Farangs and condoms

[martin911]

The other morning one guy who stays in my place showed me another Gr message he had just received
Again like the message i spoke about in the other GR Topic(but wasnt as crude) it was along the lines of meeting up ,going back to room ,having sex with another Thai boy etc etc
The farang then said at the end of the message would it be ok for no comdoms to be used (profile slightly edited ) -- rawrawtxp

So that started a conversation between us on condom use --the guy(worked in bars 2 odd years before i met him ) i was talking to i have known for 1.5 years and he has spent a big part of that time living under my roof , he is a friend only -- there is abs nothing sexual between us now (was briefly first few weeks when he played with me and BF) so he had abs no angle nor reason to lie about what he said to me !!

I asked him did many farang ask him not to use comdoms ???

I wss kinda shocked --

He said that "not half but near half " farang do !!!!!!!!!!!!!!! -
He says he wont go with farang that do ask --i hope (for his sake ) that he dosent --
I am inclined to believe him on that because i rem on of the few times we had sex before that at one time during our "special time " he said he had felt condom break,and he made me stop and pull out and check -- so back then he being careful and as his life got a little easier since moving in (dosent have to sell his ass to pay room rent etc ) i guess he is able to be able to make that decision (turn farang down )
But other boys in Pattaya may not if the farang is insistent and if they need the money !!

Now i guess that anybody reading this is farang and that if they are in the group that the thai boy talked about then they are not going to admit to it here so il ask this --has any else had this discussion with their thai friends/BFs etc and what were the replies ???

Well I can't answer your question about the number of farang and I don't want to deviate the topic in any way but just to say I'm still shocked even this trip the amount of Thai guys that are either not concerned whether you use a condom or not or pay lip service to but don't really care if you say no or worse actually two thai guys have asked me not use at all with one almost pleading.

When in the middle of sex and just before that point of no return I've unintentionally got into a habit of "just about" going ahead with no condom and more times than not ive been asked the question " no condom" but unfortunately it was almost as a statement of fact rather than an instruction to stop and put on one ( which I do) and I would say tgAt has been the case in at least 50% of the guys I've been with :-(

With one guy the other day the condom broke mid session right at tte worst possible moment so to speak and we stopped ( but to late ) and the guy was quite rightly concerned but when I reassured him that I was fully aware of my recent negative results etc and asked him the same question to ease my own mind he couldn't even tell me the last time he'd had a test :-(

So, I've no doubt you're right that a certain amount ( lots) of pressure comes from farang I have to say I think a fair portion of responsibilty also still comes from Thais still just not giving a shit, either from a lack of education reasons of the fear of losing some tip :-(

But back to your question - what's others take on the farang issue ?

[Neal]

I can only tell you the seriousness of it all. I know several people who live in and visit Thailand who are HIV. I also know some boys who work or worked in various bars who are HIV. For me, well it is condom is a must and even usually play where there is no sex that would transmit HIV as to become HIV here in Thailand is more of a death sentence to me than most people. I am on dialysis and there are no dedicated machines for HIV patients ANYWHERE in Thailand. So once I were to become HIV positive, I would have to stop dialysis immediately and wait a few weeks for the inevitable.

[bruce_nyc]

( just replying to subscribe )

I'm curious about this too. Has anyone else asked any Thai bar boys this question?

( oh, I see your message slipped in ahead of mine, DaBoss. )

DaBoss, have you ever asked your boys how many falong ask them not to use a condom?

PS - A friend of mine here has his own dialysis machine in his apartment. It's some sort of a new portable device. He actually gets it free somehow, because he is training to teach others how to use it. But he does the whole thing himself... all alone... in his apartment. I could put him in touch with you if you're curious/interested in learning more about it.

PPS - Here in the big cities in the US, at least, there is a real barebacking movement. You'll encounter many guys who ask you to do it bare. Some will beg and plead or even insist on it. It has always baffled me.... as to what is going through their heads.

[Neal]

No, I hope to God that they are smarter then that. I do know the boys I go with that I do get into a slightly risky scene, do automatically pull out a condom and are safe although I am concerned that some if pushed would not be. I would rather not know as it would depress me how many boys may be willing and how many Falang and Thai customers would try to push the boys to not wear condoms. If I gave you a gun and asked you to play Russian Roulette, would you? Why would you ask or demand the boys to play?

[bruce_nyc]

If I gave you a gun and asked you to play Russian Roulette, would you? Why would you ask or demand the boys to play?

