500 Baht for a drink!

[christianpfc]

On a recce in Silom/Surawong/Patpong last week, I saw this note about 500 THB drink price in Moonlight. I asked the staff if that's for Chinese New Year, and he confirmed and said the drink price will be back to 480 afterwards. There might have been 500 drink prices before that I missed (as I don't go to Silom often, and when I go I give wide berth to the expensive places). When I asked at Jupiter 2018, there as well 500 for one drink.

9602

In Saramrom I had a boy for 500 in November, and I have several regulars from online dating for 500 (however they don't speak English, so that market is not easily accessible to the average tourist). I pay 500 for sex, other people pay 500 to look at boys!

[gerefan2]

I walked past the Tawan Bar in BKK last night and there was a large sign on the door saying:

“Second drink 300 Baht” ....no mention of the price for the first drink.

I kept walking .....

[aot871]

In 1 way the lack of asian visitors might be good,,. in that it might bring the thai bar owners to their sences and they might lower the prices for drinks,, now that its mainly western expats or tourists using the bars,, or it might go the other way as is normal for the thais and they increase their prices

[pong]

In 1 way the lack of asian visitors might be good,,. in that it might bring the thai bar owners to their sences and they might lower the prices for drinks,, now that its mainly western expats or tourists using the bars,, or it might go the other way as is normal for the thais and they increase their prices

So youre still so new and unaccustomed to Thai logic that you think farangy. A tipical Thai will do the sums after a day or 2, see that income is missing and thus RAISE the prices. At least that is what the usual fora always claim that will happen. Wessiś will go to their beloved Patters for lower prices.
Chris-du sollte ja dann auch bemerken: the 500 quoted along this stinky canal Klong Lot is the very same since at least 10-12 yrs now. No price hike there. But those bars keep on rising and rising the prices sometimes even more as once/yr. In economics, to whom the Chinese are not unaccustomed to, this is called ´what the market will bear´-thats also the way sky-high Britsh train prices are made.

[christianpfc]

Indeed. Since I remember (2011?), the going rate has been 500 at Saranrom (in a narrow range, a boy once went with me for 400 - his suggestion - and one boys once asked for 600 which I did not agree to); whereas drink prices have doubled in 10 years, and so have tip expectations.

In economics, you can make a graph: low price = high number of customers but not viable; high price = low number of customers but not viable; and somewhere in between is where price x number of customer has the maximum.

From a money boy perspective, it is better to have one customer at 2000 than 2 customers at 1000.

[Mancs]

In Vietnam a small tin of beer can be had for about 27 bt from a minimart. But the street will have to provide the 'show'.

[goji]

Looks like there are 2 reasons not to go in Moonlight.
1 The type of boy is not what I look for.
2 Extortionate drink prices.

The first reason means the second is not a problem. When a bar I want to visit charges 500, that's a problem.

[christianpfc]

I walked past the Tawan Bar in BKK last night and there was a large sign on the door saying:

“Second drink 300 Baht” ....no mention of the price for the first drink.

I kept walking .....

Tawan charges 400 for first drink (posted outside when I passed yesterday).

[christianpfc]

Last night (Friday) the sign outside Tawan said 500 for first drink, 300 for second. Out of curiosity (no intention to ever go there again), I had a look at the drink menu in Dream Boys and soft drinks are 450 and alcoholic and cocktails 500.

[bucknaway]

I'm not surprised by 500 baht drink prices and I don't think it's the end of the rise. If I was planning a trip to Thailand I'd be a little pissed off but I don't know when or if I'll be back.

I wonder if any bar will demand 550 this year or will it try 600?

Thailand is expensive now, and when anyone asks me about Thailand I tell them shopping and sightseeing is fun and can be fun. You have to haggle for most things and expect to be cheated. I also tell them nightlife drink prices are at a level that remind me of highway robbery.

I wonder when 800 drink prices will be the norm?

[colmx]

Funny thing is, the more they charge, the worse the bar is!

Dreamboys Bkk is 450-500B for a drink and staffed by Tuktuk drivers with an awful Ladyboy big cock show. Screw boys across the street is staffed by gorgeous twinks and charge 300B a drink

Similarly BBB in Pattaya rip clients off @400B a drink and have guys fully dressed (like a Karaoke bar) - whilst Cupidol and Toyboys across the street are staffed by gorgeous undressed twinks and charge 220-260B a drink

When I was in DB BKK last month I was astounded by the lack of talent. Took a Farang friend there promising that it was the best club in Thailand, we both left feeling like we had been tricked into a scam bar. The sign outside says "no cheating" - it should read "unsuspecting tourist trap"

[Mancs]

Yes, Screwboys is much more fun than Dreamboys and cheaper. And twinkier men.

