Quieter bars

[Old git]

'As one gets older, things start to go wrong'

This statement of the bleedin' obvious came from a remarkable, wizened and very plummily spoken guy, now resident in Hua Hin and known to all as Dr Mike, who has spent much of his medical career tending 'pro bono' to people across the globe who would otherwise be unable to afford medical treatment.. His recollections of living with and tending to the Masai warriors alone, is a half hour well spent.

In my case, most things have not gone wrong, aside from my hearing which is now wracked by tinnitus. This does not greatly impair my hearing, except when someone is speaking to me over a background of loud music, in which event, I can often make sense of bugger all.

However..


it's too stereotypical of a grumpy old man to moan about loud music..

But.. now that recent events have obliged bars to turn down the volume control, I'm seeing a host of posts on both gay and straight forums welcoming the drop in volume levels.

So.. when crusing for a bar to visit, are you:

a) Unconcerned by the music volume

b) Positively attracted by loud music

c) Negatively deterred by loud music

[fountainhall]

Obviously "loud" is largely a personal view but I assume you mean so loud it is almost an assault on your ears. In that case, definitely I vote 'c'.

The dangers of listening to such loud music are now well documented and I feel sorry for the bar boys and disco workers who have to put up with it night after night. But then again, most of these same boys have their headphones in for much of the rest of the day listening to music at a similarly high level. I recall reading some years ago that if you are listening to music in a public place and cannot hear someone talking next to you, the level is too high.

And the real problem is that the damage done to hearing can take decades to manifest itself.

[Nirish guy]

Absolutely right FH. I played in a cabaret band 4 nights a week for around 12 years, with a 200 watt keyboard amp sitting 15 ft away from my ear and a full band PA system 30 away from my other ear, all quite happily and without worry. I also hit many a nightclub on my nights off again without worry - well, now - my hearing is FUCKED !! 30% loss of hearing in on ear and 25% in the other and both rapidly getting worse, plus a permanent tinnitus ringing in my ears ( which thankfully is just bearable). I really should be going and getting a hearing aid but pure vanity stops me ( as I'm only 47) but my staff members who have to endure my endless "pardons" when they talk to me or listen to me talking way too loudly ( apparently as I cant hear myself) are ganging up to make a hearing aid intervention shortly I'm told if I don't at least consider it !

So yes, whilst I would have been the first person to laugh at those who used to go to nightclubs wearing ear defenders I now would encourage any young ( or not so young ) person to do so as like all progressive health issues you don't miss what you had until it's gone and then its too late to do anything about it and Thailand clubs are in my experience far worse than those in the West too it seems !

[a447]

Were you a horn player by any chance, Nirish?

Sorry to hear about your hearing loss. Imagine what is going to happen to all those young people who walk around with earbuds 24/7.

[Nirish guy]

Why don't be ridiculous, a horn player no, I of course was the organ player :-)

And don't worry my hearing loss does come in handy at times and especially in Thailand when the boys start launching into their "maybe you can help me" pre-prepared begging speeches as funnily enough my tinnitus just seems to go right off the scale at that point :-)

[Up2U]

I don't go to go-go bars like I used to, so I vote for "c". Loud music was always a turn-off for me, but the boys were much younger, they liked it, I understood and tolerated it. The mourning period is a blessing in disguise in that I can sit in the Jomtien complex, enjoy a drink, socialize with friends without being blasted out by some birthday party or special event.

[scottish-guy]

Guys - I know a thing or two about this, I have moderate hearing loss and I also have tinnitus 24/7.

The truth of the matter is people with decent hearing can hear in substantial noise. Think back - when you were younger you could cope in these environments with very little difficulty, right?

If you struggle these days, theres no point blaming the music when you can clearly see other people conversing or if the barboy hears your drinks order perfectly. Guess what - it's YOU!!

As Old Git's doctor friend says - you're getting older, and things deteriorate.

I see that NIrish accepts his hearing is damaged, but for others you should get your hearing checked and when you finally accept it's YOU and not everybody else, then consider doing something about it.

You'll never hear normally again but with the right help, things can be improved considerably - and that includes the tinnitus.

Oh and NIrish - nobody has to see those hearing aids nowadays.:p

[gerefan2]

As someone who has recently been issued with two hearing aids (!) I agree you should get tested earlier rather than later.

It is unfair and very annoying for people to have to endure the constant repetitions and pardons etc.

Whilst they are not perfect my friends are very thankful Ive got them!

[Nirish guy]

So, are we on to something here I wonder !

Is this in the future going to be the way of spotting aging gay men in a busy crowd !?

