Neal, former owner of SGT has died, posted on Gaybutton [Archive] - Sawatdee Gay Thailand the oldest and most popular gay forum on Thailand and South East Asia

christianpfc

June 4th, 2014, 13:21

I had a few chats with Neal in front of Happy Place, intended meeting for dinner never materialized. Can't say anything bad about him in real life.

After he sold the board, I found his antics funny and entertaining for some time (but then it turned embarrassing and disgusting) and there was nothing directed at me. But when someone posted a picture from my gayromeo account on the bitchboard in October 2013 and I asked him to remove it, read yourself:

I object to posting pictures of me.

May I ask if this picture is on Gay Romeo as the poster said? Is it also under your ChristianPFC name? Did you not think that anyone would see it, copy and paste it?

So you admit it is a photo of yourself. You have freely and intentionally put your photo's into the public domain, so you can have no complaint when your picture is displayed on this forum.
Lack of manners! That's where he lost me. To his defense: some people think his mental confusion comes from the medication he had to take.

No ill feelings, but I won't shed tears over him either. Rest in peace and good luck to everyone you left behind.

scottish-guy

June 4th, 2014, 15:49

.. we can infer almost nothing about a person we've never met based solely on what they write in online Forums - yet so many posters continue to do so..

I have no desire to start a debate but I have to make it clear that Kommie's remark does not apply to me. I knew him for at least 15 years (maybe even 20) - certainly before he ever set foot in Thailand.

The only people mourning him today are his family, those who were in his pocket, those who are extremely naive and don't know a 10th of what went on, and the Pattaya lawyers whom he kept busy trying to silence anybody who spoke out against him (as several members of this Board know well).

If and when someone posts an independently-sourced death notice I will feel free to say a LOT more - not to needlessly or unfairly disparage him, just to get the facts right and things into perspective. Right now, whilst I accept he is probably dead, I wouldn't put anything past him.

EDIT: Excellent posts from NIrishguy & a447a on GB board now, telling it EXACTLY like it is.

RonanTheBarbarian

June 5th, 2014, 02:52

I would imagine that would be an interesting post for many here, ScottishGuy.

I for one would be curious to learn more about his background prior to Thailand - I know he was in the adult toy trade or movie industry, but nothing else.

A second issue that you should cover is why (and I don't ask this in an accusatory way) if you knew him for twenty years, were you willing to be a moderator on his board before you had your falling out?

I am sure they are good reasons (perhaps not realising what a headcase he was until too late etc, etc.) but I am sure it is what many long-term SGT members will be wondering when they hear the lenght of your acquaintance.

scottish-guy

June 5th, 2014, 04:31

Ronan it's quite straightforward - I deliberately said I knew him for 15-20 years rather than I was friends with him.

When I first met him he was living in Colorado and had a business selling sex toys but (more importantly, and as he told me himself) poppers, which he referred to in that campy voice as "per/fumes".

However, I did not meet him there, I met him in Prague in the mid 90's - where we shared a very small hotel on a few occasions, so everyday interaction was inevitable. There is a whole story to that episode in his life (which is quite juicy) but I will not go into that at this time.

Anyway, that went on for maybe 3 or 4 years, then he suddenly disappeared (that's even juicier!)

Couple of years later I started going to Hamburg and fuck me, who should be lording it up in my hotel again but Neal!! That happened a couple of times.

Now, whether it was Prague or Hamburg, I did not seek his company although I was occasionally in it - he always had an entourage fawning over him and I prefer to keep myself to myself. Hence, as I said I knew him, I talked to him, I sat with him, but I was not friends with him.

Then I started visiting Thailand, and on about my 3rd trip we were having a meal in the Ambiance and who should come down the stairs!! Turned out he'd been living there for a while, so we again exchanged hellos and pleasantries etc. Then, a few years later of course he opened Happy Place and invited us to his new bar etc. I was happy enough to go there on a few occasions, buy drinks, and some of my company took off boys - and it was a good bar, but although I did not dislike him I did not wish to be in his company.

As for this forum, he approached me at a time when his health was worsening and asked if I would help moderate it for him and that really what he wanted to do was to give it away to me (turned out he had spun that line to several others). At that time he was getting mega-shit from the original Bitch Board and I thought they were treating him appallingly so I said I'd help. At that point you're right, I did not know he was unstable - I offered to help in good faith because he was under pressure. The falling out happened for a number of reasons which again I will not go into at this time - but basically I was shafted and not in a nice way.

Hope that gives some insight.

joe552

June 5th, 2014, 04:40

My own view - which would apply to anyone, since I never met Neal - the guy is dead, let it go.

Smiles

June 5th, 2014, 10:08

" ... However, I did not meet him there, I met him in Prague in the mid 90's - where we shared a very small hotel on a few occasions, so everyday interaction was inevitable. There is a whole story to that episode in his life (which is quite juicy) but I will not go into that at this time.
Anyway, that went on for maybe 3 or 4 years, then he suddenly disappeared (that's even juicier!) ... "
You were Neal's lover??? Fuck buddy (fewer points)? How small?
Holy shit!!!
Too excellent Doooood! ... gory details please, I shall not cringe. You were a bottom, right? Doooood!!

blazer

June 5th, 2014, 10:46

Never knew Neal or met him, but is always sad to see someone die at a relatively young age. I often wonder about how we can better take care of ourselves to remain in good health and live longer.

June 5th, 2014, 11:11

My own view - which would apply to anyone, since I never met Neal - the guy is dead, let it go.You done read biographys then?

joe552

June 5th, 2014, 11:16

Posting on a message board immediately after someone's death hardly qualifies as a biography. But hey, I'm off to Thailand this morning, so have more important things to think about.

joe552

June 5th, 2014, 11:18

And in answer to the inevitable - so why are you posting now? question - I woke up too early and am bored before my car to the airport arrives.

June 5th, 2014, 11:19

Posting on a message board immediately after someone's death hardly qualifies as a biography.Or even obitaries?

joe552

June 5th, 2014, 11:25

What are "obitaries"?

June 5th, 2014, 11:26

What are "obitaries"?Them articles what people write in newspapers when famous people die.

scottish-guy

June 5th, 2014, 11:27

Ummm nookie with Neal? No - <insert joke about being good with one's fists...but...>.

6 or 8 room pension/hotel, with tiny bar/restaurant/breakfast room.

We had 3 rooms, he had 1, but he dominated the hotel (as you might expect)

As I said, difficult not to interact

scottish-guy

June 5th, 2014, 11:29

What are "obitaries"?Them articles what people write in newspapers when famous people die.

Thanks BG - I thought they were sleeping pills from the 60's.....as in "...the singer died in her hotel room from a lethal cocktail of alcohol and obituaries"

joe552

June 5th, 2014, 11:30

What are "obitaries"?Them articles what people write in newspapers when famous people die.

Presumably using proper English?

a447

June 5th, 2014, 12:27

Joe, you and others have questioned why people are posting about someone who has died.

In my case, I made a post on another board simply to put the record straight ; to give the other side of the story. I felt physically ill as I read all the kind, soothing words about Neal, written by those who either did not know him, or only met him once or twice. When I first met him I got the same impression as others - he was an interesting guy and seemed pleasant enough. I was fascinated with the things he told me about running a bar - I'd never met an owner of a gay bar - and I found his stories about the ins and outs of the business, and watching him interact with the boys, very interesting.

Although we were never friends - I was more interested in the boys inside the bar than chatting to him - I visited Happy Place every night and would chat to Neal when I went outside for a ciggie. It wasn't long before I saw a different side to Neal, a side many of the posters who are defending him obviously didn't get to see. (I write about one incident on another board and won't repeat it here). And that was only the start! He never had a kind word for anyone and took every opportunity to describe SGT posters as weirdos, nut cases, losers, assholes..you name it. I and another poster who sat with us on many occasions often wondered what he said about us in our absence. So you guys who thought you knew him well enough to write nice things about him, guess what...

