Toxin gives exclusive interview to UK paper

"You must call me Doctor" Toxsins interview in full is here:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-1024257/EXCLUSIVE-Dr-Thaksin-gives-Sportsmail-amazing-insight-Man-City-dream.html

I love the bit about how he did so much fighting a AIDS/HIV epidemic etc., etc.

Can't think of any other ex Thai Prime Minister who goes in fear of assassination. Even General Suchinda lives in great comfort in LOS and he set armed troops against his own people on the streets of Bangkok back in the early nineties!

[fedssocr]

he may also be afraid of going to jail.

Call me "doctor". What an egomaniac!

DELETED

"You must call me Doctor"

Only if he calls me Bwana

As far as I am aware, he is perfectly entitled to expect to be called Dr.

From Wiki........

He later went on to obtain a master's degree in criminal justice from Eastern Kentucky University in the United States, in 1975. In 1978 he received a doctorate in criminal justice at Sam Houston State University in Texas with a dissertation on "An Analysis of the Relationship Between the Criminal Justice Educational Process and the Attitude of the Student Toward the Rule of Law

Reporter probably asked Thaksin's people how best to address him: "Mr. Thaksin", "Khun Thaksin", "Pol. Capt. Thaksin", "Former PM Thaksin", "Dr. Thaksin" or other. "Dr. Thaksin" is clearly an appropriate choice.

[Hmmm]

As far as I am aware, he is perfectly entitled to expect to be called Dr.

From Wiki........

He later went on to obtain a master's degree in criminal justice from Eastern Kentucky University in the United States, in 1975. In 1978 he received a doctorate in criminal justice at Sam Houston State University in Texas with a dissertation on "An Analysis of the Relationship Between the Criminal Justice Educational Process and the Attitude of the Student Toward the Rule of Law

I don't know about you, but where I come from people don't get higher degrees without having an undergraduate degree first. Of course some countries have institutions that accept anyone who can pay, and give away degrees like they come in boxes of Corn Flakes.

Since the Thaksin family's contribution to higher education includes two members accused of academic misconduct and one who tried to get into a prestigious degree course for which she was not qualified by the back door, I think I'd be keeping quiet about it if I were him.

Thaksin has an undergraduate degree. No university in the US would have accepted him for a master's or doctorate program if he didn't.

I don't know about you, but where I come from people don't get higher degrees without having an undergraduate degree first. Of course some countries have institutions that accept anyone who can pay, and give away degrees like they come in boxes of Corn Flakes.

I'm inclined to agree, as with most things that Toxsin has been involved with if you dig deep enough the smell is certainly not that of roses! I also remember a few years ago that he put out that he had worked in a McDonnell's in the States to put himself through Uni. This of course proved false, and was proved.

It was KFC, not McDonalds, and I did not hear that it had been disproven.

Remember that at that age, he was just another guy -- not the super rich super-connected manipulator he is today.

I just looked it up. He graduated from the Police Cadet Academy, which of course is an undergraduate degree.

[Hmmm]

I just looked it up. He graduated from the Police Cadet Academy, which of course is an undergraduate degree.

No policeman I know would claim that going to police school is the equivalent of an undergraduate degree. Nor do I know of any real university that would accept it for entry to higher degree study.

And in Thailand, what do you reckon they study, Corruption 101 ?

The Police Cadet Academy gives an accredited, four-year bachelors' degree -- same as the Air Force Academy or Naval Academy in the US, or their equivalents in Thailand. It is where police officers are trained -- not run-of-the-mill traffic cops.

The Police Cadet Academy gives an accredited, four-year bachelors' degree -- same as the Air Force Academy or Naval Academy in the US, or their equivalents in Thailand. It is where police officers are trained -- not run-of-the-mill traffic cops.

Some of you may be surprised when I tell you this, maybe even stunned in the case of Hmmm, but the statement made by our newbie above, is actually spot on and totally correct.


Cheers,


George.

You will find that I usually know what I'm talking about, although you may often find the truth distasteful.

