At airport...arrival...ATM's??

[Blueskytoday]

Upon arrival,,,and PRIOR to the Immigration counters for entrance into the country,
are their ATM machines in case someone needs cash to cover funds to show they have money
to stay in Thailand...Friend is asking me and I don't know.
I am in such a hurry to get to the IMM counters I have never looked around the areas before
the IMM counters...Thanks

[christianpfc]

I clearly remember one exchange booth, but didn't pay attention to ATMs.

[bobsaigon2]

Google of "Suvarnabhumi Airport Bangkok ATM machines" produced the following locations which appear to be accessible before IMM. Probably additional ATM's besides TMB before reaching IMM.

TMB banks /ATM cash machines at BKK's passenger terminal:
On Level B near the entrance
On Level 2 near doors 1 & 7 & at Exit C; before Exit C; in the International Hall; and at Concourses C, D, & E
On Level 3 in the passenger terminal and in both Concourses C & E.
On level 4 between doors 1 & 2; at Sections DE, HK/ KL PQ/ RS & W; and on the concourse connector between E & C gates.

[arsenal]

Yes. There are plenty of ATMs. They're quick and easy to use. I always get cash out of one when I arrive.

[Up2U]

Google of "Suvarnabhumi Airport Bangkok ATM machines" produced the following locations which appear to be accessible before IMM. Probably additional ATM's besides TMB before reaching IMM.

TMB banks /ATM cash machines at BKK's passenger terminal:
On Level B near the entrance
On Level 2 near doors 1 & 7 & at Exit C; before Exit C; in the International Hall; and at Concourses C, D, & E
On Level 3 in the passenger terminal and in both Concourses C & E.
On level 4 between doors 1 & 2; at Sections DE, HK/ KL PQ/ RS & W; and on the concourse connector between E & C gates.

Arrivals is level 2, it appears there is no ATM before passport control although I have seen both TMB and SCB ATM's in the baggage claim area, before customs and exiting to the public area. Of course, there are ATMs throughout the airport in the public areas but that doesn't help the op. I personally wouldn't worry about covering funds if passport control agent should ask(highly unlikely), just show them ATM and/or credit card or home country currency if they should ask.

[Oliver]

Get as little as you can there; much better rates in Silom/Surawong and so on.

[gumblebee]

Get as little as you can there; much better rates in Silom/Surawong and so on.

AFAIK all ATM's in Thailand charge the same 180bath for international transactions. Is there a difference in exchange rates between ATM's at the airport and those in the city? For cash exchanges I remember the booths at the level of the the train station offer better rates than those in the arrivals hall.

[francois]

ATM exchange rates the same in airport as elsewhere from my experience. Current fee for international withdrawals is 200 Baht.

[goji]

ATMS will give you the Mastercard or Visa rate, which will be the same on every ATM. The variables are the ATM fee and whatever percentage loading your own bank adds on.
My comments are of course presuming that none of us would be dumb enough to accept the ATM offer to convert the transaction into your own currency at the ATM rate.

Anyone paying a >2.5% loading to their own bank and >180 baht to the ATM operator is most likely to be better off bringing a wad of cash and changing it at Super Rich. At least for the start of the trip.

[Patanawet]

ATMS will give you the Mastercard or Visa rate, which will be the same on every ATM.
My comments are of course presuming that none of us would be dumb enough to accept the ATM offer to convert the transaction into your own currency at the ATM rate.
and >180 baht to the ATM operator is most likely to be better off bringing a wad of cash and changing it at Super Rich. At least for the start of the trip.
I have always refused the offer at ATMs after reading much advice to refuse but I have no idea why. BUT please Goji do not call me 'DUMB' for not understanding why!
Also the ATM fee in almost every ATM now is 200 Baht not 180.

[Oliver]

When I arrived in BKK at the end of May, the airport booths were offering about 1.5 less per UK pound than the ones in Surawong..... as usual nowadays.

