So, what is happening at Soi Twilight?

[werner]

What is the latest news?

Are the venues at Soi Twilight still in operation?

Is there any definite word about when the "redevelopment" of the area will begin?

I for one will certainly miss the area. During almost very trip to Bangkok, I visited the soi for a drink and people watching.

Moreover, during each trip, I had met at least one or two fantastic, handsome guys from Dream Boys who provided excellent service and entertainment.
Yes, the owner was cranky, the show was boring, and the prices were ridiculous, But some of the go-go guys that worked there were great.

[gerefan2]

Signs outside Soi Twilight.

[latintopxxx]

well that answers your question...

[werner]

So does this mean that the venues on Soi Twilight are still in operation?
And the soi will not be closed for another six years?

[Patanawet]

well that answers your question...
Not really. It tells you what the owners want you to think.

There are now three extra bars outside of soi
Twilight ---
Fresh Boys (in addition to the existing one in Twighlight) and Tokyo Boys (nothing to do with Japan - more Cambodia ) both bars next to or above Screw Boys in Patpong 2.
Another, -- I forget name in a cul-de sac, Soi Wall Street, opposite Soi Twilight. This was a boy bar a few years ago.

[edit: G-Boy, used to be Heart Beat, then vacant for some years.]

[sglad]

There's a long thread on Soi Twilight on Gaybutton's forum:

http://www.gaybuttonthai.com/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=8885

[sglad]

Signs outside Soi Twilight.

I wonder if these have become necessary because of all the rumour-mongering, speculating and exaggerating about venues opening and closing, invaded by tourists from X country, etc by bored farangs with nothing better to do, some of whom are not even in Thailand. I cautioned against this in the Could Double Shot Shut Its Doors thread started by the lonely dingbat. All this gossip and negative speculation can be detrimental to a business, especially if they're at a crossroads or under negotiations. I mean you will know if a business is closed when it actually is. Why the need for the salacious gossip and speculation?

[gerefan2]

by bored farangs with nothing better to do, some of whom are not even in Thailand.

So where are you? Singapore maybe??

I took those pics the other day and I AM in Bangkok. I can report that there were very few, if any farangs in Soi Twilight this evening. Sunday 5 August. But it is lowest of low season..

In answer to the other comments I visited Screwboys. Not much to say.i also went to Tokyo Boys. Even less to say. Fresh Boys 2 seemed to be upstairs above those two but was in darkness.

Beer in Screwboys 300 Bt and in Tokyo bar 380. Not worth staying.

[frequent]

Why the need for the salacious gossip and speculation?Where would the Forum - not to mention business publications generally - be without it? Gossip and speculation, after all, formed the original basis for the Watergate investigation and the current probe by Mueller of Trump. You could argue it had a role in bringing down the government in Malaysia recently. It's part of what it means to be an open society, not a semi-closed dictatorship like Thailand

[Nirish guy]

Why the need for the salacious gossip and speculation?

Did you forget that this is a GAY board or something as that answers your question without it even having to be asked ! :)

[lonelywombat]

I wonder if these have become necessary because of all the rumour-mongering, speculating and exaggerating about venues opening and closing, invaded by tourists from X country, etc by bored farangs with nothing better to do, some of whom are not even in Thailand. I cautioned against this in the Could Double Shot Shut Its Doors thread started by the lonely dingbat. All this gossip and negative speculation can be detrimental to a business, especially if they're at a crossroads or under negotiations. I mean you will know if a business is closed when it actually is. Why the need for the salacious gossip and speculation?

Maybe sglad should indicate where he is living at the moment. I have been in Pattaya for a month but doubt you are.

[frequent]

Maybe sglad should indicate where he is living at the moment. I have been in Pattaya for a month but doubt you are.Thonglor Soi 55 is his former haunt. Before that, Si Sao Thewes. Both are in Bangkok, of course, as is Soi Twilight

[scottish-guy]

What does it matter where sglad is?

Is there some new policy that only those who are actually in situ at any precise moment may comment on that location?

[lonelywombat]

Is there some new policy that only those who are actually in situ at any precise moment may comment on that location?

I note from several recent posts, members who live half way around the world ,were quick to criticize posters who were living here and had been inside the premises.
Seniority overcomes those who are actually here? Volume of off topic posts compared to what is happening here?
Do I have to go back to the earlier posts for the Casino next to Yensabai?

[frequent]

Do I have to go back to the earlier posts for the casino next to Yensabai?Yes please. Give us a synopsis

[scottish-guy]

I note from several recent posts, members who live half way around the world ,were quick to criticize posters who were living here ....
Seniority overcomes those who are actually here?

An alternative view would be that the "people who are actually (living) here" have presided over the near death of Sunee and the reduction of Boyztown to a shadow of what it once was, and thus they have no bragging rights whatsoever.

[lonelywombat]

An alternative view would be that the "people who are actually (living) here" have presided over the near death of Sunee and the reduction of Boyztown to a shadow of what it once was, and thus they have no bragging rights whatsoever.
Now from your position half way around the world you criticize OTHERS who have caused the decline of Sunee?
How about those who have been in the bar several times in the last week.
Is your situation of not having visited for {how many years?} placing you at fault, rather that those here that try and put some cash over the bar

[Patanawet]

Not really. It tells you what the owners want you to think.

There are now three extra bars outside of soi
Twilight ---
Fresh Boys (in addition to the existing one in Twighlight) and Tokyo Boys (nothing to do with Japan - more Cambodia ) both bars next to or above Screw Boys in Patpong 2.
Another, -- I forget name in a cul-de sac, Soi Wall Street, opposite Soi Twilight. This was a boy bar a few years ago.

[edit: G-Boy, used to be Heart Beat, then vacant for some years.]

I did not give anyone permission to edit my message.
If you have something to add -- do it as a separate message.

