Thailand Tests New Anti-HIV Gel

[fountainhall]

Anyone reading the Boards over the last few years knows only too well that the rate of HIV infection amongst msm in Thailand is very high. According to ThailandтАЩs Ministry of Public Health and the USCDC, this rose dramatically from around 17% in 2003 to 29% in 2011 - http://www.irinnews.org/report/98439/th ... -hiv-rates (http://www.irinnews.org/report/98439/thailand-s-msm-face-alarming-hiv-rates). According to another 2013 UNAIDS Asia Pacific Report, throughout the region generally the rate ranges from 15% to 25%. One of the most worrying trends in Bangkok, it seems, is the number of saunas that have sprung up in recent years catering mostly to young Thais for Thais where condom use is the exception rather than the norm. This is a sad result of successive governments substantially reducing the countryтАЩs HIV education educational programmes which were so effective in the late 1980s and 1990s.

Today, though, GayAsiaNews reports on the first trials of a new Chiang Mai-based research programme into tests of an anti-HIV rectal gel which, if successful, might be a new tool in the fight against HIV.


Research Institute for Health Sciences in Chiang Mai University which has been a research site for over 35 major International studies in the past years is one of the sites for the study. Similar study sites will commence soon in South Africa, Peru and the US.

The objective of this study is to ascertain the safety of a rectal microbicide gel. Depending upon the outcome of this study, more studies will be conducted later.

The study in Chiang Mai will have 24 study participants. Thirteen study participants have been recruited by June 2014 and 11 more study participants will be recruited by October 2104. The study is expected to finish by the end of first quarter of 2015.
http://gayasianews.com/2014/06/17/thail ... er-people/ (http://gayasianews.com/2014/06/17/thailand-researches-anti-hiv-rectal-gels-for-gay-transgender-people/)

[christianpfc]

" One of the most worrying trends in Bangkok, it seems, is the number of saunas that have sprung up in recent years catering mostly to young Thais for Thais where condom use is the exception rather than the norm."

I have been to over 10 different gay saunas in Bangkok, at least they all provide a condom and lube for every customer.

[Up2U]

Were those saunas visited Thai on Thai? I have read that young Thais view HIV as a foreign concern; have sex with a foreigner then use a condom, have sex with another Thai then you're are ok.

[fountainhall]

I have been to over 10 different gay saunas in Bangkok, at least they all provide a condom and lube for every customer.
I guess the natural follow on from that has to be - (i) is this usual in all the other primarily Thai for Thai saunas, and (ii) do the guys there actually use them? All I can say is my Thai friends tell me condom use is not at all common.

[Nirish guy]

Likewise I get similar replies that "condoms (maybe) only needed with farang, but Thai ok as it "only farang who have problem" and likewise in some saunas (and even surprisingly a popular farang sauna in Pattata) yes you maybe get your condom - if you go and ask at the bar !! ( and I mean a singular condom) but look out if you have the nerve to go back and ask for a second or a third and stand by for either a stupid needless 10 baht charge to put you off asking or a look of "but you already got "it" earlier and now you want more!"

Very depressing all round when you think just how many times infections of all sorts must be getting passed round totally needlessly between Thais ( and no doubt some stupid farang too) and sometimes with dire consequences for both parties and all when that is all totally avoidable :-(

[francois]

Cannot one bring their own condoms to these saunas? Or is that a no-no? Why rely on some inferior product if safe sex is so important?

[Nirish guy]

You absolutely can Francois and I would absolutely recommend you do that and in fact it was a thai friend who first suggested that I do that as ( and this never occurred to me as it would normally never happen here in Europe) but he stated that it was more usual than not that the condoms you would be given in the the saunas in Thailand would be both of cheap manufacture perhaps but also more scarily also perhaps be out of date as the Thai guy behind the counter maybe couldn't read the european calendar date printed on the condom - and even if he could he probably wouldn't care enough to not give you them - plus as you've saving them money the sauna's are of course more than happy that you bring your own condoms ( and lube) too usually - and at least then YOU know what you're getting and using and you can also bring the required amount and not have to run about the place begging for more if you need them.

[fountainhall]

I am sure everyone can take condoms into any sauna. The issue is surely less their availability than a lack of desire (or understanding of the need) of young Thais to use them.