[Up2U]

I have always refused the offer at ATMs after reading much advice to refuse but I have no idea why. BUT please Goji do not call me 'DUMB' for not understanding why!
Also the ATM fee in almost every ATM now is 200 Baht not 180.
If you accept the bank's ATM offer you are bypassing the most favorable rate offered by Mastercard or VISA and substituting the bank's rate (often called DCC = dynamic currency conversion). The DCC rate is typically 2-5% less than MC or VISA. Note, this also applies when using your credit card, be sure you see Thai baht only on the credit card slip. I always tell the cashier Thai baht only and on several occasions have had the transaction canceled and redone.

[gerefan2]

Blueskytoday....I have never heard of anyone being asked to prove they have enough money to stay...where did you hear that from?
What sort of passport does your "friend" have?

[Smiles]

... Upon arrival,,,and PRIOR to the Immigration counters for entrance into the country,
are their ATM machines in case someone needs cash to cover funds to show they have money
to stay in Thailand...Friend is asking me and I don't know ...
I'm with Gerefan. (And besides which, the thread seems to have turned into a whine about exchange annoyances)

Why would 'your friend' think he might need money to show to Thai Imm on arrival?
If he is entering as a tourist and he is a citizen of any of the countries who need no visa for 30 days then there is no need to "show money" at all.
If he is entering on a 90-day Non Imm visa then he already has his visa (from a Thai Embassy or Consulate) and has already shown his income as part of the visa process.
I have never, ever, heard of a situation where a bonafide entrant, with the proper visa, has been asked to "show money" to the Imm guys at the airport.
Where did your friend get the idea he would perhaps need to do this?

[Up2U]

I'm with Gerefan. (And besides which, the thread seems to have turned into a whine about exchange annoyances)

Why would 'your friend' think he might need money to show to Thai Imm on arrival?
If he is entering as a tourist and he is a citizen of any of the countries who need no visa for 30 days then there is no need to "show money" at all.
If he is entering on a 90-day Non Imm visa then he already has his visa (from a Thai Embassy or Consulate) and has already shown his income as part of the visa process.
I have never, ever, heard of a situation where a bonafide entrant, with the proper visa, has been asked to "show money" to the Imm guys at the airport.
Where did your friend get the idea he would perhaps need to do this?

http://travelhappy.info/thailand/new-proof-of-cash-requirement-for-all-tourists-entering-thailand/

Never heard of a falang being asked for funds.

[Up2U]

A U.S. tourist would have to have about $300 on his person.

[ggobob]

My ATM card is issued by a USA credit union. The credit union does not charge a conversion fee, so when I use an ATM for cash I am only charged the 200 THB charge. Important to check with your issuing bank. Many do not waive the conversion fee when then as noted above increase the cost and lessen what you get back.

[Old git]

If you read the small print in the Thai immigration rules, proof of sufficient funds does get a mention, so the OPs friend has been reading up.

However, if you're arriving by air they assume you're not destitute, and don't check, - so don't worry about it.

As for ATMs, if you're going to be a regular visitor, find a Thai address you can use, grab your passport and open an account with the Bangkok Bank (they seem to be the most oblging towards farangs). Then a use a specialist currency transfer outfit (not a high street bank) to send all the money you need for your trip over in one hit.

I find this reduces the true cost of changing money to less than 1%

[goji]

I have always refused the offer at ATMs after reading much advice to refuse but I have no idea why. BUT please Goji do not call me 'DUMB' for not understanding why!
Also the ATM fee in almost every ATM now is 200 Baht not 180.
Considering you make the correct decision, I wouldn't dream of calling you dumb.
On the other hand, I'm sure you will agree it's not remotely smart for anyone to regularly choose the more expensive of the 2 options.


When I arrived in BKK at the end of May, the airport booths were offering about 1.5 less per UK pound than the ones in Surawong..... as usual nowadays.
Agreed. Airport booths are almost always a rip off.
The worst were in Romania, where they were taking about 20% of your money (they did not get my business).