[arsenal]

The Womble wrote about Scottish Guy.
"Is your situation of not having visited for {how many years?"

Ssshhh. We're not allowed to mention that.

[frequent]

How about those who have been in the bar several times in the last week.The reports I've read say Pattaya is dead so presumably "those" number between "not many" and "not enough"?

[scottish-guy]

Now from your position half way around the world you criticize OTHERS who have caused the decline of Sunee?
How about those who have been in the bar several times in the last week.
Is your situation of not having visited for {how many years?} placing you at fault, rather that those here that try and put some cash over the bar

Sept 2016 was the last time I visited (sorry if that doesn't meet your criteria for being allowed to express an opinion) and furthermore I won't be back anytime soon.

My life situation has changed, I've visited almost 20 times already, and all I hear of now is prices going up and the "entertainment" going down. I'm not wealthy but I could afford to visit next week if I wanted to - I just no longer want to. "Been there, Done it, Bought the T Shirt" as they say.

But you've now (predictably) gone into ultra defensive mode. I'm not "blaming" anybody, I'm merely pointing out that the "people living here" are clearly not able to sustain the entertainment venues, they need the additional spending power of tourists and regular visitors.

To turn round and tell those regular visitors and tourists that their opinions are worthless is kind of shooting yourselves in the foot, would you not agree?

The mere fact that certain individuals have chosen to live in (or in some cases permanently fled to) Pattaya/BKK/Thailand does not give them any "superiority" no matter how they might wish it to be so

[frequent]

Go on lonely, send him one of your famous snotty PMs. You know you want to

[arsenal]

And to think not that long ago they were planning to have a nice breakfast together. Oh well.

[lonelywombat]

Go on lonely, send him one of your famous snotty PMs. You know you want to

You are the only snotty PM I can know of . And you certainly earnt that many times over

[Blueskytoday]

Prices are affordable for the tourist,,they have their amount figured in their trip...for the residents of Thailand....this is actually to me,,,getting out of reach to enjoy several times a week...it is in my opinion getting really pricey.

[bkkguy]

Is there some new policy that only those who are actually in situ at any precise moment may comment on that location?

it would probably help to require at least minimal contact with reality

bkkguy

[scottish-guy]

Since when was anything involving gogo boys, bar boys or any form of commercial sex in Pattaya in any way related to reality - it's all a (paid for) illusion and if/when his money runs out Joe Punter is brought down to earth with an almighty bump (there's that balcony scenario again!)

:drink:

[paborn]

I think Sglad is capable of defending himself. However, I wonder if anyone has read what he, actually, said? I reference to some photos of a buiness in Soi Twilight putting out signs that they plan to be there for 6 years. There was some discussions as to the accuracy of the sign and Sglad made the point that the business was combating all the rumours and innuendo which are disasterous for any business.

Given the cost and effort of farang visiting Thailand it seems a reasonable comment to me and whether one is in Thailand or not I have seen no post with creditable knowledge of the lease situation.

[arsenal]

Rumours and innuendo are what we do here. Once hard and fast facts stick their unwelcome nose in we all soon lose interest.

[Nirish guy]

Prices are affordable for the tourist,,they have their amount figured in their trip...for the residents of Thailand....this is actually to me,,,getting out of reach to enjoy several times a week...it is in my opinion getting really pricey.

I assure you that speaking as a tourist things in some places in Thailand are gettting really pricey for us too !

Indeed I know I can spend twice as long and spend half as much and get laid three times more in other places in SE asia than I do in Thailand now and that ( for me anyway) is and was a fact.

I still go to Thailand for old time sake and yes as there are still many cute guys about etc. However you are correct that pricing in some venues now is getting prohibitive - and not because I can't afford it, just that I'm conciously choosing NOT to now pay "any price they think of" to enjoy their establishments any longer.

I think the last go go bar I walked out of in Soi twlight two weeks ago quoted me 500 or 550 baht for entry - and that was before I bought a beer - screw that - show or not - and I told them so in no uncertain terms as I turned around to leave without entering. Staff members that I'd been drinking with previously told me when I came striaght out again that they believed they could charge that figure as the rich Chinese would and DID pay it, but as I told them - "look inside your bar, the place is almost empty and that's at 10.30pm on a Friday night !"

That should really tell them all they need to know. But hey Thai logic was in full play of course, i.e "no customers ? Ok put prices up to pay for bar !" Good luck with that says I - and perhaps THAT'S just one of the reasons that Soi Twilight is dying on it's arse of late.

[paborn]

Rumours and innuendo are what we do here. Once hard and fast facts stick their unwelcome nose in we all soon lose interest.

True, but his comment is, also, true.

[paborn]

I assure you that speaking as a tourist things in some places in Thailand are gettting really pricey for us too ! Indeed I can spend twice as long and spend half as much and get laid three times more in other places in SE asia than I do in Thailand now and that ( for me anyway) is and was a fact. I still go to Thailand for old time sake and yes still many cute guys about etc, but you are correct pricing in some venues now is getting prohibitive - and not because I can't afford it, just that I'm conciously choosing NOT to pay "any price they think of" to enjoy their establishments any longer. I think the last go go bar I walked out of in Soi twlight two weeks ago quoted me 500 or 550 baht for entry - before I bought a beer ! - screw that - show or not - and I told them so as I turned around and left without entering. They told me they could charge that as the Chinese DID pay it, I told them to look inside the bar, the place was empty at 10.30pm on a Friday night ! That should tell them all they need to know. But Thai logic at platy of course, no customers, put prices up to pay bar ! Good luck with that.

I used to say that even the most costly off in Bangkok could not compare with Europe and America ( rent boys ) ; but as age brings less urgency and the rising cost of air and hotel stays tourists are paying a great deal for the "cheap" sex.

Nirish - how about a report as to where you are better served? I have been searching the boards and find no good or compelling information about other places.

