When does 17 mean 18 ?

[malchik21]

Maybe someone can help...I staggered back in the early hours to my Hotel in Boys Town from meeting friends who prefer to hang out in Soi 7 area. Very much worse for wear I was approached by what seemed, through my unfocused eyes, to be a nice attractive boy that wanted to come back to my Hotel with me for a very reasonable fee. So why not...Passing by the reception and my new friend handing over his ID certainly did not flag anything untoward. However the following morning with eyes now focused on the beauty in front of me I casually suggested to him that he had a very young body for a boy in his 20's..I assumed that was his age. He informed me at once that he was in fact 17 but not to worry as that actually means 18 !! When I asked how this was he informed me that as he is in the year (presumably Buddhist year) that his 18th birthday will occur he is actually considered to be 18. I am still a free man and walked through the departure immigration with ease so I live another day. Should I have been worried ? My dear mentor Thomas Cromwell once gave very sound advice "Believe No One"
I did not raise this further with reception as I think least said etc....just curious.

[bobsaigon2]

Here in Vietnam, you begin your 18th year the day after your 17th birthday, and can do whatever 18 yr olds are permitted to do. Sounds similar to the Thai way of calculating age. So does the Thai minimum age of 18 for consensual sex include those who have celebrated their 17th birthday, but not yet their 18th?

[Up2U]

I am 66 years old and that is my legal age. I am in my 67th year, my Thai bf says I am 67, I explain to him I am 66(legally). If a boy Thai boy tells you he is 18, be sure to check his id because he probably is legally 17 and of course underage.

[egel]

The Thais seem to add up ages differently to Westerners.

When they are born, and before their First Birthday, they are considered to be 1. (They dont count the first year in months as we do in the West). Consequently, they are always one year older than their counterparts in the West.

Same same as a building...no ground floor!

Now, you need a legal legal to say whether the age of consent is 18 ...in Thai terms or Western terms.

[malchik21]

Thanks for the input. I would have expected reception to point out his age to me as they are, and I am very pleased they are, quite strict on this for all of our benefit. In this case they were relaxed about it so I never gave it a second thought...I am never in any state to attempt mathematical gymnastics at that time of the morning not to mention I would not have been able to focus on his ID card. Alls well that ends well. At the time of writing I would like to say how nice Toy Boys is these days. Good selection of boys for all tastes I would say.

[goji]

The Thais seem to add up ages differently to Westerners.

Thais hardly state their ages consistently, certainly when speaking in English. Some may be younger than claimed, others may be one or two years older.

[paborn]

By the way, I have not been to Pattaya in many years. I have been going solely to Bangkok, but I need a change. What hotel in Boys town did you use. those many years ago I stayed at the Ambience and was delighted by the rooms and appointments. But I have been hearing mixed reviews, Can anyone, please give me a rundown on the gay hotels in Boys town - the Copa looks good. But, I've very unsure

[malchik21]

Yes it was the Ambiance. Can not rate it highly enough. Location, price, security and good clean modern rooms. I love boys Town, in particular Toy Boys bar to finish off an evening but do enjoy the peaceful atmosphere of Sunee Plaza and some of the "no holds bar" attitude of the boy bars, Eros for example. Sunny Boys, I am told is a recreation of Happy Boys, where the boys wear flimsy underwear is very enjoyable where you can get a nice sampler before deciding to "off" a boy. This was my 3rd visit over 3 years and there just seemed to be more boys than before. If I have enough reward points I would normally go to the Marriott Resort which is about 3 blocks away form Boys Town. If I had one particular boy I wanted to stay the week with I would go there but if you want to be mischievous then Ambiance would do it for me. I am sure Copa should be the same. The rooms will be noisy up to 2am but seeing as I never plan to be asleep at that time it never had any effect on me. If you have an early morning flight from BKK then head back there for the night.
I have never stayed in BKK but would like to just to compare. Happy hunting.

[thaiguest]

Going back to the point of the OP I would like to know if the age of consent is different for thai/thai as opposed to foreigner/thai fornication-relationship.

