Drugs, bar boys and online sex in Thailand

[Surfcrest]

Drugs, bar boys and online sex in Thailand

More and more these days, guys are coming to Thailand and bypassing the bar scene altogether in favor of picking boys up online. There is an open thread already where the focus of the discussion is on the number of "high sex" profiles online or the mentioning of "high sex" in profiles. There have also been a number of threads that have focused on raids or police crack downs in the bar areas. A number of posters have responded by saying that this is just another attempt by the authorities to exact bribes.

I recall with one of my first visits 20 years ago or so that I met a boy, who now would only be a handful of years younger than I am today, if he's still alive (and I sincerely hope that's he case). With that earlier visit, as I 'm sure it has been with many fellow posters, the attraction and the magic we shared together was something I still think about today so many years later, a beautiful memory I will carry with me to the end of days.

When I returned to Thailand a year later to rekindle what I thought we had before I quickly discovered that things between us had taken a 180 degree shift in the opposite direction and that something about him or about us had changed. At the time, I couldn't put my finger what is was. He seemed a little indifferent to me, going out with his friends all night long and slepping most of the day away. His eyes were glazed over most of the time and having smoked enough pot as a teenager myself, I figured that probably was one of the things he and his friends were up to at all hours. I never thought of it to be any more than that in respect to drug use and I never did figure it out in the month or so that I was there. I tried to set him up well financially hoping that when I returned again it might shift back to what it was between us but hen listened / read over the next year through his calls and his letters at how his life fell apart....how he hit rock bottom and found himself with the choice of military or jail time. The last correspondence that I had from him he sent me a photo of himself wearing his military khakis and holding a large automatic rifle.

On my next visit, I was walking through Sunee one afternoon with an American friend and came across a group of young boys in a group that had just gotten seriously high on something. I recognized the same glazed look in their eyes that I saw in my boy's eyes the year before. The American, explained to me that they were high on ya ba and that's when the year before started to make sense. Since then I have been seeing more and more of this in Pattaya and now Bangkok, the symptoms and the distruction it causes, not only to the ones addicted but to the ones connected to those addicted. As I said in an earlier thread, I'm now seeing visitors to Thailand getting involved in it and the spread of the same problem back home. You need only to go online yourself to see how prevalent it has become now. Where I come from, drugs are easily accessible especially the hard drugs such as cocaine, heroin and now crystal meth and so there are a lot of holes for people to fall into. The same applies here in Thailand, especially with the uncultured boys who come to the cities to make money for themselves or their family and then find themselves trying to fit in.

Ya ba is also known as crystal meth, or Tina or a number of other aliases. I am fortunate today that I got a crash course on the drug here in Thailand many years ago as it has helped me avoid being dragged down financially with the demands of the boy I spoke of earlier and with other people since, both here and at home. I've had a great deal of experience over the years working with my own employees back home through their addictions be they drugs, alcohol and gambling but I have no experience with the drug itself so I can only tell you about what it does to you based on what others have told me and the damage I've seen it do. I can tell you that it is very addictive to an addictive personality type and that people high on the drug have a need for sex that isn't satisfied easily (can go all night long - literally) and so it is quite often mixed with Viagra or Cialis. People high on the drug have been known to engage in high risk sexual activity and so it is no surprise that HIV infection is up where this sort of activity is happening. Prolonged use will result in the person's physical appearance being affected negatively, including substantial teeth loss. If you recall "Queer As Folk", that is what Ted became addicted to resulting in the British version, his death.

If you are online in Thailand looking for a hook- up you will see more and more profiles mentioning High Sex, High Fun, Hi Fun or referencs about having sex multiple times or all night long that you need to be aware of. The first hazard of course is that they try to involve you with the drug so you are able to be as sexually charged up as they are. The next problem is that because it is so addictive, these are the types of dates where you need to keep a watch on your valuables or they will steal from you to feed their habit if when are deeply addicted already. Another hazard is that if they get picked off by the BIB while with you, that could drag you into being arrested with them.

Let me say the problem is not only indicative of boys you will meet online. Bar boys / Beach boys get swallowed up with this as well. If you are online, you will notice many bar boys also have profiles and are playing the market from both angles. Sometimes they may be rent boys by trade, but the gay ones might be online looking fr a date f their choosing rather than how it works out for them when they are working. You need only look at the number of raids in the sex trade areas to know the police are on to this problem as well, whether in response to the drug problem or to line their pockets. I personally think the first is more likely, especially given the pee testing that has been going on with all the raids and that this is probably the right response from the authorities given the magnitude of he problem here in Thailand.

A short while ago someone was writing about a host bar, where they felt uncomfortable that the boys had been all lined in front of them for choosing. I recall my earlier visits to the Saphan Kwai area in Bangkok that was the way it was done and I imagine this to be more Thai style....vs the "go go" thing, a concept more farang driven. I can even recall a visit to an establishment where they didn't bring the boys out at all but rather brought the customer a catalogue of the boys photos to choose from. When you think about it, this isn't really far off from where we are today with online meetings, if the photos / profiles are accurate and truthful. Having see a few people online that I know, you are probably more likely to find a farang lying about his age than a Thai and you are probably just as likely to find an underage guy in a bar as you would online. I know no bars that test their boys for drugs.

Now the bar boy scene certainly has it's draw backs as well. While it is nice to see the boys dance or stand before you in their little undies and with a number pinned on to make the selection process easier, that isn't to say they are going to perform to your expectations once you get them home. It can be a complicated affair when you have been told at the bar by either the boy or the mamasan / bar worker that the boy is this or is that and does this or that, and then you get them home to find out they weren't as you were lead to believe? If you have spent considerable time and money through the process that can be both frustrating and dissapointing especially when time is of the essence. One thing I find all too often is that many of the bar workers are straight and as a result perform less than expected or not at all. On the flip side of that coin I have yet to find a straight one online and so having one that is gay and into you for the right reasons, rather than being with you because you picked him and paid for him is a big, big plus.

I'm sure you could come up with many reasons to go online or stick to the bars for company. Undoubtedly the bars don't want you to go online as that's going to cut into their business and so they will warn you of the possible hazards and try to scare you away from the idea. I would hazard to guess that some of these bars or bar owners have never tried the online thing and so really don't know themselves for sure one way or another. If you are getting on in years, you may not be able to find what you want online whereas if you are still in good shape and reasonably attractive the online thing is probably going to be much easier and without the bar costs. It's probably not a heck of a lot different here in that respect as it would for you where ever you call home. It's quite simple to get the details out in the open right away with online message exchanges. You can ask them if they are a mony boy up front or specify in your own profile whether you are or not interested in money boys. The same is true with the drug factor, whether you see something in their profile or you want to specify up front your feelings about drugs or people on drugs.

Either way, both mechanisms for meeting guys here in Thailand is open to you, each with their own precautions, pluses and draw backs. The drug problem here is not going to subside until the authorities start focusing more on the source of these drugs and educating the boys on the hazards.

Surfcrest

Drugs, bar boys and online sex in Thailand.......More and more these days, guys are coming to Thailand and bypassing the bar scene altogether in favor of picking boys up online. There is an open thread already where the focus of the discussion is on the number of "high sex" profiles online or the mentioning of "high sex" in profiles. Surfcrest

Unless I am blind, which of course i could be, the above mentioned thread is NOT an open thread and was removed within 24 hours after it was opened by either the owner or moderator as not a topic that they wanted seen on this board. I could be wrong but ...... :love4:

[cdnmatt]

Nice post. The only thing I'll add is one benefit of meeting online is you're not restricted to your locality, and all of Thailand opens up. You can easily meet some guy in bumfuck nowhere, who'd be more than happy to travel an hour or two by bus to see you. Increases your chances of meeting some cute, sweet, hard working guy who hasn't been corrupted by the bar, drug, and prostitution scene yet. Well, if that's what you're looking for of course...

.... corrupted by the bar, drug, and prostitution scene....



LUXURY!


