Advice about first trip to Bangkok

[goteed1]

Will be in Bangkok for the Thanksgiving holiday 2011. I'm there from 11/25 - 12/3 and wondering if I should split the trip with a short trip to one of the beach cities. I've been lurking here and reading all the info but I honestly have no idea which one beach city is any better than the other. I'm probably looking for nightlife at the beach city as well as typical beach acitivities. I'm wondering if it's worth a 2 or 3 night side trip? Knowing what you know now after many visits, how would you plan your first trip? Appreciate your feedback.

Thanks


max

[RichLB]

Congratulations on your decision to visit Thailand. You will love it. But, you've asked a tough question. Bangkok is a big city with lots to see. My feeling, though, is that 3 or 4 days there are enough time to visit the tourist destinations and pick up the flavor of the city. For a gay visitor, the nightlife can not be beat, but the fast pace of the city can be wearing during daytime hours.

I'd encourage you to add a visit to a beach city. But, which one depends so much on your personal tastes and what you like to do. My choice is Pattaya. It is not a pretty city but offers a variety of touristy things to do during the day and has 3 main gay zones (Pattayaland, Sunee Plaza, and Jomtien Complex). It also offers a gay beach for relaxation and "socializing" in the Jomtien area. After my first visit to Pattaya, years ago, I fell in love with it and have retired here.

Phuket (Patong Beach) is a far prettier place. While there is nightlife there, I find it limited. There just aren't enough bars in Paradise Complex to keep my interested. The beach is pristine, but as far as I know there is no gay area. My problem with Phuket is that it is just all too sparkling new (since the tsunami) and filled with lots and lots of young tourists from Europe and Russia. I don't get the feel that I am in Thailand in Phuket.

If it's quiet and relaxation you are seeking, you might think about beaching it on one of the islands. Samui is popular and does have a little gay night life. I'm sure there are other islands with more idylic settings, but i have not been to many.

If the beach is not central to you, you might consider adding Chiang Mai to your itinerary. Personally, I find the place boring, but those who ive there love it. It does offer elephant rides and, of course, Doi Suthep. It's the other main tourist destination in Thailand, though.

Make sure, though, to make reservations early when you visit. You are planning on coming during one of the busiest periods and hotels fill up fast.

[pong]

this last is bull-s..t. You find hotels a plenty and for Thailand it is not (yet) high season at all. Unless you only for 100% want to stick to the overpriced few ''gay'' hotels always listed/mentioned here. Us-TG is not a specific Thai thing at all either.
Pattaya is far closer to BKK as Phuket-a 2 hr busride vs. a 1,30 hr flight+all the checkins etc. Also; in THAT time of year wheather tends to be unstable in Phuket-this=last year was part. bad re rains then. But you might just toss a coin if you are undecied. Also you did not give any clue as to what you like or want to see/do otherwise, some/many people really dislike this big city here (BKK), others get to love it.

Sex or sand which comes first?

[RichLB]

In spite of Pong's assurance, DO make reservations. I have recently had a friend come to Pattaya only to find every hotel full and the only place he could find was a small hotel on the dark side (across Sukhumvit). And, again, Pong is wrong. The period between Thanksgiving and Christmas are particularly busy and with the Russians here running from the snow it is likely to be even more crowded during the period of time you are considering visiting.

In spite of Pong's assurance, DO make reservations. I have recently had a friend come to Pattaya only to find every hotel full ...

RichLB is correct - make a reservation. I too had friends in Pattaya week before last who arrived unexpectedly (on a Saturday night, mind you) and without reservations. We tried several hotels and most were completely full, with others able to offer only either a single night or a single top of the house room with price to match. They ended up paying 3000B a night in desperation (very nice room though) which they did not want to do

You have NOTHING to lose by booking in advance.


Good luck!

My honest oppinion is visit the highlights, ou dont have much time at all. Sooooooooooooo

Fly to Singapore and get to Pulau Lankawi (simple ferry) and from there to Ko Lipe simple ferry..or go to the South by bus and etc

(From November to May, ferries to Ko Tarutao and Ko Lipe leave daily from the jetty at Pak Bara, 60km north of Satun in southern Thailand. Boats also run to Ko Lipe from Pulau Langkawi, which is served by regular flights from Singapore and Kuala Lumpur.)

