Bad press for Phuket

[Beachlover]

Phuket's still a nice beach and party destination but the rip offs and scams supported by local authorities aren't going unnoticed...

---------------------------------------------------
Island a paradise for many, and hell for others
December 26, 2011

Seven years after the tsunami, Australians are all too carefree on Phuket, writes south-east Asia correspondent Lindsay Murdoch.

A scantily clad Russian dancer clings to a pole behind a second-storey street-front window of a nightclub called L'Amour.

A large Australian flag flutters below her in a breeze coming off the Andaman Sea.

Across the street, the "Aussie Bar" is crowded with young Australian drinkers, many of them shirtless, who are shouting to be heard above music thumping from nearby girlie bars.

Away from the seedy red-light district of Patong Beach, it is boom time on Phuket seven years after the Boxing Day tsunami hit southern Thailand with awesome savagery, killing more than 5000 people and wiping out the region's tourism industry.

Phuket International Airport is being upgraded to take 12.4 million visitors a year by 2014.

The island once known as the "Pearl of the Andaman Sea" is undergoing a building frenzy with 43,000 hotel rooms open and at least 7000 more in the pipeline.

But Larry Cunningham, Australia's honorary consul on the island, has spoken out about the rip-offs, scams, criminal activities and bad behaviour that are ruining the holidays of scores of Australians, including a new wave of "schoolies".

Up to 25,000 Australian tourists a month are visiting Phuket, most of them arriving on cheap direct flights from Australia's capital cities, lured by the benefits of the high Australian dollar and an exotic location.

"Many Australians come here behaving as if the same standards and laws apply in Thailand as they do in Australia," Cunningham says. He is a property developer from Sydney who has lived in Phuket for 11 years.

"They have little idea about Thai culture and think that what happens in Australia happens here."

Cunningham, 62, knows that when the telephone rings at night at the exclusive Chava resort he built on Phuket's Surin Beach, it is usually Thai authorities telling him more Australians have landed in trouble.

Up to 50 Australians a year die on Phuket, half of them from natural causes and the other half from motorbike and car accidents, misadventure or suicides.

Cunningham estimates about 80 per cent of the cases in which Australians find themselves in trouble are settled before he hears about them, often through extorted payments.

Australians sometimes find themselves in situations that make them "scared for their lives", he says.

Unscrupulous jet skis operators on Phuket have been ripping off customers for years. They make false claims of damage to the skis and demand immediate payment. "Thugs will surround the hirers, threatening physical harm or worse if they don't pay money," Cunningham says.

"They have the hirers over a barrel because they handed them their passports."

In the latest case last week, two Australian women injured in a jet-ski accident were pursued by thugs who went to the hospital where they were being treated.
This was even though a South African man responsible for the accident had agreed to pay for the damage involved.

Similar scams involve the hiring of motor bikes.

Cunningham says Australian "schoolies" coming to the island in rising numbers are being preyed on by Thai criminals, and corrupt police, at "full moon" parties where they are often robbed after having their drinks spiked, set up and extorted for money or sexually assaulted.

"We have also had motor boats coming from the parties crashing, killing and maiming people тАж these parties are dangerous and the kids should not attend them," he says.

Cunningham tells the story of two young Australian men who awoke in an alley behind a bar about 30 hours after their drinks were spiked.
All their valuables were gone.

In another instance, an Australian man involved in a business dispute was wrongfully accused of sexually abusing a child.

While being held for 84 days in a Phuket jail, he was told his throat would be cut if he did not put money into a bank account. He obliged.

Some other experiences: one Australian had to pay $50,000 in hospital fees after coming off a motorcycle he rented. His Australian insurer declined to pay the fees because he did not have a current Australian motorcycle licence.

The family of an 88-year-old Perth woman had to pay $30,000 to send her home in a medivac journey after she broke her hip. She had not been able to get travel insurance because of her age.

Many Australians get into trouble after they pick up an escort in a bar only to discover, after returning with the escort to their hotel, the companion is a "ladyboy".
"You couldn't print many of the stories,'' Cunningham says.

