The return

[arsenal]

The Thaksinistas are back and within time HE will return. Thaksin is to the Thai Monarchy what Abraham Lincoln was to slavery. Change is coming to Thailand. It remains to be seen if this change comes peacefully or not. The establishment verses the people.
The days of feudal, rigididly hierarchical nations is coming to an end.

[Narakmak]

True believers. So tedious.
Especially fans of Thaksin. Pitiful.

[Thai Dyed]

True believers. So tedious.
Especially fans of Thaksin. Pitiful.

You don't mean to imply that he was a pimp, do you, Narakmak? Tsk, tsk.

Here, Narakmak, Yingluck Shinawatra has a beautiful red rose for you:
[attachment=0:dt52zp4w]Yingluck Shinawatra.jpg[/attachment:dt52zp4w]

[Narakmak]

She's not a pimp. More like the other thing. Family biz, don't you know?

[Smiles]

" ... The days of feudal, rigididly hierarchical nations is coming to an end ... "
Written by a man who hasn't a clue about Thai people, Thai institutions, and general 'Thai-ness'.
Western arrogance is so refreshing.

[luvthai-2]

He may return but the Generals will not take this lying down. If he returns look for aa coup and him being arrested.

The days of feudal, rigididly hierarchical nations is coming to an end.

As Smiles has pointed out you know nothing about Thailand and how it works.

[arsenal]

Smiles, Combat....Yin and Yang...very funny, I like it.

Ok. So instead of wot i writ (forgive my spelling but i no nuffing bout nuffing as you too fine gents pointed out) How do you see the next couple of years unfolding? You know what I think so give us all the benefit of the knowledge you both have.

[Khor tose]

Smiles, Combat....Yin and Yang...very funny, I like it.

Ok. So instead of wot i writ (forgive my spelling but i no nuffing bout nuffing as you too fine gents pointed out) How do you see the next couple of years unfolding? You know what I think so give us all the benefit of the knowledge you both have.

You really don't think they are going to answer you do you? They have been wrong about the whole Thaksin issue from the start. The last thing they want to do is go on record and have it bite them in the ass.
Khon Kean went overwhelmingly for Thaksin which shows how in touch combat is, and Smiles lives in Hua Hin and is still hoping the King will stop by on his next trip to his 8th Palace.
I get a kick out of all the posters, not Smiles or Combat, who told us how the people of Bangkok hated the red shirts. They won more votes this time then in 2001 and 2005. Funny how the exit polls showed them wining about ten extra seats over what they won in Bangkok, but the results were different. The only place in Thailand where the exit polls did not agree with the resuilts. Up to 40% off. Funny right. :dontknow:
Yes, Smiles thing will be different as these are not the same people.

You really don't think they are going to answer you do you? They have been wrong about the whole Thaksin issue from the start. The last thing they want to do is go on record and have it bite them in the ass.
Khon Kean went overwhelmingly for Thaksin which shows how in touch combat is, and Smiles lives in Hua Hin and is still hoping the King will stop by on his next trip to his 8th Palace.

Quote me! I personally don't like Thaksin which was confirm to me when he justified the murder of all those thousand during his so called drug clean up back in 2003. I have never said that his party or a party tied to him would not win an election. Again you are shooting from the hip.

[arsenal]

Combat.
Don't start a fight with someone else to avoid answering my question. I asked you how you see the next couple of years unfolding. I presume that you are capable of writing a few lines of general academic discourse about a political system that is virtually in it's own category. Aren't you?

Combat.
Don't start a fight with someone else to avoid answering my question. I asked you how you see the next couple of years unfolding. I presume that you are capable of writing a few lines of general academic discourse about a political system that is virtually in it's own category. Aren't you?

One word "Trouble" the opposing forces in Thailand will not take change laying down as they have far too much vested interest to do so. And once 'you know who' dies, depending who succeeds him then everything will change again either for the better or the worst. Thaksins sister has a chance to do something, but if she concentrates on clearing her brother of all corruption charges rather than sorting out Thailands problems then she is no better than those that she has followed.

BTW It is not I who is starting a fight, Khor tose made a statement but as usual can not back it up with quotes, and you have made a comment about feudal, rigididly hierarchical nations coming to an end,which considering Thailands history is rather a lame comment. Everything might eventually come to an end, but how long is the piece of string?

