Where would you buy in Pattaya/Jomtien?

[colmx]

Hi All
Have just returned from another short (but enjoyable!) trip to LOS and laos.

After lugging that suitcase of mine around once again - I have decided that i would like to buy a small Condo in pattaya/Jomtien to use as a base when I'm in Thailand.

I'm 34, so don't intend to retire for a long time yet, this condo would simply be a home away from home an would hopefully be rented out from may-November and kept for my own/family/friends use from Dec-April.

The condo is not intended as an investment - but neither is it considered as throw away money!

My budget is around 3M Baht and the key factors I am looking for are:
- Foreign ownership
- On a baht bus route
- Close to beach or South Pattaya
- Not too far south in Jomtien (ie. would rather Dongtan area)
I'm not a beach person at all, but the sea breeze would be nice

I have condidered the following developments,woudl be interested in hearing other peoples opinions:

Centre Condo:
Stayed here for a month around 5 years ago, building was a little tired back then - especially in relation to the lifts, has it improved or got worse since then?
Has the closing of Hollywood made it less noisy around there?
What about noise from the school/Wat?

City Garden:
(Near welcome plaza on Soi Toyota Karaoke)Looks impressive but won't be finished for 2 years, also seems over priced with units starting and 4M Baht

Yensabai Condo:
I have heard bad things about the owners of the building itself... Still true?
Also not sure if i want family/visitors staying so close to Sunnee!

View Talay 5:
Any comments?
Better than VT 1 and 2?
I see unfinished condos for sale at 2M and finished at 3M, is the hassle of (tastefully) decorating a condo worth 1M
Is it beter to have a condo on the Jomtien or Pattaya side?
(Jomtien = south facing so gets all the sun - not sure if this is a good or bad thing!)
Also i notice there is a building C and D... Anyone know if there are plans for building A and B that would effectively block out the views from the C+D buildings?

View Talay 3:
Not sure if i want to live on pratumnak
As above not sure which side of the building is best

View Talay 1+2:
Wht is the upkeep of these buildings like?
I think the apts look much smaller than those avilable in VT5 and 3?
Too far from beach and have to cross Theppaya rd?

Royal Hill condo:
These look really nice from the outside.
Has anyone bought here?
Much Noise from traffic?
Too far from beach and have to cross Theppaya rd?
Any comments?

Anybody any other places that they recommend that i take into consideration?

I cannot be of any direct help, as I have never lived in a condo and only live near as opposed to actually in Pattaya, but I would strongly advise you to rent before buying, particularly given the present reasonable costs of renting.

As Marsilius pointed out elsewhere, as a result of money laundering a lot of houses and condos are empty but that does not necessarily mean that their owners are desperate for buyers. At the same time there are a lot of properties on the market and very few buyers (so the experienced owner of one of Pattaya's oldest real estate firms told me recently), so there are definitely some bargains to be had - and possibly a lot more to come.

Property prices around me, in what the estate agents euphemistically call "East Pattaya", are now back to the same level they were 4 years ago or more. A plot of land of five and a half rai, with road access and electricity, was recently sold for 3 million baht after being advertised at 7 million for 4 years; a large house around the corner, on around two rai, is now for sale at 10 million, down from 16 million 4 years ago. While some real estate agents will swear to you that property values are going up or, at worst, remaining steady, what they are actually talking about is prices; as far as valuation is concerned, the sales price is irrelevant as it is determined only by the purchase price.

My apologies if this is not strictly relevant to you, but it does have some bearing on where / what / when to buy in Pattaya/Jomtien.

I saw a sign of a new condo building where the units were starting at 1.5 million in South Pattaya.

Also concerning Center Condo...I was there a few weeks ago and it seemed to be much better cared for and the elevators seemed to fixed and working well. I still believe that center condo has a great location. Since Hollywood has been closed for a long time, it seems quite. Doesn't Botting have a web site? Maybe someone will post the site address.

[Irish1972]

Have you looked at Chateau Dale, on the Bus route into town, convenient to Jomtien Complex and the beach. I stay there in a friends condo each time I go and for me it is perfect. Have no real experience of anywhere else to compare it too, but I know a fair few Irish guys with places there.

[colmx]

hi Irish1972
I fogot to add Cgateau dale to my list above
It is also one of teh ones that i was considering...

I'm interested in hearing what other people think of the price of the Chateau Dale condoes versus location of View Talay 5...

Unlike in Europe, having the sun shining into your home is unwelcome in the tropics. Not only does it get too hot, it can bleach away the colours from your sofa, etc. I suggest you look for an apartment that faces East (if you're the type that wakes up early and likes bright mornings) or North, if you don't want to be woken up with too much light, too early.

Apartments facing West in Pattaya/Jomtien, while possibly having seaviews, also face a hot, glaring, afternoon sun.

Your point about breezes is right on. Having a good air flow is very important in the tropics, especially on humid days. You save a lot on air-conditioning if the apartment has a steady breeze. Thais generally don't like airconditioning, so your partner may prefer this.

... as close to Bangkok as possible

[puckered_penguin]

On a low floor or a condo without a balcony.

[dab69]

... as close to Bangkok as possible

good enough reason to stay in Pattaya

As with real estate any where in the the world it's location, location, location. The best location is near the baht bus run between Pattaya and Jomtien.

Secondarly it is the building itself. I would avoid all of the View Talay buildings. They are basically Russian tenament buildings using on plan, and even the newer ones are just "pigs with lipstick", also, the newer ones are almost completely empty and unfinished. Not a good investment unless you can get one for almost nothing.

Center Condo is old and not properly maintained, and the Wat next door is talking about building a ten story parking structure

I think the suggestion of Chateau Dale is the best. Chateau Dale has it all location, investment potential and living environment: buy there.

Center condo - NEVER. Unless your a sex-a-holic the same for YenSabi. Of course, some people won't mind living in an ant hill. They are noisy, the wait for lifts is aggrevating and the traffic sounds are terrible.
Nothing wrong with V.Talay one and two. They attract renters, but probably not too many in the months you want to rent it out. Its hot and crappy in Thailand during March to October.
Renting would be much better for you I think. Maybe. The few things you need when your here, you can buy. No need to drag things from home.
And the best advice is rent first if you intend to buy.

[Lunchtime O'Booze]

go to Pattaya Properties-they will look after you.

I think you just need to figure out what YOU want, and find it. Does it need to be close to Sunee or boyztown? Close to the beach? Easy to shop? What?
Airy, air conditioned? Big? Small? Views? Garden? Pool? Gym? Bars? Housekeeping?

I think renting in places you think you might buy is a good idea. The market seems to be in your favour at the moment.

DELETED

very useful thread. I will be buying soon and need all the advice i can get.

[lonelywombat]

I own a condo in Pattaya that is rented 6 months of the year

With the exchange rate going through the floor, I would say forget buying until you have the advantage on exchange.

Your turn will come and your monetary unit will buy more [say 25% even more] than now.

Rent for a year even two and do not be impatient

[colmx]

Mr G, visit my website (http://www.thailand-property-guide.com) and do a search for studio condos in Jomtien, and then the same for Pattaya at 2 - 3 million Baht.


Hi John
Have already been looking at your website... Problem is there is too much choice!

That is why I'm trying to narrow down my options!
Unfortunately it looks like Chateau Dale may be out of my price range....

I'm still interested in hearing any opinions on Royal Hill Condotel...
It has always caught my eye since the day they started building it
(for those unfamiliar its the 6-7 story building over car park, just after sugar hut and before Chateau Dale on the road from Pattaya to Jomtien)
Anyone but or vist there? Anybody any comments?

Oggie:
Maybe we should goi halves together... seeing as our holidays never seem to overlap! Just as long as we change the bed after each of your visits :albino:

[colmx]

Hi Wombat - I'm in the Eurozone - so it seems that now is one of teh bast times for me to spend Euro on Baht?

