A potential problem?

[joe552]

This isn't the only internet forum I post to (go on, call me an internet slut, I don't care). It occurs to me, though, that I'm sure many of us are on different sites at the same time, What if our concentration slipped for that vital minute?

I'm a member of a local community forum in Dublin, focusing on old photos of our grandparents and their stories. What if, late at night, after a bottle or thee, I inadvertently post there about the 18 year old I shagged from Sunee? They're a nice bunch of mainly middle aged people, like myself, but I think it might be reported to the admin of the site.

So how to guard against such a slip-up?

[bobsaigon2]

I’ve been worried about the same thing, Joe. What if the text of one of my SGT posts was inadvertently included in an email to my sisters, my business partner, my employees?

Of course if things went wrong, we could always try
“It wasn’t me”
“Someone hacked my email account and is sending salacious messages”
”My laptop was stolen. Sorry if you got any offensive emails”

Long ago, during my very brief FB experience, a guy in Manila decided to insert “In partnership with James” on my home page. My excuse to my sisters was that James was a disgruntled brother of a young lady I met in the Philippines. I think that worked.

So, post sober and wide awake are the only safeguards I can recommend.

[joe552]

Good advice bob, only problem is the "post sober" bit. Ain't gonna happen

[latintopxxx]

dunno joe..u might just liven up that community group...would be real funny..

[goji]

This is an unlikely scenario.

A more likely scanario is to accidentally e-mail erotic photos on one's PC or phone ? One false button press from the Android photo gallery & the photo is already attached to an e-mail. All it needs is a second button press to put in a recipient and a third one to send (or something like that).

Or much more likely, simply attaching the wrong file to an e-mail.

[Nirish guy]

Or just live an open and honest life and then you'll not have to worry about screwing up or giving a shit what anyone else thinks anyway ....you could always try that ?

[joe552]

goji, I have no idea what you just said. I don't have a smartphone. But you seem to suggest it takes 3 steps to do this - shirley you'd notice by then?

NIrish, I do live an open, honest and celibate life here in Dublin. My important siblings II have 2 of lesser importance) know my taste, but I don't want them to know the graphic details.

[latintopxxx]

worst case scenario is a " pocket call" or in this case a pocket email or sms with pics attached...

[joe552]

latiin, I have no idea what you just said.

[Nirish guy]

latiin, I have no idea what you just said.

You need to get with the programme Joe, my mother is 80+ and would understand that and carry out such functions regularly on one of her many devices - usually much to my annoyance when I discover her creating "groups" and all sorts on WhatsApp etc and usually include distant family members on same, when who the people she's listing can barely all can't stand each other and all without her realising what she's ACTUALLY doing ( or so she claims, perhaps she's just a wicked sense of humour !?)

Likewise she gets very pissed off with the "man" who delivers her emails when he "doesn't" - or more accurately when he doesn't get this done "before he leaves in the evenings" ( this is usually after she gets a "undeliverable" bounce message back). Likewise if it's during the day I'm then told that "the man who looks after her emails" may well be on his lunch break but she's sure he'll be back soon to look after it "as he always sends all her other stuff quite promptly she finds" :)

To be fair this was a while ago now and she IS actually reasonably savvy now and does send pics and attachments and starts video chats and all sorts now all on her own - so yes Joe, time to brush up on your tech it seems when an 80 year old woman is starting to show you up !

[joe552]

Now, how can I put this? I HATE technology, and will have to be dragged, kicking and screaming, before I get an I Phonel I've had no credit on my phone for the last 2 weeks; Has anybody noticed: Of course notl.

That' my little rant over.

[latintopxxx]

joe..pocket call is when u have your phone in your pocket..or in your case in your handbag and its unlocked and u accidentally make a call or send a nonsensical sms..

[joe552]

thanks latin, but be careful, you could turn into my "go to guy" on tech matters.

[bobsaigon2]

Or just live an open and honest life and then you'll not have to worry about screwing up or giving a shit what anyone else thinks anyway ....you could always try that ?

