No Let Up For The Heat In Pattaya

[Manforallseasons]

I've lived here for over a decade and I find the older I get the less I can tolerate the heat, rain at the moment is very infrequent and the days are mostly cloud free. If I were a visitor and had an option I wouldn't come at the moment, hopefully when the rains come however short their duration it should help.

[oldfarang]

There are plenty of good tips to stay a little cooler in this hot weather.

Of course the aircon, but personally I dislike them and almost never use them, not even now in Thailand.
Try and stay away from cold drinks. Yes a cold beer or ice water taste great, but it is better to drink a cup of hot tea or something. Research Google, if you want to know why.
Third here in Thailand most 7/11 and Family shops have the lovely wet towels for instant refreshment. Usually they are 12 to 27 baht depending on size. They are called "pah yin" and are nice when walking outside for a good instant cool off and refreshing.
A few showers a day to feel refreshed, does wonders.

[catawampuscat]

It's time for mad dogs and Englishmen. B-) .

[thaiguest]

It's time for mad dogs and Englishmen. B-) .

Your being a Quiet American Gentleman can you tell the difference....sorry but the bloody cat jumped on my keyboard and caused a premature posting...EDIT........on soi Buacau at 3 am?

[joe552]

It's hot in Thailand? Jeez, who'd have thunk it?

[Smiles]

" ... I've lived here for over a decade and I find the older I get the less I can tolerate the heat ... "
Interesting you mention that . . . I am exactly the opposite.
I've been coming to Thailand from 2000 to 2006, and now have been living in Thailand since 2007. In the beginning I couldn't stand the heat and tried my best to walk in the shade and shadows as best I could, and hated the sweaty clothes and having to change my underwear three times a day.
But now, I'm reasonably acclimatised, and have been for many years. The sweat bothers my hardly at all now (but I do thank christ for those those cold cotton towels sold in every 7-11 in Thailand ~ also mentioned above by OldFarang), and I have a drawer filled to over-brimming with Calvin Klein and Everlast underwear. I still change t-shirts twice a day ... but now it's simply second nature rather than an annoyance. Cold showers whenever I feel like it.
But I can take the heat now: walk miles in it, run in it, bicycle in it. I would have never have thought to do that years ago.

Now, when I come back to Canada, the cold gets to me deep in the bone and I always seem to be wearing twice the weight of sweaters and coats than other folks walking the streets.

I am jealous at your guys who live there. I wish I could already retire from work. Sadly I am of a generation who has to work till age 67. Many of your generation could already retire around 55-57. At least in my country, the Netherlands. That luck is not in place for people from my generation.

So we can now draw 4 conclusions:
1) My generation (start of 40s) got the age of buying a house when the house prizes were at the highest

2) My generation - when you are gay - now has the age to go for sex tourism to Thailand (20 and 30 year olds you do not see in gogo bars and beer bars). And guess what: exactly at this moment, when I have finally the age, it is going down (if I have to believe your words), and not as good anymore as it was. So also here I have bad luck

3) I can not retire before age 67

4) My generation has to experience the downfall of the West as economic power and the rise of the East. My generation is the first in the West since hundreds of years who will have it financially worse than the previous generation! (Your guys had it better than your parents, who had it better than their parents etc etc; this 'law' stops with me!!).

Do your guys realise your luck? Retire early? Etc etc. Life is unfair. :-)

[dab69]

It's time for mad dogs and Englishmen. B-) .

Your being a Quiet American Gentleman can you tell the difference....sorry but the bloody cat jumped on my keyboard and caused a premature posting...EDIT........on soi Buacau at 3 am?


Now I am really getting interested in finding more about soi Buacau

[dab69]

At least in my country, the Netherlands. That luck is not in place for people from my generation.


And now Dutch stamjumpen is no more?
Hot Dutch boys jumping to hardstyle music on YouTube videos I had so much respect for.

[francois]

Do your guys realise your luck? Retire early? Etc etc. Life is unfair. :-)

Yes I do realize I was lucky to buy a house when cheap and sell when expensive, retire in my early 50s, come to Thailand when it was more active and find a wonderful boyfriend and even hope to have a few more years before the sun finally sets.

