A Working Boy's Nightmare

[Dodger]

The comments below focus primarily on “working boys”, with the acknowledgement that “working girls” are equally effected by the pandemic.

No one’s been able to accurately determine how many sex workers there are in Thailand, or the actual amount of revenue they generate. Reported estimates range anywhere from 300,000 to 1,000,000 sex workers. Havocscope, a research company that studies the black market, estimated the Thai sex trade (boys and girls) to be worth $6.4 billion a year, or about 3% of the country's gross domestic product prior to the covid pandemic.

As we all know, the majority of working boys in Pattaya were either employed at one of the venues in Boyztown, Sunee Plaza or Supertown (Jomtien Complex), worked independently as freelances, and/or sold their services on the gay dating apps. Most of the boys who worked the gay venues and/or freelance are now flat- broke, and even the “shining stars” on the dating apps have to be finding it difficult to earn enough money to even cover their room and board. Some of the boys are now homeless. Just from the naked-eye, most (not all) of the bar boys who are sticking it out in Pattaya seem to be str8-for-pay boys…with many being immigrants from Cambodia, Myanmar, and Laos.

Well over half of the working boys in Pattaya have left town in the past twelve months. Those remaining are huddled in rooms packed with other boys, sharing among each other to make ends meet, and praying that another lockdown doesn’t come into play which would almost certainly be the last nail in the coffin. Some of the boys have families to return to in rural areas if need be, but not all are this fortunate. Even when they do return home there is no guarantee that life will be any easier. Some boys come from extremely impoverished villages, where the money they send home to their families is sometimes the primary source of income.

Many of the unemployed working boys have migrated to on-line dating apps to sell their services, although are faced with the same dismal market conditions. Domestic demand for sexual services is alive and well, but with the overwhelming majority of revenue in the sex industry coming from international tourists, marketing ones services to a domestic audience during this pandemic is by-no-means a viable long-term solution.

The retired expats are making whatever contributions they can to keep the fires burning, but, unfortunately, most are on fixed budgets and spend more conservatively, coupled with the fact that many (not all), are seasoned veterans of LaLa Land and aren’t easily swayed into buying gold bracelets, farm tractors, and replacement water buffalos, which is the type of cash-flow that has always fueled this industry.

Most Thai sex workers are not eligible for the social protection measures included in the government’s stimulus package (as limited as that may be) while non-Thai sex workers don’t have access to any support. In short, when times are good, the sex workers contribute $6.4 billion to Thailand’s GDP and tea money is flowing upstream in healthy dosages, but when times are bad, the sex worker is left to survive on his own or simply perish. As cruel as this sounds, that’s the reality of the situation.

It’s impossible to fully assess the impact that the pandemic is having on the working boys, but, suffice it to say, they’re floating aimlessly farther and farther down the river without a paddle.

[cdnmatt]

Start a GoFundme called HTTH, and try to raise some funds.

Just don't mention HTTH = Help The Thai Hookers".

[StevieWonders]

It’s impossible to fully assess the impact that the pandemic is having on the working boys, but, suffice it to say, they’re floating aimlessly farther and farther down the river without a paddle. ...
Sir Desmond Glazebrook:
City's a funny place, you know, Prime Minister. If you spill the beans you open up a whole can of worms. I mean, how can you let sleeping dogs lie if you let the cat out of the bag? Bring in a new broom and if you're not very careful you find you've thrown the baby out with the bathwater. If you change horses in the middle of the stream, next thing you know you're up the creek without a paddle.

James Hacker:
And then the balloon goes up.

Sir Desmond Glazebrook:
Obviously. They hit you for six. An own goal in fact.

[Dodger]

Start a GoFundme called HTTH, and try to raise some funds.

Just don't mention HTTH = Help The Thai Hookers".

Not a bad idea, but not my area of expertise. I stick to direct donations.

What they need most now, is what we all need..."the vaccine".

[StevieWonders]

Start a GoFundme called HTTH, and try to raise some funds.

Just don't mention HTTH = Help The Thai Hookers".If anyone would care to Go Fund Me for the half-dozen boys I’m supporting please let me know. You’ll be Forever In My Prayers - hereafter to be known as “FIMP”.

[cdnmatt]

If anyone would care to Go Fund Me for the half-dozen boys I’m supporting please let me know. You’ll be Forever In My Prayers - hereafter to be known as “FIMP”.