[a447]

I wonder when 800 drink prices will be the norm?

Prices will probably rise in relation to the rise in the number of coronavirus victims, as this will severely stem the number of foreign tourists.

As we know, in Thailand the fewer the customers, the higher the prices. They never seem to learn.

Until it's too late and their business goes under.

[arsenal]

BBB and X-Boys charge the highest prices and they're both still open whereas most of the others have closed so...

[Jellybean]

Just over a week ago, along with ChristianPFC to show me around, I visited the new location of the ‘gay’ go-go bars in Patpong for the first time. It’s not far from the old ‘Soi Twilight’ and very close to Screwboy Bar. But as Christian has already highlighted, the drinks (and no doubt the off fees) are very expensive, especially for me given the fall in the GBP/THB exchange rate.

We managed to have a look in many of the bars and, although only a quick glance, I didn’t see much that would entice me to pay B450 for a bottle of water (that equated to £12.50 at the time of my visit, but I see at today’s exchange rate the cost has fallen to £11.14 but nevertheless still expensive).

But back in the day, I visited three or four bars a night in ‘Soi Twilight’ and occasionally squeezed in a quick recce at Super ‘A’ Bar or Nature Boy Bar. It all depended on how quickly I spotted the lad of my dreams. Today, I simply could not afford to bar hop on that scale, pay for drinks for the potential off to sit with me, pay the off fee, pay the very high rental cost and repeat the whole process night after night.

And to be perfectly frank, despite living here for six or three months at a time, I have not entered those bars for, perhaps, three or more years, preferring to go to massage parlours, meeting old flames at my apartment or arranging to meet new contacts from the apps. All of which are considerably cheaper than going to the Patpong bars. Sadly, for me, the go-go bars in Bangkok have quite simply priced themselves out of the market. If only the bars would realise this and reduce their prices and see if that attracted more customers, because when I had a sneak peak, they all looked particularly empty to me. But, that’s no more than a pipe dream and most unlikely to happen, as a447 said in his post:


. . . As we know, in Thailand the fewer the customers, the higher the prices. They never seem to learn . . .

Luckily, for me, there are alternatives and I suspect many of their former customers are also exercising their right to go elsewhere.

Strangely enough, despite not going to those bars for such a long time, I was surprised that so many barkers and mamasans remembered me. But, if truth be told, I was a loyal and very regular customer of the ‘Soi Twilight’ bars for many, many years, but it saddens me to say, not anymore, not at those prices!

But what of the alternatives? It’s my usual practice to visit Pattaya at least twice during my trips and I am seriously thinking of making Pattaya my home base during my next trip. I shall however wait and see how this current trip pans out before making any firm plans. Back in March 2018, I did look at three or four apartment complexes in Pattaya, but to be honest, I did not like anything I saw. They all seemed perfectly acceptable for two or maybe three weeks, but not for a three month visit. If I have time during my next visit, I’ll cast my net wider and see what else is on offer at a higher rent.


BBB and X-Boys charge the highest prices and they're both still open whereas most of the others have closed so...

Sorry, I can't explain the reason for that, arsenal.

[dinagam]

Sorry, I can't explain the reason for that, arsenal.

Let's just wait another couple of months for the corona virus epidemic to show its effect on Boyztown bars with the dwindling Chinese customers. It is indeed a really interesting time for the gay bars of Thailand .

[gerefan2]

BBB and X-Boys charge the highest prices and they're both still open whereas most of the others have closed so...

But others, charging far less, have not closed. Take for example Toyboys, Nice Boys and even Power boys.

It could of course be the case that the larger places like BBB and the Bangkok bars have enough money in hand to tide them over periods when there are no Asian visitors such as the Airport sit in, the riots in BKK, the floods, the high value of the baht, the ferry sinking in Phuket, and now the Corona virus.
My betting is they have sufficient capital to survive this which is just the latest crisis.

[goji]

Some bars seem to survive perfectly well selling expensive drinks to customers from China etc. With very few off fees and customers who go mainly for the show.