It is not only that Australians can be victims. Cunningham says there is an increasing number of cases in which Australians have gone to Thai police to make false claims of theft so they could claim insurance back home in Australia. "Thai police view the making of false declarations very seriously," he says.

Cunningham stresses he is not advising Australians to stay away Phuket, which he says is a fabulous place with near-perfect beaches where they can enjoy the "land of smiles" culture.

"I'm just asking them to be aware of the possible pitfalls and avoid them," he says.

Cunningham says surviving the 2004 tsunami and seeing its "horrendous" aftermath encouraged him to help Australians who get into trouble. He was on a boat off nearby Krabi when a 9.2 metre wall of water smashed into southern Thailand about 11am local time on Boxing Day.

"I am a grandfather and I like to make a difference where I can," Cunningham says.

"I felt that as I spoke Thai, I could do a lot to assist after the tsunami and, when the honorary consul position was advertised the following year, I applied for it," he says. "The job can take [a] huge personal [toll] but at other times it can be very rewarding."

Along the Phuket coast, luxurious resorts have been built where the tsunami crashed ashore, destroying once beautiful beaches and villages.

Beside a hotel swimming pool at Patong Beach, Juliette Law, 44, from Coffs Harbour, says she does not fear another tsunami because the chance of one striking again is small. "Phuket is a terrific place for the family to come," says Law, a teacher in environmental science.

John Bassett, 61, and Nina Lahimann, 50, from Byron Bay, drove two hours north along the coast from Patong Beach to Khao Lak, a white-sand resort which in 2004 was a scene of devastation.

Bassett is sitting in a restaurant overlooking the beach where, as millions of YouTube viewers saw, the tsunami swamped a lone swimmer and then smashed into a restaurant. But he says it is good to be away from the seedy part of Patong Beach, which he likens to a "zoo" or the kingdoms of ''Sodom and Gomorrah''.

"We have come to this part of Thailand for the last two years тАж this is a beautiful place and it's a nice thought that our money is helping victims of the tsunami," he says.

Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/travel/travel-new ... 1p9ii.html (http://www.smh.com.au/travel/travel-news/island-a-paradise-for-many-and-hell-for-others-20111225-1p9ii.html)
---------------------------------------------------


---------------------------------------------------
Kiwi dies after Thai sex romp: report
December 28, 2011 - 10:22AM

A New Zealand man has died after a reported sex romp with two Thai prostitutes.

The man, in Thailand to mark the anniversary of a friend's death in the Boxing Day tsunami seven years ago, was found dead in a Phuket guesthouse, according to local police.

A friend of the 30-year-old discovered his body on Tuesday morning, the Phuket Wan Tourism News reported local police as saying.

The website, in a story headlined Phuket tourist mourns tsunami friend, has sex with two Patong bar hostesses, and dies, quotes a local police spokesman saying the dead man had taken two prostitutes back to his room at the Keeta Guesthouse at Patong Beach the night before.

Lieutenant Jakapong said the dead man was overweight and may have had health issues.

The police officer told the newspaper the dead man and another 29-year-old New Zealander had attended a candles in the sand "Light Up Phuket" ceremony at Patong Beach on the anniversary of the 2004 tsunami before the pair went out on the town after the ceremony.

"The man told his friend that both girls were beautiful so he decided to take both back to his room," Lieutenant Jakapong said. "We found two used condoms and a sex stimulant in the man's room."

The prostitutes were not in the room when the body was found, Lieutenant Jakapong said.

New Zealand's Ministry of Foreign Affairs and Trade said it had not been approached for consular assistance but was making inquiries.

AAP

Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/world/kiwi-dies-a ... 1pc0h.html (http://www.smh.com.au/world/kiwi-dies-after-thai-sex-romp-report-20111228-1pc0h.html)
---------------------------------------------------

[kjun12]

The bad press Phuket is getting is not bad enough. The place will have to be brought to its knees before the ways of the taxi drivers, jet ski people and other crooks, as well as corrupt police, change their ways. I write to as many travel sites as I can find warning travelers to avoid Phuket.

[krobbie]

The bad press Phuket is getting is not bad enough. The place will have to be brought to its knees before the ways of the taxi drivers, jet ski people and other crooks, as well as corrupt police, change their ways. I write to as many travel sites as I can find warning travelers to avoid Phuket.