:alc: :alc: :bot: :bot: :bis: :bis: :alc: :alc:

[Beachlover]

The first hazard of course is that they try to involve you with the drug so you are able to be as sexually charged up as they are. The next problem is that because it is so addictive, these are the types of dates where you need to keep a watch on your valuables or they will steal from you to feed their habit if when are deeply addicted already. Another hazard is that if they get picked off by the BIB while with you, that could drag you into being arrested with them.
It's good to be aware of these risks/implications and avoid them.

Most of the working boy/moneyboy scene is comprised of very low socio-economic class Thais who are naturally more susceptible to these kinds of issues.

I think many foreigners come to Thailand and spend most/all of their time with this segment of the population without realising these aren't the type of people you might ordinarily spend time with back home. There's nothing wrong with this in principle, but it helps to be aware of it and set your expectations (and be alert to the probable risks) accordingly.


As I said in an earlier thread, I'm now seeing visitors to Thailand getting involved in it [drugs] and the spread of the same problem back home.
So far, I've never come across a Thai taking drugs (that I've been aware of ). Only foreigners. I've also come across Caucasian foreigners (American and French accents... ) selling drugs/pills in Bangkok nightclubs a few times now. What stupid idiots...

I recall being in a nightclub in Sukhumvit where a young American guy was openly and arrogantly selling E in the male toilets. When I walked out of the club there was a cop standing down the road. I wonder how f*cked the American would've been if someone had told the cop to check out what was taking place inside.

...one benefit of meeting online is you're not restricted to your locality, and all of Thailand opens up. You can easily meet some guy in bumfuck nowhere, who'd be more than happy to travel an hour or two by bus to see you. Increases your chances of meeting some cute, sweet, hard working guy who hasn't been corrupted by the bar, drug, and prostitution scene yet. Well, if that's what you're looking for of course...

What you posted is very true. When I was in Chiang Mai, a tuk tuk driver I hired, to take me around, kept asking me if I wanted a nice boyfriend. He stated that he has some friends in his village that would fix me up with some nice innocent gay boy. The tuk tuk driver told me that I didn't want anything to do the boys in Chiang Mai as they were too professional and gold diggers. Apparently he has never been to Pattaya!
:evil4:

Since then I have used the internet and yes, they made those long bus trips!

... the working boy/moneyboy scene is comprised of very low socio-economic class Thais ...

Take a look at the Punters.


:occasion9:

[dab69]

haven't seen a single profile online about high times.
did get a warning from a katohey about a boy I had been with inside the bar
but kinda brushed it off. found him on one of the social web sites year later and something in Thai which I google translated as "club drug man".
still would have hooked up with him.

in front of Mike dept Store I have heard a guy saying "marihijuana, coke"
as if for sale.

[Surfcrest]

haven't seen a single profile online about high times. .

What site were you looking through? Gayromeo has plenty.

I am new to this site but not new to BKK. This time is different i am here on a 1 year post and live near Robinsons Sukumvit. I am 33 I don't care for the go go scene and I can do without the noise level in Dj. I can't believe how popular Gayromeo has become here, some nights there are over 900 people online. I learned how to setup a filter on Gayromeo to what I want. I work different hours and when the need occurs there is always someone......God bless Gayromeo!

[Beachlover]

... the working boy/moneyboy scene is comprised of very low socio-economic class Thais ...
Take a look at the Punters.:occasion9:
Good point! I know you're joking... but I would say a good proportion the "punters" would still need to be of decent socio-economic status to Thailand. You probably won't get the absolute lowest of the low in most cases...


When I was in Chiang Mai, a tuk tuk driver I hired, to take me around, kept asking me if I wanted a nice boyfriend. He stated that he has some friends in his village that would fix me up with some nice innocent gay boy.
Did you take him up on the offer? :-)

... the working boy/moneyboy scene is comprised of very low socio-economic class Thais ...

Take a look at the Punters.


:occasion9:


Not getting involved with the post but love Scottishguys comeback! :laughing3:

[colmx]

haven't seen a single profile online about high times.


The High times profiles are a bit of a Bkk phenomenon

I reckon 30% of the Bkk based profiles are looking for high Fun

The Pattaya percentage is closer to 3-4% and is mainly visitors to Pattaya from Bkk..

Boys and the drug thing and Gayromeo. I have meet no one on G.R. that talked about drugs or appeared to be high and if they were and it didn't cause a legal problem should I care?

Disregard the Moral Minority here and just take the precautions you normally would, and given the drug laws in Thailand, that should include avoidance of illegal drugs.

Disregard the Moral Minority here and just take the precautions you normally would, and given the drug laws in Thailand, that should include avoidance of illegal drugs.

Hi,


Drugs laws like nearly ALL laws are there to be abused by a completely corrupt Police Force out to further their own ends at the expense of the general public and visitors to Thailand. The US Government by their ignorant policies trying to keep drugs out of the States,feed this greed by offering the Thai police 'incentives' to stop the drugs and bonuses for the capture of drugs.This leads to achieving 'targets' by fair means and foul to achieve financial rewards.

As and until this gets addressed,tales of abuse of visitors and their human rights as well as unsatisfactory explanations for 'mysterious' deaths etc will continue with the Embassies turning a 'blind eye' to these events,intent on only furthering their diplomatic careers without rocking the boat.

Thailand is not considered a particularly prestigious post for diplomats,more of a stepping stone to a glamorous posting and they are not going to jeopardise that for Joe Public.

When you look at Thai law,they have all the correct statutes in place,their law being a mish mash of US,UK and French law.In theory and if you look at the written laws they should be satisfactory for the wellbeing of the Country.

Laws however,are only as good as the ability of those that enforce them. Laws in Thailand are seen by those in power,are something to be held up when they come under the scrutiny of the UN or other bodies and are seldom intended to be enforced in practice. In the small scale this applies to Police riding around without safety helmets,drink driving,smoking in restaurants because they are 'Police' to more serious breaches of covering up suspicious deaths and suicides and/or offering poor explanations and investigations to the bereaved.

They are not supposed to be a third world country any more and so this type of behaviour is unacceptable,you can't have your cake and eat it,but that is what they always want to do. These are the first people to cry 'foul' when they are doing business in western countries and feel they are not getting the same rights as everyone else.

[Patexpat]

haven't seen a single profile online about high times.


The High times profiles are a bit of a Bkk phenomenon

I reckon 30% of the Bkk based profiles are looking for high Fun

The Pattaya percentage is closer to 3-4% and is mainly visitors to Pattaya from Bkk..

Couldn't agree more. My Thai friend worked as GM for a hotel here in Pattaya, and moved to BKK about 6 months ago. He uses GR, and contrasted Pattaya GR profiles as a lot of, but not exclusive, money boys but he was amazed at the number of guys in BKK on drugs wanting 'hi' fun.

This leads to achieving 'targets' by fair means and foul to achieve financial rewards.

Which brings to mind the 'War on Drugs' instigated by their Dear Leader Toxsin when around 3,000 people, some of them children, were murdered by the BIB in the street in just over a month, all to please Toxsin as he wanted numbers not convictions.

[bucknaway]

Guys in Thailand continuously offer to do drugs with me and I am constantly telling guys that I don't do drugs. Their reply is to say they were only joking.... yeah... right....

Guys in Thailand continuously offer to do drugs with me and I am constantly telling guys that I don't do drugs. Their reply is to say they were only joking.... yeah... right....


Bucky,

And a lot of times if you were to accept,their police buddies are standing around the corner guessing at how much they are going to extract from your ATM. :headbang:

This leads to achieving 'targets' by fair means and foul to achieve financial rewards.

Which brings to mind the 'War on Drugs' instigated by their Dear Leader Toxsin when around 3,000 people, some of them children, were murdered by the BIB in the street in just over a month, all to please Toxsin as he wanted numbers not convictions.


Combat,

I remember that period of time,and that is when the Americans had to step in and exert pressure to stop it.

The US couldn't believe it was going on for real at first. :dontknow: :dontknow:

[netrix]

I know no bars that test their boys for drugs.