You will find that I usually know what I'm talking about, although you may often find the truth distasteful.

As is proved more often than not, it usually is. Agreeing with you Quisp means only one thing! It's time for me to get away from this forum, get some fresh air and go and grab a beer or two. Now where the fuck am I going to be able to get a beer and be able to enjoy a cigarette at the same time? Well, other than standing outside a 7-11 or a go go bar that is. OK, Beam me up Scotty and I hope you are able to answer my question. :ufo:


George

Sounds like Soi Twilight still accommodates nicotine addicts. There's your answer.

[Hmmm]

The Police Cadet Academy gives an accredited, four-year bachelors' degree -

"Accredited" ... by whom ?

I guess Thaksin must have been away the day they learnt that extra-judicial killings were illegal.

By the Ministry of Education, of course.

A degree from the Royal Thai Police Cadet Academy is just as legit as one from Chula or Thammasat. Or the US Coast Guard Academy, West Point, Naval Academy, etc., etc.

[Hmmm]

By the Ministry of Education, of course.

A degree from the Royal Thai Police Cadet Academy is just as legit as one from Chula or Thammasat. Or the US Coast Guard Academy, West Point, Naval Academy, etc., etc.

I suspect Chula grads might beg to differ.

And if you wish to group military or police training colleges with real universities, I guess that's your prerogative.

Bottom line ... if you're trying to convince me that Thaksin is a legitimate holder of a doctorate in criminal justice - in any educational, moral, or ethical sense - you're wasting your time.

Sigh.

I didn't say that the Academy was as good as school as Chula or Thammasat. I said that the degrees it bestows are just as valid. Which they undisputably are.

And if you wish to group military or police training colleges with real universities, I guess that's your prerogative.

Mr Quisp is not making the grouping - this is a question of fact and internationally accepted educational standards, not personal opinion.


Bottom line ... if you're trying to convince me that Thaksin is a legitimate holder of a doctorate in criminal justice - in any educational, moral, or ethical sense - you're wasting your time.

Morals and ethics have nothing to do with his legitimate use of the title "Doctor".

Thank you, GF. Some people here are really exasperating.

[Smiles]

" ... "Dr. Thaksin" is clearly an appropriate choice ... "
Only if one wishes to get their audience to sniggerin'.
I've seldom come across a Phd who insisted on being addressed as 'Doctor'. Henry Kissinger is one who comes to mind, but he's as large an egomaniac (as Dr Quithp is) as can be found on this good earth.
Phd's can afford to be reasonably humble on this point as the've already done the deserving work and everyone knows it. Dr Thaksin makes an idiot of himself in suggesting it, and lands himself squarely into Pompous Twit territory.

Cheers ...

[cottmann]

.......No policeman I know would claim that going to police school is the equivalent of an undergraduate degree. Nor do I know of any real university that would accept it for entry to higher degree study......

What does that say about the nature of Eastern Kentucky University, which is accredited by the Southern Association of Colleges and Schools (SACS), and which accepted him into the program for (and awarded him) a master's degree in criminal justice?

[colmx]

Sigh.

I didn't say that the Academy was as good as school as Chula or Thammasat. I said that the degrees it bestows are just as valid. Which they undisputably are.

Are they as good as the degrees available on Khao San Road?

[dave_tf-old]

What does that say about the nature of Eastern Kentucky University, which is accredited by the Southern Association of Colleges and Schools (SACS), and which accepted him into the program for (and awarded him) a master's degree in criminal justice?

Clearly it indicates a sinister American role in the creation of this monster. Since it is a recognized University and not a typical diploma mill, all evidence points to it being a tool of American Imperialism nestled in the hills of a minor 'southern' state far from the gaze of righteous New England and California liberals and used to train future dictators in disguising themselves as populist politicians, with minors available in graft, corruption, and pomposity.

Given the facts as we know them, no other possibility exists.

Since I don't live terribly far from this campus, I will--if requested--pay a visit and try to put together a more complete dossier on it's more covert operations. That is, providing I don't feel like my life is endangered.