VERY well said.

And remember this, guys. The harm isn't even so much that YOU are positive.... maybe you know you are negative....

The harm is in conditioning them to give in... and agree.... to bottom bareback. By "training them", in a sense, that it's ok to do that.... It's only a matter of time. They WILL contract hiv. And hiv in Thailand is not the same as having hiv back home. Treatment is too expensive for most of them to keep up with.... so, the net result very well may be "a death sentence".

No one wants that result. Do you want to be responsible for that ultimately happening to this young guy... just for a little selfish pleasure?

Am I right?

[Neal]

Two things. Not sometimes it is a death sentence because the medicine is too expensive but almost always it is a death sentence because usually they will not want to be seen going to Dr Philpe or another place to get these meds. They don't want their friends to know or see so most of the time they go home to family in the country, in shame and die. What? Does the truth hurt?

And no, I don't expect the reality of this to change any of the Thai or Falang who insist on barebacking to change their ways as many are old enough that if they contract it, well it is near the end of their life anyway so who cares, some have the feeling that they have it so why not take as many with him as possible, or after all they can go back to their country and get free medicine whareas the boy cannot.

This is a very very sad subject for me.

Slightly off topic - but related to the discussion - you will now find in chatrooms young HIV- people deliberately looking for HIV+ sex partners for unprotected sex, so that they can become infected.

Take a look on the likes of Gaydar and you will regularly see this - names like "Wannabepoz" or "Virusboy"and such.
At first I though it was some kind of sick fantasy but apparently not, at least some of them are perfectly serious!

Some people are just plain mental - and I put farangs going bare with Thai sex workers (male or female) in that category.
There is a kind of assumption that the transmission is all one way but I seriously doubt it.

[bruce_nyc]

There is a kind of assumption that the transmission is all one way but I seriously doubt it.

You have hit on another very interesting topic. Maybe one for another thread. But I think this is very often assumed. And I often wonder how true it is.

[christianpfc]

This is quite discomforting. Putting on a comdom is like putting on the safety belt (I know there are people who drive motorcycle without helmet or car without safety belt, but for me it is automatic, without thinking) or looking left and right before crossing a street - I don't question it. This question (whether to use a condom or not) never came up in any of my encounters in Thailand. This is one of the few subjects that I take so serious that I don't joke about (as to see how my Thai friend reacts).

There is a development in porn that I consider dangerous: no condom porn. They even have sign like a traffic sign with a crossed out condom. This is contraproductive in the fight against HIV and would forbid all porn without condom. If people watch porn without condom, they think it's ok not to use condoms.


When in the middle of sex and just before that point of no return I've unintentionally got into a habit of "just about" going ahead with no condom and more times than not ive been asked the question " no condom" but unfortunately it was almost as a statement of fact rather than an instruction to stop and put on one ( which I do) and I would say tgAt has been the case in at least 50% of the guys I've been with :-(
I don't quite get that. You start (insertive sex) without condom and put the condom on just before you are about to cum? This is an unsave method of contraception (coitus interruptus), and probably an unsafe way to prevent transferral of HIV and does not prevent transferral of other STIs.

[anonone]

I think NIrish means he is just about to insert, but has not yet. Getting into position, so to say. Where the Thai would think he was about to get fucked, but had not put on a condom yet.

Some time ago, I met up with a guy for a second time. As inticement, he told me since I had been with him before, he would let me fuck him without a condom. Hard to understand the logic going on there.

As the saying goes, let the buyer beware...

. :ky:


Loving these new little character things....

[CoffeeBreak]

May I also remind everyone as inconvenient that it may seem condoms ought to be used not only for anal sex but for oral sex too. Major STD's are caused by failure to do so. No excuses.

[Oliver]

That is correct. One Thai guy I know who is hiv+ swears that his infection is the result of oral sex.

May I also remind everyone as inconvenient that it may seem condoms ought to be used not only for anal sex but for oral sex too. Major STD's are caused by failure to do so. No excuses.

Well there may be no excuses but I simply refuse to comply in the case of oral sex - whether giving or receiving it - so I guess I'm one of those irresponsible people who ought to locked up.

The farang below , pictured sitting in his Pattaya hotel loom waiting for his GR boy to arrive, obviously has the right idea.

[attachment=0:1rbiclki]Iwaitforboy.jpg[/attachment:1rbiclki]

[joe552]

scottish-guy, I hope you had permission from NIrish Guy before you posted his photo on the board? :dontknow:

He said it was ok providing I photoshopped it to make him look slimmer - I was happy to oblige.