[Nirish guy]

...........the business was combating all the rumours and innuendo which are disasterous for any business..

Perhaps the businesses should inform their own staff of the party line they wish given out then to kill and rumours as I know I talked to several different bar guys in the Soi and got (roughly) the same answers from them all about moves and timelines for same ( all said at least a year away) - I actually doubt whether they even know any more than the rest of us as I'm guessing they too are working from the same rumour mill, but if the bars want a consistent party line put out then their own serving staff might be a good place to start perhaps.

[Nirish guy]

I used to say that even the most costly off in Bangkok could not compare with Europe and America ( rent boys ) ; but as age brings less urgency and the rising cost of air and hotel stays tourists are paying a great deal for the "cheap" sex.

Nirish - how about a report as to where you are better served? I have been searching the boards and find no good or compelling information about other places.

A) You're spot on re the "cheap" sex thing there - as once you get home and add up the bills a "cheap" holiday thailand aint anymore !

B) I purposefully don't / didn't bother with any formal trip reports anymore for a variety of reasons as I found you're damned if you do and damned if you dont. Also I'm aware that my BF (who is FULLY aware of who and what I am) also reads the Board sometimes for fun too ( with my full knowledge as he sits beside me when doing so as he reads in amazement - and disgust - some of the stuff farang write here) I feel it's better perhaps not to give too literal a running commentary on my (busy) pastimes in other Countries.

But in answer to your question, quite simply, one word - BALI. This trip I was also travelling with a friend who also has plently of experience right across Asia and he also concurs with me - and this is and was all for FREE I should add - for both of us so it;s not just either "me" or a one off thing it seems!. However as I said I've no wish to get into much more detail that that and risk having to listen to others posters opinions on my life and choices here so I'll leave that at that - suffice to say though that while they're busy commenting I'm just busy quietly gettting on with it - at a pace ! :)

[paborn]

Interesting. Somehow, I never think of Bali as part of SE Asia. I believe that Bali has the highest Hindu population in Indonesia, still I have a fear of gay activities in a Muslim country. I hasten to add that I'm not a Islamaphobe; it is the horror stories coming from areas where a fundamentalist- even a local govenor - gains power and starts a reign of terror.

[arsenal]

Paborn wrote.
"the rising cost of air and hotel stays tourists are paying a great deal for the "cheap" sex."

Both air fares and hotels are considerably cheaper (in.real terms) than they were 20 years ago and you can still get sex in Thailand for 1000 baht if you use the apps. Not to mention a really nice three course dinner for the price of a large bucket of cinema popcorn in New York or London. It's really only the go go bars where prices have gone up and even then I don't find 260 baht for a beer (X-Boys) particularly excessive considering they have a show and don't charge an entrance fee. A motorbike still only costs 150 baht a day, plenty of 3 star hotels for 1000 baht per night or less.

As for the Chinese well assuming they follow the European model what you'll get is package tourists first (check) then normal independent travellers (more and more) and then ex-pats owning businesses (beginning) so there is the possibility that a new tranche of foreigners will rejuvenate the gay scene in Pattaya.

[Oliver2]

I've been to Bali on four occasions, twice in late 1990s on my own and twice in recent years with P. I've stayed each time in Seminyak, apparently the centre of gay life. And "Seminyak, you ain't no Pattaya", though it has its positives. There is no equivalent to the go-go/offing scene with only a handful of gay bars available, nor are there host bars open from 1700 while the apps we explored out of curiosity didn't come close to offering the numbers of guys that Thailand's do.
Don't misunderstand me; I love Bali as a destination with P, even if the clogged-roads are a major problem if you wish to explore. Nor am I saying that there is no gay commercial sex available. It's just that the ease and comfort of participating in Thailand sets it apart.
By the way, hotels are cheaper in Thailand in each category from cheap to luxury. I cannot comment on the ease of entertaining visitors but the massage joints we tried (twice) were nowhere near the standard of Pattaya's either in terms of facilities, nor of available masseurs....but they were cheaper.
Despite all this, Bali is a remarkable destination and I recommend it. A boyfriend helps!

[arsenal]

Oliver wrote.
"Despite all this, Bali is a remarkable destination and I recommend it. A boyfriend helps!"

Do you mean by taking him with you or leaving.him at home? I believe both are practiced.

[paborn]

Paborn wrote.
"the rising cost of air and hotel stays tourists are paying a great deal for the "cheap" sex."

Both air fares and hotels are considerably cheaper (in.real terms) than they were 20 years ago and you can still get sex in Thailand for 1000 baht if you use the apps. Not to mention a really nice three course dinner for the price of a large bucket of cinema popcorn in New York or London. It's really only the go go bars where prices have gone up and even then I don't find 260 baht for a beer (X-Boys) particularly excessive considering they have a show and don't charge an entrance fee. A motorbike still only costs 150 baht a day, plenty of 3 star hotels for 1000 baht per night or less.

As for the Chinese well assuming they follow the European model what you'll get is package tourists first (check) then normal independent travellers (more and more) and then ex-pats owning businesses (beginning) so there is the possibility that a new tranche of foreigners will rejuvenate the gay scene in Pattaya.

The Chinese influx is, I suspect, what is keeping the bars alive and I'm grateful.

Of course, your right. in " real terms" But wages are stagnant in much of the developed world and retired people ( a good portion of the Pattaya visitors) are living off their savings. I live well, want for nothing and , while not wealthy, I can afford the trip. Yet, I use "rising" probably too losely as I meant that the airfare and hotels are set against a fixed or lower income than before.

I paid $1,500 USD for my emirates ticket and this is roughly the same amount I have paid for a decade. Trouble is a decade ago my income was rising, bonuses could be earned and I did not have to consider that I was selling capital to draw for my needs.