My first experience of Thailand was Phuket and for the next two years I also took time out of my agenda to visit. I will limit my thoughts to Patong, as that is where I stayed. The last time was New Year 2010 and I swore I would never again set foot in the place.

It is a veritable den of thieves. I am fairly liberal but extortion and the like just get my goat. It is so obvious but the general visitor doesn't realise until it's too late.

I now consider it one of the places I advise travelers to avoid when going to Thailand.

During my ONE visit to Phuket just prior to the tsunami, I found the people westernized, rude and crude. I felt that in no way did they resemble the Thais of the rest of their nation but a group of people who did not care in the least.
I felt the bars were poorly run and had no customers and the city in total chaos with construction everywhere.
I never returned and have no desire to. Their loss but I don't think they care.

[Beachlover]

During my ONE visit to Phuket... I found the people westernized, rude and crude. I felt that in no way did they resemble the Thais of the rest of their nation but a group of people who did not care in the least.
I've found most of the Thais I've encountered in Phuket are totally different to the Thais I encounter elsewhere... They don't have that same warm, happy, friendly spirit and all look a bit fed up. They're just not the same. They see ripping off tourists as a routine.

I think they've just found they can push and jack up the prices as much as they like and it makes no difference... the stupid tourists still keep coming! Plus, apparently the local authorities are ruthless about collecting kick backs. All the businesses that operate there have to pay enormous kick backs and they keep rising. They have to pass on the costs to their customers.

Phuket has built an insanely strong brand as a tourist destination and it'll take some years yet before any of this stuff makes a visible dent in their tourist numbers. People are still developing new resorts and expat-oriented homes on the island.

There's no direct competitor... Hua Hin's has little to do, is too quiet and not as beautiful... Samui is apparently just as bad with the rip offs and isn't as developed... Krabi isn't anywhere near as developed so you can't really go there to party and such. Phuket and all the surrounding islands is where you go. I think Krabi will become the place to go in the future.

DELETED very very very OFFENSIVE

[newalaan]

DELETED very very very OFFENSIVEOffensive to whom exactly? If it concerns the monarchy, underage discussion or has possible legal implications then fine....delete away...but if it is just 'generally' offensive then spare me the protection please, no need to shield me from very offensive scribblings on a forum website, I am all grown up, no nannying required after 16 years of age in the UK.


It is a veritable den of thieves. I am fairly liberal but extortion and the like just get my goat. It is so obvious but the general visitor doesn't realise until it's too late.I now consider it one of the places I advise travelers to avoid when going to Thailand.Whilst i agree that there are some very select groups of thais in Phuket prepared to rip-off the unsuspecting , i would say it unfair to advise anybody, especially if gay, not to travel there. There are still alot of very nice guys in Patong and Paradise who are just as deserving of customers as Pattaya, Chaing Mai or Bangkok. Fair enough to warn of scams i agree, but that's all you really need to do.


I've found most of the Thais I've encountered in Phuket are totally different to the Thais I encounter elsewhere... They don't have that same warm, happy, friendly spirit and all look a bit fed up. They're just not the same. They see ripping off tourists as a routine.
During my ONE visit to Phuket just prior to the tsunami, I found the people westernized, rude and crude. I felt that in no way did they resemble the Thais of the rest of their nation but a group of people who did not care in the least.I felt the bars were poorly run and had no customers and the city in total chaos with construction everywhere.I never returned and have no desire to. Their loss but I don't think they care.I'm not sure what thais Beachflooder, Krobbie and justme are referring to or have encountered..........are we speaking specifically gay Thais from Paradise Complex.......all Thais in general around Patong or known scammers such as tuktuk guys, jet-ski guys etc?

If it is gay guys in Paradise you are referring to i can only disagree, as over the years i have found many good and very loyal friends there and find them every bit as fun, accommodating and reliable as guys from other parts of thailand. In fact i also find some of the guesthouse/bar owners go out of their way for you, much more friendly and helpful than any of the Bkk ones or most of the Pattaya ones. Also when staying in Paradise I've found the boys there go out of their way for you too, with no expectations. More than once waiters or staff at a beerbars have offered to take me on his motocy somewhere outside Paradise in Patong with no acceptance of renumeration. In fact over the years that has happened many times, possibly in part due to their knowing the difficulties of getting around in Patong and having to deal with tuktuk/motocy guys, but they dont need to go out of their way, they just do. Also i have found freelance and/or non-money boys in the likes of Galaxy to be very nice and happy to mix and be sociable.

