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Wish you all the best Kevin but if it's no smoking then I won't be there.

[thrillbill]

Wish you all the best Kevin but if it's no smoking then I won't be there.

I'm sure you are in good enough shape that you could sit outside between shows and smoke. Hopefully you do not have to have a cigarette stuck in your stained lips 24/7. Making the bar/club non-smoking is following the new law placed in Thailand. And if you haven't been out of Thailand for awhile, this is the rule in such places as Paris, London, and in some cities in the States.

Wish you all the best Kevin but if it's no smoking then I won't be there.

I'm sure you are in good enough shape that you could sit outside between shows and smoke. Hopefully you do not have to have a cigarette stuck in your stained lips 24/7. Making the bar/club non-smoking is following the new law placed in Thailand. And if you haven't been out of Thailand for awhile, this is the rule in such places as Paris, London, and in some cities in the States.

Kevin knows the bar business and he knows that the BIG spenders: the ones who buy a bottle of Black Label every night and share it with 5 or 6 boys; are the type of punters who also like to smoke and share their 60 Bensons a day with the boys. He will make more money out of one big spender than he will from 20 diet coke drinkers who sit there for nearly an hour nursing the one drink. If there's no smoking then he will be losing a lot of money.
It's good to see in a later post that Kevin has confirmed that there will be smoking and non-smoking areas. Give everyone a choice - not just the anti-smoke lobby.
As for the new non-smoking law ... wait to see how the police enforce it; if at all.

Looking forward to Feb. 1
Sorry to hear that there will be a smoking area. Will this area be enclosed so the smoke does not drift? I hope so. Will you have the area after Feb. 17?
Could you give us an idea as to what the VIP room will be?
Parking...will Day Night allow us to park in their parking area? I think you might fill it up!

All of the sad, stale, smelly arguments were made every where else in the world where smoking has been banned in bars and restaurants...and guess what??? Within a few weeks all the smokers are still going to the bars..whining, crying and standing outside on the street smoking between drinks. Face it guys the days of smokers being able to invade everyone else's airspace in public accommodations with their disgusting little habit is dying more rapidly than the smokers and the people that they kill with their second hand smoke.

Kevin.....put the smokers out of everyone elses air space. The customers will still come and spend money if you have a quality product.

As to the show. Please, please, please a whole new show...and not the same show every night. Last month I went to the 'New Show" at Top Man. Between the smoke in the air and the re-fried old Throb show I could not get out of Top Man fast enough.

[travelerjim]

All of the sad, stale, smelly arguments were made every where else in the world where smoking has been banned in bars and restaurants...and guess what??? Within a few weeks all the smokers are still going to the bars..whining, crying and standing outside on the street smoking between drinks. Face it guys the days of smokers being able to invade everyone else's airspace in public accommodations with their disgusting little habit is dying more rapidly than the smokers and the people that they kill with their second hand smoke.

Kevin.....put the smokers out of everyone elses air space. The customers will still come and spend money if you have a quality product.

As to the show. Please, please, please a whole new show...and not the same show every night. Last month I went to the 'New Show" at Top Man. Between the smoke in the air and the re-fried old Throb show I could not get out of Top Man fast enough.


THANK YOU SOI 10 TOM...

My sentiments exactly...
and you have said it so much better than I.

Absolutely "NO SMOKING"
as the new Thailand law says as of February 11th...
and a NEW SHOW...
will bring the customers time and time again...

Good Luck Kevin & Mark!

TravelerJim

[lonelywombat]

Kevin knows the bar business and he knows that the BIG spenders: the ones who buy a bottle of Black Label every night and share it with 5 or 6 boys; are the type of punters who also like to smoke and share their 60 Bensons a day with the boys. He will make more money out of one big spender than he will from 20 diet coke drinkers who sit there for nearly an hour nursing the one drink. If there's no smoking then he will be losing a lot of money.
It's good to see in a later post that Kevin has confirmed that there will be smoking and non-smoking areas. Give everyone a choice - not just the anti-smoke lobby.
As for the new non-smoking law ... wait to see how the police enforce it; if at all.

It is your type of punter that drives others away. I very much doubt anything you say will occur.

I have watched the way this has developed in my own city from 1 July, and it is the opposite

As with the rest of the world, a smoking area outside or in a seperate area is the norm.

If you dont like it go somewhere else.

kquill has to live with the present and the future. You are not part of either

I am quite happy to take my business elsewhere.
IтАЩm sure that Panorama or Oscars or Bondi or any of the Sunnee Plaza bars that have outside seating will welcome the extra trade and so will the boys who work in those bars.
Free booze and ciggies all night plus a generous tip at the end if there's no off, plus a meal at Pak Boon Loy Fa and maybe a trip to the disco for more free booze and cigs тАж itтАЩs a Thai bar boyтАЩs dream.
If Kevin wants to lose his long-established customers and mates who are mostly heavy smokers and are happy to spend well over 4000 Baht every night of their holiday in his bar then that is up to Kevin. But itтАЩs not up to you.
If Kevin has any sense he will make the VIP room for smokers only тАж it will guarantee him a higher return on his investment in that area.

Let the 60 Baht soda-and-a-twist crowd sit on the hard seats, Kev.