[Nirish guy]

...... "Seminyak, you ain't no Pattaya", though it has its positives. There is no equivalent to the go-go/offing scene with only a handful of gay bars available,!


Oliver it's weird as everything you've said is 100% correct and I've no doubt that that was your experience. Alternatively I can safely say that I'd a blast in the two main bars ( as you say not a patch on Patts but I found the fun was way more), likewise I found no need for the usual bar pick up routine as to be frank there was no shortage of willing victims either in the bars or online, but I guess if one decided not to use those avenues or the beach to pick up then I could see how it might appear that there's less action easily available there, but I can assure all that that most certainly is not the case.

Aside from that I agree with you too that Bali in general is a lovely place and has a lovely vibe - in my case though bringing a / my BF is the LAST thing I might want to do there perhaps ! :)

[Nirish guy]

I have a fear of gay activities in a Muslim country.

I think your fears are probably well grounded in most cases, however Bali is a different story as it's considered the "holiday island" of Indonesia and things are a LOT more relaxed there and a blind eye is turned to most gay activities ( as long as they dont rock the boat too much) but same sex couples etc are very much the norm and accepted there without any problem, Likewise the locals ( who mainly ARENT from Bali at all but some there from other Indonesian cities either on holiday or to work and as they too also realise that things are more relaxed there in relation to gay sex etc they then also actively go there for fun with Bules (white guys) too - hence the ease and availablity for fun should one desire it.

[Oceans]

I hang out in Twilight 5-6 nights a week. It is the middle of low season. Gonna be slow.
If someone at a gogo quoted 500 before drink, there was a language issue or doorman was wrong. Entrance fees aren’t charged that don’t include a drink. This price would have to be Dreamboys, and I gave hard time believing they are empty on a Friday night. X-Boys dropped their drink prices to 350 several months ago.

Much of the issues with Twilight seem like rumors and it is. But it’s the owners of the construction project working with the owners of Twilight businesses who are making the decisions and very few know what’s going on behind closed doors, except the owners.

You can get flights from New York and LA for as low as $600 starting in September when fall and winter rates take place.

The national pastime on these forums is complaining about the prices, but everyone seems to keep coming back.

[Nirish guy]

I hang out in Twilight 5-6 nights a week. It is the middle of low season. Gonna be slow.

Totally accept that.


If someone at a gogo quoted 500 before drink, there was a language issue or doorman was wrong. Entrance fees aren’t charged that don’t include a drink. This price would have to be Dreamboys, and I gave hard time believing they are empty on a Friday night.

You're right it was of course Dreamboys and no the 500 ( or 550 actually I seem to recall actually!) WAS the figure as that's what took me back a bit in thinking "WHAT". And whilst I normally would agree with you about the beer included thing I actually didn't see anything mentioning that on the sign - but I concede that could well have been the case. Re empty or not I'm speaking generally and whilst there may have been half a dozen people dotted around that was it and it certainly wasn't what we'd be used to in there, the Soi itself was almost EMPTY too and again that was on a Friday night - but as you say low season so perhaps not so surprising - but how long can we all keep using that "low season" answer when it's now a case of "high season" being about 6 or 8 weeks a year and the rest of the year being more like low season perhaps.


The national pastime on these forums is complaining about the prices, but everyone seems to keep coming back.

Yep, you're correct there also and that same conversation has been going for as long as the board has it seems and I doubt that'll change and yes many of us go back - and why not as there are of course lots of cute guys and it IS a holiday and not our usual every day lifes so a change there is always welcome - BUT - many of us now go other places as well and speaking personally I now only go about a quarter as much as I used to to Thailand and do go elsewhere instead and no matter what way we cut it that IS cheaper for me ( and every bit as enjoyable if not more so) - so will I stop going to Thailand, no probably not but will I go MORE, no, definitely not - and there in lies the problem for the bar owners I'm guessing ( not that I presume for a second that they give a fiddlers shit for me or my money of course as I do realise my business means nothing to them - except when their bars are lying half empty perhaps ?

[MiniMee]

The national pastime on these forums is complaining about the prices, but everyone seems to keep coming back.Well, not everyone.....

[scottish-guy]

Self-evidently not - or the bars (which are left) wouldn't be half empty, as is being widely reported

[paborn]

Totally accept that.


Yep, you're correct there also and that same conversation has been going for as long as the board has it seems and I doubt that'll change and yes many of us go back - and why not as there are of course lots of cute guys and it IS a holiday and not our usual every day lifes so a change there is always welcome - BUT - many of us now go other places as well and speaking personally I now only go about a quarter as much as I used to to Thailand and do go elsewhere instead and no matter what way we cut it that IS cheaper for me ( and every bit as enjoyable if not more so) - so will I stop going to Thailand, no probably not but will I go MORE, no, definitely not - and there in lies the problem for the bar owners I'm guessing ( not that I presume for a second that they give a fiddlers shit for me or my money of course as I do realise my business means nothing to them - except when their bars are lying half empty perhaps ?

Exactly, I did a trip report about Santo Domingo recently. Not what it used to be, but my old hustler friend acts as my "personal shopper" and I have a wonderful time. (90 minutes by air from Florida, reasonable airfare, airbnbn at great prices. It costs a lot less than Bangkok. Still I long to return, just not as often as I used to.

[arsenal]

.Minimee wrote.
"Well, not everyone....."

One trip in 10 years can still make one an expert with an opinion on everything, apparently.

[Andaman!]

Maybe sglad should indicate where he is living at the moment. I have been in Pattaya for a month but doubt you are.

This thread is about Soi Twilight. So what if SGLAD is not in Bangkok......neither are you as your own post clearly states that you are in Pattaya so Twilight is not exactly on your doorstep for nightly shenanigans.

This type of unnecessary and catty comment perhaps explains why you are LONELYWOMBAT and not just WOMBAT.