Thanks to everyone for your inputs so far!
Just wondering what people thought of Jomtien Plaza Condotel?

Also nobody seems to comment at all on VT5, is that because its so bad or so good?
I believe the blocks there are smaller thant VT1 or 2 - so i guess they are less "russian" looking?

I'm also very keen to get anyones comments on Hyde Park residence on Pratumnak and the Royal Hill Condotel on Thrappaya road...

I have seen some bargain properties online, but unfort they will be gone by the time I get back in April!

Anyone care to comment on how long it takes to "close" a sale once I find my dream place?
Or if anyone else has a place to add to teh list would be glad to hear!
Thanks in Advance

The best one you mentioned was Royal Hill Condo, they look fabulous, I had a look at those whilst I was recently there. However, your budget of 3 million bht not sure if you can get something with that, I noticed that the ones on the internet are rather large and therefore pricey, I'm not sure if there are cheaper ones available, more in line equal to a 2 bed apartment back in the UK.

I would steer away from View Talay, as someone said on here, they are a Council block waiting to happen.

There are a few being built in the Pratumak area, but they seem to me to be "on the hill" and I don't see any baht buses going around there. Although on my way to Pratumak I did notice a place called Tara Court, that looked good.

Oggie:
Maybe we should goi halves together... seeing as our holidays never seem to overlap! Just as long as we change the bed after each of your visits :albino:

Lol. I thought timeshares had died out.

The property market is I think at its lowest ebb .One company has just reduced their houses as they have not sold any for ages by a third.
The strong bart the low pound and the political situation has really depressed the market here.
REALLY important you get a Shanot in YOUR OWN name .As the Thai Law only lets a certain percantage of Falang own here.Seek legal advice DO NOT TRUST any of the agents they are just like second hand car salesmen.
I would buy somewhere which is established not noisy and there is no land left to build around it.If you buy near empty land you could get your view blocked or a road built outside.
Wait for the pound to get stronger before you buy.If you have not been coming to Pattaya for long rent and bide your time.Do not be taken in by the agents!!!

DELETED

The property market is I think at its lowest ebb .One company has just reduced their houses as they have not sold any for ages by a third.
The strong bart the low pound and the political situation has really depressed the market here.
REALLY important you get a Shanot in YOUR OWN name .As the Thai Law only lets a certain percantage of Falang own here.Seek legal advice DO NOT TRUST any of the agents they are just like second hand car salesmen.
I would buy somewhere which is established not noisy and there is no land left to build around it.If you buy near empty land you could get your view blocked or a road built outside.
Wait for the pound to get stronger before you buy.If you have not been coming to Pattaya for long rent and bide your time.Do not be taken in by the agents!!!

Which company was that, can you send me details via private message.

Always, always, always use a good, competent, INDEPENDENT Thai lawyer with any real estate transaction in Thailand. DO NOT use the lawyer recommended by any real estate agency. This should be obvious but too many forget that a real estate agency's job is to sell sell sell for the owner, not to take care of the buyer. That is not to say that all real estate agents are crooks, but to make sure that you, the buyer's, interest is protected.

Also, make absolutely certain that you understand everything about where to you are buying and the implication of its location, even if it is a great house at a cheap price. I can not even begin to tell you how many guys are living far away in "East Pattaya" still trying to figure out how to get to town and home again after a night out, and hoping that a thief has not broken in while they were away. A fool and their money are soon parted.

Just a few thoughts:

View Talay 5 is probably the most convenient of the lot, with its proximity to beach, pubs, market etc. Building C is finally becoming more quiet, as most of the flats have now been decorated -- if you move into building D be prepared for 2 years of building noise. The pool side restaurant has reasonable (if not particularly healthy) food at good prices and both English newspapers, and the staff are pleasant and cheerful. There is another cafe inside which has alternative fare (more salads, sandwiches), even cheaper, and a third, Mini Bar, which has tired old bar girls from the 1970's, serves weak gin and tonics and food that smells like sewage (happily most customers only go for drinks, so one need not suffer the odours often). The reception staff are as helpful as they are required to be, security staff will radio for a motorbike taxi for you, and technical staff are so stupid that one feels the urge to water them twice a week.

View Talay 3 is in a quieter location, and is a quieter building altogether. There are fewer rooms for hire to tourists, so common areas are less crowded, and no constant parade of people with suitcases. The standard unit, like VT5, is 48 square metres, however more of this is dedicated to balcony in VT3. Balconies at both 5 and 3 can comfortably seat 8 people, however 3 is just a little bit wider. The poolside restaurant staff are miserable, the food is miserable, and they charge twice as much for it. There are no other restaurants to date.

Which side of the building:

In VT5 and VT3, Jomtien side is coolest most of the year, with the balcony in shade from late morning onwards. In the 'winter' season (now), the balcony will be shaded after around 2 pm. So if you want to have drinks on the balcony in the early evening, choose Jomtien side, however you will not see the sunset. Pattaya side is HOT in the afternoon and evening, but you can watch the sun set, and at last from VT5, there are often good city views.

The Jomtien side of both buildings will have noisy neighbours for some time to come. VT5 has VT7 next door, as well as a new hotel that is supposed to be built (anyone have information on this?). Not sure what is going next to VT3, but perhaps someone else might?

In VT5, if you buy a low floor unit, do not choose Pattaya side. The generators are noisy, as are the barbarians who come to work every day renovating flats. You would also need to hear the constant coming and going of motorbikes. The staff sometimes forget to close the garbage shed, thoroughly unpleasant, especially if combined with the food smells from Mini Bar.


What to watch out for:

Check all sinks and showers -- water pressure can be a problem. It is usually a matter of getting one of the odious technicians to come and fix it, and they will need to come back 4 to 12 times, in order to find that the regulator before the water metre is clogged. They will expect a tip for this. You are not allowed to beat them.

Neighbours display of shoes -- I've seen this outside several flats in VT5: neighbours who want to show off their extensive shoe collection. This is not only a reminder that the majority of any given population has no taste, but also leads to unpleasant odours permeating the corridors. I find that kicking them down the corridor works nicely. The same neighbour had a habit of leaving food dishes outside, waiting for the girl from the restaurant downstairs to come pick it up. She never did. Smashing the plate on the floor, and kicking some of the broken bits and rotting food under the offending neighbour's door works well for this one.

Security not managing the lifts -- the security guards in VT5 do not understand the concept of a service lift. Often they direct pack animals carrying construction materials into the passenger lifts. These pack animals invariably stink. A stern expression and direction to the faulty staff member that that sort of thing belongs in the service lift usually works, and they then waste more of residents' time redirecting the offending beasts to their appropriate quarter.

Parking -- During the high season, VT5 is awash with tourists, most of whom, it would seem, hire cars. As such the car park is quite crowded in the evening, and you may need to park in the staff parking area, which is just past where Jesus left his shoes. I've not been to VT3 in the evening, however I suspect that it might be worse, as one really needs a car in that location.

Decorate yourself

It is definitely worth trying to find a bare shell, and decorate yourself. If you go to VT5, take a look at all the condos in the window. Okay, in half of them the genius photographer has only taken a photo of a bed, but for the rest, look carefully. They are hideous. If you can still obtain a condo for 2 to 2.5 million baht, you will save money, and, assuming that you have a good eye, will end up with something tasteful.

Go to all of the building supply shops before buying anything. Look at condos on the Internet to discover what design ideas you like -- not only flats in Pattaya, but also London, Paris, Tokyo -- get as many ideas as you can. Visit the local shops that make bespoke sofas (if you are buying a studio, you'll probably need one), hide-a-bed's (even more so), etc. And use a builder that comes recommended by at least TWO people.

[thaiworthy-old]

Mumbai, what an exceedingly witty and interesting post. You write well. You are truly a "senior member" of this Forum. This was entertaining as well as informative. I will cut and paste this into my scrapbook for reference later.

Actually, all the posts in this thread have been enlightening. I am not a seasoned veteran of the "living in Thailand," set, so I don't have much to offer except gratitude and appreciation.