I know a couple.

[Surfcrest]

The High times profiles are a bit of a Bkk phenomenon

I reckon 30% of the Bkk based profiles are looking for high Fun

The Pattaya percentage is closer to 3-4% and is mainly visitors to Pattaya from Bkk..

This is true because the online demographic between Bangkok boys and Pattaya is very different. I have seen many of the Pattaya boys working in the sex trade industry where the Bangkok boys that I have met were not. The Bangkok phenomena appears to be more recreational, as it is in many other parts around the world. Similarly so, many Pattaya boys are either online to supplement their income, cannot /do not work in the commercial sex trade industry or are looking for a hookup of their choice (rather than the deal they get while working).

The ya ba problem that I see in Pattaya has been in the Sunee area. If you are able recognize what someone high on crystal looks like you may notice it more. Again, the problem appears to be near epidemic proportions here and those affected may not have the capacity or the means to be online. With it being so readily and easily available in Pattaya it remains just as big a problem as in Bangkok. Having said this, it is not a problem that is only affecting the Sunee boys or Thai boys necessarily.

[Beachlover]

Guys in Thailand continuously offer to do drugs with me and I am constantly telling guys that I don't do drugs. Their reply is to say they were only joking.... yeah... right....
That's a good decision Bucknaway... I steer clear of drugs myself. I generally walk out on guys if they suddenly bring out poppers and start using them (without asking first).

Thailand ranks number three in the per capita use of methamphetamine worldwide!


Here is the actual text:

"The Thai government estimates that 3% of the population uses Yaba (Crazy drug) on a regular basis making the country rank third in the per-capa usage of methamphetamine ... The sale of Yaba to Thailand finances most of the Burmese separatists arms purchases, a small ethnic minority known as the United Army Of Wa.
Thailands' prison population is comprised of more than 60% incarcerated on drug charges!"


As to 1 and 2 you'll need to do your own research!

Thailand ranks number three in the per capita use of methamphetamine worldwide!


Hi,

Who is 1 and 2 then please? :dontknow:

Thailand ranks number three in the per capita use of methamphetamine worldwide!


Hi,

Who is 1 and 2 then please? :dontknow:

I'd also like to know how they add it all up and come to that conclusion?

[bao-bao]

Guys in Thailand continuously offer to do drugs with me and I am constantly telling guys that I don't do drugs. Their reply is to say they were only joking.... yeah... right....
That's a good decision Bucknaway... I steer clear of drugs myself. I generally walk out on guys if they suddenly bring out poppers and start using them (without asking first).
Great if you steer clear of them yourself, but my suggestion would be to consider changing that "generally" in your personal code to "always", and remembering that them asking first doesn't make any illegal substance legal - or offer you any legal protection if there's a knock at the door (wink wink).

[Beachlover]

That's good advice. I don't take any drugs... ever. The only time I've ever encountered poppers has been in saunas. When I first started out I was pretty naive and would just say no to them and ask them to put it away. Now a days I tend to say no AND gently excuse myself.

Never encountered someone wanting to use anything worse than poppers with me but if I did I'd be out of there quick and probably not so gentle saying good bye!

One of the difficulties in the war on drugs pertains to the bars and thier employees. Years ago, the urine tests were pretty readily available in pharmacies. Now, you can't buy them and that leaves the bars in an awkward situation. They want the boys to be clean from drugs, and the police want to fine a bar for having employees on drugs, but they won't make the kits available for sale to test for drugs. The only way to get these test kits is when they "fall off the truck going to the police stations", so that, for a reasonable fee some find their way to the bars that do want to test for drugs. :dontknow:

[dab69]

Guys in Thailand continuously offer to do drugs with me and I am constantly telling guys that I don't do drugs. Their reply is to say they were only joking.... yeah... right....
That's a good decision Bucknaway... I steer clear of drugs myself. I generally walk out on guys if they suddenly bring out poppers and start using them (without asking first).


Note to self: pack 1 bottle of Beach repellent

[blueboy]

Surfcrest - There is a distinction between Ya Ba which is a mixture of methamphetamine and cafeine in a tablet form, and crystal meth also known in Thailand as 'Ice' comes in small crystal that look like bits of glass or ice. Crystal meth is just methamphetamine. First one tastes sweet, which is why it also know as 'cholalee' and, ice is bitter. The effects from what I hear are quite different.
Both drugs are widely used amongst barboys. You may also just see when there are raids in Silom Soi 2, Sunee or Boyztown the number of boys that are carted off after having given a urine sample.

Surfcrest - There is a distinction between Ya Ba which is a mixture of methamphetamine and cafeine in a tablet form, and crystal meth also known in Thailand as 'Ice' comes in small crystal that look like bits of glass or ice. Crystal meth is just methamphetamine. First one tastes sweet, which is why it also know as 'cholalee' and, ice is bitter. The effects from what I hear are quite different.
Both drugs are widely used amongst barboys. You may also just see when there are raids in Silom Soi 2, Sunee or Boyztown the number of boys that are carted off after having given a urine sample.


Hi,

Yaa Baa is basically 'speed' The problem with all these drugs is the additives they put in and the purity it is available in this region to get people seriously hooked. To my knowledge your description of ice is correct and it is also highly addictive.

They are allowed to be classed as a user with being caught in possession of up to 15 Yaa Baa pills,anything over this is classed as automatically possession to sell,carrying far heavier sentencing. (allegedly)

It is also the nonsense people get up to to feed these habits that causes alarm as well as the crime. Also,they class Cocaine in Thailand only as Class B,I know an Italian first hand who got four years for nearly a Kilo,unheard of in the West, he said and it was accepted by the court, that it was for personal use. With metamphetamines they limit is 20 grams,and over this you are looking at a life sentence and certainly Death sentence if it was a Kilo.

Another point of concern is the vast differences in sentencing by the different Courts without explanation at all. It is a nonsense at times. I have also seen first hand,vicious young Thais walking away with 7 years for murder,and with good behaviour and an amnesty,they will be out in four. :dontknow: :dontknow:

Thailand likes to jail its citizens, the people in Thai jails,including those on remand exceeds 500,000 people,many for petty offences and many innocents jaled until trial.Theuir system is set up and geared for even the innocentto plead guilty just to get out with a shorter sentence.Most of the Thais cannot afford decent representation by lawyers and their ''legal aid ' system is a joke for these people.

[Dodger]

KQuill Wrote:


This leads to achieving 'targets' by fair means and foul to achieve financial rewards

You've got that right.

Last July my BF Thep returned to PTY from his home in Si Saket to attend an Isaan concernt with his friends. I was back here in the States when he first informed me of his plans. I wasn't thrilled with this because of his past problems with yaba and knowing that his friends would most likely be using at the concernt, but he said he would only stay in PTY for 1 day following the concernt and would be fine.

That phone conversation ocurred on July 4th and on July 7th he had been arrested, convicted and sentenced to 2-1/2 years for being in a room where 30 yaba tablets had been found during a police raid.

When I arrived in Thailand I found that the court records reflected that the story Thep had told me was in fact the truth. The police had entered the room where Thep sat with two of his friends who were apparently waiting for other friends to join them for the concert, the police busted in, searched the room and found the yaba. Both of Thep's friends failed the pee test which was immediately administered by the police. Thep passed the pee test. All 3 were arrested and received the same 2-1/2 year sentences.

I secured a lawyer and spent 2 months trying to free Thep, although failed. Thep informed the lawyer in my presense that the police who entered the room that night knew exactly who the yaba belonged to, and that was Theps' friend who the room belonged to, although what they really wanted was the name of the distributer who he purchased the yaba from. Their request was made clear that if they received the name of the distributor they (meaning Theps' s 2 friends) would only be charged with failing the pee test and not the possession charge which by far carries the greater penalty. Thep of course would not be charged with anything - because he passed the pee test. Apparently, all 3 boys just sat there with their heads down and didn't say a single word. Thep was convicted on grounds of association - which is nothing short of a total violation of the law, and there wasn't a dam thing the lawyer could do about it.