[frequent]

To be fair to The Wombat (and looking forward to another PM from him), sglad recently started a thread called "Where is Traveler Jim?". Perhaps Lonely is a particular chum of TJ's and is merely engaging in some sort of pay back?

[kjun12]

There's a long thread on Soi Twilight on Gaybutton's forum:
Hopefully, when I go there to check out this thread I, don't throw up. Anything dealing with him makes me sick

[werner]

This has become a meandering thread dealing with all sorts of issues.

Could some one please provide more information about what is happening in Soi Twilight now? For example, is Dream Boys still active and full of hot guys?

[I know that some members dislike Dream Boys and think that it is overpriced, but during almost every trip to Bangkok, I have met some great guys there.
And I have my own gripes about the place: I find the owner cold and curt, even though I have tried to talk to him in several languages--French, German, and English}

Most of the information on the Gaybutton discussion is outdated and irrelevant.

[frequent]

This has become a meandering thread dealing with all sorts of issues.Could some one please provide more information about what is happening in Soi Twilight now? For example, is Dream Boys still active and full of hot guys? .There's a really, really simple explanation, werner, when you think about it. Those who post here are either tourists or residents. The vast majority of tourists apparently go to Pattaya, and a significant proportion of residents live in Pattaya. The only point of Pattaya is the sex trade. Therefore you'll get detailed information on gogo bars in Pattaya from Pattayans or visitors to Pattaya. Those of us who live in Bangkok do so precisely because it is not centred on the sex trade and our trips to Soi Twilight (at least in my case) occur infrequently and because we're hosting a visiting friend who wants to go. Therefore our information will be patchy and incomplete. The most pertinent comment in this thread for you is post #25 from blueskytoday. He and NIrish both comment on the expensiveness of the gogo bar visit in Bangkok. If you want actual descriptions then you'd have to rely on another visitor, a447 - but he prefers the Golden Cock/Silom 6 area. I can't recall him mentioning Dream Boys, although there's a niggling feeling that he has reported on success with the Swede who owns Dream Boy and Bangkok Boys (and G.O.D. and ...). For myself I've never understood the need to chat with a bar owner, whether a gogo bar or somewhere like Connections, Stranger, Telephone or Balcony, but then I don't consider myself to be needy

As for what constitutes a "hot guy" - it's entirely in the eye of the beholder. For a friend of mine a "hot" guy is one who looks like a geek. Another won't touch a boy with tattoos, while a third will only go for a guy with extensive tattoos

[werner]

There's a really, really simple explanation, werner, when you think about it. Those who post here are either tourists or residents. The vast majority of tourists apparently go to Pattaya, and a significant proportion of residents live in Pattaya. The only point of Pattaya is the sex trade. Therefore you'll get detailed information on gogo bars in Pattaya from Pattayans or visitors to Pattaya. Those of us who live in Bangkok do so precisely because it is not centred on the sex trade and our trips to Soi Twilight (at least in my case) occur infrequently and because we're hosting a visiting friend who wants to go. Therefore our information will be patchy and incomplete. The most pertinent comment in this thread for you is post #25 from blueskytoday. He and NIrish both comment on the expensiveness of the gogo bar visit in Bangkok. If you want actual descriptions then you'd have to rely on another visitor, a447 - but he prefers the Golden Cock/Silom 6 area. I can't recall him mentioning Dream Boys, although there's a niggling feeling that he has reported on success with the Swede who owns Dream Boy and Bangkok Boys (and G.O.D. and ...). For myself I've never understood the need to chat with a bar owner, whether a gogo bar or somewhere like Connections, Stranger, Telephone or Balcony, but then I don't consider myself to be needy

As for what constitutes a "hot guy" - it's entirely in the eye of the beholder. For a friend of mine a "hot" guy is one who looks like a geek. Another won't touch a boy with tattoos, while a third will only go for a guy with extensive tattoos

Frequent,
Thanks for your interesting comments.

I always like to get to know --and chat a bit-- with the owners of the restaurants and other places I patronize. In Europe, the U.S., Japan, I have often gotten to know the owners.

By the way: Isn't the owner of Dream Boys, German, NOT Swedish? And does anyone know whether or not this go-go bar is still in operation? How many go go guys now work there and are available?

Yes, yes, there are great differences in what might be considered "hot. In the past, Dream Boys always had at least a couple of really hot guys.

[Smiles]

" ... our trips to Soi Twilight (at least in my case) occur infrequently and because we're hosting a visiting friend who wants to go ... ""Hosting a visiting friend"? How twee is that?
(Right, I've used that adjective twice now in two weeks, and apologies are necessary). Voltaire (Frequency's alter ego -- way ahead of Freud) had no friends either but still found himself constantly in some kind of ghastly Trumpian style Friends-Only-Rally all the time, continually being hoisted on one's own holiday petards... but thus goes history.

But where was I? Ah, yes, I agree ... Pattaya is certainly unique in it's sex-residents seeming necessity to run around with visiting newbies showing them The Scene: i.e. Big Cock Shows; Fuck Shows; Cum-In-My-Mouth Shows; Sit-On-My-Face Shows; Chuk Wow Shows (strictly for shy Mormons and lonely wombats); and, worst of all, Morlum Music Bars where Irish sex tourists insist that every Thai guy is 100% available simply because he's standing next to him at the urinal and taking a longish look at YOUR pathetic little cock.

At any rate... carry on with your friends (who may, or may not, exist).

[Nirish guy]

where Irish sex tourists insist that every Thai guy is 100% available simply because he's standing next to him at the urinal and taking a longish look at YOUR pathetic little cock.