In the starkest terms, Kevin, would you wish cancer on anyone else?

As someone who has suffered at first hand the carcinogenic effects of smoking, I would have thought that a non-smoking bar would be Kevin's first priority and to hell with the selfish polluters who wish to inflict the effects of their disgusting habit on others.

Don't forget Kevin that you will be subjecting yourself to the effects of their smoking much more than others in your new bar (because you will presumably be there for long periods most nights) and that is surely not in your best interests because of the disability you now suffer as a result of your previous throat cancer. You (and we) need the second-hand carcinogenic effects of Coatimundi and others smoking like a hole in the head!

Really what we are talking about when we talk about smoking bans is a health issue.

Really what we are talking about is how Kevin wants to spend his own money.
Does he want to get a decent return on his investment by looking after his big spenders or does he want to cater to a bunch of whining do-gooders who donтАЩt hive a damn about the boys or the business and who only look after themselves.
ItтАЩs KevinтАЩs decision тАж not anyone elseтАЩs.

http://secure.cartsvr.net/product_images/catalog11882/picname1699103.gif

Just do what you know how to do best and everything will fall into place. As a non smoker I am so thankfull the new law will be in place before I arrive. Wonder how many cell phones will be calling in to report the bars that don't follow the new rule?

... and who only look after themselves.

Do you seriously blame us/them for trying to look after our/themselves with selfish addicted morons like you around !?

You can smoke to your heart's content but just because you have absolutely no will-power, don't try to inflict your dangerous habit on those of us who don't smoke or have had the will-power to stop .

[thrillbill]

[quote="Soi 10 Tom"]All of the sad, stale, smelly arguments were made every where else in the world where smoking has been banned in bars and restaurants...and guess what??? Within a few weeks all the smokers are still going to the bars..whining, crying and standing outside on the street smoking between drinks. Face it guys the days of smokers being able to invade everyone else's airspace in public accommodations with their disgusting little habit is dying more rapidly than the smokers and the people that they kill with their second hand smoke.

Kevin.....put the smokers out of everyone elses air space. The customers will still come and spend money if you have a quality product.

I agree with the above statement. And it is pretty sad for us more educated, mature fellows to encourage the young Thai men to be smoking cigarettes. (ok if they smoke me :compress: )

V.I.P. Rooms = Very Imminent Pulmonary diseases. I have no problem with persons wishing to die early from their own choice. I do object strenuously to the side effects of their smoking on others particularly those who have to work in such an environment.

As an ex- very heavy smoker now with severe pulmonary diseases I do appreciate the amount of self deception that can exist among smokers as with any other addiction.

To my mind Kevin's brilliant stroke with Throb/Splash was to join to two bars together and offer multiple shows interspersed with go-go dancing. Most bars have go-go dancing for a long time and then a show for a long time - some well over an hour.

It always struck me that for commercial success a number of small shows interspersed with go-go dancing would be good formulae. Then people can drop in at any time and see a bit of show and the boys.

The other essential is to have a range of attractive boys. The the punters will flow, crawling over broken glass if necessary and smoking, drink prices etc become makeweight. Of course it's not easy to achieve this or maintain it but some bars seem to be able to achieve this for a period if not for ever. I am thinking of the almost ever fabulous Boyz Boyz Boyz, excellent Wild West and on opening Funny Boys 2 - my how the word about a batch of new handsome boys flew around town when that bar opened and it was packed from day 3.

The growth of gay bars and establishments in Pattaya and the whole of Thailand has been astonishing over the last decade. Day and Night PLaza has not been an area of any successes so far. Let's hope this new venture will change that.

I did hear that a problem for Lek's Bar was the boys were getting Sunee Plaza range tips of 500 + baht and many who went there went back quickly to Pattayaland where they get 1000 baht +. I wonder if this can be changed - maybe an inclusive off and tip fee as was done at the high-end Turning Point host bar Bangkok for years - 1500 baht.

Whatever Marsha and Kevin achieve it's proven that they can raise a storm of publicity and interest ( whoever expected to see Topman with over 10 customers? ) Quite honestly, I cannot imagine why anyone would wish to run a show bar in Pattaya but thank goodness that there seems to be a line of people happy to so do.

[bkkguy]

does he want to cater to a bunch of whining do-gooders who donтАЩt hive a damn about the boys or the business and who only look after themselves.


perhaps you could explain how subjecting bar staff and dancers to tobacco smoke at work is a better way of "giving a damn" about them than being happy that they (and we) are in a smoke free environment

and no I don't seriously believe that all the bars are going to close and thus all the staff starve to death if non-smoking laws are enforced!

bkkguy

Some words of encouragement to all those smokers.....

ENCOURAGEMENT #1

South Africa introduced a ban on smoking indoors in public places a few years ago and (surprise, surprise) smokers have managed to survive and live within it.

ENCOURAGEMENT #2

I too was a die hard smoker who flatly refused to frequent any place which would not allow smoking. After many many failed attempts I eventually managed to quit three years ago. I will not attempt to explain to smokers the freedom one experiences when free from the addiction. The pleasure of taking a 12 hour long haul flight without clawing the armrest craving a cigarette for the entire duration. The surprise at being able to quit and, not instantly become an anti-smoking nazi. It goes on and on. Hopefully all you die-hard smokers will find a way to quit one day and in so doing experience these pleasures and surprises. AT LEAST, keep your minds open to the possibility of seeing the light one day!

