Kevin Spacey

[joe552]

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2017/oct/30/kevin-spacey-vicious-lie-gay-men-accusation-attempted-sexual-assault?CMP=share_btn_link

Again my lack of computer skills is on show for all to see. This should be a link to an article in The Guardian about Kevin Spacey. Do you have an opinion?

[pennyboy]

I thought Kevin Spacey came out years ago. Is this his second coming?

[bobsaigon2]

Though there were rumors, I don't think he ever came out before. And that appears to be the basis for the criticism now, i.e., he did not come out until he was accused of inappropriate activity many years ago. People seem to be saying he is guilty of not coming out in the past, but surely it is contrary to human nature to announce what could have been, in years gone by, harmful to one's career.

[Nirish guy]

The issue is not as to whether he came out or not, it's more as he has tried (intentionally or otherwise) to conflate the two matters into one, suggesting that his being gay was in any way anyway related to his allegedly attempting to bed a 14 year old boy.

The two issues are not related and make no more sense than Harvey Weinstein suggesting he did the things he's being accused of "because he was straight". No one would accept that as any form of defence or reason nor accept it had anything to do with the matter but would quite rightly just say "No, you did that because as you chose to try and have sex with a 14 year old boy" nothing more and being gay or otherwise is a totally different issue and the two matters aren't linked in any way.

[scottish-guy]

Nirish is completely right in his analysis.

What we now have is a perfect storm of outrage from those str8s who think all gays are perverts anyway and all gays who although they may like a bit of felching or bukkake or nailing each others cock to the table, don't want to be associated with perverts.

[joe552]

scottish-guy, I only understood half of the words in that post. What on earth is felching?

[scottish-guy]

Ejaculating up somebody's arse* and sucking the contents back out.

Well, you did ask!

*or vage

[dinagam]

How graphic! One could use a suitable euphemism.

[scottish-guy]

Well I guess i could have said Hole Hoovering, but Joe demanded an explanation

:D

[bobsaigon2]

An abuse of power. George Takei said : When power is used in a non-consensual situation, it is a wrong. Men who improperly harass or assault do not do so because they are gay or straight — that is a deflection. They do so because they have the power, and they chose to abuse it.

[joe552]

Scottish-guy, I did ask what felching meant. Thanks for the explanation, I've just thrown up my lunch. Do people really do that?

[latintopxxx]

..all I need to know is that hotties like Brad Pitt, stallone, redford,tom cruise... and others willingly sucked cock to get ahead..now that is what i call a fantasy ...

[joe552]

out of that list, latin, the only cock I'd want to suck is Brad Pitt. He'll be here about noon tomorrow.

[latintopxxx]

lucky u...like they say ' luck of the irish"

[arsenal]

The young C Thomas Howell and Rob Lowe and of course who can forget Christopher Atkins running around naked in The Blue Lagoon.

[joe552]

I remember back in the late 70s or early 80s going to see an Italian movie with my girlfriend. The lead actor, about 18, was absolutely stunning. I left the cinema in some confusion.

[Surfcrest]

The two issues are not related and make no more sense than Harvey Weinstein suggesting he did the things he's being accused of "because he was straight". No one would accept that as any form of defence or reason nor accept it had anything to do with the matter but would quite rightly just say "No, you did that because as you chose to try and have sex with a 14 year old boy" nothing more and being gay or otherwise is a totally different issue and the two matters aren't linked in any way.

I think its important to note that what Harvey Weinstein is accused of and what Kevin Spacey is accused of are two separate things. The intention may have been the same, but Weinstein is actually being accused of rape whereas Spacey attempted sexual assault. Why is forty something Anthony Rapp bringing this up now? Because he thinks his situation is similar to the other #metoo revelations? Was Spacey advancing Rapp's career somehow by having sex with him or is this merely opportunism on Rapp's part?

No doubt, having sex with or trying to have sex with someone this young is bad enough. Is Spacey a pedophile or did he find a young boy in his bedroom, after a party where all the other guests had gone home already and what may have crossed a few people's minds, Spacey went way too far with?

His next greatest mistake was coming all out with it and spoiling his coming out. Was it to get it out into the open or to be accepted into the gay community as one of ours....because the later certainly didn't work.

Surfcrest

[joe552]

Surfcrest, I've read your post a couple of times, and still can't decide if you're somehow defending Spacey?