Maybe they look a 'bit fed up' when faced with you 'in the flesh' BL as perhaps you might not reflect the image and aura of your avator and forum persona. Just a thought.

[kjun12]

Newalan, I must disagree with you. I think we should warn as many fellow travelers as we can that Phuket is a bad, unethical and violent place to visit. Only by suffering financially will the bad things there be changed. The crime and rip-offs there are legendary and the government does nothing about it. I will bad mouth the place whenever and wherever I can.

[newalaan]

Newalan, I must disagree with you. I think we should warn as many fellow travelers as we can that Phuket is a bad, unethical and violent place to visit. Only by suffering financially will the bad things there be changed. The crime and rip-offs there are legendary and the government does nothing about it. I will bad mouth the place whenever and wherever I can.And you are entitled to your opinion kjun12. But are you and others blaming the guys who work in the gay area at Paradise Patong for making it a bad, unethical and violent place? if not, it's a bit unfair on them to have posters like yourself on gay forums advising gay visitors to avoid the place because of the antics of a minority of money grabbing thais. As you say the authorities, government does nothing about it, shouldn't your anger be directed at them rather than the innocents trying to earn a living there?
The place will have to be brought to its knees before the ways of the taxi drivers, jet ski people and other crooks, as well as corrupt police, change their waysBut you realistically know that won't happen, it's just far too popular as a tourist destination.

I don't know why a gay traveller needs to be interacting with the mafia scum anyway. I have two types of holiday in Phuket. The first is the 3-4 short break, a lazy holiday where i camp in Paradise, Patong and there is more than enough there to 'entertain' me for a short break. I get the guesthouse to arrange transport to and from the airport. Anything outside Paradise in Patong is walkable, such as the beach etc.. and so no need to use tuktuk, jet skii operators.

The second type of Phuket holiday is where i go around the island to beaches, attractions etc.. and for this i hire a car. Nine car rent operate beside the airport and a honda Jazz (ideal for phuket) can be had for about bt1000 per day. Pick up from the airport and return there and you save yourself Bt1100 in taxis fees also, with no need to use tuktuks at all.

But what i was REALLY trying to ascertain was APART from tuktuk and jet skii mafias what other reasons would there be to avoid phuket for a short break or a weeks holiday?

OK Newalaan, granted that the guesthouses and bars etc are probably very very accommodating and friendly but my friend and I did not stay in the middle of Patong Beach in a guesthouse. We wound up staying at the Le Meridian because that is his "style".
I can surely say that from the reception to the pool manager to every stinking employee in the hotel complex was rude, unaccomodating and helpful. When we asked to have an umbrella moved to where we were sitting the pool employee said we could move it ourselves! When we made a complaint to the hotel manager, the next day the Pool Manager came and told the boy that accompanied us that "if we thought he and his staff were rude before, wait til we saw what we would get now!" Unbelievable!
We found the scuba service we used at the hotel rude, we found the bars empty of customers and the boys sitting around waiting for people to arrive. Sure we went around Phuket and did not stay at the hotel 100% of the time and I am sure other people visiting would like to go around Phuket. Phuket in general was just not a very nice and sweet memory for me.
I am sorry but the first impression and dose of Phuket was enough. I have no desire to visit it again.

[martin911]

OK Newalaan, granted that the guesthouses and bars etc are probably very very accommodating and friendly but my friend and I did not stay in the middle of Patong Beach in a guesthouse. We wound up staying at the Le Meridian because that is his "style".
I can surely say that from the reception to the pool manager to every stinking employee in the hotel complex was rude, unaccomodating and helpful. When we asked to have an umbrella moved to where we were sitting the pool employee said we could move it ourselves! When we made a complaint to the hotel manager, the next day the Pool Manager came and told the boy that accompanied us that "if we thought he and his staff were rude before, wait til we saw what we would get now!" Unbelievable!
We found the scuba service we used at the hotel rude, we found the bars empty of customers and the boys sitting around waiting for people to arrive. Sure we went around Phuket and did not stay at the hotel 100% of the time and I am sure other people visiting would like to go around Phuket. Phuket in general was just not a very nice and sweet memory for me.
I am sorry but the first impression and dose of Phuket was enough. I have no desire to visit it again.