Thep has been in Pattaya's Nong Palai prison for the past 8 months and will be released on an early pardon granted by the Honorable King in December of this year. His 2 friends did not receive the pardon and will remain in prison to serve their full terms.

The police got their numbers that night and that's really all that mattered.

No offence Dodger, but only the "boys" present in the room and the BIB know for a fact what happened that night - you don't know and neither does anybody on this forum. Sure you have listened to your boy's account and believed it - but who is to say it's truthful? I'm not saying it isn't - I'm just pointing out it could either be truthful or a complete tissue of lies.

What he really needs is some common sense and to quit associating with drug fiends - but if you haven't managed to comminicate this to him with any effect by now, I doubt he will listen in the future.

:occasion9:

[Beachlover]

Thailand likes to jail its citizens, the people in Thai jails,including those on remand exceeds 500,000 people...
Christ... 500,000 is a huge number considering a population of 67 million. Where did you get that number from? That would be as bad as the US ratio wise.


No offence Dodger, but only the "boys" present in the room and the BIB know for a fact what happened that night - you don't know and neither does anybody on this forum. Sure you have listened to your boy's account and believed it - but who is to say it's truthful? I'm not saying it isn't - I'm just pointing out it could either be truthful or a complete tissue of lies.

What he really needs is some common sense and to quit associating with drug fiends - but if you haven't managed to comminicate this to him with any effect by now, I doubt he will listen in the future.
Well put, Scottish. That's the most sensible thing I've ever heard you say.

Regardless of this, at the end of the day, Dodger cares about his BF and feels he needs to do everything he can to help. When something like this happens to a friend or loved one, that's what you do. I have friend who cheaped out hiring a lawyer who did a sh*t job and lost a case. He has an opportunity to appeal. I feel the circumstances are his fault and he is not entirely innocent but if he loses the appeal his career is finished (amongst other implications) so I assisted him in funding a better lawyer because he's a good friend and that's what you do...

[Dodger]

scottish-guy Wrote:


Sure you have listened to your boy's account and believed it - but who is to say it's truthful?

No, actually I didn't believe a single word he was saying...I didn't believe what his friends on the street were telling me, and I didn't believe his mother or father who had attended the court trial. In short, I didn't believe a word of what anyone was saying to me - until I walked in the court with a lawyer and interpretor and read the court records for myself. Obtaining facts through investigation is what I do for a living - and the last thing I would do is believe anyone, especially Thep, under these circumstances.

Thep had no business going anywhere where there was the probability of drugs being around because of his previous addiction. For that he is suffering the consequences. As far as his innocence from a legal perspective - he violated no law and was wrongly convicted. With the exposure to this case (via my pressure through two sets of lawyers) Thep has received a pardon dropping one year off his sentance. The guilty party, meaning ther person who actually owned the drugs did not receive a pardon, nor did Thep's friend who had failed the pee test when the arrest took place.

The perceptions you've drawn from my comments are fully understandable, because they are identical to my own perceptions - before I had the facts.

Fair comment.

Good luck.

:occasion9:

[bao-bao]

No offence Dodger, but only the "boys" present in the room and the BIB know for a fact what happened that night - you don't know and neither does anybody on this forum.
Precisely what I was saying in the "It isn't Songkran yet, but..." thread. Who's traveled where, what happened with the check bin in the 500/1000 baht dispute, who woke up in what toilet and who was on their knees catching diseases in another are ALL speculation to EVERYONE but those who were there and those who have seen substantiated proof, as you believe you have seen. Almost everything on the forum has to be taken as something you hear from a stranger on the train, so to speak.

All of the rest of it is just posturing and simian chest pounding. Entertaining - to a point - but (as a past professor used to say) "Jesus wept!"

Dodger - it's not my place to judge so let me just say I hope things go as you said in December and that it's a happy reunion for you two - and that Thep finds the willingness to do what he needs to do to remain clean and out of trouble. It's a slippery slope for meth and ice users, and I wish him strength.

Dodger,

Are you saying there was another amnesty this last December???? I KNOW there was one last May?? Dodger they call what your lad did 'Roo um' Thais usually pronounce it loo um,meaning together,combined/involved/associated. It's a bloody disgrace of a system.

Cop walk in the room, let's say even an honest one, if they get paid,they MAY use their discreion and release the others,if not, it's roo um and they all go down together.

I met a really young student guy in the hospital over there, who had been home to Isaarn to visit for holidays and he was offred a lift back to BKK from his brother and friend. Car was stopped.The other two ADMITTED their responsibility and said he knew nothing. They got 25 years for admittingit,he got life because he had pleaded not guilty.

The judge said, he must have known there were drugs in the pick up! go figure!,end of a 20 year old boys life.

I am also seeing drug use in the UK is rampant with the Police overwhelmed and understaffed to cope,it is a Global problem but the penalties,for reasons I have already been into,(and they are not for the welfare of the population at large in Thailand), are far far more severe

Beachlover,

You know where I got my figures from,first hand,so to speak! :glasses7:

[Beachlover]

Precisely what I was saying in the "It isn't Songkran yet, but..." thread. Who's traveled where, what happened with the check bin in the 500/1000 baht dispute, who woke up in what toilet and who was on their knees catching diseases in another are ALL speculation to EVERYONE but those who were there and those who have seen substantiated proof, as you believe you have seen. Almost everything on the forum has to be taken as something you hear from a stranger on the train, so to speak.
Bao Bao... I think your point is a given when it comes to most forum posts. So why do you keep vaguely repeating it, what specific outcome are you aiming to achieve and how do you feel people should specifically act on it?

I would also say, with all due respect that I suspect you don't grasp the significance of what happened on the thread you refer to. What started as a relatively trivial debate and an ordinary personal attack/defense escalated into a potential civil and criminal case, hence the decision by a number of people to cease further comment on the matter. Your trivialising of the issue doesn't achieve anything constructive at this late stage.


You know where I got my figures from,first hand,so to speak! :glasses7:
Kquill... I respect someone with first-hand experience, but I'm sure you didn't hand count the entire prison population in Thailand!

I don't question your 500,000 figure or your opinion that Thailand jails a high proportion of its citizens. Just curious where you got the number...

Precisely what I was saying in the "It isn't Songkran yet, but..." thread. Who's traveled where, what happened with the check bin in the 500/1000 baht dispute, who woke up in what toilet and who was on their knees catching diseases in another are ALL speculation to EVERYONE but those who were there and those who have seen substantiated proof, as you believe you have seen. Almost everything on the forum has to be taken as something you hear from a stranger on the train, so to speak.
Bao Bao... I think your point is a given when it comes to most forum posts. So why do you keep vaguely repeating it, what specific outcome are you aiming to achieve and how do you feel people should specifically act on it?

I would also say, with all due respect that I suspect you don't grasp the significance of what happened on the thread you refer to. What started as a relatively trivial debate and an ordinary personal attack/defense escalated into a potential civil and criminal case, hence the decision by a number of people to cease further comment on the matter. Your trivialising of the issue doesn't achieve anything constructive at this late stage.


You know where I got my figures from,first hand,so to speak! :glasses7:
Kquill... I respect someone with first-hand experience, but I'm sure you didn't hand count the entire prison population in Thailand!

I don't question your 500,000 figure or your opinion that Thailand jails a high proportion of its citizens. Just curious where you got the number...


Beachy

Figures are public record and knowledge. My lawyer gave them to me,and they,the Thai authorities, were forever trying to come up with ideas to reduce the population in Thai jails but as fast as they released them,more were entering. In fact,for every one going out 4 or 5 were coming in.

A good start to reduce some of the numbers would be to allow bail until trial,but if they don't have te guarantee money,no bail and presumed guilty until proven innocent. Do you know they give up to ten years for stealing a car, five if you accept the charge.

However, unlike UK and other Countries they don't see themselves out of pocket with prisoners, in the UK it costs the taxpayer ┬г800 PER WEEK PER PRISONER, in a normal security jail.This rises as the security class gets higher.

