The pros and cons of using a VPN

[goji]

I see he's also promoting a VPN service, that'll certainly be of interest to at least one of our members I guess so they can ensure that they're getting the best possible price from their existing VPN service provider eh Stevie ?! :)

Now there's a point. Does FrequentFiveHandles need one VPN network for each handle to cover tracks ?
[One suspects it's more than 5 handles]

I've personally never bothered with VPNs, on the basis that I EITHER have to pay for a service I don't actually need OR have to use a potentially dodgy free provider, which presumably negates any security benefits.
However, when certain sites are blocked in Thailand, I'm not entirely against the idea.

[mr giggles]

Actually, I think you meant to say "5 of them" i.e., Stevieclueless, wingnut, mr. giggles, frequent, argosy.

I don't mean to freak you out or anything Stevie, but there's actually 5 of you.

Prove it or Shut Up

[Nirish guy]

Ahh that old chestnut......." prove that I'm using multiple VPN's to log onto the board using all my different handles" which by the very nature of VPN's you know full well of course that people cant ( easily) do........what a classic conundrum eh.

Well as Moses' super duper NASA grade software can't spot that ( or at least is set to ignore it in your case perhaps) that would then prove to be difficult as you well know, but just as long as you know that WE know, I'm guessing that's good enough for most people and you can carry on with your weird little pastime there to your hearts content it seems now.

[Nirish guy]

Oh no, just the one is service is fine for him I'm sure - well for this board as I'm guessing he's also doing the same on many other boards too as people like "that" always seem to do, then he can simply log on using the one VPN setting it as showing from a new "location" thus masking his REAL IP address etc each time ( thus beating the Nasa Super computer etc etc) and then just log on in under one the many MANY user names all stored - my good he better not lose his password lists or he's SCREWED eh :).

You'd wonder where someone gets the time never mind the energy or will to bother with such a pastime, but as my dear mother always says "there's nowt as queer as folk".

[goji]

Oh no, just the one is service is fine for him I'm sure - well for this board as I'm guessing he's also doing the same on many other boards too as people like "that" always seem to do, then he can simply log on using the one VPN setting it as showing from a new "location" thus masking his REAL IP address etc each time ( thus beating the Nasa Super computer etc etc) and then just log on in under one the many MANY user names all stored - my good he better not lose his password lists or he's SCREWED eh :).


Right. So most of the genuine members would have a fixed IP and location, whilst the multi-handled trolls would have it continuously changing ?
I'd have thought the FSB ought to be able to detect that & then do some surgery.
Then once the cancer has gone, we might just get more genuine members posting real content & outbreaks of civilized discussion.

[Nirish guy]

Right. So most of the genuine members would have a fixed IP and location, whilst the multi-handled trolls would have it continuously changing ?

Correct. When you're at home etc your computer / connection shows one fixed Ip address and that's generally what Software looks out for when making it's checks ( amongst a few other things too). But when once you chose to click to log on using your VPN service it will then auto select a random country for you to to be "seen" to be logging on from, or if you prefer you can select the country ( using the same one each time perhaps) to again appear to suggest that you are actually logging on from there. But most super duper NASA grade software these days can quite easily identify that you are logging on using a VPN service ( not that there's anything wrong with that in general assuming thats being done for legitimate reasons of course)


[QUOTE=goji;276742] have thought the FSB ought to be able to detect that & then do some surgery.

I would imagine that the "detection" side of things has long since been "detected". The rest of your statement re any surgery or otherwise would presume an actual will or intent to do something / anything about that in general and as to why that might not be happening I guess one can only wonder and speculate for the possible reasons for that.......

[StevieWonders]

What a relief that’s all been sorted out NIrish.

[Nirish guy]

Feel free to add to it where necessary as I freely admit that siren I stopped travelling internationally my knowledge of current VPN services is at least a year out of date, whereas yours I would imagine is still right bang up there of course :-p :-)

[StevieWonders]

Feel free to add to it where necessary as I freely admit that siren I stopped travelling internationally my knowledge of current VPN services is at least a year out of date, whereas yours I would imagine is still right bang up there of course :-p :-)On the contrary I share goji’s views - I don’t use one.

[Nirish guy]

On the contrary I share goji’s views - I don’t use one.


What MORE than one, wow that must make it a very expensive hobby for you - oh well at least with the exchange rate improving just now that might help with that a bit for you eh :)

[Brad the Impala]

Perhaps Moses could comment on the above and put some members out of their misery............

[cdnmatt]

Why all the hate on VPNs? I don't use one for generally browsing such as this, but use them daily for work.

If you have an administration panel you don't want accessible on the internet, put it on a separate server instance, and setup VPN on said instance. This way, admin panel can only be accessed at for example http://10.0.2.16/ or whatever, and only after you've successfully authenticated to the VPN with a SSH key.