Enjoy and send a post card. :bee:

You can avoid Bangkok entirely, save it for a rainy day. :bis:

[Jason1988]

You may want to split your time between Bangkok and Pattaya. I have enjoyed Pattaya so much that there have been a few trips that I went directly from the Bangkok airport to Pattaya and returned to the airport without staying in Bangkok. Pattaya is not that far away and easy reachable from Bangkok.

[thonglor55]

Congratulations on your decision to visit Thailand. You will love it. He may hate it - some people do. The best you can say is "Many people love it".

[thrillbill]

If it is your first time in Bangkok you should also include seeing the sights along with your gay entertainment (4 days).It looks like you have a week only, so there isn't much time to fly to Phuket for the beach. You can take a taxi down to Pattaya (1000-1200 baht if you bargain hard) which takes less than 90 minutes and enjoy the change of pace there. You will need to do your homework on where u want to stay in Pattaya since things are spread out (the gay beach is not walking distance from Boystown but you hop on a baht bus). 'When it is time to leave Thailand, it is only a 800 baht taxi ride to the international airport. Personally I prefer Phuket gay area over Pattaya but that is probably because I live/work in Pattaya.

[fedssocr]

you shouldn't have to bargain at all to get from BKK to Pattaya for 1200. That is the rate car/limo services charge. Book a return trip and it can be done a little more cheaply.

I think the Bangkok/Pattaya duo makes sense with only a week. Each has its supporters and detractors. I love Bangkok and it's insanity. I hated Pattaya the first time I went there but it has grown on me somewhat. Nice for a few days, but not too much longer for me.

[goteed1]

Thanks for all the input. Looks like Pattaya is the concensus so far. Also, I just priced out airfare to Phuket from BKK and back and didn't realize it was so expensive. Are there any areas in Pattaya that you would recommend? Specific Hotels? I don't have a specific agenda as to whether I need to be closer to nightlife or the ocean. I'm totally open and budget is open as well.

Thanks again

max

[Smiles]

" ... Thanks for all the input. Looks like Pattaya is the concensus so far ... "
Max, just be sure of what you are thinking of when you say "beach cities" ... as you do in your original post.

Pattaya/Jomtien have 'beaches', but they are pure krud. Pattaya Beach is flithy, arguably unswimmable, crowded, hooker-infested, with terrible so-called 'sand' which is in fact, simply grit.
Jomtien has a large gay beach area with pleasant under-umbrella seating and a plethora of eye-candy wandering by. But the sea there is also quite foul ... slightly better than Pattaya Beach, but I wouldn't put a big toe in that soup.

Phuket, although much further afield, at least has decent sandy beaches, and Patong Beach has a reasonable gay scene.

[goteed1]

Smiles,

You bring up some good points to consider. I was looking at airfare for that time period from BKK to HKT and the cheapest right now is a $250 USD round trip fare. Is this a good fare? I'm not sure what to expect for the cost of the trip and that would probably factor in the decision.

Thanks

[Jellybean]

I would echo the majority of posts so far and recommend Bangkok and Pattaya on your first trip. If you feel up to it, it would be great to read your account of your trip in due course. I hope you enjoy your first trip, which if you do тАЬlove itтАЭ will, I am sure, be the first of many. Chock-dee krap (Good luck!)

Honestly if you want clean beaches and chance encounter with the love of your life in a tropical paradise then re-read my post. Do Bangkok as an after thought or on your second visit cause you will be hooked no doubt. Culturaly BK is a must but for the moment let your heart find the essenc of Thailand as it always was..........you dont have much time at all. :bounce:

[thonglor55]

...but for the moment let your heart find the essenc of Thailand as it always was....Hookers?

[Dboy]

you shouldn't have to bargain at all to get from BKK to Pattaya for 1200.

there's even a way to do it for FREE:-) If you stay at Dynasty Bangkok (Suk Soi 4), they will give you a free ride down to Pattaya if you stay a night at the Dynasty there (Soi 13). Yea I know neither property is in a gay area, but it's an option.

Another option is a mini-bus arranged by many of the tourist shops in Bangkok. Should be less than 500Bt, the downside being that they take longer to get you where you're going.

Cheaper than the mini-bus, you can bus from Ekamai (aka "East Bus Terminal) for 110bt or so.

