Language Misunderstandings with Thai Men

[Mancs]

At least I learn the odd new word of Thai from the times I can't communicate. I was once in Patong Beach and a young man offered me an hour's 'massage' for 900 baht. He was about 20. It was my first trip to Thailand and I was shocked how wrong I was in guessing men's ages. In the middle of our time together, I started to get anxious he might be under 18 and asked if I could see his ID card. To which he asks what I mean when I say: "Ai Dee Hah?" I know know (think) that 'ai dee hah' means something like: "Mr (ai is implying insulting title for male) good five."

Or, even worse, he could have thought I meant: "ai hee-ah". To quote from a Thai language site: "ai hee-ah - Just do not even think about using this one. 'Son of a bitch' or 'bitch' is a rough translation of this but does not begin to convey the strength of the insult. The word hee-ah is a monitor lizard but as in insult it suggests lowly, slimey and all kinds of bad things." Whatever it meant to him I certainly never got to see his ID card!

Much later with another man in Bangkok he was playfully on top of me asking me to buy him an ipad. I tell him I will give him some money but I don't buy ipads. To which he replies: "Dai. Dai". Naturally I hear this as: "Die. Die" and wonder if he is threatening me. Later I learn the word "Dai" and realise he is telling me I Can buy him an ipad. "Can. Can" is much better than; "Die. Die".

What are your experiences of failing to communicate with Thai men?

[joe552]

The most common misunderstanding I come across is that the boys expect me to pay them, rather than the other way round. Must be a cultural thing, but it leads to some fun times indeed. :alc:

I done bother trying to speak thai they will never understand me so its English take it or leave it. "I fuck you" says everything I need to communicate.

[christianpfc]

I know know (think) that 'ai dee hah' means something like...

I now know...

This subject is of little value unless accompagnied by the Thai words in Thai script.

Some other words that sound similar in English and Thai, but have different meanings:

English "fuck" sounds like Thai р╕Яр╕▒р╕Б which means "squash ; gourd (family of vegetables) or [to] hatch ; brood" (I came across both meanings: in Baan Sukhawadee they have a miniature of a chicken hatching building "fuck building", and I had gourd in a meal, and my Thai friend proudly announced that I am eating "fuck", being aware of the different meaning in Thai and English)

English "yet" sounds like Thai р╣Ар╕вр╣Зр╕Ф which means "Sexual intercourse" (impolite).

(Translations from http://www.thai2english.com)

[lukylok]

I done bother trying to speak thai they will never understand me so its English take it or leave it. "I fuck you" says everything I need to communicate.
Is that old age or anglo-saxon inability to learn another language ? :happy7:
Reading your post english isn't your forte either

[kjun12]

I done bother trying to speak thai they will never understand me so its English take it or leave it. "I fuck you" says everything I need to communicate.
You are so "low so".

I done bother trying to speak thai they will never understand me so its English take it or leave it. "I fuck you" says everything I need to communicate.You are so "low so".And you my friend are a stalker.

[a447]

Deleted A447 do you have to argue with everyone? Neal
First paragraph deleted



anglo-saxon inability to learn another language

More like just a lazy attitude and the belief that everyone should speak English. I am amazed that more English people don't speak French, given their history and proximity to France. Then again, I've met heaps of English people who haven't even been across the Channel to France. "They eat garlic over there!"
Mind you, the French don't speak English either. In my experience, it's not that they can't; it's that they don't want to.

You'd be hard-pressed to find a foreign language speaking Anglo-saxon in Australia. "Everyone speaks English overseas, so why bother?"
And when you do speak another language on the train or sitting in a coffee shop, you get some real strange looks, especially when it's me talking to an Asian (Japanese).

My Aussie friends think I'm mad trying to learn Thai (sometimes, I think they might be right!). But my foreign friends think it's just par for the course.

I always enjoy chatting to the guys back in the room, both before and after the deed. I've met a number of guys, especially over the past year for some reason, who also love to chat and we learn a lot from each other. And their English is really good, so they are not your typical escapee from the farm.