Whereas the average "normal" person might go clubbing in their 20s and 30s and suffer moderate hearing loss as a result when older, are we older gay guys, who frequent Thailand etc and insist on going to bars and clubs (and generally getting on like people half our age ), setting ourselves even most apart from the mainstream of society and will a gay bar of the future ( if they even exist in 20 years time) comprise 90% of the clientele all either wearing the latest slickest most fabulous hearing aids available to man.

Or as is more likely and mainly due to vanity will we all be standing about unable to hear each other, throwing in the odd "whats that?" here and there just in case and thus pretending that the blank expression we have on our faces when others are talking to us as we can hear bugger all is just us being aloof and superior and just generally way to fabulous to talk to the likes of "them" ! :)

T'will be interesting to see perhaps ! :-)

[Dalewood]

Absolutely "c" for me. Back when I was in the US Navy, I will never forget a couple of bars near the main gate of our navy base in the Philippines. The girls in the bar would literally have to cup their hands and shout into your ear to make themselves heard. Not only was I worried about their long-term hearing but even the structural soundness of the building---it was THAT loud.

[goji]

C. In some cases, I only got as far as the gogo bar entrance & then decided not to go in due to excessive music volume. I do try to tell the doormen why I'm not going in, as if enough people do that, they might just see sense. Eventually.

Music should never be loud enough to interfere with conversation.

[scottish-guy]

So, bearing in mind the age profle of SGT members, that'd be about 50 dB then?

[Old git]

"Music should never be loud enough to interfere with conversation"

+1

[Yraen]

Whoooo ! I clearly understand hearing loss as we get older.

For me, the answer is to carry acoustic ear plugs whenever I go out. That way, if I find a place I like but the
"music" is too loud, I just put in my ear plugs. So if you see a guy wandering about with bits of yellow foam poking out of his ears then that could be me. :)

[arsenal]

I think some of you should stop posting on this board and subscribe to the monthly newsletter from Saga. Maybe a coach/walking holiday in some genteel part of the English countryside would be a more appropriate holiday for you.

[Old git]

So, aside from that Arsenal, are you voting A, B or C?

[Oliver]

No oldies means no gay Pattaya.

My vote, predictably some may think, goes for bars with quieter music. And (thinking of Boyztown) and walls. Thick ones.

[arsenal]

Well Old Git if I have to choose I'm going to go for a. I usually go to a go go bar alone and so conversation is not of prime importance. However I don't recall ever having problems with too loud music. This is more of a beer bar thing I think. Sometimes the corner where BBB is located has several places rocking the soi with different songs.

[christianpfc]

c) Negatively deterred by loud music

When I enter a bar or disco, I have a look around first, if it there is too loud music or I can spot smoking and there is nothing in sight that can compensate for the inconvenience, I use that as an excuse to leave. Otherwise I might stay.

When going to disco I know in advance it will be loud, so I bring earplugs. Or stuff tissue in my ears, should I have forgotten to bring earplugs.

[gerefan2]

"carry acoustic ear plugs whenever I go out. That way, if I find a place I like but the
"music" is too loud, I just put in my ear plugs."

and I just take my hearing aids out!!

[scottish-guy]

Christian is right - if I'm going to what we oldies call a Disco and others call a Club then I know its going to be ear-splittingly loud - so many years ago I invested in special earplugs which dont simply block my ears and make me feel as if I'm underwater, they clip the overall volume and bring it to an acceptable level whilst maintaining an ability to converse. If anybody wants details then PM me.

When going to a bar, I've never encountered one where I could not take the noise level, and I think the people complaining of such need to accept that it's possibly their problem:


Hearing Loss often results in a reduced dynamic range (the range between sounds being audible and being uncomfortably loud) - so you don't hear soft sounds so well (as you'd expect) but loud sounds become uncomfortably loud (which you might not expect)


Tinnitus often gives rise to a condition called Hyperacusis - where loud sounds actually become unbearable

So if you have either Hearing Loss or Tinnitus then you're going to have problems in noise and if you have both Hearing Loss and Tinnitus then you're probably going to have very considerable difficulty in noisy environments - even to the extent where you simply have to avoid or remove yourself from the situation.

[Patanawet]

For me a club is a place you have to be a member of.
A bar, gogo bar or disco is not a club -- it is a bar, gogo bar or disco.

PS to be an even more pedantic old git -- a 'scooter' is a Vespa or a Lambretta (other brands are available).

[francois]

PS to be an even more pedantic old git -- a 'scooter' is a Vespa or a Lambretta (other brands are available).

To be even more pedantic, Patanawet, a Vespa or Lambretta are scooters.

[scottish-guy]

Well, I never had a Vespa or a Lambretta but I had this rather snazzy moped when i was 16 (before the UK nanny state "speed limited" mopeds)

4084

[Patanawet]

To be even more pedantic, Patanawet, a Vespa or Lambretta are scooters.

Ha ha -- or vespaS or LambrettaS are scooters. Oh, I become CFC.

[francois]

Cfc = ?

[Patanawet]

Cfc = ?

Sorry I meant to write C.pfc, a self appointed member of the grammar and spelling police who makes nearly as many mistakes as the contributors he tries to humiliate for making minor mistakes in messages.
Really sorry for wandering off from the original subject of the thread.

[mahjongguy]

" loud sounds become uncomfortably loud (which you might not expect) "

Yes, it's true, and quite unexpected. Only when you become stone deaf can you walk blissfully around the noisy canyons of Silom Road. Then you get run over by a scooter.

With that segue, let me add my two cents' worth: a scooter is any motorbike with a step-through design.

[francois]

Well,maybe not quite mahjongguy! Technically a scooter has a flat platform for the feet while motorbikes most often do not have that feature, not to be pedantic. 5555

I suppose you could say that all scooters are motorbikes, but not all motorbikes are scooters?

I had to look up that word segue; never saw it used before.Good word.

Segue - to make a transition without interruption from one activity, topic, scene, or part to another <segued smoothly into the next story>

[francois]

Sorry I meant to write C.pfc, a self appointed member of the grammar and spelling police who makes nearly as many mistakes as the contributors he tries to humiliate for making minor mistakes in messages.
.

Now I understand, C.pfc = ChristianPFC

[mahjongguy]

Francois - I don't think your definition differs materially from mine.

The U. S. Department of Transportation defines a scooter as a motorcycle that has a platform for the operator's feet or has integrated footrests, and has a step-through architecture.

Like the Honda Click below, 90% of the motorbikes in Thailand are scooters.

[francois]

majhjongguy, a thousand pardons. As I was walking around today I noticed that most of the motorbikes do have some sort of platform for the feet thus do meet definition of a scooter.
Exceptions those motorbikes that have manual transmissions.

So, for all practical purposes, except for stylistic differences, motorbikes are scooters and scooters are motorbikes.

And yes,the Click is a perfect example.

[arsenal]

But what about the Yamaha Nouvo with it's sort of step through and sort of platform? My personal choice of ride when in Pattaya.

[scottish-guy]

.... My personal choice of ride when in Pattaya.

You're now taking this thread into LatintopXXX territory

:D

[latintopxxx]

...well if its good enough for the total hottie son (Max Key) of the NZ prime minister then its good enough for me!?

http://www.nzherald.co.nz/entertainment/news/article.cfm?c_id=1501119&objectid=11737059

Simply insert " bubble butt /eager to please/value for money money boy" where the word " women" appears.

[Old git]

There's going OT and going OT..

Morphing from quieter bars to what defines a scooter is almost an achhevement...

-
I stick to four wheels..

Edit: Yet another spurious and un-deleteable c
arriage return -only on this site..

Edit 2 -now another..

[Moses]

Edit: Yet another spurious and un-deleteable carriage return -only on this site..

Edit 2 -now another..

Do you click "reply" or "reply with quote"? Do you use computer or phone?
Edit 1
Edit 2
Can't reproduce carrriage

[Old git]

I click 'Reply' and mostly use a smart TV

[Moses]

I click 'Reply' and mostly use a smart TV

At forum we use scripts to publish content without page reloading. It is usual modern practice. I have no idea if browser at smart TV can work correctly with it. I will make research, but if my suspicion about conflict of browser and script are right, then I doubt what I can fix it - this script is part of core of forum's software. Please give me 4-5 day for to read about smart TV browsers.

[scottish-guy]

Just wondering if Old Git takes the Smart TV off the wall and carries it about with him when he wants mobile internet?

[Blueskytoday]

Your all off topic....move on

[Nirish guy]

^ Which of course are you too in posting the above - and as am I with this very reply - and you know what, look, the world is still turning and no one has died ! ( well I'm sure quite a lot of people have died in the time it took me to type this and you to read it but hey they certainly didn't die because a thread on a gay forum went off topic ( for the millionth time) so perhaps we can all finally move on past all this "its off topic nonsense" when the subject is nothing weightier than the volume in bars ( for the millionth time).

[francois]

Well, back on topic, although I liked the diversion on Scooters. Recently in Boyztown, Pattaya at Oscars bar and noted that the bar next to Oscars, Serene, had increased their noise/music level. Serene is one of the worst noise offenders in that location. I suppose in two more weeks they will be back at the 747 jet noise level as before. Sad.

[Oliver]

And that's one of the problems. If one bar turns up its volume, neighbouring bars compete. And so on.
One of the things I learnt a couple of years ago when Copa was having its early-morning parties in the soi for a dozen people, was that there appears to be no co-operation among the business owners. A few weeks ago, Le Cafe was blasting-out massive volumes of music at 1730 to the consternation of others ...bars and hotels alike. The bar-owners should understand that Boyztown needs all of its bars and hotels to succeed; this puerile attempt to engage in "volume-battles" is ultimately ruinous to all.
I should add that I found the noise levels improved this month; with the exception of Le Cafe. Its karaoke nights, when drunks sing tunelessly through the wee hours at astonishing volume-levels while everyone else is trying to sleep are unbearable.

[scottish-guy]

Regarding Serene bar or "Serene Night Club" as they bizarrely call it:

The last time I wasn't in Thailand I (obviously) imagined that their noise level is in inverse proportion to the number of patrons they attract.

Most evenings they seemed to have a maximum of 3-4 customers during the entire night and the handsome, dark haired waiter with the pink/yellow top and the impossibly tight, bright trousers spent most of his time just standing and looking into the soi.

On the rare occasions they had customers then often it was the same group of 4 younger ones who would buy a bottle and burst into laughing and whooping every so often (which is fine), but with one of them loudly and unexpectedly screeching at the top of "her" lungs in that affected way that some young queens do to get noticed.

I bought one drink there just to sample the atmosphere and even though I had the lowest of expectations I was still disappointed.

A rather bizarre venue altogether.

[Magnum]

I miss the music outside and the party atmosphere. However, I stay at Ambiance Hotel and do appreciate a lot to have the choice for a sleep before 4 am.

Indeed, Oscars is often packed with many customers and Serene just next to it is empty. Maybe the sweet staff?

[francois]

The staff at Oscars are not shy about, pardon the pun, sucking up to their customers. I love it.

[Old git]

In Hua Hin there's a straight bar called The Romantic - for a long time now, when the noise from neighbouring bars ratchets up, they turn their own music off.

- it's a very popular bar..

[christianpfc]

Sorry I meant to write C.pfc, a self appointed member of the grammar and spelling police who makes nearly as many mistakes as the contributors he tries to humiliate for making minor mistakes in messages.
Really sorry for wandering off from the original subject of the thread.
I do not try to humiliate others, I try to be helpful, maybe educate others about easy to avoid mistakes.
If you find mistakes in my posts, please point them out to me.

[newalaan2]

But.. now that recent events have obliged bars to turn down the volume control, I'm seeing a host of posts on both gay and straight forums welcoming the drop in volume levels.

So.. when crusing for a bar to visit, are you:

a) Unconcerned by the music volume

b) Positively attracted by loud music

c) Negatively deterred by loud music

I find a definite distinction between 'enclosed bars' aka..Agogo bars, and beer bars. The same sound level in an enclosed venue is completely different from that of an outdoor beerbar. Serene might well be the exception as it sees itself as an open fronted night club and in high season, specifically high Russian season it is exactly that, and so increases the volume accordingly at times.

Often the show element in Agogos or the specific showbars is too loud realistically for the size of the venue, but I can rarely think of an occasion in a Gogo bar where I've felt the volume too loud when the boys are dancing. Anyway I'm there hoping the boys onstage will entertain by...erm...dancing and so disco music is required. I disliked the can-hear-a-pin-drop atmosphere of old funny boys, but rule of thumb for me is, if in a Gogo bar and I can hear the monotonous drone of either Germanic or certain North American booming voices then the music volume is clearly too low.

In beerbars again, I cant really think of a situation where it has been too loud, the volume dissipates outdoors anyway. Against the argument for no/very quiet volume were the Jomtien Bars in the days immediately following the Kings passing where next to no music was heard, and it was eerily quiet with no atmosphere. The Dolce Vita waiter told me the boss there had put on some music just to cover the silence and the female next door at LN snooker bar complained to him, so he switched it off immediately. It was more about what one was 'seen' to be doing in relation to 'respect' rather than any reality. In the following days when the volumes gradually increased it added to the enjoyment immensely. Here I'm not talking about 'partying' level volume as clearly that would have been totally unacceptable, I'm talking about a reasonable volume background music.

Again, there is 'loud music' and 'extremely loud' music. I class the clubs and discos as extremely loud, in Hollywood it is often simply too loud to enjoy, often NAB likewise. But you know in advance they are going to be extreme so the choice is there at the door...go in or not.

So in the agogos/beerbars a) and b) .In clubs probably c).