Thanks everyone! This is the reason I visit the Sawatdee Forum.

Just a few thoughts:

and technical staff are so stupid that one feels the urge to water them twice a week. ...

View Talay 3 is in a quieter location, and is a quieter building altogether. There are fewer rooms for hire to tourists, so common areas are less crowded, and no constant parade of people with suitcases. The standard unit, like VT5, is 48 square metres, however more of this is dedicated to balcony in VT3. Balconies at both 5 and 3 can comfortably seat 8 people, however 3 is just a little bit wider. The poolside restaurant staff are miserable, the food is miserable, and they charge twice as much for it. There are no other restaurants to date.


Which side of the building:

In VT5 and VT3, Jomtien side is coolest most of the year, with the balcony in shade from late morning onwards. In the 'winter' season (now), the balcony will be shaded after around 2 pm. So if you want to have drinks on the balcony in the early evening, choose Jomtien side, however you will not see the sunset. Pattaya side is HOT in the afternoon and evening, but you can watch the sun set, and at last from VT5, there are often good city views.

The Jomtien side of both buildings will have noisy neighbours for some time to come. VT5 has VT7 next door, as well as a new hotel that is supposed to be built (anyone have information on this?). Not sure what is going next to VT3, but perhaps someone else might?

In VT5, if you buy a low floor unit, do not choose Pattaya side. The generators are noisy, as are the barbarians who come to work every day renovating flats. You would also need to hear the constant coming and going of motorbikes. The staff sometimes forget to close the garbage shed, thoroughly unpleasant, especially if combined with the food smells from Mini Bar.


They will expect a tip for this. You are not allowed to beat them.


I find that kicking them down the corridor works nicely. The same neighbour had a habit of leaving food dishes outside, waiting for the girl from the restaurant downstairs to come pick it up. She never did. Smashing the plate on the floor, and kicking some of the broken bits and rotting food under the offending neighbour's door works well for this one.

Security not managing the lifts -- the security guards in VT5 do not understand the concept of a service lift. Often they direct pack animals carrying construction materials into the passenger lifts. These pack animals invariably stink. A stern expression and direction to the faulty staff member that that sort of thing belongs in the service lift usually works, and they then waste more of residents' time redirecting the offending beasts to their appropriate quarter.
....

Decorate yourself ...

It is definitely worth trying to find a bare shell, and decorate yourself. If you go to VT5, take a look at all the condos in the window. Okay, in half of them the genius photographer has only taken a photo of a bed, but for the rest, look carefully. They are hideous.

...
And use a builder that comes recommended by at least TWO people.

LMFAO - Nice one bombaygin!

Thank you Thaiworthy and 555 for your kind words!

I might add that now that Pattaya is no longer just my weekend getaway from Hong Kong, and I am working here full-time, the condo is no longer suitable. My partner and I live together, and the space is just too small, also there is no privacy in a condo, and one is just a bit too close to one's neighbours.

I've decided to move East of Sukhumvit (Chuk Nork reservoir area, if you are familiar), and am awaiting completion of a charming little 4 bedroom house that will be just the right fit. One poster wrote that this is a horrible mistake, but actually there is a nice community over that way, and the quality of life is miles better than living in town. For those who have been to my parties, just imagine how wonderfully I shall be able to entertain with so much more space, a second oven, and a barbeque, not to mention space for a few more wine cellar fridges!

I will keep the condo both as a second office and a space for G&T's at sunset :)

[thrillbill]

I am also from the States and thought of puchasing a place since right now I get a housing allowance from my company. I have decided not to buy a place here;for, the distance and cost of a flight will be too much for me when I retire. I have heard of other nice places to retire at such as Panama and Costa Rica... and there is a gay life there.

I think in the long run it would be better for you to rent.... purchasing a condo here will most likely not be an investment, it will (hopefully) keep its value. Pattaya is not only being over built but the infrastructure is unable to support the numerous high rised condos/hotels being built. In some areas, there is still a water shortage. This will only get worse. The noise and pollution is above the norm.

...But if you are determined to buy a place, I would buy it in the Jomtien area where there are many gays that have purchased condos there. Just make sure you rent in the area/ or place that you plan to buy before you invest in it.

Good Luck

I agree that the best idea is to rent and try renting in several areas befor you decide where to buy. Given the state of thai politics right now I would caution any buyer to be carefull. Everyday they seem to change the retirement and visa requirements and why would you buy and not be able to spend longer periods of time in your home? Not only that but you may buy a place with a view only to have the view blocked by new constuction. there is no law protecting the buyer. It is very BUYER BEWARE now.

[Impulse]

I bought a 48 sm shell on the Pattaya side of vt 5.I liked the location and cancelled my vt7 purchase because for the same size(48 sm) the vt5 was only 2 million baht as opposed to 3 million. Plus there is still the controversy over how high they will build the vt7.I hope buyers get their monies back if it is cancelled. My unit is still a shell and will be for a couple of years as I dont plan on going to LOS till then.The balconies on vt5 and vt3 are bigger than vt1 and vt2.I looked at places in vt 1 and 2 and the small balconies and the hassle of crossing the street to get to the beach didnt seem worth it. Its interesting that the Pattaya side of the vts are advertised as being the cool side in adds by Pattaya trader. I admit the vt buildings are not very attractive but it was easy to buy it directly from vt and was hassle free. I find jomtien complex attractive but it was(Is) about to have its views blocked. Im glad to have bought a year and a half ago as it would cost more now with the baht so strong.Colmx is dealing in euros so maybe waiting for prices to drop might make sense. vt3 is a nicer looking building for a vt project but the location kinda sucks unless you have a car.

[colmx]

Just a few thoughts:

View Talay 5 is probably the most convenient of the lot.

Hi Mumbaighost
Thanks a lot for a very witty and informative post!

Its good to hear comments form people who have actually lived in these developments

BF used to Live in LV apartment on 3rd road, it used to annoy the sh1t out of me when his neighbours left their dirty plates for days on end outside their apartments. The boys working in teh restaurant down stairs would only be sent for the plates when they ran out of clean plats downstairs!

I have a couple of quick questions for you:
Given the chance to start over again would you buy in VT5 again?
How much did you pay for your unit
How much did it cost you to do it up?

Hope these questions aren't too intrusive!
If so you can kick me down the corridor too!

Wpild also love to hear from any other VT5 residents...
Traveller Jim where are you? :cyclopsani:

DELETED

I'm 34, ..........

Only 34 and already in love with Pattaya?
I wonder what you look like......

Just a few thoughts:

View Talay 5 is probably the most convenient of the lot.


I have a couple of quick questions for you:
Given the chance to start over again would you buy in VT5 again?
How much did you pay for your unit
How much did it cost you to do it up?

:cyclopsani:

First one is a tough one -- yes I probably would buy in VT5 again, despite the hassles. The location is really very convenient, and for the first year I did not have a car. If you are one of the (MANY) expats or retirees who don't want to drive here, it is highly recommended. Even though I am moving out to the countryside at end of quarter, I will probably still maintain the VT5 flat as in in town office (our real office is practical but ugly, and investors seem quite content to sip gin and tonic on my balcony!), and as a place to sleep when I have had one too many to drive home.

I paid 1.95 million for the condo, about 370k for initial decoration (tiles, European kitchen with ceramic hob and oven, wardrobe, air-con, electrical, telephone and computer network wiring -- this was my really shopping around and getting the best bargains on electronic equipment etc. An additional 126k for the bed -- wood bookshelves that slide open to reveal a fold-out bed, including a Sleepytime mattress. Further 50k for entertainment -- flat screen TV, DVD player, and acceptable speakers. Further 20k on kitchen things (from kitchen shop on 2nd Road -- great place), 30k on further furniture. So about 600k all told, even including duvets, bed sheets etc.