The only real "misunderstandings" I've had with Thai guys is when they say they will bottom for me, but back in the room they suddenly become top only!

[kjun12]

And you my friend are a stalker.
And, I thought I was just replying to an ignorant posting by you. Please, also, do not insult me by referring to me as your friend.

[SmoothLegs]

My guess is the title could be ........ with Thais (in general)

Anyway, I learned most of my Thai "speaking" capability from my many holidays in the past. I used to carry a small notebook (pen and paper, not the nowadays computer thingy) and wrote down certain words and phrases, in English and phonetic English. Of course this was only the basics needed for holiday fun.

Now, I live here I got lazy and most Thais prefer to speak English and learn from you anyway.

But as a good expat, I went to Thai school. (80% was because I needed the ED-Visa that comes with it and 20% wanted to learn some more Thai.

Believe me, school is a gigantic waste of your time. Yes, you learn more Thai, but in the world, me and most of you are (low so Thais, Isaan), the Thais will not understand you anyway, because you learn the "high so" Thai in school. So, unless you plan to have chats with the prime-minister or similar, don't bother. You will not get to have conversations with the Thai people we associate with.

To avoid remarks coming which I already feel, my teacher always said (unless she was lying, well she is Thai) that my Thai was excellent pronounced while in school and she did not understand why I would quite the lessons.

[christianpfc]

Believe me, school is a gigantic waste of your time. Yes, you learn more Thai, but in the world, me and most of you are (low so Thais, Isaan), the Thais will not understand you anyway, because you learn the "high so" Thai in school. So, unless you plan to have chats with the prime-minister or similar, don't bother. You will not get to have conversations with the Thai people we associate with.

Disagree. I went to a language school and can now read and write Thai and make myself understood in simple situations. I can't judge the the quality of my spoken Thai, have problems understanding what others say, but we can have a conversation about simple subjects.

[egel]

I can't judge the the quality of my spoken Thai, have problems understanding what others say, but we can have a conversation about simple subjects.

Exactly. Go to a school and learn Thai in Pattaya and you will have problems.

Thailand is a huge country and there must be numerous dialects.

The boy you are talking to could come from Chang Mai in the North or (unlikely I know) Phuket thousands of miles further south.

Its not surprising that the Thai you learn in Pattaya (with its complete mixture of inhabitants) sometimes is not, or cannot, be understood.

[Impulse]

It's the damn R letters. I know I'm pronouncing the Thai correctly, but the Thai men I hang around with rarely use the R. I'll say "Dai Prot", and my friend will say it's Dai Pot, no R.

[newalaan2]

What are your experiences of failing to communicate with Thai men?
Nowadays in general I dont have that many misunderstandings, I find a mix of basic Thai and clear english does ok when I'm in farang orientated places like Silom/Suriwong, Phuket, Pattaya and the likes....but in the rest of Thailand esp Issan the basic Thai needs to be very clear, if it's not the blank looks are far more frequent than in Pattaya. I try to speak and pronounce as close as possible to the way I've heard bf talk, or I get him to repeat something a few times until he reckons i've 'got it'.

But some things can still prove frustrating....I dont know why but the most common misunderstanding I come across is ordering Vodka. I have lost count of the number of times I have asked for Vodka-coke and there is a puzzled look....so I will try Vodka and cola...the waiter then gets a colleague....."i'm sorry what u want?" Vodka and coke..."Oh!!....Vod-KAAAA!!" So I have asked 1st guy for Vodka..2nd guy for vodka...then 2nd guy turns to 1st and says.."he wants vod-KA" 1st then says "oh vod-KA!!"...they all sound exactly the same to me apart from the exaggerated KA at the end. I just think..how many drinks could that get confused with? The other common one is when ordering a breakfast asking if they have 'brown toast' [as in wholemeal], invariably as has happened in Palmers Bar, white toast arrives, you say you asked for brown toast...they say "yes it brown" (as in the colour brown made by the toasting of white bread). You can only smile at that can't you! Again no big deal.