[latintopxxx]

he's not defending spacey, and to be very frank unless other accusers come out of the woodwork this could all be fake news, lets give spacey benefit of the doubt until its proven. for heavens sake there was almost no contact, no nudity, no sexual act took place...have to wonder exactly what the point was of all this

[arsenal]

As the police in both New York and London collect more and more information against Harvey Weinstein and the weight of evidence against him seems overwhelming it's difficult to see him avoiding a long long prison sentence. In his shoes and at 65 years old perhaps he would take a revolver and do the honorable thing because the alternative looks worse.

And the allegations against Kevin Spacey are mounting although not in the same category as Weinstein.

http://www.bbc.com/news/entertainment-arts-41829484

[cdnmatt]

Personally, and maybe I'm just being blind and stupid again, but from what I know, this shouldn't even be news.

Harvey Wienstien (sp), yes that definitely needs to be news. That has to come out 100%, so everyone knows not to pull that shit.

However, Spacey? He didn't rape anyone, or do anything near criminal. 30 years ago he has drunks, and made a pass at a 14yo boy. The boy refused, and Spacey let it go. That's hardly as bad as Harvey wandering into an actresses bedroom on a ship, and proceeding to masurbate in front of her.

When it comes to this Spacey story, I'm certain everyone here on this forum can think of something even more stupid that we've done in the past 30 years, so I'm a little baffled as to why it's news.

Spacey was just being drunk and gay, what's the problem? He didn't hurt anyone. If he did, he'd be currently sitting in a cell awaiting trial.

[latintopxxx]

seems like another actor has come forward with allegations that a drunken spacey groped him in a bar...

[Nirish guy]

Spacey was just being drunk and gay, what's the problem?

And now you're doing what Spacey got slaughtered for too and that's conflating the fact that he trued to have sex with a 14 year old boy with his being gay - the two issues are in no way linked !!

[cdnmatt]

seems like another actor has come forward with allegations that a drunken spacey groped him in a bar...


Really? I'll go check.

Speacey groped someone in a bar? OMG, horrible!!!

And what exactly do you do in the Thailand bars?

Again, fake news. This shouldn't even be a story.
a

[joe552]

When I was a younger gay man and still having sex, no matter how drunk I got I never tried it on with a 14 year old. That's just wrong, and is not reflective of gay men's lives.

[joe552]

http://www.bbc.com/news/entertainment-arts-41829484

It seems it's not an isolated incident.

[latintopxxx]

matty...host /gogo bars in thailand are designed so that customers may enjoy the hosts...i think there is a world of difference between that and a world famous actor groping men in a " normal" bar ....if u cant tell the difference then maybe u r not only blind visually. furthermore I really dont think there is an excuse for propositioning a 14 year old....if it was a drunken one off then it can be overlooked/excused..but not if s pattern emerges of him doing this on a regular basis.
I take a lighter view of him propositioning adults as they are free to refuse and report..but a 14 year old?! So it is news (bad that is) if its discovered that he's been doing this on a regular basis a la michael jackson

[cdnmatt]

matty...host /gogo bars in thailand are designed so that customers may enjoy the hosts...i think there is a world of difference between that and a world famous actor groping men in a " normal" bar ....if u cant tell the difference then maybe u r not only blind visually. furthermore I really dont think there is an excuse for propositioning a 14 year old....if it was a drunken one off then it can be overlooked/excused..but not if s pattern emerges of him doing this on a regular basis.
I take a lighter view of him propositioning adults as they are free to refuse and report..but a 14 year old?! So it is news (bad that is) if its discovered that he's been doing this on a regular basis a la michael jackson


Again, maybe I'm being blind and stupid again, so please feel to correct me if I'm wrong.

1.) 30 years ago Space was drunk one night, made a pass at a 14yo boy. The boy refused, so Spacey backed down. No harm done.

2.) Spacey groped some young guy at a bar. From the sounds of things, Spacey didn't rape him or anything. Not to mention, it was a bar, so that guy was probably at least 18.

Maybe there is more details to come out, but for now, this is just retarded.

[Nirish guy]

....... maybe I'm being blind and stupid again, Spacey was drunk one night, made a pass at a 14yo boy. The boy refused, so Spacey backed down. No harm done.

Re your first comments - yes, fairly much and re your second all I can say is dear love these children that you tell us you're thinking of taking on (total bullshit by the way but I'll humour you for the purposes of this post) id you think "no harm done" is the correct response to a grown man trying to have sex with a 14 year old juvenile.

Tell me if you were the parent of a 14 year old girl and some older guy took her to bed and tried to bed her would that be your view too re that - I dont think so somehow as I'm guessing you'd want to take a hammer to his head and not be so quick with the "no harm done" lines then.