[lukylok]

Do your guys realise your luck? Retire early? Etc etc. Life is unfair. :-)

Do you realise your luck. You have never heard of the "cold war" when we opened a bottle, it was one the russians wouldn't drink.
When you could NOT be openly gay.
When your life expectation was 65.
When you had known rationning in your young years.
When reaching somebody was writing a letter which could at best be answered 6 days later.

Have a life !
Stop complaining and enjoy what's there.
It won't be the same in 5 years from now.
You're thinking like a 85 years old ! And I hope to be better at 85 !

[Smiles]

The OP's topic has been washed away ...

Do your guys realise your luck? Retire early? Etc etc. Life is unfair. :-)

Do you realise your luck. You have never heard of the "cold war" when we opened a bottle, it was one the russians wouldn't drink.
When you could NOT be openly gay.
When your life expectation was 65.
When you had known rationning in your young years.
When reaching somebody was writing a letter which could at best be answered 6 days later.

Well I will swap your luck with mine immediately. My preferences go to your kind of luck! Retire at 55 and enjoy about 30 years paid vacation after that; living in a sex paradise. Still have experienced the West as the economic power and have it financially better than the previous generations. You do realise of all humans who have ever lived you belong to the top 0.001% in term of well being? There are very very very few who could enjoy 30 years paid vacation in a sex paradise with good enough money!! Very very very few.

You want to swap your luck with mine? I mean if my luck is so much better than yours, you wouldn't hesitate for a moment. Of course when we do the swap I must retain my age; I don't want your current age :-) .

[Surfcrest]

The OP's topic has been washed away ...
The various side topics have melted together with the OP (In the heat, of course) and I could never pull them apart at this stage.
The most important defense against the heat is having a good natural breeze, if you can get it and a fridge full of ice cold beers doesn't hurt either.
Defined benefit pensions will be a thing of the past in the future and so having a 60 year or 65 year plan is better than the risk with a defined contribution plan and the instability with the market. I think I'll finish off the day with a little Joe Cocker...Did I cover all the bases? lol

Surfcrest

http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y69/Surfcrest/Mad%20Dogs%20amp%20Englishmen.jpg

[Up2U]

Living and retiring in Jomtien I have become completely acclimated to the humidity. It's not the heat but the humidity that would make me wilt and perspire profusely when vacationing in Thailand. Today, I use the ac to cool down the condo and then the fan takes over through the night. The sea breezes at the beach are delightful. If dining out only restaurants with air conditioning are considered, not so much for me but for my friends. If retiring here, the good news is your body will eventually make the adjustment.

[joe552]

If retiring here, the good news is your body will eventually make the adjustment.

Apparently not for MFAS, or maybe it's just the menopause?

[Manforallseasons]

Joe I suspect you still live with your mother, your posts here are seldom original as they often follow those of the same people, sometime back you said you wanted to retire here, after posting your pros and cons both financially and otherwise it became apparent to you that it most likely would not be possible! Yes I do not like the heat but compared to your meek existence I'm thrilled to be right where I am.

[fountainhall]

Clearly some adjust quickly, others find it a lot more difficult. That's hardly surprising!

I came from the UK. In my first year in Hong Kong, I arrived in the relative cool of early March. As April gave way to May and the heat and humidity rose seemingly exponentially, I thought I could never survive through my contract. June and August were the worst months. Thank goodness for air conditioned malls which I'd pop into as I made my way from A to B. Yet by the following year, I was starting to enjoy it. By the 3rd year, I was fine.

It's certainly pretty hot in Bangkok now. I was at the pool in the early afternoon and after an hour in the sun I had to give up. Yet by early evening, there was a very pleasant breeze as I walked much of the way home.

With global warming, though, I guess we have to expect it is going to get considerably hotter over the coming years!

[Up2U]

For those living in Bangkok I understand your plight. Walking on a crowded street with heat inversion or standing on a crowded BTS platform is no fun. That is why I chose to live in Pattaya, drive a car (no motorbike thank you) and enjoy cooling sea breezes along the beach.

[cdnmatt]

I think we've had rain the past 4 days in a row now, so it's starting to cool things down a bit. Looks like the rainy season is just getting started, or one can only hope. But yeah, this is generally the hottest time of year in Thailand, but this year's temps were no different than the last. Anything in the 30s I'm fine with, but once it gets into the 40s that's almost too much for me, because then the fan feels like it's belowing hot engine exhaust on you.