Old hands probably know these routes already, but good to know for someone new.


dboy

[Beachlover]

Will be in Bangkok for the Thanksgiving holiday 2011.
Bangkok is one of the greatest cities of the world in my opinion. I had a pretty poor opinion of it on my first trip so foolishly only spent one night there but I've been back countless times since. I never run out of stuff to do in Bangkok. The hustle and bustle will leave you buzzing, shopping is great, food is fantastic and the nightlife is awesome... I get almost no sleep when I'm in Bangkok!

There's a good thread here about stuff to do in Bangkok: gay-thailand-f9/trip-ideas-for-things-bkk-t20256.html (http://www.sawatdee-gay-thailand.com/forum/gay-thailand-f9/trip-ideas-for-things-bkk-t20256.html)


wondering if I should split the trip with a short trip to one of the beach cities. I've been lurking here and reading all the info but I honestly have no idea which one beach city is any better than the other. I'm probably looking for nightlife at the beach city as well as typical beach acitivities. I'm wondering if it's worth a 2 or 3 night side trip? Knowing what you know now after many visits, how would you plan your first trip? Appreciate your feedback.
Need to consider transit time for Phuket is about double that of Pattaya, but I believe it's worth it.

Bangkok to Pattaya door to door transit time is about 1 hr 45 mins. Cost is about 900 baht (from airport) to 1,300 baht (from Bangkok city) by meter taxi (no booking) going there and 500-900 baht coming back (negotiate). If you choose to visit Pattaya, head directly there when you step off the plane. The airport is partway between Bangkok city centre and Pattaya so this will save you a little time.

Bangkok to Phuket (Patong Beach) door to door transit time is about 3.5 hrs and cost each way is about 2,250 baht (250 for BKK airport taxi, 1,500 flight approx, 500 Phuket airport taxi).

Personally, if it was my FIRST trip I'd do Phuket instead of Pattaya.

Pattaya has better nightlife but totally sh*t beaches. The two beaches - (1) Pattaya Beach isn't really a beach I'd barely consider going for a run on and (2) Jomtien Beach is nice enough and spacious but the water's crap and it is not a visually appealing setting at all. Pattaya also has a bit of a seedy, Wild West "anything goes" atmosphere which you may or may not like.

Phuket is slightly more expensive. Nightlife isn't as good and it is a bit of a tourist trap so watch out for rip off attempts but you get (1) beautiful beach... one of the nicest developed beaches in the world and (2) lots of beach and water type activities to do and a gorgeous picturesque paradise like setting.

If it's your first time there you should definitely (1) do one of the speed boat trips where they take you island hopping for a day and they drop you off at some nice snorkeling spots. The islands around Phuket are your classic tropical paradise, and (2) do a sea kayaking/canoeing trip to explore some of the "hongs". Hongs are lagoons in the middle of islands only accessible by sea caves and one of the "great natural wonders" of Thailand. Have to see them once in your life.

Go with a company called "The Original Sea Canoe Company" (most tour agent tables will have their pamphlet) and do the "self paddle" trip. They are slightly more expensive but offer a quality experience where you get to explore and do what you want at your pace, instead of being herded around and waiting at each island for them to offload/onload 30 inflatables and 60 tourists. Highly recommended.

Have fun!


I was looking at airfare for that time period from BKK to HKT and the cheapest right now is a $250 USD round trip fare. Is this a good fare? I'm not sure what to expect for the cost of the trip and that would probably factor in the decision.
What airlines are you looking at? Go for LCC (low cost carriers). The two I know fly the Phuket-BKK route are AirAsia and Nok Air. I've never paid more than 1,500 for it.


You have NOTHING to lose by booking in advance.
Not entirely true. Booking in advance can mean you lose a little flexibility and any advance payment if you change plans depending on the place you're booking into. Some take a deposit (so you don't lose everything if you cancel). A lot of hotels I book into offer a 14-day advance rate at a discount so I always take this if I'm sure of my plans.

You should book ahead if you're certain of your plans. Otherwise, leave it open.

I doubt anyone would have issues finding last-minute accommodation in Pattaya unless it's in a super-peak period (e.g. New Years/Xmas) or they're budget-restricted. I read the story of RichLB's friend and I'm guessing he was looking for under-1,000 baht accommodation so that's fair enough.

....I never run out of stuff to do in Bangkok....