I never worked to a budget, and only chose the materials I really wanted, after extensive search and third and fourth visits to shops that had the materials I wanted. When you choose materials, think of what you can live with for 5 years, not what is economical. Also consider each material, and whether it is just trendy (a pastiche that you will tire of quickly) or if it will endure fashion trends.

For my last two flats in Hong Kong, I have worked similarly -- in those cases, taking an old flat that needed a wrecking ball taking to it, but which offered spacious rooms and a charming environment, hunting down materials, fabrics, stones, and finally putting the whole production together. Hong Kong has 1000 times the materials that Thailand has to offer, and the added benefit of no import duty. Chinese workmen are also far more efficient, and come at about the same cost, so building here was a challenge. If you choose materials and plan everything carefully, the actual work only takes about 5 weeks for a studio. ALWAYS pay for work done, and NEVER by the day. NEVER pay 100% up front -- I paid 50% of labour, and provided the materials, to ensure work done properly and on time.

I ordered a minimum renovation for the bathroom -- just kept the standard View Talay toilet, sink and vanity, and just put glass to shield the shower (I hate water on the floor), and built cabinets under the sink, also added towel rack and two sets of shelves for pharmacy and shower things, as well as a third shelf to hold lots of clean towels.

If you are going to have a hide-a-bed (VERY strongly recommended if you are buying a studio!), I suggest having that put in before any built in wardrobes or cabinets to cover the air-con. The air-con cabinet is great extra storage, but make sure that it is designed so that you can open the front to for manual control -- my remote died recently (will cost 2000 baht to fix the I/R port!), and I have had to use a wooden cooking spoon to turn on the air-con!

I am a sailor by hobby (Etchells class, in case there are any other yachties reading this??), so I have thought of how we make the most of space on a sail boat. 48 square metres, some of which is balcony, is not a huge space, so we need to put hidden storage wherever we can. I drew each component as cut-outs, and fitted things together in different configurations until I found what I wanted. Then I did 3 water colour perspective paintings, and gave them to the designer who did the work for me.

I hope that this is helpful!

[colmx]

colmx

take a look here bargain new condo development (http://www.thailand-property-guide.com/index.php?p=property_details&PropID=0009276)

Good prices.

Hi John
They do seem like good prices, but i feel a little too far away from the action for me! (you know i like to be near the bars discos!)



Only 34 and already in love with Pattaya?
I wonder what you look like......

Hi Scott
I've been coming to Pattaya for the last 7 years...
I wouldn't say I'm in Love with Pattaya... But i am in love with one of its (ex)residents
As for how i look... I don't look as nice as i did on my first trip...
But i'm still fairly well preserved, well under 80KG an get my fair share of freebies in Pattaya

Mumbai:
Thanks again for your post,
I'll def take a look at VT5 on my next trip...

However something keeps drawing me to Royal Hill Condotel and Hyde park residence...
RHC always caught my eye on teh way to Jomtien
HPR's locationintrigues me as its quite close to where BF used to Live (soi Sattee) and a loction we both like for its convenience to both town and jomtien.

Anybody here been to See Hyde Park Residence?
I believer there is a HPR2 on the cards now...

... as I have said before they look good, and on-route, which means you won't get ripped off when getting taxis,

Hyde Park Residence are located in Pratumak Hill - I think I passed a couple of these buildings on my last trip, they are on the hill, I don't see taxis going up there, although you could probably walk up and down the hill (but would you want to, it would take I bet at least 1/2 hour to get to some of those places on the hill even though they look and are advertised 5 mins from the sea, and a tuk tuk / taxi would definately ask for 100 bht come 2 in the morning). Give it a miss.

Go with your instincts.

RHC and Hyde Park are good value for money, and the Iguana folks appear to be committed to delivering a good quality product. And as they are a fairly serious lot, you won't have to put up with the shenanigans that we must tolerate with View Talay (sinking fund disappearing, small charges for ridiculous things, grossly incompetent staff etc.).

Pratumnak Hill is a nice environment, as long as you are prepared to drive. The baht bus that charges 10 baht to go to Jomtien wants 100 or 150 to take you anywhere from Pratumnak, even though it's closer. If you are near the Royal Cliff you can use their limousines -- 200 baht gets you anywhere around Jomtien in a Mercedes E class. On the other hand, you may be lucky and have a motorbike taxi stand pop up outside your condo -- but motorbikes do melt in the rain (like Singapore taxis!).

If you will have a car or motorbike, Pratumnak can be very pleasant. I've always noticed that the air on the hill is always a bit cooler than Jomtien (and subsequently much cooler than Pattaya). There are some very good restaurants and cafes on the hill. It is ill advised to walk down certain sois at night, and Pattaya Park is best avoided after dark.

[colmx]

Hi All
Thanks to everyone for their input so far... I'm still scouring the property sites looking at available property in Jomtien/Pattaya

Unfortunately it looks like Hyde Park is sold out an I'm not willing to wat on Hyde Park residence II - so I'm still looking...

Just wondering if anyone had any opinions on "Suan Sawarn"
http://suansawarn.com/
They don't give any address or location for the development - just that they are 700M from the beach...
I am really interested in their innovativ and smart duplex designs..

Anyone know what part of Jomtien they are in?
Anybody got any comments on the development?

Thanks in Advance (again!)

[colmx]

Also interested in hearing what people think of Jomtien Condotel
(not Metro Jomtien Condotel)
I think its the older building next to VT5 - any comments on thsi location?
Thanks!

Suan Sawan is *very* cheap, with a *very* cheap quality of finishing. If it is for a weekend place, and you are not sensitive to that sort of thing, it's great value for money. It's in the hinterlands behind Jomtien Park Villas -- I'm not sure how you could get to the beach in 700m unless you are a bird, but perhaps they know of a new soi that will come through, that I don't know about.

Grand Condotel is the empress dowager of condos in Jomtien, and one of the earliest. They have the tightest security, nicely kept gardens and common areas. Friends who live there, both as owners and tenants, have always had positive things to say. And even though she's an old girl, condo prices (and house prices) remain high. Be sure that the unit you are looking at will not be obscured by Regatta.

DELETED

[Up2U]

Just a few thoughts:

View Talay 5 is probably the most convenient of the lot, with its proximity to beach, pubs, market etc. Building C is finally becoming more quiet, as most of the flats have now been decorated -- if you move into building D be prepared for 2 years of building noise. The pool side restaurant has reasonable (if not particularly healthy) food at good prices and both English newspapers, and the staff are pleasant and cheerful. There is another cafe inside which has alternative fare (more salads, sandwiches), even cheaper, and a third, Mini Bar, which has tired old bar girls from the 1970's, serves weak gin and tonics and food that smells like sewage (happily most customers only go for drinks, so one need not suffer the odours often). The reception staff are as helpful as they are required to be, security staff will radio for a motorbike taxi for you, and technical staff are so stupid that one feels the urge to water them twice a week.

View Talay 3 is in a quieter location, and is a quieter building altogether. There are fewer rooms for hire to tourists, so common areas are less crowded, and no constant parade of people with suitcases. The standard unit, like VT5, is 48 square metres, however more of this is dedicated to balcony in VT3. Balconies at both 5 and 3 can comfortably seat 8 people, however 3 is just a little bit wider. The poolside restaurant staff are miserable, the food is miserable, and they charge twice as much for it. There are no other restaurants to date.

Which side of the building:

In VT5 and VT3, Jomtien side is coolest most of the year, with the balcony in shade from late morning onwards. In the 'winter' season (now), the balcony will be shaded after around 2 pm. So if you want to have drinks on the balcony in the early evening, choose Jomtien side, however you will not see the sunset. Pattaya side is HOT in the afternoon and evening, but you can watch the sun set, and at last from VT5, there are often good city views.

The Jomtien side of both buildings will have noisy neighbours for some time to come. VT5 has VT7 next door, as well as a new hotel that is supposed to be built (anyone have information on this?). Not sure what is going next to VT3, but perhaps someone else might?