[arsenal]

Combat

Thankyou. That's all I wanted. You may well be right, none of us can know what the future will bring. I just happen to believe that those people who voted for his sister were really voting for him in full knowledge of what that vote meant. I also think that the reason the establishment is so fearful of him is precisely because they know that there is a groundswell of support for him and what he stands for.
But it's just my opinion.

[Khor tose]

Combat.


BTW It is not I who is starting a fight, Khor tose made a statement but as usual can not back it up with quotes, and you have made a comment about feudal, rigididly hierarchical nations coming to an end,which considering Thailands history is rather a lame comment.

Actually, if you read the condensed article by Andrew Marshall that arsenal cited you would see that this is his thoughts not mine. However, I do agree with everything he has said. He only over 17 years experience reporting on Thailand for one of the world's major news agencies. By the way, I don't like Thaksin anymore then you do for the drug war he started. It not only resulted in over a thousand people killed but lead to an increase in drug use in Thailand. Drug wars are always counter productive.

It not only resulted in over a thousand people killed

I think you will find the figure was closer to 3,000 including young children and old people, all carried out over a period of a few months.

[Smiles]

Ok. So instead of wot i writ (forgive my spelling but i no nuffing bout nuffing as you too fine gents pointed out) How do you see the next couple of years unfolding? OK, I'll bite.
I have no idea what will happen in the ~ as you say ~ next couple of years: except that this pie-in-the-sky will not:

The Thaksinistas are back and within time HE will return. Thaksin is to the Thai Monarchy what Abraham Lincoln was to slavery. Change is coming to Thailand. It remains to be seen if this change comes peacefully or not. The establishment verses the people.
The days of feudal, rigididly hierarchical nations is coming to an end.
You and Khor Tose are approaching the present scenario from the point of view of your own rather sophomoric ideology(s) ... the only point of agreement (I presume) would be that both our outlooks are ~ like Mexican food ~ simply opinions. Obviously neither you two (as KT seems to think in the Siamese Twin mode: me and My Man Combat) can let go of the 'American' prescription for all that ails a country . . . i.e. a thorough dose of good old Democracy, preferably like us.

Khor Tose says I've "been wrong about Thaksin from the start'. Bullshit.
The main (and only) points I've made over the last few years about Mr Thaksin is that he financed the Red Shirt protests last year in Bangkok; that he completely controls the Phuea Thai Party; and that he will do anything to get back to Thailand (happily skipping right by the Courts and the jail house of course), never mind the consequences for the country. I'll happily stick to those few observations ... in the main because I believe them to be true.

The election results have been pretty predictable for a long time now. I'm not disappointed in the results, as neither would I have been disappointed in the election of the Democrats. And why?: because election results in Thailand mean squat . . . all of the parties share an over-arching mediocrity, none give a tinkers damn about the Thai people, and whichever party wins an election it always and inevitably slides fast down that slippery slope towards that lustrous goal of what REALLY matters in Thai politics: I.E. Power (above all), status, face, money (the fun way, under the table), stealing the Thai people blind, an institutionalized and generalized corruption, and never ending buffets.
This description holds true for the Democrats, Phuea Thai, and The Rest of Them . . . and it certainly holds true ~ I know you can't/won't believe this, being stuck in the ideology ~ for the Red Shirt Boys & Girls as well (see for instance: Mr Jatuporn, whose love of buffets and meglamaniacal speechifyin' are blatantly obvious, around the gut and the ever-sore throat).

Some interesting ~ but hardly exhaustive ~ possible scenarios:

Madame Shinawatra will govern as a puppet, taking orders from The Man, try to get him back as quickly as possible (the hell with the harm it does for the country) and will succeed. The army will do nothing. Everyone will hold the fingers crossed, and their noses closed.[/*:m:14w2v6c5]
Madame Shinawatra will govern as a puppet, taking orders from The Man, try to get him back as quickly as possible (the hell with the harm it does for the country) and will succeed. The army will soon thereafter stage a coup, citing the same reasons as the last one.[/*:m:14w2v6c5]
Madame Shinawatra will refuse to have anything to do with expatriating her beloved brother, and will rule with her own conscientious ... for the good of the country. Once realizing the scope of such a disaster, the Phuea Thai Party will immediately conspire to get rid of her. The Man will approve such a coup (yep, a coup!) and grant the leadership to someone (a man!) more amenable. The army will watch and wait.[/*:m:14w2v6c5]
The newly appointed-one will go to #1 or #2 above.[/*:m:14w2v6c5]
The army will stage a coup. Sooner or later.[/*:m:14w2v6c5]

