What is missing in Gay Thailand... It just came to me...

[bucknaway]

I was looking at some of the pictures of Pattaya and was thinking of some of the things I would like to do there, but no one is there to make it happen. I then realized just what a goldmine Pattaya would be to a Philadelphia type event promoter.

I have a friend in Philadelphia who makes his living by putting together events for the gay community. When he is not putting together events in many different bars in Philly, he is hosting bus trips to NYC, Washington DC or Baltimore for a night or a weekend of gay fun. Or he enlists the co-operation of many bars and hotels and will host a weekend in Atlanta, Hawaii, or Puerto Rico during a holiday weekend. Often during one of the gay pride weekends held in that city or island.

I imagine that if he were in Thailand he would be putting together AWSOME beach parties with music, dancing, drinks and a tent of gogo guys if he could get away with it. And if he could not work out arrangements with a hotel at the event sight, he would find one willing and also arrange free transportation to and from the event site to the hotel.

And if no hotel would co-operate than I imagine he would try to find a island where he could put up tents if he had to.

YEAH... Thailand needs a gay event organizer/promoter.... :occasion9:

[lonelywombat]

I doubt there are farangs with the money or younger Thais that can afford the money to pay for these parties. But you have raised the question as to what will attract young farang gays to Pattaya. There is nothing really to make it stand out.


I posted following to the boxing thread. This thread will probably last longer so cut and pasted here.I doubt the nakedness implied in the press reports of the show, will be full frontal.
posting.php?mode=quote&f=9&p=223862 (http://www.sawatdee-gay-thailand.com/forum/posting.php?mode=quote&f=9&p=223862)






Has anyone ever been to a venue where they had nude Thai boxing?
You mean like the "put on" boxing rubbish they have in the bar halls? Or real nude boxing? ...I wish!!



Quite a few years back, there was an expat who used to have parties at his house in Pattaya, that featured nude wrestling by Thai boys. I believe he was quite generous with cash prizes plus the contest winner having his choice of the boys to fuck, or smoke him. From memory 2000 baht entry and free drinks.

There was betting on the side and a lot of competition amongst the guests to get boys for some bedroom wrestling later in the evening.

I can recall some parties where the boys played strip poker, with the loser having to JO or more. There also were "slave" auction parties where the boys put themselves up for the highest bidder. Stunning boys and a lot of money changed hands. Those slave parties were in BKK, wrestling and poker in Pattaya.

Would certainly be more interesting than some of the "hot" shows I have seen in recent years.

[netrix]

yea great idea, but you're posting it in the wrong place. this forum is the
wrong crowd for that scene. most posters here are completely unaware
that there's an entire gay community in thailand outside of the gogo bar scene.
they assume all gays in thailand are femmy little 19 yr olds from issan
and live in huts with dirt floors and chickens in the house.

.....they assume all gays in thailand are femmy little 19 yr olds from issan
and live in huts with dirt floors and chickens in the house.

Ridiculous comment

- we know some are only 18.

:occasion9:

[Beachlover]

you have raised the question as to what will attract young farang gays to Pattaya. There is nothing really to make it stand out.
Lonely, most younger foreigners aren't attracted by Pattaya's dominant commercial sex scene. In fact, it can be a turn off.

The kind of sleazy prostitute-oriented venues you seem keen to promote like Boyztown and Sunee just don't have anything for most of the younger crowd. If I brought any of my gay friends there they'd be bored and disgusted. If I brought any of my straight mates to Walking Street most would be disgusted too.

What advantages Pattaya DOES have to attract younger people currently is...

(1) Connectivity - quick and easy to get to thanks to its proximity to Bangkok

(2) Value - accommodation and amenities are cheaper and more plentiful than Phuket/Samui

(3) Beach - compared to Phuket/Samui/Krabi it's sh*t but still something...

(4) Existing scale and size to its development - There's already plenty of life and it doesn't need to be built up as other up and coming destinations like Krabi need to be.

To attract a younger gay crowd (and similarly for younger straight crowd) it would need to develop the right mix of selling points. It doesn't have any "natural beauty" to compete with Phuket/Krabi/Samui but it could develop a reputation as a more urban beach "party town" for younger people. At the moment its reputation as a "party town" is more oriented towards older gays in the prostitute scene.