Joe, it's more about telling people that the " nice" Neal they saw was not the conniving, deceptive, intimidatory, duplicitous, treacherous arsehole I discovered when we had a simple disagreement about how he was running this board; he didn't like to be told he was wrong and so he let loose with incredibly viscous messages to me in which he threatened to have me assaulted by his " boys" - later he threatened to have his boys hunt me down and kill me! And all this over a very simple clash of opinions about the way he was kicking people off his board for trivial things.

That us why I had to keep quiet about being in town. I know exactly where Scottish Guy is coming from, as he had an even worse experience with Neal, if that is possible.

Neal was happiest when he was seen as someone of relevance in gay Pattaya. But his inability to see other people's point of view led to it all crashing down around his ears and he ended up being banned from all the boards (that alone should tell people something) and became irrelevant. This made him very frustrated and he became a complete monster. But it was all his own doing and he refused to recognise this. He saw himself as the centre of the universe and believed he couldn't possibly be wrong - it was everyone else's fault when things went bad for him. I once told him to look in the mirror and he replied that he does so every day and likes what he sees! That says it all.

Have those posters saying nice things about Neal and suggesting he RIP never read the Bitchboard when he owned it? Have they never read the incessive, maniacal invective aimed at Gaybutton and Surfcrest, just to name two? Didn't they notice that he never ever had a kind word to say about anyone? Didn't they notice the blatant lies he told? Didn't they notice the irony in his constant "woe is me, I'm sick" statements when he was always writing about how he liked eating, especially cheesecake? Didn't they put two and two together and realise he was the cause if his illness? ( I've actually seen him stuff his fat face and it almost made me puke.) Didn't they see his treachery in selling this board, whilst all the time he was secretly setting up a rival board and sending out pms to members here to get them to join his new board, all with the intention of bringing SGT down? And what on earth did these posters think when they saw Neal posting photos, addresses, private telephone numbers, etc of members of this board on his own board?

It's all out there on the net for everyone to see. If all of the above leads people to think that Neal is in any way deserving of sympathy, God help them.

fountainhall

June 5th, 2014, 12:53

I have not posted on any Board for the better part of a year as I believed I had formally resigned from all to which I used to contribute. Having been informed about the death of Neal, a man whom I never met but who had decided to raise issues with me on this Board, his pathetic Bitch Board and in various PMs (in a much milder manner than with others, I hasten to add), I decided to look at the comments being made about him. I then realised I had - for some reason totally forgotten - remained as a member of this Board.

I will make just three comments. First, he was obviously a friend to some, and to those who mourn him, I extend my condolences.

Second, to those who knew him only through his various personae on different Boards, he latterly came across as a vicious, paranoid, vindictive individual who would stop at nothing to berate, humiliate and all-but libel many people. He was hell-bent on attacking reputations, no matter how inaccurate his usually puerile and idiotic prose. He seemed positively thrilled at the thought he was blazing a path of destruction. The depth of his depravity concerning the present owner of this Board was utterly disgusting. To those who admonish others for speaking ill of the dead, remember Shakespeare: "The evil that men do lives after them; the good is oft interred with their bones."

My third, more minor, point concerns those bones and the reason I and some others joined this Board. When Neal took over, he announced a photo competition with several categories and generous prizes of Bt. 24,000. It was a great idea. Many entered. I happened to win Bt. 6,000. I and some others (Including Christianpfc) asked if he would kindly donate our winnings to the Pattaya Street Kids Charity. The total in donations was over Bt. 15,000. He soon announced in the thread this would be done. Not knowing the man, but having heard about his generosity, I assumed it had indeed been done. Some months later (I stress at a time when our few communications were still entirely amicable), I suggested in a PM that to round off the photo competition threads it would be a nice gesture to post the receipt from the charity on this Board. I was almost verbally attacked and told he had been given no receipt. I then asked if he could perhaps scan a part of the letter he would no doubt have received and post that. The attack was stronger - he had received no letter! This annoyed me as I know that charities must by law (something Neal purported to know a great deal about) provide formal receipts, but I did not pursue it. Soon I became an object of Neal's hate-generating mindset, ending up with my being accused publicly of all sorts of things including, ridiculously, of being a hydra. Privately the threats were far stronger.

I still have no idea if any charities received any of the promised funds.

Dave

June 5th, 2014, 13:24

So I still have no idea if any charities received any of the promised funds. I raise this now for it may throw a slightly different light on what some have been posting.

I'm not sure what light it is you expected to throw two or three years after the fact. Very brave of you to bring this up now that the man is dead. If you were so concerned as to whether the kids' charity received the funds, why didn't you pick up the phone and call them yourself, instead of passing innuendo on a matter that is a couple of years old and where one of the principal players is already dead. Now that you're back, are you going to stick around and post or are you going to "retire" again until somebody else falls dead before you will come out again to raise your ethical concerns with regards to that dead person?

Dave

June 5th, 2014, 13:26

Posting on a message board immediately after someone's death hardly qualifies as a biography. But hey, I'm off to Thailand this morning, so have more important things to think about.

Safe trip!

fountainhall

June 5th, 2014, 13:42

Very brave of you to bring this up now that the man is dead.
Interesting comment from someone who has been a member of this Board for less than 2 weeks! Do you seriously believe that any Charity anywhere will confirm to one party other than a registered authority that (a) it has received a donation from another party and (b) the amount of that donation? That my friend is probably illegal. Besides, who on this Board has any clue under what name any donation was provided - SGT? Neal Barnard? the Bar he then owned?

But you can rest easy. I was surprised to see I remained a member of this Board after not contributing to it for so long. As I stated, I did not resign from this Board - unlike two others. Now having had my say over events in which I was a direct participant (and which, I believe, you were not, although you are perfectly entitled to comment on what others post in any way you please), I will make no further contribution.

Dave

June 5th, 2014, 13:53

Very brave of you to bring this up now that the man is dead.
Interesting comment from someone who has been a member of this Board for less than 2 weeks! But you can rest easy. I was surprised to see I remained a member of this Board after not contributing to it for so long. As I stated, I did not resign from this Board - unlike two others. Now having had my say over events in which I was a direct participant (and which, I believe, you were not although you are perfectly entitled to comment on what others post in any way you please), I will make no further contribution.

Oh I see. So you were just dabbling around your computer and decided to throw in an innuendo or two to see if your account still worked. If you you were sincere about this, you would have gotten the information you wanted by hook or by crook, and thanked (or confronted) Neil with your findings. From what I've read of your posts, you've never been a man of few words. You constantly bitch about airlines, go on and on and on about bad service, incessantly complain about being slighted here or there and yet you chose the quiet route on this one and only decided two years later, after the man is dead, to tell the world about it? Hmmm... It's too easy to claim nobility for oneself while dancing on the grave of another. You may have succeeded in besmirching a dead man's character further, but it is the kids who are the losers in this, if the money never got to them. And you've got only yourself to blame for it as a "direct participant" in the matter. The other guy is dead.

And, thank you, I will rest easy as my conscience is clear. Can't say the same for you.

June 5th, 2014, 14:08

What are "obitaries"?Them articles what people write in newspapers when famous people die.Presumably using proper English?I thought your Irish like James Joyce.

fountainhall

June 5th, 2014, 14:20

If you felt so strongly about this, you should have got the information you wanted by hook or by crook, and thanked (or confronted) Neil with your findings.
Since this seems to have stuck in your craw, how do you suggest this could have been done without breaking any law? You suggested phoning. I knocked that on the head. Wouldn't work legally! And why on earth should I have bothered to thank Neil who could so easily have provided that proof - but did not?

