I'm sure a reminder isn't really necessary...

Do take care.

I learned yesterday that a guy that worked as a Masseur at deleted maybe 3 or 4 years ago and who has since worked at deleted found out he was HIV+ at the beginning of the week.

He was still working as a Masseur in Bangkok until last week and showed no outward symptoms.

Jon

Jon,

Why are you posting this?

[Dboy]

I think Jon doesn't want us to die. Keep your Patriot Missles safe !

Dboy

The reminder is always play safe, many will get angry at me now, but I can't see why he should not continue to work as a masseur because his is HIV+. If he only give ordinary massage then no problem. If he gives sex massage then----- well you cant dance a tango alone, and in Thailand and all over the world you never know with whom you are dancing with if it is a quick intercourse. It is up to you/us as the costumers to take care at our self and the guys we are together with.

[allieb]

Actually Kun Jon is just reminding us of what's out there, We all need a kick up the arse from time to time. It's so easy to drop our guard with someone we feel is special and after a few gin and tonics and a fabulous night out as I did with my bf of three years and found out later he had been HIV for 2 years. Love is blind. I was ok after my test but others may not be as lucky as me.

As Mrs Thatcher said after a massive Aids campaign in the UK during the late 80s "Everybody knows the risk. Now the choice is yours." If you get HIV its your own fault

Unfortunately Thailand is rife with HIV and a gentle reminder from our sisters is not a bad thing. There is no reason why the boy shouldn't keep working as a massure and if we keep heeding the reminders of people like Khun Jon then we will al be ok

By the way I have been in touch with my ex bf. Having steped back for a while and thought things over, I told him I will still be his friend and offer any assistance I can with his problems of having HIV. Any body who isn't familliar with my story it was posted under "My boyfriend is HIV and didn't tell me"

allieb I can only agree with you 100%

One of the reasons I drop by this Forum only occasionally and contribute even less is the self-righteous, priggish tone adopted by so many, as evidenced above. I've always thought "There but for the grace of God" is a better rule of thumb.

[Aunty]

One of the reasons I drop by this Forum only occasionally and contribute even less is the self-righteous, priggish tone adopted by so many, as evidenced above. I've always thought "There but for the grace of God" is a better rule of thumb.

Why really???? Well that's the kettle calling the pot black if I ever saw it!


Aprrox. 25% of male sex workers in Thailand are HIV+. That's 1 in 4. Sleep with five guys who are sex workers in Thailand and the chances are you've slept with somebody who is HIV+. If you practice safe sex when doing so, then the chances of becoming infected are small. If you don't want to get infected at all then don't have sex with them. But a massage and a happy ending is perfectly safe.

[wowpow]

Aunty advises abstinence? Curious is curious!

Statistics and how to interpret. 75% of male sex workers in Thailand are HIV negative so, on average you could sleep with 75 before you find one with HIV+. I think I remember a report that concluded that 1 in 4 were positive. When I looked at the methodology it looked very fragile and a low base number of interviewees. Sticky Rice's recent release states 28% from the MSM organisation see http://www.sawatdee-gay-thailand.com/fo ... 7122#87122 (http://www.sawatdee-gay-thailand.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=87122#87122)

Sexworker's who are HIV+ is a wierd situation. I used to regularly and safely see a gorgeous guy in London and we become friends and used to go out together to museums etc.. When told me that he had become HIV+ and I could never go and see him again. He swore blind that he had only had unsafe sex once in the previous 3 months and he had told that guy who had tested negative! Somehow, in my head at least, there is a wide difference between a worker likely to be HIV+ and one who definitely is.

One hopes that Khun Jon is educated on being HIV+ and safe sex and insist that his customers play safe.

75% of male sex workers in Thailand are HIV negative so, on average you could sleep with 75 before you find one with HIV+. Huh?

One hopes that Khun Jon is educated on being HIV+ and safe sex and insist that his customers play safe.

As my boyfriend is HIV+ I'm very well aware of safe sex thanks. I also don't frequent the Bangkok Massage places myself as I don't stay in Bangkok these days but I do have contacts with some of the guys.

... Aprrox. 25% of male sex workers in Thailand are HIV+. That's 1 in 4. Sleep with five guys who are sex workers in Thailand and the chances are you've slept with somebody who is HIV+. If you practice safe sex when doing so, then the chances of becoming infected are small. If you don't want to get infected at all then don't have sex with them. But a massage and a happy ending is perfectly safe.

Actually, sleeping with such a small number as five guys (five is small if you are 'butterfly') does not mean that the chances are you have slept with someone who is HIV+. The odds of sleeping with someone HIV+ on your first time with a gogo guy are one in four, the chances of sleeping with someone HIV+ remain a one in four chance whether it is your 2nd, 3rd, 4th or 5th guy, the odds do not change (unless of course you are going through the entire boy population of Pattaya). The fact is that you may never sleep with a HIV+ guy or all the guys you sleep with may be HIV+. Aunty's point of practicing safe sex is valid, no matter who you sleep with.