I don't know if Pattaya should bother attracting younger people but if it did, some things it could consider doing are...

(1) Partition the more sleazy commercial sex stuff to specific zones in Pattaya to give the non sex oriented nightlife room to breath. For example it could develop the Jomtien side of Pattaya into a younger and more hip and trendy area, free of commercial sex bars. The same needs to be done if they're to attract families.

(2) Innovate to make the place more hip and trendy... set up late night bars and nightclubs on the beach for young backpackers to party (e.g. like the Full Moon Party)... attract trendy venues like a Ministry of Sound nightclub... attract regular and once-off events to appeal to the younger crowd, like the gCircuit dance parties.

Anyway, Pattaya's brand is so synonymous with sex and prostitution and this kind of transformation takes decades to do (unless you're Singapore or Dubai). It'll be interesting to see if Pattaya has made some in-roads to attract a different crowd (e.g. families or young backpackers) in addition to the current sex crowd 5-10 years from now.

I can recall some parties where the boys played strip poker, with the loser having to JO or more. There also were "slave" auction parties where the boys put themselves up for the highest bidder. Stunning boys and a lot of money changed hands. Those slave parties were in BKK, wrestling and poker in Pattaya.(quote)Lonley Wombat


Christ, sounds great, I would have enjoyed it in my teens let alone now!

[Patexpat]

It'll be interesting to see if Pattaya has made some in-roads to attract a different crowd (e.g. families or young backpackers) in addition to the current sex crowd 5-10 years from now.

Anyone with their fingers on the pulse can see this is happening NOW, not in 5 or 10 years ... the new breed of tourists have very little in common with the sex tourists of old - although of course there are still many of those, but not the same as before. The successful businesses are the ones that are moving with times, not hanging on to 'tried and tested' and now failed - business practices!

Anyone with their fingers on the pulse can see this is happening NOW, not in 5 or 10 years ... the new breed of tourists have very little in common with the sex tourists of old - although of course there are still many of those, but not the same as before. The successful businesses are the ones that are moving with times, not hanging on to 'tried and tested' and now failed - business practices!(quote)Patexpat

Can you give any examples?

[quote="Beachlover"] it would need to develop the right mix of selling points. It doesn't have any "natural beauty" to compete with Phuket/Krabi/Samui



Not since I fet anyway!................ :laughing3: :laughing3: :laughing3: :laughing3:

[sing_lofty_sing]

No matter what type of change you made to attract the younger Gay party goer sooner or latter you would find the venues attracting the young Russian crowd with GF or wife and brats in tow. With the 1 bottle of Leo beer for 3 to share. And then the loutish idiots you can see in most European resorts on the Med. Sorry it was a good idea but i think Pattaya would be best left to the Old ferang and his gogo Sweetie's. Both gAY AND sTR8.

Just give people what they want .... unadulterated sex!.......If the right mix of bar girls attracts many young guys why can't the right mix of bar guys attract a young clientele? Maybe just except that the current locations are tired and need to open somewhere else!

Just give people what they want .... unadulterated sex!.......If the right mix of bar girls attracts many young guys why can't the right mix of bar guys attract a young clientele? Maybe just except that the current locations are tired and need to open somewhere else!


Hi,

It has been getting said for years and years by owners who have been in Pattaya a long time that as the older gay clientele were dying off they were not being replaced by more Westerners coming through, It seems it is now coming to fruition.

Facts are younger gay guys are not interested in paying for sex at all, The World has changed with the drug scene is part of everyday night time culture across all developed Countries, hence the populatity of the full moon parites etc.

Pattaya has expanded too fast for the people using the place and add up the bars now to what you had in early nineties or late eighties.

Thailand has become more wealthy and affluent and there are a lot more jobs for the Thais, even unskilled for them to do.

Add to the mix a recession, global melt, political problems in the Country, corruption out of control as it is a non elected puppet prime minister and a military regime, are you surprised it is not what it was.

Even if it reinvents itself, the golden era may be over as we all knew it. That will mean those of you who continue going will have to adapt to the Russian crowds etc or look elsewhere for your holiday destination fun.

...That will mean those of you who continue going will have to adapt to the Russian crowds etc or look elsewhere for your holiday destination fun.