Interesting exceptions where you can get a good rate in the airport include:
1 The SuperRich booth down at the airport rail link below Suvarnabhumi
2 Pre-booked exchanges at UK airports (book on line). I'm not saying these are offering the best level rates, but the pre-booking often moves the price from "rip-off" level to very very competitive. Disclaimer I have tried it for various currencies, but not the baht.

[Old git]

If you use a debit card issued by a Thai bank, the fee is ZERO

If you use a foreign card the exchange rate is way below the published rate, so you get hit with a double whammy..

You CAN get the better of these thieving bankers, so DO IT!

[goji]

If you use a debit card issued by a Thai bank, the fee is ZERO

If you use a foreign card the exchange rate is way below the published rate, so you get hit with a double whammy..

You CAN get the better of these thieving bankers, so DO IT!

1 Some of the Thai banks charge zero for ATM withdrawals within the local region, but charge about 12 baht for a withdrawal elsewhere. So if your account is in Bangkok, withdrawals there are free, but you pay the fee in Pattaya. Still much better than 200 baht.

2 Actually, foreign banks offer a near perfoect exchange rate via Mastercard or VISA, then charge you a percentage on top. For UK banks, that is typically 2.75%.
Or zero for a Halifax Clarity Credit card. So that can be a very good way to spend money, if you pay the card off rapidly.
People have also listed US banks with a zero loading.

I agree 100% about beating the thieving bastards.

[christianpfc]

ATMS will give you the Mastercard or Visa rate, which will be the same on every ATM. The variables are the ATM fee and whatever percentage loading your own bank adds on.
My comments are of course presuming that none of us would be dumb enough to accept the ATM offer to convert the transaction into your own currency at the ATM rate.
Let's call them "ignorant" instead of "dumb". And I have to admit that would apply to me, as I wouldn't know which of the options give the better rate (the names are misleading). But I don't remember being offered a choice (other than savings or currents account) when withdrawing from an ATM.


Blueskytoday....I have never heard of anyone being asked to prove they have enough money to stay...where did you hear that from? What sort of passport does your "friend" have?

It is stated in immigration rules, but seems not to be enforced at the airport. But it is enforced at Sadao border crossing (between Penang and Hat Yai): I was asked to show proof of sufficient funds and had the required 20 kTHB with me because I read about this before on Thaivisa, and I witnessed another passenger on our van being refused entry to Thailand because he didn't have 20 kTHB to show. Don't know if they accept equivalent amount of other currencies.

[francois]

ATMS will give you the Mastercard or Visa rate, which will be the same on every ATM. The variables are the ATM fee and whatever percentage loading your own bank adds on.
My comments are of course presuming that none of us would be dumb enough to accept the ATM offer to convert the transaction into your own currency at the ATM rate.



Call me a dummy since I also fell for this scam when arriving at the airport and using an ATM. :crazy_mini:

[rincondog]

Here is the Visa calculator that gives the exchange rate you receive on ATM withdrawls.
https://usa.visa.com/support/consumer/travel-support/exchange-rate-calculator.html/

Here is the Mastercard calculator
https://www.mastercard.com/global/currencyconversion/

[justaguy]

I don't know about atm's but I am dead sure scb and kasikorn have lousy rates at their BKK Airport exchange booths.

Several times I have checked the rates pusblished on the boards with the rates on their website, and all the time, the difference was between 1,75 and over 2 baht to the Euro.

Aks yourself why the rates of SCB and Kasikorn at the airport are exactly the same to the digit.

Last time I checked was 4 months ago. Do NOT exchange large amounts at those exchange booths, as you will get a lousy rate.

[lukylok]

All the banks apply the same rate at the airport. They have an agreement to avoid competiton. And it is the lousiest rate in Thailand.

[christianpfc]

But the Superrich in the basement next to ARL ticket office has good rates. Anyway, the op was about ATMs, not exchange rates.

[justaguy]

But the Superrich in the basement next to ARL ticket office has good rates. Anyway, the op was about ATMs, not exchange rates.

The warning has a place here I would think, it wouldn't surprise me if the atm's at the airport have the same lousy rates. By the way, the superrich booth at the arl station is behind immigration, the OP is about getting money before immigration.