An off in Bangkok is now very expensive. So for anyone who wants to economize, the obvious options are to spend a larger part of the trip in Pattaya and/or use the phone spps.

The phone apps save the off fee and many of the lads are inclined to accept a reasonable tip . On the other hand, it seems boys from certain fashionable bars are trained to always ask for more money. For instance, my last short time tip to a Bangkok gogo boy was 1600. He was pushing for 2000, for well under an hour's service. When I returned to the bar 2 days later, the same boy was constantly trying to catch my eye. So it seems my tip was sufficient?

[christianpfc]

I wonder when 800 drink prices will be the norm?
Prices have doubled in 10 years. Expect to see 1000 THB drink prices in 2030, or 800 in 2026.

I now make it a point telling them (doorstaff and waiters at Bangkok gogo bars) what the problem is (boys fully dressed or high prices). Applies to Pattaya Bars as well. Don't know if it's of any use having a look into A-Bomb and telling them I will go somewhere with boys in underwear, but it makes me feel better. The best part of my recent visit to Screwboys was telling mamasan that I will be in Pattaya next week, and can boys there for 1000, so I will until then instead of paying 2000 now (whereupon she said some can go for 1500, but my target is 1000!).

[Marc K]

Guys, guys, when are we all going to get the message: AN END OF AN ERA has come. Yes, it might be sad, even nostalgic to many (including myself) but that doesn't change reality. We all remember the delightful play times of the past, but hey -- SPOILER ALERT! -- they are gone, gone, gone. Any objective visit to the funereal SP for example surely demonstrates that point. I haven't been to the "new" Patpong bars, but there is no way in hell I am going to finance the underworld with those kind of exorbitant prices. I am sure we can all remember the days (not long ago!) of 99B drinks even in BT. I'd much rather give the money to a sweet boy.

That's not to say that we all need to run off to the nearest nunnery. I have found ample opportunities with the apps (as many of you have pointed out in this thread) as well as just gently cruising around. Around where? One of my favorites of all times I met at the butter counter at Food Mart. Another in the 7-11 by the police box. All one reasonably has to do is be kind, be interesting, be friendly and start a conversation without being completely direct (which is off-putting to many Thais) or coming across as a hopeless miscreant. No, it doesn't always yield sex but more often than not it can with just a little bit of effort. You don't have to (shouldn't) "fall in love", you don't have to even be friends, but you can easily create a rapport which yields benefits for both sides. Keeping in touch then is easy (via Line) and when the need arises... well you get the point.

So why do we need those stupid bars? Who likes lip-synced katoeys singing for an hour? Watered-down drinks? Exorbitant prices? Pushy mamasans? Of course magic might strike you there but the odds of anything memorable happening are shrinking by the day.

Hugs and good luck to all. I am infrequent poster on this board but I do appreciate the conversations a lot so thanks to those who keep the board active.

[goji]

For drink prices to double in the next 10 years, it needs a continuing supply of wealthy tourists who will pay the higher prices. I'm not sure that will happen.
However, the ways to deal with high prices are to either to go elsewhere or make sure we have enough money to pay the prices.

Over the years, I've tried telling bars why I don't go inside. Typically this is due to excessive music volume or overdressed boys. Well managed businesses figure out what their customers are looking for and adapt. Of course, some customers have completely different needs to me.

[pong]

What do you think of yourself that a Thai bisnis would even listen to unsollicited advice? If its free, it cannot be good. For this advice on how to run a bisnis one needs to pay a respected company for that at last a few ´hmoon´=10.000s. A major part of the advice following will be to hire some extravagant stars=dao, VITM (very Imptt Thai Model, famous from the local gutterpress) for some extravagant party, to be attended, for free, by the ThongLor Mc-Bz/BMW jetset, but only if the JW is at least gold label and there is free parking nearside and a few dozen of very available Thai ´sao suay´= beautiful ladies, for whom the organiser pays the fees. That all of the Thai gutterpress will also attend-thats for sure-just leave that to the organisers, thats part of their normal work routine.
(for those too unsure-this is meant as a tiny parody on how it works around here).

[christianpfc]

Around where? One of my favorites of all times I met at the butter counter at Food Mart. Another in the 7-11 by the police box. All one reasonably has to do is be kind, be interesting, be friendly and start a conversation without being completely direct (which is off-putting to many Thais) or coming across as a hopeless miscreant. No, it doesn't always yield sex but more often than not it can with just a little bit of effort. You don't have to (shouldn't) "fall in love", you don't have to even be friends, but you can easily create a rapport which yields benefits for both sides.