I know the feeling, dear ....So Many Men, So Little Time.....you're not Miquel Brown are you?

:laughing3:


[youtube:rsqyppr4]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n_MiRWo4Myw[/youtube:rsqyppr4]

I would suggest you spend a few days in Bangkok. Forgo the beach and go to Chiang Mai!

I would suggest you spend a few days in Bangkok. Forgo the beach and go to Chiang Mai!

Why Chiang Mai?

[Beachlover]

you're not Miquel Brown are you?
Christ, Scotty... you're like a history lesson sometimes. WHAT era was that from? LOL

I would suggest you spend a few days in Bangkok. Forgo the beach and go to Chiang Mai!

Why Chiang Mai?


Pattaya is well past it's prime it also has a an ugly beach and filthy water, on the other hand if you have never been to Thailand before and prefer a city Chiang Mai give you the flavor of Thailand! If gay nitelife is important to you I think it has been less negatively impacted than either Bangkok or Pattaya.

... Chiang Mai give you the flavor of Thailand! If gay nitelife is important to you I think it has been less negatively impacted than either Bangkok or Pattaya.

Went once - spent a week bored out of my head. Never again.

If your idea of nightlife is 2 boys shuffling in a gogo bar then it's fine. Otherwise, it's a dead loss.

Like anywhere it depends what you're looking for - I'm looking for fun.

:occasion9:

... Chiang Mai give you the flavor of Thailand! If gay nitelife is important to you I think it has been less negatively impacted than either Bangkok or Pattaya.

Went once - spent a week bored out of my head. Never again.

If your idea of nightlife is 2 boys shuffling in a gogo bar then it's fine. Otherwise, it's a dead loss.

Like anywhere it depends what you're looking for - I'm looking for fun.

:occasion9:


I guess I must have went to the other Chiang Mai.
:occasion9:

I also prefer Pattaya to Bangkok but that was after I spent a week there and took in all the usual tourist sights. I think a day trip to Pattaya is the easiest thing to do.

You can get there for something like 200 baht if you take a minibus. The catch is that you'll need a Thai speaker/boy to take you since nobody will speak English. To me it makes more sense to spend that 1k baht on the boy than a cab...that way you'll have a tour guide/translator with you the whole time. On a short trip you don't want to waste a lot of time figuring out how to get to where you're going, etc.

[thonglor55]

....I never run out of stuff to do in Bangkok....And it's so refreshing being able to step out of the closet, isn't it (not like being in stifling Sydney)?

[goteed1]

Wow, thanks for all of the input. I still haven't made up my mind but this really helps.


What airlines are you looking at? Go for LCC (low cost carriers). The two I know fly the Phuket-BKK route are AirAsia and Nok Air. I've never paid more than 1,500 for it.



Thanks for that, I had been using Kayak.com, but didn't realize that these 2 airlines aren't selling seats that far in advance yet, but some test dates show that this is definitely an affordable option. Looks like around $100 USD RT.


Honestly if you want clean beaches and chance encounter with the love of your life in a tropical paradise then re-read my post

Ha! Thanks, I am not looking for a chance encounter with the love of my life. I hear your warning about Bangkok, but I love big busy cities, can't wait to see it.

Is there that much difference between the nightlife of Phuket and Pattaya? Phuket looks easier to get around as well. Ocean views prettier in one or the other cities? These are the few remaining questions for me.

You're getting totally different kinds of advice because you're never quite stated what your interests are except "beach"and "nightlife". Your more recent reply helped a little when you said you love busy cities.

Lots of people come to Thailand for different reasons. Some hate cities and are here chasing the dream of an idyllic tropical paradise -- though I doubt if anyone has found it yet. Others are here to find "the love of their life". From their perspectives and experience, you will necessarily get very different advice.

Of course there is the problem of you not having seen Thailand before and thus it is hard for you to state your preferences. Let me try to help by creating simple lists of what you are likely to be confronted with in each of three places. Why don't you tell us then, which of these items interest you? Then people can help better.

