on with the fantasy that your boy is out in the boondocks with no opportunity or desire to cheat on you, carrying the flame for his distant lover and longing for the day when he will return.

Who has the more unlikely fantasy?

it's the fantasy and the right hand in Europe who keep these guys alive.
I'm not sure if Markie1 read the whole story of this topic.
But I am happy for him. Other people running around and they met Elvis at the Cofe shop and they are happy.
But by the way: How is your sex life back in UK? Just right hand or left hand?

[markie1]

it's the fantasy and the right hand in Europe who keep these guys alive.
I'm not sure if Markie1 read the whole story of this topic.
But I am happy for him. Other people running around and they met Elvis at the Cofe shop and they are happy.
But by the way: How is your sex life back in UK? Just right hand or left hand?

I know the gaus havea bad reputation for been sluts ,but there si some good ones also ,

Yes the right hand works wonders
loll

markie1,

we evidently have different views on long term relationships. "speak with him every day on the phone and get to see him at least every 3 months" is hardly living together and is very much a LDR (Long Distance Relationship), not a LTR (Long Term Relationship). Your evidently rather intimate and recent knowledge of Bangkok and Pattaya bars also indicates that this is not what I personaly would call a "serious" relationship - while you may "trust him 100%" I cannot help wondering how far that actually goes and how far he can trust you.

I hope it works out for you - if it does that will make the second LDR I (or apparently anyone posting here) knows of to become an LTR.

Visa to UK - not impossible, but somehow you do not sound like a native English speaker yourself.

All the farang I know in long term relationships with Thai boys support them (financially) 100%. They also help support their BF's family (e.g cash help to buy extra labour at planting and harvesting time). Some of the Thai boys are eager to have their partner set up businesses for them, but this seems to work out more expensive for the farang than just having them stay at home cleaning the house. Apart from any other consideration, a working class thai boy would lose face if he wasn't so supported.

But things weren't so different in Europe (or the US) fifty years ago. Working class girls expected their husbands to support them while they did the house.

If you're not prepared to support your Thai BF for the rest of your life (and beyond), find someone rich and middle class, or do your searching at home.

[markie1]

I am prepared to do that ,and should this be a long term relationship ,has my last one lasted 20 years in the UK ,then i will do any thing i can to help him ,and his family ,and yes i have long term plans,early days only just over a year together ,but time will tell.hes a good lad and hopefully all will work out .

Yes i do know pataya and other places very well,i have travelled a lot ,and know all the bars ,i did the bar stuff before i meet my current boy friend ,and still do them on accotions ,its all new to him so its fun ,and i like to see the shows ,and catch up with friends in pataya,that have kept in touch with ,the residents i mean .so its nice to come there have a few beers with friends ,go out to dinner and enjoy the shows.
so hope to meet more of you in person on my next visit in September
take care

[markie1]

markie1,

we evidently have different views on long term relationships. "speak with him every day on the phone and get to see him at least every 3 months" is hardly living together and is very much a LDR (Long Distance Relationship), not a LTR (Long Term Relationship). Your evidently rather intimate and recent knowledge of Bangkok and Pattaya bars also indicates that this is not what I personaly would call a "serious" relationship - while you may "trust him 100%" I cannot help wondering how far that actually goes and how far he can trust you.

I hope it works out for you - if it does that will make the second LDR I (or apparently anyone posting here) knows of to become an LTR.

Visa to UK - not impossible, but somehow you do not sound like a native English speaker yourself.

English born and breed dear ,lived here all my life .i will try for the visa next year ,let you know how we do . Also hopeing to buy a small pad out there also ,and live and work between the two .so we will see .

take care

[markie1]

markie1,

we evidently have different views on long term relationships. "speak with him every day on the phone and get to see him at least every 3 months" is hardly living together and is very much a LDR (Long Distance Relationship), not a LTR (Long Term Relationship). Your evidently rather intimate and recent knowledge of Bangkok and Pattaya bars also indicates that this is not what I personaly would call a "serious" relationship - while you may "trust him 100%" I cannot help wondering how far that actually goes and how far he can trust you.

I hope it works out for you - if it does that will make the second LDR I (or apparently anyone posting here) knows of to become an LTR.

Visa to UK - not impossible, but somehow you do not sound like a native English speaker yourself.

I dont know any different really always been in a relationship,most of my life ,has i said the last one aws a 20 year one

You have to expect alot of the guys on here to be sceptics. The only thai boys they have ever interacted with are Bar boys. Anyone that tries to have a meaningful relationship with a bar boy is aking for trouble. My first "BF" was a Moneyboy. I learned the hard way. Now I I'm in a relationship with a college educated guy with a good job. I help him pay for a Larger apartment so that I have a place to stay when I visit. Thats it. He works 6 days a week, 10 hours a day office job (for about the same monthly salary a bar boy can make in a week). Relationships can work with Thai guys.. they just have to be the RIGHT thai guys.