Keeping in touch then is easy (via Line) and when the need arises... well you get the point.
My experiences are different. Either you get directly to the point (money for sex) or end up with straight friends. Nice boys, interesting stories, but no way to get my hands into their pants. Happened to me many times.

One cute boy I met on Pattaya beach about five years ago and we loosely stayed in touch on facebook. Recently, he messaged me and asked when I come to Pattaya again. I told him I go to Pattaya frequently to meet boys and asked if he is interested. He replied that he is married with two children.

Keeping in touch is not easy. Many boys frequently change phone numbers, Line/online dating/facebook accounts. I have lost many this way.

When in Pattaya, the most efficient use of time and money for me is to go to a gogo bar!

[sglad]

...The best part of my recent visit to Screwboys was telling mamasan that I will be in Pattaya next week, and can boys there for 1000, so I will until then instead of paying 2000 now (whereupon she said some can go for 1500, but my target is 1000!).

OMG! OMG! She must've been devastated to lose such a WARM, GENEROUS, FUN and EASYGOING customer such as yourself. She must've gone back to her room that night and flagellated herself, banged her head repeatedly against the wall and pulled out every single one of her pubic hair with tweezers. So ashamed and filled with regret she was at having lost such an irreplaceable, magnanimous and popular customer (the boys would never EVER forgive her) that she then donned a black kimono, walked over to Lumpini and comitted seppuku at dawn.

[dinagam]

What a triumphant soliloquy, sglad...
Now go take a bow.

[Marc K]

... I told him I go to Pattaya frequently to meet boys and asked if he is interested. He replied that he is married with two children... When in Pattaya, the most efficient use of time and money for me is to go to a gogo bar!

Hi Christian, Well the saying "different strokes for different people" is true. And yes if time is at a great premium (especially for ST visits) then the direct approach is likely to lead to the least frustration and most "happy endings" for sure. But if you have some time and can accept a reasonable amount of frustration, then I still suggest that the no-gogo-bar approach is still the best. At go-go bars I feel guilty supporting the Thai underworld, including the corrupt police and squandering money on worthless drinks and now-getting-outlandish bar fines. I'd much rather generously tip a nice guy who had performed a valuable service.

As for the married guy with two kids, hey! where! where!, send him my way! Since when did that ever stop any horny Thai men?? :love:

Marc

[bucknaway]

I think it will be word of mouth that kills off future gay tourists. Sure bars can demand premium prices, but when vacationers go home and talk about their visit they will be forced to talk about the high drink prices and higher tips.

If your not living in NYC or LA you may think it's not worth it to fly to Thailand and end up paying more for time with a guy.

Bars may be happy that vacationers will pay the high prices today. Tomorrow? Why worry about tomorrow it's always a day away...

[latintopxxx]

food, drinks and company are still cheap and plentiful in Pattaya....just keep away from gogo bars...lots of talent available on apps...lots of cheap food/drinks/accomodation available ...stop being such debbie downers

[PapaBear]

I agree. I visit Pattaya three or four times per year and always still have fun. It's not the wild, crazy place like it was 15-20 years ago but it's still a giggle. Never a shortage of cute guys in the massage shops, beer bars or online. I still go to Toy Boy and Winners gogo and always enjoy myself. The other overpriced gogos I avoid. The wonderful Thai food is cheap as is the accommodation.

Take a look in the mirror then ask yourself where else in the world can I have the same amount of fun for the price you pay.

[Mancs]

One lad in Screwboys once said to me "One hour sex, 1000 bt". I will always give them the going rate. But if money is tight make them an offer. They can only say no.

[Nirish guy]

Why worry about tomorrow it's always a day away...

OK, so, fess up guys...so, was I the ONLY one who singing that last line in full on "Annie" style when reading it !? :-)

[Jellybean]

OK, so, fess up guys...so, was I the ONLY one who singing that last line in full on "Annie" style when reading it !? :-)

Not only that NIrish-guy, but I considered posting a YouTube (https://youtu.be/Yop62wQH498) link, but then thought better of it. ;)

[christianpfc]

Keeping in touch is not easy. Many boys frequently change phone numbers, Line/online dating/facebook accounts. I have lost many this way.
I estimate the half-life time of phone numbe or line/facebook/online dating account to one year. (No experience with instagram or twitter, but I guess similar.)