[cottmann]

What does that say about the nature of Eastern Kentucky University, which is accredited by the Southern Association of Colleges and Schools (SACS), and which accepted him into the program for (and awarded him) a master's degree in criminal justice?

Clearly it indicates a sinister American role in the creation of this monster. Since it is a recognized University and not a typical diploma mill, all evidence points to it being a tool of American Imperialism nestled in the hills of a minor 'southern' state far from the gaze of righteous New England and California liberals and used to train future dictators in disguising themselves as populist politicians, with minors available in graft, corruption, and pomposity.

Given the facts as we know them, no other possibility exists.

Since I don't live terribly far from this campus, I will--if requested--pay a visit and try to put together a more complete dossier on it's more covert operations. That is, providing I don't feel like my life is endangered.

I was trying to be ironic but obviously didn't succeed - unless I'm missing the irony in your response.

[dave_tf-old]

That's OK. I was attempting parody and may have missed the mark myself.

Oddly, it was neither your nor your remark that was being parodied. I simply used your Irony Board to spring into the pool of parody.

[Brad the Impala]

That's OK. I was attempting parody and may have missed the mark myself.

Oddly, it was neither your nor your remark that was being parodied. I simply used your Irony Board to spring into the pool of parody.

Oh yeah, a likely story!








(Only being sarcastic so that I can in on this interesting exchange)

[lonelywombat]

You have not answered whta we all ant to know. Was this masters degree from a sham university or a real one.

Was it earnt or was it bought?

[dave_tf-old]

Well, shame on me.

Neither Eastern Kentucky University (where he recieved his Masters) nor Sam Houston State University (where he recieved his Doctorate) are Yale or Harvard, but they are real Universities--not sham.

Assuming he actually attended these institutions, completed his course-work to the satisfaction of his professors, and had the Dissertation accepted without cheating or bribery, then he indeed earned his degrees rather than buying them.

[cottmann]

Well, shame on me.

Neither Eastern Kentucky University (where he recieved his Masters) nor Sam Houston State University (where he recieved his Doctorate) are Yale or Harvard, but they are real Universities--not sham.

Assuming he actually attended these institutions, completed his course-work to the satisfaction of his professors, and had the Dissertation accepted without cheating or bribery, then he indeed earned his degrees rather than buying them.

His May 1979 PhD dissertation was titled "An Analysis of the Relationship between the Criminal Justice Educational Process and the Attitude of the Students toward the Rule of Law," which I think someone mentioned earlier. Among his conclusions were "There was a significant linear relationship between the criminal justice educational process and student attitudes toward the rule of law," and "there was a significant positive relationship between the number of hours in criminal justice completed and student attitudes toward the rule of law." From this, one could conclude that he spent some years in graduate school discovering that the more one studies criminal justice, the better one's regard for the rule of law. Of course, as Bernard Trink would have written, TIT!

His PhD isn't worth the paper its written on. Now if it was a PhD from the west...

His PhD isn't worth the paper its written on. Now if it was a PhD from the west...

His PhD is from America.

Really? I wonder who he paid to do it for him?

He got his master's degree when he was 26 and his PhD when he was 29, both from well-respected universities in America. At that point, he was not rich enough to pay anyone to obtain the degrees for him. He was a nobody.

As painful as it may be to admit, the degrees are valid and well-earned.

[cottmann]

He got his master's degree when he was 26 and his PhD when he was 29, both from well-respected universities in America. At that point, he was not rich enough to pay anyone to obtain the degrees for him. He was a nobody.

His family was one of the richest in Chiang Mai and certainly rich enough to send him to, and support him in, the States to get two graduate degrees.


As painful as it may be to admit, the degrees are valid and well-earned. Oh, at least as valid and well-earned as Newin Chidchob's.

Where did Newin's degree come from? A Western university?

The Shinawatra's may have been wealthy by Chiang Mai standards, but they were peanuts compared to the families of wealthy Americans -- who must earn their degrees like everyone else. One cannot just waltz into an American university and buy a degree.

[cottmann]

Where did Newin's degree come from?