The western method of calculating age sounds logical- we're not 1 year old until we're 1 year outside the womb.

Thais may have their own perception of age but the Thai police will be quiet happy to make you pay up for bedding a 17yr 51wk old young man if they get the chance.

For those out there who may be interested as far as I know every horse is considered to be born in January so some could be almost 1 year younger than their stated age.

[scottish-guy]

........every horse is considered to be born in January so some could be almost 1 year younger than their stated age.

OMFG - I had no idea - thanks for info.

Next time I take a horse back to my loom, I'll be extra careful in checking the age.

I wouldn't want to run the risk of being branded a pervert.

[a447]

Just be careful with the horse's cock, SG. Some of those horses can give an Isaan boy a run for his money and could do quite a bit of damage to your nether region!

[frequentfliers]

not worth the risk.17 is under age.

[fountainhall]

Many Asian countries have adopted the Chinese way of calculating age whereby you are 1 when born. But Thai passports and ID cards go by date of birth, so when you take someone who says he is 18 but is legally 17 you could be in for a lot of trouble.

I am 66 years old and that is my legal age. I am in my 67th year, my Thai bf says I am 67, I explain to him I am 66(legally). If a boy Thai boy tells you he is 18, be sure to check his id because he probably is legally 17 and of course underage.So the correct title of this thread should actually be "When does 18 mean 17"

[ainamor]

thaiquest. The age of consent in Thailand for Thai / Thai sex is 15 years of age. The legal age for Thai / foreigner is 18 years of age.

There is a large well know hotel in S. Pattaya that until a few months ago had notices displayed by the lift (elevator) in the lobby that is was a criminal offence to take any visitor under 15 to their room.

[Nirish guy]

every horse is considered to be born in January

So a word to the wise for newbies to Thailand -- avoid going to all and any race tracks in Thailand in January otherwise you'll be TORTURED with horses coming up to you with those big soft brown eyes and with money clipped around their necks declaring to you "today my birthday" - for 31 days non stop !! And worse - as always happens in those situations you try to be nice and clip some money on and STILL it's some other bastard who gets the ride later after you've had to move on ! Lol

[thaiguest]

........every horse is considered to be born in January so some could be almost 1 year younger than their stated age.

OMFG - I had no idea - thanks for info.

Next time I take a horse back to my loom, I'll be extra careful in checking the age.

I wouldn't want to run the risk of being branded a pervert.

Yes. But you being from Scotland and NIrish being from Ireland should know that this is the method of determining the age of racehorses in Britain and Ireland at least.
It may not apply here in Thailand though so be careful as you promised.

[thaiguest]

thaiquest. The age of consent in Thailand for Thai / Thai sex is 15 years of age. The legal age for Thai / foreigner is 18 years of age.

There is a large well know hotel in S. Pattaya that until a few months ago had notices displayed by the lift (elevator) in the lobby that is was a criminal offence to take any visitor under 15 to their room.

Thanks for the clarification.
An important point to note is that some hotel security staff and receptionists may not know that foreigner/thai sex is treated differently under the law so may not point out the age deficit in the case of say a 17 year old thai boy/girl.

[egel]

is was a criminal offence to take any visitor under 15 to their room.

Point of order...why cant i take a person of ANY age to my room?

The stupid bitch in reception im my Condo has put up a notice saying No Visitors under 20. Furthermore, it then says any Visitors under 20 must be accompanied by BOTH parents.
Shes probably never heard of divorce/seperation as Im sure no one would have her anyway!

[frequentfliers]

I am surprised that the Ambiance allowed this.It only takes a second to check an id card.

[thaiguest]

is was a criminal offence to take any visitor under 15 to their room.

Point of order...why cant i take a person of ANY age to my room?

The stupid bitch in reception im my Condo has put up a notice saying No Visitors under 20. Furthermore, it then says any Visitors under 20 must be accompanied by BOTH parents.
Shes probably never heard of divorce/seperation as Im sure no one would have her anyway!

The 2 guys who came to my room to fix my sunshade were both under 20 and didn't have to bring 4 parents along.