After my first couple trips to Thailand and I knew I would be returning regularly, for the first 2 years I made a real effort to learn some Thai, from books, listening etc....the sole purpose of this was not to converse or anything like that, it was merely to confirm that what I said in English was not misunderstood if it seemed in doubt. So I ask 'how much?'....the guy says "hundredbaht-neung-loy"...i would confirm "Neung L(R)oy?". In noisy clubs and bars i find confirming in Thai very helpful. I am far more lazy the last few years and dont look up books, so I only pickup new words by just listening, especially to very common phrases I am likely to use alot, mostly from the bf. I would say it is definitely worth the effort to know a few phrases and words, it certainly does make for an easier time of things.

Never had any misunderstandings in bars when offing boys about what is to be done back in the room and how much....simply because I never discuss it in advance. I just chat with a guy to see if there is chemistry, the chat may or may not include references to top, king, queen, etc.. but usually I can be fairly sure if a boy is 'likely' to bottom, but its never an issue back in the room. I've never been "i MUST have this/that" kinda guy. I am a top so no bottoming for me is the only definite...everything else is doable...and i'm never all that bothered which. Obviously there are gay boys who specifically want to be fucked...that's fine misunderstanings here very 'unlikely', but generally I just 'go with the flow'.........as long as i'm having a good time, i'm satisfied. I found mostly from reading the gay forums just how 'uptight' some get if the boy doesn't deliver specifically what was demanded and paid for!' that for me is just too much potential stress to carry around with me and recipe for a letdown. Anyway I always used to find any boys who stated they were this or that would also just go with the flow after a few drinks in a relaxed situation. So language misunderstanings never much of an issue in those circumstances for me.

[Impulse]

.........as long as i'm having a good time, i'm satisfied. I found mostly from reading the gay forums just how 'uptight' some get if the boy doesn't deliver specifically what was demanded and paid for!' that for me is just too much potential stress to carry around with me and recipe for a letdown. Anyway I always used to find any boys who stated they were this or that would also just go with the flow after a few drinks in a relaxed situation. So language misunderstanings never much of an issue in those circumstances for me.

That's a great attitude! I find the more I try to plan the session, the worse the outcome. Just go with the flow.

[SmoothLegs]

Believe me, school is a gigantic waste of your time. Yes, you learn more Thai, but in the world, me and most of you are (low so Thais, Isaan), the Thais will not understand you anyway, because you learn the "high so" Thai in school. So, unless you plan to have chats with the prime-minister or similar, don't bother. You will not get to have conversations with the Thai people we associate with.

Disagree. I went to a language school and can now read and write Thai and make myself understood in simple situations. I can't judge the the quality of my spoken Thai, have problems understanding what others say, but we can have a conversation about simple subjects.

I suppose that is accurate, but then you stay in Bangkok, where most people speak the more official school Thai and probably also learn in school the official Thai language.

Any young Thai (6-12) not in Bangkok, goes mostly to the standard Thai cheap (3500 baht per year) schools (if they go at all) and will learn the local Thai from there locally born and educated teachers. Even after 12yo if they are lucky to go to high school it is still local with locally born and raised/"educated" teachers. Where as most do not even finish high school.

So even when they are older and leave their small town city, for whatever reason, and we, as farangs, meet them, they can not speak the official Thai language they teach us (farangs) in Thai Language Schools.

Yes, here in Pattaya, I did have simple conversations with Thais, in Thai, but they where of the so called Higher Class, probably on a weekend coming from Bangkok.

The boys, we meet in the bars (Pattaya), just can not speak or understand the official Thai language we learn.

[SmoothLegs]

It is about the Thai laguage they teach US at Thai Language Schools. That is the official Thai language.
If all Thais would also learn the official Thai Language, in speech, at school, we all could understand them, not matter where they come from. But since Thais, as all countries, have everywhere their own dialect and just don't use the official Thai Language they should learn at school, we do not understand then and they do not understand us, which of course also happens between Thais themselves.