:evil4:

[kittyboy]

May I also remind everyone as inconvenient that it may seem condoms ought to be used not only for anal sex but for oral sex too. Major STD's are caused by failure to do so. No excuses.

My qualifications in this area have been challenged in the past but I really was a volunteer HIV/STD counselor for many years.

The risk of HIV transmission for the recpetive oral partner are close to zero.
The risk of HIV transmission for the performing oral partner are not large but there is a risk.

You can get stds from oral sex, syphilis, gonorrhea, herpes, HPV, clamydia, etc. from either sucking or being sucked but generally the rates of transmission are low and these are all non fatal diseases and generally treatable.

IMHO - when you start telling people that they need to wear condoms for all sexual acts people including oral sex they see the message as being alarmist and start tuning out the safe sex message of wear a condom and then people start becoming complacent towards using condoms for anal sex.

Again it depends on your risk preference but I never use a condom for oral sex - giving or receiving.

[CoffeeBreak]

kittyboy says:


Again it depends on your risk preference but I never use a condom for oral sex - giving or receiving..........You can get stds from oral sex, syphilis, gonorrhea, herpes, HPV, clamydia, etc. from either sucking or being sucked

Which = kitty boy is an idiot.

Made even worse by spouting on about being some form of counsellor. No medical expert(eg a doctor) would seriously advise gay sex(oral/anal) without a condom, but we have some clown coming on this forum trying to say otherwise.
You got to be joking?!
And no wonder disease in our circle is rife.

Kitty boys view is not idiotic in the slightest and is one held by both myself and just about every other gay man I know - including advice given out by HIV prevention helplines etc - while "of course" the official line ( and facts) are that ANY sort of anal or oral sex could cause some form of infection like everything in life you chose what level of risk you are happy with and move on from there.

So to say that kittyboy is an idiot for deciding not to wear a condom during oral sex is a ridiculous and totally over the top thing to say and kittyboy is quite correct that if NO form sex without a condom is the message you would wish the gay world to embrace then all you're going to do is reduce the number of people actually wearing condoms full stop.

So whilst you're no form of sex without a condom may be good in an ideal world it is simply not realistic or necessary as by that logic there should be no one crossing roads - ever - because there's cars on them sometimes, life's permanently about weighing up risk versus advantage and this topic is no different.

So out of interest then - do you always wear a condom when giving or receiving oral ? If you do you will be I think the second guy I know who does and I won't say how I regard the first guy but each to their own I guess.

[kittyboy]

As I said I was an HIV/STD counselor for years.
The counseling and medical staff had many discussions over the years about condom use for oral sex. The medical and counseling staff generally agreed it was a risk preference.
I stand by my statement.
And I certainly am an idiot about certain things but am I an idiot in terms of HIV/STD prevention?
I guess it is for others to determine if my advice is useful.

Ha and re "my" gimp suit pic :-) Jesus I'm tying some ribbing this week ! Lol

And that couldn't be me as I'll have you know my gimp suit is a different tone of black to that - and mines in a Matt finish not gloss as gloss gets to slippery when you've lube on your hands as surely EVERYONE knows joe ! Don't show your ignorance man !! Lol

...No medical expert(eg a doctor) would seriously advise gay sex(oral/anal) without a condom....

Actually - you may be the idiot -

No medical expert (eg) a doctor would differentiate between gay sex (oral/anal) and str8 sex (oral/vaginal/anal) when it comes to condom use - especially when one is routinely consorting with sex-workers of either sex.


:occasion9:

[homeseeker]

http://www.realjock.com/article/1065/

'A lot of people equate unprotected oral sex with "safe" sex, but they're wrong' ; so the idiot is not coffeebreak.

http://www.realjock.com/article/1065/

'A lot of people equate unprotected oral sex with "safe" sex, but they're wrong' ; so the idiot is not coffeebreak.

He is an idiot if he thinks that a "medical expert" advising on condom use with sex-workers would differentiate their advice according to whether it was gay or str8 sex taking place.
Which is what I said - what's the matter with you?

[homeseeker]

scottish guy refuses to use protection for oral sex, despite the overwhelming evidence its' unsafe, yet, he asks what's the matter with others???!!!
what a loser.

[pennyboy]

In that case you can add me to "your" list of losers.
I never use a condom for oral sex as I consider the risk to me as small as other of my life activities.
I always use a condom for anal sex but am saddened when some Thai guys say "up to you" when I reach for the condom.