[yaraboy]

Jakenasty is right. Many with successful relationships have no need for this Forum.I know of a number of LTRs ; all with non bar boys. Frankly there is usually a trade off between age and financial worth, but it can balance out. My guy is very frugal and insists on working even though I have a project which keeps him busy

I know one guy in Pattaya he have in total 3 condos (one is owned by on bf, the other 2 are rented and paid by the falang. The guy gave the condos to his friends for cash and stay in one by him self. He move them to an other condo when the falang is coming for a while and stay with each in his rented condo. Relationship is where money is not any topic and both are independent. Maybe in 1000 cases 1 time. But here are 999 Falangs who believe that they are this one and only case.
Listen this 10 years already: Not in my case. My boy is different. Yes, until the car, house or condo is paid and they are on the save side. Sorry guys - Love is over when someone start to talk about money problems.

"...I stay with him now 3 years, 5years etc I trust him and I will buy a house in his name...." Do you know how long they have to work with the whole family a life time to reach an amount of 4-5 Million Baht? How many guys running around in Pattaya and were believing in this before? The house is still there, the BF (Ex) live still there but the one who paid it ones rent a small room in Sunee somewhere because there is not much money left anymore. But who will run around and tell this so open? Insider know and just smiling.

[Dodger]

I recently broke up with my тАЬx-bar boy friendтАЭ, even after a formal bonding ceremony, for the very same reasons that are being emphasized in this thread.

ItтАЩs unfortunate (for me), but I was one of those farangs who thought he was that one out of 1,000 who had stuck gold and could make it workтАжbut not the case.

My bf started conning me almost immediately after our bonding for more money to re-build the family house, which I refused to front. He reacted to my refusal by threatening to return to the working scene, as this, in his twisted story-line, was the only way he could earn enough money fast enough to make his parents happy. I played the тАЬhold cardтАЭ and told him to do whatever he felt he had to do, but I would not be providing any more funds than originally agreed upon prior to our bonding, and that was my bottom line.

One week later, and after several other attempts to get me to give in, he finally left his family village and returned to the working scene.

He phoned me the day he arrived back in Pattaya, and in a last ditch attempt to get me to break down and send him the money he wanted, I told him we were finished. At first, he didnтАЩt believe what I was telling him. In all his planning and scheming he failed to realize that he could potentially ruin everything for himself (and his family) if his manipulative money grabbing scheme failed, which it did.

He went from a position of security, both financially and emotionally, right back to the melting pot where he started in the blink of an eye. I, on the other hand, will have to suffer the consequences (emotionally) of losing him, although find a little comfort in the fact that I didnтАЩt throw my hard-earned money to the wind, and will just have to re-group (re-focus) and continue on my way. The money I had saved, which was planned for the re-building of his parentтАЩs home in one yearтАЩs time, will now be used towards the purchase of my own home in LOS, which works for me.

I hold no grudges or resentments towards him, (at least IтАЩm trying not to), and will try to learn from this experience and not make the same mistake again. I agree with one posters comments, that Thai boy/farang relationships can work, as they do in many cases, although, it has to be with the RIGHT one.

One thing IтАЩve learned is that the Thai boys are extremely resilient. They have the ability to recover from a broken relationship at the speed of light, which, conversely, is not the case with the majority of us aging farangs. IтАЩll try to use this knowledge to help myself in going forward. One way of accomplishing this, is to find another lovely starlit to fall head-over-heels in love with, and start the whole process all over againтАж55555. Hell, why not?

Mai pen rai

One thing IтАЩve learned is that the Thai boys are extremely resilient. They have the ability to recover from a broken relationship at the speed of light, which, conversely, is not the case with the majority of us aging farangs.

That's because they usually don't have any real feelings -- certainly not love -- for the aging farangs they shack up with. And why should they? It is the farang that usually picked them out of a line up, and fell in love at first sight. The boy had no say in the matter -- he was simply "chosen". Too many farangs expect genuine love to come out of such a situation, which is unrealistic and, ultimately, pathetic.

[markie1]

You have to expect alot of the guys on here to be sceptics. The only thai boys they have ever interacted with are Bar boys. Anyone that tries to have a meaningful relationship with a bar boy is aking for trouble. My first "BF" was a Moneyboy. I learned the hard way. Now I I'm in a relationship with a college educated guy with a good job. I help him pay for a Larger apartment so that I have a place to stay when I visit. Thats it. He works 6 days a week, 10 hours a day office job (for about the same monthly salary a bar boy can make in a week). Relationships can work with Thai guys.. they just have to be the RIGHT thai guys.I totally agree with you ,and having spent most of my life in relationships ,they sure can work if you have meet the right guy ,this is my second relationship witha thai guy ,My privious lasted just over a year ,and it was not through him been a bad guy that we seperated we were just not compatable,and no he was not a bar boy either, he was a good person with a good education.

I recently broke up with my тАЬx-bar boy friendтАЭ, even after a formal bonding ceremony, for the very same reasons that are being emphasized in this thread.