[jimnbkk]

Some words of encouragement to all those smokers.....


...I too was a die hard smoker who flatly refused to frequent any place which would not allow smoking. After many many failed attempts I eventually managed to quit three years ago. I will not attempt to explain to smokers the freedom one experiences when free from the addiction. The pleasure of taking a 12 hour long haul flight without clawing the armrest craving a cigarette for the entire duration. The surprise at being able to quit and, not instantly become an anti-smoking nazi. It goes on and on. Hopefully all you die-hard smokers will find a way to quit one day and in so doing experience these pleasures and surprises. AT LEAST, keep your minds open to the possibility of seeing the light one day!


I hate to burst your bubble Brett, but you'll never be free of the addiction. You (and I) have managed to free ourselves of the habit, but we'll never be free of the addiction. I've been quit since 9 November (but who's counting) 1983, but, if I had a cigarette today, I'd smoke a pack tomorrow I fear.

I don't like the stink either, and if I spend any time in a place where there are a lot of smokers, the nastiest thing is the smell of my clothes. I have to put them outside to air out before i put them in the wash hamper inside so they don't stink up the whole house.

Sorry to burst YOUR bubble but no, I took the decision a long time ago to get over the addiction and not to crave cigarettes so luckily I do not find being an ex smoker a risky or traumatic experience. Agree about the stink on your clothes but as soon as you tell a smoker that they get very defensive! Is a realization only an ex smoker can get to.

As a non smoker I am so thankfull the new law will be in place before I arrive.
How will the police enforce it ... if at all? It's all down to how the police interpret the law; not how you interpret it from reading the message boards.


Wonder how many cell phones will be calling in to report the bars that don't follow the new rule?
Wonder how much notice anyone in authority will take of your calls?

http://www.allstatesign.com/store/images/products/2309_small.gif

[Nathan B]

Making the bar/club non-smoking is following the new law placed in Thailand.

I agree. And don't forget to strictly enforce the anti-prostitution law as well.

Doh! I didn't mean that. Please make sure you only enforce those laws that I support.

My non-smoking nephew and niece now complain that bars and clubs in the UK smell of stale beer and body odour. They're also frequently left on their own, like Billy No-mates, while all their friends live it up outside. "Never mind, think of your health!" I said, but they glumly replied they'd rather everyone enjoyed themselves.

In my long experience of Thai bars I don't ever recall seeing a customer drop dead from inhaling someone else's cigarette smoke, but given the strength of feeling in this thread I guess it must be an everyday occurrence. Continuing the Health & Safety theme, I would therefore suggest:

1) Bar boys are fully clothed at all times, so as not to catch a chill.
2) Dancing should be forbidden, in case a boy pulls a muscle.
3) Alcohol should remain freely available, and cheap, because it never did anybody any harm.

Save me from these prim, self-righteous anti-smoking bigots. Whatever happened to personal liberty? Freedom and justice for all (except smokers)!

No, I don't smoke, nor have ever smoked.

Responses to this post are not required.

Nathan B, while no responses are required, you make it too easy==most who reply as you do are actually smokers but claim not to be to somehow hope to give your illogical posting some credibility. However, smoker or non-smoker, your post makes little sense and misses several key points that others have brought up here and in the past when this topic has been hashed and rehashed many times.

Your list of "suggestions" implies that non-smokers are somehow worried about you--as if they might be worried that if a bar boy danced, he might pull a calf muscle, you claim. Not at all--as wowpow and others stated very clearly, smoke all you want, kill yourself if you wish, but in doing so, simply do not endanger the health and lives of others. If a barboy is dancing and pulls a muscle or catches a chill, or even the drunk (who if he becomes too obnoxious, will be thrown out of the bar), does not endanger the health/lives of other patrons simply sitting in the bar.

Additionally, why is it a personal liberty, freedom or justice issue?? You, oh, excuse me, I mean anyone, as you are not a smoker I recall, has the personal liberty or freedom to smoke themselves to death, but not the liberty to endanger others. Just as someone might have the personal liberty and freedom to own and drive a car, but the not not the liberty or freedom to drive recklessly and endanger others' lives. In some countries, citizens have the personal liberty and freedom to own guns, but not the liberty to use them to endanger others. Now, there are certainly those that drive recklessly (most certainly in Thailand) and some who will use guns to hurt/kill others, but there laws against those actions and those individuals can be prosecuted and jailed. As to whether in Thailand the poilce will enforce the no-smoking laws, like they rarely do with the reckless driving, remains to be seen, but that is another issue entirely.

And as to justice--where is the justice for those whose health/lives are endangered by another's unsafe addiction?

I had one friend recently who said that he had a plan, he was joking of course, but it will illustrate a point, to go around to the bars and when he saw others smoking (especially those who seemed not to demonstrate the slightest courtesty with their cig's) and spit on them. When they reacted, as of course they would, he wanted to ask them why their nasty habit was ok, but his enjoyment/nasty habit of spitting on smokers was not ok--Nathan B, where is the personal liberty and freedom for my friend. It must be those damn anti-spitting-on smokers bigots at work again, the self-righteous bastards that they are!