Plus I can only have A/C on in the bedroom, because the front and back doors are open majority of the day for the dogs. There were a few really hot days where all three of us cuddled into the office, and I closed the door and turned the A/C in here on, but that's it.

What's your alcohol intake like? If it's fairly high, try switching it out for water for a few weeks, and I bet you'll notice it makes massively easier to deal with the heat, and you won't sweat anywhere near as much.

Goosood, you're doing it wrong, dude. This is the generation of self (and remote, many times) employment. The days of good paying, stable, secure corporate jobs are out the window. There's 100,000s of expats all over the world who setup their own shop, created their own job / income stream, and travel the world like free birds. Our parents generation didn't exactly have this luxury.

Goosood, you're doing it wrong, dude. This is the generation of self (and remote, many times) employment. The days of good paying, stable, secure corporate jobs are out the window. There's 100,000s of expats all over the world who setup their own shop, created their own job / income stream, and travel the world like free birds. Our parents generation didn't exactly have this luxury.

I looked into that. It is very hard to get a work permit for Thailand. It can only be for a job for which they can not find a Thai national.
English teacher seems to be the most easiest and popular expat job. But I am Dutch. English is not my native language. And it pays only 30.000 baht a month.

I wonder then how other expats do it, because I read you only get the work permit if they can not find a Thai. Even most IT jobs are not possible anymore.

[cdnmatt]

I wonder then how other expats do it, because I read you only get the work permit if they can not find a Thai. Even most IT jobs are not possible anymore.

Well, nobody announces to Thai immigration they're working here, because they work from home or a co-working space. Thai authorities don't seem to care in the slightest anyway. I have yet to hear of a single person being charged for illegally working because they were running a blog, doing some graphic design or whatever from home. If Thai authorities did care, they would be raiding the countless number of co-working spaces setup in places like Chiang Mai and Bangkok, geared solely towards expats. I can guarantee you, 95% of expats you see in those places don't have a work permit, but many are putting in 60+ hour work weeks.

For the older guys who are about to throw a fit, don't bother. Goosood is actually correct -- you guys had lots of advantages during your generation that are not available to us. I'm not complaining, and that's just the way the cookie crumbles. At the same time, we have several advantages you never had, and we're making the best out of them.

[fountainhall]

I wonder then how other expats do it, because I read you only get the work permit if they can not find a Thai. Even most IT jobs are not possible anymore.
I do some work here, but I have a company based in Hong Kong. Everything is routed through that company, including fees which are invoiced from Hong Kong and payments made direct to the company's Hong Kong account. That is perfectly legal.

If you don't want to go the work permit route, it's a breeze opening up a company in Hong Kong and you only need one director now. But banking may be more of a problem if you are not a Hong Kong Permanent Resident. But you could check out opening a small company in a country where the fees are small and where money transfers are easy and cheap. When working in Thailand you are then working on behalf of that company. In most cases you then have no need for a work permit.

I wonder then how other expats do it, because I read you only get the work permit if they can not find a Thai. Even most IT jobs are not possible anymore.

Well, nobody announces to Thai immigration they're working here, because they work from home or a co-working space. Thai authorities don't seem to care in the slightest anyway. I have yet to hear of a single person being charged for illegally working because they were running a blog, doing some graphic design or whatever from home. If Thai authorities did care, they would be raiding the countless number of co-working spaces setup in places like Chiang Mai and Bangkok, geared solely towards expats. I can guarantee you, 95% of expats you see in those places don't have a work permit, but many are putting in 60+ hour work weeks..

Thank you! I will look into it. But this system only works if you are your own employer and have oversea clients? And it concerns a job you can do from the comfort of your home?
So indeed a web designer job springs to mind. (Sadly not one I can do).
So I should start my own 'company', get some clients in Europe and do the work via my computer in my home in Thailand?
But I will need to travel than a lot to Europe. I think clients want to see you? Speak to you, before they give you an assignment.

(I also guess each 3 months they need to leave the country of course for a brief time; because these expats can only stay now I assume in Thailand on a tourist visum, if they do not have a work permit?)