God someone's in good form today it seems - NOT. And Colmx ! FFS ! What have I told you about running around those Morlam bars with your cock out ! You'll be getting us as bad a name as those Canadians FFS ! ( I had to stop and check that wasn't me there for a minute but no, I haven't been in a morlam bar in a LONG time ......plus my cock is delightful....well adequate I think was actually the word ( so I'm told) so, nope, couldn't possibly be me for once. PS .....it IS Pattaya.....so lets face it every Thai guy there IS probably 100% available - its more just a matter of when, how and for how much anyway ! Other places in Thailand of course not, pattaya.....well......

[gerefan2]

Werner..I will give you some straight forward answers without going into long excessive oblique English, which may not be your native language. Some people seem to think this is a Readers Digest forum...

Answer ..I was there last week. Most places open. Some moved to Patpong. Many boys available. Dreamboys open....OK!
Visit...

[colmx]

And Colmx ! FFS ! What have I told you about running around those Morlam bars with you cock out !

It can't be me either, I always go to the cubicles as I'm shy when people stare at my tiny cock!

[Nirish guy]

It can't be me either,


Well, that only leaves one other culprit then doesn't it .........so, it seems if he's not in Soi Twilight ( last week) he's out flashing his (tiny ?)....no sorry just checked....pathetic little cock about .......Gerefan ! I was going to say you should be ashamed......but hell it's pattaya so really no need to be as they've all done much worse I'm SURE.....

[gerefan2]

You handsome man...you have big cock.,,,

So many people have told me....they cant all be wrong surely?

[colmx]

Gerefan ! I was going to say you should be ashamed......

I never even knew Gerefan was Irish!
I do recall dragging both Joe252 and Ronan The Barbarian to both a Morlam concert on Soi 3 and Sinlapin Issan afterwards in January... so it could be one of those two dastardly guttersnipes!

[gerefan2]

I never even knew Gerefan was Irish!
!

He isn’t, but he is partial to the few pints of he black stuff!

[Manforallseasons]

Going back to the title of this thread......it is over...get over it!!!!!!.....Don't come to the gogo bars in Pattaya we who live in Pattaya like things just the way they are!

[Nirish guy]

Be careful what you wish for........

[frequent]

Pattaya is certainly unique in it's sex-residentsI see the greengrocer's apostrophe (https://blog.oxforddictionaries.com/2011/02/04/random-apostrophization/) is still alive and well

[gerefan2]

Grammar Nazi....some people think this forum is a training ground for the Booker Prize.

Anyway Im’ on frequents’ ignore list so I know hes’ not Going to see this unless someone quoteS it.

[Nirish guy]

Grammar Nazi....some people think this forum is a training ground for the Booker Prize.

Anyway Im’ on frequents’ ignore list so I know hes’ not Going to see this unless someone quoteS it.

I’m happy to oblige :-)

[arsenal]

the Eros in that sentence are not Nice and freaky willl show his Power to prove he's the Winner

[Tintin]

the Eros in that sentence are not Nice and freaky willl show his Power to prove he's the Winner

that's not necessary a Good thing but Krazy as a Dragon!

[gerefan2]

the Eros in that sentence are not Nice and freaky willl show his Power to prove he's the Winner

The clown, sorry clone... actually I was right fist time... never goes to Pattaya so you can imagine him arriving and planning to go for a drink at Oscars, before eating in Amor, whilst looking to take a boy from Prisma or Kawaii and thinking he is booked to stay at the Cafe Royal.

At least he will have plenty of time to fill the Everything Else forum with those endless crappy cut and paste jobs from the High Brow comics he obviously can only afford to read online.

[werner]

Werner..I will give you some straight forward answers without going into long excessive oblique English, which may not be your native language. Some people seem to think this is a Readers Digest forum...

Answer ..I was there last week. Most places open. Some moved to Patpong. Many boys available. Dreamboys open....OK!
Visit...

Thanks for addressing my questions and providing some information! I will look forward to visiting Soi Twilight during my next trip to Bangkok. Hopefully I will be able to visit Bangkok in September.

And I hope that Dream Boys will have hot guys, as during past visits. I will ignore the owner; the staff have always been helpful and friendly, although they often beg me for tips.....

[Nirish guy]

I will ignore the owner..

Which is EXACTLY the action he actively seeks and encourages.

[scottish-guy]

..some people think this forum is a training ground for the Booker Prize...

Hooker prize would be more apposite

[a447]

Which is EXACTLY the action he actively seeks and encourages.

Actually, my experience of him is the exact opposite.

I've always found him very charming and very chatty, despite his somewhat dour appearance. He's a really nice guy with lots of interesting stories to tell.

He has hardly lived in Germany, having moved to Sweden when he was a child. He has led an unusual life and if you give him the time, he'll tell you all about it.

He'll also give you the low-down on doing business in Thailand and its many pitfalls.

If I'm in Soi Twilight I'll often go up and say hello. It also gives me a chance to practise my German as these days I rarely get the chance to speak it.

[paborn]

Good for you. We get out of relationships what we are willing to put in.

[sglad]

If I'm in Soi Twilight I'll often go up and say hello. It also gives me a chance to practise my German as these days I rarely get the chance to speak it.

So who do you practise your English with?

[werner]

Actually, my experience of him is the exact opposite.

I've always found him very charming and very chatty, despite his somewhat dour appearance. He's a really nice guy with lots of interesting stories to tell.

He has hardly lived in Germany, having moved to Sweden when he was a child. He has led an unusual life and if you give him the time, he'll tell you all about it.

He'll also give you the low-down on doing business in Thailand and its many pitfalls.

If I'm in Soi Twilight I'll often go up and say hello. It also gives me a chance to practise my German as these days I rarely get the chance to speak it.

A447, Thanks for your insights and info. I should NOT be so critical of the owner of Dream Boys--perhaps I somehow inadvertently offended him.

[frequent]

A447, Thanks for your insights and info. I should NOT be so critical of the owner of Dream Boys--perhaps I somehow inadvertently offended him.And as you can see, he is a German - but also a Swede - hence the confusion

[Nirish guy]

--perhaps I somehow inadvertently offended him.