IP restrictions to login to servers is another one. If you're travelling lots, and your IP is constantly changing, having a secure VPN that always has the same IP address is a necessity, so you can keep server access restricted by IP.

I have clients in China and due to the firewall a VPN is a necessity for their team. I even developed out a really cool system for this, so there's only one proxy / VPN users need to connect to, but all requests are evenly distributed across thousands of proxies managed by admin in round robin fashion. For example, if someone visits a site with say 50 assets (CSS, images, et al), the server logs will show 50 different IP addresses for that single page load. It's quite cool. :)

Quit hating on VPNs, they're very useful.

[Moses]

Perhaps Moses could comment on the above and put some members out of their misery............

Sorry guys, I will not comment how exactly board software checks accounts. Than more I will say - then more easy for bad guy will be to create additional accounts.

[Nirish guy]

Why all the hate on VPNs? .

If you mean from me you wont find any hate in my post, I already stated I use them when travelling for several security reasons. The post wasn't about hate, merely that they' can be used to avoid the Nasa super computer / the great firewall of China etc etc.

[StevieWonders]

Perhaps Moses could comment on the above and put some members out of their misery............You will never convince conspiracy theorists by rational argument. That particular gang have little worthwhile to say so have to prove their self-importance some other way. If you look at their posting history for March an average of almost 20% of their posts are devoted to their conspiracy theory with Q himself easily surpassing that. Apparently they would rather wreck the Forum by their endless posts on the conspiracy they’ve “identified” than finding something relevant, topical or interesting to say.

[Brad the Impala]

Sorry guys, I will not comment how exactly board software checks accounts. Than more I will say - then more easy for bad guy will be to create additional accounts.

Thanks Moses, but I wasn't asking you to give the details of how the software works. However the repeated assertions by several posters that SW is using multiple identities simultaneously, in breach of the forum's rules, is worthy of response. Otherwise we are all just going to go round and round in circles indefinitely and the board is just going to become even more insular than it currently is!

As "the experts" allege that this multiple posting is facilitated by the use of VPNs it would clarify a little if you could just state whether, in the case in question, these are or are not being used? Or if the the same IP is used for the multiple posters referred to?

Presuming that the board software can detect this?

Of course it is possible that someone might want to use VPNs for another reason(like having previously been banned or needing to protect their identity for another reason), so the fact of their use does not necessarily lead to a conclusion of guilt. However the absence of their use(and of duplicate IPs) might help move the debate on to more productive topics.

[StevieWonders]

All a VPN does is provide a different IP address. No “duplicate-poster”-seeking software is going to rely on such a primitive mechanism. Neither Facebook nor Google rely on IP addresses to track people across the Internet and I don’t imagine what Moses deploys does so either.

[Dodger]

Prove it or Shut Up

No need to prove anything Stevie, because you've already done that for us.

"LIKES"
Stevieclueless, wingnut, mr. giggles, frequent, argosy.

[Moses]

Thanks Moses, but I wasn't asking you to give the details of how the software works. However the repeated assertions by several posters that SW is using multiple identities simultaneously, in breach of the forum's rules, is worthy of response. Otherwise we are all just going to go round and round in circles indefinitely and the board is just going to become even more insular than it currently is!

As "the experts" allege that this multiple posting is facilitated by the use of VPNs it would clarify a little if you could just state whether, in the case in question, these are or are not being used? Or if the the same IP is used for the multiple posters referred to?

Presuming that the board software can detect this?

Of course it is possible that someone might want to use VPNs for another reason(like having previously been banned or needing to protect their identity for another reason), so the fact of their use does not necessarily lead to a conclusion of guilt. However the absence of their use(and of duplicate IPs) might help move the debate on to more productive topics.

1. There are no users with the same IP on forum.
2. Forum's software will detect and ban users with the same IP unless it will be "instructed" to ignore specific users, for example I have 3 accounts here - my own and 2 for testing with different privileges.
3. Modern software don't use IPs for to detect clones. It may use for example motherboard's serial number, or license key of Windows/MacOS/Android or phone's/tab's memory's serial number and so on... mostly it based on "fingerprint" - set of serial numbers from motherboard + hard disk + memory + license key. Member who wishes to have clones will need different physical or virtual device for to create each clone then.

And word to all fans of conspiracy: please leave clone's detections to moderators and our software. It looks like a paranoia or bulling when some members runs by forums for to follow another one member and accuse him on cloning accounts after each his post. Please use red triangle instead and provide proof. Hint: "We know" isn't proof.

[mr giggles]

You'd wonder where someone gets the time never mind the energy or will to bother with such a pastime, but as my dear mother always says "there's nowt as queer as folk".

Loved, Queer as Folk. Preferred the British version to the US version.

[Dodger]

With all the computer genius's we have around here, no one can figure out how to handle a hydra???