[joe552]

Joe I suspect you still live with your mother, your posts here are seldom original as they often follow those of the same people, sometime back you said you wanted to retire here, after posting your pros and cons both financially and otherwise it became apparent to you that it most likely would not be possible! Yes I do not like the heat but compared to your meek existence I'm thrilled to be right where I am.

You're absolutely right MFAS, After consideration, I realised it would not be possible for me to retire to Pattaya. I'm glad I've made you feel better about your life.

....

Thanks!

Any idea what the average expat earns in a month? Teacher job seems to be 30.000 baht. Which is not much at all. And if you have your own company (with you as only employee) than you need I think quite some clients to get a descent monthly income (unless it are indeed only overseas clients which you can give a bill according to overseas norms).
If most expats have to live from 30.000 baht a month I am not going to do it.

[cdnmatt]

Any idea what the average expat earns in a month?

How long is a piece of string? I'm sure there's some struggling at $500/month (15,000 THB) and others raking in $150k+/month (5mm THB). You're thinking about this too conventionally. The job market of the previous generation is gone, and a new one has emerged. This is especially true after 2008. A lof of people got hurt, frustrated, angry, and decided, "if you're going to lay me off that easily, fuck it, I'll create my own job then".



Thank you! I will look into it. But this system only works if you are your own employer and have oversea clients? And it concerns a job you can do from the comfort of your home?

Not necessarily. By no means do you have to go the client route. That's what I personally do, but hardly the only way to earn a good living.

And no, clients don't need to see you. They may want a meeting via video chat once or twice a week for a progress update, but for the most part, they don't even do that from my experience. For another example, I have two people I'd consider employees -- one in Ecquador, and another in Litiuania, and I've never met either of them. I also have a slew of contractors I use from time to time spread all over the world, and I've never met them either.

This is especially true if you specialize in a certain niche, because then people want the most skilled person, not some local who doesn't have the proper skills. For example, if I need some web design work done, I'm not going to go shopping around for designers in Khon Kaen. I'll go with the guy I know in Costa Rica, because he does excellent work. It's 2015, it's a globalized world now.

Again, there's tons of different ways to make money online. For example, start a blog, and if it becomes popular, you can easily bring in $10k USD/month off ad sales, review posts, etc. Heck, there's some people making over $100k USD/month just off Youtube videos, from the ad revenue that's generated via Google Adsense, because they get so many views. (no, don't start a Youtube channel). Another one is white-label products -- skin cream, supplements, fitness gadgets, whatever. Buy in bulk from China, ship to a US fulfillment center, and market & push sales from your home in Thailand.

Here, if you need to sharpen up your skillset:

http://coursera.org/
http://lynda.com/

[fountainhall]

And no, clients don't need to see you. They may want a meeting via video chat once or twice a week for a progress update, but for the most part, they don't even do that from my experience. For another example, I have two people I'd consider employees -- one in Ecquador, and another in Litiuania, and I've never met either of them. I also have a slew of contractors I use from time to time spread all over the world, and I've never met them either.
Totally agree with cdnmatt that you have to think outside the box. From what you say you can forget regular paid employment unless you are sure you can pick up a teaching job and are prepared to live on that salary.

As for meeting clients, of course anyone with their own business will need to visit clients and potential clients occasionally - but not necessarily often. The basic cost of living here is a lot lower than most western countries and so your fees can be lower - so build these meeting expenses into your fees. I have one client in Hong Kong which I have seen once in the space of a year, but we Skype call every 10 days or so. Naturally it helps keeps costs down if your company base is relatively close to Thailand like mine. Similarly with staff. When required, I engaged freelancers there with whom I have worked quite a few times in the past.

Re Hong Kong, I am not sure if you have ever been there, but it really will be worthwhile checking out company law. In my earlier post I forgot about an English friend based in Singapore who had only visited Hong Kong 3 or 4 times. He opened a company, got a bank account and did all his business on line. The one director I referred to in my earlier post does not even have to live in Hong Kong now - so perhaps I was wrong about banking issues!

Another interesting point about a Hong Kong registered company is that clearly Hong Kong tax law applies. Corporate tax there is 16.5% and individual tax a maximum of 15%. Even better, you are allowed to claim the rent you pay on an apartment as a tax deductible expense. So whilst I own my Bangkok condo, I charge the company quite a lot for the privilege of letting me live in it and use it as an office! The end result is that I have had to pay virtually zero tax in Hong Kong for 11 of the last 14 years.