A lot of Foreigners in UK jails were offered free repatriation and some money,Britain has been trying to remove them because of the cost but they throw away their passports and Countries such as China refuse to have them back without proper documentation.

Vietnam is similar and these guys just don't want to return to their homelands even though they are illegals. :dontknow:

[Beachlover]

Fair enough... I'm surprised the number is that high as that would make the prisoners to population ratio would be on par with the US.

I suspect the cost of jailing is probably a LOT lower in Thailand since standards are lower.

I guess lots of Thais can't afford bail.

Fair enough... I'm surprised the number is that high as that would make the prisoners to population ratio would be on par with the US.

I suspect the cost of jailing is probably a LOT lower in Thailand since standards are lower.

I guess lots of Thais can't afford bail.


Beachlover,

The Thais make sure it costs them bugger all,they make money out of it, with the canteen prices and market food for remand prisoners controlled by the wives of prison warders. What do you think they are producing in Bangkwang,the Bangkok Hilton??..... Counterfeit jeans and footwear!

Also at various other jails such as Chonburi, they produce furniture and umbrellas,Nong palai does different types of carrier bags,plastic and cardboard etc etc.

These prisons are run lwith business in mind. You then must ask yourself how all these drugs and mobile phones get into the prisons with all visits being non contact.

They get the newspapers and TV down and have a big parade every so often to mark all the drugs and phones they find, and no reporter ever has the guts/gumption to ask,how are they getting in in the first place.

Look at the car parks and see the vehicles being driven on the salaries of a prison warder,but no one queries it.

AMAZING THAILAND. I'll leave it there,its just the hypocrisy of it all,makes the blood boil,and what do they do??.........Smile.

[Dodger]

kquill Wrote:


Are you saying there was another amnesty this last December???? I KNOW there was one last May??

Yes, there was another amnesty announced shortly after the Honerable Kings birthday (Dec 5), although the pardons are planned in two phases for the months of June and December of this year. Unfortunately (for Thep anyway), the early releases involving the Nong Palai Remand Prison won't ocurr until December. The Bankok Hilton and Chon Buri also drew the bottom card as well and must wait until December.

I am very aware of the term "Roo Um" as this was first explained to me by the Thai visitors to Nong Palai who I became friends with over time. Note that I visited Nong Palai daily for 2-1/2 months and walked away complety disoriented regarding what they refer to as "a legal system"...what a joke.

Every single thing you said about the corrupt under pinnings of the Thai legal system is absolutely correct. Everybody is on the take, from the food vendors outside of the prison walls up to the warden. It is, as you stated, nothing more than a business, with the prisoners, guily of their crimes or innocent, being nothing more than the rusty spokes which hold of this corrupt and grossly lob-sided wheel together.

After losing my battle to free Thep, I decided the next best thing was to try to leverage the situation the best I could. By doing so, I learned how to get to the right person(s) to make things happen which would benefit Thep during his incarceration. It cost me 20,000 baht to secure a trusty job for Thep where he now gets the freedom to move around a bit more - and is responsible for filling out various forms for the puching inmates, e.g., food orders, bank withdrawls, lawyer visitation request forms, etc., and he loves the job. It cost me 3,000 baht for a bed matress and another 3,000 for land. For those who don't know what I'm talking about, land in Nong Palai anyway, is nothing more than a section of the cell block which is against the wall with a little more sleeping space. I know it doesn't sound like much, but the alternative is sleeping on the ground with your legs overlapping the guy across from you due to the over-crowded living quarters.

Kevin, I don't know how you even survied your situation, but all I can say is I'm glad you're out of there and safe now.

I will return to Thailnd in a few weeks for a 3 month stay and will be back at Nong Palai every day as I did previously. Again, for those who may not understand the necessity for these frequent visits, it's because if I'm not there to order food for him he is stuck sharing a couple bowls of rice and a few rotten chickens per day divided amoungst 50 inmates in his cell block. I made sure there were enough funds in his prison bank account to carry him over until I return - although a prisoner is not allowed to spend more than 200 baht per day.

Years ago, the urine tests were pretty readily available in pharmacies. Now, you can't buy them and that leaves the bars in an awkward situation.

That's an interesting observation Unkie. One bar owner (Mark from Krazy Dragon) has publicly stated that he regularly tests his employees for drugs, and I myself had recourse to buy a few testing kits from a pharmacy in Sunee only last year. I did not know they had dried up the supply here, but they are easily available on the internet

[homeseeker]

This in an interesting thread with some disturbing stories like this one:



KQuill Wrote:


This leads to achieving 'targets' by fair means and foul to achieve financial rewards

You've got that right.

Last July my BF Thep returned to PTY from his home in Si Saket to attend an Isaan concernt with his friends. I was back here in the States when he first informed me of his plans. I wasn't thrilled with this because of his past problems with yaba and knowing that his friends would most likely be using at the concernt, but he said he would only stay in PTY for 1 day following the concernt and would be fine.

That phone conversation ocurred on July 4th and on July 7th he had been arrested, convicted and sentenced to 2-1/2 years for being in a room where 30 yaba tablets had been found during a police raid.

When I arrived in Thailand I found that the court records reflected that the story Thep had told me was in fact the truth. The police had entered the room where Thep sat with two of his friends who were apparently waiting for other friends to join them for the concert, the police busted in, searched the room and found the yaba. Both of Thep's friends failed the pee test which was immediately administered by the police. Thep passed the pee test. All 3 were arrested and received the same 2-1/2 year sentences.

I secured a lawyer and spent 2 months trying to free Thep, although failed. Thep informed the lawyer in my presense that the police who entered the room that night knew exactly who the yaba belonged to, and that was Theps' friend who the room belonged to, although what they really wanted was the name of the distributer who he purchased the yaba from. Their request was made clear that if they received the name of the distributor they (meaning Theps' s 2 friends) would only be charged with failing the pee test and not the possession charge which by far carries the greater penalty. Thep of course would not be charged with anything - because he passed the pee test. Apparently, all 3 boys just sat there with their heads down and didn't say a single word. Thep was convicted on grounds of association - which is nothing short of a total violation of the law, and there wasn't a dam thing the lawyer could do about it.

Thep has been in Pattaya's Nong Palai prison for the past 8 months and will be released on an early pardon granted by the Honorable King in December of this year. His 2 friends did not receive the pardon and will remain in prison to serve their full terms.

The police got their numbers that night and that's really all that mattered.



1.you mention your b/fтАЩs past problems with drugs, are these actual court convictions and has he previously be locked up ? 2. Is it your b/fтАЩs case that he had no knowledge there were drugs in the room? 3. Did your b/f give evidence in Court and what did he say? 4. As you have researched this case please tell us precisely the reasons given by the Court for convicting your b/f.5. what was the charge(s) he was convicted upon.

Thank you.

Dodger,

It was tough in there! What do the English call it,character building!! :laughing3: :laughing3:

Regards many other posters, they can't possibly understand as they haven't been through it or had someone close been through it.

I see some of the posters are trying to look at your man's case from a Western legal point of view, you know and I know, that won't work!

[Dodger]

homeseeker Wrote:


1.you mention your b/fтАЩs past problems with drugs, are these actual court convictions and has he previously be locked up ? 2. Is it your b/fтАЩs case that he had no knowledge there were drugs in the room? 3. Did your b/f give evidence in Court and what did he say? 4. As you have researched this case please tell us precisely the reasons given by the Court for convicting your b/f.5. what was the charge(s) he was convicted upon

1) My bf has been recovering from his addiction to yaba for the past 2 years. He was arrested 3 years ago for failing a pee test - paid a 14,000 baht fine.

2) Thep neither admitted nor denied knowing that there were drugs on the premises. The arrest report simply stated that the 3 boys were found in a rooom located at...( )... where 30 yaba tablets were discovered. It went on to say the name of the boy who's name was on the rental unit...and gave the names of the 2 boys who had failed the pee tests which were administered twice....once in the room during the arrest - and once again at the soi 9 police station.