Responses welcome.

I think that the one thing that those of you who are thinking of wishing that the police will overlook smoking are overlooking is that the King, who I understand is a smoker, is in public support of the ban. He has made it one of his issues. If you will look at the ban on the public display of cigarettes for sale you will quickly see that the ban is enforced; there is only a sign up that says they are available for sale. The police do enforce the ban on public display of cigarettes for sale. I think that is a good hint as to the way the new smoking ban will be enforced. The King gets what the King wants.

Why are we shooting the buffalo before it causes any problem what so ever.

Let's just wait until the 17th of next month, and knowing Kevin he will deal with this matter, pleasing smokers as well as non-smokers.

Why are we shooting the buffalo before it causes any problem what so ever.

Let's just wait until the 17th of next month, and knowing Kevin he will deal with this matter, pleasing smokers as well as non-smokers.

On the other part of the thread that Jinks split from this, poster talked about fresh ideas, not having things that were too dated. The idea that one must smoke when drinking is to me very dated.

Too many of my friends that spent their youth smoking have paid a terrible price. In our small community here in Pattaya we have lost several in the last few years and grieved for those that have had to battle cancer or lung disease due to smoking. Is our community so not concerned about the future friends that will continue to die or become disabled from smoke and second hand smoke that when we have a chance to ban smoking thru law, we think only of the cash register? I hope not.

If Birdcage needs an explanation of why it bans smoking other than the law. How about pictures of some of our dear friends at the entrance who suffer or died with the caption "In Memory of.....this is a smoke free club"

To those that say, well eating too much and getting fat can kill or disable you, I agree. But the very big difference is that their over weight only disables them. It does not do what second hand smoke does.

Kevin actually has asked for input from his customers. It appears that the majority of posters here are giving good advice based on thier preference as a customer. I use to live in West Hollywood, CA any when the ban on smoking came in their were many people that said it would ruin the bars, no one would go to them, etc. A few months later even then smokers were saying how much better it was..no burning eyes,no smelly clothes,no headaches from the second hand smoke.


As to spending money. I an quite sure one does not have to be a smoker to buy a bottle and have the boys sit with you and drink. During the holidays I really enjoy buying one or two bottles and having the boys sit and drink. If one of the boys starts to smoke I just say no and fan my hand in front of my nose. They laugh and stop smoking and they make sure others that join later don't smoke. The fun doesn't stop.

Now this may seem a little off topic, but one of the recent threads talked about drug use amongst bar boys. Maybe a VIP room that allows YABBA use would appeal to some. I mean....liberty, freedom....and it does not endanger the health of the non drug user sitiing next to you. The boys (according to the recent posts) would love it and just think of the money that could be made since it would be one of the few bars with a separate area for this.

[zinzone]

Surely the answer is to make it no smoking inside the bar but have tables and chairs outside where those who want to can smoke.
Most bars around town have such an area immediately outside the bar so that area can be used for smoking.
Those who are gasping for a ciggie can simply leave where they are sitting inside for a few minutes and go outside for their smoke.

These days it is not only the height of selfishness to smoke in a bar, but it endangers other customers and staff too.
Having a designated "non smoking area" inside the bar is unlikely to help as the air cons etc will simply circulate the smoke to the no smoking area's.

What problem?....... There is no problem:-

RainWalker99 says:- Really what we are talking about when we talk about smoking bans is a health issue. Do smokers have the right to kill those who don't smoke? In the starkest terms, Kevin, would you wish cancer on anyone else? EndтАж..

Friends who seem to know the Intimate details of , Rainwalker99 I have met via writing on this forum, who know him from Vancouver, tell me he well knows, that in the Dufferin Hotel Vancouver, a gay bar now very watered down, but they have a тАЬStripper Guy AreaтАЭ with prices slightly higher, but more Importantly for this thread they also have a special Glass тАЬVIP RoomтАЭ for smokers, who can look out at all the action around the bar, and have had it there for years.

Also if you walk from your Plane at Bangkok Airport you will see a very nice Smokers room, because Smokers love to take in as much smoke as they can, why does Kevin not make a stage for shows and behind the stage is a glass VIP Room, so the smokers can not only breath in all those smoking in there exhaust fumes, but also get VIP viewing of the show, he can even put a cigarette machine in there and the use of a smoking jacket, as they use to after dinner in the 30s, smokers go to the smoking room, its all nothing new, then everyone will be happy and non smokers can look at smokers with total contentment on there faces.

www.dufferinhotel.com (http://www.dufferinhotel.com)

'Smoking kills. If you're killed, you've lost a very
important part of your life.'
-- Brooke Shields, during an interview to become
spokesperson for federal anti-smoking campaign .

http://whyquit.com/whyquit/BryanLeeCurtis.html

... Kevin actually has asked for input from his customers. It appears that the majority of posters here are giving good advice based on thier preference as a customer.