ItтАЩs unfortunate (for me), but I was one of those farangs who thought he was that one out of 1,000 who had stuck gold and could make it workтАжbut not the case.

My bf started conning me almost immediately after our bonding for more money to re-build the family house, which I refused to front. He reacted to my refusal by threatening to return to the working scene, as this, in his twisted story-line, was the only way he could earn enough money fast enough to make his parents happy. I played the тАЬhold cardтАЭ and told him to do whatever he felt he had to do, but I would not be providing any more funds than originally agreed upon prior to our bonding, and that was my bottom line.

One week later, and after several other attempts to get me to give in, he finally left his family village and returned to the working scene.

He phoned me the day he arrived back in Pattaya, and in a last ditch attempt to get me to break down and send him the money he wanted, I told him we were finished. At first, he didnтАЩt believe what I was telling him. In all his planning and scheming he failed to realize that he could potentially ruin everything for himself (and his family) if his manipulative money grabbing scheme failed, which it did.

He went from a position of security, both financially and emotionally, right back to the melting pot where he started in the blink of an eye. I, on the other hand, will have to suffer the consequences (emotionally) of losing him, although find a little comfort in the fact that I didnтАЩt throw my hard-earned money to the wind, and will just have to re-group (re-focus) and continue on my way. The money I had saved, which was planned for the re-building of his parentтАЩs home in one yearтАЩs time, will now be used towards the purchase of my own home in LOS, which works for me.

I hold no grudges or resentments towards him, (at least IтАЩm trying not to), and will try to learn from this experience and not make the same mistake again. I agree with one posters comments, that Thai boy/farang relationships can work, as they do in many cases, although, it has to be with the RIGHT one.

One thing IтАЩve learned is that the Thai boys are extremely resilient. They have the ability to recover from a broken relationship at the speed of light, which, conversely, is not the case with the majority of us aging farangs. IтАЩll try to use this knowledge to help myself in going forward. One way of accomplishing this, is to find another lovely starlit to fall head-over-heels in love with, and start the whole process all over againтАж55555. Hell, why not?
Mai pen rai

Hi Dodger - good tale with a good moral to the story. You said it in the beginning that it is possible to find the right boy but your odds are about 1 in 1000 - that's probably being extremely generous! You are lucky to bail out when you did!! If you're going to get a boy from a bar even straight from the village - the odds will be about the same. Someone once said "The most expensive sex I've ever had in Thailand is the one I didn't pay for". So advice for you all aging farangs - better to keep your money in a safe place and pull out 1000 baht whenever the urge strikes - this will end up being cheaper by far. Don't try so hard and maybe you'll get lucky!!!

You said it in the beginning that it is possible to find the right boy but your odds are about 1 in 1000 - that's probably being extremely generous!

"Trying to find the right boy" is precisely the problem.

Soul partners must find each other. You will never find a true soul partner by picking someone out of a go-go line-up.

khorthodkrub: Best sentence! The most expensive are they who cost nothing in the beginning!

".....he never ask for money. Until today I not gave him one Baht...he loves me for sure...." and so on.
Wait until the day come he want to introduce you to his mum. Travel to Udon or Buriram, sleep on a wooden floor and pay in the end of the day more as you would ever pay with 5 money boys in the best suite of a 5 star hotel.

.. pay in the end of the day more as you would ever pay with 5 money boys in the best suite of a 5 star hotel.I look forward to more episodes from this story

You said it in the beginning that it is possible to find the right boy but your odds are about 1 in 1000 - that's probably being extremely generous!

"Trying to find the right boy" is precisely the problem.

Soul partners must find each other. You will never find a true soul partner by picking someone out of a go-go line-up.

You are right!!!

[Dodger]

Chao Na Quote:


Too many farangs expect genuine love to come out of such a situation, which is unrealistic and, ultimately, pathetic.


I think genuine love can be cultivated in these relationships. It certainly was in my case.

Is that love, in-and-by-itself, strong enough to permeate the realities of life that the impoverished Thais have to deal with? Usually not.

Can the tenacity of a farangs love change these realities? Usually not.

Can this genuine love be purchased with money. Never

Can a farang teach himself not to fall in love because of these realities. Not in my case.

I hold myself accountable for choosing the wrong person to build a relationship with, but not with the fact that I allowed myself to fall in love.

I remember reading once where a young and brash reporter asked Thomas Edison if he was going to call it quits after his 352nd experiment with the incandescent light bulb failed. Edison replied..."young man, I have never failed. I have just successfully determined 352 ways that are not the correct way." One week later he invented the light bulb.

mai pen rai

[catawampuscat]

No matter how many times posters tell their stories, many of us will continue to think that somehow our situation is different,
that this is real love, that this boy is different, that we are more attractive,sexier,handsomer,funnier, more entertaining etc.. than that
foolish old fart but in the end, reality sets in and it is time to do it all over again but a little differently, hopefully, as even foolish
older men can learn and not make the same mistakes over and over..