3) I didn't arrive in Thailand until 2 months after the court hearing, so I don't know what he was asked or what he said first hand, although according to what I know about the situation, and how well I know Thep, he probably sat there with his head slung down and said nothing. By-the-way, this is the most common reaction from a Thai in a Thai courtroom. There is no bickering or debate or show of emotions like you see in the West. One thing you should know is that Thep and his best friend who visited the room of the third and somewhat distant friend were more paranoid about what would happen to them if they pointed the finger at the friend who was selling the drugs than they were of a prison sentence. I personally believe Thep knew full well that there would be drugs in his friends room, but wasn't concerned in the least. Young and dumb.

4) The judgement from the court was nothing more than a recital of the arrest record and read as if it were written by a third grader.

5) He was covicted for possession of 10 yaba tablets. They (the system) simply divided the 30 tablets found in the boys room by 3.

Before you starrt drawing your own conclusions about this let me tell you that THE SYSTEM in Thailand has no resemblance to what we in the West refer to as a LEGAL SYSTEM. They simply do what they want (or are told to do)...money is the only real motivating factor...and the actual legal rights of those captured in THE SYSTEM are all but non-existent.

There is a major anti-drug campaign in motion right now which was launched back in July shortly before my bf's arrest. This campaign is being administered from the highest levels and they mean business. The word is out that local police who do not report a high number of arrests are putting their jobs in jeapardy. It is now a numbers game.

Homeseeker, I just answered your questions, although will not debate with you. Please just read...try to understand...and believe me when I tell you that what I say is the truth regarding this matter. I have little patience left for trying to make reason of this myself and have no desire whatsoever to make reason with anyone else. Right now Thep and I are doing what we can to keep each other motivated and focusing on December.

Hi Dodger,

Good on you.Roll on December for your happiness.

I have never used substances other than alcohol and before,cigarettes. I am not a drug user and never have been.

However,when you have been through the system,your heart if you have any humanity goes out to a lot of these kids.They,for the most part,are not hardened criminals,although there are plenty of hard core criminals in there.

A lot are just daft lads,who have poor schooling and don't want to be the 'odd man out' with their mates. I will also say I have had involvement with kids who I have known to use the stuff when I was out playing the field,but not in my presence or with me. Unfortunately,it's the way of the World we live in.

Plenty of the posters on here will have been with these lads on the gear and not have a clue. A great many in the bars are at it,male and female!

Also, the problem is there is too much easy money in drugs,and there are plenty in the highest echelons of power who get rich and will continue to get rich from drugs. Add on the fact that the US pours money into the Thai coffers,trying to keep a lid on it,Thailand will ALWAYS 'find' drug traffickers,because if they ever admit the problem is solved,the Americans will stop paying!

A great majority of those in jail are users,not Al Capones or major gangsters, and they supply to feed their habits.

Posters on here should not forget,they used to sell 'speed' at the bloody petrol stations and it was taken regularly by long distance drivers,shift working cooks in the big hotels, and all the others required to work long and arduos hours.

They get tiny amnesties like 1 year in 9 but rapists,paedophiles,murderers can get up to a third off in a general amnesty.

Their system needs a complete update and overhaul. Mr.Thaksin and his cronies did not help and pushed the place further into the dark ages.

Jesus, Police going out and shooting women and kids and anyone they 'thought' was a dealer. It was like the OK corral and the Wild West. Bloody disgraceful for a Buddhist Country.

The way they treat them in prison just reinforces bullying and thuggery carried out by people with a low IQ and of course,the obligatory uniform with pips on the shoulders meaning they can do as they please.

Finally,ANYONE caught planting these substances on innocent people should be and prosecuted executed not moved to inactive posts or able to pay their way out of it.They have ruined a persons life and their loved ones,these animals should have theirs ended.

They need a well paid anti corruption force like the old American 'Untouchables' to carry these policies and enforce them and then the World might just take them seriously. :notworthy: :notworthy:


Amen.

[colmx]

Hi Kevin
Sorry if i am dragging this topic a bit off topic....

I can barely imagine what you have been through... but have 2.5 non (hopefully non invasive) personal questions to ask...

1.Are you allowed to go back to thailand...
And if so...
Would you go back after the way you were treated

2. Have you had any luck in getting re-united with your Thai partner in the UK.

If I am being too nosey... feel free to ignore my questions or tell me to F-O!

Thanks to both Dodger and Kevin for their input who sadly know through their own experiences just how corrupt the justice system in Thailand is.

Those that rant about how all drug dealers and user should be locked up or worse really have no idea or understandings about how the BIB actually operate. The drug problem has and will be around for a long time. It's the man in the street who suffers, not the organisations who manufacture and distribute the filth with, in many cases the help of those that should be stopping it such as the BIB.

Hi Kevin
Sorry if i am dragging this topic a bit off topic....

I can barely imagine what you have been through... but have 2.5 non (hopefully non invasive) personal questions to ask...

1.Are you allowed to go back to thailand...
And if so...
Would you go back after the way you were treated

2. Have you had any luck in getting re-united with your Thai partner in the UK.

If I am being too nosey... feel free to ignore my questions or tell me to F-O!

Hi colmx,

I haven't asked about going back and don't want to!

I was given amnesty and my case was called and treated as a 'general' case,otherwise I would not have been able to get 1 in 4 reduction. They charged me under the 'old law' of straightforward possession.

It's a load of crap anyway as they know full bloody well there was no drugs crime committed,they just didn't appreciate getting caught out of their own people implicated,it caused them a loss of face.

Let them do this to others and watch the tourism collapse.It's got worse since Thaksin left as they have nobody keeping them in check now.

Thet certainly pay no attention to Abbhisit,at all. They all desreve each other,in my view :hello2:

I am reunited with Tam, and he is on his way over to UK shortly,15 years together now! He visited me every week in Bangkok. :love4:

[bao-bao]

Those that rant about how all drug dealers and user should be locked up or worse really have no idea or understandings about how the BIB actually operate.
Speaking in absolutes is usually a mistake; but some of the BIB belong behind bars, too. My feeling is that the people who manufacture the illegal drugs, the people who run the groups who distribute it, the people who profit/prey on others by selling it and the bottom-of-the-food-chain folks who commit other crimes to get them and have their lives destroyed by them (albeit by choice, oftentimes) also deserve to do the time for the crime.

[Jason1988]

I personally think that alcohol does about as much or more damage to some people's lives. Although not illegal, the process for becoming free of the drug, has about the same success rate as illegal drugs. If governments didn't profit from alcohol sales would the drug alcohol have been declared illegal?

If governments didn't profit from alcohol sales would the drug alcohol have been declared illegal?

Well, it has been - in several countries at various times!

Without much success of course.

:bot: :bot:

[Jellybean]

An interesting, informative, thought provoking, disturbing and harrowing topic, which I think shows this board at its best and is why I find it so compulsive. I think all the contributions so far have been to a very high standard.

I was not aware of the term тАЬhigh sexтАЭ, although I occasionally use Gayromeo. Forewarned is forearmed, as they say and IтАЩll definitely give those boys a miss. Unlike Surfcrest I honestly cannot say that I have noticed any bar boy in Bangkok to be тАЬhigh on drugsтАЭ. I havenтАЩt been to Pattaya for a while so maybe things are different there. But perhaps I am not looking hard enough or for the right signs. And, to the best of my knowledge, no boy I have taken out of a bar or met on the Internet was on drugs at the time we met. And no boy has suggested the use of illegal drugs. I was a regular club goer on the London club scene so I am familiar with what people look like when on some types of drugs, although I make no claims to be an expert in this area. But I take the warnings here very seriously. Of course it goes without saying that the best advice is to avoid anyone you think is using illegal drugs.

I thought DodgerтАЩs account of the arrest and imprisonment of his boyfriend terribly sad and deeply moving. I can only imagine the nightmare that Dodger and Thep find themselves in and hope that time passes quickly and they can be speedily reunited. Guilt by association seems a terrible injustice and the fact that the Thai justice system did not recognise ThepтАЩs innocence is disturbing.