This being Thailand and it's cesspool politics, there are of course a dozen (if not more) scenarios which might or might not happen. As said above, I know not which one, or which combination of the dozen(s) will take place.
But whatever the near (and far) outcome will be, it will assuredly have absolutely nothing to do with the Thai population (including your beloved Red Shirts) crying, striving, yearning, fighting, blubbering for the overthrow of the existing system (pick a name: call it Feudalism, Authoritarianism, Elitist Paternalism, a Police/Army State, whatever turns your crank ... it is all those things and more) and replacing it with the shining utopia of the Golden Age of Democracy ... as in, that Big Fat Happy One, across the Pacific.

[arsenal]

Thank you Smiles.
It's not biting, it's a discussion.

You too may well be right.
I still think the establishment are terrified of Thaksin. A man who whether we like it or not appeals to huge numbers of Thais, wants to make constitutional changes and has the money to gain the power to do so. They voted for him, they voted for his sister.
I think it unlikely he will return before the big expected event, the coup that ousted him was all but sanctioned. However afterwards is a different matter. The new man will not have the status of a deity. The Thais as a nation give every impression that they are ready to move forward and sooner or later they will.
But it's all conjecture.

[Khor tose]

Ok. So instead of wot i writ (forgive my spelling but i no nuffing bout nuffing as you too fine gents pointed out) How do you see the next couple of years unfolding? OK, I'll bite.
I have no idea what will happen in the ~ as you say ~ next couple of years: except that this pie-in-the-sky will not:

The Thaksinistas are back and within time HE will return. Thaksin is to the Thai Monarchy what Abraham Lincoln was to slavery. Change is coming to Thailand. It remains to be seen if this change comes peacefully or not. The establishment verses the people.
The days of feudal, rigididly hierarchical nations is coming to an end.
You and Khor Tose are approaching the present scenario from the point of view of your own rather sophomoric ideology(s) ... the ly point of agreement (I presume) would be that both our outlooks are ~ like Mexican food ~ simply opinions.
Obviously neither you two (as KT seems to think in the Siamese Twin mode: me and My Man Combat) can let go of the 'American' prescription for all that ails a country . . . i.e. a thorough dose of good old Democracy, preferably like us.

Excuse me, but you quote Arsenal and then say that is our opinion. Well I don't know if that is combats opinion or not, but actually it is mine and it is Andrew Marshall's who Arsenal quoted. Let me quess this 17 years Thailand specialist news Veteran for one of the two most prestigious news agencies in the world is just a hack who knows nothing about Thailand. The end of the feudal system quote has been echoed by the NYT, The Economist, The Gaurdian and other news sources also. It is the subject of much of Marshall's report and the wiki leak cables from the Thai people in power to the American Ambassador. Yes, it is an Opinion but it has a far sounder basis for fact then your cynical opinion of Thailand and your dismissal of the landslide vote for PT.


Khor Tose says I've "been wrong about Thaksin from the start'. Bullshit.
The main (and only) points I've made over the last few years about Mr Thaksin is that he financed the Red Shirt protests last year in Bangkok; that he completely controls the Phuea Thai Party; and that he will do anything to get back to Thailand (happily skipping right by the Courts and the jail house of course), never mind the consequences for the country. I'll happily stick to those few observations ... in the main because I believe them to be true.