Farang Impractically Metastasizing Pornography?

That doesn't make any sense.

[Manforallseasons]

Dodger nothing new here, what point are you trying to make?

[dinagam]

They should all go back to the village monasteries and enrol for a year or two as novice monks so as to repent for the sordid lives they got themselves into. Additionally a stint in the farms will rehabilitate both body and soul, aside from reaping good harvest from the land. Everyone including the society at large will reap the benefits of industrious young men.

[Moses]

They should all go back to the village monasteries and enrol for a year or two as novice monks so as to repent for the sordid lives they got themselves into. Additionally a stint in the farms will rehabilitate both body and soul, aside from reaping good harvest from the land. Everyone including the society at large will reap the benefits of industrious young men.

1. Enrolling to monastery costs a lot of money for donation
2. Surrounding villages will not be able to feed so heavy populated monasteries

[dinagam]

1. Enrolling to monastery costs a lot of money for donation
2. Surrounding villages will not be able to feed so heavy populated monasteries

Now is the time for them to learn more about humility. No need for fancy donations.
Assuming that there are 300k moneyboys and more than 100k monasteries in the whole of Thailand, there won't be any stampede.

[Patanawet]

Don't feed the troll!

[Moses]

No need for fancy donations.

Hahahaha... "no need' is funny declaration. Good luck to find monastery in Thailand what will accept enrolling without donation...

[cdnmatt]

Hahahaha... "no need' is funny declaration. Good luck to find monastery in Thailand what will accept enrolling without donation...

Every last one of them will. Monasteries don't just turn people away.

[Moses]

Every last one of them will. Monasteries don't just turn people away.

Matt, where you got that city legends?

[cdnmatt]

Matt, where you got that city legends?


I read it on al_shamimi Habab's .news blog, because he's trustworthy like that.

Or I lived in Khon Kaen for 8 years, one or another. Anyone can go live in a temple anytime they want, for as long as they want, no charge, and you will never be turned away. If you have the means then a donations is graciously accepted, but by no means is that a requirement. You have to follow the rules, but living there is free.

Temples don't even turn away street dogs, let alone humans.

[Dodger]

I.

Anyone can go live in a temple anytime they want, for as long as they want, no charge, and you will never be turned away. If you have the means then a donations is graciously accepted, but by no means is that a requirement. You have to follow the rules, but living there is free.

Temples don't even turn away street dogs, let alone humans.

I think you'll find that different monasteries in different towns and regions address outside visitors differently. As a general rule, monasteries are intended for monks, nuns and novice monks, and no one lives there for free. Everyone works. Some of the larger monasteries have small guest houses where outside guests can stay for a day or two, but I have never heard of anyone being permitted to stay for longer terms just for a place to lay their heads. In general, if you mean “for free” as a way of avoiding being responsible for the cost of your own living, the answer is no. You have to be there for a good reason such as attending a retreat.

Buddhist monks have no concept of the word "homeless" in a traditional sense. Your home is inside you.

It's not uncommon to see a few dogs living on monastery grounds which have been taken in by the monks,...but, again, as a general rule, monasteries don't open their gates to stray dogs either. If they did, they would have to construct Noah's ark.

[Dodger]

Dodger nothing new here, what point are you trying to make?

You're right. Not sure why I wrote this.

I ran into another homeless boy this morning over near soi day/night...listened to his story...reflected on the big picture...and just felt compelled to write...with no real point to be made

[goji]

Dodger nothing new here, what point are you trying to make?

When did you write something new yourself ?

[cdnmatt]

I think you'll find that different monasteries in different towns and regions address outside visitors differently.

Oh, I wasn't really talking about us. I meant the homeless hookers this thread is about.

You are right, they have to become a novice and follow the rules, and it's not exactly what'd we classify an enjoyable life, but it is available to them. They wouldn't get turned away, and get free shelter and food (well, once every morning).

As far as I'm aware, you could even be a 50 year old farang, and go be a novice if you wanted to.

[wingnut]

I have known several boys over the years who went to be monks. No donation asked or sought. What is your information based on Moses?