[christianpfc]

But if you have some time and can accept a reasonable amount of frustration, then I still suggest that the no-gogo-bar approach is still the best. At go-go bars I feel guilty supporting the Thai underworld, including the corrupt police and squandering money on worthless drinks and now-getting-outlandish bar fines. I'd much rather generously tip a nice guy who had performed a valuable service.
I do get a lot of boys from online. But the only place where you can see them in underwear on stage is a gogo bar. For that reason (see my rants about bars with fully dressed boys, all on my blacklist), I continue visiting gogo bars. Supporting underworld is not the first thing that comes to my mind, however it irks me that many bars have as many wait staff as boys. So every gogo boy has to feed one staff in some way, means prices could be half. And online dating and Beach Road show prostitution works well without pimps!

[sglad]

Sorry, I can't explain the reason for that, arsenal.

Why not? I thought the reason should be painfully obvious - they are well-run bars. So are Moonlight, Jupiter, Hotmale, Screwboys, Lucky, Banana and Adam's Apple. I'm sure there are a couple of others that I've missed out. They are run as profit-making enterprises with proper staffing and management, goals and targets, with sound recruitment and marketing strategies. The bar is always properly stocked and the show must goes on. Not some hobby business for a bored farang in Pattaya where the boys disappear as soon as the boss does (see goji/jun's complaint about Winner Boys in Sunee on the Gaybuttonthai forum).

You may not approve of the selection of staff in these bars, you may not like the clientele, you may baulk at their prices, but the fact remains they know who their market is and gear it accordingly. The owners of Moonlight and Hotmale are Thais in their 30s and 40s and they've got some fresh ideas in store in line with regional nightlife and entertainment trends.

On an average night, Moonlight sees about 200 customers who don't even look at their ticket prices let alone whine about it on gay Thailand forums. They get a lot more customers on weekends and SE Asian/East Asian holidays. Of course, every venue might have the occasional quiet day or a lull in their business during a crisis, but they will survive if their fundamentals and reputation are strong and the corona outbreak is not the first major crisis that Thai tourism has faced.

As for the lack of fun, 'offs', and goodlooking guys in these "grand" bars, one only has to look at the Gayguides forum to know this is not true. The guys there are having the time of their lives judging from their trip reports.

[dinagam]

Why not?

As for the lack of fun, 'offs', and goodlooking guys in these "grand" bars, one only has to look at the Gayguides forum to know this is not true. The guys there are having the time of their lives judging from their trip reports.

Most of the trip reports are from about a dozen guys and half of them are residents of Bangkok and poring and getting drunk over muscles or gym physiques, and charming mamasans, which as a corollary can be quite nauseating for those who also like seafood, vegetarian, or Japanese food in their restaurant menu.

[christianpfc]

The pricing structure (drinks, off fee, short time expectations) in straight bars is completely different.
See recent stickman: 200 Baht Drinks Coming Soon?
https://www.stickmanbangkok.com/weekly-column/2020/01/200-baht-drinks-coming-soon/

[sglad]

Most of the trip reports are from about a dozen guys and half of them are residents of Bangkok and poring and getting drunk over muscles or gym physiques, and charming mamasans, which as a corollary can be quite nauseating for those who also like seafood, vegetarian, or Japanese food in their restaurant menu.

No restaurant can provide a variety of dishes that caters to everyone's tastes - that's why we have a variety of restaurants. Same same with bars. If you like twinks, Lucky Bar and Freshmen have them aplenty - and many of them very cute and pretty. If, for some reason, you like boys who are of legal age but look twelve Pattaya is only two hours away.

If people get along with mamasans and fellow travellers and bar-hoppers, then more power to them! If you find the collegial and convivial spirit among Gayguides ' forummers "nauseating", then you can find some other hole more suited to your temperament and personality. Perhaps gather "upon the heath" with two other whiners here and "meet with Macbeth".

If you're trying to say that their generally positive trip reports are anecdotal, then I'd agree with you. But so are the complaints here. And the complainants are the same half a dozen suspects with a long history of negative posts, constant whining, self-centredness, penny-pinchingness, insufferable superiority complex and fragile egos. Take the OP, for example. The only segment of Thai society that would give him the time of day are the poorest and the downtrodden (god bless them!) and yet he constantly berates them for the social ills and shortcomings that afflict the poor everywhere, not just in Thailand. At least they're trying to eke out a living with very little government and social welfare support. Let's hear what the OP, who comes from an advanced country with strong social welfare support systems, has achieved in the last five years.