[TravellerDave]

I always take extra condoms and lube into gay saunas. In the cruising areas I find sometimes anal is refused afteri have put a condom on. Also some guys leave them back in the locker and there is a need for two, because I'm versatile.
Interesting about the gel, but I'm staying with condoms for now, although I would love bareback if it was safe.

[lego]

I guess the idea is to offer an alternative to those who don't like condoms and currently cannot be bothered to use them for one reason or another. I've got the bad feeling that this idea could backfire: On the one hand, I think there will be some takers within that aforementioned group, so they'll get a higher level of protection as intended and that's a good thing. But on the other hand, it's inevitable that there will also be takers among those who currently use condoms and who will then abandon them in favor of the new gel. Assuming that condoms offer a higher level of protection, it could prove very tricky to communicate that effectively, complicating things for safer sex education.

[Nirish guy]

exactly Lego - and it should be remembered that a) this gel is a LONG way off yet as it is still only in the human test phase and also b) it is never going to be a replacement for condoms in regard to safer sex but it's being suggested at groups such as MSM were maybe one long term partner / husband etc has HIV and the other does not to help reduce the risk of cross infection, it will never if course protect from all the other nasties out there and should most certainly not be thought of as a replacement for normal condom use.

[maump]

Today, though, GayAsiaNews reports on the first trials of a new Chiang Mai-based research programme into tests of an anti-HIV rectal gel which, if successful, might be a new tool in the fight against HIV.


http://gayasianews.com/2014/06/17/thail ... er-people/ (http://gayasianews.com/2014/06/17/thailand-researches-anti-hiv-rectal-gels-for-gay-transgender-people/)

was there any definitive follow-up on this? I assume failure because there is little on google after the date of this post.

[maump]

Anyone seen these? what is the cost? will the boys participate in this test?

HIV Self-Test Kits Rolled Out In Pharmacies Nationwide
HIV self-testing kits are available at pharmacies from today under a new measure to help Thailand meet its commitment to end HIV-Aids by 2030.


https://www.nationthailand.com/blogs/life/40005527

[StevieWonders]

This experimental gel predates PrEP and has probably been made redundant by it

[maump]

Yes, you are probably right.... but how many boys are using PrEP? the HIV rates are still very high... and karma still rules them.

[GWMinUS]

Interesting about the gel, but I'm staying with condoms for now, although I would love bareback if it was safe.

Do you know about PrEP? If you take that you can have condumless anal sex without worrying about HIV!!
Google Descovy...

[Moses]

Do you know about PrEP? If you take that you can have condumless anal sex without worrying about HIV!!
Google Descovy...

... and still worrying about hepatitis, syphilis, пonorrhea, papillomaviridae and so on...

[maump]

... and still worrying about hepatitis, syphilis, пonorrhea, papillomaviridae and so on...

on my last visit I used PrEP. I did go bareback with 2 long-term boys (one of which we both got a local HIV test) and one regular Thai man (not Money Boy).

I did come home with chlamydia.....

[goodtimeth]

on my last visit I used PrEP. I did go bareback with 2 long-term boys (one of which we both got a local HIV test) and one regular Thai man (not Money Boy).

I did come home with chlamydia.....

But a lot more pleasure than with condom lol

[latintopxxx]

...whole world discussion so dominated ny "the virus"...covid...that I had to stop and think what hiv was...

[dinagam]

I thought you were already on PrEP a couple of years ago...

[latintopxxx]

...quite correct...but im not going to be on it 365 days/year....gotta give the internal organs a rest...been off it for over 6 months....have a live in houseboy /uni student who satisfies my every need...best I can do in these covid times ....life is tough

[dinagam]

How nice...
I wish I could have a houseboy just like this one.
Wouldn't it be wonderful...

[bkkguy]

How nice...
I wish I could have a houseboy just like this one.
Wouldn't it be wonderful...

I must be getting old and jaded - I would be happy just to have that kitchen!

[Nirish guy]

Id just be happy if I got get my guy to WASH the bloody dishes, dressed or otherwise I'm really past caring !! l :-)

[latintopxxx]

u guys r too funny....my current one is Chinese student ...believe his family have spent just about every yuan they have to send him to study here ...on a student visa that allows him to work 20 hours/week but with covid he lost his job....that part time job was to pay for his accomodation and some living expenses....upon discovering he was in a dire financial situation I generously invited him to move in with me...fwb type arrangement....not that I had to try to hard...his grindr profile said "looking for a free room"....