Why am I not impressed.

Personally, I don't think the "hydra" in question should be banned at all, at least until more members start posting. It's too much fun raking him (the 5 of them) over the coals...LOL

[cdnmatt]

With all the people who talk as if they're computer genius's around here, no one can figure out how to handle a hydra???

Why am I not impressed.

1.) Moses is gas lighting everyone when he says he tracks by MAC addresses, Windows license keys, et al. He doesn't.

2.) It's basically impossible to protect against hydras. If someone wants to create multiple accounts, they'll do just that. Moses could even go as far as to require a valid and verified phone number from eahc user, and even that's quite easy to circumvent as you can buy phone numbers for $0.20/month nowadays.

[francois]

Personally, I don't think the "hydra" in question should be banned at all, at least until more members start posting. It's too much fun raking him (the 5 of them) over the coals...LOL

Stop feeding the troll, Dodger! Put him on Ignore and forget him as I have.

[Moses]

1.) Moses is gas lighting everyone when he says he tracks by MAC addresses, Windows license keys, et al. He doesn't.


Matt, for sure you can prove your words and you may quote me where "he says he tracks by MAC addresses, Windows license keys, et al. ? Again just bla-bla-bla? Pseudo-expert ?

[cdnmatt]

Matt, for sure you can prove your words and you may quote me where "he says he tracks by MAC addresses, Windows license keys, et al. ? Again just bla-bla-bla? Pseudo-expert ?

Previous page:


3. Modern software don't use IPs for to detect clones. It may use for example motherboard's serial number, or license key of Windows/MacOS/Android or phone's/tab's memory's serial number and so on... mostly it based on "fingerprint" - set of serial numbers from motherboard + hard disk + memory + license key. Member who wishes to have clones will need different physical or virtual device for to create each clone then.

That above quote used to have the phrase "I use" in it before you edited it.

Regardless, no, that's not how modern web sites track visitors, and I'm sure you know that. Don't make people think they're computer is giving out that much information to web sites, because it's not true, and I'm sure you know that.

[goji]

The real question isn't what technology people use to sustain multiple handles, but whether or not trolls should be booted off for taking the mickey.

If all that counts is number of posts, even with zero quality, then carry on as we are. In fact, why not expand it and create some bots with Artificial Stupidity to post even more hostile crap ?

Of course, I doubt going down that path creates much value, as any serious potential new members are likely to take one look and run away. So quality goes downhill, fewer new members arrive and the value of the franchise is reduced.

An alternative strategy might be to raise quality and delete about 8 handles. With a commitment to deleting any new handles as soon as the trolls reappear. In the short term, there might be a reduction in the number of posts, but in the long term it should work out.

[StevieWonders]

... taking the mickey.Matthew 12:30-32

[gerefan2]

Matthew 12:30-32

And




Generally I regard the practice of religion as a fantasy. Its believers insist on their particular reality and try to get others to share their fantasy of (generally) a Supreme Being and all that that entails..

[Moses]

Previous page:



That above quote used to have the phrase "I use" in it before you edited it.

Regardless, no, that's not how modern web sites track visitors, and I'm sure you know that. Don't make people think they're computer is giving out that much information to web sites, because it's not true, and I'm sure you know that.

You are liar. Unfortunately for you nothing may be deleted permanently at this forum. I do it for precaution for to put on correct place shameless liars like you are. Even your "deleted" post is saved in DB. Wanna see how it was? look here (picture below shows exactly my words quoted by you in 3 minutes after my posting< there is your now deleted text "What the hell are you even talking about? You know full well I'd read and respond to that, so why bother even saying it? You know full well it's BS." and quoted by you my text "3. Modern software don't use IPs for to detect clones. It may use for example motherboard's serial number, or license key of Windows/MacOS/Android or phone's/tab's memory's serial number and so on... mostly it based on "fingerprint" - set of serial numbers from motherboard + hard disk + memory + license key":

10982

So you are just primitive liar pretended something been deleted by me. Next time please stop to chat with imagine me in your head and just read my words. Or carefully listen your screen reader (I don't know what exactly you are doing).

So it isn't mine "gas lighting", it is your "gas farting", dear Matt...

[arsenal]

You can have all the NASA grade software, kitchen ware, Tupperware and evening wear you like but Inspector Arsenal of The Yard uses something far sharper. Coppers 'unch. Repeated phrases, the same foes, the same grammar quirks and just simple facts to get 'is man. I am absolutely certain that argosy/frequent/steviewonders/mrgiggles is the same poster and so in fact are you. If you're going to choose to allow Rain Man to bring his special needs behaviour here then the rest of us are going to react by milking the absurdity for all its worth.