From what I've read of your posts, you've never been a man of few words.
Aha! so this is the real nub of your argument. It's personal. Fine, that's your privilege. But now we know. It's not about Neal after all.

You may have succeeded in besmirching a dead man's character further, but it is the kids who are the losers in this, if the money never got to them. And you've got only yourself to blame for it as a "direct participant" in the matter.
What a tragic joke! Your logic is more than a tad twisted with that little paragraph! I, christianpfc and the others are to "blame" if the donations never got to kids, and we were never in control of that money in the first place? What utter nonsense!

Dave

June 5th, 2014, 14:43

From what I've read of your posts, you've never been a man of few words.

Aha! so this is the real nub of your argument. It's personal. Fine, that's your privilege. But now we know. It's not about Neal after all.

So this is not about the kids' charity but you making it personal about Neal? Fine, that's your privilege. At least now we know where your priorities are.

You may have succeeded in besmirching a dead man's character further, but it is the kids who are the losers in this, if the money never got to them. And you've got only yourself to blame for it as a "direct participant" in the matter.

What a tragic joke! Your logic is more than a tad twisted with that little paragraph! I, christianpfc and the others are to "blame" if the donations never got to kids, and we were never in control of that money in the first place? What utter nonsense!

Nice of you to drag christianpfc into this. He didn't raise this matter, you did. But that doesn't really matter, does it? Dead or alive, you'll drag anyone's name into the mud to serve your twisted logic and less-than-honorable motives.

I will make no further contribution.

I guess this was a lie too.

lego

June 5th, 2014, 14:58

Hopefully Neal's death will give this board and its owner the chance to - finally - move on. I haven't known him and now I never will, may he rest in peace.

I have not posted on any Board for the better part of a year as I believed I had formally resigned from all to which I used to contribute.
Are you confusing 'message board' with 'board of directors', or just an incredibly funny guy? One does not formally resign from message boards, does one?

fountainhall

June 5th, 2014, 15:12

Good point! I guess in this case it was both meanings! For my own reasons I decided to leave two other Boards after contributing for several years. I asked the owners to delete my memberships. I suppose I could have continued just as a non-contributing member but I wanted a total break. For his own reasons, one owner then posted that I had "retired" - his word not mine. That is what I was thinking of when I wrote "resigned".

Surfcrest

June 5th, 2014, 16:25

To those who admonish others for speaking ill of the dead, remember Shakespeare: "The evil that men do lives after them; the good is oft interred with their bones."

I really need to get a "Like" button, thanks for that fountainhall...brilliant!

I made a commitment once upon a time for when this day would come and so I am keeping that promise by allowing anyone to post any comment they want about Neal...good or not.
I would hope it would not drift off track with members attacking other members for their comments, but I also believe the great posters like fountainhall are easily able to handle themselves here.

It would be no surprise to any member what I thought of Neal Bernard and simply put, it would be redundant to go over what is still posted here in historic threads on this Board and others.

I paid a considerable amount of money for two internet domains from him. He first tried to sign over a bogus domain with the site name spelled slightly wrong. He never did sign over both domains and so I only received 50% of what he legally promised. He threatened me with legal action until I threatened him back. He threatened to send his boys after me up until we actually met. He attempted to gain access into my building. He once posted on his board a news story of a pedophile who was arrested in Canada for crimes against children in Thailand with my complete name edited in.

Neal knew it would have been a roll of the dice to do anything about him in Thailand, despite the imbalance in our legal representation there. I knew that sooner or later he would have to come back to the USA, where I could settle this continuing dispute between us. If it wasn't for the pedophile post I probably wouldn't give a shit about what he cheated me out of, but that post was simply him having gone way too far. Needless to say I've been smiling for quite awhile, through the demise of the TBB and now to see this loose end (pardon the pun) closed off.

Hopefully Neal's death will give this board and its owner the chance to - finally - move on.

You know lego, up until now I haven't said a thing on this topic and wasn't planning to until I noticed my friend fountainhall being jumped on. But truly it was really your post that I noticed, because you've mentioned this obsession you think I have with Neal before and no doubt this is yet another jab at me and something you really know nothing about. Only the tip of the iceberg of our dispute was ever discussed here and even more was discussed long before you were ever a member. If I have something to say about this topic or any topic that's my right as a member (not an owner), as it is a right of any member...including yourself. No doubt you've heard this similar jingle from me before, so ,maybe you can - finally - move on about it!

Surfcrest

http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y69/Surfcrest/Flintstone.jpg

a447

June 5th, 2014, 17:47

Fountainhall, irasshaimase!

fountainhall

June 5th, 2014, 18:28

Arigato gozaimashita!

francois

June 5th, 2014, 18:49

Bienvenue Fountainhall.

fountainhall

June 5th, 2014, 19:18

Et merci ├а vous, Fran├зois

lego

June 5th, 2014, 22:58

Hopefully Neal's death will give this board and its owner the chance to - finally - move on.
You know lego, up until now I haven't said a thing on this topic and wasn't planning to until I noticed my friend fountainhall being jumped on. But truly it was really your post that I noticed, because you've mentioned this obsession you think I have with Neal before and no doubt this is yet another jab at me and something you really know nothing about.
I typed a rather lengthy reply but I came to the conclusion to delete it. Just two things: First, this wasn't meant as a jab and I'm sorry that you got that impression. Second, please just take what I've written at face value, for once. I've got no agenda with regards to Neal, and never had one (I didn't know him at all, and I don't know you either).

Impulse

June 6th, 2014, 00:46

Does anyone know what happened to the Cambodian guy that Neal was seeing? I recall Neal mentioning to him that if anything happened to him he would know where to go for it. This was on a thread about leaving behind money for our boyfriends in Thailand. That was one guy that I cannot remember Neal ever saying anything negative about, except that he chewed food with his mouth open.

Surfcrest

June 6th, 2014, 15:10

My third, more minor, point concerns those bones and the reason I and some others joined this Board. When Neal took over, he announced a photo competition with several categories and generous prizes of Bt. 24,000. It was a great idea. Many entered. I happened to win Bt. 6,000. I and some others (Including Christianpfc) asked if he would kindly donate our winnings to the Pattaya Street Kids Charity. The total in donations was over Bt. 15,000. He soon announced in the thread this would be done. Not knowing the man, but having heard about his generosity, I assumed it had indeed been done. Some months later (I stress at a time when our few communications were still entirely amicable), I suggested in a PM that to round off the photo competition threads it would be a nice gesture to post the receipt from the charity on this Board. I was almost verbally attacked and told he had been given no receipt. I then asked if he could perhaps scan a part of the letter he would no doubt have received and post that. The attack was stronger - he had received no letter! This annoyed me as I know that charities must by law (something Neal purported to know a great deal about) provide formal receipts, but I did not pursue it. Soon I became an object of Neal's hate-generating mindset, ending up with my being accused publicly of all sorts of things including, ridiculously, of being a hydra. Privately the threats were far stronger.

I still have no idea if any charities received any of the promised funds.

The Treasurer / Trustee of the Pattaya Street kidsтАЩ Support Project requested I post the following email sent August 2, 2012;

Hello Neal.

I am pleased to confirm that the donations totalling 9000Baht made to Pattaya Street Kids by your competition winners have been received.

At the moment we have a lot of children in need of help for food both at school and at home so these generous donations from your members will make a great difference to the help we are able to give to these kids.

Please would you be kind enough to pass on our thanks to the winners for their kindness in thinking of the children especially at a time when everybody is feeling the effects of the world's economic problems.

Kind regards.