First point. The Thai Government maintains - or used to maintain - a list of universities whose degrees it recognized as legitimate and valid, etc., in terms of meeting the statutory educational requirements for Thai MPs, etc., i.e.,

Second point. Under Thai rules, therefore, Mr Newin's qualification was seen as being as valid, etc., as Dr. Thaksin's.

Third point. In the days when he was in the Thaksin ministry, I believe that his official website said that his degree was received from Pacific Western University in Hawaii (now, I understand, California Miramar University), a California state-approved institution.

Fourth point. Many people around the world, including many formerly employed by the US Federal Government and its agencies, have parchments from this institution.

Fifth point. Some US and other government agencies have described PWU as a diploma or degree mill.

Sixth point. Whether or not PWU is or was a degree mill is in the eye of the beholder and, in the eyes of the Thai Government, its graduates were competent to hold ministerial portfolios.

Well, the two universities Thaksin attended in Kentucky and Texas are most definitely NOT degree mills -- and no amount of money from a two-bit Chinese-Thai family in Chiang Mai could have purchased his degrees for him. He attended those universities as a full-time student. He may be a despicable, maniacal despot, but he DID earn those degrees.

From the wiki page of Newin's "alma mater"


California Miramar University is not accredited by any higher education accreditation agency recognized by the U.S. Department of Education or the Council for Higher Education Accreditation (agencies that recognize the accepted higher education accreditors in the United States). As such, its degrees may not be acceptable to employers or other institutions.

So, there is no comparison whatsoever to the universities Thaksin attended, which are 100% legitimate, accredited and respected.

[cottmann]

...... One cannot just waltz into an American university and buy a degree.

Give enough money to its endowment fund and they'll be pleased to give you a degree - though they will disguise this fact and call it one "honoris causa."

Thaksin's degrees were not honorary, and there is no evidence I can find that either he or his parents made any donations at all to the universities. If you have such information, please post it. Otherwise, please stop grasping at straws and posting trash accusations. If you want to attack Thaksin, there is plenty there to attack. You can start with his war on drugs and the Suvarnabhumi Airport fiasco. He did earn his degrees, though.

[cottmann]

Thaksin's degrees were not honorary, and there is no evidence I can find that either he or his parents made any donations at all to the universities. If you have such information, please post it. Otherwise, please stop grasping at straws and posting trash accusations. If you want to attack Thaksin, there is plenty there to attack. You can start with his war on drugs and the Suvarnabhumi Airport fiasco. He did earn his degrees, though.

If you read all the thread, you would note that I have not suggested that his degrees were neither earned nor valid. I have posed no accusations about Thaksin or his degrees or his parents. Neither have I suggested that either Thaksin or his parents made donations to universities. My responses are to particular comments or part-comments you made (perhaps taken out of context). Why don't you read what is written and respond to those?

With regard to Suvarnabhumi Airport, the land was bought as long ago as 1973 and the New Bangkok International Airport company was formed in 1996. He is not completely to blame for it.

Didn't say that he was. Construction was largely carried out under his administration, however, and it is from the granting of construction and other contracts that most of the accusations against Thaksin and his cronies stem.

Back to education, did you or did you not say that his degrees were "at least as valid and well-earned as Newin Chidchob's"? You did, as that is a direct quote.

Would you care to withdraw that statement now, seeing that Newin's "degree" did not come from an accredited educational institution -- and is therefore not as "valid" as that of Thaksin by any possible measure?

[cottmann]

......Back to education, did you or did you not say that his degrees were "at least as valid and well-earned as Newin Chidchob's"? You did, as that is a direct quote.

Would you care to withdraw that statement now, seeing that Newin's "degree" did not come from an accredited educational institution -- and is therefore not as "valid" as that of Thaksin by any possible measure?