I have stayed in Le Meridian (the one nearest Patpong beach,not the Yacht club one ) a few times before and i found it the opposite of what you describe Justme !!

I never had any problem with the gay guys there --als had great fun ,but it is the rest of the place that stops me from going back --far far to commercial ,tuk tuk mafia etc !!

Im surprised that there is still enough people going to Phuket that there still is a gay area !!!

[newalaan]

We wound up staying at the Le Meridian because that is his "style".I can surely say that from the reception to the pool manager to every stinking employee in the hotel complex was rude, unaccommodating and helpful.Fine, i can understand your anger and it would have angered me too, but you had ONE very bad experience in a straight western hotel chain resort which seems to have coloured your opinion of the whole island. I have had unfortunate accomodation experiences in Pattaya and Bkk over the years, but one bad experience would certainly not put me off from going back to try a different place and it wouldn't prompt me to tar the whole place with the same brush. But that is me and my preference and you have yours which is fair enough. I have visited Phuket more than a dozen times over the years and yet to have the feeling that i would never go back, there is alot of very positive fun to be had in the right areas of Phuket and to me is still worth a visit for a change of scene.

To be honest 'justme' your experience is exactly why I dont stay at straight family orientated western hotel chains or resorts in Thailand. As I have noted in the past, their sneering attitude as well as the underlying and disapproving comments and attitute from the snobby thai staff aimed at the ears of my bf in these kind of places makes staying there simply not worth the money, time, hassle and my bf feeling uncomfortable. My previous referencing of 'gay friendly' hotels in posts in the past used to get the usual bog-standard replies from some of the long-time (deluded) Thailand experts here bleating that there is no such thing as a 'gay friendly' hotel in Thailand because they are ALL gay neutral! which my (and probably your) experience tells me is a load of old tosh.

But i was just more interested to find out if it was specifically the gay aspect of Phuket criticism was directed at and if so why, as you did mention that you considered some of the bars to be poorly run.

I understand what you are trying to say to me Newalaan but I can safely say that I have spent the majority of the last 12 years in Thailand. I have stayed at the Shangri-la in both Bangkok and Chain Mai, I have stayed at a big western hotel on the beach in Hua Hin and Koh Samui and other places which I forget the names. Sometimes gay hotels and mostly straight upper ammenity style. I have NEVER, NEVER been treated as I was in Phuket, especially by staff members who rely on tips. Everywhere I have gone the Thai staff don't care, up2u.
Sure, maybe you get d]some snears or looks from other tourists but NEVER from staff. so you have to understand that as it was the first trip and the way we were all treated, well Chaing Mai is always on my list of places I like to go rather than Phuket. My decision is also based on what I read about the Tuk Tuks and Taxis and such. Seems to me like it just is not a welcoming place I want to go back to. Up2me. :3some:

[Brad the Impala]

During my ONE visit to Phuket just prior to the tsunami, I found the people westernized, rude and crude. I felt that in no way did they resemble the Thais of the rest of their nation but a group of people who did not care in the least.
I felt the bars were poorly run and had no customers and the city in total chaos with construction everywhere.
I never returned and have no desire to. Their loss but I don't think they care.

It does sound as though your views of Phuket were very coloured by the accomodation that you chose, which is an unfortunate basis on which to judge the province of Phuket as a whole. The Meridien receives a 4 star rating on Trip Adviser so many people must be satisfied with it. As for some poorly run bars, I am sure that you are right, but there are poorly run bars in Pattaya for example too, but I don't read you advising people to stay away on that basis!

As for the city in total chaos, that doesn't tally with my experience of Phuket Town, which is a rather charming provincial capital.