Don Ford.
Treasurer / Trustee.
http://www.slum-kids.org

scottish-guy

June 6th, 2014, 19:08

It's amazing how, as things (allegedly) change, they remain the same! No sooner has the Great Lawsuit Man died (and I remain to be convinced about that) than a little bird tells me that his self-proclaimed arch-enemy who very publicly called him all sorts (and vice-versa) is ranting and raving on another board about how Fountainhall and others ought to be sued for their comments. Also, a statement that I am sexually attracted to 2 year olds ( sound familiar, Surfy?), that I said the notorious Gentleman Club was my all-time favourite bar (which it was not, and which I never said) and the totally ludicrous suggestion that Fat Boy had "something on me" which, if anybody knew the lengths he went to just try to identify me, they would realise how implausible that is. One would certainly be forgiven for wondering whether the Great Lawsuit has simply morphed into yet another identity . Has anybody actually seen any independent reports of his death? Or is it simply that his fistful of acolytes over on that particular board are every bit as much twisted fucks as the leader was?

fountainhall

June 6th, 2014, 23:18

Hello Neal.

I am pleased to confirm that the donations totalling 9000Baht made to Pattaya Street Kids by your competition winners have been received.

I am delighted that this has surfaced - although why it could not have been either posted or sent by PM to the contributors when the matter was first raised fails me. Still, since I raised doubts about the donations, I will double my Bt. 6,000 and send it to the same charity.

scottish-guy

June 6th, 2014, 23:26

Very generous - but you had better post the receipt Founty, or all hell will break loose - I'm sure you know that.

Nice to see you here - you should stay. Once this topic has settled down it will be all sweetness and light again.

:ymhug:

fountainhall

June 6th, 2014, 23:33

you had better post the receipt Founty, or all hell will break loose - I'm sure you know that
Yes, I am aware of that! I will make the donation next week and will certainly post the receipt or acknowledgement of receipt on this thread when it arrives.

Surfcrest

June 7th, 2014, 00:13

Oh timmberty? He's just a parrot repeating the lies he read from Neal on the bitchboard. All those lies died with the TBB.
I had to go digging to find the link to that little rag. Let me know if you want me to block timmberty's access!
...or poleaxe, for that matter :)

Surfcrest

Smiles

June 7th, 2014, 02:12

" ... Still, since I raised doubts about the donations, I will double my Bt. 6,000 and send it to the same charity ...
A classy reply Fountainhall.

bucknaway

June 7th, 2014, 06:31

Has anyone any actual proof he is dead? I only ask because he lied about himself so much...

[youtube:1c9obola]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nqAvFx3NxUM[/youtube:1c9obola]

colmx

June 7th, 2014, 06:43

Has anyone any actual proof he is dead? I only ask because he lied about himself so much...

[youtube:65p557fb]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nqAvFx3NxUM[/youtube:65p557fb]
I swore i wasn't gonna respond to this thread until Neal was confirmed as buried...but Buckies post above has spurred me into action...
When there is proof of death is will be more like this clip than Buckies clip!
[youtube:65p557fb]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OdQDXs75Ulo[/youtube:65p557fb]

Impulse

June 7th, 2014, 08:09

Lol, for the few who know me in real life, if you find out I died, please don't post it on any of these boards. =))

Smiles

June 7th, 2014, 08:17

Lol, for the few who know me in real life, if you find out I died, please don't post it on any of these boards. =))
Good idea. Please add me to that list as well.
My old man has strict orders to take my rotting cadaver out into the Gulf of Thailand on a fishing boat and throw me over. Then delete all message board connections.

bucknaway

June 7th, 2014, 09:43

I already died once as reported on this board some years ago so I don't think anyone is allowed to repot me as dead. Y'all will have to wait for me to post about my death =P~

a447

June 7th, 2014, 09:57

Let me know if you want me to block timmberty's access!
...or poleaxe, for that matter

Oh, no! Don't do that! You'd take away their oxygen and our opportunity for a good laugh. They "just pace in their cages like discontented leopards" and we all like to go to the zoo every now and then, don't we!

That small group of pariahs are, to paraphrase NIrish, like the weak-kneed wimps who stand behind the bully, egging him on. They have no mind of their own ( no brain, in the case of Timmberty) and are simply followers, even though their boss and Great Leader is apparently dead and has gone to hell. (I agree with Scottish on this - Neal was such a duplicitous cunt that I wouldn't put anything past him).

And how hypocritical are they?? Many of them were members of the bitchboards at the time when Neal was writing cruel and disparaging remarks about people who had recently died, but not a single word of admonishment from them. Not one. Did any of them write anything critical of, say, LMTU? Did any of them joke about the guy who committed suicide, or admonish those who did? Did any of them criticise Timmberty for his joke about how the cabin crew knew Neal was dead? (Very funny, btw).
"The lady doth protest too much."

Now they are bleating about those of us who are portraying the real Neal in response to those who have been writing nice things about this monster - people who only had a passing acquaintance with him (had a cup of coffee with him, sent him a suggestion by email, spoke to Thais who were in his pocket and depended on his money, etc) and were not the victims of his maniacal intimidation and threats. Although Neal always threatened people with libel, he was never averse to liberally libelling others - naming them, posting their personal details and then accusing them of being all kinds of things, from pedophiles to fraudsters. In one case, he allowed a post on SGT ( by a new poster who only made the one post...hmmm...) about a guy travelling to Thailand on a false passport! How could the poster possibly have known that? Did the guy in question -his sworn enemy who Neal had banned from this board- show him his passport in the restaurant? That's an example of the lies we are all talking about. That could have been you in Neal's twisted world. Had you gotten to know him and he believed you had crossed him in some way, no matter how trivial, then you would no doubt be joining us in putting the record straight.

As for not speaking of the dead and all that crap, did people really think the passing of someone so evil, so controversial and, at one time, such a large (pardon the pun) player in gay Pattaya would not solicit posts across all the boards?

Poor old Timmberty. Such bitterness and negativity in every post. I guess that's how you become if you find yourself bored shitless and without adequate financial resources to get out and enjoy life. You end up like the sad old fucks I reported on during my last trip to Pattaya - sitting in a bar getting drunk every night and leading a lonely life without purpose.

Timmy, old son, you should have worked harder at school. Then perhaps you'd have been able to find a well- paid job and would have enough money to enjoy yourself, rather than spend your time on the PBB writing about us...lol. (But then again, with such limited intellectual capacity......). Go get a hobby, Timmy. There are heaps of charities always looking for volunteers. Go do something useful in your life...or just get a life!

ikarus

June 7th, 2014, 12:43

Neal was not an evil person. He was just... paranoidal somewhat. As many others, I did have some collisions with him and I quickly realized that the best way is to stay away . People who flew too close to him had a chance to have their wings melted down(trust me on that one). Having said that, I always felt sorry for him because of his illness. And it was possible to deal with him as a message board owner. In any case, he was a doer in real life and I generally like this kind of people.
As for Fountainhall "contribution", note that we are talking about the money Neal gave to him as a prize. The whole story, therefore is quite shitty and tell you more about characters like Fountainhall rather than Neal.
RIP. You lived your life to the fullest...

Manforallseasons

June 7th, 2014, 12:45

This thread has given many a chance to vent or say something non toxic but as Neal deserved no recognition as being human while alive why give it to him in death?

fountainhall

June 7th, 2014, 13:50

As for Fountainhall "contribution", note that we are talking about the money Neal gave to him as a prize. The whole story, therefore is quite shitty and tell you more about characters like Fountainhall rather than Neal
I am confused by your comment. Various Board posters won cash prizes. Several, including myself, requested their winnings be donated to local charities. Neal kindly agreed to do that and so no cash was ever received by the winners. Later, despite at least a couple of polite requests, no confirmation of donations was provided on this Board or by PM. Yet, one quick post similar to that made by surfcrest yesterday would very simply have ended the issue there and then! I have absolutely no idea why that was not done. I can't believe you are suggesting that having offered prizes it would have been perfectly proper for donations never to have been made. Given that assumption, then why would you object to the issue being raised now when it was Neal himself who decided - for whatever reason - never to provide the donors with the requested confirmation of their donations?