[Armando]

Havocscope, a research company that studies the black market, estimated the Thai sex trade (boys and girls) to be worth $6.4 billion a year, or about 3% of the country's gross domestic product prior to the covid pandemic.
In 1999 Forbes magazine quoted another study showing the value to Thailand of the sex industry in total as US$25 billion or 12% of GDP. I find it hard to believe the total amount will have reduced prior to the pandemic, even if it may have dropped percentage-wise as GDP will have risen significantly.

https://www.forbes.com/forbes/1999/0614/6312214s2.html?sh=4eb853ce2cc7

[Dodger]

In 1999 Forbes magazine quoted another study showing the value to Thailand of the sex industry in total as US$25 billion or 12% of GDP. I find it hard to believe the total amount will have reduced prior to the pandemic, even if it may have dropped percentage-wise as GDP will have risen significantly.

The numbers quoted by Forbes appear reasonable for 1999. But that was 22 years ago when the sex industry in Thailand was in full-bloom. It's not anywhere close to that today...unfortunately!

[StevieWonders]

The numbers quoted by Forbes appear reasonable for 1999. But that was 22 years ago when the sex industry in Thailand was in full-bloom. It's not anywhere close to that today...unfortunately!
More and more the “Thai” sex industry is becoming less Thai. Before the pandemic a significant proportion of working boys were Lao, Khmer and Burmese in the country on short term visas or illegally.

[Dodger]

Oh, I wasn't really talking about us. I meant the homeless hookers this thread is about.

You are right, they have to become a novice and follow the rules, and it's not exactly what'd we classify an enjoyable life, but it is available to them. They wouldn't get turned away, and get free shelter and food (well, once every morning).

I think we're on the same page.

I wouldn't be surprised if a few boys haven't navigated to the gates of a local temple this past year for this very reason.

I can't help but have this cartoon image of a young novice monk wearing makeup with a number pinned to his robe...LOL

Checkout the video embedded in the link below:

https://www.pinknews.co.uk/2019/04/20/gay-buddhist-monk-makeup-artist/

[Dodger]

More and more the “Thai” sex industry is becoming less Thai. Before the pandemic a significant proportion of working boys were Lao, Khmer and Burmese in the country on short term visas or illegally.

Yes, and there are reasons for that.

1 - Economic advancements: Before the pandemic Thailand's economy was growing creating more job opportunities for the young.

2 - Thailand's ageing population: The number of older people is growing exponentially: Thailand is currently ranked the third most rapidly ageing population in the world. The number of people aged 60 and over in Thailand now stands at about 13 million, accounting for 20% of the population, and the number of persons aged 60 and older is projected to double between now and 2050.

The median age in Thailand in 1970 was 18. The median age now is 40. There are simply fewer young people around to service the sex industry. Migrants fill this gap.

I'd like to see more Vietnamese boys in the future (median age 30). They're my second favorites.

Stats below:

https://www.un.org/development/desa/pd/sites/www.un.org.development.desa.pd/files/unpd_egm_201902_s3_vipanprachuabmoh.pdf

[Daveuk]

More and more the “Thai” sex industry is becoming less Thai. Before the pandemic a significant proportion of working boys were Lao, Khmer and Burmese in the country on short term visas or illegally.

Last year I recall bringing a Khmer boy back to my gay hotel. At the reception desk he produced his passport to the clerk who put it in a box. I noticed that in amongst the Thai ID cards was nearly as many passports. I don’t remember seeing boys passports at all until about 5 years ago.

I really hope that plenty of non Thai boys can get into the country after things return to normal.

[goji]

I had a Lao freelancer within my first few days in Bangkok, back in 2006. He was on the steps of the Kasikorn bank near Soi Twilight. There have been a steady stream of them ever since.

The proportion of Khmer and Lao lads has increased over the years and they are usually over 50% of my dates on these trips.
As far as I can remember, the last Vietnamese lad in my bedroom was in Singapore, back in 2008. I'd quite like to try another and will do so, just as soon as I meet one who accepts he only gets paid for performing as promised.
Vietnam has 96 million people, compared with just over 7 million in Laos or 16 million in Cambodia. I suspect the Vietnamese don't have much interest in working as hookers.

[Armando]

The numbers quoted by Forbes appear reasonable for 1999. But that was 22 years ago when the sex industry in Thailand was in full-bloom. It's not anywhere close to that today...unfortunately!
You seem to forget the sex industry is far from limited to the declining number of sex tourists. It has always been mostly Thais for Thai and you find that in every part of the country. So to suggest that the overall value of the sex industry has dropped from $25 billion to $6.4 billion is totally unrealistic, I expect. it may have dropped but nowhere like around 75%.