I wouldn’t worry too much about that as if you did it seems that youre one of many as the guy isn’t known for charm and outgoing going personality perhaps and A447s experiences with him are I’m guessing the exception rather than the norm.

Going back to the point at the start of thread though I’m more surprised why you’d even bother trying to befriend either him or any busy bar city centre bar owner as surely other than being polite with you ( which isn’t even the case always with this particular guy it seems) surely any interaction would only be superficial and one of just going through the motions for them and you might as well just talk to a bar boy and have the usual “what your name, how long you stay Thailand” conversation for all it means ?

[werner]

I wouldn’t worry too much about that as if you did it seems that youre one of many as the guy isn’t known for charm and outgoing going personality perhaps and A447s experiences with him are I’m guessing the exception rather than the norm.

Going back to the point at the start of thread though I’m more surprised why you’d even bother trying to befriend either him or any busy bar city centre bar owner as surely other than being polite with you ( which isn’t even the case always with this particular guy it seems) surely any interaction would only be superficial and one of just going through the motions for them and you might as well just talk to a bar boy and have the usual “what your name, how long you stay Thailand” conversation for all it means ?


Thanks for your comments.

I still do not understand why the owner of Dream Boys has been curt and cold to me. Through the years, I have gone to the bar at least 30 times, and have offed at least 10 guys -- all have provided excellent service.

Perhaps the owner was offended because I started a conversation with him in German. Maybe he considers himself Swedish and does not want to be reminded of his German origins. [I should NOT generalize, but some Germans seem to have all sorts of hang-ups about their nationality and country.]

Several forum members have questioned why I would want to be friendly and chatty with a bar owner. Maybe this is because I come from a small Swiss town, where I always knew the owners of the restaurants and shops I patronized.

I should note that owners of several gay venues in Thailand have been most gracious and friendly.
--The owner of Coffee Boy in Chiangmai, where I once stayed for 4 or 5 days, was very chatty and friendly, and provided detailed information about the local gay scene and his staff.
--The elegant owner of the [now closed?] host bar Adam & Eve in Pattaya was extremely gracious and friendly the several times I visited her bar. She [is this the correct pronoun?] provided detailed and accurate information about the guys who worked in the venue. She even gave me her telephone number and told me to call if I ever needed any information or help. As I recall, she spoke good English and decent French....
--The half-Japanese, half Thai owner of the the [now closed] Masuda Superlex bar always tried to be friendly and helpful even though we didn't speak a common language, but he specifically asked his British transgender mama-san to help me. [What ever happened to her? She later worked at Midnight Cowboys....]

This is the service I expect from venues I patronize. This is the service that is offered at shops and restaurants in my small Swiss hometown, at least to people that speak French, preferably with a Swiss accent.



--

[Nirish guy]

I still do not understand why the owner of Dream Boys has been curt and cold to me. --

Because sometimes some people are just ignorant cunts and have no manners or wish to interact with others - surely having reached your age in life you've experienced this before, it really cant be a first for you - is it ?

As my thai friends would say "maybe you tink too much" - just take people as you find them, if you're nice to them and they're nice to you great but if not ( for whatever reason) simply move on and don't let them or whatever they've got going on in their lives bother you ( so much apparently)

[werner]

Because sometimes some people are just ignorant cunts and have no manners or wish to interact with others - surely having reached your age in life you've experienced this before, it really cant be a first for you - is it ?

As my thai friends would say "maybe you tink too much" - just take people as you find them, if you're nice to them and they're nice to you great but if not ( for whatever reason) simply move on and don't let them or whatever they've got going on in their lives bother you ( so much apparently)

Good advice! Thanks!

Yes, I have encountered a lot of nasty people in many countries during the 70+ years of my life, but very, very few in Thailand. And this is one of the reasons I enjoy Thailand so much.

[paborn]

After all this discussion I hesitate to admidt that I never noticed the owner of Dream Boys, I can't even estimate the number of times I've been there. I guess I go there to shop and he's - well, not what I'm looking shopping for. Come Jnauary I'll have a look. Frankly, I'm so myopic I thought the transvestite mamasan at Super Lex was the owner - oh well, it was my happy hunting ground for years.

[a447]

I can best judge the German guy from my own experiences with him.

When I first saw him I thought, What a miserable old bastard! Here he was, running a very successful bar in Thailand and raking in the money, yet always looking unhappy and unapproachable.

So one night I decided to approach him. I asked him, in German, how he was going and what business was like. To my surprise he engaged with me in conversation and we had a very enjoyable chat.

I wasn't looking for friendship; rather, I was interested in what it was like to run a business in Thailand.

And that's why I used to sit and chat with Neal outside Happy Place in Pattaya. It was more of a monologue with Neal doing all the talking, but I found his stories about the trials and tribulations of running a gay bar fascinating.

And unlike the German, who has always been very interested in my life and has asked me many questions, Neal never asked me a single question - it was all about him.

I take people as they come and consider myself to be non-judgemental - until the bullshit starts. To me, he comes across as very genuine.

I also tend to trust people. Ok, I got it wrong with Neal but we live and learn.

So as far as I'm concerned, the German is a really nice, friendly guy. That may be because I don't go up to him and constantly complain about the over-priced drinks in Dreamboys. I also know he's suffering various serious health problems - nothing to smile about, I'd imagine.

But I'm guessing here.

I also remember a conversation I had a few years ago with a guy who worked at Dreamboys and he described him as "a good boss. Good heart".

So who knows?

[Nirish guy]

You may well be right - and my comment about "some people are cunts" wasn't directed at him in particular, more just in general. Maybe he's the nicest guy on the planet, I've no idea.