The atmosphere in Chinese and other Asian language forums is very different from this one. Firstly, no one talks about the other customers - old white guys are never mentioned - unlike here and elsewhere where people are obsessed with China and other Asian customers. The focus is on having fun; where to shop, where to eat, the nicest rooftop bars, the hottest guys, the latest dance clubs, etc. Race or nationality doesn't come into it; the understanding is if you can afford it, then you are fit to enjoy it like everyone else.

[mr giggles]

. But so are the complaints here. And the complainants are the same half a dozen suspects with a long history of negative posts, constant whining, self-centredness, penny-pinchingness, insufferable superiority complex and fragile egos.

.

You can also add they are often one sandwich short of a picnic- many remain undisturbed by a decent education.
:unknw_mini:

[AsDaRa]

And online dating and Beach Road show prostitution works well without pimps!

Which section of Beach Road has sexy guys looking for farang?
And after what time each day?

[dinagam]

Which section of Beach Road has sexy guys looking for farang?
And after what time each day?

They're not looking for falang in particular, just for any potential customer with money that is legal tender.
Their eyes will catch yours if they are on duty, any time of day.

[a447]

I've never seen guys looking for customers on Beach Road - just girls and ladyboys.

On many occasions coming back from dinner with my "friend" I've seen the ladies all along the footpath, down to Walking Street. I've asked him why the guys don't hang out there but he can't explain it either.

Must be some reason.

[pong]

The only remaining city anywhere in Th as far as I know where there are still regular reliable MBs/guys walking/standing their trade plying for custom is here in BKk along klong Lot and near Saranrom park, as our dear christian has so often described and explained. Its by far a mostly Th forTh thing. There is also an invisible divide to where the ladies doing ditto stand/walk and the males. It even seems that the katoeys=ladyboys also have their own territorium, but we´re very lucky here in Bkk there are not too many (anymore) of them, but occasionally they wander into their screaming habits without much knowledge of these unwritten boundaries.
IF newspprs report again about thieving and noisy obnoxious ladyboys its always, always Beach rd in Pattaya.
I guess to maintain a supply of willing enterprising guys there must at least be a kind of minimum level of custom, otherwise its too much of timewasting without revenue. This is clearly seen in many a sauna (also here in BKK) that advertises to be gay but where there is more emptiness as gayness. But then there the cashier still gets his money, the boss pays. And yes, its also abundantly clear that the apps now so widespread have eaten a big dent out of all that endless useless waiting-just like GRAB will pretty soon diminish the endless supply of taximeters-hopefully esp. those that dont want to go on what their shield says they have.

[Marc K]

I do get a lot of boys from online... I continue visiting gogo bars. Supporting the underworld is not the first thing that comes to my mind, however... online dating and Beach Road show prostitution works well without pimps!

Indeed! Shouldn't we do what we can to undermine the mafia and deflate the pimps? Just exactly what useful purpose do they serve to justify their inflated prices and watered drinks? Money syphonned by these low-lifes is effectively subtracted from what you can tip a nice boy who renders important services to you, right? I assume none (few) of us have money to burn.

And maybe there is some middle ground. I feel badly that places where guys used to linger around are fast disappearing as well. Do you remember the (BKK)(old) Surawong Cafe and Malaysia Hotel terrace, for example? I found such arrangements more palatable since you can have some interaction in a public place first. But these kind of place seem to being sadly "cleaned up". I do agree that app use has its downsides and potential risks.

Oh and yes it would be nice if the "Royal Garden Girls" on Beach Road would share some of their extensive turf with some Royal Garden Boys! It would definitely brighten up the place!!

[AsDaRa]

Indeed! Shouldn't we do what we can to undermine the mafia and deflate the pimps? Just exactly what useful purpose do they serve to justify their inflated prices and watered drinks? Money syphonned by these low-lifes is effectively subtracted from what you can tip a nice boy who renders important services to you, right? I assume none (few) of us have money to burn.