Multiple handles, an insane desire to respond to EVERY post and do it first, a hatred of almost everything and everyone coupled with a longing to be thought of as clever and the most recent development, a stored file filled with members posts to use against them in future fights. NOT normal adult behaviour.

[StevieWonders]

Right on, Q

[Nirish guy]

Right on CUE

[StevieWonders]

And ...
the most recent development, a stored file filled with members posts to use against them in future fights.

[mr giggles]

Multiple handles, an insane desire to respond to EVERY post and do it first, a hatred of almost everything and everyone coupled with a longing to be thought of as clever and the most recent development, a stored file filled with members posts to use against them in future fights. NOT normal adult behaviour.

And when have I supposedly done those things?

[latintopxxx]

...this is all very tiresome...why cant we just be nice to one another...,

[arsenal]

Ipsa enim loquitur in testimonio.

[StevieWonders]

And when have I supposedly done those things? arsenal has told Moses (the Forum owner) to get right royally fucked; he has no intention of following his instructions:
And word to all fans of conspiracy: please leave clone's detections to moderators and our software. It looks like a paranoia or bulling when some members runs by forums for to follow another one member and accuse him on cloning accounts after each his post. Please use red triangle instead and provide proof. Hint: "We know" isn't proof.It will be interesting to see how that plays out.

[Dodger]

This is EXACTLY what a Troll lives for.

The more people he gets angry or upset - the better.
The more disruptive conflicts he creates - the better.
The more negative attention he gains - the better.
The more he feels in control - the better

The members only have 2 choices:

1) Put the Troll (and his hydras) on IGNORE
2) Roast him over an open fire every time he (or one of his hydras) opens his mouth.

Any new members signing on to the Forum should be informed that there's an active Troll communicating on the Forum, and give the new member the Trolls multiple handles so he's not caught off-guard in the event the Troll starts baiting him.

P.S. Moses and Matt, stop fighting. This is exactly what we don't need.

[cdnmatt]

P.S. Moses and Matt, stop fighting. This is exactly what we don't need.

But there is someone on the internet who is wrong. What's a guy supposed to do?

[StevieWonders]

But there is someone on the internet who is wrong. What's a guy supposed to do?”He who pays the piper ... “ is the general rule.

[Dodger]

But there is someone on the internet who is wrong. What's a guy supposed to do?

Realize that the person who is "right" has absolutely nothing to gain.

[arsenal]

frequent/steviewonders/argosy/mrgiggles wrote.

"arsenal has told Moses (the Forum owner) to get right royally fucked; he has no intention of following his instructions:"

Et tu Rain Man.

[Dodger]

Instructions for putting Member on "IGNORE LIST"

Curtesy of Moses:

Click on Trolls nickname
Click Trolls profile
Click "Put on Ignore List"
Click "Yes" when asked if you are sure you want to do this.

Repeat these steps for the Trolls Hydras (other nicknames).

[StevieWonders]

Et tu Rain ManIn Shakespeare's Julius Caesar the would-be dictator-for-life lies dying in the Roman Forum as the person he regarded as his best friend and ally withdraws the sword with which he (Brutus) has just delivered the final blow; Caesar utters the famous words "Et tu Brute", translated by, as I recall, the authors of 1066 And All That as "oh you brute!".

I'm deeply touched that the SGT Forum's wannabe dictator-for-life regards me as his best friend and ally and has marked it out by recalling those famous words from Shakespeare.

[arsenal]

"I'm deeply touched"

Yes. You are.

[Moses]

Deeply touched... hm... is it about fisting or only about fingering yet?

[arsenal]

Slightly unbalanced mentally.

https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/touched

[goji]

The members only have 2 choices:

1) Put the Troll (and his hydras) on IGNORE
2) Roast him over an open fire every time he (or one of his hydras) opens his mouth.

Any new members signing on to the Forum should be informed that there's an active Troll communicating on the Forum, and give the new member the Trolls multiple handles so he's not caught off-guard in the event the Troll starts baiting him.


Option #3 is for the members to quit and go to some place that's not over run by trolls. However, for now I'm settling for #1, combined with making damn sure I don't post any interesting stories that allow the troll(s) to figure out who I am.

There's a trade off with every board management decision. Uncontrolled trolling means more posts (by trolls) but far fewer people actually bothering to post anything interesting.


The alternative way to put people on Ignore is via the settings menu. Then paste each name in.

Argosy
cdnmatt
frequent
mr giggles
pong
StevieWonders
wingnut

[Dodger]

......However, for now I'm settling for #1.


Wow,...,,It's only been one day and I'm already in love with the "Ignore" option.


Flush!!!...hahahaha

[Surfcrest]

In a room with so few people it’s not so hard to know who’s who...whether they’re logged in or not. It’s not so much figuring out who a user is from the billions of other users around the planet, as it is to figure out who’s who from the few people using the site at any given time, with time stamps.

Surfcrest