The heteros are even worse at this and sometimes end their own lives over broken hearts and cheating wives, if you read the weekly English
language papers.. The traps are worse with the straights as children are often involved and very messy family relationships with the extended family.
Some of us are romantic and want the wedding bells to ring but we are lucky in most cases, that these marriages are not legal and
really are just blessings from the monks..

Hope springs eternal and as long as you can afford the financial and emotional roller-coaster, many of us will be tempted to get on the
ride again and enjoy the ups and bear with the downs and live another day in the this pleasure paradise complete with snakes and heart
aches.. :cat:

I did this once, while living in the U.S., and came out of it pretty well. "S" was a bar-boy, met at the Barbieri, but a very unusual one. He had a strong sense of ethics and was a joy to be around.

When he realized how expensive Bangkok was, he went back home to Lopburi, and I believe that's where the "trouble" started. His career in Bangkok (including me) had awakened him to just how handsome and desirable he was, and, being a normally-sexed 19yo, started getting to know gay men in Lopburi. In any case, when I finally moved to Chiang Mai, he came up to give it a try, but ultimately gave up and left. One of the applicable truisms is that you CAN'T simply take a boy out of his life and expect success. "S" was a Lopburi lad, a Central Thai guy, and he had no friends in Northern Thailand. Nor could he speak the local language (kham meuang). In any case, I have nothing but good memories of him. It was a pity we had to part, but, when we did, he meticulously took what was his, and ONLY what was his -- that was his typical behavior.

I think the two main problems with LDR's are the following:

First, you don't have enough time to actually get to know the boy. You have to make a snap judgement based on his self-presentation over a brief period of 5-20 days. It may not all be "acting" -- he may be eager to find a farang friend -- but it isn't HIM, either. I would think (a parallel example) that I'd have to know someone for six or twelve MONTHS before I would give him a key to my house.

Second, whether you like it or not, when you leave you are abandoning him. Letters and phone calls won't make up the difference. Thais much prefer to do things IN PERSON in the REAL PRESENT.

If you like the boy and enjoy helping him, do as you please. But do be on the watch for the outright frauds, who are billing 3-4 farang men at the same time. (How can you do that? I don't know!)

Is that love, in-and-by-itself, strong enough to permeate the realities of life that the impoverished Thais have to deal with? Usually not.



Impoverished?

Oh, please. Impoverished is not having enough to eat. Impoverished is not having shoes on your feet, or decent clothes on your back, or a roof over your head, or access to clean water.

None of these boys are truly impoverished -- even the worst off of them has shoes, plenty to eat, clean clothes, and a roof waiting for them back at home. Most of them have cell phones, motorcycles, and money for going out.

Not as rich as you or me? Undoubtedly.

Desirous of material things that they can't afford, but do not need for survival? Oh, yeah.

But impoverished? Give me a major fucking break, Mother Teresa.

All these posts look at things from the farang point of view. That, as much as anything else, is why the relationships fail.

Look at life on the farm. The basic necessities of life grow in the fields, swim in the ponds, eat scraps in the back yard, or scuttle through the ditches. As long as the surplus from rice growing is used to buy seed for the next crop, money is not needed. So, when there is money it tends to get spent all at one. Some of it on useful stuff like clothes. Some of it to pay back debts or share with family. Some of it to blow on booze. And why not?

The same attitude to money is shown by most bar boys (most of whom are still farm boys at heart). Give then 1,000 baht and they'll spend it in a day. Give them 10,000 baht and they'll spend it in two days. Give them 100,000 and it might last as long as a week. So, they never have any money. So, they are forever asking for it. Solution. Be mean six days a week, generous on one.

As to sharing good fortune with the family, for the farm boy (the bar boy) there's no other option. It's what people do unless they have a very bad heart. If they're down to their last 200 baht and will give 100 of this to their mum, why wouldn't they be askance that you're not willing to share just a little of your fortune with them. Yes, you must think of what you'll be living on in the future. Life isn't just this year, but the next and the next. But farm boys don't think that way. The basics are secure (barring a drought). Money's for blowing.

If your Thai boy's middle class, most of this won't apply. Middle class Thais are pretty much like westerners when it comes to money. But if you like farm boys (I do) you need patience, the resolve to say no and keep on saying it, and quite a lot of love.

Going back to the story that the original post is based on, I cant help but notice the sympathy by the writer towards the emotional well being of his friend who had been so terribly betrayed....and yet not one word of sympathy for the wife back home who was about to be, well, so terribly betrayed - and dumped. :clown:

[Dodger]

Chao Na Quote:


Impoverished?

Oh, please. Impoverished is not having enough to eat. Impoverished is not having shoes on your feet, or decent clothes on your back, or a roof over your head, or access to clean water.[quote:126b800x]

Chao Na,

Your ignorance is beginning to amaze me...and I'm normally not a person who is easily amazed.

It's obvious to me that you either have 1) never visited rural Thailand, or 2) did so while under the influence of some very heavy medication.