If you're a co-owner in the building have the bitch sanctioned by management. If you're a renter tell your landlord you will check out unless the bitch is over-ruled.

[latintopxxx]

I'm not totally surprised at there being different age of consent law for Thai on Thai vs Foreigner on Thai, bit like going to the nationl parks...foreigners pay more!!!
I certainly prefer laws which are very clear cut like NZ where its 16 for everyone. Personally I'm uncomfortable with a 40 year getting it in with a 16 year old teen....really should wait until he is legally an adult as when he can drive and drink and vote; really dont think that a 16 year old can make informed decisions....their brains are still not fully wired up.

[thaiguest]

I'm not totally surprised at there being different age of consent lawa for Thai on Thai vs Foreigner on Thai, bit like going to the nationl parks...foreigners pay more!!!
I certainly prefer laws which are very clear cut like NZ where its 16 for everyone. Personally I'm uncomfortable with a 40 year getting it in with a 16 year old teen....really should wait until he is legally an adult as when he can drive and drink and vote; really dont think that a 16 year old can make informed decisions....their brains are still not fully wired up.

I agree with your being uncomfortable with NZ democratic law re 40 yr olds and 16 yr olds.
A 40 yr old is at the peak of human awareness.
A 60 yr old however is not so sharp so there should be some allowance made thereby.
In the USA they're now charging (and convicting) 14 yr old children for "adult" crimes such as murder.
So does it follow that a 16 yr old should be convicted for the "adult" act of seduction in the case of a 60 yr old gay man or straight man/woman?
Recently a female judge in the UK gave just such a statement in a case involving a female student/teacher case and of course is still running the man-hating gauntlet aka the neo-lib-fem philosophy which holds everything to be right so long as it fits into it's world view.

I called a (as it turned out) 13yo girl a "stupid bitch" the other day for blocking the pavement and not getting out of people's way when asked but answering back instead. I thought she was a short fat woman (not that that matters) - I definitely wasn't checking her for tits. Her older sister was outraged and started screeching at me about inappropriate behaviour towards a 13yo. I'm always amused by the way at young 'uns on Grindr who witter on about "please be age appropriate". I've always considered 18 or 19 or 20 or 22 or whatever they are as very appropriate for me.

[scottish-guy]

Kommy has it 100% right.

In the case of the likes of Grindr - if they are old enough to legally put themselves out there, I regard them as fair game. They can always say "NO" (and frequently do - usually incorporating the phrase " Fuck off you fat cunt") - but please spare us the queeny-teeny outrage at even being contacted by a friendly grandfather figure.

When str8s and (even worse) holier-than-thou gays tell me that I ought to be embarassed at shagging people 1/2 my age I tell them that they're right and I am - but I just can't find sufficent ones who are 1/3 my age.

:))

[latintopxxx]

ok, I must move in different (not saying better) social/wealth circles. I would never...never call anyone a bitch (at least not loudly in public to their faces) ...demonstrates a distinct lack of class...and limited vocabulary, and to me 60 is not old...75 is the new 60!!!! If u live in a deprived neighborhood where a macca is considered to be a meal...then sure...by 60 u will be old/fat/ugly....its all a matter of looking after yourself...I know heaps of 60+ who have little trouble keeping up with me.

[latintopxxx]

...and without passing judgement I still dont understand this fascination with 17/18 year old twinkies, most are feminine stick figures, would be like fucking a bicycle, am sure I would get bruised, and for sure i would break him. Give me some slutty 22-28 year old with a bit of muscle who knows what the hell he's doing...afterall I'm not a trainer.
Kinda reminds me of the islamic suicide bombers..willing to do it for 80 (I think its 80) virgins...what a nightmare...

[fountainhall]

Kinda reminds me of the islamic suicide bombers..willing to do it for 80 (I think its 80) virgins...what a nightmare...
Looked it up - it's 72. Still a nightmare! An even worse one when you read further descriptions of these virgins, for they "are so beautiful, pure and transparent that 'the marrow of the bones of their legs will be seen through the bones and the flesh.'" That would put me off being a terrorist martyr for life!

ok, I must move in different (not saying better) social/wealth circles.I've never been in any doubt that you are irredeemably non-U latintopxxx

[latintopxxx]

have read and reread your reply several times...am still unclear as to what u mean:(

Kommy has it 100% right.