Well, if I'm a loser because of that, I'm betting the vast majority of guys on SGF are losers too.

However, that was not the point I was making as regards Coffee Break's post - as you well know.


:occasion9:

[Neal]

Maybe I am mistaken but this article does say that:
The chances are much lower and points to recent dental surgery or cuts in the mouth.
It also points that the different studies say different things and are disputed.
I think.


HIV
Is HIV transmission through oral sex an urban myth propagated by men who don't want to admit they had unprotected anal sex? Maybe, maybe not. Although oral sex is a much lower-risk behavior than anal or vaginal intercourse, some studies have concluded it is possible to transmit HIV through oral sex. It's far from common, and several health departments consider it a low to moderate risk activity, but it is possible. In other words, don't panic, but don't assume you could never get HIV from oral sex.

The risk of HIV transmission via oral sex is increased if the person performing the oral sex has cuts or sores in his mouth, if the person receiving oral sex has other sexually transmitted diseases, or if ejaculation takes place in the mouth. This risk is primarily for the person performing the oral sexтАФsaliva alone is extremely unlikely to transmit HIV, and so, unless the person performing oral sex has lots of blood in his mouth from dental surgery or other trauma, oral sex is a low-risk activity for the receptive partner. While many gay men do not use condoms for oral sex (or dental dams for rimming), it's important to note these are effective ways to even further reduce the low chance of transmitting HIV through oral sex.

[fountainhall]

It is not only the bb trend amongst westerners (and therefore presumably some of the visitors to Thailand) that worries me; it is a similar trend that seems to be current amongst younger Thais in many of the mostly Thai-for-Thai saunas that have mushroomed in recent years (there are dozens in Bangkok). One of my Thai friends and his boyfriend have visited quite a few. He tells me that condoms are rarely available and used only infrequently.

The really sad thing is that Thailand used to be at the forefront of the promotion of condom use - an extension of its very successful family planning campaigns promoted by Khun Meechai. Indeed, Thais often call condoms "Meechais". Many will know of his Cabbages and Condoms restaurants. Since the late 1990s, though, government funding for HIV and general sex education has been drastically cut. ItтАЩs therefore hardly surprising that many teenage Thais grow up without much knowledge of HIV and how it can be contracted.

Here are some pretty dreadful statistics -


1. It is thought that around 85% of Thai youth do not see HIV as something that they should be concerned about, even though 70% of all STI cases in Thailand occur among this group. Premarital sex has become more common among young Thais, but only 20-30% of sexually active young people are using condoms consistently.

2. Men who have sex with men are currently a major risk group in Thailand. In Bangkok (ThailandтАЩs capital and largest city), HIV prevalence among MSM rose from 17% to 28% between 2003 and 2005 and has since dropped to 24.7% in 2009.
http://www.avert.org/thailand-aids-hiv.htm

So any farang intent on enjoying the company of a Thai friend during his visit to Thailand had better be aware that there is a roughly one in four chance of that partner being HIV+.

For westerners and those with medical insurance that covers HIV, of course HIV is no longer the death sentence it once was. For young Thais, as daBoss pointed out, there are cost and social stigma elements that prevent treatment. For many, it is in reality a death sentence, as anyone who reads any of the gay Thailand Boards from time to time will know.

But for us all there are still many reasons to be ultra careful about not catching HIV. Everyone should read this rather grim article from New York Magazine of November 2009. Here are just a few quotes тАУ


Most news accounts today call HIV a chronic, manageable disease. But patients who contracted the virus just a few years back are showing signs of whatтАЩs being called premature or accelerated aging. Early senility turns out to be an increasingly common problem . . . Doctors are also reporting a constellation of ailments in middle-aged patients that are more typically seen at geriatric practices, in patients 80 and older. They range from bone loss to organ failure to arthritis . . .