And if you still suggest that you're serious about taking on someone else's children ( and refusing to give them back if the mother requests it !) then I seriously suggest you rethink that idea - for the long term good of the children as I doubt your "no harm done" views would be appreciated by any current adoption services out there.

[joe552]

Much as it pains me, I've given latintop a like for his view of host/gogo bars. The boys working in these places are all of legal age. There's no similarity to what Spacey is being accused of.

[cdnmatt]

Re your first comments - yes, fairly much and re your second all I can say is dear love these children that you tell us you're thinking of taking on (total bullshit by the way but I'll humour you for the purposes of this post) id you think "no harm done" is the correct response to a grown man trying to have sex with a 14 year old juvenile.

Tell me if you were the parent of a 14 year old girl and some older guy took her to bed and tried to bed her would that be your view too re that - I dont think so somehow as I'm guessing you'd want to take a hammer to his head and not be so quick with the "no harm done" lines then.



And if you still suggest that you're serious about taking on someone else's children ( and refusing to give them back if the mother requests it !) then I seriously suggest you rethink that idea - for the long term good of the children as I doubt your "no harm done" views would be appreciated by any current adoption services out there.



Again, unless I'm just being blind and stupid, it has yet to be reported that Spacey had in any way shown agressive behaviour, which is the main thing for me. From what has been reported so far, he acted like a gentleman. Obviously, he shouldn't have made a pass at the 14yo, but he did, quickly realized his mistake, and backed down.

It's not like he beat, drugged, or raped anyone. If the details change, and it emerges he showed aggression towards anyone, then I will be happy to change my mind, and call him a piece of shit. For now, he was just being gay and drunk, and nobody got hurt in the process.
n

[cdnmatt]

This story is stupid. There is a 44yo man who just now decided to come forward, and complain that Spacey made a pass at him one time 30 years ago? He's not accusing Spacey of rape or anything, but just that he made a pass at him.

I don't know about you, but to me, that sure sounds like someone who's going through a rough time in life, and wants some easy money from soneone who is really rich,.

[latintopxxx]

...he was 14....do u get it?????

[cdnmatt]

...he was 14....do u get it?????


Yeah, I get it. Do I get to sue the cocaine addict for havbing to witness him causing a huge fight in my house during a ~60 person party, and punch my mother in the face when I was about 9?

Of course not. Spacey made a pass 30 years ago, the kid refused, and that was it. Obviously, he shouldn't have done that, but it's hardly the tragic event the media is making it out to be.

[joe552]

There's none so blind as those who will not see.

[Surfcrest]

Surfcrest, I've read your post a couple of times, and still can't decide if you're somehow defending Spacey?

I think Joe, if I just said good bye to the last guest leaving party at my house, where perhaps a lot of alcohol was consumed and possibly some frolicking with the guests more to my liking....and I came to my bedroom and found, a young Robert Redford looking guy, possibly looking older than his true age....that this thought may have crossed even my mind. He's certainly not my type and I'm not into the young ones, but anyone else may have reacted differently...whether that is with intent, or in humor. Being drunk doesn't excuse the behavioral, but it didn't go farther than what Rapp describes and that's much different than being a predator or being Harvey Weinstein.

Surfcrest

[a447]

Apparently, Spacey gave another guy he propositioned his 5000 pound IWC watch in order to keep him quiet.

The problem is, he tried to get it back the next day, but the guy had already sold it for 3000 pounds.

This may just be the tip of the iceberg.

[cdnmatt]

There's none so blind as those who will not see.


Joe, about three days ago you publicly admitted on this forum you want to have sex with a 16 year old. What the hell are you talking about?

What's even more laughable is how latin is acting all horrifed about this. What's wrong latin? Guilty conscience, and need something to validate your own behavior? For years now you've been posting on SGT, constantly bragging about how you absolutely love to totally abause Thai guys, both physically and emotionally. Even if you never actually act out those fantasies, you have a much sicker mind than Spacey.

Again, unless new evidence comes to light showing aggression or violence, then I'm going to stick with the assumption this is just some 44yo guy who fell on hard times, and what's an easy and large pay day.

[cdnmatt]

And sure enough, here we go now:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kYLwX4lY7Jk

[joe552]

matt can you point out where I said I had sex with a 16 year old? That's a serious allegation.

[Nirish guy]

Especially considering that the legal age of Consent in Ireland is I believe 17 !!