[sglad]

Where would the Forum - not to mention business publications generally - be without it? Gossip and speculation, after all, formed the original basis for the Watergate investigation and the current probe by Mueller of Trump. You could argue it had a role in bringing down the government in Malaysia recently. It's part of what it means to be an open society, not a semi-closed dictatorship like Thailand

No, it doesn't. In an open society, people would be free to speak their minds on the many platforms available and theoretically have access to a freer press and a variety of news sources, thereby reducing the need for/incidence of gossip and speculation. If anything, it is in closed or semi-closed societies and dictatorships that gossip and rumour-mongering tend to breed and thrive.

[paborn]

The current investigation of Trump was not started by gossip. The Trump staffer drunk in London did gossip with the Australian Ambassador but the ambassador followed protocol and reported it to US contacts. We are, after all, allies. Hard to see that as gossip.

[frequent]

The current investigation of Trump was not started by gossip. The Trump staffer drunk in London did gossip with the Australian Ambassador but the ambassador followed protocol and reported it to US contacts. We are, after all, allies. Hard to see that as gossip.For someone who accuses me of selective quoting this is rather a bizarre post. What I said was "gossip and speculation". The usual definition of gossip includes "idle talk", so you seem to be taking a rather narrow view of what gossip is, if you think a conversation in a bar is not gossip

[paborn]

Actually, I was not posting about you. I acknowledged that gossip started the process - a drunken George popadapoulas - but the actual investigation started with a proper reporting using diplomastic channels. If you listen to American news every day as I do the Trump camp calls it gossip and fake news. The facts started that way but the Justice Department acted according to sound imformation.

[Blueskytoday]

So whats happening on Soi Twilight...get back to the original post..not politics

[frequent]

So whats happening on Soi Twilight...get back to the original post..not politicsOpinions swing between SFA (Sweet Fuck All) and FIIK (Fucked If I Know)

[werner]

I can best judge the German guy from my own experiences with him.

When I first saw him I thought, What a miserable old bastard! Here he was, running a very successful bar in Thailand and raking in the money, yet always looking unhappy and unapproachable.

So one night I decided to approach him. I asked him, in German, how he was going and what business was like. To my surprise he engaged with me in conversation and we had a very enjoyable chat.

I wasn't looking for friendship; rather, I was interested in what it was like to run a business in Thailand.

And that's why I used to sit and chat with Neal outside Happy Place in Pattaya. It was more of a monologue with Neal doing all the talking, but I found his stories about the trials and tribulations of running a gay bar fascinating.

And unlike the German, who has always been very interested in my life and has asked me many questions, Neal never asked me a single question - it was all about him.

I take people as they come and consider myself to be non-judgemental - until the bullshit starts. To me, he comes across as very genuine.

I also tend to trust people. Ok, I got it wrong with Neal but we live and learn.

So as far as I'm concerned, the German is a really nice, friendly guy. That may be because I don't go up to him and constantly complain about the over-priced drinks in Dreamboys. I also know he's suffering various serious health problems - nothing to smile about, I'd imagine.

But I'm guessing here.

I also remember a conversation I had a few years ago with a guy who worked at Dreamboys and he described him as "a good boss. Good heart".

So who knows?

a447,

Thanks for writing in some detail.

I feel very, very bad about having made some derogatory remarks about the owner of Dream Boys. I would like to apologize to him and to his friends.

He has run an interesting and successful bar that I have visited many times. Perhaps when I approached him to say hello, he just was very busy or in a bad mood.

If and when I visit the bar again, I will apologize to him personally if he is there. I hope that he will accept my sincere apology.

P.S. I wonder if he and the other owners/managers of the gay venues read this forum.....

[werner]

So whats happening on Soi Twilight...get back to the original post..not politics

If anyone has news about what is happening at Soi Twilight, please reply!

[scottish-guy]

I see the greengrocer's apostrophe (https://blog.oxforddictionaries.com/2011/02/04/random-apostrophization/) is still alive and well

Apparently it even survives chemicals which kill 99.9% of everything else:

7733

[frequent]

Apparently it even survives chemicals which kill 99.9% of everything elseSuch as RoundUp (http://fortune.com/2018/08/11/monsanto-roundup-cancer-trial-verdict/)? What an an unfortunate name. It always reminds me of that line from the Two Ronnies about the Sheepdog Bra - "rounds them up and points them in the right direction" (one for you, poshglasgow)

[a447]

I feel very, very bad about having made some derogatory remarks about the owner of Dream Boys. I would like to apologize to him and to his friends.

He has run an interesting and successful bar that I have visited many times. Perhaps when I approached him to say hello, he just was very busy or in a bad mood.

If and when I visit the bar again, I will apologize to him personally if he is there. I hope that he will accept my sincere apology. .

That's a very generous gesture on your behalf but perhaps an apology is not needed. Up to you.

And judging from the accounts given here by other members he can, at times, be unpleasant.

I was simply pointing out that he has always been nice to me and treated me with respect.

Your point about him running a successful bar is valid; he has somehow managed to prosper when so many others have failed and I respect his business acumen, which has provided us with so much fun over the years.

[bkkguy]

Opinions swing between SFA (Sweet Fuck All) and FIIK (Fucked If I Know)

actually on discussion forums it is usually knowledge that swings between SFA and FIIK, while opinions - even when based on such knowledge - are usually much more explicitly expressed, this has been particularly so when discussing the best "solution" for the Twilight venues for when the soi is re-developed next week/month/year/decade

bkkguy

[bastrecht]

So is soi Twilight still open and good for to find twink boys?

[Blueskytoday]

As usual this goes off topic again..

[gerefan2]

So is soi Twilight still open and good for to find twink boys?

Yes

[bkkguy]

So is soi Twilight still open and good for to find twink boys?


Yes

yes Blueskytoday I can see why you want to stay on topic - it's just so riveting

bkkguy

[bastrecht]

Yes

Thanks!