There are definitely problems with transport in Phuket, but as Alaan has advised above it isn't difficult to circumvent these. I have always found Southern hospitality to be the best, and have had wonderful holidays there, but we all see things differently............

[Nathan B]

They don't have that same warm, happy, friendly spirit and all look a bit fed up. They're just not the same. They see ripping off tourists as a routine.

It is a veritable den of thieves

Phuket is a bad, unethical and violent place to visit.

I can surely say that from the reception to the pool manager to every stinking employee in the hotel complex was rude, unaccomodating and helpful.
What a ridiculous set of sweeping assertions. Phuket is no worse and no better than any other major tourist destination in Thailand (tuk tuk drivers excepted), or most or the rest of developing SE Asia for that matter. The comments merely reflect the attitudes of the posters.

I visit Phuket regularly and find it more relaxed and friendly than either Bangkok or Pattaya. In the daytime there's a huge variety of activities, and in the evening every option you could wish for - including 2 gay nightclubs - in a compact area. I can still get a beer in a go go bar for 100 Baht, and if you're on a budget a room in a reasonable guesthouse can be had for 500 Baht.

I've stayed at the Meridien many times with my partner and always been treated well. It is a large family hotel, but the facilities are good and the private beach is superb. To claim every employee is rude is just crass.

The reception people were rude, the pool people, the buffet/restaurant & convienience people, scuba person, oh I am sorry you are right Nathan.... we liked the maid. She was very kind! The other guests gave us no attitude or strange looks. While we were there a man was sucked into the pool's filter system because it had no screen cover. Everyone came running as the life guard and others tried to get his leg out. When the filter system was turned off and he was taken out with his leg cut up, they all seemed more interested in why there was no cover, rather than to attend to the man's injuries and the fact that he was complaining that his vacation had now been ruined as he could not enjoy water the rest of his stay. Who knows? :dontknow: Maybe they had a staff change after the Tsunami. Enuf said about my experience at the Le Meridian Phuket!

[kjun12]

Newlaan and Nathan are Phuket's self appointed defenders but I will not go there and always advise everyone I can to stay away. Some of our generalizations are too encompassing but most of their defenses are outright absurd. :argue:

[Khor tose]

And you are entitled to your opinion kjun12. But are you and others blaming the guys who work in the gay area at Paradise Patong for making it a bad, unethical and violent place? if not, it's a bit unfair on them to have posters like yourself on gay forums advising gay visitors to avoid the place because of the antics of a minority of money grabbing thais. As you say the authorities, government does nothing about it, shouldn't your anger be directed at them rather than the innocents trying to earn a living there?
Give me a break newalan. You visit Phuket and you do not know that the boys there are on contract. Their folks are given money in advance and the boy is required to perform with any customer. Just out of curiosity have you ever talked to any of these boys, or do you just fuck and go. When you support this place you are supporting modern day slavery. Having read many of your post, I doubt that fazes you at all, but it does bother me

[Brad the Impala]

And you are entitled to your opinion kjun12. But are you and others blaming the guys who work in the gay area at Paradise Patong for making it a bad, unethical and violent place? if not, it's a bit unfair on them to have posters like yourself on gay forums advising gay visitors to avoid the place because of the antics of a minority of money grabbing thais. As you say the authorities, government does nothing about it, shouldn't your anger be directed at them rather than the innocents trying to earn a living there?
Give me a break newalan. You visit Phuket and you do not know that the boys there are on contract. Their folks are given money in advance and the boy is required to perform with any customer. Just out of curiosity have you ever talked to any of these boys, or do you just fuck and go. When you support this place you are supporting modern day slavery. Having read many of your post, I doubt that fazes you at all, but it does bother me

Are you saying that the off bars in the Paradise Complex operate on a different basis to those elsewhere in Thailand?(Which would be bollocks!)

[Khor tose]

Are you saying that the off bars in the Paradise Complex operate on a different basis to those elsewhere in Thailand?(Which would be bollocks!)

Gee are you dense. It is quite clear that that is exactly what I am saying. The boys are required to stay in the rooms owned by the club and if they split someone is sent to their parents to get the money back.