Thanks for all the advice guys.
You two are clearly of the entrepreneur type. I myself wouldn't know what business to start, I lack know-how. And how to find clients? I think I lack the character/personality for being an entrepreneur. I feel more at home being an employee.

(I think by the way very few blogs can earn you a living. You only get paid for adds if your visitors click on them. Most people never click on adds. I don't. And you need many many visitors. This is really a long term process before sufficient people know the blog)

It may look that I am looking for excuses to not start a company, but I don't think I have the skills/ambitions/know-how to be an entrepreneur. And most important: I wouldn't know what to do. At least I don't know about a job I can do from home. I wished I had studied web design.

But again thank you, I now know how it can be done, being an expat in Thailand:
1) Start your own company/blog, register the company in a foreign country and then you can work in Thailand and get Thai clients and no work permit needed at all

2) Get the very hard to get work permit and work for a company in Thailand

3) Are of the lucky type who can retire in their early fifties and enjoy 30 years paid vacation in Thailand (because for example parents die early (not lucky, but you know what I mean), you sell their home which gives you quit some money to live in Thailand for quite some years, even if you add the money you get from selling your own house; or because you were born in the right age where being retired at 55 was very normal).

4) In my country with very good social security laws, an option can be: fake an injury so you can not work. Then the government pays you each month some income because you get official approval you are unfit for work. Go live in Thailand on a tourist visum and you can live as a king from your social security income. (Of course each 90 days you need to leave Thailand for a few days.). I wouldn't be surprised if some Western expats in Thailand fall in this category.
In the Netherlands in January 2015 822870 people received social security because they are considered unfit for work. (There are also other social security incomes you can receive, but this i just the ones who are unfit for work). You must know we have 17 million inhabitants, including children and elderly. So then 822870 is very very high. I wouldn't be surprised if many of them live as a king from their government income in Thailand.

I wonder how many Western expats fall in category 4?

[christianpfc]

(I think by the way very few blogs can earn you a living. You only get paid for adds if your visitors click on them. Most people never click on adds. I don't. And you need many many visitors. This is really a long term process before sufficient people know the blog)
Stickmanweekly wrote something about selling advertising space directly, thus he gets money independently from clicks. I read somewhere that Thaivisa does extremely well with advertising. But there is only space for a few blogs or forums who get so much income via advertising that their owners can live on it. Everyone else, like you and me, have to do our daily mundane job.

Back to the op. I got used to the heat, but I'm in constant fight with the sun. Either walk in the shade, stay in before 5 pm, or wear a hat that fully covers my head, face and neck and sock-like sleeves to cover my arms. (Does anyone has a used Burka for sale? PM me.)

I am aware of these refreshing towels, but never bought any, only used them when given for free e.g. in restaurant or massage place.

[Smiles]

I am aware of these refreshing towels, but never bought any, only used them when given for free e.g. in restaurant or massage place.
The ones they give out in bars and restaurants are inferior to those in 7-11. Also, they come two sizes with two prices: 12 baht and 27 baht.
Buy a dozen or so and keep them in your fridge. I always have a couple in my shoulder bag ... those puppies are without peer for sweaty brows.

[francois]

(I also guess each 3 months they need to leave the country of course for a brief time; because these expats can only stay now I assume in Thailand on a tourist visum, if they do not have a work permit?)

Goosood, you raise a good question. Just how do younger guys remain in Thailand if not with a work permit?
Other than visa runs every 3 months or some sort of educational visa, what other options are there?

Sorry Smiles for getting off-topic of cold towels and sweaty balls.

[cdnmatt]

Tourist visas, ED visas (add a little extra to the tuition, and they'll happily say you're attendance is excellent), B visa if you want to hire 4 people (ways around that too), wife, kid, Elite Card for 500,000 baht giving you 4x5 year visas, and other creative ways.

[cdnmatt]

Well, I now have my dogs officially addicted to air-conditioning. They seem to quite like it. :)

Can't wait for the next electric bill.

Not sure what it's like in Pattaya, but still stupid hot here. We had about a week of rain nearly every day, which was great, and cooled things off considerably. Now it's back to blue sky, no wind, no clouds.