тАЬItтАЩs spooky,тАЭ says Mark Harrington, who heads Treatment Action Group, a New YorkтАУbased HIV think tank. тАЬIt seems like the virus keeps finding new tricks to throw at us, and weтАЩre just all left behind going, WhatтАЩs going on?тАЭ

. . . Some 60 percent of HIV-positive men in their forties have osteoporosis or its predecessor condition, a problem that typically isnтАЩt diagnosed in men until well into their eighties. Jules Levin, founder and executive director of the New YorkтАУbased National AIDS Treatment Advocacy Project, only found out about this two years ago, when he stumbled and shattered his wrist. He was 57 at the time and in exceptionally good shape, other than his undiagnosed osteoporosis. тАЬThis is what opened my eyes to all of this stuff,тАЭ he says. тАЬAging is the No. 1 problem in HIV today.тАЭ

. . . the frontline doctors I spoke to are crying out for help. тАЬThis needs urgent, comprehensive attention,тАЭ says Paul Bellman, a prominent HIV doctor in the Village who has noticed a significant increase in such patients in the past six months. One called recently to say he risked losing his demanding job because of a sudden inability to recall simple tasks. тАЬI wish I could say, тАШIтАЩm so glad you called me, because this is whatтАЩs causing it.тАЩ But I donтАЩt have the answers. Nobody does.тАЭ
http://nymag.com/health/features/61740/

[Oliver]

I agree with Kittyboy's post, not only because the guy I know is trustworthy but because this is the advice I gleaned from various authorities in the UK.

In general terms, if falangs wish to task risks- and I accept that the risk in this case is not great- then it is "up to him." However, it's a different matter if he expects a Thai worker to take risks on his behalf, however small they may be. I always discuss HIV+ infection with any guy whom I take off; they always claim to have full understanding of the need for condoms for anal sex but very few know of the risk of oral sex.

As the older and wealthier partner in these transactions, it's our duty not to encourage guys who may be in desperate need of money to do anything which is so dangerous. Accordingly, I advise my offs always to insist on a condom.

[bruce_nyc]

Scottish, the problem with the illustrated strategy is....


Not only are his mouth and eyes exposed ( and we all know that shooting liquids could easily land there) ....

But more importantly, his HANDS are exposed! He could have any number of germs if he accidentally touched something "dirty" with his hands.

( This is why food service workers in first world countries always wear the same pair of thin Saran wrap gloves all day long as they handle your food. )

Bruce dear, it was a JOKE.

:banghead:

[bruce_nyc]

I know it was a joke. LOL

I was joking too.

By the way, I missed the entire page 2 of replies. I didn't mean to interrupt the serious conversation with a silly joke.

[christianpfc]

The risk of HIV transmission for the recpetive oral partner are close to zero.
The risk of HIV transmission for the performing oral partner are not large but there is a risk.

As far as I know, the risk for the receptive partner is higher than for the active partner (you do not exactly say the opposite, but I interprete it that way).

http://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtm ... 02a1t1.gif (http://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/figures/r402a1t1.gif)

http://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/figures/r402a1t1.gif

[zubes]

Well given the time before any symptoms show I would probably be pushing up daisies before then but that's not the point, these boys avail their young bodies to pleasure older guys albeit for a fee we are supposedly better educated and in my humble opinion WE have a duty of care to the boys irrespective of our own situation be it age or free healthcare back home. The boys do not have that luxury, I never have sex without a condom, even with my live in b/f of seven years as we both enjoy playing around. So even if offered I would refuse, a minutes lack of thought can end in a life sentence, enough said.

[gaymandenmark]

Even if it is a long time ago, I have to tell this story:

I had a really nice, now dead, friend in Thailand. When he got drunk, and I was sleaping, he made me hard and suddenly my cock was into his asshole.
I always had to stop, asking what are you doing.
It is not a joke, it happended several times.

Another time I was together with a rent boy in Pattaya, I dont know why, but he was happely eating my cum. Maybe it was to late, but I educated him, not to eat customers cum.
This is also not a joke.

What is the worst, I had a "bf", even if we were no monogame. He is 35 for Gods sake and should know. Last time I was together with him, he asked me: I like you to fuck me without condom, because now we know eachother, okay nah?

I mean, they are not stupied guys, but why are so ignorant about the HIV question.

[fountainhall]

In Thailand and quite a few other countries, far too many guys just do not know about the consequences of catching HIV. Part of the reason must be lack of education and the cutback on government funded educational programmes. Sadly, it is not something that can be drummed into a Thai guy by one farang. It's partly a peer group thing and needs fellow Thais to hammer the message home.

For others everywhere, it may be partly a feeling that HIV is a chronic manageable disease and not a death sentence. That may be true now, but at the rate the virus is mutating, who knows what the future holds?

And for others, maybe it's a Russian roulette kind of feeling. "I know it's a risk, but I'm healthy and it won't happen to me."

Unfortunately, in the case of HIV it is a truism that "Fools rush in where angels fear to tread!"