Oh, by the way, Citibank still does not charge the 200 baht ripp-off rate, they have a branch close to Silom 4

[justaguy]

All the banks apply the same rate at the airport. They have an agreement to avoid competiton. And it is the lousiest rate in Thailand.

Yep, that's exactly what is going on.

[cdnmatt]

All ATMs in Thailand have shit rates. At least compared to xe.com they do. I've been here 6 years, and I still get pissed off every time I go to the ATM and pull money out of my CAD bank account.

[justaguy]

Actually, citibank rates are very close to the exchange rates I get from exchange booths. And since they don't charge the 200 baht ripp-off rate, there really is no incentive to bring cash in the country.

[cdnmatt]

I don't know, but compared to xe.com rates, I generally get dinged about an extra $60 CAD when I pull 30,000 baht out of a ATM. That's a good 5%, so enough to make you want to punch a ATM screen once in a while. :)

[Up2U]

For those who feel they are getting ripped off by ATM's their anger is misplaced. It is your home bank that is the culprit by charging you excessive fees. Your home bank typically charges an out-of-network fee plus currency exchange fee of 1—5%. In America the big banks are the worst, BofA, Wells Fargo, Chase, Citizens, etc. followed by the credit unions. There are some options available such as Capital360 and Schwab which are feeless (Schwab actually refunds the Thai bank 200 baht charge)and I get the VISA or MC rate as in post #24 which is also the same as the XE rate. I recommend doing your homework before traveling abroad and get an ATM card that doesn't rip you off.

[Up2U]

I meant to say the VISA rate is fractionally lower than the XE rate but still a good rate and typically better than cash.

[neddy3]

It is always a good idea to arrive in Thailand with enough baht in your wallet to get you through a day or so.

[cdnmatt]

It is always a good idea to arrive in Thailand with enough baht in your wallet to get you through a day or so.

Why? When have you ever arrived to Thailand (or any foreign country for that matter), and upon falling asleep on your first night thought to yourself, "thank god I picked up some local currency in my home country before coming here"?

[Up2U]

Why? When have you ever arrived to Thailand (or any foreign country for that matter), and upon falling asleep on your first night thought to yourself, "thank god I picked up some local currency in my home country before coming here"?
In the days when I was holidaying in Thailand I always kept enough baht on my person from one trip to the next. Getting baht in my home is cost prohibitive.

[a447]

when I pull 30,000 baht out of a ATM.

How does that work, Matt? I can only withdraw 20.000 baht at a time.

[cdnmatt]

How does that work, Matt? I can only withdraw 20.000 baht at a time.

When was the last time you were in Thailand? Started around 6 - 8 months ago I think -- I noticed Bangkok Bank (yellow ATMs) were offering 30,000 withdrawals. Nowadays, Siam, TMB, and others offer 30,000 baht withdrawals too.

I don't know if it's every single one of their ATMs, but play around a bit, and these days it shouldn't be difficult to find ATMs that allow you to withdraw 30,000. From what I see, once Bangkok Bank began offering it, it spread quite quickly. Before, I had to go into the city to a specific Bangkok Bank ATM to withdraw 30,000, whereas now I can do so just from my local market 5 minute walk away.

Nonetheless, it helps alleviate that 200 baht pinch.

[scottish-guy]

When was the last time you were in Thailand?..

On behalf of my client, Mr Mini Mee, I have to formally ask you to cease and desist from using his material.

Any such repitition will be referred to our legal advisers Messrs Bernard & Bernard (deceased) - who are very experienced in matters of chat forum litigation.

[neddy3]

Why? When have you ever arrived to Thailand (or any foreign country for that matter), and upon falling asleep on your first night thought to yourself, "thank god I picked up some local currency in my home country before coming here"?

Never. The Thai baht that I arrive with is kept from my previous visit.

My flights arrive late afternoon.

At the airport, I can collect luggage, head for taxi, go to hotel, have a night out.
And not have to think about airport rates/ATM rates/cash rates etc until a day or two later.