Your reference to people who don't have enough to eat caused me to chuckle, as the majority of Isaan residents either eat what they grow or catch (including slow running insects) - or don't eat that day at all. Your reference to those who don't wear decent clothes or have a roof over their heads also caused a chuckle, because most residents of these rural farm areas don't wear decent clothes or have enough tin covering their shacks to keep the rain out. The part I liked the most, was your reference to those who can't afford to have shoes on their feet, because most of these people can't afford the luxury of buying shoes. They either wear worn-out hand-me-downs, opt for a pair of 20 baht plastic sandals, or just waddle around in all their hidden wealth with bare feet.

Furthermore, if the boys we all have the pleasure of sharing time with didn't have families living in this level of poverty, they wouldn't be laying around sucking on our dicks to begin with. Thus, the reason why these relationships we're discussing have such a high failure rate.

Take a trip up to Isaan...leave the meds at home...pull up a straw mat and share a meal with these folks, maybe you'll learn something. But, then again, maybe YOU won't.









[/quote:126b800x]

Thanks, Dodger, but I have spent months and months in Isaan over the past twenty years, and visited every single province there.

How much time have YOU spent in a REALLY impoverished place? Sub-Saharan Africa, for example? Or, closer to home, rural Laos, Cambodia, or Myanmar?

You obviously have no frame of reference on poverty whatsoever.

"Impoverishment", Dodger style:

http://www.volunthai.com/images/vt_image_programs.jpg


"Impoverishment", for the rest of us:

http://www.msf.org/source/countries/africa/angola/2002/magnum/fz-48.jpg

[Dodger]

Imaginative cut n' paste photos, but frankly, I don't think you've ever left the bar stool.

Imaginative cut n' paste photos, but frankly, I don't think you've ever left the bar stool.

Frankly, I think you need to visit more of the world. Of course, you probably would not have much interest in visiting places without a sex tourism industry.

[catawampuscat]

It is pretentious for any of us, save a missionary type or a doctor without borders person, to begin to describe the
horrors of the starving masses of parts of the world..
One is still impoverished, if they are barely sustaining themselves and live in huts without running water, electricity
and without enough to eat..

There are relative degrees of impoverishment and just because there are worse cases doesn't negate dodger's
assertions about many rural Thais living impoverished lives..

Our friend Chao Na does get a bit holier than thou at times and reminds me of one of my favorites posters, opionated,
sarcastic but often shooting arrows of truth and honesty thru the bullshit many of us post but sometimes he goes
over the top and proves himself to be no boy genius.. :cat:

Imaginative cut n' paste photos, but frankly, I don't think you've ever left the bar stool.

Of course, you probably would not have much interest in visiting places without a sex tourism industry.

or without a Burger King or KFC .............. (now that's really impoverished)

[TrongpaiExpat]

Thanks, Dodger, but I have spent months and months in Isaan over the past twenty years, and visited every single province there.


Months and months traveling Isaan and not a single trip report or travel insight post under your current name or past monikers.

What would you like to know? If you're looking for tips on where to pick up some fresh ass in the hinterlands, I'm afraid I can't help. If you want to know about the Khmer monuments, forest wats, national parks, the Mekong river towns, etc,...fire away. As said, I have been in every single province in Isan, and travel up that direction at least three or four times a year. Couldn't care less if you believe me or not.

[Brad the Impala]

What would you like to know? If you're looking for tips on where to pick up some fresh ass in the hinterlands, I'm afraid I can't help. If you want to know about the Khmer monuments, forest wats, national parks, the Mekong river towns, etc,...fire away. As said, I have been in every single province in Isan, and travel up that direction at least three or four times a year. Couldn't care less if you believe me or not.

So share some of your knowledge and construct an informative post with your time, rather than using it to write a number of one line put downs.

We all know what interests you, Bradley, and I certainly have no information to share in that regard.

[TrongpaiExpat]

[quote="Chao Na":2dxm7by4]What would you like to know? If you're looking for tips on where to pick up some fresh ass in the hinterlands, I'm afraid I can't help. If you want to know about the Khmer monuments, forest wats, national parks, the Mekong river towns, etc,...fire away. As said, I have been in every single province in Isan, and travel up that direction at least three or four times a year. Couldn't care less if you believe me or not.

So share some of your knowledge and construct an informative post with your time, rather than using it to write a number of one line put downs.[/quote:2dxm7by4]

Exactly, that was my point. I don't doubt your word and no I am not looking for "fresh ass" in Isaan, that's why there's a Pattaya. Your quite an asshole or have some personality disorder but, I get the feeling that if you wanted, you could provide very useful and accurate information on travel in Thailand.

I travel around Thailand quite a lot as well and next month I have planed a trip from Udon to Loei Province, Phu Kradung Nationa Park,Phu Hin Ronghla, Nam Tok Chat, Dan Sai and then take rt. 211 following the Mekong to Nong Khai and back to Udon. I am going with my BF, ass not as fresh as it once was, but it will due.

I guess we are going way off topic. How about starting a new post on the ins and outs of Isaan travel?