I was also sorry to hear of kquillтАЩs experiences. I saw a British TV documentary a few years ago on the subject of Bangkwang Central Prison (тАЬThe Bangkok HiltonтАЭ) and was shocked at the living conditions of the prisoners. I found kquillтАЩs account informative but chilling.

As someone who lives in Thailand it is so easy, as you go about your everyday life, going to the supermarket, going to a bookshop, going to restaurants, walking around Bangkok and visiting other parts of Thailand to imagine that everything in Thailand is sweetness and light. Like all societies, of course, Thailand has its dark side.

Around 5 years ago I spent 6 weeks in Chiang Mai at a Thai language school. One of my classmates, an Australian guy, recommended a book called, тАЬPrivate DancerтАЭ by Stephen Leather. It was an account of a foreigner's involvement with the female go-go bar and drug scene in Bangkok. It was said that every man visiting Thailand should read this book. It helped me to understand the workings of the boy go-go bar system.

That led me to read another book, by the same author тАЬConfessions of a Bangkok Private EyeтАЭ, written on behalf of an Australian private detective, based on his case files. It told of the very dark side of Thailand, murders, assassinations, hit men, drug dealers, westerners who lost their hearts to тАЬmoney-hungry bar girlsтАЭ, suspicious spouses and partners who had reason to suspect the fidelity of their Thai partners and needed the services of a private detective. I highly recommend this book, which is relevant to the topic being discussed.

Another book which I would also recommend is тАЬBangkok BoyтАЭ by Chai Pinit, itтАЩs the story of a straight, gay for pay bar boy, and itтАЩs a sorry tale of prostitution and drug taking in Pattaya and Bangkok. I recommend these three books because I believe it gives us foreigners an insight into a world that many of us might not be fully aware of, especially newcomers to Thailand.

With regard to my personal experience of the Thai justice system, well thankfully nothing as disturbing as DodgerтАЩs, just a few civil matters and second hand experiences which I won't go into here. But I can imagine that someone being in the wrong place at the wrong time could, quite possibly, get dragged into the murky world of drug users and, despite being innocent, get caught up in the Thai justice system.

I make a point of warning my friends from London who visit me not to even think about bringing any illegal substance with them or to search out drug dealers in nightclubs, the punishment, if caught, I tell them is just too severe. Lastly, I agree with several other posters here who warn that we should not assume that the Thai justice system is comparable to what they are used to back home. The television series, тАЬBanged up AbroadтАЭ makes this very point.

Years ago, the urine tests were pretty readily available in pharmacies. Now, you can't buy them and that leaves the bars in an awkward situation.

That's an interesting observation Unkie. One bar owner (Mark from Krazy Dragon) has publicly stated that he regularly tests his employees for drugs, and I myself had recourse to buy a few testing kits from a pharmacy in Sunee only last year. I did not know they had dried up the supply here, but they are easily available on the internet

A few weeks ago, when Soi 2 was shut down for an hour by the police, I told them through an interpretur of my problem about the kits have not being available in pharmacies for about a year or two both in Pattaya and Bangkok. I was told by the police that kits can be had and how much they would charge me. We are obtaining them but the first delivery has not arrived yet. Mark may have some old ones or maybe the information that every pharmacy has given me, including Facino, is incorrect. If Mark or anyone else knows a place to obtain them and it is CURRENT INFORMATION please advise me where. If you are absolutely concered, I might suggest that if a bar tells you that they check for drugs, tell them something like, Gee I never saw one of those kits, can you show it to me so I can see what it looks like? :love4:

... I myself had recourse to buy a few testing kits from a pharmacy in Sunee only last year...


WTF?

Your sex life must be a laugh riot!

After selecting the 'lucky' boy for the night (Teeth, hair and nails examined, ID checked and cross referenced with Birth Certificate no doubt) and repairing to the GWN4ASIAN love nest, I can just imagine the scene at the door: "Now Mr Pong, would you mind pissing in this tub and waiting outside until I've tested you for drugs - and while you're waiting please slip on these three extra thick condoms and this pair of Marigold rubber gloves"

:dontknow: :dontknow:

[Beachlover]

LOL... Scottish. I don't know if gwm4asian is getting the testing kits to test his "paid companions". Might be for other uses.

But I've heard some people do this and think it's a bit disturbing when you're having to demand your partner or casual fling take a drug test! Seriously...

I was not aware of the term тАЬhigh sexтАЭ, although I occasionally use Gayromeo. Forewarned is forearmed, as they say and IтАЩll definitely give those boys a miss.

I've been following this for a while since I first saw something about it a while back (Thai Visa?). I did it again this weekend. A run through the 1000+ users online (Bangkok) at any time searching for "high" revealed the numbers of them are INSIGNIFICANT. Not worth getting dramatic about. Less than 1.5% Less than 1 per page each of the 20+ pages. Some of these profiles are "actors" out for whatever (clothing designers? - the lighting on their models is just too professional ;-) ). More subtle "variations" of "high"?? "Hi" is one. There are more of these, but probably are just what that is, "HELLO" - Thais thinking that's just something needed to say to break in to what they have to say. A search for "drugs" reveals only "NO DRUGS" written in profiles (1%). So as you will give those few boys a miss, some are doing that as well. BTW, GR does not have a subtle "are you interested in ... " question, so maybe the few feel the need to make it obvious. MOST profiles seem quite innocent. What they want is their business, I think the 1000+ regular users hope that some here would mind theirs.

I have not checked the Pattaya online section.

As to the other cynical, insinuative writing in this thread (YAWN!) I just wonder if GB is running you off (I'm not watching). They're BACK! It is entertaining, somewhat. I catch up on it once a month.

(I won't be back here for a week ..)

For now I'm off to where there are a THOUSAND boys, for real. :love4:

[Dodger]

kquill Wrote:


It's a load of crap anyway as they know full bloody well there was no drugs crime committed,they just didn't appreciate getting caught out of their own people implicated,it caused them a loss of face.


Irronically, that is exactly what my lawyer told me when the news of Thep's pardon was announced. It's the courts way of concealing its wrongdoings - protecting those involved with the miscarriage of justice - and saving face in the process. What a bunch of shit!

In the wake of this huge anti-drug campaign, I also see these early release pardons as a way for the Thais to avoid building new prisons, because the 3 prisons which service Pattaya have reached record-breaking inmate populations, e.g. The Hilton, Nong Palai and Chonburi. Nong Palai was oringinally intended as a remand prison for those awaiting court trials and/or those who received sentences of less than 3 years for lessor offenses, which over the past 3 decades never had over 1,200 inmates. When I left Thailand back in early December the headcount was over 2,600 inmates. Over double the population of its planned capacity.

The drastic increase in the number of arrests over the past 8 months has also created a huge bottleneck in the Thai court system. There is a waiting line a mile long just to get a case motioned up and processed, and being detained in the local police stations like the Pattaya soi 9 station have a 45 day waiting list which exceeds to 30 days max that they are supposed to hold an arrested person before they can receive a court hearing. The legal infrastructure is not designed for this capacity and is about to bust. The BIB keep reporting the numbers...the money keeps pouring into the system...and they view these mass pardons simply as a means of relieving the pressure on the system, and at the same time, tossing the seeds (good, along with the bad) back on the fileds for another harvest. TIT!

Hi,

The numbers they cram into those cells is beyond sane peoples comprehension. There can be 80/90 in a space built for 25 people, far less( maybe eight),if it was for the same use in the UK.

Many cases will be not proven,petty crime,not guilty but no money for bail, and people who have beeen set up!!

A boy who has stolen a mobile phone will be next to a murderer,there is no separation in the cells. A major criminal and highly dangerous person,next to a 19 year old,who failed a pee test in Pattaya.

There is no fresh water,prisoners are fighting and use violence for water to wash in.