Bottem line...

Dont just pack it, wear your jacket.

[UncleSam]

the jon who started this stupid post, singling out one thai guy among hundreds working in the sex trade for being HIV+

...or the whiz who calculates that:

If 75% of male sex workers in Thailand are HIV negative so, on average you could sleep with 75 before you find one with HIV+.

hehehehe............

I'm not sure who is dumber, the jon who started this stupid post, singling out one thai guy among hundreds working in the sex trade for being HIV+

If you think the post is stupid then don't add to it you Prat. Gees the idiots you get on this board.

Kun Jon,

I know from your previous posts that you must be a kind, caring individual, so my comments are not meant to тАШflameтАЩ, but maybe these thoughts will explain why I and many others think your post was ill-conceived.

Why give the name of the establishments at which this guy worked? Was it pertinent? Should one exercise any greater caution there than any of the other massage places? I donтАЩt think so. Really serves no purpose to name the establishment.

But naming the places he worked is potentially very harmful to this individual. You have given his resume. Maybe a current or former employer or fellow coworker can identify him now. You have provided the means for someone to know his personal medical status. No, you didn't name his name, but you provided enough info that people who know him can figure it out. Shame.

For this reason I ask the Moderators to delete this entire thread. It is not the business of this public board to violate individual ThaiтАЩs medical privacy.

[Davey612]

I agree with SF Farang. It is a given that we encounter HIV+ all the time. We take a calculated risk everytime we have sex with someone whose status is unknown. Hence safe sex.

But what is not fine is the way exemplified by the OP. Warn us of a specific potential "alleged" person who is positive. But usually directed at "them." That is, the guys who are providing the service. If we are going to use this board to warn of people whom we think are positive, shall we also start issuing warnings to the Thai guys about the arrival of "description of farang, using so and so flight number, staying at so and so hotel" and please be warned that he is hiv+? Maybe in the world of Kun John that is ok. Am I right, Kun John?

I agree with SF farang, Kun Jon, as we know from his past posts is a caring individual and probably only meant well with this post. Naming individuals isn't the right way to go about things as no one actually knows who reads this forum or if at all the original information that was given to Jon is true!
Safety is up to the individual, and passing around the details of this person is not ethical so I too would suggest politely that the moderator removes this post.

[

Statistics and how to interpret. 75% of male sex workers in Thailand are HIV negative so, on average you could sleep with 75 before you find one with HIV+. ]

By that odd reasoning, it also should mean that if you can sleep with 75 guys before you find one with HIV+, chances are the next 25 you sleep with will all be HIV+. Care to rethink this?

[Aunty]

As if there are 1 in 4,mate get fuckin real.....................

You wish you sick fuck! The only reason you're not dripping pus from your tiny cock is the tranny's that you plow in Thailand need to be blown up first!


Fatman you are technically right, but think of it this way. Let's say there is a jar that has 100 marbles in it. 75 are white and 25 are black. Now assuming they are randomly distributed within the jar, every time you reach in to take out a ball, you have a 1 in 4 chance of pulling out a black ball. Now while that odd never changes, (well actually it does but we won't go there) the probability of picking out a black ball increases every time you reach in. Now I haven't actually crunched the numbers to determine how many times you would need to reach in to make it almost certain that you would get a black ball but five times is probably getting pretty close. Of course it's possible to go 7 8 9 even 10 times without getting a black ball, but the probability of that happening is small and gets smaller the higher you go. Of course you can also reach in and pick out a black ball on your fist go, which is why, as I know you agree, it's important to always practice safe sex.

[allieb]

Boy George

You are a sick cancerous fuck. If you are not HIV already you deserve to be and people like you should die quickly Thailand is having its problems with HIV because of people like you. You have a choice to play safe. The Thai money boys are strugling to survive and take chances just to get the next meal on the table you inconsiderate sleeze bag

[catawampuscat]

is there no end to the tolerance of the moderators? why is this revolting troll allowed to continue? what does he have to say to run afoul of the
moderators? how about, if this old cat agrees to retire, if the troll and all his incarnations are permanently banned? a small price to pay.. what do you say? :cat:

The Thai money boys are strugling to survive and take chances just to get the next meal on the table you inconsiderate sleeze bag

Those very true words make the never ending stream of posters who complain about having to pay 1000 Baht to a boy for sex seem more pathetic than they already are!

...maybe he IS one of the moderators! Ewwwwwwwwww...........

[UncleSam]

It wouldn't be the first time here.

hehehehe........................