Well I don't like him a lot either for some of the reasons mentioned above. However, you are concentrating on the man and ignoring the message. He did bring change to the poor people of Thailand. Something that had never been done before, and was certainly not done in the last 5 years by the Generals and their party. He not only made their life better, but he started to clean up the cesspool that Thailand had become by regulating everything from social drugs, to the sex industry. I really oppose his war on drug and the consequences, but in that he was no worse then what we have done in the USA. Much of the ex-pat resistance to him I am sure has to do with his attempt to clean up the sex industry. By the way, this is not an accusation against you. I know better. As to him being a crook, I am sure you are correct. However, the men prosecuting him were doing some of the same things, they appointed the judges, and threw in some charges that were garbage. They made such a farce of his trail that no country has really tried to extradite him back to Thailand knowing he would appeal the extradition and probably win. The fact that they let him go should be enough prove that they knew this was just a quid pro quo. Leave be quite and you will get your money back. I am sure if he had been quite they would have given it back. As to him financing the red shirt protest in Bangkok last year, where is your proof. All of the Democrats commissions found no such link. In fact they seize funds from several corporations who they tried to blame. Yes, it is your OPINION but has not been established as fact, and believe me the democrats did try to prove it. Furthermore if you think the protestors in Bangkok where willing to die for 500 baht then you far more cynical then I am. I think the landslide victory alone would have told you that there is a real people power movement in Thailand, and not just some people thinking with a sophomoric outlook on Thailand. By the way cutting down an opinion with those terms is kind of sophomoric, don't you think?


The election results have been pretty predictable for a long time now. I'm not disappointed in the results, as neither would I have been disappointed in the election of the Democrats. And why?: because election results in Thailand mean squat . . . all of the parties share an over-arching mediocrity, none give a tinkers damn about the Thai people, and whichever party wins an election it always and inevitably slides fast down that slippery slope towards that lustrous goal of what REALLY matters in Thai politics: I.E. Power (above all), status, face, money (the fun way, under the table), stealing the Thai people blind, an institutionalized and generalized corruption, and never ending buffets.

So if this were true, why the landslide victory for the PT party. You know better then millions of Thais. Let me guess you said you really did not care who won, but the PT party is just composed of ignorant farmers who are fooled by the Thaksins. That opinion and outlook makes you no different then the Generals and others who have been regulating this country. Whether you know it or not you are a member of the Democratic party if you take that view. If you came up North here you will find that many red shirts are educated middle class people who want a better life and not ignorant farmers, fooled by the Thaksins.



Madame Shinawatra will govern as a puppet, taking orders from The Man, try to get him back as quickly as possible (the hell with the harm it does for the country) and will succeed. The army will do nothing. Everyone will hold the fingers crossed, and their noses closed.[/*:m:2zt80s8v]
Madame Shinawatra will govern as a puppet, taking orders from The Man, try to get him back as quickly as possible (the hell with the harm it does for the country) and will succeed. The army will soon thereafter stage a coup, citing the same reasons as the last one.[/*:m:2zt80s8v]
Madame Shinawatra will refuse to have anything to do with expatriating her beloved brother, and will rule with her own conscientious ... for the good of the country. Once realizing the scope of such a disaster, the Phuea Thai Party will immediately conspire to get rid of her. The Man will approve such a coup (yep, a coup!) and grant the leadership to someone (a man!) more amenable. The army will watch and wait.[/*:m:2zt80s8v]
The newly appointed-one will go to #1 or #2 above.[/*:m:2zt80s8v]
The army will stage a coup. Sooner or later.[/*:m:2zt80s8v]

This being Thailand and it's cesspool politics, there are of course a dozen (if not more) scenarios which might or might not happen. As said above, I know not which one, or which combination of the dozen(s) will take place.
But whatever the near (and far) outcome will be, it will assuredly have absolutely nothing to do with the Thai population (including your beloved Red Shirts) crying, striving, yearning, fighting, blubbering for the overthrow of the existing system (pick a name: call it Feudalism, Authoritarianism, Elitist Paternalism, a Police/Army State, whatever turns your crank ... it is all those things and more) and replacing it with the shining utopia of the Golden Age of Democracy ... as in, that Big Fat Happy One, across the Pacific.

I am going to change your name to Mr. Cynical. Your smile must be a sardonic one. My scenario Madam Thaksin will govern will the help and advice of her brother and conditions for the poor and middle class will improve provided the generals and those who govern allow it. If not, then total stagnation and maybe civil war.

[Smiles]

My scenario Madam Thaksin will govern will the help and advice of her brother and conditions for the poor and middle class will improve provided the generals and those who govern allow it. If not, then total stagnation and maybe civil war.
Well wrong again. Thailand will continue, gradually improving (though not necessarily in the western sense), moving back some steps, improving slightly again (hopefully not in the western sense), at it's own pace, within it's own definitions ... etc etc etc.
Fortunately, your particular dreams ~ for that is what they are ~ are irrelevant.