The open sewer toilets overflow with filth and excrement,and no water to take it way. Not even basic hygiene that would expect from any nation state.

They ought to be thoroughly ashamed.

This isn't being tough,this is denying basic human rights of food,water and shelter. The inmates can't even have a sleeping space,open toilets with five people trying to sleep in the open area as there is not sufficient space on the floor. This often leads to savage outbreaks of extreme violence.

Food,if you can call that disgusting stuff they give out, is covered in flies. Cats all over the prison in an attempt to keep vermin down. Guys turning up at their excuse of a medical centre, which has no medicine because the funds for medicine have been stolen,with serious skin infections due to filthy water, being givn two paracetemols and sent away.

Pattaya was and is the very worst of all of them combined,and they know it but do nothing about it,and nor can the Embassies mostly. Their written complaints are acknowledged then disregarded by the Thais

They should tear it down and start again, it is poor testament that the one built by the japanese in World War two in Bangkok with slave labour,is in a far better state than that slum they call Nong Palai. This place was only built nine years ago.

The authorities should hang their heads in shame,they are nothing short of barbarians. :crybaby: :crybaby:

I'll leave the subject now I think,it is a bit disturbing and it makes me puke that it is all covered up and white washed over. The worst thing that happens to a corrupt cop,is he moves to an inactive post to carry on his treachery somewhere else. :dontknow:

[bao-bao]

Thankfully I haven't been detained or incarcerated in Thailand, but as I wrote in my November "My Time In A Thailand Prison" post just visiting the holding areas was disturbing and moving enough for me.

I shudder to think of what it's like inside, and from what I've read (and been told by those who have been in a position to know) Mr. Quill's giving you a fairly clear representation of the places.

Glad he's safe and sound now.

[Dodger]

quill Wrote,


They should tear it down and start again, it is poor testament that the one built by the japanese in World War two in Bangkok with slave labour,is in a far better state than that slum they call Nong Palai. This place was only built nine years ago

Nong Palai looks like a WW2 concentration camp from the outside, and according to Thep it is as evan worse than you describe on the inside. Each prisoner gets the equivalent of 5 cups of dirty water when they shower. The water drips slowly from a pipe which runs along the ceiling. He says that sometimes he only gets a few drops on his forehead, and before I arrived in Thailand he didn't have any soap.

The first time I saw him in the visitors section I started to weep uncontrollably, even after programming myself to be strong and to stay positive during all my visits, I simply couldn't make it happen when I saw him for the first time. He is a slim boy to begin with - but he looked like a skelton. He was so infested with parasites which covered his arms and legs that he appeared as if he had lepracy. I had all I could do to stop myself from grabbing one of the security guards in the vistors section and ripping his head off his shoulders. This level of inhumanity was simply beyond my comprehension.

The only good thing was the fact that these animals were so corrupt that it provided me the avenue I needed to get Thep the things he needed to survive. First I obtained perscripton-strenth cream which rids parasites. I had to slip this small package along with 1,500 baht into the hands of a police women who is officed near the outside visitation buidling. Thep received the cream 24 hours later and the parasites were completely gone in 3 days. I immediately focued on improving his diet, thus the reason for my daily visits to NP. His daily rations now included 1 chicken, 1 pizza, 4 bottles of water, 2 cartons of milk, 2 packages of rice noodles, 1 fruit yogurt, and i carton of L&M's. He doesn't smoke, but as you know a carton of farang cigarettes is worth its weight in gold. He always gives them to his cell boss for protection and special favors. His locker was also immdeiately filled with the non-perishable necessities, e.g., bar sopa, shampoo, extra t shirts and shorts, skin lotion, etc.

I also found a good sponsor for Thep to look after his needs while I'm here working in the States. Her name is Wan and her husband is pulling 3 years in NP for drug possession. Wan is a university graduiate, speaks fluent English, lives 1 km from NP, and owns her own business in PTY. She became my best friend during this ordeal and I grew to trust her. After stocking Theps NP bank account with enough money to hold him during our separation, I also gave Wan enough funds to provide additional food for Thep. She now visits him twice per week and acts as the communication point between Thep, his family and myself. I talk to her on the phone every Sunday - and she has now become good friends with Thep's mother and father. They even stay at her home when they visit NP - which isn't often because they live 11 hours away and have their farm chores, but at least there is a connection now which serves Thep well.

All that I've done, and it does nothing whatsoever from keeping me tossing and turning at night trying not to think about this. Every time I sit in a restaurant staring at a hot plate of food I find myself losing my appetite. December seems so far away.

Dodger:

You seem like such a good person. Hopefully, you will be rewarded for all the kind things you are doing for your friend.

All my best to you and Thep!

[Diec]

Dodgey, the love you show for your drug addled lover brings me to tears. Does he know how much you love him? To see him upon visitaition infested with bugs, and the fact that you paid to have him deloused speaks volumes about your character. Thep needs the love that only you can give him. When Thep gets out of prison, please give us an update on his condition.

[catawampuscat]

Brilliant postings from kquill and dodger.

I had a brief encounter with the judicial system myself and fortunately with a happier ending..
I was called, early one morning a couple of years ago, by a Thai guy to let me know my regular guy was in Soi 9 jail, Pattaya..

The holding cell was crowded but otherwise in reasonable condition from what I could see..
It turned out that my guy got into trouble while drunk and
had an altercation with a policeman.. I heard from one of the officials that something like 25,000B. would take care of the situation.
No doubt the sight of a farang inflated what it would take and in my best Thai, I responded mai dai (cannot).
I was pissed off that he got into a fight while drunk and that I was in Soi 9 at that early hour but
I did provide him with drinks,baht and some food and cigarettes (universal jail currency).
By the next day, I was reconsidering my decision not to pay off but soon thereafter, I received another call that he was in
the courthouse.
I went over there (between Jomtien and Pattaya) with a good translator ( thuggish motorbike driver I knew).. It turned out
my guy was fined 500B. by the court and upon my paying the 500B., he was released.. Had I not paid the 500B. he would have been kept for a month or more in lieu of paying the fine..
I was glad I hadn't panicked and jumped the gun and that I didn't pay the 25,000B. My guess is that the result would have been the same except someone would have pocketed some easy money..

I post this only as an example of what can happen. Many other financial decisions with this same guy were absurd and like many of us, I put out for mobile after mobile, motorbike and even a stop or two at the gold store... But , at least I got it right once :cat:

Cat,Diec,Dodger,bao bao,

All of you guys and more of you that I haven't managed to mention for fear of overkill, make this a good board to post on when it matters!

Dodger,

I have sent you a pm but it is saying it is in my outbox, How does that work out??,and have you received it as its important. :hello2:

[Surfcrest]

I've been following this for a while since I first saw something about it a while back (Thai Visa?). I did it again this weekend. A run through the 1000+ users online (Bangkok) at any time searching for "high" revealed the numbers of them are INSIGNIFICANT. Not worth getting dramatic about. Less than 1.5% Less than 1 per page each of the 20+ pages. Some of these profiles are "actors" out for whatever (clothing designers? - the lighting on their models is just too professional ;-) ). More subtle "variations" of "high"?? "Hi" is one. There are more of these, but probably are just what that is, "HELLO" - Thais thinking that's just something needed to say to break in to what they have to say. A search for "drugs" reveals only "NO DRUGS" written in profiles (1%). So as you will give those few boys a miss, some are doing that as well. BTW, GR does not have a subtle "are you interested in ... " question, so maybe the few feel the need to make it obvious. MOST profiles seem quite innocent. What they want is their business, I think the 1000+ regular users hope that some here would mind theirs.
I have not checked the Pattaya online section.

I've seen quite a few online with "High" or variations of the same terminology with the same connotations. Worse still is that even if you make it clear right from the start that you aren't into that sort of thing it still comes up in conversation, especially afterwards when he's talking about getting together again sometime and "Have you ever tried......? And do you think we could get into a little......?"
It's really too bad because some of these guys are worth a second go or more until they mention this.

Surfcrest