BANGKOK
10 - 12 million people
Palaces and temples, many suffering tour group crush
Shopping, from cheap bazaars to Milan fashion in glitzy shopping malls
Congested streets, traffic jams, beggars, vendors, buskers, political demonstrations
Urban rail; taxis where you may have to haggle sometimes
River rides; dinner cruises
Traditional Thai dancing; dinner theatre
Modern cinemas with latest releases, though you have to stand up for the king or else risk jail
Over sixty men-on-men massage parlours, with happy endings
Bathhouses, though most customers therein spurn White men, except in Babylon
Gay dance clubs heaving with sweaty bodies some of which are for hire
Gogo bars with real fucking on stage
Noise, pollution, aggressive touts
. . . . ah, the wonderful city life!

PATTAYA
Population perhaps 200,000
No building older than 50 years; any building that is more than 10 years old will look unfit for habitation
Vendors have taken over every usable metre of sidewalk selling knock-offs of every conceivable kind
Songtaews and motorcycles for transport
Crazy White trash and Arab tourists speed around on their rented motorbikes without any licence
One bathhouse, reported to have White:Thai customers in 3:1 ratio
Countless open-air bars for elderly gay White men to drink themselves silly while being flattered by young Thai waiters out to earn a tip
Gogo bars where you may be the only customer, faced with 20 hungry gogo boys desperate for income
Men-on-men massage parlours that know not the first thing about massage -- but then neither do their customers
Late-night dance bars where you are totally ignored if you go alone
Cabaret shows featuring 70-year-old drag queens from Blackpool, lip-syncing to songs no one under the age of 45 has ever heard of
Alley after alley packed with honky-tonk bars; girls call you "handsome" when you walk past
Beach fronting a sea that is little more than the extension of the muddy estuary of the Chao Phraya River
. . . . Ah, the wonderful pleasures of Sodom-on-Sea

PHUKET - PATONG BEACH
Population perhaps 50,000
No building older than 50 years; any building that is more than 10 years old will look unfit for habitation
Dusty roads, no sidewalk, vehicles shave your arm as they go past
No transport of any kind that is not an outrageous price-gouging scam
Several day-tour options including boat-trips along with camera-happy packaged tourists
Gay life confined to one alley
A handful of gogo bars where you may be the only customer, faced with 20 hungry gogo boys desperate for income
Cabana bars where freelancers come up to you to tell you that you're extremely sexy and can we go back to your room honey?
Nowhere else to go on the second night because there's only one alley and you're not keen to meet the same guy who called you honey but turned out to be a dud in the room
Meals at prices halfway to European prices
Beach indeed faces ocean and looks beautiful until you meet the swarms of stinging jellyfish in the water
Ride a jetski and experience a life-threatening experience when the jetski operator says you've damaged his vehicle and must hand over your life-savings to compensate
. . . . Ah, the beauty of Paradise-on-the-Andaman

PHUKET - OTHER BEACHES
Four- and five-star self-contained resorts strung out on the West coast of Phuket island
Separated from each other by golf courses and headlands jutting into the sea
Beautiful sunsets, then go to bed at 9 p.m. since there's nothing else to do
No transport of any kind to Patong Beach unless you hire a hotel limousine -- and then how do you get back?
No gay life except the swishy waiter in the Oyster Bar
. . . . Ah, the peace and quiet of tropical exile

---

Run it by me again please: Why do we like Thailand so much?

Oh yea Phuket is much prettier than Pattaya the beaches are nicer cleaner the people friendly and many gay Westerners (not quite the same quality of gay as in Pattaya....) have holiday homes there. You can also do nice boat trips to nearby Islands. :glasses7:

Oh I forgot you dont need the gay ghetto in Phucket, its only one lane anyway. In Phucket you may meet charming local gays anywhere, even on a shady little dust road full of delicious cooking smells wafting through the coconut groves, playing children and naughty dogs. It still has some charm where Pattaya well :8( since Neddies closed not even the burgers are any good. Go South you absolutely should on a first trip.

Is there that much difference between the nightlife of Phuket and Pattaya?

There's nothing fancy about Pattaya--people go there for the boys and perhaps due to its proximity to Bangkok, which makes it an easy day trip. Phuket is more expensive/upscale and more of a vacation destination.

Is there that much difference between the nightlife of Phuket and Pattaya?

There's nothing fancy about Pattaya--people go there for the boys and perhaps due to its proximity to Bangkok, which makes it an easy day trip. Phuket is more expensive/upscale and more of a vacation destination.