Absolutely correct summary of the situation.

However, I feel I will be here until the last drag queen pops her clogs, as I cannot see a better offer on the immediate horizon.

:laughing3:

...That will mean those of you who continue going will have to adapt to the Russian crowds etc or look elsewhere for your holiday destination fun.

Absolutely correct summary of the situation.

However, I feel I will be here until the last drag queen pops her clogs, as I cannot see a better offer on the immediate horizon.

:laughing3:

Well,

If it has done anything at all for me by what happened to me,it has kicked me up the arse to go and get out and explore new places that I would not have done had I stll been sat in Pattaya.

Look for the pluses in life, eh?... :alc:

You make some very good points Bucky,but I doubt whether the current gay bar owners have the motivation or even the interest to do anything to add excitement,and I am talking about the whole of the gay Pattaya business community not just in Boyztown.

As for putting on parties count me in,I love having fun and listening to music,however whether the current gay clientele are interested in this is another thing.(Many of them are younger than me but constantly complain about music being too loud in bars,yet lived through the headbanging period of the 60s and 70s).I think many of them want to feel old.
A many times I attended the Le Cafe Royal late in the evening to listen to the lovely singing by Toi,and I was the only customer.



I didn't enjoy my last visit to Pattaya,and I am a frequent visitor of around 2-3 times per year.
I may perhaps leave a 12 month break in between visits this time,but I think this really comes down to the responsibility of the present gay business owners.

Maybe I am just an old fart,and many of you will disagree, but bring me back the old days anytime ..........the days when we actually all got together to have fun and we didn't worry if the music was too loud! :occasion9:

[lonelywombat]

you have raised the question as to what will attract young farang gays to Pattaya. There is nothing really to make it stand out.
Lonely, most younger foreigners aren't attracted by Pattaya's dominant commercial sex scene. In fact, it can be a turn off.

The kind of sleazy prostitute-oriented venues you seem keen to promote like Boyztown and Sunee just don't have anything for most of the younger crowd. If I brought any of my gay friends there they'd be bored and disgusted. If I brought any of my straight mates to Walking Street most would be disgusted too.

What advantages Pattaya DOES have to attract younger people currently is...


From all reports the young straight male has not deserted Pattaya and the bars are just as busy as before. The big question is why straight males will come to Pattaya and other similar places but are staying away from Gay Pattaya. Surely there are straight versions of gayromeo. I know the straight sanuna scene is not as obvious, but it also does not attract a big following either from gays in Pattaya.

The sleazy prostitite oriented venues that disgust you are the prime reason people come to this forum. if it disgusts you that much why bother hanging around. You are not going to change things.

Your comment about backpackers does have merit. Some of the places rented to Thai boys could be converted to backpacker both gay and straight, which could brigten up the beer bars at Jomtien and Sunee. I doubt if anybody in Boyztown 1,2 3 could be bothered getting off the ars to try it out.

[bucknaway]

The gay scene in Pattaya for the most part is a "Sit and watch" type of scene and that is geared towards the elderly and those who have little tolerance for the heat. A younger crowd want to move, dance and be active. That is why many will follow the Sonkran festivities from province to province. Remember what it was like to be young and full of energy? I remember being a young dude and Driving to DC one early spring with a friend. We had just enough money for gas, tolls dance club entry and a drink or two. When the bar closed we slept in the car and drove to the Baltimore Inner Harbor to simply walk around and window shop before heading home. We enjoyed it so much that we did it as often as possible!

I imagine Thai guys are no different as they too just want to have fun and will be willing to spend the Baht if they thought the fun was worth it. If you can get the guys to attend the farang will follow because they want to go where the guys are and where the fun is.

I think it is a dam shame that the only place to dance and have fun near the boyztown area is the straight disco on walking street.

You are so right Bucky.It's mostly the "sit and watch" crowd,actually I get no pleasure in sitting and watching people walk by.
I was hoping that the next generation could somehow liven things up again but it seems the young enterpreuners are not willing to invest in the Pattaya Gay scene unlike the straight scene which has boomed with new enterprises and ideas.