[joe552]

Yes NIrish, I believe it's 17.

[latintopxxx]

Read another interesting article linked to this questioning the use of teen boys as male fashion models, giving them sex appeal and thus desirable.

[cdnmatt]

matt can you point out where I said I had sex with a 16 year old? That's a serious allegation.


You don't remember? Jesus, life is more difficult when you remember every thing, and everyone else seems to conveinently forget everything.

I never said you *had* sex with a 16yo. I said that you made a post saying you *want* to have sex with a 16yo. I don't know, I'm blind, so I'm not going to bother. Go look at your own post history, and you will see it.

Maybe you were too drunk to remember making that post. Oh right, kind of like Spacey. Plus you're planning a sex tourism trip to Thailand shortly, so if anything, you're a far more danger to societty than Spacey.

I have yet to understand why there's such vitriole attitude towards this, when the evidence so far presented showsabsolutely nothing.

[bobsaigon2]

Yes, 17 in Ireland. More details and comparisons at https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ages_of_consent_in_Europe

[cdnmatt]

Oh, that good old defense. It wasn't my fault the store owner left the cash register open, so don't blame me for stealing the money.

Sorry for coming down on you like this. It's just quite comical that you think this Spacey thing is a huge ordeal. [referring to above messages]

May I ask, why the desire to throw Spacey under the bus like this? Because he's gay? Because he came out as gay? Because he's a very famous Hollywood actor? Because he's really rich? Why?

[joe552]

I have asked Moses to delete the two posts. They were inappropriate for an open forum. I apologise to all concerned.

[sglad]

I think its important to note that what Harvey Weinstein is accused of and what Kevin Spacey is accused of are two separate things. The intention may have been the same, but Weinstein is actually being accused of rape whereas Spacey attempted sexual assault. Why is forty something Anthony Rapp bringing this up now? Because he thinks his situation is similar to the other #metoo revelations? Was Spacey advancing Rapp's career somehow by having sex with him or is this merely opportunism on Rapp's part?

No doubt, having sex with or trying to have sex with someone this young is bad enough. Is Spacey a pedophile or did he find a young boy in his bedroom, after a party where all the other guests had gone home already and what may have crossed a few people's minds, Spacey went way too far with?

His next greatest mistake was coming all out with it and spoiling his coming out. Was it to get it out into the open or to be accepted into the gay community as one of ours....because the later certainly didn't work.

Surfcrest

Rapp is coming out with the story now because the floodgates have opened for victims of rape, assault and other inappropriate, predatory behaviour to speak out safely. They feel safe because they know they are not alone and the public is listening because theirs is not an isolated case. Kudos to the two NYT journalists who broke the story; they created this safe space and I sincerely hope they win the Pulitzer. The majority of Weinstein’s victims weren’t raped but his other abusive, predatory actions towards them have been just as deserving of rebuke.

Incidentally this is not the first time Rapp has spoken of this incident. This is the first time he mentioned Spacey by name. He first spoke of the first incident in an interview with The Advocate in 2001 but the magazine had withheld Spacey’s name then. The Advocate has corroborated Rapp’s story and I suppose the climate created by the Weinstein firestorm has made it conducive to mention Spacey by name now. You can read The Advocate interview here:

https://www.advocate.com/news/2001/06/01/music-boys%E2%80%A6and-everyone-else

Rapp is not some starving actor seeking fame and fortune. He’s had a long Broadway career and is in a successful TV series. He doesn’t need the money or the publicity.

Spacey knew how old Rapp was at the time; they had been working in a play together and it was Spacey who had invited him to the party. Rapp said he was bored because all the other guests were too old and he had withdrawn into a bedroom to watch TV.

Don’t forget; Spacey has not refuted Rapp’s allegations - merely that he didn't remember the incident - and tacitly admitted that he might have fiddled with the 14-year-old while being horribly drunk, as if that's an acceptable justification.

As others have said, this is just the tip of the iceberg for Spacey; predatory behaviour is rarely isolated and is usually part of a pattern. Here’s one report alleging this:

http://www.thisisinsider.com/men-who-accused-kevin-spacey-of-sexual-harassment-list-2017-11

Conflating his sexual orientation/coming out with his predatory behaviour was not some honest “mistake”; it was a tactical miscalculation by his crisis management team and it backfired big time. I watched this old movie on TV once - can't remember the title - but it was about this American president who was caught fiddling a little girl and his PR team created a fake war to deflect attention from it. I didn’t sense an ounce of sincerity from Spacey’s Twitter message; it was damage control that put him deeper into the ground. I wonder if his PR team did it on purpose because they are tired of all the damage control they’ve had to do covering his ass (so to speak) over the years. I mean surely they’d know that this BS wouldn’t work – the PR industry is filled with literate gays who’d be attuned to (or been targets of) attitudes, perceptions and negative stereotypes of gay people and gays being kiddie fiddlers is one of the stereotypes that gay advocates have been trying very hard to fight.