" ... I am going to change your name to Mr. Cynical... "
Be my guest. In the case of the Thai political scene, I think that 'cynical' may well trump 'delusional' at every conceivable turn.

[Khor tose]

Be my guest. In the case of the Thai political scene, I think that 'cynical' may well trump 'delusional' at every conceivable turn.

Fine we are both on record. However, even if I am wrong my delusion is shared by many people like Marshall more familiar with this country then either one of us, and 15.7 million Thai voters (Not forgetting that 2 million possible PT ballots were marked incorrectly which would have given them 55% of the vote instead of 48.7%.)

By the way, "Not The Nation" has a great article that agrees with your views and you may want to post it here.

[arsenal]

I would just like to point out that nothing I have written is quoting or agreeing with anyone. I have never heard of this Marshall. These are my own thoughts and opinions based partly on what has happened in Thailand over the last few years but more strongly on my knowledge of how Nations move from old systems to become more egalitarian societies.

[Khor tose]

I would just like to point out that nothing I have written is quoting or agreeing with anyone. I have never heard of this Marshall. These are my own thoughts and opinions based partly on what has happened in Thailand over the last few years but more strongly on my knowledge of how Nations move from old systems to become more egalitarian societies.

Whoops, you are right and I am sorry. The citations were from Andrew on another thread and I forgot they came from Andrew and thought Arsenal, especially since what Andrew Marshall is talking about is the end of the Monarchy and the succession. Mia Culpa, I truly did not mean to put words in your mouth. However, I would recommend you do read this article and if interested read the long version.


{Remember the rules re The Monarchy on this board - jinks}

[krobbie]

While you guys have your political push and shove )I'm with smiles, as ever), I am still trying to figure out what "rigididly" means. Perhaps the OP can enlighten me?

I truly did not mean to put words in your mouth.

Are you sure?


They (combat and smiles) have been wrong about the whole Thaksin issue from the start. The last thing they (combat and smiles) want to do is go on record and have it bite them in the ass.

Seeing as you seem to have based some of your views on articles written by others I am still waiting for you to quote me on your previous outburst about being wrong about the whole Thaksin issue from the start, and perhaps you could also explain why it is the last thing that I/we want is to go on record and have it bite us in the ass?

Oh and like krobbie I am in agreement with what smiles has written, but unlike you I am not going to belittle you just because you hold a different perspective.

[Beachlover]

One possible scenario is what I call the "Second Chance Scenario". This is where Thaksin will be allowed to return or rule via his sister and will tread more carefully.

This time the Shinawatras will be more tactful and avoid putting off the "powerful people" (e.g. Army) too much. The mistake he made last time was pissing off too many powerful people to fast, especially the Army. The Shinawatras might consider this election win to be a "second chance" to come back and have another go at ruling without pissing people off to the point where they stage a coup to oust him.


The days of feudal, rigididly hierarchical nations is coming to an end.
As lovely as that would be, I think you're being overly optimistic if you think that's going to happen with a wave of a wand now. The election result is just one stepping stone towards that and fuck knows if this stepping stone will lead in the right direction.

[Beachlover]

You really don't think they are going to answer you do you? They have been wrong about the whole Thaksin issue from the start. The last thing they want to do is go on record and have it bite them in the ass.
What the f*ck have they said about Thaksin that was wrong? Any quotes? Or are you talking out of your oversized arse as usual?


Khon Kean went overwhelmingly for Thaksin which shows how in touch combat is
What the f*ck does Combat have to do with Khon Kaen? (Spell it right you dumb fuckstick)


Actually, if you read the condensed article by ***** ****** I do agree with everything he has said. He only over 17 years experience reporting on Thailand...
Firstly, thank f*ck Jinks jumped on to remove some of those links.

Which dumb fuck was stupid enough to post them in the first place? Do you want this site completely blocked in Thailand?

Secondly, for someone apparently living in Thailand and reliant on this country for a comfortable retirement, your stupidity takes my breath away, KT.

Have you taken legal advice? The article you referred (and possibly linked) to is lese majeste material. You've just declared your full agreement with everything it says.

You do realise that if the government was reading this, discovered your comments and then tracked you down (not terribly difficult, considering you're a reasonably well known person amongst many farangs on these forums and you are open about your city of residence) your entire future in Thailand could be well and truly f*cked?