I spoke to several young gay men on vacation in Pattaya and they didn't enjoy it,they were not interested in paid sex and 2 of them were heading back to Bangkok,the other a young professional Chinese guy was going to Phuket.


I was having dinner one night at one of those fabulous Thai all u can eat 109 baht places when next door I spotted a large sign "Dude Man Disco".
I asked the boy I was eating with about this place and according to him it was once a gay disco,but had closed down,this place was just off South Pattaya Rd,a 10 minute walk away from Tukcom.I wonder what happened there?

[pong]

I
YEAH... Thailand needs a gay event organizer/promoter.... :occasion:
No need-anyway, as you likely very well know, a farang cannot even do that job. But there are (already) Thai enough who do just that. Just find a nice Thai freind willing to translate, find one or more of those free give-away mags and see the shows, miss XYZ contests, special offers, mr. Beautiful or whatever parade etc. or those cruises for gay Singy's etc-the latest design beachwear included.
Dear BL from Ozzie dohn yundah: you took the wrong place for that-Samui might be more suitable. Though I think Bali would be far more attractive and closer by for the OZzie addicts, plus they even can speak OZzie style of incomprehensible english there and go surfing.

[Patexpat]

Anyone with their fingers on the pulse can see this is happening NOW, not in 5 or 10 years ... the new breed of tourists have very little in common with the sex tourists of old - although of course there are still many of those, but not the same as before. The successful businesses are the ones that are moving with times, not hanging on to 'tried and tested' and now failed - business practices!(quote)Patexpat

Can you give any examples?


As I live here, AND run a business, yes I can. Where do you want me to start? Chinese tourists? Russian? Korean? A demographic split of clients perhaps?

Anyone with their fingers on the pulse can see this is happening NOW, not in 5 or 10 years ... the new breed of tourists have very little in common with the sex tourists of old - although of course there are still many of those, but not the same as before. The successful businesses are the ones that are moving with times, not hanging on to 'tried and tested' and now failed - business practices!(quote)Patexpat

Can you give any examples?


As I live here, AND run a business, yes I can. Where do you want me to start? Chinese tourists? Russian? Korean? A demographic split of clients perhaps?



Thanks for the reply, I am interested in knowing what specific business have done to create a viable business model where so many others have failed.

I found the hetrosexual areas of Pattaya are booming,with many new investments in Go Go bars,whilst the Go Go bars in the gay scene have declined .
I also found the LadyBoy bars that operated far outside the gay areas were doing far better with customers than the gay bars in the gay areas.

<sorry, duplicate post>

Anyone with their fingers on the pulse can see this is happening NOW, not in 5 or 10 years ... the new breed of tourists have very little in common with the sex tourists of old - although of course there are still many of those, but not the same as before. The successful businesses are the ones that are moving with times, not hanging on to 'tried and tested' and now failed - business practices!(quote)Patexpat

Can you give any examples?

As I live here, AND run a business, yes I can. Where do you want me to start? Chinese tourists? Russian? Korean? A demographic split of clients perhaps?


Thanks for the reply, I am interested in knowing what specific business have done to create a viable business model where so many others have failed.


Pat?

Pat?


You'll know him by his Surname:

McGroin.

:occasion9:

I spoke to several young gay men on vacation in Pattaya and they didn't enjoy it,they were not interested in paid sex and 2 of them were heading back to Bangkok,the other a young professional Chinese guy was going to Phuket.


Great - all the more paid sex for those of us who choose sit on LCR terrace every day counting our liver spots and coughing up phlegm!

Let me tell you, young man, there is nothing worse in this world than emerging from Boyztown after a wonderful evening of world-class entertainment featuring Maisie Trollette, Davina Sparkles, Miss Falkirk, and Dolly John, to find that all the prostitutes have been taken off for free sex by these good looking asian teenagers/20somethings. My God it makes me mad!!! Fortunately, with the Alzheimer's, most of us have forgotten about it within 20 minutes anyway and we go back to talking about WW2.

As for your 2 friends who went off to BKK for free sex, good luck to them! According to one young whippersnapper who posts here, as soon as they hear his plane is touching down, the boys in BKK are lubing themselves up in order to give him free sex that night, so I guess your 2 friends will get their hole no bother at all.