And maybe there is some middle ground. I feel badly that places where guys used to linger around are fast disappearing as well. Do you remember the (BKK)(old) Surawong Cafe and Malaysia Hotel terrace, for example? I found such arrangements more palatable since you can have some interaction in a public place first. But these kind of place seem to being sadly "cleaned up". I do agree that app use has its downsides and potential risks.

Oh and yes it would be nice if the "Royal Garden Girls" on Beach Road would share some of their extensive turf with some Royal Garden Boys! It would definitely brighten up the place!!

I know in maffia movies they often own sex shops etc. But besides this stereotype do you guys have evidence the maffia is really involved in the gogo bar scene? I am not naïeve, I know that is the stereotype and stereotypes have some basis in fact.

But what do we really know about this ? Maybe in Thailand it’s the exception ? I understood many farang owned the bars. Always always when I read in the forum about who owns bars it is farangs.

It would however explain how Sunee can stay alive. No money is earned but the bars are used for whitewashing illegally earned money.

[arsenal]

AsDaRa.
You do realise that in Thailand the mafia and the police are the same thing. And they own many of the bars and sex shops.

[christianpfc]

Which section of Beach Road has sexy guys looking for farang?
And after what time each day?
I was speaking of prostitution in general. A few years ago I counted over 500 available ladies on Beach road (Walking street to Hilton). Number of boys much smaller, the record was 5 available boys, but on some strolls not boys at all. The few boys I saw were all near Boyztown, and except for that one lady count, I don't venture further along Beach Road. There might be large numbers of boys elsewhere that I missed because I never went there, but I doubt it.

On 17jan2020 I met an available boy on Jomtien Beach (near police box) around midnight.

[Brad the Impala]

Dear Christian, only you could do the counting of “over 500 available ladies”!

How many exactly? Or did you just stop counting when you got over 500? So there could have been 600!

[Nirish guy]

Dear Christian, only you could do the counting of “over 500 available ladies”!

How many exactly? Or did you just stop counting when you got over 500? So there could have been 600!

Yes very shoddy recording of the details there Christian, we've come to expect better from you ! Very lax indeed.

[Zebedee]

Yes very shoddy recording of the details there Christian, we've come to expect better from you ! Very lax indeed.

You asked for it Nirish. The undisputed expert!

[Marc K]

AsDaRa.
You do realise that in Thailand the mafia and the police are the same thing. And they own many of the bars and sex shops.

Arsenal, you got that exactly right. And, AsDaRa, forgive me for saying so but yes you are indeed naive, sorry to say.

You know over the years I've heard many compelling(?) arguments about why we should patronize the go-go bars:

A. We have someone to complain to if things don't work out. Maybe get a free off to use the next time.
B. The boys are routinely checked for disease.
C. We can ask the mamasan to negotiate the language issue if the boy does not speak English and we don't speak Thai.
D. It's safer to choose someone in a public place.

Although these factors might have held gravitas 20 years ago, IMHO, NONE of these arguments hold water today. And, nine times out of ten entering a go-go bar is a dismal experience. They are now only a nostalgic flashback to a bygone era.

[sglad]

...nine times out of ten entering a go-go bar is a dismal experience. They are now only a nostalgic flashback to a bygone era.

This might be true if you're from a bygone era yourself. But if you're new to the go go scene and do not view/make it as your primary source of entertainment and socialisation in Thailand, it can be quite exciting. It's all relative.

[Zebedee]

Personally Im not fussed if I find my guy in a bar or a go-go bar, as long as he is my type....and many are not. Its always the face that attracts me first, and as long as he is not taller than me, and he is slim its game on. Next step is to find out what he can do and how much. I realise some here prefer to see the guys in undies, not a big deal for me,as long as I know they'll be coming off when in my hotel room anyway.
God things are so much easier in Thailand, why cant the rest of the world operate like that. Don't have to worry if you're going to be murdered in your bed,drink spiked, robbed, stabbed,or whatever else .We really are spoiled in Thailand,and sometimes I forget that.

[AsDaRa]

Arsenal, you got that exactly right. And, AsDaRa, forgive me for saying so but yes you are indeed naive, sorry to say.

You know over the years I've heard many compelling(?) arguments about why we should patronize the go-go bars:

A. We have someone to complain to if things don't work out. Maybe get a free off to use the next time.
B. The boys are routinely checked for disease.
C. We can ask the mamasan to negotiate the language issue if the boy does not speak English and we don't speak Thai.
D. It's safer to choose someone in a public place.