Let's say there is a jar that has 100 marbles in it. 75 are white and 25 are blackI fear Aunty has been plagiarising her own work from the learned journal she edits, Nuclear Physics for the Under Fives. The relevant entry is here - http://www.sawatdee-gay-thailand.com/fo ... .php?e=266 (http://www.sawatdee-gay-thailand.com/forum/weblog_entry.php?e=266)

[cuteboy]

I am a poor, sick ****. I deserve abuse, and the hate of the good people on the Board who think that it is a good idea to have sex with someone who is HIV+. Why, because I do not.
I would not knowingly do it.
An occasional point made before is that many bars give their workers health checks at intervals. I had assumed that they did this to provide medical advice should it be needed and to have them stop working if they proved to be HIV+.
Taking precautions is neither here nor there to the argument. I would like bars to withdraw boys who are known to be positive and thought that they did.
Of course there is a risk if you have sex with a sex worker, but I see no reason to increase that risk.
'The poor boys are there to earn a crust'...I read. The poor boys have made a career decision. For every boy who decides on this one 20 decide on another. Each must earn a crust. I assume you take a boy with a huge scar on his face, who appears to be diseased, or who is just plain ugly because the poor boy needs to earn a crust.
The shrieks are of cant and hypocrisy.
In fact I am surprised that you allow yourself any choice of boy at all. One should clearly be chosen for you as you enter the bar.
No, I suspect that you would like to choose. And you can choose on whatever basis you like, as long as it is not on the basis of HIV status.
Daft f***** nasty c*****, yes that's me.
Fortunately not as intellectually challenged as the nonsense in several posts above.

I am a poor, sick ****. I deserve abuse, and the hate of the good people on the Board who think that it is a good idea to have sex with someone who is HIV+. Why, because I do not.
I would not knowingly do it.... Taking precautions is neither here nor there to the argument. I would like bars to withdraw boys who are known to be positive and thought that they did.

Fortunately not as intellectually challenged as the nonsense in several posts above.

Cuteboy,

I quickly looked through the previous posts in this thread and failed to see anyone advocating that you (or anybody else) have sex with someone HIV+. You certainly have the right not to knowingly have sex with an HIV+ person; itтАЩs your choice. So thatтАЩs something we agree on.

But of course your real point is that all the whores in the world should be tested for HIV, identified, and removed from working as sex workers, so that you may have the unfettered right to walk into any whorehouse and engage services without risk of sleeping with someone HIV+. And to that end, you support publicly identifying boys who are positive, and you take issue with those of us who said itтАЩs wrong to do so.

You know, testing all the whores in the world will be fairly expensive. And it shouldnтАЩt just be the whores; all gays should be tested, too, right? Otherwise, how do you know someone might not end up in your bed some night?

WhoтАЩs going to pay for that testing? You? Here's a far cheaper solution that achieves the same goal (e.g., Cuteboy does not have to sleep with any HIV+ person, ever). In fact, this will guarantee that you will never catch HIV: Cuteboy stays out of the whorehouses and leads a life of celibacy. But thatтАЩs no fun, right?

Clearly you have a great fear of catching HIV. I have 2 friends who have been in a relationship now for 10 years; one is +, the other is -. ItтАЩs been that way since the beginning of their relationship. Shows what faithful adherence to safe sex can do. But, hey, better to ruin the lives of thousands than to inconvenience Cuteboy with the need to exercise a little personal responsibility, right?

I continue to find it mind-boggling that some people, in the middle of a sexually-transmitted epidemic like AIDS, continue to think the world should be geared towards making it completely safe for them to buy sex, no matter the social impact or cost to others.

And I continue to find it depressing how many gay people on this board take such selfish, unenlightened, and downright mean positions on issues like privacy and compassion that - not so many years ago - used to bind our community, not divide it.

Yes maybe not such a good idea making a pariah out of one guy. But the warning is a good one, in a general sense, especially where there are perhaps frustrated elderly northern European gays out there, looking to cash in on a frenzy of cheap available sex with Thai rent boys.

I recommend everyone getting a small fully colour illustrated booklet of sexually transmitted diseases, and putting it by their bedsides in place of the bible, and when temptation reaches it's ugliest climax, turn to it's pages for solace and guidance, at least you will know what to avoid.
This includes anyone wearing too much foundation cream, it could conceal lesions and bruising. Rather take such merchandise and treat to a slap up dinner, of fresh vegetables especialy garlic and easily digested protein like fish, good for you and good for me. Another thing to avoid in order to be completely safe, is bodily secretions, blood and faeces. If this means he has to fuck your arm-pit senselessly then so be it. And always always wear a condom, you don't want to spread your own little package of surprises to his arm-pit.

First and foremost, enjoy Thailand, it's wonderful people, rich culture, fabulous food and thrilling settings, and you will be rewarded with memories that will last a life time.