Still, in the light of surfcrest's post, I have acknowledged and am pleased that despite Neal's odd decision the donations were in fact made. I also acknowledge my part in raising the issue now. Although wholly unaware of what had actually happened until yesterday, I will next week make a Bt. 6,000 donation to the Pattaya Street Kids Charity.

June 7th, 2014, 14:02

For all his huffing and puffing Neal never worked out who created the spoof blog FatBoySawasdee.

scottish-guy

June 7th, 2014, 14:27

Just to clarify what a447 said - the post about the "false passport" was about a former owner of a showbar in BT - maybe you can work it out. The person concerned was named in full and should he wish to see the post I have a screenshot.

The allegation (via a "brand new poster" - who's initial post would have to have been approved by the Admin of course - i.e. Neal, so he would have been culpable either as the hydra or the publisher, or both) was along the lines of he had been sitting in a restaurant when who should walk through the door but X. According to the post, X was shocked to see the writer sitting there ( perhaps munching on a giraffe leg), because (and I quote) X knew that I knew he is banned from Thailand. It then went on to say (and I quote again) he was travelling on his dead brother's passport.

Then a VERY CLUMSY response appeared from "Neal" telling all future respondents to watch what they said because X might be watching the board.

A couple of hours later he must have thought better of it (or been contacted) and the topic had gone. But not before I'd taken the screenshots, which I still have.

Incidentally, I hear some Neal fans are doubting what I posted about a "small hotel in Prague" - well, I'll name it: Holger's Pension! And no, I didn't rip it off the internet because it's been shut for at least 15yrs. There is however an SGT poster who was familiar with the Prague scene at that time who will doubtless recall the venue - I'll leave it to him to confirm if he feels like doing so.

:ymparty:

a447

June 7th, 2014, 15:10

Ikarus wrote:

I did have some collisions with him and I quickly realized that the best way is to stay away .

Had you had more collisions you would have no doubt seen that he was, in fact, evil.

As for it being possible to communicate with him on the boards, you obviously had more success than many of us here. When I tried to communicate with him over a relatively minor thing, he banned me! He summarily banned others from his "playground" - I think Kommentariat was one, from memory after he'd made an innocuous post.

And speaking of boards, I was Ton on the original BB. It was when I tried to make a post about the false passport affair that I was banned - on the spot! Neal was sitting there monitoring all the posts. When I mentioned the ban on this board, Neal posted on the BB that I was lying and that I was never banned. Unfortunately for him, I had a screenshot of the website where it showed I could no longer post. Yet another of Neal's lies exposed. So no, Ikarus, it was not possible to communicate with Neal on the boards.

The allegation (via a "brand new poster" - who's initial post would have to have been approved by the Admin of course - i.e. Neal, so he would have been culpable either as the hydra or the publisher, or both)

If I recall, in those days, your first few posts had to be ok'ed by Neal. This guy joined and immediately made the one post and was never heard from again. No waiting for him! Yet another example of Neal's duplicity. God, he was such a sneaky cunt, but not smart enough to remain undiscovered. I remember the time when I received a pm, supposedly from a member of this board. It was obviously from Neal. "No, no. I didn't send it," he protested. What he forgot was that the member in question had been suspended from the board so could not possibly have pm'ed me. Neal obviously had access to our pms, which were supposed to be private. A pm I'd received from another member here was mysteriously deleted.

As for feeling sorry for his health problems, which he played for all they were worth (remember the "stroke" which caused him so many problems? He was still able to set up a new board, despite telling us his stroke forced him to sell SGT as he no longer had the strength to run it. It didn't stop him from spewing out his vile bile on his other boards. I'm not doubting he had a stroke; I'm doubting its severity as Neal's subsequent actions give lie to his claims of its debilitating effects on his health.

And let's not forget that post he made out of the blue where he told us he'd suffered FOUR heart attacks. How come he'd never mentioned them previously? Up until then, he'd only ever mentioned one - over and over again, I might add. He was just looking for sympathy. "Woe is me."

And I don't see how anyone could feel sorry for him when he alone made the decision to ignore medical advice and continue stuffing his face with all the wrong foods. His diet exacerbated both his heart condition and his diabetes. It's a fact that so many overlook when they offer their sympathy for his health problems.

Having said that, I did, however, feel sorry for him in regards to his kidney problems and actually sent him info on research being done at a University here in Australia. No-one should have to deal with dialysis. But that is no excuse for his appalling behaviour, both on and off the boards.

MiniMee

June 7th, 2014, 15:27

I posted about a "small hotel in Prague" - well, I'll name it: Holger's Pension!

You mean Pension Haus Holger on Pod Sychrovem?

Ah, I remember it well...

Marsilius

June 7th, 2014, 18:22

Neal obviously had access to our pms, which were supposed to be private. A pm I'd received from another member here was mysteriously deleted.

The same thing happened to me. It had never occurred to me before now that Neal might have been deleting PMs. I guess that paranoid is the most apt description for him.

fountainhall

June 7th, 2014, 22:16

. . . you had better post the receipt Founty . . .
Receipt posted (hopefully the URL will work - if not, I may need some advice!)

http://i1125.photobucket.com/albums/l597/fountainhall/Pattaya_Charity_Receipt.jpg (http://s1125.photobucket.com/user/fountainhall/media/Pattaya_Charity_Receipt.jpg.html)

scottish-guy

June 7th, 2014, 22:51

I posted about a "small hotel in Prague" - well, I'll name it: Holger's Pension!

You mean Pension Haus Holger on Pod Sychrovem?

Ah, I remember it well...

Yes, MiniMee - that's the one!

Surfcrest

June 7th, 2014, 23:12

A classy reply Fountainhall.
You're a classy guy fountainhall!

Surfcrest

scottish-guy

June 7th, 2014, 23:13

It never occurred to me before now that Neal might have been deleting PMs. I guess that paranoid is the most apt description for him.

My PM facilty was accessed and my outbox completely emptied - I also suspected my inbox had been accessed. When I confronted him about it and told 3 people about it by PM after they PMd me on GayThailand asking why I'd left, he admitted accessing my PM facility and emptying the inbox. He denied reading my Inbox and sent umpteen emails theatening to sue me, on the basis I had sent out emails libelling him (actually I'd replied to PMs stating the truth) and threatened to have me arrested the minute I set foot in Thailand! I have all the emails. I had to delete my email address to stop the harassment.

Smiles

June 7th, 2014, 23:32

My PM facilty was accessed and my outbox completely emptied - I also suspected my inbox had been accessed. When I confronted him about it and told 3 people about it by PM after they PMd me on GayThailand asking why I'd left, he admitted accessing my PM facility and emptying the inbox. He denied reading my Inbox and sent umpteen emails theatening to sue me, on the basis I had sent out emails libelling him (actually I'd replied to PMs stating the truth) and threatened to have me arrested the minute I set foot in Thailand! I have all the emails. I had to delete my email address to stop the harassment.
I also had a profane and escalating series of toxic PM's with Neal. There came a time that I could not really believe the absolutely demented stuff I was receiving from him. I finally told him to profanely fuck off: After that I never again posted on Sawatdee until he sold the board to Surfcrest.

But ~ as the above quote makes clear ~ he was stooping to the level of accessing PM's of his members, then issuing allegations and threats of the most psychotic kind.
Frankly, as a former owner of Sawatdee, I had no idea that an Admin could access PMs at all: certainly the original EZboard version did not allow that.
After reading the above from Scottish Guy, I'm surprised that Sawatdee survived at all. Things were obviously much, much worse than I ever imagined.