Although these factors might have held gravitas 20 years ago, IMHO, NONE of these arguments hold water today. And, nine times out of ten entering a go-go bar is a dismal experience. They are now only a nostalgic flashback to a bygone era.

I believe you. It is just that we read over the years in the forums about many farang owning the bars. Even gogo bars. Search the forums for “owned” or “owner”. At least in Pattaya. Not sure about Bangkok

[christianpfc]

Dear Christian, only you could do the counting of “over 500 available ladies”!

How many exactly? Or did you just stop counting when you got over 500? So there could have been 600!

Details here: https://christianpfc.blogspot.com/2014/12/pattaya-tue-thu-9-11122014.html


Tuesday 9.12.2014
Now I finally have time for a project I had in mind long time: a Beach road street hooker count! Walk all the way from Walking street to the northern end 00:15-1:00 and count 423 available ladies on the beach side. Density decreases from south to north (00:30 Hilton 303, 00:55 Holiday inn 423, no more between Holiday Inn and northern end of Beach road). On way back by songhtheo I notice there are ladies standing on the other side of Beach road as well, so the real number is higher.

My memory was wrong: 423, not over 500. Writing everything down finally pays off!

[Nirish guy]

Details here: https://christianpfc.blogspot.com/2014/12/pattaya-tue-thu-9-11122014.html

My memory was wrong: 423, not over 500. Writing everything down finally pays off!

Yes but which direction were they walking in, towards Walking Street or away from it and were they walking in groups or singluarily and what was the breakdown of the age grouping of the ladies i.e number of 20-30 year olds, 30-40 olds and "others" Christian !?? I mean COME ON, there's no point in only giving us half the data set and expecting us to be satisfied with that, you're just letting yourself down and you're letting the board down and honestly we expected better from you,

[latintopxxx]

christian ignore the trolls...even worse pedantic trolls.....just keep posting pics of your offs...only suggestion from my side is possibly vary the position..as in nice doggy style showing off bubble butts...

[Marc K]

I believe you. It is just that we read over the years in the forums about many farang owning the bars. Even gogo bars. Search the forums for “owned” or “owner”. At least in Pattaya. Not sure about Bangkok

Hi AsDaRa, I'm not really questioning who "owns" the bar. If owners (or more likely tenants)(farang or not) are to survive you can be sure that a sizable portion of the profits are being sopped up by the police as tea money or by even more nefarious elements as protection money. Let's be realistic about that.

Sure many farang come to Pattaya with the romantic dream of opening a gay bar but few remain in business for even a few years. An exception to this observation may be Madame Jim (BBB) who survived (and presumably prospered) for decades.

[Oliver2]

I remember Kevin and his staff arranging health checks for the dancers back in the days of Throb and Michael Burchill mentions them at Cockpit in his book about Boyztown. But now? .

[goji]

About 3 years ago, most of my lads were from the bars.
Now, almost all are from the apps.

Also, I am increasingly getting good results via the apps. It's so easy to spec out exactly what they need to do to get the tip on the apps. No more "cannot suck", as he's already agreed there's zero tip if that's the case.

Just a few say they do everything, then drop out when I query each service. That's way better than them not delivering in my room.

In contrast, it costs me 150-500 baht to talk to boys in the bars, so there is more incentive to take a lad with borderline attitude, as the drink bill mounts up if I speak to several.

[gerefan2]

I remember Kevin and his staff arranging health checks for the dancers back in the days of Throb and Michael Burchill mentions them at Cockpit in his book about Boyztown. But now? .

Having done a minor survey in Toyboys, which revealed only 1 or 2 Thai boys out of 20 or so I doubt that the bar owners do any health checks at all on the majority who are nowadays all Cambodian or Lao

[Marc K]

Goji, My experience mirrors yours. Now whenever I am in BT, I ask myself why I ever spent all that money at BBB (nowadays to be penned in with a bunch of oogling Chinese frau). at A-Bomb (in a seemingly always empty bar)... Whenever I walk through SP, I cringe at the dingy, now-deserted bars filled with ghosts of the past.

I'm not sure if APPS will be the sole surviving medium to happiness in the future. Maybe they too will be only a transition to a different method of meeting as it does also have its weaknesses. I am waiting for some aspiring entrepreneur to come up with a new way of displaying the available wares. Whatever it is I just hope that it mostly allows the men in the trade to flourish.