Works for me.

[francois]

When was the last time you were in Thailand? Started around 6 - 8 months ago I think -- I noticed Bangkok Bank (yellow ATMs) were offering 30,000 withdrawals. Nowadays, Siam, TMB, and others offer 30,000 baht withdrawals too.


30,000 Baht is over $1000 CAD; my banks have max of $500 and $700 withdrawals. Not sure of limits of other banks in America or Europe.So, in some cases withdrawals of 30,000 is moot.

As for the yellow ATMs, Bangkok Bank ATMs are Blue/Orange.

[cdnmatt]

You can call your bank, and ask them to up your limits if wanted. I have $3000 CAD/day.

And I don't know, whatever bank the yellow ATMs belong too. I thought it was Bangkok Bank, but maybe I'm wrong. There's one at the 7/11 just beside the front entrance of Fairy Plaza here in KK. That's where I first noticed 30,000 withdrawals were available.

[francois]

I thought everyone living in Thailand for any length of time would be familiar with the Yellow Bank.

[justaguy]

Why? When have you ever arrived to Thailand (or any foreign country for that matter), and upon falling asleep on your first night thought to yourself, "thank god I picked up some local currency in my home country before coming here"?

That wouldn't be a good idea as the offsite rate you would get is even worse than the rate you would get at the airport.

Having said that, I usually arrive with a few left over Euros that me and my boyfriend managed to not spend at the airport bar and a few thousand baht from my previous trip.

Enough to pay for a Taxi to Thong Lor, pay the first night to the apartment building office and a few beers whilst wating for the key (we always arrive very early morning).

As to getting 30.000 baht, wow, but useless to me, my bank doesn't charge me a withdrawal fee and neither does citibank in Bangkok, so I usually just get 9800 baht each time. Only if I plan on going away from Bangkok for a few days (say to Buriram, Khon Kaen or Nakhom Phanom) I get a bit more.

[cdnmatt]

I thought everyone living in Thailand for any length of time would be familiar with the Yellow Bank.

Ohhh, that's where my mind got messed up. "Krungthep" = Bankgok in Thai, so my mind must have correlated "Krungsri" with Bangkok.

[christianpfc]

I meant to say the VISA rate is fractionally lower than the XE rate but still a good rate and typically better than cash.
I found the rate for exchanging cash (at places with a good rate like Superrich) about 0.5% below XE and visa rate around 2% below XE.

For all details read here: http://christianpfc.blogspot.com/2016/07/money-exchange.html

[Up2U]

I did an ATM withdrawal 3 hours ago. 1 USD = 34.68 Superrich is 34.58(a very good rate, no Superrich in Pattaya) I have found VISA to be about .2% less than XE. If your card is 2% less than XE then that tells me your home bank is gouging you. The visa rate changes once a day but an exchange rate kiosk will change throughout the day.

http://www.superrichthailand.com

[Up2U]

I thought everyone living in Thailand for any length of time would be familiar with the Yellow Bank.

I use Krungsri and can pull 30,000. Beware, my Krungsri ATM tries to play the DCC game with me (along with Kasikorn).

[cdnmatt]

Yeah, the yellow ATMs (Krungsi, sorry for the mix up) I think were the first to begin offering 30,000 withdrawals. At least they were the first one I noticed, and that was probably a good 8 months ago. Then within a few months it seemed most other banks followed suit.

I know for sure Siam and TMB offer 30,000 withdrawals now, or at least their ATMs at my local market do. No idea about K-Bank, as haven't used their ATM in ages.

I don't know, I'm only at the ATM a couple times a month anyway. Pull out my 30,000, click my heels, and do a jig down the street while I continue on with my jolly gay life.

[justaguy]

Also one thing to note is that the likes of Superrich not always have the best rates. The mainstream banks don't change their exchange rates in the weekend, so exchange booths use the friday afternoon rate all weekend.

Supperrich changes their exchange rates on saturday as well.