Surfcrest

June 8th, 2014, 00:39

Which....takes us full circle back to this discussion a year ago ;)

http://sawatdeenetwork.com/forum/moderators-access-accounts-private-content-t28825-15.html#p274092

Enjoy,

Surfcrest

(I'll post an update on this sensitive topic in Board Business very shortly)

scottish-guy

June 8th, 2014, 02:35

For clarity - I made a typo in line 2 - should have read "he admitted accessing my PM facility and emptying the outbox" - as I said in line 1

The argument that deleting the contents of someone's outbox is not somehow accessing their PM facility is so ridiculous as not to be worthy of even the faintest consideration.

My privates were interfered with!

Ohhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh, Matron!

lego

June 8th, 2014, 14:41

As for Fountainhall "contribution", note that we are talking about the money Neal gave to him as a prize. The whole story, therefore is quite shitty and tell you more about characters like Fountainhall rather than Neal.
That's very obviously nonsense. When someone wins a prize and gives it up in favor of a charity, it's the winner of the prize that is to be commended for doing so. He could have just pocketed it, after all. Good on fountainhall, I'd say, and it's even nicer that he just made an additional contribution. :ymapplause:

francois

June 8th, 2014, 17:07

Regarding PMs the cardinal rule is never write anything controversial, contentious or litigious since it can and will be held against you. [-X

scottish-guy

June 8th, 2014, 18:03

Regarding PMs the cardinal rule is never write anything controversial, contentious or litigious since it can and will be held against you. [-X

Disagree, Francois - the cardinal rule is a PM is PRIVATE, and not available for an Admin or Mod to surreptitiously read/delete/or disseminate.

If that is not adhered to, all trust is lost in the PM facility - which would be regrettable and any Board Owner may as well shut it down if people can not rely on the security of their private communications and (by extension) their private details.

Really, some SGT posters need to get away from constantly attacking the offendEE and protecting the offendER. I well remember posters here attacking a447 for being robbed!!

francois

June 8th, 2014, 19:06

Regarding PMs the cardinal rule is never write anything controversial, contentious or litigious since it can and will be held against you. [-X

Disagree, Francois - the cardinal rule is a PM is PRIVATE, and not available for an Admin or Mod to read/delete/or disseminate. !

And the Easter Bunny lays multi-colored eggs. Nothing is PRIVATE is prudent course of action. Anyone can and will use a PM to their advantage if so inclined. I have little doubt that moderators/owners can and do access PMs. That is life on the forums.

scottish-guy

June 8th, 2014, 19:19

OK, maybe I'm guilty of taking people and things at face-value - but I hope and expect a denial of that assertion (as far as THIS board, under the current management, is concerned) will be forthcoming from Surfcrest.

I have no concern (now) about the security of my private comms/info here.

Smiles

June 8th, 2014, 20:55

Regarding PMs the cardinal rule is never write anything controversial, contentious or litigious since it can and will be held against you.
And ...

I have little doubt that moderators/owners can and do access PMs. That is life on the forums.
I can only speak for the EZBoard Sawatdee ... the message board platform I chose when I started Sawatdee, and the only one used while I was the Admin. Elephantspike used it also for about a year before switching to phpBB, the system in use today.
On EZBoard there was absolutely no possible ability to access Members' PMs by either the Owner, the Admin (if different) or the Moderators. PM's were always sacrosanct as far as I am aware.

Did Neal find a way? I have no idea.
Certainly he was smarmy enough to use it if in fact he had of found a way ... but that is not saying he did.
In my opinion, if anybody behind the scenes could access PMs when it is specifically stated that it is not possible to do so (and that's what the EZBoard platform stated, and as far as I know, what every message board system states), then the credibility of every message board is ruined beyond repair.
Do you really think any message board system would allow that?

Smiles

June 8th, 2014, 22:57

On the other hand, and later . . . after posting the above I did a bit of searching on the phpBB home website. Things apparently are not necessarily quite as cut and dry as I allude to in the post above.

They have a huge number of forums there dedicated to owners or admins asking technical questions about phpBB message boards.
One of the replies to a question regarding PM security in general suggested that an Admin could theoretically get access to the board database itself and perhaps be able to read everything which is posted on the board, including PMs.
Everything would be much more difficult to find as it is all in database-speak (i.e. not easily view-able, and very unlike the message board view which we are all familiar with) , but I suppose someone who is knowledgeable about such stuff may well be able to read PMs ... or so said one person on the thread.

https://www.phpbb.com/community/viewtop ... &p=9872865 (https://www.phpbb.com/community/viewtopic.php?t=1640595&p=9872865)

francois

June 8th, 2014, 23:52

The only thing I am certain about when it comes to spying on others' personal messages is that the NSA (US National Security Agency) has not, and has never, listened to Chancellor Angela Merkel's phone calls. :^o

One must also realized that any PM sent to another member has no guarantee that the member will not reveal it's contents.

Surfcrest

June 9th, 2014, 02:01

Please see;

http://sawatdeenetwork.com/forum/moderators-access-accounts-t30715.html

Surfcrest

newalaan2

June 9th, 2014, 04:35

I've been busy preparing for my trip to Thailand as well as travelling recently so I haven't had time to add some thoughts on Neal's demise yet, but a response on this side-issue of owners access to PMs is worth an effort, This 'problem' will remain unresolved no matter what Board owners/moderators say. It is a matter of trust or whether it is actually worth a second of your time worrying about it.

I could never have trusted Neal on this issue, as despite any assurances given, there is always another techie-talk expert who will come up with a way to circumvent whatever has gone before, and given Neal's easy attitude to throwing money around to get his way, I certainly wouldn't have put it past him to hire a real expert if he really was that desperate.

Ironically I started the thread on "Moderators Access to PMs" last year because of Neal himself blabbing his big mouth off when he was desperate to try and smear jinks. I despised him for that, (although jinks and I never saw eye-to-eye on his moderating methods I always appreciated the time he put in over many years, and outside of Mr Moderator I had a lot of time for him). From a personal point I really couldn't care what an owner has access to on a forum about gay thailand issues, the bulk of which is basically trivia, it's hardly homeland security and while some will say "that is not the point" one needs to put things in life into perspective.

What did come out of Neal's awful tenure and this question of access to PMs however, was that it did spook some members on SGT. I have fairly regular contact with a few long time Board members, recently there has been a bit of communication back-and-fore because of reaction to posts I made and of the 8 regulars only 2 use Board PMs, the others use Email only.

Some of that goes back to the fact that not all the interaction is specifically about SGT, but these are long standing current members who contribute on a fairly regular basis, and I'm afraid no matter what I or anyone else says about the probability of PMs being accessed, they simply do not believe that access is impossible. One person is convinced that it can be done because of knowledge from his line of work.

One or two (or more) of them may chip in here on this subject and explain their reasons for doubting. I personally don't understand why they have an issue anyway, a gay Thailand board is a fairly trivial part of many people's real lives and don't know why they are that bothered about access to unimportant messages (in the context of real life) on an anonymous cyberspace forum.

I have to choose words carefully nowadays as anything I post, no matter how matter of fact, is being picked-on by surfcrest if it in anyway refers to him, (and being the owner that can de difficult to avoid), and given this clear personal animosity towards me, anything he deems as a 'slight' to him or his 'friends' gets the new classification of 'a poke in the eye' , followed by an out-of-proportion response. So I will clearly state that I certainly accept the current owner of SGT's assurance that no PMs would or have been accessed under his watch.

Surfcrest

June 9th, 2014, 07:24

I could never have trusted Neal on this issue, as despite any assurances given, there is always another techie-talk expert who will come up with a way to circumvent whatever has gone before, and given Neal's easy attitude to throwing money around to get his way, I certainly wouldn't have put it past him to hire a real expert if he really was that desperate.