Nirish, a couple of bones to pick with you, if I may. "Just live an open and honest life...." Is it really as easy as that where you live and where you work? And is it really easy to not give a shit what anyone else thinks? Well, yes, for some people it is. For many, it isn't. People (like me) don't come out either (or both) because they don't want to make their family or professional life difficult, or because they are not comfortable with what people might think of them. This could be considered a lack of courage or it could simply be because they prefer not to be the cause of conflicted emotions or discomfort in others. Tons of stuff written about this and I know I am not expressing myself clearly.

At home, people know you're living with a male partner and you're certainly not concealing anything. Fine, that works for you. I've no idea what people at your workplace know about you.

Joe has come out to some of his family. I don't see why he should expand on that. There are still many situations when people would not react in a supportive manner if they knew one was gay. Personally, I just don't see how it would help my business, or make my sisters feel better, if I came out. Simple as that.

-------------------------------------------------------------

The other bone: I am absolutely, 100% in agreement with Joe when he says "I HATE technology, and will have to be dragged, kicking and screaming, before I get an iPhone". I know some 80+ yr old people enjoy manipulating smart phones and I have seen 3 yr old children here in Vietnam managing the phones and iPads quite well, but I have yet to be convinced that there is a need to become a customer of Apple or Samsung. My business partner gave me an iPhone and not long after that it joined the stable of cyber devices managed by my life partner. I'm fine with my dumb Nokia and look forward to growing old(er) along side it. :)

[joe552]

Good morning bob, hope you're doing okay. It's just about 4am here in Dublin, so a long morning ahead.

Thanks for agreeing with me about the smartphone issue. My sister, who is 2 years older than me, and doesn't use a computer at work (she works in a coffee shop) got a tablet as a gift from her son. She loves it, and spends a lot of time on Facebook, and playing silly games. Not my idea of fun.

Regarding coming out - all my family know I'm gay. It's really become a non-issue, something we rarely talk about, 'cos there's no need, especially among the younger generation. But I'm aware that for some of our generation, that isn't always the case.

[bobsaigon2]

I have to admit that my comments to Nirish are not coming from someone who lives in the US or Europe, where things may very well have changed since my last prolonged residence there decades ago. In my current life, Vietnamese people are obviously aware of the age difference when they see my partner with me, but they are likely to think he is my care giver rather than my life partner. Some who have quietly inquired about the truth of the matter have done so with a sympathetic smile. Our situation is well known to my partner's family, but it is not a subject of discussion among them.

[joe552]

Thanks for sharing that bob

[latintopxxx]

bob u r lying to yourself if u really believe that they think he is your carer....

[joe552]

latin, that was a typical, but totally unnecessary post

[a447]

bob u r lying to yourself if u really believe that they think he is your carer....

Why wouldn't they think he's bob's carer?

We're talking about Vietnam here, not Thailand.

And Saigon, not Pattaya.

I have both gay and straight friends and I came out right at the beginning with my straight friends. If anyone ever had a problem with it, they would not be a friend and I'd have nothing to do with them.

I told my parents over dinner one night when I was about 15. I think dad's reaction was something along the lines of "Really? Pass the sugar, please."

Mum also appeared totally fine with my sudden admission, although I think deep down she probably wasn't at first.

The only time I kept it quiet was at school. I would have been crucified.

[Smiles]

Joe's angst is quite funny actually. I can just see the faces of the old Coots on the Photograph Forum when your post comes up from you on the detailed delicacies of rimming, then screwing, a 19 year old who loved every minute of it.

Gotta love it. I'd like to be a fly on the wall with those boys! :D :D

[Nirish guy]

[QUOTE=bobsaigon2;229795] Is it really as easy as that where you live and where you work? And is it really easy to not give a shit what anyone else thinks? Well, yes"/QUOTE]

Thanks Bob, you saved me a lot of typing there with your final two words there as that would have been my answer.

"At home, people know you're living with a male partner and you're certainly not concealing anything. Fine, that works for you. I've no idea what people at your workplace know about you."

Everything. I've no secrets from anyone anywhere in the world ( which feels great) as a) I dont need to have and b) that is I'm not doing anything that I consider wrong or that needs hidden in the first place - and yes before anyone asks yes that includes going to Thailand and fucking guys half my age if I chose too. Whilst thats my business and no one else's I certainly dont try or need to hide that fact in anyway, as why would I, because of other peoples views or opinions maybe ? I REALLY and honestly could care less what anyone else thinks of me or my life. Also honestly I find that aside from the odd dickhead trying to "look" like they're disgusted by gay people, honestly generally speaking I find that other people couldn't REALLY give a shit and are way too busy just struggling to get on with their lives and problems every day to REALLY give a toss about me or my life - and again if they did, I really don't care anyway so......