[Brad the Impala]

[quote="Brad the Impala":3slwim4y]

Are you saying that the off bars in the Paradise Complex operate on a different basis to those elsewhere in Thailand?(Which would be bollocks!)

Gee are you dense. It is quite clear that that is exactly what I am saying. The boys are required to stay in the rooms owned by the club and if they split someone is sent to their parents to get the money back.[/quote:3slwim4y]

Then you are talking bollocks!! While there may be some incidence of this relating to bars anywhere, no more so in Patong than anywhere else I would suspect, it is an incredible assertion that all the disparate bar owners in Patong carry out this policy. Apart from anything else it would be impractical to pursue, given that boys in the bars there come from all over Thailand from Hadyai to Nong Khai.

I have to agree with Brad.

There may be a degree of what Khor Tose says going on but it is not (from talking to the boys) particularly prevalent, and if it was they would be only too happy to tell your their story in the hope you'd be outraged and tip extra

Brad says they come from all over Thailand and that is undoubtedly correct - but some are from outside Thailand which just renders the logistics of reclaiming money from their families, a ludicrous proposition.

But if you have any hard evidence Khore Tose, let's have it.

:occasion9:

[newalaan]

I have'nt had much time to spend on the forum posting lately but I needed to make time to reply to 'Khor tose's' polite observations.

Gee are you dense. It is quite clear that that is exactly what I am saying. The boys are required to stay in the rooms owned by the club and if they split someone is sent to their parents to get the money back.Yes, guys with many years and long term experiences of Thailand, especially Phuket as Brad has, would be dense, whereas you 'Khor tose' are so wonderfully enlightened. Thank goodness you have posted to put us all right.


Give me a break newalan. You visit Phuket and you do not know that the boys there are on contract. Their folks are given money in advance and the boy is required to perform with any customer. Just out of curiosity have you ever talked to any of these boys, or do you just fuck and go. When you support this place you are supporting modern day slavery. Having read many of your post, I doubt that fazes you at all, but it does bother meI dont think i've seen such a clueless, naive and dramatic reply for some time here. But certainly "Khor-tose" i would be delighted to 'give you a break'...so over to you....care to give some actual specifics you have experienced regarding the enslavery of all the Patong Boys! I would hate to think there was no actual basis to your delusion. Meanwhile i'll give some of my experiences with Phuket that I have gleaned over a dozen years, and why i am quite happy to return to see many of the nice guys who have worked there for years and who in my opinion deserve to see a share of the visitors tips and cash just as Bkk, Pattaya, and Chaing Mai do.


Just out of curiosity have you ever talked to any of these boysYES! Starting with the bar/gueshouse i have stayed for years and know the owner very well, I can tell you none of his seven staff are/feel enslaved NONE, they are free to do what they want, he is good to them and they love working there rather than Pattaya or Bkk. One of his staff is graduating and works to earn money to pay for that, the others are lovely, honest down to earth gay guys who prefer (as opposed to being forced) to work in Phuket. I know guys from many of the bars there including a group of friends who regularly work between Patong and Bkk depending which is the busier, i have met up with them in both Patong and DJ station-Bkk, they "Khor tose" i can guarantee are free to go and work where they want. Another example is a guy i have known working in Patong since he was 19 and over the last 7 or 8 years he has worked as a waiter, he rarely goes off with farangs or anybody for that matter. He is under NO pressure to go with customers and he took the bar job based on that agreement with the owner, yes Khor tose he set the terms for his employment, strange situation for a "modern day slave". These are actual, real-life, true examples from the guys themselves.

As in any sex-for-sale area of course there will be instances of cartels and mafia-inspired attempts at control, just look at Sunee, Boystown, Silom/suriwong, for cartel controlled business practices and with Patong even though there are two big players who seem to have alot of influence regarding bar ownership and management, but you are WAY off the mark to suggest ALL guys who work in Patong are enslaved, that's just crass and utter nonsense. OR maybe it's just pure luck and coincidence that the all guys in Patong I have come into contact over 12 years just happen to be the only ones outside of this mafia enslavery. But obviously you have come across different experiences and I would be happy to learn, so please educate away.....