There is nothing upscale about the gay nightlife in Phuket - many of the smaller beer in the Paradise Centre bars are downright squalid (I have had cockroaches run over me) and the gogo/showbars are no better than in Pattaya.

The Phuket boys have a less commercial attitude though - but thats just my experience and opinion.


:occasion9:

[RichLB]

I guess Macaronni prefers Bangkok, but let me amend his review of Pattaya with a less jaundice eye.

Pattaya -

Population perhaps 200,000 - that's most probably correct but the population varies with the season.

No building older than 50 years; any building that is more than 10 years old will look unfit for habitation. - there are plenty of older buildings in Pattaya in the French colonial style, but the city blossomed after the Vietnam War and as a consequence these older structures are surrounded by sparkling modern buildings.

Vendors have taken over every usable metre of sidewalk selling knock-offs of every conceivable kind - Yep, plenty of street life with vendors selling food, trinkets, and other items popular with the passers by. Different from BKK, though, the sidewalks are more than ample for strolling past them.

Songtaews and motorcycles for transport - True

Crazy White trash and Arab tourists speed around on their rented motorbikes without any licence - Driving in Pattaya can be an adventure. I don't think it's accurate to put the blame on just farang and Arabs, though. Young Thais, like kids everywhere, seem to believe they are immortal and drive accordingly.

One bathhouse, reported to have White:Thai customers in 3:1 ratio - If it's sexual encounters you seek there are actually two now. The new Thermae has just opened, but has not had time to catch on yet. If it's a real sauna you seek, there are tons of them here that are popular with both Thais and farang.

Countless open-air bars for elderly gay White men to drink themselves silly while being flattered by young Thai waiters out to earn a tip - Well, there ARE numerous open air bars, but few that cater to gays are populated by the clientele Macaroni seems to find. Most are relaxed, accommodating venues with a wide age range of customers and nice Thai guys eager to meet farang.

Gogo bars where you may be the only customer, faced with 20 hungry gogo boys desperate for income - and plenty others where you may have trouble finding a seat and while the guys are always happy to get to know you I hardly think desperate is the appropriate word.

Men-on-men massage parlours that know not the first thing about massage -- but then neither do their customers - and even more where the masseurs are trained and skilled in the art of massage.

Late-night dance bars where you are totally ignored if you go alone - I suppose that could be true since the late night discos are for those who want to dance and party with their friends. I doubt you would be ignored if you reached out to people, though.

Cabaret shows featuring 70-year-old drag queens from Blackpool, lip-syncing to songs no one under the age of 45 has ever heard of - Yep, those kinds of places exist for reasons that elude me. But, Macaronni left out those shows featuring beautiful Thai Katoeys in shows that rival Las Vegas style productions for those who like this kind of entertainment.

Alley after alley packed with honky-tonk bars; girls call you "handsome" when you walk past - Yep, that's true and isn't it fun when that happens?

Beach fronting a sea that is little more than the extension of the muddy estuary of the Chao Phraya River - While Pattaya beaches aren't the cleanest in the country, they hardly match that description. The gay beach is fun, relaxing, and never boring.

The review also left out all the other positive attractions of Pattaya. A quick Google search wil present you with lists of tourist attractions which will keep you busy for as long as you have energy to visit them. For shopping you have a range from the usual junkie kind of stuff found in any tourist city to upscale European fashions in the 6 story new Central Mall. He also failed to mention the enormous selection of restaurants in Pattaya with food at a fraction of the cost found in Bangkok and prepared by 5 star chefs who have settled in Pattaya for "retirement". He also left out the other farang a tourist is likely to meet. Pattaya hosts a friendly community of expats who are always eager to befriend visitors. Pattaya may not be everyone's first choice, but it hardly resembles the description presented by Macaronni.

[Thai Dyed]

You're getting totally different kinds of advice because you're never quite stated what your interests are except "beach"and "nightlife". Your more recent reply helped a little when you said you love busy cities.

Lots of people come to Thailand for different reasons. Some hate cities and are here chasing the dream of an idyllic tropical paradise -- though I doubt if anyone has found it yet. Others are here to find "the love of their life". From their perspectives and experience, you will necessarily get very different advice.

Of course there is the problem of you not having seen Thailand before and thus it is hard for you to state your preferences. Let me try to help by creating simple lists of what you are likely to be confronted with in each of three places. Why don't you tell us then, which of these items interest you? Then people can help better.