In VT5, if you buy a low floor unit, do not choose Pattaya side. The generators are noisy, as are the barbarians who come to work every day renovating flats. You would also need to hear the constant coming and going of motorbikes. The staff sometimes forget to close the garbage shed, thoroughly unpleasant, especially if combined with the food smells from Mini Bar.


What to watch out for:

Check all sinks and showers -- water pressure can be a problem. It is usually a matter of getting one of the odious technicians to come and fix it, and they will need to come back 4 to 12 times, in order to find that the regulator before the water metre is clogged. They will expect a tip for this. You are not allowed to beat them.

Neighbours display of shoes -- I've seen this outside several flats in VT5: neighbours who want to show off their extensive shoe collection. This is not only a reminder that the majority of any given population has no taste, but also leads to unpleasant odours permeating the corridors. I find that kicking them down the corridor works nicely. The same neighbour had a habit of leaving food dishes outside, waiting for the girl from the restaurant downstairs to come pick it up. She never did. Smashing the plate on the floor, and kicking some of the broken bits and rotting food under the offending neighbour's door works well for this one.

Security not managing the lifts -- the security guards in VT5 do not understand the concept of a service lift. Often they direct pack animals carrying construction materials into the passenger lifts. These pack animals invariably stink. A stern expression and direction to the faulty staff member that that sort of thing belongs in the service lift usually works, and they then waste more of residents' time redirecting the offending beasts to their appropriate quarter.

Parking -- During the high season, VT5 is awash with tourists, most of whom, it would seem, hire cars. As such the car park is quite crowded in the evening, and you may need to park in the staff parking area, which is just past where Jesus left his shoes. I've not been to VT3 in the evening, however I suspect that it might be worse, as one really needs a car in that location.

Decorate yourself

It is definitely worth trying to find a bare shell, and decorate yourself. If you go to VT5, take a look at all the condos in the window. Okay, in half of them the genius photographer has only taken a photo of a bed, but for the rest, look carefully. They are hideous. If you can still obtain a condo for 2 to 2.5 million baht, you will save money, and, assuming that you have a good eye, will end up with something tasteful.

Go to all of the building supply shops before buying anything. Look at condos on the Internet to discover what design ideas you like -- not only flats in Pattaya, but also London, Paris, Tokyo -- get as many ideas as you can. Visit the local shops that make bespoke sofas (if you are buying a studio, you'll probably need one), hide-a-bed's (even more so), etc. And use a builder that comes recommended by at least TWO people.

An informative post. I am currently staying at VT5 and agree with many of your comments. However, The 5C building although close to the beach has the negative of being quite a hike to the main road. Since I don't use motor bikes or have a car this might be a deal buster for me. The weather is nice now but I can envision the rainy season and getting soaked. The new VT7 location should be super.

A word of caution and advice. The View Talay juristic person has a history of mis-management. 6 months after project completion an owners meeting should be called to choose a new homeowner's board. This was not done for up to 7 years for some of the VT projects. Meanwhile, the reserve accounts were depleted and the new homeowners boards are struggling to deal with many neglected issues and underfunded reserve accounts. You can read aboout it at: http://thaicondoforum.com/
I suggest all VT3 and 5 owners to organize quickly and give the VT juristic person the boot, and hire a professional management company while there is still time.

DELETED

[Diec]

How much you want to bet we will never hear from Colmex purchasing a condo in Pattaya?

Anyone who has sense enough to ask advice about buying property in Thailand, probably has sense enough to eventually see the pitfalls.

That was what you meant, wasn't it Diec?

[colmx]

How much you want to bet we will never hear from Colmex purchasing a condo in Pattaya?

Hi Diec
I'm Irish - Irish People like to own their property - not rent it...

I guess its something to do with the fact that we wern't allowed to own property for 800+ years! The Irish psyche always wants to own the place where they put their head...

I can't see any downside or pitfalls to owning a property to be honest... As long as the new Thai govtdon't do anything to discourage me :compress:

I have been looking at buying a property as well in Pattaya, mostly due to the beach and the lack of smog that is present in Bangkok. Anyway, I don't want to spend all (or most) of my savings for a place and want to finance it and was pointed to the Bangkok Bank in Singapore, according to their literature they will loan up to 70% at about 8.75% (which I think is high for A credit) over 20 years (loan amounts no less than 100k USD and no more than 800K USD), with a prepayment penalty of 1.5% of the loan amount to be pre-paid. Has anyone had dealings with them? Is there any other way beside owner financing or "hard money" lending which may have even a higher interest rate and less favorable terms? My goal is to be able to spend 6 months out of the year in Thailand with-in the next 5 years and full time with-in 9 years, but in the meantime when I travel to Thailand I would like to sleep in my own bed, and have no desire to rent a place.

Anyway, I don't want to spend all (or most) of my savings for a place and want to finance it and was pointed to the Bangkok Bank in Singapore, according to their literature they will loan up to 70% at about 8.75% (which I think is high for A credit) over 20 years (loan amounts no less than 100k USD and no more than 800K USD), with a prepayment penalty of 1.5% of the loan amount to be pre-paid.So basically you think it makes sense to buy a place for around USD145K, paying around USD8K/year (ie. 250K baht) in interest (plus the usual outgoings for condo maintenance) and forgoing interest income on the USD45K deposit, for a place you'll only live in for 6 months a year?

Not saying that it makes financial or fiscal sense at all, just want to make the best deal I can and get what I want ... and I am looking more into buying something in the 350k USD range not 145. I have talked with some friends in Thailand and they suggest that I rent it out while I am not there .... I have not given that idea much thought, esp. with some of the horror stories that are told on here about large amounts of damage done to properties.

[colmx]

Hi GBMG
Nice to see that i'm not the only person that likes to sleep in my own bed and under my own roof!

Unfortunately my budget is around 20% of yours!
But I plan on obtaining finance for the property directly from my mortgage provider here in Ireland

I plan to do it by releasing Equity from my PPR (permanent place of residence ie. my Tiny Apartment)in Ireland

Interest rates here are at 0.75% above the European Central Bank rate
ECB is currently 4.00% - and unlikely to go up so i would pay 4.75% PA

This relates to тВм2850PA or тВм237PM = ~11K THB PM

I believe financing from you home country will always be cheapest?

On another note 350K USD is 11 Million Thai Baht... at an average cost of 50K THB per square meter in Pattaya - this would give you 220 Square meters!!! Are you planning on buying a whole floor somewhere?

Hello Colmx,

Unfortunately I have not been able to find a bank in the US willing to loan on a foreign property. I don't own a house I live on my yacht (which I have for sale) so I don't really have anything to put up for collateral except my good name a high credit score. I am still looking around for options to Bangkok Bank as I feel they are charging way too much for an "A" paper loan, mind you I didn't mention the filling fees which equal almost 2k USD and get this, if you make any changes to the loan during the process, let's say you find something wrong with the property and you negotiate a lower price, they charge you a fee to redo the paperwork for the loan.

... before buying, the credit crunch is affecting the USA, has drifted over the UK and probably part of Europe. Asia is aware of it and I'm sure it is affecting them. A lot of people probably finance their overseas properties via UK/US/European banks - and the banks are now not borrowing the money out. Now unless you have money to put up front and a lot of people dont, they it is going to affect property prices.

Colmx,

The price per square meter is good to know as I ran some calculations and one of the properties priced out 1mil baht more than it should be ...granted it's asking price, but I had been told that many people are set on their asking price and don't really want to negotiate much and will allow the properties to sit until they get their price. How is the market there holding up, especially due to the global decline in housing prices. There seems to be a lot of inventory both in Pattaya and Bangkok, much more supply vs demand, which in conventional logic would pull prices down, but what I am seeing there is they are building more and more and prices seem to be staying artificially high?