I am already answering inquiries on this topic on a thread in the Board Business Forum. As I said in my response in that thread, there was only two other technically minded people around Neal with any of the Boards after elephantspike left. Ron arrived on the scene after Neal got the boot from Sawatdee and designed the pink bitchboard. He's a talented individual, he put a good platform together for them. The other tech ran the server and kept the site online. He fixed things for a fee and is a private contractor with no interest in the Board. Had Neal brought someone in and they did anything with the Board we (jinks and I) would have known from the logs. Neal never managed anything with the Board's software after elephantspike left, he didn't respond to software warnings to update the software, he didn't turn on or turn off things that weren't working and he never cleaned out his moderator logs. Moderator logs store all Board activity, including software activity. There was / is no history in the logs of Neal accessing anything in the Board controls and as Ron has said recently, he couldn't do anything with the controls beyond the very basics. In reviewing the logs (and we still have these) we can see the editing Neal did on past historic threads 1 - 3 years ago. Dante was the first tech to look at the software after I purchased it from Neal and after jinks and I had cut Neal free.

I have to choose words carefully nowadays as anything I post, no matter how matter of fact, is being picked-on by surfcrest if it in anyway refers to him, (and being the owner that can de difficult to avoid), and given this clear personal animosity towards me, anything he deems as a 'slight' to him or his 'friends' gets the new classification of 'a poke in the eye' , followed by an out-of-proportion response. So I will clearly state that I certainly accept the current owner of SGT's assurance that no PMs would or have been accessed under his watch.

No newalaan2, not anything you post. Just anything you post about me...such as this. If I could put you on ignore, I certainly would. Unfortunately as the only moderator and you being one of the few that requires moderation from time to time, we are at an impasse. I'm a busy man away from the Board, elephantspike is a busy man outside of the Board, neither of us has the time or any interest in reading your PM's or even knowing you are using the PM function. As the Chief Engineer, I would hope elephantspike would announce to the Board if he saw me meddle with the software or do any more than what I'm doing which includes updating the front page and building our network.

Surfcrest

dab69

June 9th, 2014, 23:38

Oh wow.

Aside from Neals discomfort with the flight.
Wondering how that would be handled, considering how full
the flight might have been, and exactly when it was discovered.

scottish-guy

June 10th, 2014, 00:48

Well let's face it they certainly couldn't have stowed Neal in a toilet, could they?

The talk elsewhere has been of it being a medevac flight, in which case a problem doesn't arise - but others have pooh-poohed that.

Assuming a commercial flight, it depends how long into the flight the death occurs - but if turning back or diverting is not an option, I hear that British Airways (for example) put eyeshades on the corpse, put a blanket around him, a newspaper on his lap, and set a Gin & Tonic in front of him.

It's also been known for a crew member to sit next to the body until the flight reaches its destination, to prevent anybody asking if the guy who hasn't moved for 10 hours is OK.

I'm glad it was dab69 who asked the question - I wouldn't want to be accused of bad taste.

Manforallseasons

June 10th, 2014, 00:56

I have to choose words carefully nowadays as anything I post, no matter how matter of fact, is being picked-on by surfcrest if it in anyway refers to him, (and being the owner that can de difficult to avoid), and given this clear personal animosity towards me, anything he deems as a 'slight' to him or his 'friends' gets the new classification of 'a poke in the eye' , followed by an out-of-proportion response. So I will clearly state that I certainly accept the current owner of SGT's assurance that no PMs would or have been accessed under his watch.

newalaana you are such an intrigal part of SGT that for you to have to choose your words is outrageous. If you had any self respect you'de do what tor-toise did and tell Surfcast you won't take anymore and permenantly deprive us of your profound contribution!

catawampuscat

June 10th, 2014, 11:06

Medevac logical choice and the scuttlebutt last night in Pattaya .
Timing was sad as Neal's Medicaid started on death day and social security disability in the works.

This topic/thread closed on gaybuttonthai and gaythailand forums

Manforallseasons

June 10th, 2014, 13:58

After viewing the last post has this thread run it's course and become rather boring?

Surfcrest

June 10th, 2014, 15:37

I have no intention of closing it, locking it or moving it anywhere. It will run it's course, slowly drift down to Page 2 and beyond, to be forgotten like the topic at hand.
From a Board perspective, I think the worst outcome of the Neal years were that we lost a lot of good members. Some of you have made it back and we know you by the names we knew you as before. Others may have returned under new usernames, some are still drifting back right up to today. I think of the ones that haven't come back though, especially the ones that made me smile like Koh Samui Luv, Lunchtime O'Booze, Sen Yai, Hmmm the continuing absence of Sooty and so many others.

Surfcrest

Manforallseasons

June 10th, 2014, 19:07

Surfcast perhaps those that have gone stopped reading the board, maybe an email to their email account might be helpful. Something like Neal's dead it's safe to go back in the water.

lego

June 10th, 2014, 19:17

Aside from Neals discomfort with the flight.
Wondering how that would be handled, considering how full
the flight might have been, and exactly when it was discovered.
By sheer coincidence (I would think!), a movie named "7500" was just released in Thailand. Among other things, that's what they have to deal with, a sudden death of a passenger aboard.

thailuv

June 15th, 2014, 00:40

Wow, Neil gone. I had my fair share of skirmishes with Neil especially during the course of the photo competition but nothing so serious as to form an overwhelmingly negative opinion of someone I have never met in person. Great to see some old hands still around. I've been studying so havent been around for a while and was never an avid poster anyway. Just sayin RIP Neal

christianpfc

June 15th, 2014, 10:28

Welcome back, fountainhall, glad to see you back on the forum, I hope you will stay with us and maybe even join gaythailand again.

The idea of checking if Neal really donated the money to charity never occurred to me, I simply cannot imagine that someone sinks so low (but after the contest, the bitchboard has shown that you can get even lower).

June 15th, 2014, 14:48

The idea of checking if Neal really donated the money to charity never occurred to me, I simply cannot imagine that someone sinks so low (but after the contest, the bitchboard has shown that you can get even lower).Good heavens Chris, it's clear you've never encountered The Compleat Arsehole (and I hold myself out as a practitioner). You tell people what they want to hear - the Thais, surely you realise, are absolute masters of this, they have elevated it into an art form? - and then do whatever it is you were going to do anyway. It's my standard response to bureaucrats, who have been conditioned to getting pieces of paper. Given them what they want and they can file it away. Whether it's a set of factual statements or some plausible mock-up is entirely up to you. I recommend wholeheartedly Stephen Fry's magnificent television comedy series Absolute Power (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Absolute_Power_(comedy)) or, indeed Armando Iannucci's The Thick of It (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Thick_of_It) for those who wish to learn, or just marvel at, what can be achieved if you are sufficiently cynical.

fountainhall

June 17th, 2014, 12:39

Thanks Christian. I opened a bit of a hornet's nest with my comments about the competition donations. My correspondence with the late owner was entirely by PM - not in a thread as some made up. I just could never understand why he simply never posted the receipt as it would have nicely closed off the competition threads for all participants. However, we finally know the charity got the money and that is the important thing. I thought the competition idea was excellent, by the way, and many of the submitted photos were great. I hope more will be run here in future.

christianpfc

June 17th, 2014, 19:55

Good heavens Chris, it's clear you've never encountered The Compleat Arsehole (and I hold myself out as a practitioner).
I have met Neal (I assume you're speaking about him) twice in front of his bar and saw him a few times around. From personal interaction, I can't say anything bad about him (except that he could have offered me one of the pieces of cakes he devoured while we were chatting).