In the case of the likes of Grindr - if they are old enough to legally put themselves out there, I regard them as fair game.One of the more interesting aspects is their reactions. A common one is to respond "pedo" - in effect someone who has reached the age of consent is accusing another (older) person of being of pedo merely because of the age difference. In my younger days "faggot", "queer" or "poof" were terms of abuse against homosexuals generally. These days it's "pedo" used by straights against gays and younger gays against older gays indiscriminately. If you believed the myths of the Limousine Left all of that was going away.

However I'm a great believer that those of us who form the senior figures of The Homintern (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homintern) have a duty to induct younger men into the mysteries of sodomy. It's simply noblesse oblige.
have read and reread your reply several times...am still unclear as to what u mean:(Have you tried Google?

[LoveThailand]

It is more natural I think both for gay and straight people to get their initial sexual experience within their age group. There is probably some number of young people (both gay and straight) who might have a preference for older partners. But in my opinion in the majority of cases sexual contacts of young men with significantly older partners are not primarily driven by sexual desire.

[thaiguest]

It is more natural I think both for gay and straight people to get their initial sexual experience within their age group. There is probably some number of young people (both gay and straight) who might have a preference for older partners. But in my opinion in the majority of cases sexual contacts of young men with significantly older partners are not primarily driven by sexual desire.

"Not driven by sexual desire" by which of the two parties may I ask?
As I have posted before I had the pleasure of being pleasured by young tiger-sex boy from France in the Malasia Hotel who (thankfully) was into men over 60 only. He wanted no money nor needed money from me.
I would to meet him again if only to fill a deep, personal sleep.5

[bkkguy]

The age of consent in Thailand for Thai / Thai sex is 15 years of age. The legal age for Thai / foreigner is 18 years of age.

wrong, in every English translation I have read the Thai age of consent laws do not differentiate based on nationality and neither do any other laws that may apply here - but if you have a link to a reasonable English translation of a relevant section of the Thai Penal Code that proves your statement - or indeed any serious discussion of why the common English translations of the code are wrong - then please post it here, I would love to read it, and no I don't mean a link to some vague unsupported statement on another discussion forum thread like this one


There is a large well know hotel in S. Pattaya that until a few months ago had notices displayed by the lift (elevator) in the lobby that is was a criminal offence to take any visitor under 15 to their room.

there are some quite specific laws relating to detaining a minor away from his/her parent or guardian without permission - but I doubt even the most egregious police officer would go quite that far



An important point to note is that some hotel security staff and receptionists may not know that foreigner/thai sex is treated differently under the law

I would say most hotel security staff and receptionists, and indeed most foreigners, are aware that foreigner/thai sex IS treated differently under the law in some way, though most - particularly the foreigners - don't seem to understand, or indeed be interested in understanding, how and would prefer instead to keep spreading miss-information like "The legal age for Thai / foreigner is 18 years of age."

the majority of foreigners charged over under-age sex are not prosecuted under age of consent laws but under prostitution laws which define prostitution as sexual gratification "in return for money or any other benefit" and it does not take a particularly egregious police officer to interpret that quite broadly, eg a bowl of noodles, use of a game machine, taxi fare home etc

the key point is that although ALL prostitution is illegal, the law specifies very strong penalties where the prostitute is under 18 and even stronger penalties when the prostitute is under 15 and enforcement is very strict, however where the prostitute is 18 or over enforcement of penalties for the customer is rare, hence the origin of the miss-information that the "legal" age for foreigners is 18 - though again this statute does not differentiate based on nationality!

of course this usually promotes a barrage of responses that I am just being pedantic and the easiest thing for newbies to understand is that the legal age is 18 though personally I fail to see how this helps anyone understand anything and thus I am never surprised at the regular repeated threads arguing about the age of consent in Thailand and the miss-information and confusion that is spread by posts like ainamor's

bkkguy

[LoveThailand]

It is more natural I think both for gay and straight people to get their initial sexual experience within their age group. There is probably some number of young people (both gay and straight) who might have a preference for older partners. But in my opinion in the majority of cases sexual contacts of young men with significantly older partners are not primarily driven by sexual desire.