[Marsilius]

GBMGymnast - for an explanation of why many Thai owners of empty properties are not too concerned if they go on holding on to them for quite some time - even in a falling market - see the earlier posts on http://www.sawatdee-gay-thailand.com/fo ... 13771.html (http://www.sawatdee-gay-thailand.com/forum/a-night-mare-just-about-to-happen-for-some-t13771.html)

Marsilius,

I did read that thread previously, and have re-read it. Are there any reputable companies to work with that will steer you clear from these overpriced units and only show you ones that are priced reasonably? Or is this way too much to ask for?

If I was buying from a developer an unfinished property or one off plan I would check that the said developer had finished his other projects.
There are developers around Pattya who have not finished and even abandoned some of their previous projects because of the downturn .Blaming cash flow problems.
Leaving many people frustrated and angry especially as the developer will have had most of their money in stage payments.
Do not believe there isn't a downturn in the market here .The hype the developers are portraying of the great life style property boom in Pattaya is laughable and just not true.
There are too many imponderables in Thailand and the world as to be able to predict when the property market here will recover.
Large projects are being hyped up hugely in a desperate attempt to sell the empty units.
When you sign a contract make sure that each stage payment measures up with the various stages of completion.Otherwise you will end up with paying a lot of money for an empty space.

Or is this way too much to ask for?Yes. This Is Thailand

Not saying that it makes financial or fiscal sense at all, just want to make the best deal I can and get what I want ... and I am looking more into buying something in the 350k USD range .... I have not given that idea much thought....

According to your posts & profile you are a California policeman, with no house and no collateral, ready and willing to pay over $100,000 down followed by $25,000 annually in interest / lost interest alone, plus the capital re-payments, ( a total of around $50,000 per year including maintenance charges, etc) for an apartment that you plan on only using infrequently for the next 5 years, for 6 months a year after that and, if all goes according to plan, retire to in 9 years time (with 11 years of mortgage still due). While JB may be able to steer you in the right direction, TB would appear to be more likely to be interested in giving you some personal advice!

I understand TB is trying to give me advice, and I appreciate it. However, at this point I am looking for advice on where to buy, not really on if I should buy. Basically, I am going to purchase something ... and I have decided that upto 6.5 million baht is my comfort zone. The property will be paid off in about 5 years. I will put down 30% cash. The advantage to my profession (I am not a police man btw) is that I can retire at 50 with 90% of my salary and 100% of my medical plus my 401k etc etc. So considering I make in the 6 figures, paying for the property truly is not the issue. However, getting the most for my money is of the utmost importance. One place that I am considering is Northshore as I can get a new 1bd 1bth on about the 11th floor with seaview. Has anyone actually looked at any of these units? If so what where your thoughts? Also I am looking at Centre Condo, but I have read that they are having some issue with a building being put up in one of the driveways? Anyway, any direction as to what buildings to buy or stay away from would be great... and I already know not to buy it if it's not built ... personally I am staying away from VT, just a preference.

[Smiles]

I may easily be wrong, but I have a sneaking suspicion that GBMGymnast should be discussing this problem with wx40afp.

Cheers ...

I may easily be wrong, but I have a sneaking suspicion that GBMGymnast should be discussing this problem with wx40afpI'd come to the same conclusion for a different reason - GBMGymnast is off his rocker

I believe that is really a shame that people ask for assistance from people on this board that have made a new hopefully better and happier life in Thailand, but instead of helping us avoid some of the pitfalls that you or some of your friends have experienced, instead you insult and try to humiliate. I will not bother with this post any further, I will do the research myself and if I make a mistake, so be it. Thanks for nothing, my sincere apologies to those on here that really do want to help.

[Dboy]

I've gone through the condo-buying urge, and we are nearly the same age so would like to offer a few comments and alternatives.

Like you, I've discovered that hauling my stuff back and forth, getting my laptop through US customs, etc is a real pain in the ass. One alternative to this is to get a storage unit. There's a storage place in Jomtien that worked out great for me, and in addition to storage they also offer mailboxes..so you can get your 'official' address taken care of there too. I use this address for my Thai bank account and will use it for my drivers license when I finally get around to sorting that out.

I have many MANY issues with buying a condo. It's not just the politics, or the economy, or the fact that farang have no rights in the country, or that any year you can be refused a visa (and likely WILL be at some point), or that living in a place like Pattaya will likely shorten your life, or that it's kinda boring in the day time, rising lawlessness in Pattaya, fat loud british people waddling around throughout the city, rising nationalism, desperate people all over, drugs, gangs, shootings, motorbike accidents, drunks, stupid people with tattoos, those touts on beach road, poor infrastructure..although I consider all of those important flaws. The MAIN reasons for not buying is that the construction is poor, the designs are bad (there are a few places I like, such as Chateau Dale, and the marina property south of jomtien..I forget the name?), little hope that property will be maintained in the future, and hap-hazard zoning (to be polite). What if (like me) you decide that you love Thailand, but that pattaya is a bit of a pit. A 'fun' pit, but still a pit.

Also consider your lifestyle. If you're like me you meet quite a few people while on bar adventures. During the course of socializing you will meet people that turn out to be psychopathic stalkers. I have 3(!) right now. They start out normal, then they want to move in and take over your life. If you OWN the place you live, they will be able to stalk you FOREVER. If you rent, you move, change out your SIM card, and you're good-to-go. If it hasn't happened to you (yet), trust me this is coming from experience and this is a factor worth considering.

Also lately I've been traveling a bit in Isaan and will do a bit more of that next month. Right now I like Pattaya, but I could be very happy in one of the quieter towns in Isaan. Not now, but at some point. I'd rather not have that condo to factor in to a moving situation. I understanding the 'owning' mentality, but owning doesn't really mean the same thing in Thailand as it does in the west.

Anyway, whatever you decide I hope it works out for you. I do know quite a few owners, so my opinion is certainly debatable. One area I have not seen suggested here in Naklua (the area north of Dolphin). There are some nice places in that area.

dboy

[andrewcraig]

I bought in Pattaya a one bed condo. I regret it I am forced to use it when I would like to be elsewhere

I did not want to spend all my life there, and knew it was too small for me to retire to.

I now am faced with a forced trip to Pattaya so as to not waste money

I am not prepared to rent

My friends regret all tenancies.

do not buy . Rent and maintain your independence.

....really a shame that people ask for assistance .... I will do the research myself and if I make a mistake so be it ....

GBMG, you were given advice - unambiguous and objective advice - by a number of people. You chose to ignore it:

... at this point I am looking for advice on where to buy, not really on if I should buy. Basically, I am going to purchase something ...

Asking for advice on what specific condos are best is like asking which bar / boy is the best - you may get a myriad of different answers, all or none of which may apply to you. It is made virtually impossible when in the space of a couple of days your price range changes from around 11 million baht to 6.5 million. colmx has clearly thought through his requirements, the pitfalls, etc, done his homework and asked specific questions which have received several pages of specific answers - you have not, hence some of the responses.

I am not a police man btw

No insult or humiliation intended, but you gave your profession as "law enforcement" - in most English speaking countries this means "police force".

It's not just the politics, or the economy, or the fact that farang have no rights in the country, or that any year you can be refused a visa ... or that living in a place like Pattaya will likely shorten your life, or that it's kinda boring in the day time, rising lawlessness in Pattaya, fat loud british people waddling around throughout the city, rising nationalism, desperate people all over, drugs, gangs, shootings, motorbike accidents, drunks, stupid people with tattoos, those touts on beach road, poor infrastructure.... Right now I like Pattaya, but I could be very happy in one of the quieter towns in Isaan.

Dboy,

I agree with 90%+ of what you have said, and I live here! All the "flaws" you name are increasing, rather than diminishing, although recently I have noticed less British accents and more fat loud Americans in silly shorts and far more loud Russians in very much shorter shorts, but generally I would not disagree with you. I too like Isaan, but the advantages are outweighed by the basic requirements of a good hospital, a decent vet, and easy shopping, none of which are available in the areas I like.

