Friendship "Tipping"

I read the recent article initiated by Surfcrest in which he discussed tipping.
I have encountered a related subject on which I would appreciate input from any interested parties.

Having visited Thailand numerous times I know many Thai boys and Thai bar owners. When I meet these people during my wanderings they will frequently, after a brief conversation, ask me for money. I mean that we may be just standing on the street and they have not complained that their mother's water buffalo died. They just want money. In the past, I have resented this request and usually I have not complied. On a recent trip I complained to one of my Thai friends (a middle 20's boy) and asked him for his reaction to this "begging". He hesitated to answer but finally said that he thought it was OK for a Thai to ask for money from a "rich" farang. I later asked another Thai friend and he also said that he agreed with the practice.

If all Thai people find this practice acceptable then I am surprised that I have any friends at all due to my historic reluctance to give money to anyone who asked for it. Assuming that other farangs are also asked for money ---What do you do?

When I meet these people during my wanderings they will frequently, after a brief conversation, ask me for money.
If all Thai people find this practice acceptable then I am surprised that I have any friends at all due to my historic reluctance to give money to anyone who asked for it. Assuming that other farangs are also asked for money ---What do you do?

I work in a company where the Thais are fairly well paid but obviously not to farang standards.

Now and again one of the staff will at lunch ask if I'll pay for their food and at other times simply say 'You give me 50 Baht?' I have found after years in Thailand that this is quite acceptable behaviour although not the norm. Often people I meet outside of the work environment will also have no qualms about asking for a few Baht. The way I personally deal with it is to sometimes pay for the lunch at the office and outside I will sometimes give a few Baht and other times simply say 'No I poor farang' with a smile. I have never found a refusal offends if delivered in the right manner.

Just do not be offended if asked, also try to deliver your refusal jokingly.

What you have encountered is the Asian practice of patronage, also known as The Big Man Syndrome. In a traditionally hierarchical (dare I say feudal) society such as Thailand, patronage is completely entrenched. It's why many Thais, for example, can't see what the fuss is all about when Westerners disdain vote buying. I suggest you get hold of some books about Thai society - you'll find plenty of references to the patronage system and the Big Man Syndrome. There are those who hold that since no non-Thai has a place within the traditional Thai social structure, that the only role left to them is, in fact, as someone or some group's patron

IF you have a Thai Boyfriend.. just let it be known and the other Thai boys will not ask you for money. They know you have already been drained.... LOL

IF you have a Thai Boyfriend..That's just the point - he is your boyfriend, you are his patron (not his boyfriend, although he knows that's what you want to hear - and speaks accordingly)

This isn't just in Thailand, but common throughout Asia. When I worked in HK, if the boss asked you to lunch, he paid whether Gweilo or Chungkwokyan. Some of my HK friends come to London and use their homes here for several months, especialy in the summer. Many Chinese guys I knew as the consorts of well-placed expat gweilos are now in senior professional positions. They frequently book a table at a good Chinese restaurant and ask a dozen friends. Only one person takes the bill and it's just as likely to be the Chinese whose friends are mostly retired as a retired gweilo. It's giving face and amongst real friends it's not competitive or racially determined.

[Davey612]

The Coloner/homiterm got it right. It has nothing really to do with whether you are a farang or not. It has to do with status and wealth.

The other side of the coin (ahem) is that the person who is trying to get favors from you may, from time to time, give you little gifts to show appreciation. Now you know how the Asian emperors feel? hahaha.

The issue is generally one of how you manage the relationships. We in the west have a notion of equality that sometimes borders on the absurb. I remember once a middle-class guy who was dating a rich friend of mine. This guy insisted on paying his share for the aviation fuel used in my friend's private plane. His eyes almost came out when he saw the bill. Obviously, he did not pay his share and my friend let him off politely.

So, if you are in Thailand and are a bit uneasy about being seen as the perennial walking ATM, then just keep thinking of the movie "godfather." As long as the other side knows that this is not just purely out of the goodness of your heart, then it will be fine.

I think too much.

It's a tricky one indeed. I assume the friendship is non sexual and that the guy(s) you spent time with enjoyed your company, free drinks, entertainment, food etc. I had the same dilemma and still find it hard to resolve in my own mind. However, what I have done in practice (looking back) seems to be that if the guy is a money boy, bar boy, host in a bar etc, and I have asked him to spend time with me at say Karaoke, a night of drinking, listening to live music etc, I do tend to give a tip at the end of the night before we go our separate ways. Afterall, he has a living to make and by being with me he is not earning - he can always refuse but never does.

As for the non bar boy (usually friend of a friend or waiter or coffee shop guy who likes to chat and comes out for a drink) I tend to see how it goes. Sometimes I will give them a tip at the end of the night and sometimes I will not, it depends what kind of vibe I get from the guy. I did used to worry about offering a tip to a guy who is not a money boy because I feared they would be insulted but I can honestly say when I have offered a tip, it has never been refused and it has always been accepted gratefully.

This doesn't help at all and has left me confused as to why sometimes I offer a tip and sometimes don't!

[Surfcrest]

However, what I have done in practice (looking back) seems to be that if the guy is a money boy, bar boy, host in a bar etc, and I have asked him to spend time with me at say Karaoke, a night of drinking, listening to live music etc, I do tend to give a tip at the end of the night before we go our separate ways. Afterall, he has a living to make and by being with me he is not earning - he can always refuse but never does.


This surely is the right thing to do.

This year I made the mistake of taking two of the waiters two of the boys and two of the ladyboys out to J.J. Pub for a late night of dancing / drinking.
The cost included the off-fee plus the 500 baht tip each for the night.
An expensive night for Thai standards but a pleasant memory for life.

Surfcrest