"Not driven by sexual desire" by which of the two parties may I ask?
As I have posted before I had the pleasure of being pleasured by young tiger-sex boy from France in the Malasia Hotel who (thankfully) was into men over 60 only. He wanted no money nor needed money from me.
I would to meet him again if only to fill a deep, personal sleep.5

Obviously you may. By sexual desire of the younger one.
As I said there are probably some young men driven towards older men - but I doubt their numbers are large. Count yourself lucky on that one occasion. And have your wallet ready for the rest.

[malchik21]

Although this has been mentioned many times on here before but to be on the safe side I understood that this is the defining law:-

"Section 8 of the 'Prostitution Prevention and Suppression Act' states
'Whoever, for sexual gratification of that person or of the third person, commits sexual intercourse or any other act against a person who is over fifteen (15) years but not yet over eighteen (18) years of age, with or without his or her consent, in a place for prostitution, shall be punished with imprisonment of one to three years and a fine of twenty thousand to sixty thousand baht. If the commission of the offence as specified in the first paragraph is committed against a child not over fifteen (15) years of age, the offender shall be punished with imprisonment of two to six years and a fine of forty thousand to one hundred and twenty thousand baht.'

A place for prostitution could be a hotel room if that is where payment is made ?? You would need a smart lawyer or a plentiful supply of brown envelopes to argue this one.

My original post was to try and understand if this meant 18 + years as opposed to being in his 18th year of age i.e. 17 and a few months as my friend attempted to inform me.

I will be more careful next time. 22 + are just fine for me.

[francois]

....of course this usually promotes a barrage of responses that I am just being pedantic .....

bkkguy

You, being pedantic? Who would ever think that.

The age of consent in Thailand for Thai / Thai sex is 15 years of age. The legal age for Thai / foreigner is 18 years of age.wrong, in every English translation I have read the Thai age of consent laws do not differentiate based on nationality and neither do any other laws that may apply hereYou are looking at the wrong law. The law on prostitution states that the age of consent for acts of prostitution is 18. If you want to mount a test case that the 15yo with whom you're having sex is not someone you have paid please go ahead, we'll all be thinking of you - but I can't promise prison visits - and the papers in your home country will be thrilled to splash your story across their pages with the appropriate headline about paedophiles.

That law is the reason why gogo and massage boys must be 18 even though they cannot visit the same gogo bar as a customer until they are 20 (the licensing law).

[goji]

My original post was to try and understand if this meant 18 + years as opposed to being in his 18th year of age i.e. 17 and a few months as my friend attempted to inform me.
Yes, the post discussed ages of consent, but has not answered the original point.

A western 40 year old has completed 40 years and is in his 41st year.
Is the person also considered to be 40 years old in Thailand, or 41? Presumably he is legally 40 in Thailand as well?

[Dodger]

goji wrote


A western 40 year old has completed 40 years and is in his 41st year.
Is the person also considered to be 40 years old in Thailand, or 41? Presumably he is legally 40 in Thailand as well?

Answer = 40.

The only country that I'm aware of that considers a new born to be one year old at the time of birth is Korea. This then becomes their legal age. There may be others but Thailand is not one of them.

It's not uncommon for a 17 year old Thai sex worker to want to stretch his (or hers) age when interacting with a potential punter - but legally they are 17.

[mahjongguy]

"It's not uncommon for a 17 year old Thai sex worker to want to stretch his (or hers) age when interacting with a potential punter - but legally they are 17."

That makes it sound as if the intent is always deceptive. Any Thai, if asked their age, will reply with their legal age + 1. That's what "age" means here.