TrongpaiExpat, please keep polite and dont use the word "asshole"
I am thankful that CN not write his whole travel story here. For me he dont need to prove anything. It's ok for me.
He make his provocation but he never attacking anybody here so you please do it maybe same.
Because you are all men and not boys
Thanks

[TrongpaiExpat]

TrongpaiExpat, please keep polite and dont use the word "asshole"
I am thankful that CN not write his whole travel story here. For me he dont need to prove anything. It's ok for me.
He make his provocation but he never attacking anybody here so you please do it maybe same.
Because you are all men and not boys
Thanks

OK, Pascal. Perhaps you don't know his past names? Let's just say he can be an unpleasant person.

[Brad the Impala]

TrongpaiExpat, please keep polite and dont use the word "asshole"
I am thankful that CN not write his whole travel story here. For me he dont need to prove anything. It's ok for me.
He make his provocation but he never attacking anybody here so you please do it maybe same.
Because you are all men and not boys
Thanks


555! Been around long have you?

What past names? Who do you think you are slinging such wild and spurious allegations?

All I've done in this thread is to point out that the people of Isan aren't "impoverished" by world standards, and I'm getting attacked for this? Perhaps some old queens here like to stroke their egos by going around saying how they're helping the "impoverished people of Isan", but that just shows their ignorance of real world poverty. There are hundreds of millions of people out there who can only dream of owning a pair of flip flops, or having a tin roof over their heads, or having a non-stop supply of sticky rice and protein sources.

You guys would be better off sticking to topics such as "are the bars open on Khao Pansa or not?"

[allieb]

Re paying a monthly allowance.

I did this with a boy I was involved with for 3 years. Call it what you like but I prefer to call it a retainer I never considered him my Love. I thought I loved him but really I was in love with a body and a person with the ability to amuse me and fulfill a dream.

I knew he had other farang but I chose to keep the pot boiling. He would tell me he loved me but that was what he was being paid to do. Funny thing though he really did like sex with older men. He did things with me that he wasn't coerced into doing, always got a hard on when I undressed at night at the sight of beer tummy "Imagine "He phoned me every week when I had left Thailand and of course I hung up and called right back at my expense.

Was he really in love with me, I don't think so. I think he liked me a lot. I was generous when I was with him. I finished with him 2 and a half years ago. Funny he still calls and is desperately trying to curry favor again. Sometimes I take the call sometimes I don't. I have never gotten him out of my mind and often until now fantasize over the sex we used to have. I have chosen not get back with him and torment myself any more because looking at it all from all angles it will go nowhere.

The downside of the relationship was that after the third or forth drink he became a handful. I couldn't handle his sudden change into what I can only describe as mental case. This happened too frequently for me and although I would love to get him between the sheets again the roller coaster ride isn't worth it. Like most Thais he could never manage on whatever amont of money he reveived.

My last word on this is don't expect too much out of your Thai Bf on a long didtance relationship and if you are having a nice time then a reasonable retainer is in order but know when things have run their course and move on Like DODGER did. When you have to say no again and again its time.

[Smiles]

" ... OK, Pascal. Perhaps you don't know his past names? Let's just say he can be an unpleasant person ... "
No no, 'asshole' is good. I would dilute it a bit to Chao Na (Boygeenyus) " ... can be an asshole ... ", rather than the blanket statement " ... he's just an overall asshole ... ". But then, can't we all ... be one that is, at times.

Look, Boygeenyus has been on this Board for a coon's age, and he posts some good stuff ... once in awhile ... in a blue moon (here I go again kind of agreeing with Catwampuscat on this).

But overall he is just a childish little bitch-bully who believes he has the god given right to play the grand Moral Compass for the Board as a whole. That kind of sanctimonious personality I've encountered many times in my life at work and at play, and I think we all have. And in the end they all turn out to be assholes of one kind or the other. They are the kind of boorish encounters one tries hard to avoid . . . i.e. make a quick beeline for the back door of the coffee shop when he (or she) steps in the front door. There's a number of these dudes and/or dudesses at 'The Bean Scene' here who's entrance makes me thank god for the leafy little back yard attached to the main building: these guys never go out there because there's hardly ever anyone there to teach things to.

Put him on 'ignore', it's the best solution. I don't myself because I rather enjoy watching The Boy wallowing in sanctimony at every turn. For me, entertaining on some sort of odd masochistic level.

Cheers ...

[catawampuscat]

maybe trongpai and the Impala can give Chao Na the benefit of a doubt.. Afterall, I don't believe our dear moderators
would tolerate another reappearance of boygenius or bbb or any other previously unwelcomed poster, so maybe we
are jumping to conclusions even thou there are strong similarities..

maybe in the spirit of Buddhist Lent (today/tomorrow) we can get past our petty differences and stop with the asshole calling
and all the bitchy queens references.

also telling a poster what topics he should post about or trying to direct anyone is ridiculous and I am sure none of us want
to be told what to post about or to prove ourselves to anyone..

mellow out fellows and try a little tenderness. :cat:

[allieb]

Whether Chao Na is someone from the past doesn't bother me. Everyone has the right to an opinion. I agree fully with Smiles and Cat. In the old days when Boygeenyes was posting although he could be an AH I found him amusing I never put him on ignore even after receiving personal insults.