But I fear your Chinese friend en route to Phuket will need to open his wallet as readily as he opens his legs to get any action there. Boys in Phuket make the Pattayan boys look like philanthropists.

Bah, Humbug

:occasion9:

[Beachlover]

it seems the young enterpreuners are not willing to invest in the Pattaya Gay scene...
Gay businesses in Pattaya are dominated by and focused on the commercial sex scene. If you go to Siem Reap (Cambodia), you'll see a heap of gay entrepreneurs who've creatively developed some fantastic hospitality/entertainment businesses outside the commercial sex scene... There are some really nice bars, restaurants, hotels, spas and such founded by gay entrepreneurs there. This kind of thing may attract a younger gay audience... and by "young" I'm not just talking about gays in their 20s only.


The sleazy prostitite oriented venues that disgust you are the prime reason people come to this forum. if it disgusts you that much why bother hanging around.
I was talking about my friends. I didn't say it all disgusts me. I'm a little more open minded to the commercial sex scene than most young gay guys I know.


You are not going to change things.
True. But isn't your long-running interest in discussing how to "attract more gays/young gays to Pattaya" the same?

My main point to you is you've been focusing a lot on how it can be better promoted when in fact, it's the "product" that's the issue. No amount of promotion will attract young gay farang who aren't already visiting to what is currently on offer in the venues you're keen to promote (namely, places like Boyztown and Sunee).


Your comment about backpackers does have merit. Some of the places rented to Thai boys could be converted to backpacker both gay and straight, which could brigten up the beer bars at Jomtien and Sunee. I doubt if anybody in Boyztown 1,2 3 could be bothered getting off the ars to try it out.
There's plenty of cheap accommodation around... It's the bars and choice of nightlife, which is lacking for younger gays in Pattaya.


Facts are younger gay guys are not interested in paying for sex at all...
True for the most part... and they're certainly not going to be attracted by what's currently aimed at the older generation.


Thailand has become more wealthy and affluent and there are a lot more jobs for the Thais, even unskilled for them to do.
I think this is a great thing...


Dear BL from Ozzie dohn yundah: you took the wrong place for that-Samui might be more suitable. Though I think Bali would be far more attractive and closer by for the OZzie addicts, plus they even can speak OZzie style of incomprehensible english there and go surfing
Of course, you're right. Pattaya would face an uphill battle to do all this...

[Patexpat]

Anyone with their fingers on the pulse can see this is happening NOW, not in 5 or 10 years ... the new breed of tourists have very little in common with the sex tourists of old - although of course there are still many of those, but not the same as before. The successful businesses are the ones that are moving with times, not hanging on to 'tried and tested' and now failed - business practices!(quote)Patexpat

Can you give any examples?


As I live here, AND run a business, yes I can. Where do you want me to start? Chinese tourists? Russian? Korean? A demographic split of clients perhaps?



Thanks for the reply, I am interested in knowing what specific business have done to create a viable business model where so many others have failed.

easy - 30 years experience in what I do, and NOT a bar/restaurant/entertainment business ... although many of those are in my client base. If you need more info, then pay me for my expertise and consultancy!

[thonglor55]

Thanks for the reply, I am interested in knowing what specific business have done to create a viable business model where so many others have failed.easy - 30 years experience in what I do, and NOT a bar/restaurant/entertainment business ... although many of those are in my client base. If you need more info, then pay me for my expertise and consultancy!Excellent reply Patexpat. Damn cheek of the man!

[colmx]

I spotted a large sign "Dude Man Disco".
I asked the boy I was eating with about this place and according to him it was once a gay disco,but had closed down,this place was just off South Pattaya Rd,a 10 minute walk away from Tukcom.I wonder what happened there?

Dude (on Soi Bunkot) closed around 2 years back

At one stage it was the "in" place to go in Pattaya... but its time at the top of the tree was short lived!

At the Time there was X-ray, Dave Man Club and Dude competing for the late night Gay business, X-ray moved to a new premises and the crowdmoved to the new X-Ray

The opening of NAB finally deprived Dude of its remaining customers...and it closed

Incidentally a lot of the bar boys now live on Soi Bunkot and there are at least 6 Boy karaokes in the immediate vicinity (as well as Si Saket restaurant which is full of gay people after closing time(s))