[SmoothLegs]

I have suggested this to some Thai/English teachers and also some good English speaking girls/women:

Why not open a "school" (yes, it will not be officially sanctioned by the Thai government, but who cares), where we can ONLY learn the LOW spoken Thai, the Thai we get everyday. No reading or writing, just basic speaking. Anybody (farang) can do this learning from what ever country (ok, need some basic English skills if the teacher only knows English), since you just, yourself write down the phonetics for how it sounds to you.

The school should starts with all basic, most used words.
Then small sentences and some grammar, then small conversations and so on.

No diploma or anything, just basic (low) Thai speaking skills, to have a nice chat in a bar.

It will be fun, cheaper then a standard school and no strings attached.

[Jellybean]

rocket wrote:
тАЬIt's the damn R letters. I know I'm pronouncing the Thai correctly, but the Thai men I hang around with rarely use the R. I'll say "Dai Prot", and my friend will say it's Dai Pot, no R.тАЭ

rocket, sorry I have to ask, because I canтАЩt find any reference to the words тАЬdai protтАЭ or тАЬprotтАЭ in my Thai dictionary or in my notebooks. IтАЩve never heard the word before and the Thai concierge staff at my condo didnтАЩt know the meaning of the word either. So can you let me know what it means in English? Thanks.

[a447]

I wonder if the "not understanding what the locals say" syndrome is not in some way akin to what happens in Japanese.

It has nothing to do with hi-so or lo-so; it's just that there are 2 types of Japanese spoken. One when being polite or talking to strangers, and another when talking amongst friends.
A common complaint I often heard from foreigners in Japan seems to mimic the problems mentioned in this thread.

Are they just talking a kind of "insiders" Thai, where the grammar remains the same but slang and abbreviations abound?

In the case of Japanese, verb endings are totally different and incomprehensible to those who have only learnt the polite language.

An example would be: Are you hungry? in polite Japanese is "Onaka ga sukimashita ka" whereas among friends, we'd say "hara hetta?"

If that is the case, then the solution would be to just learn "street" Thai and not bother about the other.

Any native Thai guys out there who can clarify the situation??

[christianpfc]

I had chats with boys who are not from Bangkok, and I could make myself understood in Thai. I assume language in television is central Thai and not local dialects, so everyone should be able to understand central Thai from watching TV. That just leaves the different levels of Thai. I prefer to err on the side of speaking hi-so Thai (which will be understood) rather than lo-so Thai.

[timmberty]

i find this thread rather strange, i live in london and often travel all over the u.k. i travel to newcastle every now and then, and i would imagine i can understand about 70% of what they are saying, tho they understand most of what i say.
its not a visitor to a country thing, it happens to people who live there too, im sure those in issan wouldnt be able to understand much of what the phuket mob say.
every country has dialects many are hard to understand by people who speak the same language.
we in london will say ... im going .. in newcastle they say the same thing but it looks like this.... im gannin ..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AhHLmhchLrU
try that !!!
and thats just one dialect.

[Flossie]

I agree with Christian. People from Isan speak Lao, same as in Laos. People in Laos watch Thai TV and have no problem understanding the central Thai. When in Lao I speak to people in central Thai and they understand. I don't always understand their replies (just like in Thailand 5555). Re the earlier post about missing r's, this may be Lao again - there r's disappear so eg pratet becomes patet, braisanee baisanee etc. I don't know what "drot" means either and can't be troubled to try to look it up given the numerous possible spellings in Thai.

The third post in this thread has been confirmed by almost every post that has come afterwards.