Maybe we should have a vote as to whether to let him back on the board again and the guessing games will stop as to if he is using a new name or not. I would say let him back.

[Smiles]

" ... In fairness ... Strikes me, he's made an effort to be mild... but that's just my opinion ... "
And in fairness, I'd agree. He's toned down overall. Perhaps he's made a pact with Elephantspike: he won't be deep-sixed (again) "if" ...?

My comments above were meant regarding his posting career on Sawatdee, not necessarily this latest incarnation.

Cheers ...

Smiles, this series of quotes is just for you so I'll get it out of the way early - a posting career on Sawatdee: God help us. " ... yer a goddam idiot, so shut the fuck up .."!


Anyone that tries to have a meaningful relationship with a bar boy is aking for trouble. My first "BF" was a Moneyboy. I learned the hard way. Now I I'm in a relationship with a college educated guy with a good job. I help him pay for a Larger apartment so that I have a place to stay when I visit. Thats it. He works 6 days a week, 10 hours a day office job (for about the same monthly salary a bar boy can make in a week). Relationships can work with Thai guys.. they just have to be the RIGHT thai guys.

And why does his being "a college educated guy" make him any more (or less) likely to be "the RIGHT thai guy" ?


no he was not a bar boy either, he was a good person with a good education

Since when did "a good education" make "a good person", or even make it more likely? I know of no-one here who has a "good education" (even 555 only went to a minor public school!) but that, at least to me, simply makes them less fortunate but not less worthy.


Many with successful relationships have no need for this Forum. I know of a number of LTRs ; all with non bar boys.

I simply know of "a number of LTRs". I am not perceptive enough to be able to tell whether they were bar boys, massage boys (bar, beach, body, or foot), beach boys, freelancers, or those who are just "helped" by their partner, nor am I prejudiced enough (in person, at least) to see the point in asking.

On a lesser note, I also fail to understand the connection between "successful relationships" and the "need for this Forum "!! My partner sleeps eight hours a night, I sleep four - it simply serves to "fill the unforgiving minute".


Yes, until the car, house or condo is paid and they are on the save side. "...I stay with him now 3 years, 5years etc I trust him and I will buy a house in his name...." тАж. The house is still there, the BF (Ex) live still there but the one who paid it ones rent a small room in Sunee somewhere because there is not much money left anymore.

Well, the car, house, etc are paid; the new "town" car is in his name, the older country pick-up in mine; similarly, the motorbikes. The house is owned jointly (dual directors, single signature) and additional land here and in his home village is in his name (in his home village, with no title deeds of any description, it would be difficult to be anything else). All bank accounts, including those in the UK and offshore, are also in joint names, single signature. He could walk away tomorrow, legally and morally, with more than if he won the jackpot on the lottery (Thai, unfortunately, not UK or US) and all he would be giving up would be me and a pension - and he would also have half the pension if I were dead.

We both, in my view, put in equal amounts (everything we had) and that is what we are both entitled to. What is he waiting for? I do not know, but after more than five years it cannot just be out of curiosity, sympathy and the dogs.


None of these boys are truly impoverished -- even the worst off of them has shoes, plenty to eat, clean clothes, and a roof waiting for them back at home. Most of them have cell phones, motorcycles, and money for going out. тАж..

"None"? Reminds me of someone here saying "all"! My partner happened to leave "home" with no shoes, nothing to eat, no clothes apart from those he was wearing, and no home to return to, with or without a roof. Issan is more than just pretty temples and striking views.


One is still impoverished, if they are barely sustaining themselves and live in huts without running water, electricity and without enough to eat

Precisely. Until he was seven no-one in the village had electricity, and until a lot later the only thing running about the water was the child pushing the cart with containers of water from the lake behind the temple down the mud track to their "house".


I hold no grudges or resentments towards him, (at least IтАЩm trying not to), and will try to learn from this experience and not make the same mistake again. I agree with one posters comments, that Thai boy/farang relationships can work, as they do in many cases, although, it has to be with the RIGHT one.
I think genuine love can be cultivated in these relationships

How can I end up by agreeing with both Catawumpus and Dodger??

I too had a disastrous time with my first Thai relationship (LDR) - based on lust not love, it was doomed to failure and there is nothing I regret about it more than my own obduracy in refusing to admit that I had made a mistake and ending it earlier, before either of us got hurt any more than was necessary.

Can love be "cultivated"? My partner never told me he loved me until after we had been living together, 24/7, etc, for over three years, and he has since told me that he did not love me when he agreed to move in for a salary of 4,000 baht a month plus board and lodging (I can hardly blame him!). Maybe the answer is just "don't think too much" and, if you're lucky enough, count your blessings instead of your money.