[Dodger]

You seem to forget the sex industry is far from limited to the declining number of sex tourists. It has always been mostly Thais for Thai and you find that in every part of the country. So to suggest that the overall value of the sex industry has dropped from $25 billion to $6.4 billion is totally unrealistic, I expect. it may have dropped but nowhere like around 75%.

It's a dart toss. Published estimates are all over the map.

One thing we know for sure is that the sex industries contribution to Thailand's GDP is significantly less than it used to be.

Thailand can't even measure its own general population, let alone the number of under-the-table prostitutes they have running around.

[latintopxxx]

Thais pay a lot less than farangs...

[cdnmatt]

Thais pay a lot less than farangs...


Not always. Lots of Thais have their mia noi setup with her own condo, new car, nice jewellery and clothes, et al.

[StevieWonders]

Not always. Lots of Thais have their mia noi setup with her own condo, new car, nice jewellery and clothes, et al.Generally a mistress doesn’t count as a prostitute so is not part of the “sex industry”

[cdnmatt]

Generally a mistress doesn’t count as a prostitute so is not part of the “sex industry”


Ok, how about that one Thai ladyboy in Bangkok who offered Leo 5000 baht for one night via Grindr. Does that count?

[StevieWonders]

Ok, how about that one Thai ladyboy in Bangkok who offered Leo 5000 baht for one night via Grindr. Does that count?What was your cut?

[Armando]

It's a dart toss. Published estimates are all over the map.

One thing we know for sure is that the sex industries contribution to Thailand's GDP is significantly less than it used to be.
Agree with the first sentence. But where do you find any published information about the second? I doubt if the Thais who take part in the country's sex industry is considerably less than it was. And is anything for sure about the total sex contribution to GDP other than the income from tourism is drastically down.


Thais pay a lot less than farangs...
Not necessarily. What about the hiso community who pay vastly more than western sex tourists. And why would Thais in 2021 pay less than they did in 2019? A little less overall, certainly since average incomes must have dropped. But a lot less? I doubt it.

[Dodger]

Agree with the first sentence. But where do you find any published information about the second?.

This is like two drunk Irishmen tossing darts in a dark room at a moving target.

Based on published estimates (dart tosses), it appears as if 3-4% GDP (US $6.4 billion) is the baseline for current Sex Industry GDP contributions – which is a very significant decline from baseline estimates of US $25 billion (GDP 12%) back in 1999

Here are a few sources…there are hundreds more:

1999 Estimates
A 1999 Forbes Release refers to a Thai University Study that estimates the Sex Industry to be worth US $25 billion (GDP 12%)
https://www.forbes.com/forbes/1999/0614/6312214s2.html?sh=15b440932cc7

2015-2020 Estimates
The 2015 Havocscope Research Report below puts Thailand’s Sex Industry GDP at 3% (US $6.4 billion).
https://www.ijemr.net/DOC/ProstitutionInThailand.pdf

The 2020 Thaiger News release below also estimates the Sex Industry to be worth US$6.4 billion accounting for a significant portion of the national GDP (no actual GDP % stated)
https://thethaiger.com/news/opinion/thai-government-refuses-to-acknowledge-the-red-light-economy

The 2020 Asian Post Study below also estimates the Sex Industry to be worth US $6.4 billion (GDP estimated between 4-10%)
https://theaseanpost.com/article/thai-sex-workers-hit-hard-virus-lockdown

Bottom line: The Sex Industry has plummeted. To your point, it may not have plummeted by 75%...all anyone can do is guess, but it sure has taken a hit.

As far as the Domestic Sex Industry goes, thanks to this pandemic, the economy has been set back about 50 years. One could assume that the Thais, who traditionally enjoy frolicking with prostitutes, are spending more time at home with their wives right now. When tourists return – the economy will pick up. When the economy picks up – Thai wives will find it quieter at home as papa returns to working the fields at night with his lantern.

[christianpfc]

When I read the headline, I was expecting an unpleasant encounter with a customer.

But Covid was a process, the decline of tourists dragged on for weeks. Every boy who is still in Pattaya and setting his hopes on a quick return of tourists is a slow learner.

[goji]

. Every boy who is still in Pattaya and setting his hopes on a quick return of tourists is a slow learner.

Some were smart enough to take good care of the tourists already in Pattaya and earn a few repeat trades.
Meanwhile, in Bangkok, one lad told me I'm the first farang customer he's had for months, as all the others were Thai.