Visa rules will be tightened to stop abuse

[rincondog]

This came from Bangkok Post on Internet:

Maximum stay of 90 days for foreigners

By Chatrudee Theparat

Visa-on-arrival (VOA) regulations will be tightened for nationals of 41 countries to prevent abuse of the privilege and curb the rising number of illegal entries, according to the Immigration Police Bureau (IPB). Foreign nationals from those countries, including the US, China and India, will be able to stay longer but with fewer chances of renewing the VOA.

IPB commissioner Suwat Tumrongsiskul said nationals from those specific countries are currently allowed to remain in Thailand for 15 days maximum after the VOA is granted. The VOA is normally renewable once.

However, some foreigners including tourists ''tiptoe around the law'' by resorting to so-called visa runs to extend their stay. Most take a bus to a border, check out of the country and then return the same day to have the VOA renewed.

They repeat the practice as many times as they wish, affording them almost unlimited stay in the country. The policy is largely intended to serve tourism.

Pol Lt-Gen Suwat said the change of the VOA rules is in order.

In future, foreigners from those 41 countries will be able to stay in the country for 30 days from the first VOA stamp, which will be renewable twice at most, each time for a maximum of 30 days. In other words, a foreigner will be permitted to remain in Thailand for no longer than 90 days in total after three VOA stamps.

The commissioner said the current system is prone to abuse as many foreign nationals make numerous visa runs so they can stay on long term to do business. In some cases, they have gone unregulated, causing social problems.

Official figures showed that about 400,000 Chinese nationals were granted a VOA last year, and 18,000 of them have stayed behind.

Around 200,000 Indians made VOA visits last year and it was found that 16,000 of them have not left.

Pol Lt-Gen Suwat said the new VOA rules will be put into effect once approved by the Royal Thai Police Office.

He said more information technology will be employed in the blacklisting system. The IT-operated immigration clearance system is now in use at 15 out of 55 checkpoints nationwide to check in tourists and screen out undesirable individuals. The technology lets the bureau enlarge its database of foreign visitors to identify those on the blacklist and expel them.

Pol Col Ittipol Ittisarnronnachai, head of the Pattaya immigration centre, said its IT-operated database is shared by many hotels and resorts in Pattaya to help track down blacklisted people. The technology has been credited with weakening the local mafia network.

The Betong immigration centre in Yala is also using the system to trace people of dual nationality, some of whom are believed to be behind the southern strife.

Pol Lt-Gen Suwat said more authority to issue visas will be delegated to regional IPB offices.

At present, IPB chief inspectors are authorised to grant visas, and in future their deputies will also be able to approve visa requests

[wowpow]

This report seems very confusing and confused,

Essentially a Visa on Arrival is NOT a 30 day permission to visit Thailand for touristic purposes visa free which is granted to US citizens.

The VOA does NOT apply to citizens of the USA - the list of countries that it does is on Thai Visa. com (http://www.thaivisa.com/274.0.html)

The current VOA countries get only 15 days permission to visit Thailand so increasing that to 30 days would be welcomed. It seems that they then want to say they can do two visa runs before repeats are stopped.

As the author says the VOA and 30 day visitors may tip-toe round the law by making 'visa runs'. The point is that it is the law and only Parliament can change that- surely or can the Immigration Police?

I agree this is a very confusing article. I assume the reference to the US is simply a mistake.

As to the requirement for a change in the law, this would probably not be required. The existing rules for both Visa on arrival and the 30 day entry stamp state that the purpose of the visit must be for tourism only. If the immigration authorities have evidence that the intended visit is for anything other than just tourism, they could refuse entry. Multiple consecutive visits would almost certainly be evidence enough of this - UK and US immigration authorities turn people away on far weaker grounds than this, even when they have obtained visas in advance of their visit.

I am always aware that those of us who make monthly visa runs live on a knife edge. For the time being it suits the Thai authorities to turn a blind eye as it boosts tourism figures. But as neighbouring countries become richer and produce more tourists for Thailand, this attitude may change.

... I am always aware that those of us who make monthly visa runs live on a knife edge. For the time being it suits the Thai authorities to turn a blind eye as it boosts tourism figures. But as neighbouring countries become richer and produce more tourists for Thailand, this attitude may change.

Do you make a monthly visa run? If so why? I know it is possible to take a trip to Penang and get a tourist visa (or mulitple tourist visa) and have a stay in Thailand for 60 days, plus you can extend this at the Thai Immigration offices in Bangkok or Pattaya for a further 30 days. For just three days out of the country, you get to stay up to 90 days in Thailand and you avoid at least 2 visa runs. If you get a multiple tourist visa, you can stay 180 or 270 days in Thailand with just one/two trips to the border to renew.

Yes, I make the monthly visa runs because I live right on the Thai/laos border and it's cheaper than a two month tourist visa plus renewal. Also allows me to stock up on cheap but good quality wine!

But two month tourist visas are no less precarious than the 30 day entry stamps - more so, in fact. There have been many reports of people being refused tourist visas by particular Thai Embassies in the past - I was given a bit of a grilling over the number of stamps in my passport at the KL Embassy once myself.

Stickman offers some comments on impacts and solutions to the new visa policy.

www.stickmanbangkok.com/Weekly2006/weekly279.htm (http://www.stickmanbangkok.com/Weekly2006/weekly279.htm)

LMTU - As far as I know, people will still be able to get 1 year O visas in their home country, even under 50 - though Hull is a rather long visa run. Expensive too. But using an O visa (granted for visiting friends and relatives) to live in Thailand is just as much (or as little) an abuse as using 30 day entry stamps for this purpose. And one never knows whether it will be granted or renewed. My guess is that all visit visas will become hard to get for people with lots of stamps in their passport - at least until Thailand decides it needs to boost visitor numbers again.

This really has been a wake up call for me. Until a week ago I'd been planning to live in Thailand for the rest of my life. I have a reasonable supply of money and don't need to work, so could probably skirt round the current restrictions with only minor inconvenience until I reach 50. But I don't want to spend my retirement with the sword of Damocles hanging over my head. Foreigners have almost no legal protection in Thailand, however long they have legitimately lived here. They can be got rid of at a week's notice by the Government of the day, with no right of appeal. This simply isn't the case in most other countries, and certainly not in western countries. It may be harder to get in, but once you're there you have rights. And if you qualify for long-term residence, you will probably qualify for citizenship as well. Then you acquire exactly the same rights as the natives.

Some will be willing to take the risk and put faith in their visa being renewed each year. But there will be more scares and more crackdowns to come - whether these are to gain popular appeal for foreigner bashing, or to rid the country of individuals deemed to be a problem using methods that also catch many who are actually assets to the country. Even if one is not actually caught out by these, they will be a source of constant uncertainty. It's not so bad now - I'm rather enjoying making plans for where to spend my new life. But if I survive that long, I don't want to be forced to up-sticks when I'm 70 - and I don't want the worry that I may be forced to up-sticks when I'm 70 either. So I'll be heading somewhere that residents, whether citizens or not, have rights.

But I'll keep coming back for holidays.

You're right Justin.
Thats the way it is.
I think your decision is quite rational.
I decided to take the chance though, but thats not surprising because I have a high tolerance for risk.
If I get booted later on, I hope I still have it together enough to deal with it.