Living some 15 - 20 minutes outside Pattaya, as I do, you can avoid most of the downside of Pattaya itself without losing the advantages - land, houses and condos outside Pattaya, from Si Racha down to Sattahip, are far better value and the air, the beaches, the roads and the people are far nicer and far cleaner.

[colmx]

There's a storage place in Jomtien that worked out great for me, and in addition to storage they also offer mailboxes..
dboy

Hi Dboy
Somebody else PM'ed me about this storage place.
As soon as he posted it i remember seeing it when walking to Jomtien complex a few years agao

Can you let me know how much it cost for storage there?
I guess i woul be leaving a med/large suitcase there between trips (less than 20KGs allowed on flights)

Would also want ability for BF to free my belongings 2-3 days before my trip for laundry purposes... I presume this is possible? (joint ownership of storage cage)

Despite the above post anthe negative press Pattaya has been getting in both Irish TV and written press in the last 10 days... i'm still extremely keen to buy in Pattaya/Jomtien!

[Dboy]

Can you let me know how much it cost for storage there?

mailbox: 1000bt/year
store box: 300bt/month
laptop stored in safe: 900bt/mo

company name: Safe Independent Co, Ltd
phone: 038-303-863

I have no affiliation with this company at all. I know the prices because I'm looking at their price sheet as I write this. Not sure the exact physical address, it's on the street level at Jomtien Complex Condotel. They
have various sizes of storage units available, which consist of a metal cage bolted to a wall. Looked
secure enough to me. They don't have a way to store cars or motorbikes, but I located a guy in East
Pattaya who claims to be able to store bikes. Have not checked that out yet.


dboy

[PeterUK]

I believe that is really a shame that people ask for assistance from people on this board that have made a new hopefully better and happier life in Thailand, but instead of helping us avoid some of the pitfalls that you or some of your friends have experienced, instead you insult and try to humiliate. I will not bother with this post any further, I will do the research myself and if I make a mistake, so be it. Thanks for nothing, my sincere apologies to those on here that really do want to help.

While it is oftentimes true that critical posts on this board are motivated solely by mischief and malice and can safely be ignored, there are times when a verbal slap round the face might be just what a poster needs and I think this is one of them. What you have been saying in this thread, GBMGymnast, comes close to lunacy in my opinion, for reasons already given. You say yourself that you don't know if what you are proposing to do makes financial sense, yet you intend to do it anyway! In other words, you are allowing yourself to be ruled by emotion. This might be an acceptable peccadillo in someone wealthy, but by your own admission you are not in this category. You don't own a property in your own country and have few assets, but want to stretch yourself right out financially to own a property in a country where you clearly have little understanding of the market and what might happen to it in future. To put it mildly, it could be very volatile and you are asking for trouble. Hurt feelings from reading this thread would be a small price to pay if they caused you to reassess your plans and act sensibly. My advice is that you should wait until your own financial position is stronger and you are ready to make your fulltime move to Thailand. Then think about buying a property.

I completely understand what you all are saying. Trust me, I am not discounting any thing that any of you have said. But you have misinterpreted my financial position a little. I said I don't own a house this is true, I own and live on a 2 million dollar yacht, which I have for sale presently and I was/am planning on using some of that money toward a property in Thailand. The reason I lowered the price I was willing to pay, is based on economics. I want to save a certain amount of money per month, so I took what I make, subtracted and estimated mortgage + fees in Thailand and Rent in the US, minus 2k a month for play as well as a margin for emergencies, that is how I came up with the 6.5 MBaht. I know that the housing market in Thailand is volatile, however at present isn't it everywhere? The projected drop in prices in the US is 36% off the highs of 2006/7 (hence the reason I have no desire to purchase here). The decision to purchase in Thailand is based on my desire to have my retirement home paid for by the time I retire, not emotion. I believe that desire makes perfect sense. No I can not, as no one can say where the market will go, but I do know that once I retire I will live very comfortably in Thailand as my retirement is for life plus my 401k, medical etc. No, I am not a wealthy guy, but I am far from broke. I have tried to weight the pros and cons, I have talked with several friends that currently live in Thailand either full or part time ... and none have said not to retire there, but my friends that rent say rent, my friends that own say there is no doubt, buy, but even they (the one's that own) disagree as to whether or not now would be the best time to buy, as so much is being built, and with the recent instability of the government etc. some of them feel that prices are currently inflated and are going to drop. Hopefully this clears the air a little and I hope explains my position and situation a little clearer.

[Dboy]

I know that the housing market in Thailand is volatile, however at present isn't it everywhere? The projected drop in prices in the US is 36% off the highs of 2006/7 (hence the reason I have no desire to purchase here).

Woah man I would not necessarily compare US vs Thai real estate that way. In fact I would more likely be in the mood to buy US real estate right now. It's called buy low / sell high for a reason. All real estate is local, so your % decline number is going to happen in very localized areas. In fact, some areas in the US have been untouched by the real estate crash (North Carolina, Texas, others). Cash is king in US real estate market right now and if you time things for the maximum pain point (when someone is begging you to buy their property) then buy. Thai property market does not work like this AT ALL.

Have you ever wondered how people can sit on empty properties for YEARS in Thailand without lowering their selling price? You ever wondered why some bar owners/businesses stay open even though they have no customers? I would rather not spell why in this post cuz I don't want to start any shit with bar owners, but just think about it.



The decision to purchase in Thailand is based on my desire to have my retirement home paid for by the time I retire, not emotion. I believe that desire makes perfect sense.

I completely understand this idea since that was my plan as well.



with the recent instability of the government etc.

The political instability here isn't just recent. The main difference (thankfully) is that nobody got killed this time. The bigger picture here is that since the early 1970's there's been a struggle going on between the military vs civilian rule. And it certainly doesn't seem settled. There is more unrest potentially on the way for Thailand in other areas of the leadership, although with all my heart I wish the best for the Thai people and hope that it all works out ok.

Guess if you're not convinced yet, then probably nothing will deter you from buying. If you're that set on putting roots down then hopefully you will learn the Thai language. You'll NEVER really understand the Thais, but the language is a good first step.

chok dee

dboy

GBMG,

it is getting increasingly difficult to take you seriously:

I own and live on a 2 million dollar yacht

According to your posts you are around 40 (retiring at 50 in 5 to 9 years), work in "Law Enforcement" (but not a policeman), yet can afford not only to own a $2,000,000 yacht, but to pay the considerable maintenance and mooring charges in California - all on a salary "in the 6 figures".

I took what I make, subtracted and estimated mortgage + fees in Thailand and Rent in the US, minus 2k a month for play as well as a margin for emergencies, that is how I came up with the 6.5 MBaht.

One doesn't have to know what you make to easily work out the rest of the figures; unless your "margin for emergencies" is more than the rest put together, it barely creeps into "the 6 figures" and would certainly be nowhere near sufficient to maintain a $2,000,000 yacht.

"2 million dollar .... for sale .... planning on using some of that money toward a property in Thailand .... 6.5MBaht"

If sold, this would only entail you spending 10% of the unencumbered capital you would raise; a mortgage of any type would be pointless. If unsold, it could be used as collateral and most US banks would give you a secured loan at a far lower rate of interest than the one you propose.

I am not trying to insult or humiliate you, but I know a few people who are fortunate enough to be in the financial position you refer to - none of them, apart from in their worst nightmares, would plan on retiring to a "1 bd 1 bth" apartment in somewhere like Centre Condo (no disrespect intended to those who have).

"Trust me ...."

That, I am afraid, is just asking too much!

GBMGymnast. 9 Years ago after visiting Thailand for the second time (I really did not like it the first time) I fell in love with Pattaya. I decided that since the US dollar was high and the prices low then, I would buy a place so when I visited I would have "my" place. I did not have to worry about paying a joiner fee, rooming in a room that smelled of smoke and having all the convinces I wanted. I talked with 2 different real estate companies and they took me around and seemed to show me what they thought they would prefer.