[Flossie]

If you know some Thai and pronounce it correctly people will understand. If they donтАЩt itтАЩs because youтАЩre mispronouncing. To get it right you need to learn how to read and write in Thai; the spelling will tell you the tone, whether a vowel is long or short, and which vowel it is since if you rely on romanisations none of this is clear. Eg the province р╕Хр╕▓р╕Б and the nick-name р╕Хр╕▒р╣Кр╕Б are both romanised as тАЬtakтАЭ but are pronounced quite differently тАУ the province a bit like тАЬdarkтАЭ with a low tone, and the nick-name like тАЬduckтАЭ with a high tone. Languages arenтАЩt difficult; theyтАЩre all spoken fluently by 3-year olds.

[cdnmatt]

When in Lao I speak to people in central Thai and they understand.

Really? Where in Laos do you go? When in Vientiane, I find they can't understand Thai at all. Even when I just ask for simple things like an ashtray, or two beers and three glasses, they won't understand me at all. However, numbers are the same though. Both Laos and Thai use the same language for numbers (neung, song, sam, see, etc.).

I did find Laos people far more surprised / happy that I could speak a few phrases of Laos though, versus Thais caring that I could speak Thai. From living in Issan for so long I picked up a few Laos phrases, although not many. Definitely put some smiles on people's faces in Laos.

[Flossie]

I've only been briefly to Vientiane, but with Thai friends who did all the talking. There didn't seem to be any problems. I've spent longer in Luang Prabang (or Pabang if you prefer) and didn't have any problem conversing with eg people running boat trips on the Mekhong, tuktuk drivers. Or even on one occasion with some small boys who offered some first aid after I'd fallen down the steps in a cave. I'm surprised you had problems if you know Isan Thai which is what as far as I know they speak in Lao. A mystery.

[cdnmatt]

I've only been briefly to Vientiane, but with Thai friends who did all the talking.

Ohhh, maybe that's why. Were your Thai friends by chance from Issan? If so, that's why. They knew to speak Laos.


I'm surprised you had problems if you know Isan Thai which is what as far as I know they speak in Lao.

No, I don't really know Issan Thai (Laos) at all. I know a few phrases, but that's it. For example, instead of "chai mai" it's "meen boi", or instead of "mai bpen rai" it's "bop en yang", or instead of "yuu nai" it's "yuu sai", etc. A few things like that, but I definitely don't know how to speak Issan / Laos.

I do know central Thai quite well though, and people up in Laos couldn't understand me at all (except numbers / amounts). By no means am I fluent in Thai, but I can get around just fine speaking Thai only in Thailand, but nobody in Laos seemed to understand me. Not sure. Making another trip there in a few weeks, so I'll give it another test run again, and see what happens. :-)

I don't really know yet, because in Laos I did hear things like, "kao puut pasa Thai" (he speaks Thai), and a few other phrases. So there's definitely similarities between the languages, but I know I got the deer-in-the-headlights stare with just really simple phrases like asking for an ashtray. In Thailand, I never have that issue, so I doubt it's my pronunciation. Not sure, haven't spent enough time yet in Laos to figure it out.

[Flossie]

My Thai friends were from the north. They speak central Thai, and Thai Yai, but not Lao. Someone told me once that there are similarities between Thai Yai and Lao but I've no idea whether that's true. I don't speak Thai Yai. I speak standard Thai reasonably well though I often have difficulty understanding other people, or eg TV soap operas . Maybe I should get a "Teach yourself Lao" book to get a better idea of the differences. Of course it's possible that some of those I spoke to, being in the tourist industry, spoke Thai. But then for many years Lao had no TV service and the locals apparently had no problem following the soaps.

[anonone]

There are youtube clips that run through some Lao phrases. I really surprised BF once when I asked him in Lao "hed yang yuu" (what are you doing) one day.
I haven't gone too far in learning a lot of them though...I have a hard enough time trying to keep Thai phrases in my head.

[Flossie]

The YouTube Lao lessons are great fun and well worth a look. Thank you Anonone.

[christianpfc]

Yesterday (no, it was after midnight, this morning) I had some basic conversation with a boy from Chiang Rai province, and didn't have more problems understanding him than with boys from my neighborhood.