I mean, this dream of retiring in a bubble where you get to fuck a live-in prostitute young enough to be your grandchild could be gone down the toilet. You might have to do that in some other poor third-world country.

I'm not 100% certain about this, which is why I say "could" instead of "would" but unless I had taken legal advice on it I wouldn't be chancing it...

For the record, I neither support or oppose that law. I simply respect it as being part of the law in Thailand, a country I enjoy visiting.

Khor tose the silence is deafening, any more accusations?

[Khor tose]

Firstly, thank f*ck Jinks jumped on to remove some of those links.
Which dumb fuck was stupid enough to post them in the first place? Do you want this site completely blocked in Thailand?
Secondly, for someone apparently living in Thailand and reliant on this country for a comfortable retirement, your stupidity takes my breath away, KT.
Have you taken legal advice? The article you referred (and possibly linked) to is lese majeste material. You've just declared your full agreement with everything it says.
You do realise that if the government was reading this, discovered your comments and then tracked you down (not terribly difficult, considering you're a reasonably well known person amongst many farangs on these forums and you are open about your city of residence) your entire future in Thailand could be well and truly f*cked?
I mean, this dream of retiring in a bubble where you get to fuck a live-in prostitute young enough to be your grandchild could be gone down the toilet. You might have to do that in some other poor third-world country.
I'm not 100% certain about this, which is why I say "could" instead of "would" but unless I had taken legal advice on it I wouldn't be chancing it...
For the record, I neither support or oppose that law. I simply respect it as being part of the law in Thailand, a country I enjoy visiting.

Jinks removed nothing and these links are posted on every single web site concerning Thailand. (Oh that is right, I forgot you have been tossed off of most of them.) Combat I insulted no one or belittled no one, However just so I don't disappoint you allow me to mention that you are as big an idiot as Beachlover is.

[arsenal]

Beachlover.
I also said that it remains to be seen if it happens peacefully or not. One can only hope.

[Beachlover]

Khor tose the silence is deafening, any more accusations?
Got to be patient and understanding, Combat.

First, Khor Tose needs to haul his lard-filled arse out of bed and establish some stability on his overloaded legs. Ever tried to balance a 100kg+ pig on a tripod? Then he's got to wobble over to his PC and fire up his mediocre, logic-challenged brain.

But all that effort to get a vehicle to the start line won't lead to shit if the driver's a demented moron. So he'll still end up accusing you of saying something you didn't say or attributing someone else's comments to you. Must be tough being a dopey dumb arse. :rolling:

You should also understand Khor Tose won't come up with any proof of what he claims you said above. He's too dishonest and lacking in integrity to admit he made a mistake and apologise to you. No, wait, let's give him a break and just put that down to him being an incapable dumb f*ck dope too. :rolling:


I also said that it remains to be seen if it happens peacefully or not. One can only hope.
Sure and I agree that a lot is uncertain. No one can predict what will happen for sure.

... No one can predict what will happen for sure.

I disagree.

Some posts on SGT are extremely easy to predict.

:rolling:

[Smiles]

deleted . . . by reasons of miscommunication.

Combat I insulted no one or belittled no one, However just so I don't disappoint you allow me to mention that you are as big an idiot as Beachlover is.

Your original accusations of which I previously quoted went unanswered as you could not substantiate them. Because of that you have to revert to childish playground insults which I actually find rather amusing, and I am certainly not going to go down your road as you have now proved it to me yourself without the need for me to do so for you.

[Beachlover]

Some posts on SGT are extremely easy to predict.
Fuckstick. :occasion9:

[lonelywombat]

Fuckstick!!! Why do I always think it is a lesbian talking when you use that word. It is non a mans word more a word used by a man hater.

[Beachlover]

Yesterday, I was a prostitute. Today, I'm a lesbian. Can I be Josef Fritzl tomorrow? :rolling:

Lonely, would you care to explain why that word is "non a mans word" and "a word used by a man hater" exclusively? I've heard plenty of guys use that word, but never a woman.
By the way, you're contributing to the "abuse" and "banter" which you keep complaining about. :hello1:

[krobbie]

Guys, you don't think we have strayed a bit far from the topic of the thread do you?