"Personally, I just don't see how it would help my business, or make my sisters feel better, if I came out. Simple as that."

Now see here's why I hate these types of conversations as it always sounds like one person saying to the other "no you're wrong" so please understand and I mean this genuinely and most respectfully, but IN MY VIEW ( and in my experience as I used to think exactly like you do before I came out and was almost crippled at the very thought or prospect of EVER coming out) but no, I can honestly tell you that I've experienced absolutely no negative side to coming out whatsoever. In fact from a mental health position it only ever been a positive thing for me as it changed my whole perspective on life in a positive way as I stopped being racked with the "guilt" many gay men and brought up to feel from society's historical never ended putting down of gay people. Once I realised that I WASNT fucked up and being gay was "ok" all that (enforced) guilt was immediately lifted ( I dropped it) from my shoulders and never looked back.

Re coming our affecting business (which I worried about too) as far as I know I haven't lost one single customer because I'm gay and out and nor have my businesses suffered in any measurable way. In fact its actually quite the opposite probably as the only net effect of my coming out in work has again been a positive one as my staff ( and customers) benefited from me being more open and relaxed and generally not giving a shit about things so much anymore as I realised I really was worrying over nothing in the bigger scheme of things. And in case you're thinking "ahhh maybe your customers dont know" well as I fucked up and actually came out in a double page spread in one of our National newspapers by mistake ( long story) I doubt there's many in this small place who DIDN'T read it ! lol

So, as I said I REALLY dont mean to sound either disrespectful or unaware of your views as trust me I know EXACTLY where you're coming from and what fears and concerns you probably hold, but I HONESTLY consider coming out as probably THE most important thing I've done in my life (generally speaking and definitely from a mental health point of view) as it's allowed me to BE ME ( whoever that is) and to let go of all the fear, worry and baggage that choosing to stay in the closet brought.

I DO realise that is and was a personal decision of mine and again I ABSOLUTELY respect everyone's right to come out or not as it is of course a personal choice that each of us decide upon and for some on a ongoing basis. But I can only tell you my experience and as I say that, has only been positive - and by the way I don't mean my life is all rainbows and glitter, I just mean re normal everyday life stuff and just getting on with things.

Being gay ( in the west anyway - and I'm guessing most other places where it isn't "illegal" really isn't such a big deal these days (IHMO). OK - so cue the AHHHH BUT YOU DONT UNDERSTAND, it's not easy for me becuase xx ........ I do understand, we all have our own reasons why we convince ourselves its maybe not such a good idea, some reasons maybe enough, maybe some not, maybe some based on age and just not wanting to bother but most probably based on nothing more than a lifetime of fear, guilt and repression as thats how society made us all feel growing up. Thankfully those days HAVE changed and my advice to anyone now would be just to be yourself and to hell with anyone else's view or opinion of you, good or bad as life is too short to be anyone OTHER than your REAL self !

Sorry for the long post or if that sounded like preaching, it wasn't meant to and again I totally respect anyone's view to make up their own mind about such things, but (seeing you asked:-) that's where I'm at re that subject.

[joe552]

Joe's angst is quite funny actually. I can just see the faces of the old Coots on the Photograph Forum when your post comes up from you on the detailed delicacies of rimming, then screwing, a 19 year old who loved every minute of it.

Gotta love it. I'd like to be a fly on the wall with those boys! :D :D

Smiles, if I find the idea of fucking arse a turn off, how do you think I feel about rimming?

[bobsaigon2]

Thanks, Nirish, I really do appreciate the time, effort and desire to help that went into your post and I suspect you are 100% right about nothing negative resulting from my coming out to family and business associates.

[joe552]

NIrish, that was some powerful post. Should be shared with every 14 year old at school. That's a genuine thanks from me.

[Nirish guy]

Thanks, Nirish, I really do appreciate the time, effort and desire to help that went into your post and I suspect you are 100% right about nothing negative resulting from my coming out to family and business associates.