Yes, I did say it, and no, I don't withdraw it, for several reasons. First, it was a dig at Newin's educational qualifications rather than at Thaksin's. Second, it was a dig at Thaksin's administration (and, I suppose, at the Thai Electoral Commission or whatever its equivalent is called) that recognized Newin's degree from PWU as fulfilling the educational requirements for Thai MPs and, by extension, members of the Thaksin ministry. Third, in my answer to your question on Newin's qualifications, I made several points including that fact that in Thailand (where it counts) the degree was and is recognized as valid and well-earned, whatever its status may be elsewhere. Thus, by Thai possible measures, it was as "valid" as that of Thaksin. Your opinion of PWU is irrelevant here.

Clear?

Not really. Newin's degree is not accredited by the United States -- where it is located. The Thai Ministry of Education only recognizes degrees accredited by the country in which they were given. Newin's degrees are not worth the paper they're (presumably) written on. Thaksin's are.

[cottmann]

Not really. Newin's degree is not accredited by the United States -- where it is located. The Thai Ministry of Education only recognizes degrees accredited by the country in which they were given. Newin's degrees are not worth the paper they're (presumably) written on. Thaksin's are.

Then, one last time. You will notice - I hope - that I never mentioned the Ministry of Education. I carefully - and repeatedly - point out that Mr Newin's degree was recognized for the purposes of meeting the educational requirements for a Thai MP - which had nothing to do with the Ministry of Education but only with the Thai Electoral Commission.

In an earlier posting, you used the expression "as 'valid' as that of Thaksin by any possible measure." Therefore, by the measures used by the Thai Electoral Commission, Newin's degree was as valid as that of Thaksin - and that was the only measure that concerned me.

This is my last posting on this issue.

I carefully - and repeatedly - point out that Mr Newin's degree was recognized for the purposes of meeting the educational requirements for a Thai MP - which had nothing to do with the Ministry of Education but only with the Thai Electoral Commission.



This is no requirement by the "Thai Electoral Commission" or any other Thai government body that an MP must have an advanced degree. Where do you get this rubbish?




In an earlier posting, you used the expression "as 'valid' as that of Thaksin by any possible measure." Therefore, by the measures used by the Thai Electoral Commission, Newin's degree was as valid as that of Thaksin - and that was the only measure that concerned me.


Since the TEC does not either validate or invalidate any degree, your "measure" -- as well as your entire argument -- is spurious.




This is my last posting on this issue.



Not surprising, considering everything you have said has now been proven to be utter rubbish.

[cottmann]

I carefully - and repeatedly - point out that Mr Newin's degree was recognized for the purposes of meeting the educational requirements for a Thai MP - which had nothing to do with the Ministry of Education but only with the Thai Electoral Commission.

This is no requirement by the "Thai Electoral Commission" or any other Thai government body that an MP must have an advanced degree. Where do you get this rubbish?


In an earlier posting, you used the expression "as 'valid' as that of Thaksin by any possible measure." Therefore, by the measures used by the Thai Electoral Commission, Newin's degree was as valid as that of Thaksin - and that was the only measure that concerned me.

Since the TEC does not either validate or invalidate any degree, your "measure" -- as well as your entire argument -- is spurious.


This is my last posting on this issue.

Not surprising, considering everything you have said has now been proven to be utter rubbish.


And you, Sir, are a blithering idiot and probably a troll!

I never mentioned a requirement for an advanced degree, nor did I mention validating or invalidating degrees except insofar as the holder meets the education requirements for election to either the Thai House of Representatives or the Thai Senate. That is the job of the TEC.

As for educational requirements, I suggest you read the relevant sections of the 1997 Thai Constitution:

Section 107 []
A person having the following qualifications has the right to be a candidate in an election of members of the House of Representatives:
1) being of Thai nationality by birth;
2) being not less than twenty five years of age on the election day;
3) having graduated with not lower than a Bachelor's degree or its equivalent except for the case of having been a member of the House of Representatives or a senator before;

Section 125 []
A person having the following qualifications has the right to be a candidate in an election of senators:
1) being of Thai nationality by birth;
2) being of not less than forty years of age on the election day;
3) having graduated with not lower than a Bachelor's degree or its equivalent;

This is my last posting on this issue.

Eh?