Those board members who smoke havn't had time to post yet --- they are too busy; enjoying themselves with their mates and the boys:
"Another Bottle of Black Label please, Barman" "Nip out to the 7/11 and buy me and the lads some Marlboro, Oh and get one for yourself" "Come over and join us for a drink" "Which one of you six lads is coming home with me tonight" "Here's a few hundred each for those boys who are going home alone" "Who's coming to the disco with us" "Anyone want someting to eat?" "Have another drink, lad. Help yourselves"

The non-smokers are on their own in the Net shop or home alone tapping away at the keyboard with a nice cuppa on the side table.

People come to Thailand to have a good time. Enjoy themselves with their mates. Have a drink and a laugh with the boys. And the boys like to smoke, eat and drink all at the same time. Go to any club in Pattaya and the biggest group of boys are all smoking and drinking and laughing with the big spending customers.

The one's that Kevin really has to watch out for are the penny-pinching non-smokers who nurse one soda for two hours and then arrange to meet a boy after the bar closes.

When bar owners see that they are losing money and their big spenders because of the smoking ban things will change. Bars will close down for lack of profit or the owners will make arrangements with the enforcers to have their places ignored.
This smoking law will be enforced with the same dedication as the seat belt and crash helmet laws

http://www.speedysigns.com/images/osha/small/NOTICE06.gif

Coatimundi............If what you posted is true, how do you seem to have so much time to post?

[lonelywombat]

[quote="coatimundi"].
"Another Bottle of Black Label please, Barman" "Nip out to the 7/11 and buy me and the lads some Marlboro, Oh and get one for yourself" "Come over and join us for a drink" "Which one of you six lads is coming home with me tonight" "Here's a few hundred each for those boys who are going home alone" "Who's coming to the disco with us" "Anyone want someting to eat?" "Have another drink, lad. Help yourselves"


At a guess this night would cost 10,000 to 15,000 baht Do you spend that every night you are in LOS
.

People come to Thailand to have a good time. Enjoy themselves with their mates. Have a drink and a laugh with the boys. And the boys like to smoke, eat and drink all at the same time. Go to any club in Pattaya and the biggest group of boys are all smoking and drinking and laughing with the big spending customers.

This smoking law will be enforced with the same dedication as the seat belt and crash helmet laws

Looks like you have a great understanding of the law. Are you related to Billy

[Brad the Impala]

Surely smokers should not be allowed out in public at all. Preferably they should be shipped to concentration camps or the colonies, whichever is worse, probably the colonies.

signed

Outraged of Tunbridge Wells

[thrillbill]

--- Why should this new bar (or any other) have to wait to see if they have to follow the new law which bans smoking in bars? Why not set the trend and just have NO SMOKING - period. It sounds to me that the majority of the viewers here don't want to inhale smoke... Surely having a no smoking rule in a bar is not new to most Westerners. When I was in LA last summer, my buddy who IS a smoker also enjoyed not walking out of the bar smelling like cigarette smoke. When he wanted to smoke, he went outside for a few minutes and chit chatted with other smokers - a great "bonding" opportunity-lol. Also, I don't think smokers spend more $$$ on the "boys" anymore (or less) than a nonsmoker with drinks and all -duh.

Ok, if a smoker decides to light up a ciggie and pollute my air that I'm breathing, I have the right to FART in his face. :colors:

[Lunchtime O'Booze]

have some table and chairs for those who wish to sit outside and have a puff.

and some tables inside for those who would like to have a poof.

[andrewcraig]

.
"Another Bottle of Black Label please, Barman" "Nip out to the 7/11 and buy me and the lads some Marlboro, Oh and get one for yourself" "Come over and join us for a drink" "Which one of you six lads is coming home with me tonight" "Here's a few hundred each for those boys who are going home alone" "Who's coming to the disco with us" "Anyone want someting to eat?" "Have another drink, lad. Help yourselves"


At a guess this night would cost 10,000 to 15,000 baht Do you spend that every night you are in LOS
.

People come to Thailand to have a good time. Enjoy themselves with their mates. Have a drink and a laugh with the boys. And the boys like to smoke, eat and drink all at the same time. Go to any club in Pattaya and the biggest group of boys are all smoking and drinking and laughing with the big spending customers.

This smoking law will be enforced with the same dedication as the seat belt and crash helmet laws

Looks like you have a great understanding of the law. Are you related to Billy

This idiot cannot afford to pay almost 500,000 baht per month on entertainment plus his hotel meals and airfare Why are we taking notice of him Is he living in LOS as an expat or just a once in a lifetime visitor

he is a troll, troll, troll and in case you did not get my message he is a troll

[zinzone]

Haha....good post Doris!



In otherwords can have a "fag" inside and outside.......

[jinks]

Preferably they should be shipped to concentration camps or the colonies, whichever is worse, probably the colonies.

signed

Outraged of Tunbridge Wells

They {and I} should TRANSPORTED there are still plenty of open spaces in Oz.

I hate to burst your bubble Brett, but you'll never be free of the addiction. You (and I) have managed to free ourselves of the habit, but we'll never be free of the addiction. I've been quit since 9 November (but who's counting) 1983, but, if I had a cigarette today, I'd smoke a pack tomorrow I fear.

That may be true for some. However, others (and I am one) now find that the need to light up again has permanently gone - even the thought of doing so now makes me feel sick.
I gave up about four years ago but was tempted by friends at a wedding reception last year to have a cigarette 'to be sociable'. I lit up and took a few drags which resulted in my coughing and retching uncontrollably. The experience was so nauseating that I have absolutely no desire or craving to repeat it. Ergo, I am free of the addiction.

At a guess this night would cost 10,000 to 15,000 baht Do you spend that every night you are in LOS
Never really think about the cost ... I don't need to :cheers:


This idiot cannot afford to pay almost 500,000 baht per month on entertainment plus his hotel meals and airfare Why are we taking notice of him Is he living in LOS as an expat or just a once in a lifetime visitor
he is a troll, troll, troll and in case you did not get my message he is a troll

Oh yes I can afford it Mr.Green ... but you're right about the hotel bills - I usually stay in my own house :cheers:

I can afford to do so because I work hard and make the income. I will spend it where and how and on what or who I like. And if Kevin or any of the other bar owners want a piece of the pie then they allow smoking or I will take my money and my partying elsewhere.
There are lots of successful businessmen who come to Pattaya to blow a few thousand pounds from time to time. Kev knows that and so do his competitors.

http://www.smokefreesignshop.co.uk/acatalog/Stainless_st_circle-1.gif

i guess this is just the selfish face of capitalism ......... sigh

i (as a smoker) cannot believe how some smokers clearly dont give a damn about the wellbeing of fellow human beings

this is the 21st century and scientific evidence clearly shows the dangers of passive smoking (hence the legislation in so many countries DESPITE the massive attempt at the extremely lucrative/influential tobacco industry to stop it)

- but as long as "I" am having a good time fuck the rest of you, seems to be the sad/selfish attitude of some posters here

[jimnbkk]

is what I was taught, and as long as I believe that as a fact, I cannot smoke even one cigarette ever, then I'm ok. I hate the smell and cannot really imagine taking up the habit again. But, I'll concede that others maybe are not like me, and really were not addicted.

I remember when California enacted their very strict laws prohibiting smoking in bars and restaurants. The doom, gloom and threats to boycott these places by implacable smokers went on for about a week after the law went into effect. Then everybody, even the (evil) smokers realized how much more pleasant the places were, and life went on.

So, let's listen to the smokers (coatimundi, are you listening?) rant and rave for a few more weeks. They'll get over it, or the few that cannot get over it will go elsewhere. Not a big loss.

Kevin, I vote for starting out as a non smoking bar. And, I like the idea of photos of those dearly departed alongside the no smoking sign. (Just make sure the boys know what kind of smoking we're talking about!!)

[Aunty]

Well given that Kevin has already had a smoking related cancer, he would do well to avoid ALL cigarette smoke in the future, as he will remain, for the rest of his life, at high risk of developing another!

Smoking rates are far too high throughout Asia anyway and Thailand is no exception. A bit of social engineering won't go amiss, and Kevin can help get the ball rolling and set an example by voluntarily observing the new law. It's the right thing to do, a concept no doubt foreign to many around here.

[Wesley]

I hate the smoke but love the good time, I go to party and the smoke is part of it. if it bothers me enough I will smoke one myself then I don't notice the smell until I have to wash all my clothes again the next day. Let them have at it IMHO.

Wes

[paulg]

At a guess this night would cost 10,000 to 15,000 baht Do you spend that every night you are in LOS
Never really think about the cost ... I don't need to :cheers:


T
he is a troll, troll, troll and in case you did not get my message he is a troll

Oh yes I can afford it Mr.Green ... but you're right about the hotel bills - I usually stay in my own house :cheers:

I can afford to do so because I work hard and make the income. I will spend it where and how and on what or who I like. And if Kevin or any of the other bar owners want a piece of the pie then they allow smoking or I will take my money and my partying elsewhere.
There are lots of successful businessmen who come to Pattaya to blow a few thousand pounds from time to time. Kev knows that and so do his competitors.



Even a conservative figure of 15,000 baht per night , with the pound buying 65,000 baht it would be several 1000 pounds per week minimum. Why dont you buy your own bar or rent a small bar for your private party.
different bar every night
If a bar is closed for a private function then you might get away with it
Throw your money around instead of bragging about it.

Gents,

We will be studying what the law and exactly and see if it can be worked to enclose a smoking area, with extraction, large enough for people to enjoy and feel part of the club atmosphere, possibly as I have seen elsewhere with windows. I will check if this is allowed.

It would need to be enclosed from the rest of the club.

Incidentally, I was in the Birdcage Manchester with my friend and ex business partner who owns and operates the Birdcage Leeds ans Manchester and he has not seen a significant decline in trade by the non smoking rule.

He has made areas, outside with seating and protection from the elements for smokers.

One poster pointed out that the rule would not be enforced, I fear you are wrong, when there are fines to be had, there are people to enforce the law and their pockets!

One poster pointed out that the rule would not be enforced, I fear you are wrong, when there are fines to be had, there are people to enforce the law and their pockets!

My sentiments exactly Kevin. We must all prepare ourselves for visits from the "smoke police" as I stated in the new smoking law thread and as I said there, I believe this law will be enforced from day one with the rewards to be gained from those choosing to ignore the new law.

Good to hear you are trying to accommodate those among us that do smoke and I am sure if it is possible, you will have areas available for smokers where they will not interfere with those who do not smoke.

Choc Dee Kevin, I am looking forward to your opening night.


George.

Why do I see the comparison being made between London, Paris, California, Vancouver, we are talking about Thailand!
Where there are laws enforced for clean air it is not so hard to accept. Here in Thailand where buses, baht taxi's, motorcycles are allowed to spew out black smoke and no one gives a shit. Why choose to pick on the entertainment industry again, soon they will tell us drinking is not allowed after 9:00PM and bars closed at 10:00PM. Why do we fight against the straight community for gay rights then fight amongst ourselves over something as silly as smoking?
Health issues! Right ! We go to the bars and take off guys with STD's, probably some with AIDS, then say we are looking healthy environment to drink in! That logic doesn't work for me !
By the way i am a non smoker, we all fight for our rights's, but today smoking, tomorrow drinking, closing times, who says big brother isn't taking care of us.
I think it should be left up to the establishments who choose to make there establishments, smoking or non. Guess what guys, if it was such a concern before, why was there no non smoking bars?

Chok Dee

[lonelywombat]

Where there are laws enforced for clean air it is not so hard to accept. Here in Thailand where buses, baht taxi's, motorcycles are allowed to spew out black smoke and no one gives a shit. Why choose to pick on the entertainment industry again, soon they will tell us drinking is not allowed after 9:00PM and bars closed at 10:00PM.
Chok Dee

it is extremely hard to make a living fining Thais riding motorcycles[5 or 10 baht. oh really]

It is much easier to target clubs and bars for non complying. 10,000 20,000 maybe more every night

If the BIB thought they could get baht for drinking after 9pm then they will try.

Smoking in bars will be the retirement fund for many BIB

Have you ever been to LOS

[dave_tf-old]

All I can add is that if there is an area for tables outside for smokers, then it should be for smokers only, not indignant Fanning Freddies fearful of the least molecule of burnt tobacco reaching them.

[thaiworthy-old]

Why do I see the comparison being made between London, Paris, California, Vancouver, we are talking about Thailand!
Where there are laws enforced for clean air it is not so hard to accept. Here in Thailand where buses, baht taxi's, motorcycles are allowed to spew out black smoke and no one gives a shit. Why choose to pick on the entertainment industry again, soon they will tell us drinking is not allowed after 9:00PM and bars closed at 10:00PM. Why do we fight against the straight community for gay rights then fight amongst ourselves over something as silly as smoking?
Health issues! Right ! We go to the bars and take off guys with STD's, probably some with AIDS, then say we are looking healthy environment to drink in! That logic doesn't work for me !
By the way i am a non smoker, we all fight for our rights's, but today smoking, tomorrow drinking, closing times, who says big brother isn't taking care of us.
I think it should be left up to the establishments who choose to make there establishments, smoking or non. Guess what guys, if it was such a concern before, why was there no non smoking bars?

Chok Dee

This is the silliest and most convoluted post I have ever read. What in the Sam Hill are you trying to say?

Why would anyone restrict drinking beverages after 9 p.m? What would be the reason for it? What is the basis for your statement? We are talking about smoking in a bar. What has that got to do with anything? You talk about exhaust fumes, saying no one gives a shit, not that it's relevant (unless we start seeing baht buses drive thru bars.) Where did you come up with that one?! Regardless, a lot of people actually do give a shit. And not everyone takes off guys with STDs or AIDS, it is a mathematical improbability. But yet we are ALL breathing air in smoke filled bars, so the logic of this comparison escapes me. But the biggest stretch of all is how "fighting" for gay rights makes us look silly when "fighting" about smoking. Again, what does gay rights have to do with smoking?

Are you really "HappyHere" in Thailand? From the sound of it, I think you'd be much happier someplace else!

Why do I see the comparison being made between London, Paris, California, Vancouver, we are talking about Thailand!
................ We go to the bars and take off guys with STD's, probably some with AIDS, then say we are looking healthy environment to drink in! That logic doesn't work for me !
Chok Dee

then shall we compare with the following countries with similar legislation in place banning smoking in enclosed public places:

CUBA, BANGLADESH, TANZANIA, BHUTAN...........etc

I really don't want to get into a slagging match, but it has nothing to do with geographical location or socio-economic development, rather the bottom line is anyone who does not see the link between second-hand tobacco smoke and health risks is suffering from ostrich-syndrome.

Also, agreeing with Thaiworthy and failing to understand your logic, I do think it highly unlikely ANY guy with AIDS would be on any position to work in a bar - unless of course you meant HIV)

"Why would anyone restrict drinking beverages after 9 p.m? What would be the reason for it? What is the basis for your statement?"

I still remember when DJ closed 1 am.

"probably some with AIDS"

I am a smoker but can not see anything comparing. Like apples and pineapples or beef

"Here in Thailand where buses, baht taxi's, motorcycles are allowed to spew out black smoke and no one gives a shit."

On this one you are correct. I have been walking in the streets of Bangkok wearing a white shirt. After 2 hours in open air it had become grey. After one night in bars it was still white. What kills most, the pollution from the cars or passive smoking in a bar?
As a smoker I can also feel not comfy. if someone is just smoking into my face or the room is filled with smoke. But still gents keep the proportions.