or do you just fuck and goAs for this mean personal sniping, given that it came from a deluded old fool, i can only feel pity, so all i'll say is that you since I have never met you (more good luck and coincidence! but probably because i go out of my way to avoid opinionated fat-mouths like your goodself), then you have no idea of anything about me. I usually go there with my bf and meet up with guys i have known for years, but it IS refreshing to come across such a morally pure farang who, while close to the workings of the sex industry in Thailand, and particularly Patong, does not fuck and go, so obviously must have never partaken of sex with any of these Thai boys, enslaved or not, unless of course you actually DO or have done and are just a hypocrite of the highest order, which i suspect is closer to the mark.


supporting modern day slaveryAnd if you currently do or previously have engaged with boys from the sex industry, do you really have any idea who YOU are (or indeed have been) supporting directly or indirectly? Given the level of your naivety I suspect NOT!

[newalaan]

Newlaan and Nathan are Phuket's self appointed defenders Some of our generalizations are too encompassing but most of their defenses are outright absurd. What is absurd is your inability to come up with ANY examples, i would be delighted to learn of anything i was not already aware of i need to avoid on my up and coming visit there.


but I will not go there and always advise everyone I can to stay away
The crime and rip-offs there are legendary
I think we should warn as many fellow travelers as we can that Phuket is a bad, unethical and violent place to visit
the ways of the taxi drivers, jet ski people and other crooks, as well as corrupt police
I write to as many travel sites as I can find warning travelers to avoid Phuket.
I will bad mouth the place whenever and wherever I can Yes, yes we've got the message! You do realise that by simply repeating the same monotonous drivel like a parrot on crack you will not really strengthen your case or arguement.

But first maybe you could tell us of any Province, City or Town in Thailand from Chaing Rai in the far North, to Songkhla in the far south where corrupt police, bad unethical people, violence, rip-offs, crooks and thieves operate, mafia tuktuk/motocys/songtaew operators, in fact all the negatives you prattle on about regarding Phuket DO NOT exisit? If there is anything specific only to Phuket, please advise. I have covered most but i need to be sure before i go!

[kjun12]

in fact all the negatives you prattle on about regarding Phuket DO NOT exisit? If there is anything specific only to Phuket, please advise. I have covered most but i need to be sure before i go!
"There never was a man so blind as a man who would not see."

[newalaan]

newalaan wrote: in fact all the negatives you prattle on about regarding Phuket DO NOT exisit?
There never was a man so blind as a man who would not seeOh so true! But I think you need to change that to "There never was a man so blind as kjun12 who definitely could not see" as it clearly applies to yourself. Your quote is certainly very (ironically), apt. If you read what i actually wrote again, but take ALL the words into consideration this time, you'll 'get it' eventually. It would appear you have either misread or failed to understand the whole sentance as the part you quoted would seem to indicate. This is the whole sentence with bold type to help you join the dots.
But first maybe you could tell us of any Province, City or Town in Thailand from Chaing Rai in the far North, to Songkhla in the far south where corrupt police, bad unethical people, violence, rip-offs, crooks and thieves operate, mafia tuktuk/motocys/songtaew operators, in fact all the negatives you prattle on about regarding Phuket DO NOT exist? If there is anything specific only to Phuket, please advise. I have covered most but i need to be sure before i go! "tell us of any Province in Thailand where all the bad things which exist in Phuket (as listed)do not also exist"You will note I was agreeing with you that all those things quoted do in fact exist in Phuket, just as they do in every Province, City and Town the country over. So why pick on Phuket?

It is these other reasons (apart from those quoted) which you, as yet, have failed to tell us about and are so bad you need to expend a great deal of energy advising everybody on the internet not to visit Phuket I am concerned about. Why is it so difficult for you to tell us what they are? I'm heading there next month and I need to know about these possibly 'unique to Phuket/Patong' problems which should persuade me and other gay travellers not to visit there. Not the slavery issue of course, "Khor tose" has already brought us 'up to speed' regarding that.

[kjun12]

Newlaan, this Is my last entry concerning you and this topic. You are a Phuket fan and I am the opposite. I think it is a very bad, almost evil place because of many things. If I were to list those, you would only challenge them is your own inane way. So, this discussion is over between you and I.