[StevieWonders]

u guys r too funny....my current one is Chinese student ...believe his family have spent just about every yuan they have to send him to study here ...on a student visa that allows him to work 20 hours/week but with covid he lost his job....that part time job was to pay for his accomodation and some living expenses....upon discovering he was in a dire financial situation I generously invited him to move in with me...fwb type arrangement....not that I had to try to hard...his grindr profile said "looking for a free room"....As arsenal says, very reminiscent of Mr Micawber

[latintopxxx]

...had to google that...think my houseboy will turn out just fine....he's no fool...sometimes i wonder who's fucking whom...

[arsenal]

My reference to Mr Micawber was due to your flowery use of language which isn't latin. He's more of a Fagin type, taking advantage of a poor boy far from home who needs a place to live.

Take a look, at latin
He can get, the boys in
But I recall
He started small
He 'ad to pick a donkey or two

Paraphrased from the musical, Oliver..

[StevieWonders]

My reference to Mr Micawber was due to your flowery use of language which isn't latin. He's more of a Fagin type, taking advantage of a poor boy far from home who needs a place to live.

Take a look, at latin
He can get, the boys in
But I recall
He started small
He 'ad to pick a donkey or two

Paraphrased from the musical, Oliver..You’ll be entertaining us with your intimate knowledge of the novels of Wordsworth soon, arsenal (that’s an almost direct quotation too)

[arsenal]

How funereal of you to say that.

[goji]

u guys r too funny....my current one is Chinese student ...believe his family have spent just about every yuan they have to send him to study here ...on a student visa that allows him to work 20 hours/week but with covid he lost his job....that part time job was to pay for his accomodation and some living expenses....upon discovering he was in a dire financial situation I generously invited him to move in with me...fwb type arrangement....not that I had to try to hard...his grindr profile said "looking for a free room"....

Where I live, the Chinese students seem to be loaded. Several times a week they tend to get deliveries from Amazon, or often some luxury goods brand. When they get a car, BMW seems to be the preferred brand.

None looking for free rooms in exchange for favours. Although, just occasionally, there is one who is looking for some action.

[Manforallseasons]

u guys r too funny....my current one is Chinese student ...believe his family have spent just about every yuan they have to send him to study here ...on a student visa that allows him to work 20 hours/week but with covid he lost his job....that part time job was to pay for his accomodation and some living expenses....upon discovering he was in a dire financial situation I generously invited him to move in with me...fwb type arrangement....not that I had to try to hard...his grindr profile said "looking for a free room"....

I have to give U credit your fantasy stories remain unrivaled.

[maump]

...quite correct...but im not going to be on it 365 days/year....gotta give the internal organs a rest...been off it for over 6 months....have a live in houseboy /uni student who satisfies my every need...best I can do in these covid times ....life is tough

https://www.iwantprepnow.co.uk/how-to-take-prep/

I used 3 of the 4 methods described. everyday if vacationing in a high sex land, event based, and T's and S's when active but not being a slut.

[dab69]

Respects to fountainhall for the original post.

[maump]

Anyone seen these? what is the cost? will the boys participate in this test?

HIV Self-Test Kits Rolled Out In Pharmacies Nationwide
HIV self-testing kits are available at pharmacies from today under a new measure to help Thailand meet its commitment to end HIV-Aids by 2030.


https://www.nationthailand.com/blogs/life/40005527

very expensive on the net, see for sale in Chinese twitter sites....

[Nirish guy]

There is a big debate of course as to the wisdom of selling HIV home testing kits re how people may react when they get a positive result.

I'm torn on the subject as I think 'knowing" your status, certainly in the west IS much better than not knowing as there is plently of access to treatment now to make HIV a very manageable condition.

HOWEVER several Thai guys I know / knew who'd tested positive took it, no matter how many times you told them otherwise, to mean it was the old "death sentence" that it used to be and then took on a very "well so be it" type attitude and either started living an even more dangerous sex / drink / drugs type lifestyle ( whilst possibly infecting others too) and / or simply went home "to die", always when their death ( as ultimately happened on at least two occasions that I know of) was TOTALLY avoidable, which was heartbreaking to witness.

And yes before anyone asks I did try and help in various ways both financially and also by putting them in touch with various Thai HIV support groups in Bangkok etc, but as i said two of them at least took it on themselves that they were dying and that was that and so simply gave up, when there conditions would have suggested otherwise perhaps.