Obviously without knowing your circumstances no one can be sure about anything, but in my experience it just didn't really matter - and again if it DOES to someone, then so what, that's THEIR problem to deal with not yours, you're just getting on and living your life and life really is to short to worry about other peoples ( probably non) reaction.

My mother did a bit of weeping and wailing for about a week until she realised rather than my worrying and breaking down crying about that I was more looking at her as if to say "REALLY, wise UP mother, no big deal, get over yourself" - and within a fairly short while she did. I'm sure she's still not delighted at the "idea" of her son being gay but she's now out and about shopping with my BF every week and I hardly get a look in, life has a strange way of just carrying on. My advice for what it's worth is not to THINK of it as a big deal ( as it's REALLY not) and if you don't others won't either. in fact sometimes I'm positively pissed off by the LACK of any real reaction as my having built it up in SUCH a big way in my own head once I did come up I thought "WHAT, is that IT ?! What all these years of hiding and wrecking my own nerves and watching every word and my actions for fear of giving myself away and this is the result - NOTHING !?? I at LEAST surely deserve a few disparaging looks - nope, not even that, more a "oh right ok" or a "yeah so what" or a "what and you think we didn't know already" and trust me I'm not *that" camp even.

I should add for full disclosure that after years of wrecking my own head I eventually went to a gay charity here who had laid on a gays mans personal development course type course thing. This was held on 8 nights over the period of a few weeks and was basically a group session of personal empowerment type lessons, which at the end of the course made me / us all realise just HOW much society had made us feel as shit about ourselves as it did and why we absolutely shouldn't.

For instance on one of the evenings they ran a course about body image and about how so many gay men HATE themselves and how they look and how basically that's all bullshit and those thoughts are driven by nothing more than our own insecurities.

They also held a night that centred on what we thought about "what others think about us" and that was amazing too as we all had to write down exactly what we thought the others in the group felt about us ( bluntly and honestly) and also write down what we felt about the others in the group - then later and without knowing what would happen we had to read out our own "fears" about what we KNEW people would say about us - and TO A MAN EVERY SINGLE ONE OF US got it entirely WRONG !! We all had lists and lists of negative thoughts and feelings about how we came across to others when in reality once we read the others notes aloud they all said EXACTLY the OPPOSITE to what we had written - the point being that it's SUCH a waste of time worrying about what you THINK people think or are thinking of you as in reality you actually have NO idea about that - so why waste time worrying - and even if you're right about what they're thinking then SO WHAT still as what they think really isn't your business anyway.

I could go on re that course as it really WAS very empowering and when you added it to reading a few books such as "The Velvet Rage" etc ( give it a read) you then realised just HOW much baggage gay men have been forced to carry round with us all, until the day you finally decide to say "fuck this".

Actually the moment I decided enough was enough was when I found myself standing in a gay bar in Gran Canaria many years ago, talking to two quite old (mature) gay men and listening to myself waffle on about "how I wasn't gay you know" and "I was only in for a drink when passing" etc when one of the men gently put his hand on my shoulder and every so softly said in my ear "Son, it's ok, you dont need to explain anything to us just now, but son.... are you not tired yet?" - and his comment hit my like freight train as I realised there and then he was absolutely right and that I wasn't just tired but I was bloody EXHAUSTED and all from a lifetime of "living the lie" and THAT was the moment I said "ah fuck it" ( and no before anyone asks they didn't try to fuck me afterwards ! :)

So, I have those two older gentlemen to thank for my happier life now and this post ( to whoever may read it in the future and think "you know what he's right, I'M EXHAUSTED TOO" is I guess my thanks and payback to them taking up their valuable time with the young scared straight gay they met that night in a gay bar.

[joe552]

NIrish, another powerful post, and one that will bear reading again tomorrow, thanks for taking the time.

[latintopxxx]

funny...i came out at 14...or should I say i was outed when I was caught having my dick sucked in the school toilets ...so the whole school knew..and after that the fun increased as all the horny ones knew where to come for some fun...neighbour told my mom..and her reply was.." as if I didnt already know"...?!?!..mothers always know.
My dad wasnt really bothered...he probably assumed I was gay as I had shown no interest in soccer or cars..
So me being gay just kinda happened..wasnt a big news flash.
At work I dont advertise it but I dont hide it..I did lose a job once due to a very religiously homophobic boss (he was evangelical baptist or something)..I could have taken legal action but just couldnt be bothered with all the hassle ...anyway when I resigned 3 of his biggest customers followed me...so guess thats enough payback.
Sexually gay beats straight...when i was at school and my friends would get all excited because finally they managed to grab a feel of some tit..I would almost choke with laughter..here I was having full blown anal sex on a regular basis...even now the average straight guy has probably had less than a dozen sex partners...thats a slow quarter for me.