[yedo111]

Thanks for saving me the money!

I think I forget the LDR I was planning now, Im leaving Thailand in a couple of weeks and thinking a barboy can be a genuine BF is just ridicolous.

Lets get on with our lifes. It was fun while it lasted.

My current boyf was met while working at Adam's Apple. He didn't much like the job, and, much more important, wanted to complete his education and see the world. So he said on our first night together, and so it continues today.

I love this 23yo "boy" so much that sometimes I am surprised. He has all sorts of "non-Thai" characteristics. He's Akha, not Thai, but he's not even 100 percent Akha: he's half-Chinese and half-Akha. He is the perpetual ray of sunshine in my life, almost always brimming over with good humor and boyish energy. He's going to finish high-school this year and then go on to college. He thinks that sex is very unimportant.

So you may fly off, convinced that a "relationship with a bar-boy" is impossible.

But, of course, four years down the road, he is no longer a bar-boy and I am no longer his "customer."

He's absolutely loyal, and he's also a Christian. Not exactly your "typical Thai," but then -- very few Thai are!

He thinks that sex is very unimportant.




Perhaps he only thinks that sex with you is very unimportant.

[catawampuscat]

[quote="Henry Cate":feoz750x]He thinks that sex is very unimportant.




Perhaps he only thinks that sex with you is very unimportant.[/quote:feoz750x]


This is a classic example of why I enjoy Chao Na's postings. He read my mind on this one and is reality based unlike
many posters who live in the clouds and pretend that their straight boyfriends are with them for any other reason than
money.
At least with a gay bf, the possibility exists, however remote, and it is also dependent on the farang's age/appearance
and even personality.. I don't care if Chao Na rose like a phoenix from the ashes of bg or not and just hope he can keep from
going over the line.. :cat:

He read my mind on this one

Agreed - again!

A relationship based on what a bar-boy (or anyone else) said they wanted on the first night - no wonder he's happy!

Perhaps he is only uninterested in sex with you....

Followed by speculation that the guy is straight, etc. etc.

Do you actually think that I could spend four years with this guy and never ever have the same thought as occurred to you within the first thirty seconds?

The doubts may be "reality-based" or whatever the current advanced word may be, but I've heard them a million times.

"I've seen him, driving around with his girl-friend!!" It was his sister.

"He is a very cunning young man, simply using you and not wanting you at all."

And bla-bla-bla, from people who have never met him. By now, everyone who is close to me understands that he is actually gay. He himself is becoming a little bit more forthcoming about his admiration for handsome guys.

But it's a simple fact that he has a very low libido. To judge from other people's opinions, his very limited sex-life would make him a prime candidate for depression, ennui, and all that. But the actual situation is just the opposite. He's one of the happiest boys I've ever met -- and he always insists on a good hug and kiss before going home. To say it again, HE insists.

Another point, perhaps minor -- everybody likes him.

"But what is the use of words, and there is no end of talking..."

.... he always insists on a good hug and kiss before going home.

An original take on a long term relationship, "four years down the road"!!

[yedo111]

[quote="Henry Cate":pl3c9ad0] .... he always insists on a good hug and kiss before going home.

An original take on a long term relationship, "four years down the road"!![/quote:pl3c9ad0]

Love without sex ? Only hugs and kisses?
Im not jealous. Maybe when I get very old and my engine stopped working...

[markie1]

My current boyf was met while working at Adam's Apple. He didn't much like the job, and, much more important, wanted to complete his education and see the world. So he said on our first night together, and so it continues today.

I love this 23yo "boy" so much that sometimes I am surprised. He has all sorts of "non-Thai" characteristics. He's Akha, not Thai, but he's not even 100 percent Akha: he's half-Chinese and half-Akha. He is the perpetual ray of sunshine in my life, almost always brimming over with good humor and boyish energy. He's going to finish high-school this year and then go on to college. He thinks that sex is very unimportant.

So you may fly off, convinced that a "relationship with a bar-boy" is impossible.

But, of course, four years down the road, he is no longer a bar-boy and I am no longer his "customer."

He's absolutely loyal, and he's also a Christian. Not exactly your "typical Thai," but then -- very few Thai are! SEx is not important for who You or HIM ,i wish it wasnt Important for my boy friend he can not seem to get enough of me LOLL

Sex is not very important for him, and so he gives me my freedom.

That gives me enormous sexual possibilities, which I take advantage of.

Yet, when all is said and done, he is still the sexiest boy I have ever met. Did I imply that we never had sex?

And I also have a very handsome male harem on the side. (!)

This must be MORALLY WRONG! :-0

[Diec]

Sex is not very important for him, and so he gives me my freedom.

That gives me enormous sexual possibilities, which I take advantage of.

Yet, when all is said and done, he is still the sexiest boy I have ever met. Did I imply that we never had sex?

And I also have a very handsome male harem on the side. (!)

This must be MORALLY WRONG! :-0

You sound like a classy guy!!