[christianpfc]

Adding to gaymandenmark's story:

I had an encounter where my Lao friend wanted me to fuck him without condom, he thought I am clean because I look healthy (actually he was absolutely convinced that I don't have any STIs). I refused, he offered me a pierced condom (so I am protected, but he can still have my cum inside him). I refused again. He told he does this (using pierced condoms) with some of his "friends" (straight fuck buddies who he pays) without their knowledge.

A current colleage told me that his health centre now does not have condoms in a bowl for free taking, you have to ask the nurse. Reason: Christian fundamentalist pierced condoms because they think use of condoms is wrong.

Lesson: always use your own condoms!

[bruce_nyc]

Wow wow wow. I always wondered about that.... And the thought has been in the back of my mind... of Both situations... Using someone else's provided condoms.... And the bowl of free "take some" condoms.

The only way you know they have not been tampered with, is to buy them yourself and only use your own.

And on the topic of education, etc.... This story of the guy who proposed using a pierced condom is a good example of a guy who KNOWS the consequences. He offered a pierced condom "to protect you", but he wanted the cum inside him.

I really think it's NOT SO SIMPLE as to say that we just need more education.

I think MANY guys already have the education.... and they just don't care. Or worse, they WANT to expose themselves.

It must be some sort of a physiological problem.

.. Christian fundamentalist pierced condoms because they think use of condoms is wrong...

Always worth remembering when we rail against other creeds.

[bruce_nyc]

Meanwhile piercing condoms is morally superior.

It says so in the bible. Somewhere. I think.

:banghead:

I don't know if they had condoms in biblical times - but I may well be wrong - after all I do know someone who used a TWIX chocolate biscuit wrapper in an emergency - so I guess anything can be pressed into use!

:sign5:

[bruce_nyc]

...a TWIX chocolate biscuit wrapper in an emergency...

PLEASE tell me you are joking.

You couldn't find anything better than that, Scotty?!?

And just to be clear, are you suggesting that they had TWIX back in biblical times....?

[anonone]

Every sperm is sacred...at least that is what the priest said.
No wonder I had to swallow them all.....

:laughing3:

[quote="scottish-guy":2sdudq0u]...a TWIX chocolate biscuit wrapper in an emergency...

PLEASE tell me you are joking....You couldn't find anything better than that, Scotty?!?[/quote:2sdudq0u]


You're just jealous 'cos yours would fit in a Cadburys Fudge wrapper :ura1:

[attachment=1:2sdudq0u]scotty's condom.jpg[/attachment:2sdudq0u] [attachment=0:2sdudq0u]bruce's condom.jpg[/attachment:2sdudq0u]

[bruce_nyc]

I just had a "ah ha" moment...

This must be why they call you people, "fudge packers"....

I just had a "ah ha" moment...

This must be why they call you people, "fudge packers"....

"You people"? - are you a lesbian?

[bruce_nyc]

You CWPs ( chocolate wrapper people ).... :ink:

Have we totally side-tracked a serious topic with silliness? Maybe that's ok sometimes.... when topics get so serious they become sad and depressing... we need a light-hearted intermission to break up the tension.... before getting back to the seriousness.

[martin911]

After reading the 4 odd pages of replies it doesnt seem that anyone has really answered the question i was asking -

I know the posts on hiv transmission etc are important but its not excactly news to most here nor what i was asking about,
and there have been some individual cases (where boys didnt want condoms etc ) reported
The posts on the chatroom/GR messages in which people were actually LOOKING for hiv infected people for sex was something i had no idea on i must say
Thats shocking stuff )!!!

-- i was trying to get a wider handle on the farang side if you know what i mean --

Has anybody had the type of conversation i had with the thai guy in which i asked him did many farang ask him for condom free sex -and his reply was that close on 50% did
Ever ask a thai bar boy thai /boyfriend/ or just a thai friend that type of question ?????

[bruce_nyc]

Yes. I'm still very interested and curious to hear the answer to this too.

Some of you guys must have asked thai boys this question before. No?

[anonone]

I asked my BF but he said I was the only falang that he has had sex with, so no help there.... :sign5:
Seriously, I have not asked him about it, nor any other Thai friend.

Next time I am in town and hanging out with BF and friends, I will see if I can find out anything. A lot of time they would be reluctant to talk about the specifics of escapades with me.
The have no qualms about mentioning customers and such, but specifics are not usually discussed....like it would not be polite or something. Maybe because they are friends of the BF or something?

So not ignoring the question Martin, just nothing substantial to contribute as of yet.