All I can add is that if there is an area for tables outside for smokers, then it should be for smokers only, not indignant Fanning Freddies fearful of the least molecule of burnt tobacco reaching them.

It might be that the outside tables is where the most fun is going on. Let us be creative. It is like at my friends home, where it is only acceptet to smoke in the kichen with the window open, well he is still liberal ;-), always when he have a party, all the guys move to the place where we are only or two smkers

it gets in my eyes. i say outside is the best place for this cancerous habit!

[lonelywombat]

It might be that the outside tables is where the most fun is going on. Let us be creative. It is like at my friends home, where it is only acceptet to smoke in the kichen with the window open, well he is still liberal ;-), always when he have a party, all the guys move to the place where we are only or two smkers

Oz was another country that went to non smoking in bars on 1 July. One of the local definitions is that an area that is 75% enclosed is deemed to be indoors. Several bars created smokers rooms but that lasted only a few weeks. I have had the problem for over 7 years with dining and am used to it. The new 75% definition IS A PAIN IN THE A#*#*

But for a show bar, with a separate viewing area for smokers, a patio or courtyard with a retractable roof for when it rains has been a popular option. Also rooftop areas for patrons who dont want to smoke on the street but take their drink with them. Smokers areas that have CCTV as an option in addition to a glassed in viewing area but open to the sky, has been the local solution.

Hope this is of help.

hansiThe2 comment does not apply to show bars. Very few apart from expats,go to bars to chat and party. This situation is exactly the opposite to a party at your friends home

[zinzone]

Well if you have an enclosed area inside the premises for smokers then you might as well rename this new bar,see my heading.

What is so difficult?

Smoking is a vile habit and is soon to be made unlawful in enclosed public spaces in Thailand.

If people choose to kill themselves let them, but do it away from the rest of us.

Remember the saying if "you try to please everyone you please no one".

Well if you have an enclosed area inside the premises for smokers then you might as well rename this new bar,see my heading.

Talking about naming enclosed smoking areas, I well remember traveling with an acquaintance through Don Muang a couple of years ago. He suddenly announced that he was off the the 'leper colony'. I didn't get it at first until he disappeared into one of the 'Smoking cubicles' for his final fix before boarding the plane !

Hi Kevin.

since when you rent something for business? Or you bought the Day Night Hotel or is that just charity?

:thin: :thin: :thin:


God is dead. God remains dead. And we have killed him. How shall we comfort ourselves, the murderers of all murderers?

тАУ Nietzsche, The Gay Science,

Hi Kevin.

since when you rent something for business? Or you bought the Day Night Hotel or is that just charity?


Charity Uncle,

Just like you! you generous soul.

you're not worried about me, I cater for a different market!

:thin: :thin: :thin:


God is dead. God remains dead. And we have killed him. How shall we comfort ourselves, the murderers of all murderers?

тАУ Nietzsche, The Gay Science,

I didn't know that Nietsche or God were gay.

I didn't know that Nietsche or God were gay.
ThereтАЩs an idea for OscarтАЩs quiz night:
Which of these famous philosophers liked it up the Gary? :pottytrain2: :dontknow:

This is a message to all smokers (from a smoker):
Let's shake the world and bring the world economy to an halt. For weeks the World economy is going up and down, billions of dollars have been pumped in so called "economical repairs". Don't waist anymore money and let's take away this unbearable waiting for the big global economical ressession:

STOP SMOKING:
and show the world the importance of US being here.
Show the World that it is not US who are killing all these people with our so called 2nd hand smoke.
Show the World that there is no life possible without smokers.
Show the World how expensive life will become if there is no income from tobacco anymore.
JUST STOP.
:flower:

If your in a bar that permits smoking after the law takes affect then simply walk outside pull out the cell phone and report them. After paying a couple fines they will comply.

Hi Kevin.

since when you rent something for business? Or you bought the Day Night Hotel or is that just charity?


Charity Uncle,

Just like you! you generous soul.


The Question is, who is the Charity Uncle. I never made charity, because I don't like it. I leave it to you, because I am generous!!! Also I am not worried, because there is nothing to worry. I die 1000 times already, but Heaven and Hell don't want me. May be Pattaya is that between them! :blackknight:

you're not worried about me, I cater for a different market!

:thin: :thin: :thin:


God is dead. God remains dead. And we have killed him. How shall we comfort ourselves, the murderers of all murderers?

тАУ Nietzsche, The Gay Science,

Hi Kevin.

since when you rent something for business? Or you bought the Day Night Hotel or is that just charity?


Charity Uncle,

Just like you! you generous soul.


The Question is, who is the Charity Uncle. I never made charity, because I don't like it. I leave it to you, because I am generous!!! Also I am not worried, because there is nothing to worry. I die 1000 times already, but Heaven and Hell don't want me. May be Pattaya is that between them! :blackknight:

you're not worried about me, I cater for a different market!

:thin: :thin: :thin:


God is dead. God remains dead. And we have killed him. How shall we comfort ourselves, the murderers of all murderers?

тАУ Nietzsche, The Gay Science,


Ho HO ....the loony is back!