[Patanawet]

I thought everyone living in Thailand for any length of time would be familiar with the Yellow Bank.
KRUNGSRI BANK known to farang as Bank of Ayudhya

[christianpfc]

I did an ATM withdrawal 3 hours ago. 1 USD = 34.68 Superrich is 34.58(a very good rate, no Superrich in Pattaya) I have found VISA to be about .2% less than XE. If your card is 2% less than XE then that tells me your home bank is gouging you. The visa rate changes once a day but an exchange rate kiosk will change throughout the day.
http://www.superrichthailand.com

That's interesting. Years ago, I when withdrawing at ATM I had better rates than exchange booths, at the time the rate was set by my bank. Now the rate I get is set by visa and is poorer than exchange booths or XE. My bank account is in Euro in Germany and offers free withdrawal of foreign currency with my visa card.

The problem is, I see the exchange rate only days later on the bank statement, and those 2% poorer rate than XE is an average over several withdrawals. I don't know when and at what rate the exchange took place (i.e. when visa or my bank processed it), which makes calculations and comparisons difficult.

[Couple]

That's interesting. Years ago, I when withdrawing at ATM I had better rates than exchange booths, at the time the rate was set by my bank. Now the rate I get is set by visa and is poorer than exchange booths or XE. My bank account is in Euro in Germany and offers free withdrawal of foreign currency with my visa card.

The problem is, I see the exchange rate only days later on the bank statement, and those 2% poorer rate than XE is an average over several withdrawals. I don't know when and at what rate the exchange took place (i.e. when visa or my bank processed it), which makes calculations and comparisons difficult.

My experience is the same as yours, difference 3-5%.
That's why I always exchange cash money for several years now.

[Up2U]

I agree with those that are frustrated with bank fees and yes 3% plus is typical. I have both Schwab and Capitol360 ATM cards.

https://www.nerdwallet.com/blog/banking/debit-card-foreign-transaction-international-atm-fees/

http://thriftynomads.com/best-travel-credit-debit-cards/

[cdnmatt]

Try getting paid in bitcoin, and it will really piss you off. I invoice in USD, but obviously pay for everything in THB, so my money goes USD -> BTC -> CAD -> THB.

Only takes about an hour to do all the conversions and have money sitting in my ATM to pull out, but nonetheless, a lot of room there to get fucked in the ass with fees. Really need to sort that out into something better.

[scottish-guy]

For tourists from UK, the new EVEN PrePaid card promises the perfect Mastercard exchange rate (i.e. without any loading by issuer which is typically 3%), no transaction or card issuer ATM fees*, plus cashback on some purchases.

Potential catch: Card Fee is £50 per year or £5 a month - but I reckon you'll get that back and more on one trip.

I'll be giving it a try as I don't carry cash when I can avoid it

:clapping:

*nothing they can do about the Thai ATM fee, still have to pay that

[francois]

The problem is, I see the exchange rate only days later on the bank statement, and those 2% poorer rate than XE is an average over several withdrawals. I don't know when and at what rate the exchange took place (i.e. when visa or my bank processed it), which makes calculations and comparisons difficult.

Do you have on-line banking? As soon as I make an ATM withdrawal it is shown immediately if I go on line and check balances. Can then figure out the exchange rate. Basically the same as the XE rate at that time.

[Smiles]

Do you have on-line banking? As soon as I make an ATM withdrawal it is shown immediately
Gee .. that's easy. Of course!!!!
Guess what Christiano, it's the same simple process for me as well.

[Old git]

On the subject of arriving in the country with some ready folding currency, my advice would be: Yes, do it, but bring some clean larger denomination notes of your local major currency, be it Dollars, Pounds or Euros, and only bring Baht if you've got some left over from a previous trip.

Bring enough cash to tide you over for at least three days, in case you have a card problem or the ATMs go down (yes, they used to do that regularly in Thailand, and I wouldn't put too much money on it never happening again..)

Also, Thailand is a centre stage country for card fraud and card cloning. If your bank clocks that your card has been cloned, they will block it and you're unlikely to get another until you go back home.