[sglad]

bob u r lying to yourself if u really believe that they think he is your carer....

Yeah, they know. A straight man would usually have a female carer unless there's heavy lifting involved, in which case the wife would bring in male help. If you've never been married or never had a girlfriend, especially in places like Vietnam, Thailand or the Philippines (just to name a few) where western men are generally assumed to come for the women and the cheap lifestyle, they'd just assume you were gay and were there for the boys. No biggy.

Somebody said somewhere in one of these threads that he didn't know or wasn't sure whether the long-term relationship he had with his partner was love or not. I think you need to respect and love yourself for who you are before you can give or receive love. If you can't even be honest with yourself as to your sexuality, how could you even begin to define the relationship you have with someone else, other than it's some kind of arrangement. I'm lucky to have experienced romantic love from the time I was 16 and to know that someone loves you simply from the way he looks at you, is a very special, indescribable feeling.

By the way, Joe, remember when I wrote about gay guys compartmentalising their lives in the other thread? I think some of the responses in this one are reflective of that.

[sglad]

I told my parents over dinner one night when I was about 15. I think dad's reaction was something along the lines of "Really? Pass the sugar, please."


Sometimes I really envy guys who are so obviously gay that it makes coming out so much easier. "Hey guys, I have something to tell you, I'm GAY!" "Yeah, does the Queen speak English?"

[latintopxxx]

wonder what they eat at dinner that needs sugar?!

[sglad]

wonder what they eat at dinner that needs sugar?!

They just found out that their son was gay: they had spice and everything nice so the only thing missing was the sugar.

[joe552]

Of course the Queen speaks English, and the Pope is Norwegian.

[a447]

Sometimes I really envy guys who are so obviously gay that it makes coming out so much easier.

I wrote:


The only time I kept it quiet was at school. I would have been crucified.

I was not "obviously" gay.

Obviously.

Please brush up on your comprehension skills before you post a reply.

[a447]

wonder what they eat at dinner that needs sugar?!

Dessert. Crème brûlée. We sprinkled the amount of sugar we wanted on top.

[joe552]

One wonders if she has a hankering for German sausage, while Phil the Greek enjoys his feta cheese?

[Smiles]

Smiles, if I find the idea of fucking arse a turn off, how do you think I feel about rimming?Simply metaphors of lust Joe, metaphors of lust.

I'm beginning to think your sense of ha ha ha ha (i.e. 5 5 5 5) is entering Cndmatt territory. Don't let that happen no matter what you do ... you might return from KK blind.

[FarangRuMak]

I suppose the ultimate safeguard is never again shag an 18 year old in Sunnee.
This will even prevent your bolting up in the bed and wakening your nephews/nieces over Christmas with shouts of “Give me my money back you fake Bottom Sunnee Boy!”

[joe552]

Smiles,my lack of 555 humour regarding anal sex is well documented here. Nothing to do with Matt.

[sglad]

I was not "obviously" gay.


"Son, it's ok, you dont need to explain anything to us just now, but son.... are you not tired yet?"


:))

[joe552]

I honestly don't understand this thing of "you have to love yourself before you can love someone else". I'm being serious here. How does loving yourself actually manifest itself? Smiles loves Pot, Matt loves Leo, SG has at least strong feeling for his Vietnamese friend.

Maybe I've been single too long.

[Yraen]

Maybe I've been single too long.

No Joe. If being single is "what floats your boat" then get on with it. It takes a special kind of person to decide they are fine being single. And exactly the same kind of person who decides they prefer being partnered.

For myself, I prefer being partnered. But after a partnership fails, there is usually a 3-5 years interregnum of single-ness before I am interested enough to seek another partner.

[joe552]

What a great word
interregnum

[latintopxxx]

dont like it...sound like a disgusting bodily fluid..