Now after reading other's comments on this thread, I am glad there was no time get get to know each other better (than he would have known more about me and could have used it against me or posted it elsewhere).

Marsilius

June 18th, 2014, 04:49

From personal interaction, I can't say anything bad about him (except that he could have offered me one of the pieces of cakes he devoured while we were chatting).

Neal invited me to meet him outside his bar to discuss a possible business deal - which, knowing what I now understand from other posters on this board, I'm pleased eventually never came to anything. On a very hot evening and while he consumed several drinks, he never offered me one even though I was there to see him at his request.

Dave

June 20th, 2014, 19:54

From allegedly misappropriating donation funds for orphans, Neal's memory is now being dragged further down the drain for not sharing his cakes and offering cold drinks to someone at a bar (where you can easily order a drink for yourself). What next; Neal was taking up too much space and breathing more than his fair share of fresh air? I'm sure fountainhall will think of something.

PS Thank you Surfcrest for clearing up the matter about the donation funds and posting the letter from the orphanage that did Neal did in fact pass on the donations. SC did in one day what fountainhall claimed he couldn't do in two years other than make a scurrilous accusation after Neal's death.

Oliver

June 20th, 2014, 20:49

It's called a band-wagon.
Had Neal been nominated as Pattayan of the Year (or decade), the forum would have been full of intimate memories of his good works.
"The evil that men do lives after them,
The good is oft interr'd with their bones."

(Shakespeare's Julius Caesar)

Nirish guy

June 20th, 2014, 21:12

Oh trust me Oliver I REALLY dont think that in Neals particular case it would have been !

Scott

June 20th, 2014, 22:11

"The evil that men do lives after them,
The good is oft interr'd with their bones."

(Shakespeare's Julius Caesar)

I don't believe anyone is totally good or totally bad. Neal had his detractors and he had his admirers and many people in between who just don't care either way but see no point in rehashing his alleged misdeeds again or again. I posted this on the Neal 'in memoriam' thread on Gaybutton before it was deleted:

"I knew Neal reasonably well and found him kind and generous. He was easy to get along with but then again I didn't give him any cause for aggravation. One day my Thai partner approached him for a donation for a temple that was being built in his village. Neal promptly took out 10,000THB in cash and promised my partner another 10,000THB later, which he kept. My partner offered to get him a receipt but he waved his hand and insisted that the donation be made anonymous. The people and monks in his his village were very grateful to Neal and my partner said Neal had a good reputation among Thai people and those who worked for him. When they heard he had died, the monks in the temple he helped build held special prayers for him."

Marsilius

June 20th, 2014, 23:55

"The evil that men do lives after them,
The good is oft interr'd with their bones."

(Shakespeare's Julius Caesar)

Shakespeare - and possibly even Neal - will be turning in his grave. Where has "interr'd" come from? It needs to be spelled "interred" with that second "e" - so that it can be pronounced as a three-syllable word ("in-ter-red") in order to scan properly as an iambic pentameter.

Surfcrest

June 21st, 2014, 00:20

I knew Neal reasonably well and found him kind and generous. He was easy to get along with but then again I didn't give him any cause for aggravation. One day my Thai partner approached him for a donation for a temple that was being built in his village. Neal promptly took out 10,000THB in cash and promised my partner another 10,000THB later, which he kept. My partner offered to get him a receipt but he waved his hand and insisted that the donation be made anonymous. The people and monks in his his village were very grateful to Neal and my partner said Neal had a good reputation among Thai people and those who worked for him. When they heard he had died, the monks in the temple he helped build held special prayers for him."
I feel better knowing a small amount of the money he stole from me went to a very good cause. :)

Surfcrest

joe552

June 21st, 2014, 04:27

Jeez, I'd love to get this much attention after my death, but I doubt it. The guy is gone - let it go, ffs

June 21st, 2014, 06:49

I don't believe anyone is totally good or totally bad.Pol Pot's supporters thank you for that kind thought.

bucknaway

June 21st, 2014, 07:17

scottish-guy

June 21st, 2014, 10:59

...Neal's memory is now being dragged further down the drain

Is this meant to be a reference to the so called " reputation" he thought he had - and to "protect" which he threatened to sue or have physically harmed, everybody and anybody who was in any way critical of him?

The reality is that now he has finally fucked off to the great pig-trough in the sky, the narcissistic and entirely fictional "reputation" he constructed, has rapidly collapsed like a house of cards - and the truth is emerging. I've said it before - the only people who bought into the "Neal was a nice guy" fantasy were those in his pocket and those who are either very poor judges of character or (in one case) was working hand-in-glove with him and was simply "taken-in" by lies and deceit.

....What next; Neal was taking up too much space and breathing more than his fair share of fresh air?

It seems at least you've hit the nail on the head with that comment.

To those who say "let it lie" I would say only this - you can let it lie if you want, and I do not intend to drag more out (and believe me, I could) - but on the other hand I'm not going to stop responding to pathetic apologists. Once they stop trying to polish a turd, I'll stop pointing out that it stinks.

Smiles

June 21st, 2014, 12:56

" ... To those who say "let it lie" I would say only this - you can let it lie if you want, and I do not intend to drag more out (and believe me, I could) - but on the other hand I'm not going to stop responding to pathetic apologists. Once they stop trying to polish a turd, I'll stop pointing out that it stinks ... "
A summation, nicely put.

Oliver

June 21st, 2014, 14:59

Thanks for that example of "reductio ad hitlorum", Bucknaway. It approaches (but fails to emulate) your posting a few years ago in which you said of the racist war-criminal and serial liar, George W. Bush, that you "just love that guy!" Was it when Falluja was under a cloud of white phosphorous? I can't remember.

Who'd have thought that Neal would ever find himself in the company of two such luminaries (sic)? My memory of him is more comic- walking along 2nd Road in his enormous shorts and red braces to The Flying Vegetable Restaurant (as it once was) with three or four cute Thai guys, of relatively short stature, trotting along behind him. Just like a mother duck taking her ducklings for a swim.

I wish I'd spoken to him more often; he must have been a remarkable personality to inspire this thread- as well as being Pattaya's very own Hitler. Remarkable.

travelerjim

June 21st, 2014, 16:13

RIP Neal.....
Gone but not forgotten...

tj

scottish-guy

June 21st, 2014, 21:17

.......I wish I'd spoken to him more often.....

So do I - it might have improved your judgement.

thaiforum555

June 22nd, 2014, 01:00

I am new here and never known this Neal person or any people here.
I have to say this whole posts, 8 pages, from everybody is embarrassing to any community.
Ihave just been here for a few weeks with a few posts, most of you should be ashamed of yourselves, how you talk about the dead.
Good or Bad, give information and leave it at that. Friends will come to the funeral and others will not.

Sawatdee SAME ON YOU

Smiles

June 22nd, 2014, 05:34

" ... Sawatdee SAME ON YOU ... "
A good idea: when 'shaming' others, it's always best to spell the quintessential word correctly. Otherwise, you might be laughed at.

netrix

June 22nd, 2014, 20:14

Respecting someone simply because they are dead is a pretty ludicrous sentiment.
I'm probably one of the most easy-going guys on this board, but you can add me to the list of people Neal
threatened to have killed while screaming profanities at me at the top of his lungs in front of his bar one night.
He was disgusting on many levels - had nothing good or kind to say about anyone, ever, except as a backhanded
compliment. He prided himself on being two-faced. He relished in his deceit. He was like the villain in a bad
made-for-TV movie, the kind of evil man always surrounded by an entourage either afraid of him or jealous.

If you want to shame someone, shame the one worthy of it. Neal was a vile, shallow, gluttonous, arrogant,
lying hypocrite. He was possibly the most mean-spirited hateful person I've ever known. Nice only when it
served him to be. And that's the nicest things I have to say about him.