Therefore, have more than one funded current account, with a debit card, so if one account goes down you've still got the spare.

And.. Don't walk down the street with all your cards in the same wallet - keep some cards in your wallet and some in your hand luggage when you travel over, and after arriving, leave some in your hotel room safe when you go out..

[scottish-guy]

The Old Git makes makes a fair point - around 2000/2001 I ran out of cash in a large go-go bar in Soi Twilight (to protect the innocent I should say that bar is now closed) and in a mixture of desperation and not a little naivety I used a Credit Card to settle the bill. This was in the days of the old machine imprinted credit card vouchers which you then signed, so it was normal routine to take your card for imprint and bring it back.

I did notice that it seemed to be away a long time and I actually had to ask for it back as we were ready to leave.

Thought nothing more of this (other than they were slow) until a couple of weeks after I got back and the credit Card fraud department called me to ask about goods I'd apparently bought in Australia and Singapore. Of course I'd been neither of these places and the truth was the card had been cloned and used up to its limit.

I didn't lose any money as I could prove I hadn't been in Australia or Singapore - but a lot of hassle.

MORAL: Using a payment card in what's effectively a Thai brothel might be asking for trouble!!

:D

[cdnmatt]

Another piece of advice, that I like to use at least, is make sure with your main bank account you have an extra savings / checking account that is available via online banking, but not via ATM. Keep 95% of your money in the account that's not available via ATM. When you need money, just hop into online banking, transfer the funds to the ATM-enabled account, and pull them out. This way if you're ever forced to a ATM (I was once in Barbados years ago), you can show them your account balance, shrug your shoulders and say, "sorry dude, see, I only have $200".

As for the credit card theft posted above, find a bank that will offer you a proper VISA. You should get two credit card numbers -- one that is printed on the card, and another that is nowhere on the card. The # printed on the card will only go through if the card is physically present and swiped through the POS terminal, whereas the second # will go through for online transactions. This way, even if a waiter or someone copies down your card #, it won't work for online transactions -- the bank will decline it since the card wasn't physically swiped through the terminal. Simple concept, but very effective, and most banks these days offer it.

[scottish-guy]

..Simple concept, but very effective, and most banks these days offer it.

Simple indeed but (as a merchant myself) I don't know of any UK bank which offers two separate cards for 1) customer present and 2) customer not present transactions - you routinely get ONE card whether its VISA or Mastercard. No doubt someone will correct me!

In the UK all you need for a customer not present transaction is the Card Number, Expiry Date, Card Security Code (on the signature strip), Customers House number and Postcode digits. The first 3 are easily obtained and misused, the last two are tricky for a casual fraudster.

[cdnmatt]

As a merchant, you will know, VISA and Mastercard do not require either, AVS or CVV checks to pass in order to let the payment through. All they require is the CC# and expiry date. Your bank / payment processor might, but VISA and MC in and of themselves do not. The AVS & CVV checks are there as guides for merchants, but are not restrictions.

Yeah, Canada doesn't offer the 2 CC# thing either, and I don't know why, as loads of countries do. I know for sure Hungary, Czech Republic, Malta, Thailand, Malaysia, and Indonesia all offer it, because I've had cards from all those countries before. Not sure why places like the UK and Canada don't offer it. It's such a simple and effective solution to such a widespread problem.

[Old git]

"I don't know of any UK bank which offers two separate cards for 1) customer present and 2) customer not present transactions - you routinely get ONE card whether its VISA or Mastercard. No doubt someone will correct me!"

I think you're right, unless possibly you have a joint account with someone.

A few years back a friend had his debit card eaten by a Thai ATM that he then learned was constantly swallowing cards without reason - but it screwed him up royally..

When I got back home that year I asked my bank (Barclays) if I could have a second debit card on my current account in case that happened to me - they refused, but allowed me to open a second current account with its own debit card. Given that I can access my online banking with either card and switch funds between them as needed, this has proved an effective safeguard.

[cdnmatt]

Simple indeed but (as a merchant myself) I don't know of any UK bank which offers two separate cards for 1) customer present and 2) customer not present transactions - you routinely get ONE card whether its VISA or Mastercard. No doubt someone will correct me!

Sorry, I should clarify. You said you're coming back to Thailand shortly, so go grab an account at say K-Bank, and you'll see what I mean, because I know they offer it by default. You'll get a debit card with a VISA# imprinted on it, but try using that VISA# for an online purchase at Amazon, and it won't go through. However, login to K-Bank online banking and you'll find a second VISA# attached to the same card / account. Go ahead and use that CC# for your Amazon purchase, and it will go through just fine. Again, very simple and effective solution, and adopted in many countries, but not within the Western world for some reason.

A waiter can steal your CC#, but unless he has the ability to print cards with properly encoded magnetic strips, the CC# will be totally useless to him.

[frequent]

Another piece of advice, that I like to use at least, is make sure with your main bank account you have an extra savings / checking account that is available via online banking, but not via ATM. Keep 95% of your money in the account that's not available via ATM. When you need money, just hop into online banking, transfer the funds to the ATM-enabled account, and pull them out. This way if you're ever forced to a ATM (I was once in Barbados years ago), you can show them your account balance, shrug your shoulders and say, "sorry dude, see, I only have $200".

As for the credit card theft posted above, find a bank that will offer you a proper VISA. You should get two credit card numbers -- one that is printed on the card, and another that is nowhere on the card. The # printed on the card will only go through if the card is physically present and swiped through the POS terminal, whereas the second # will go through for online transactions. This way, even if a waiter or someone copies down your card #, it won't work for online transactions -- the bank will decline it since the card wasn't physically swiped through the terminal. Simple concept, but very effective, and most banks these days offer it.

Surely we're all using Bitcoin these days?

[christianpfc]

Do you have on-line banking? As soon as I make an ATM withdrawal it is shown immediately if I go on line and check balances. Can then figure out the exchange rate. Basically the same as the XE rate at that time.
Yes I do. By bank statement I mean the statement I see online. There are usually days between my withdrawal and being credited. But next time I will check immediately upon returning home, it might appear instantly on my visa statement and take days to be credited from my account.

[Up2U]

Yes I do. By bank statement I mean the statement I see online. There are usually days between my withdrawal and being credited. But next time I will check immediately upon returning home, it might appear instantly on my visa statement and take days to be credited from my account.
Just like Francois, I see my transactions post almost immediately on-line. I can make an ATM withdrawal, login to my banking website on my mobile phone and watch the transaction post, all within a minute.

[Couple]

As a merchant, you will know, VISA and Mastercard do not require either, AVS or CVV checks to pass in order to let the payment through. All they require is the CC# and expiry date. Your bank / payment processor might, but VISA and MC in and of themselves do not. The AVS & CVV checks are there as guides for merchants, but are not restrictions.

Yeah, Canada doesn't offer the 2 CC# thing either, and I don't know why, as loads of countries do. I know for sure Hungary, Czech Republic, Malta, Thailand, Malaysia, and Indonesia all offer it, because I've had cards from all those countries before. Not sure why places like the UK and Canada don't offer it. It's such a simple and effective solution to such a widespread problem.

Weird you had that as none of my three Indonesian credit cards have it and two of them are just renewed this month.
Sounds like a safer system I would like to have. Which banks were you cards issued by?

[francois]

With my bank, I have two ATM cards (not credit cards). One card has the VISA name on it and can be used in ATMs, POS(point of sale) and Internet purchases. The second ATM card is a separate account and has no VISA on it and can only be used to withdraw funds from an ATM.
I can do online transfers between these accounts. If I were to lose the ATM only card it would not be a big loss since only minimum funds are in that account and it would be useless for any purchases.

[francois]

Another option for having two ATM cards is to have a savings account along with your checking account. The savings account will have an ATM card which can only be used for cash withdrawals. Easy to transfer money between these two accounts with on-line banking. So, if you lose one card you still have the other as a back up.