I had met a few people that lived in Center Condo. Even though the common area was not Grade A, it was central to anywhere I wanted to go. It had a good market at my doorstep, and was right on the baht bus route. This was important to me since I knew I had several years until I retired. I knew I would visit 2 times a year for about 8 weeks each time. I felt that it would be a good investment for my needs and would allow me to avoid rental or hotel fees and the hassle of looking for a place to stay each time. I paid 1.3 million for about 60 sq meters which included upgrading (at 44baht to $1). I was very happy having that property. 3 years later when it was getting closer to retirement I wanted a bigger place that overlooked the ocean. I found it easy to sell that condo and buy another in the same complex. I made a small profit. This one was 125 sq meters and overlooked the ocean. The owner did the remodel for me. I had all marble floors, 4 new air conditioners, walls moved where I wanted, new bathrooms, and a nice electric kitchen. My total cost was 3.3 million including the remodel. (Exchange rate 42 to 1). I loved the place. I had meet someone I liked very much and he lived there even when I was in California. I had bought a used car, but having the baht bus service at my door was still important. I felt the security at the unit was good even though the upkeep of the common areas was not what I would have liked.

Finally my retirement was a year away....but my Thai friend really was working on me to buy a house for us. I thought I would please him by looking around. The newer estates were expensive I felt and since I had to pay cash (no loans) I felt it was going to be out of the question.

One day as we were riding around however we found an older housing complex. I never had any idea this place existed even though we drove a few blocks from it each day. It was centrally located and a block from motor taxis. It was a 2 story place with a separate guest house and a nice swimming pool and garden area. It was completely walled in and within my price range...it did need up grading. Anyway the owner sold it to me and agreed to allow me to make payments for a year. The price was a bit more than I had paid for the condo. (exchange 40 to 1) I have lived in the house for about one year and am now retired. It would be hard for me to go back to living in a condo. I like the idea of not waiting for an elevator and I don't have to worry about relying on the condo management group to make repairs or keep up the common area. The house is more money to maintain...water, electric, insurance, etc.

I rented out the condo long term. It took me only a few weeks to find a good renter. The recently I decided to sell the condo and invest in something else. I have sold the condo for more that twice what I paid, but actually made a bigger profit since the baht to dollar is now about 31 to 1.

I realize that this is a long post, but the main points I am suggesting is to think about buying an inexpensive place that is located near what you enjoy. If you look you can still find nice places for 1 million plus baht. It will be smaller than what you want in the long run but since you have a while until retirement, it can still be comfortable. When you get closer to retirement, look around and find something bigger. As I said pick an area based on your needs. Even though many will disagree, I still recommend looking at Center Condo. They have started to update the common area and I believe it still has a great location.

Earlier you wrote something about thinking your race would be an issue with the boys. I am glad you have found out that is not the case. Thailand is still amazing to me....just great

[andrewcraig]

I have found since I bought a condo in LOS I am obliged to stay in it otherwise it becomes dead money

I do like to travel to Europe, Japan, the US on the way to Canada [Montreal] and Mexico

My conscience grips me if I leave the condo unused for 12/18 months even longer.

To me the best way is to rent a condo, or stay in a hotel and invest your money

[colmx]

Hi All
Just a few more questions to add to this thread


Asking price versus actual price?
In Ireland asking price is usually the price that a place will sell for (unless a bidding auction ensues)
I have on TV that in Scotland asking price is usually 10% less than the seller expects to get...

What is the case in Thailand +/-/Same?

Also interested in hearing what people think of "The Residence" in Jomtien?
Seems to be some nicely finished apts for sale there.
Is it too far away for easy walking to Dongtan?
Is it better location wise than Suan Sawarn?

What about the view Talay Residences, any comments?

Incidentally since I have started looking for a condo in the last few weeks, I have beenchecking John Bottings site, Fairproperties, Jomtien-Property, East coast, Delight, Town and country etc etc quite regularly

I notice very few new properties coming up for sale - this gets me thinking that the market is not as flooded or flooding as some alarmists might lead us to believe?

Comment has been, quite rightly, about the instability of Thai government. In addition to the historical struggle between the Military and civil factions is an even more disturbing future after the present beloved monarch's demise. Many well informed Thais predict chaos in the wake of choosing a successor. Certainly there will be many changes and uncertainties.
If I were going to invest in Thai property, I think I would wait until that occurs.
Chok dee.

Asking price versus actual price?
In Ireland asking price is usually the price that a place will sell for (unless a bidding auction ensues)
I have on TV that in Scotland asking price is usually 10% less than the seller expects to get...

What is the case in Thailand +/-/Same?

You are quite right - Ireland has a "normal" system, like most Western countries; Scotland is the exception, where prospective buyers put in sealed bids, usually using the asking price as a "guide", and there is a specific cut off date.

The case in Thailand????? The asking price is anything they hope to get! Land near me advertised for 7 million baht for 3 years was recently sold for 3 million; a new house nearby advertised for 4 years at 16 million is still unsold at 10.5 million; another initially advertised at 11.8 million was unsold at 8 million (and is still unsold); next to it is a new one for sale at 35 million and next to that one sold for 55 million a couple of years ago is now for sale again at 75 million!!!! There is a sucker born every minute, rich and poor, but for most at the moment it is Dream on!!!!

"few new properties coming up for sale .... not as flooded ...." Don't believe it, or the agents: their commission is paid by the seller, not the buyer, and the property publications are paid by the agents (who the editors obviously cannot risk upsetting if they want to remain in business). Drive around when you come, and see for yourself. Make an offer (start at around 60% of the asking price at most) and see what happens.

There are LOADS of new condos going up -- a glut of properties at the low end, and a handful at the high end (although many of these are overpriced for no reason).

For top end property (new build), the seller will generally not budge on price, but they will for low end condos. I have a friend who bought a discounted flat at View Talay 5D, for example, from View Talay. Shining Star will certainly need to discount once the structural flaws begin to show again (identical Y-shaped crack on every balcony).

The Residence is *driving* distance to Jomtien beach, so if you are going to buy a car, no problem. If you are going to be that far from the beach (and have no pleasant view at all), you might just as well consider moving a bit further afield and buying a nice home in the country.

View Talay Residence is completely charmless, and facing onto what will be Jomtien 2nd Road -- so it will be quite noisy and polluted.

The Paradise Residence offer a very reasonable price per square meter -- let me know when you are here and I will give you their address. I doubt if there are any sea view flats left, but it is a short walk to the beach. The developer also developed Paradise Villas, and now has some town houses in a leafy neighbourhood the other side of Sukhumvit selling for about 1.2 million baht (Happy Place -- terrible name, but the town houses are quite nice).

[colmx]

Hi All
Sorry to keep dragging this topic up... But i keep "discovering" new condo developments(or at least new to me)

On My last trip we stayed in Chantong Place Hotel...When there I noticed a new development being built opposite the Junction of Soi Yensabai and Soi 17. My geography is kinda skrtchy - but i reckon this development is almost behind friendship supermarket on South Pattaya... Wasn't sure if it was a hotel or condo development at first...

Thanks to this link:
http://www.apatpro.com/index.php?option ... ealty=user (http://www.apatpro.com/index.php?option=com_cmsrealty&Itemid=28&action=listingview&listingID=32&cmsrealty=user)

I now know this place is VCC condotel
(Edit: Strangely it also appears to be known as MyView Condo - but MyView also seems to be on Soi Bunkot - Confusing! :drunken: )

Just wondering if anybody has been to visit first hand and has any opinions?

Personally i think location is great - at least 15 years newer than Yensabai condo or centre condo and in a similar enough location - but without the building aging issues

Also nice and close to the Birdcage!

Anybody any opinions? Thanks in Advance to everyone who has take their time to respond to this thread...

There are LOADS of new condos going up -- a glut of properties at the low end, and a handful at the high end (although many of these are overpriced for no reason)

I keep "discovering" new condo developments(or at least new to me)