[fountainhall]

The only country that I'm aware of that considers a new born to be one year old at the time of birth is Korea. This then becomes their legal age

It's not even that simple! Korean's are one at the time of birth and then add another year at the time of either the western or the lunar New Year. So someone born on December 17 can become two years old just two weeks later! Little wonder that Korean men seem to age faster!!

It is more natural I think both for gay and straight people to get their initial sexual experience within their age group. There is probably some number of young people (both gay and straight) who might have a preference for older partners. But in my opinion in the majority of cases sexual contacts of young men with significantly older partners are not primarily driven by sexual desire.As latintopxxx rightly points out, they don't know their own minds:
really dont think that a 16 year old can make informed decisions....their brains are still not fully wired up.It's up to us older men to help set them straight (if that's the term I mean)

[latintopxxx]

kommy baby....thy dont need old guys to show them the ropes...they got the internet...like hello?!

[Dodger]

fountainhall wrote:


Any Thai, if asked their age, will reply with their legal age + 1. That's what "age" means here.

Yes, but be careful when interacting with 17 year olds because that's not the way they count in the courts.

[bkkguy]

The age of consent in Thailand for Thai / Thai sex is 15 years of age. The legal age for Thai / foreigner is 18 years of age.wrong, in every English translation I have read the Thai age of consent laws do not differentiate based on nationality and neither do any other laws that may apply hereYou are looking at the wrong law. The law on prostitution states that the age of consent for acts of prostitution is 18.

no I am not looking at the wrong law, I have just re-read the sections of the Thai Penal Code relating to age of consent and prostitution to be sure and none of these sections differentiate based on nationality, so ainamor's statement is just wrong

have you or ainamor read the relevant laws recently? if yes and you have a link to support your claims of a difference based on nationality I would love to see it

also the prostitution laws explicitly state that "Any person who, in order to gratify his or her sexual desire or that of another person, has sexual intercourse or acts otherwise against a person ... with or without his or her consent" - so this is obviously not an age of consent issue regardless of what games you and ainamor want to play with terms like "age of consent", "legal age" and "age of consent for acts of prostitution" (whatever that means) - but again if you have a link to support your claim this is an age of consent issue I would love to see it

the key point is that while the letter of the law does not differentiate based on nationality, there is perhaps selective interpretation and enforcement of the prostitution laws

a Thai or a foreigner having sex with a Thai under 15 would probably have about the same chance of being prosecuted under either the prostitution or age of consent laws depending on circumstances and which option the police considered would be more likely to achieve a successful prosecution with the longest possible sentence

a Thai or a foreigner having sex with a Thai over 15 but under 18 is never going to be charged under the age of consent laws because they don't apply, but a foreigner may be more likely to face a more liberal interpretation of phrases from the prostitution law like "in return for money or any other benefit" and a more strict enforcement of the prostitution law - but I don't see how this justifies ainamor's original statement that the "legal age for Thai / foreigner is 18 years of age"

my comments on the actual laws are based on fact so if you want to argue against them provide me some better facts, my last three paragraphs on selective enforcement are based on personal opinion and observation so fee free to express your own person personal opinion and observation in response to this

bkkguy

[fountainhall]

fountainhall wrote:

Any Thai, if asked their age, will reply with their legal age + 1. That's what "age" means here.
Yes, but be careful when interacting with 17 year olds because that's not the way they count in the courts.

Just to put the record straight, that's a quote from mahjongguy - definitely not me!

kommy baby....thy dont need old guys to show them the ropes...they got the internet...like hello?!You keep me young latintopxxx - haven't had such a good LOL for hours

I would never...never call anyone a bitch (at least not loudly in public to their faces)Here you go, latin https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yC5Wrm- ... 8I&index=1 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yC5Wrm-Iq8c&list=PLa_1MA_DEorGlLCiC9HVVIoMUlgCozy8I&index=1)

[mahjongguy]

fountainhall wrote:

Any Thai, if asked their age, will reply with their legal age + 1. That's what "age" means here.
Yes, but be careful when interacting with 17 year olds because that's not the way they count in the courts.

Just to put the record straight, that's a quote from mahjongguy - definitely not me!

Yes, and I was quoting my 40yo b/f. :ymtongue: