Reshape Your Next Holiday

[Dodger]

My past holidays were always bar-centric, focused on Boys – Bars – Beer, and I know how disappointed I’d be if any of these delights were kept from me. But what would I do if they were?

Arsenel made a great point in a recent post saying he plans to “Reshape” his next holiday to compensate for all the “unknowns” out there, which makes perfect sense to me.

Using arsenel’s concept of “Reshaping”…I’d definitely carve out alternative plans so I didn’t have to contend with all the “unknowns”. Planning for the worst (the bars being closed) I think finding a Boy Special (or two) to spend my time with versus playing the butterfly role would probably work best…either a past flame (or two), or a few new embers… whatever.

Bouncing around some of the islands, sipping Leo from a frosted mug on the porch of a seaside bungalow, finding private spots for small parties with friends, and of course enjoying sex, are all things that could be enjoyed without worrying 24/7 about Thailand’s ever-changing covid restrictions.

If the bars and gogo’s happened to be open, that would just be an added plus, but not something that would make or break my holiday.

Who knows, it could end up be the best holiday ever!

A special thinks to arsenal, AKA Asa Butterfield.

[arsenal]

Yep. Excellent post Dodger. I know many of you wouldn't consider riding a motor bike but I would urge you to reconsider. There are literally dozens and dozens of truly terrible 'tourist attractions' to visit very cheaply as well as quite a few hidden gems but really it's all about the journey. The destination is unimportant. Plus if you're not drinking the evening is never quite long enough...can always have a quick final shufty around one of the holy trinity, just to see if anyone new has turned up. Being sober and taking a boy back to your hotel at 0300 is a right thrill. A ride along Jomtien Beach Road at that time is pure heaven...message the folks back home and ask them what they're doing then sip an iced tea and be happy you're not there.

[Moses]

Use this and you will have attention of all boys :)

11759

[goji]

Yep. Excellent post Dodger. I know many of you wouldn't consider riding a motor bike but I would urge you to reconsider.

I normally don't touch a motorcycle, as my travel insurance USUALLY doesn't cover me as someone who doesn't hold a full British motorcycle license.

However, having read the T&C of my latest insurance policy, there's no such clause. The only exclusion is if I'm wearing no helmet AND riding a bike of over 100cc.
So I may well hire something for a while, to see how it goes. Carefully.

The only time I've actually used any form of motorcycle so far was in Bagan, Myanmar. Whilst travelling into the area, I'd already noted very little traffic and some of the tracks looked too sandy to be much fun on a mountain bike.

I hired an electric motorcycle for about $6 per day and those 3 days were amongst the best I've ever had sightseeing. It's the blue one.....

[Oliver2]

I don't forget my first ever visit to Jomtien, driven there by an apparently pubescent child who had yet to learn the meaning of fear. As a newbie, I hadn't learnt that the system operates in a strict order, so my choice- as I thought- of a large middle-aged driver, was not allowed. And I ended up with bloody Peter Pan.

The next day, I discovered the baht buses by the temple. Motor-cycles still don't appeal. Particularly Thai ones.

One a serious note, I recall one of the dancers at Throb, Song, whom I found both charming and cute, and of his fatal motor-cy accident on the way home from the show. Crossing Second road has its perils, but motor-cys......

[gerefan2]

Provided you avoid driving a motor bike Thai Style you won’t come to much harm. A few simple rules:

Drive it like you would at home (except if your home is Italy)!
Don’t drive it fast
Avoid Sukumvit...a real death trap
NEVER drive it even with only a single drink inside you.

There are many rewards having a bike.

[Old git]

Anyone looking for a new angle to their trip who hasn't tried before, could do worse than look up their nearest Hash House Harriers - subtitled: 'drinkers who have a walking (or running) problem'

Great fun and strictly non-competitive, but very non-PC.. - most hashes take place in late afternoon crashing through the jungle for an hour or so somewhere, followed by ample beer.

[Manforallseasons]

All things considered if you insist on visiting here during this rather unusual time keeping your expectations low and focusing on other than the obvious there is no reason your trip won’t be pleasurable.

[Manforallseasons]

As for a motorbike I’ve always had at least 1 and frankly I couldn’t do without 1, having said that any place will rent you one with or without a license as a fine is only 400 baht however should you be involved in an accident the local insurance won’t cover you for liability etc, and gogi you will find it difficult to rent 1 less than 110cc.

[goji]

you will find it difficult to rent 1 less than 110cc.

The exclusion is "9 Any Claim arising from using a two-wheeled motor vehicle as a driver or passenger if You are not wearing a crash helmet where the engine size of the two-wheeled motor vehicle exceeds 100cc"

So by my reading of that, to be excluded from cover I have to be riding without a helmet AND have over 100cc. So as long as wearing a helmet, even borrowing a road licensed bike off Valentino Rossi should be covered.

[Dodger]

I always rented a motorbike during holidays before buying one about 12 years ago. Like MFAS, I go everywhere on my bike and couldn't live without it over here.

Riding a motorbike will definitely expand the scope of your holiday, for the simple reason that it's so easy to get around that you'll end up going more places in a normal day.

Yesterday I drove from Bang Saray to Pattaya at sun-up for coffee with friends - then north to Naklua to pick up Vaccine passport - then brunch back at Taco Bell in Pattaya - then some shopping at Villa Market - then a short visit to Jomtien Complex - and arrived back in Bang Saray at 12 noon. Jai and I hopped on the bike later on for a drive to a beach restaurant - some last minute shopping at the local market - and back home again. This is to just to give you an idea of the ground you can cover, and different variety of things you can do in a single day..

To ride a motorcycle in Thailand, and remain strictly within the law, you must possess and produce: A national drivers license issued in your home country valid for a motorcycle, AND, An International Driving Permit, OR, a Thai motorbike drivers license. At least those were the requirements 2 years ago when my daughter visted Thailand and rented a motorbike. Check on-line to see if they've changed.

SOME HELPFUL HINTS:

NEVER drink and drive.
ALWAYS wear your helmut (I don't, but that's stupid)
NEVER leave valuables in the seat storage compartment unattended.
Drive slow, and always be aware of any/all moving objects around you.
ALWAYS use your turn signals (they don't)
Avoid driving after dark (you'll live longer)

[arsenal]

I don't agree with the after dark suggestion. Thats when all the boys come out to play. Hoeever I will add a few add ons. Most Thai drivers are quite normal and very well tuned in to the bike culture, after all careless driving is likely to see them go into a mother and child.

You'll get a puncture at some point. Worry not. Simply ride slowly in any direction and you'll come to a tyre place to get it fixed.

As Dodger says, ride as if you're in your own country and you'll be fine.

The motorcy taxi drivers are quite unpleasant on the road but then you knew that anyway.

The Easy Rider thread is not a novel. You dont fancy a bit of that? Really!!!

The boys think you're cooler if you have a bike, Fact. You can.let them drive as you give them a lift back to the bar after naughties and fondle their man bits as you go.

[dinagam]

I still haven't got a national drivers licence for motorcycle but that have not prevented me from renting and riding a motorbike whether in Cambodia, Laos or Thailand. I ride safely and with consideration for others, and riding during daylight to explore sites in a particular province. Never been stopped by the police, although once near the border between Loei Thailand and Laos, a policeman had a bemused look on his face when he saw me riding past without a rear number plate, probably guessing that the falang was on a rented bike. All in all I've rented motorbikes in Kampot and Kratie in Cambodia, in Vientiane, Viangxai, and Savvanakhet in Laos, and in Pai, Maehongson, Loei, Khaoyai, Huahin, Kohsamui and a few more places in Thailand without encountering any problems and I've thoroughly enjoyed myself during those trips. And will continue to do so when another opportunity arises.

[Dodger]

......You can.let them drive as you give them a lift back to the bar after naughties and fondle their man bits as you go.

I got so drunk once at the old Hollywood Disco that I ended up fondling the motocy drivers man bits on the way home. When we came to a stop in front of my room he turned and smiled at me. He looked like a toothless Earnest Borgnine...LOL

[Manforallseasons]

Rarely will the shops that rent motorbikes offer insurance, even if they do it will be worth nothing if you don’t have some sort of motorbike license and if you are unlikely enough to be involved in an accident regardless of who’s fault as a foreigner it will be your fault.

[Armando]

And will continue to do so when another opportunity arises.
Would the lack of a local or international drivers' licence affect your ability to claim from your insurance policy in the event of an accident? Just curious.

[dinagam]

Would the lack of a local or international drivers' licence affect your ability to claim from your insurance policy in the event of an accident? Just curious.

I'm sure it does... Que será será.
But I must state that I drive like a mother superior; sober, prim and proper.

[Dodger]

If you don't have a valid license in the country where the accident happened, you're riding illegally and probably you're not covered by your insurance.

I’ve paid many bribes for minor driving violations, and it works like a charm, but if you get in an accident in Thailand without a license and insurance your fucked...and not by someone of your choosing.

Anyone who hasn’t rented a motorbike in Thailand before should read the link below:

https://www.worldnomads.com/travel-safety/southeast-asia/thailand/riding-motorbikes-in-thailand-what-are-the-rules

[goji]

Would the lack of a local or international drivers' licence affect your ability to claim from your insurance policy in the event of an accident? Just curious.

My International Drivers Permit cost £5.50 and took about 10 minutes in a post office.
They stamped the motorcycle box and my UK License has provisional entitlement for a motorcycle.

Regarding the legality of then riding in Thailand, I presume it depends on what rules they have for learners ? I would be interested to hear about that.

I actually got the IDP for car hire & only after reading the small print on my insurance am I considering motorcycle hire.

[Nirish guy]

My International Drivers Permit cost £5.50 and took about 10 minutes in a post office. They stamped the motorcycle box and my UK License has provisional entitlement for a motorcycle..

SO, basically you weren't covered then either to drive in Thailand nor insured . ok. So basically your licence was just about enough to get past a police check point, if lucky without having to pay a bribe as every Thai policeman now knows that your (UK/ home country) licence MUST have you already having passed your motorcycle test, a provisional licence doesn't count and from experience if they're in the mood they'll happily bring that up if there's a need for a few baht for you for their tea fund.

We need to accept that if no full home country licence exists we are all driving illegally, thats it, end of - then accept that fact and dont do it OR ( as most of us do including myself) carry on and accept the risks of minor and major costs should we find ourselves in an accident.

When you think about it that IS nuts and most of us wouldn't dream of doing that at home, but hey when the sun sea and boys kicks in sure all sense goes out the windows anyway with most of us in most regards anyway so no real difference there then......:)

[goji]

SO, basically you weren't covered then either to drive in Thailand nor insured .

1 This should be future tense, as I've neither driven a car nor hired a motorcycle in Thailand (so far).
The electric motorcycle was in Myanmar. Mostly off road, but quite possibly illegal.

2 Checking what I can do in the UK, with my provisional entitlement:

"Car driving test passed before 1 February 2001
You can ride a moped (max 50cc) without L plates.
If you want to ride a motorcycle over 50cc and up to 125cc, you will need to take CBT.
Once you have a valid CBT certificate, you can ride a 125cc with L plates.
If you want to remove the L plates or ride a more powerful machine, you will need to take the relevant practical tests."

So I need a CBT certificate (Compulsory Basic Training) in order to legally ride a bike in the UK. I think there might be a 2 year limit on that.

Now, if I got that certificate, I'm legal to ride in the UK with L plates. I don't have it yet, but there are plenty of providers near me & I guess it could be done before the next trip. If it makes any difference.

The next question is once I can legally ride a bike in the UK, is this also legal in Thailand ?
ie What are Thai rules for overseas provisional licenses ?
I suspect this is going to fall somewhere between not properly defined anywhere and not legal. So no point in rushing out to get UK CBT before the next trip. [google is not helpful on this topic]

I also had a quick look at getting a Thai motorcycle license, however, that starts off with a "proof of residency" requirement. Also takes quite a few weeks.

I CAN legally ride a 50cc moped with my UK license, but a quick look on google doesn't show anyone renting such things out in Thailand.

So it looks like it may be advisable to stick with fully legal car hire, for short periods during the trip.

[Dodger]

1 This should be future tense, as I've neither driven a car nor hired a motorcycle in Thailand (so far).
The electric motorcycle was in Myanmar. Mostly off road, but quite possibly illegal.

2 Checking what I can do in the UK, with my provisional entitlement:

"Car driving test passed before 1 February 2001
You can ride a moped (max 50cc) without L plates.
If you want to ride a motorcycle over 50cc and up to 125cc, you will need to take CBT.
Once you have a valid CBT certificate, you can ride a 125cc with L plates.
If you want to remove the L plates or ride a more powerful machine, you will need to take the relevant practical tests."

So I need a CBT certificate (Compulsory Basic Training) in order to legally ride a bike in the UK. I think there might be a 2 year limit on that.

Now, if I got that certificate, I'm legal to ride in the UK with L plates. I don't have it yet, but there are plenty of providers near me & I guess it could be done before the next trip. If it makes any difference.

The next question is once I can legally ride a bike in the UK, is this also legal in Thailand ?
ie What are Thai rules for overseas provisional licenses ?
I suspect this is going to fall somewhere between not properly defined anywhere and not legal. So no point in rushing out to get UK CBT before the next trip. [google is not helpful on this topic]

I also had a quick look at getting a Thai motorcycle license, however, that starts off with a "proof of residency" requirement. Also takes quite a few weeks.

I CAN legally ride a 50cc moped with my UK license, but a quick look on google doesn't show anyone renting such things out in Thailand.

So it looks like it may be advisable to stick with fully legal car hire, for short periods during the trip.

Sounds waaaaaaaay too confusing in the UK.

It sounds like you're trying to get a license to fly a NASA Space Vehicle to Mars.

[gerefan2]

When you get stopped by police the following happens:
1. Hand over your UK Licence and International Driving Permit.
2. He probably will not speak English, let alone read it. He will have no real idea what he is looking at. He certainly will not know about a CBT,!
3. Hand over small “gift” if you have broken the law. If a regular stop just sit and let him look at it.
4. You will be on your way in minutes.

After a few days you will know where the check points are and it is easy to avoid them. They are always in the same place.

The boys have an app that shows which check points are active and where they are. They sometimes check before leaving a bar.

Regarding insurance...if you fall off and are unfortunate enough to damage yourself how is the insurance company to know you didn’t trip over the pavement, the stairs, or any other similar accident?!

Get on your bike!

[Manforallseasons]

Regarding insurance...if you fall off and are unfortunate enough to damage yourself how is the insurance company to know you didn’t trip over the pavement, the stairs, or any other similar accident?!

Get on your bike!

What happens if you hit another or are hit by a motorbike or car or if you hit a pedestrian?
1.You are fucked

[gerefan2]

What happens if you hit another or are hit by a motorbike or car or if you hit a pedestrian?
1.You are fucked

Agreed...but I did carefully say “if you fall off” which in my experience is far more likely!

[goji]

After reading earlier posts, I've re-checked the insurance policy.

The exclusion clause that probably invalidates cover is:
"15 Any Claim arising from You being involved in any criminal act"

Incidentally, I guess that clause also invalidates cover if anyone has a heart attack whilst ****ing a prostitute, since prostitution is illegal in Thailand.
Having lectured me earlier, I'm sure N Irish has never broken the law here either. :mocking_mini:

[arsenal]

I have to disagree with much of the above.

I've never been stopped by a policeman who didn't speak pretty good English.

The checkpoints move about.

As it stands your standard IDP allows you to drive a minibus full of schoolchildren on the motorway but not a 125cc Honda Click to Carrefour. Go figure.

I've never been asked for money by a policeman if I wasn't going anything wrong and by wrong I mean no helmet. I always insist on a ticket and go to the station to pay it. Why reward the guy who stops you.

I got stopped at midnight once for not wearing a helmet and the policeman soo wanted me to give him the money. I refused and he reluctantly wrote out a ticket. One, it was not an official helmet checkpoint...they stop at about 11.00pm. Two, next time he sees me he won't bother.

After 11.00pm it's only drink driving they're interested in.

[Oliver2]

I've never rented a motor-cy but i can understand why some people like them.

For fifteen or so years, i hired a car for my travels in northern and southern Thailand. I found that the scenic roads and lack of traffic were a delight. Despite taking out enhanced insurance, I was aware that the implications of being involved in an accident, particularly if a resident was hurt, were serious.

I did the same in Bali twice when I visited alone back in the 90s. Lonely Planet had warned that any accident would probably involve a night in a cell while financial matters were attended to. I was younger and braver then.

In Thailand we now use taxis. This is at the behest of P who fusses about what would happen if we were in an accident so much that he has worn me down.

Like others, I miss the freedom and independence of self-drive and have never felt nervous about driving. I find the standards, at least in rural areas, perfectly safe.

As for The Fuzz, only once have we been stopped; this was at a permanent checkpoint north of Chiang Rai on the Golden Triangle Road. P was was given a pee test while I was allowed to sit in the car, fretting. He didn't care.

[Nirish guy]

When you get stopped by police the following happens:
1. Hand over your UK Licence and International Driving Permit. 2. He probably will not speak English, let alone read it. He will have no real idea what he is looking at. He certainly will not know about a CBT,! !

Sorry but that wasn't my experience - i fact it was the exact opposite - the policeman who pulled me for no helmet outside Tok com knew EXACTLY about the CBT requirement and UK citizens being required to have to have a full UK bike licence and international licence ( I had the second part but not the first) and he was also able to point out to me how that licence addition would have been shown via a motorbike pic on the back of my licence and he pointed out how mine WASNT there.

So it was him who actually informed ME of all of that as until that moment I genuinely wasn't aware of it all at the time (quite thankfully) as because of that I argued so strongly with him that he just rolled his eyes gave up - but I KNEW instantly he knew what he was talking about and had given up more just as he couldn't be bothered arguing with me more than anything else I suspect and he'd already got his helmet "fine" from me anyhow by that point.

So we shouldn't always assume the average Thai policeman is just green as we first think perhaps and I'm guessing that if HE knew that info then that same info must have had been passed around their various police tea rooms so others could benefit from using it when needed.

Just on Olivers comment re Bali I can confirm the police work EXACTLY the same "fine" system as the pattaya police when they can too.

[arsenal]

In addition to the above.

Previously the plods would keep the licence and you'd go and pay it at the station, either there and then or the next day. The 400 baht never bothers me.

But the last time there was none of that, they kept the bike and I had to trunk off to plodville on the back of a taxi, pay the fine and then trunk back again. Both taxi riders wete fat and not sexy. Next time I'm sticking 400 baht in the inside cover of the licence and replacing as required.

[daydreamer]

Just on Olivers comment re Bali I can confirm the police work EXACTLY the same "fine" system as the pattaya police when they can too.

I've rented cars many times in Thailand, and a few times in Bali. The Thai BIB could learn a couple tricks from the Indonesian police in Bali.

I was driving in Kuta Beach a few years back, crawling along in traffic, and a cop jumped off the curb and stopped me. He asked me why I didn't stop for the traffic light. The light was mounted on a pole about 10' high at the curb, and his partner would stand under the traffic light, and pull a tree branch down over the light, and wait for a tourist to "not see" the traffic light. Sure enough, the following day, I passed the same area, and the same cop was standing there with the tree branch pulled down, waiting for the light to turn red, so he could let the branch go, and catch another unsuspecting tourist.

[christianpfc]

My past holidays were always bar-centric, focused on Boys – Bars – Beer, and I know how disappointed I’d be if any of these delights were kept from me. But what would I do if they were?
My holidays center around the 3 B, but in my cases it's Boys, Buddha (temples) and Boulders (rocks and mountains). I like to go to bars to look at boys in underwear, but I'm not reliant on bars to get boys. I find most of my encounters online. I don't drink.

I would not have to reshape my holidays if the current conditions (no bars, no alcohol) stay in place. But the travel restrictions between provinces would be very annoying for me.


Being sober and taking a boy back to your hotel at 0300 is a right thrill.
I value a good sleep more than sex at ungodly hours. I have a rule "no sex after midnight". But other people have different sleep-wake patterns.

The only thing I drive is a bicycle in Germany. On trips, if there is a taxi, I prefer that over a motorbike. I value comfort and safety over speed and lower price.

In Thailand, for places I want to go to but no public transport, I rent a car with driver which averages at 1000 THB for a daytrip (8 hours) of 100 km, which is reasonable and I don't have to watch traffic, navigate, parking and so on, and I can use the time to read or watch out of the window (while my driver is watching the road and traffic), well worth the money.

There are places that are inaccessible by car, but can be reached by mocy. One of these places is a mountain in Phrae province. From car parking it's about 5 km, which cost 250 THB by mocy and took 50 minutes. It was an uncomfortable, bumpy, noisy ride. When I went again to same place, with the knowledge what an awful ride it was and now knowing the way, I choose to walk instead, 1 hour 10 minutes. There is a saying in German "Besser gut gelaufen als schlecht gefahren" - "A pleasant walk is better than a bumpy ride".

Out of about 20,000 traffic death in Thailand every year, most of them mocy drivers.

[Dodger]

It would be great if Members who are coming to Thailand (or, have already arrived) could post Trip Reports during their visits.

This would be very helpful to those planning to venture the waters during the high season, especially any details related to how your holiday has been reshaped during a time when they're still some restrictions in place.

vnman's report detailing his arrival at Suvarnabhumi a few days ago was extremely helpful, but after his rendezvous with a boy who he summoned to meet him from Pattaya we haven't heard a peep from him. One would assume that's a very good sign...LOL

[a447]

....we haven't heard a peep from him. One would assume that's a very good sign...LOL

He's probably cuddling up to a hot young guy in bed, weighing up whether to write a trip report for us or to get started with round three.

Decisions, decisions!