Although the statute of limitations would make a lot of these crimes no longer prosecutable, I’m still glad that these stories are coming out and I hope more victims will come forward to share their stories. If nothing else, a predator might think twice before trying to make a move on his next victim and the ones who think they’ve got away, will now be looking over their shoulders wherever it is they’re hiding, be it Hanoi, Dublin or The Gold Coast.

[Surfcrest]

Don’t forget; Spacey has not refuted Rapp’s allegations - merely that he didn't remember the incident - and tacitly admitted that he might have fiddled with the 14-year-old while being horribly drunk, as if that's an acceptable justification.

As others have said, this is just the tip of the iceberg for Spacey; predatory behaviour is rarely isolated and is usually part of a pattern. Here’s one report alleging this:

http://www.thisisinsider.com/men-who-accused-kevin-spacey-of-sexual-harassment-list-2017-11



There's a lot of fake news inflating your post.

Where do you see anything about fiddling Rapp? Roberto Covazos was 26 at the time of his incident and Tony Montana relates he was in his 30's. Was Spacey's guilt, that he as a gay man or closeted gay man making advances towards these men or that they were much younger? He's no more a predator as someone climbing into a baht-bus to go to the bars to pick someone up in my opinion. Where were Rapp's parents, through all of this?

Surfcrest

[latintopxxx]

joe.....u had sex with him so its your responsibility..yours only.... noone elses. Only reason (not excuse) u could have is if he presented a fake ID that fooled both u and the bar.
Anyway I dont really understand the fascination [referring to above post]...much rather have a guy in his mid twenties.

[cdnmatt]

Well mods, if you're going to delete Joe's posts like that, then go ahead and delete my responses too. Now my posts look retarded without Joe's original posts still here.

[christianpfc]

Removed joe552's posts an part of replies that refer to them.

[sglad]

There's a lot of fake news inflating your post.

Where do you see anything about fiddling Rapp? Roberto Covazos was 26 at the time of his incident and Tony Montana relates he was in his 30's. Was Spacey's guilt, that he as a gay man or closeted gay man making advances towards these men or that they were much younger? He's no more a predator as someone climbing into a baht-bus to go to the bars to pick someone up in my opinion.

Not fake. More and more accusations of sexual abuse and misconduct by Spacey, some from House of Cards' employees who claim Spacey created a toxic environment on set through his actions. Spacey is now doing a Harvey Weinstein by claiming to seek treatment, another PR strategy.

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/11/02/arts/kevin-spacey-treatment-old-vic.html

Predatory behaviour doesn't necessarily mean the victims need to be underaged. It's about directly or indirectly using one's power to commit sexual offences against another person. Power that can be used to seduce, intimidate and ultimately avoid getting caught and to repeat those offences. "He was a man in a very powerful position on the show and I was someone very low on the totem pole and on the food chain there."

http://money.cnn.com/2017/11/02/media/house-of-cards-kevin-spacey-harassment/

[cdnmatt]

Well, damn, that sucks. I always liked Spacey, as he's a brilliant actor.

Like I said, if new evidence comes to light, I'll change my tune. That has now happened...

[latintopxxx]

matty I can see where u r coming from but u really should moderate your viewpoint until u r sure about the facts...just glad that u finally saw reason.
The sad part is that most of these guys live in that hollywood bubble where every powerful man was having his way and everyone was complicit because they all kept quiet..almost like they had permission....strange but true

[Yraen]

...have to wonder exactly what the point was of all this

Money. ----- Spacey's. ----- Removed to Rapp.

[latintopxxx]

yraen...I assume u mean that rapp is trying to profit from this??...only issue with that is that many more are now coming forward with similar tales..looks like spacey was a serial abuser..
Whats even more alarming is that other actors/directors are being named as abusers..looks like it was more about power than sex..

[Yraen]

[QUOTE=latintopxxx;229306]yraen......only issue with that is that many more are now coming forward with similar tales..looks like spacey was a serial abuser..

Jumping on the band-wagon perhaps? Yeah, I know, I'm a cynic.