BANGKOK
10 - 12 million people
Palaces and temples, many suffering tour group crush
Shopping, from cheap bazaars to Milan fashion in glitzy shopping malls
Congested streets, traffic jams, beggars, vendors, buskers, political demonstrations
Urban rail; taxis where you may have to haggle sometimes
River rides; dinner cruises
Traditional Thai dancing; dinner theatre
Modern cinemas with latest releases, though you have to stand up for the king or else risk jail
Over sixty men-on-men massage parlours, with happy endings
Bathhouses, though most customers therein spurn White men, except in Babylon
Gay dance clubs heaving with sweaty bodies some of which are for hire
Gogo bars with real fucking on stage
Noise, pollution, aggressive touts
. . . . ah, the wonderful city life!

PATTAYA
Population perhaps 200,000
No building older than 50 years; any building that is more than 10 years old will look unfit for habitation
Vendors have taken over every usable metre of sidewalk selling knock-offs of every conceivable kind
Songtaews and motorcycles for transport
Crazy White trash and Arab tourists speed around on their rented motorbikes without any licence
One bathhouse, reported to have White:Thai customers in 3:1 ratio
Countless open-air bars for elderly gay White men to drink themselves silly while being flattered by young Thai waiters out to earn a tip
Gogo bars where you may be the only customer, faced with 20 hungry gogo boys desperate for income
Men-on-men massage parlours that know not the first thing about massage -- but then neither do their customers
Late-night dance bars where you are totally ignored if you go alone
Cabaret shows featuring 70-year-old drag queens from Blackpool, lip-syncing to songs no one under the age of 45 has ever heard of
Alley after alley packed with honky-tonk bars; girls call you "handsome" when you walk past
Beach fronting a sea that is little more than the extension of the muddy estuary of the Chao Phraya River
. . . . Ah, the wonderful pleasures of Sodom-on-Sea

PHUKET - PATONG BEACH
Population perhaps 50,000
No building older than 50 years; any building that is more than 10 years old will look unfit for habitation
Dusty roads, no sidewalk, vehicles shave your arm as they go past
No transport of any kind that is not an outrageous price-gouging scam
Several day-tour options including boat-trips along with camera-happy packaged tourists
Gay life confined to one alley
A handful of gogo bars where you may be the only customer, faced with 20 hungry gogo boys desperate for income
Cabana bars where freelancers come up to you to tell you that you're extremely sexy and can we go back to your room honey?
Nowhere else to go on the second night because there's only one alley and you're not keen to meet the same guy who called you honey but turned out to be a dud in the room
Meals at prices halfway to European prices
Beach indeed faces ocean and looks beautiful until you meet the swarms of stinging jellyfish in the water
Ride a jetski and experience a life-threatening experience when the jetski operator says you've damaged his vehicle and must hand over your life-savings to compensate
. . . . Ah, the beauty of Paradise-on-the-Andaman

PHUKET - OTHER BEACHES
Four- and five-star self-contained resorts strung out on the West coast of Phuket island
Separated from each other by golf courses and headlands jutting into the sea
Beautiful sunsets, then go to bed at 9 p.m. since there's nothing else to do
No transport of any kind to Patong Beach unless you hire a hotel limousine -- and then how do you get back?
No gay life except the swishy waiter in the Oyster Bar
. . . . Ah, the peace and quiet of tropical exile

---

Run it by me again please: Why do we like Thailand so much?

This review deserves a prize. It's one of the best I have ever read! Huzzah, Huzzah macaroni!

A good compromise would be Hua Hin or nearby its cleanwaters and upmarket with typical thai scenes. Gay life petite and charmingly relaxed, stunning beache/s some lovely places to go in the surrounds, not too far in a taxi or train from BK. Or self drive. Some nice backpackers places in the area plus upmarket boutique style resorts, not sure bout the rest of the accomadation in the slightly built up are central area as I was there ten years ago and there wasnt much, but it seems your regular good hotel should be there . :happy7:
Ask Smiles.
http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5293/5396906183_190c6a7146.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/64918943@N00/5396906183/)

http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5211/5397548318_69ab84f9a0.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/64918943@N00/5397548318/)

[Beachlover]

Thanks for that, I had been using Kayak.com, but didn't realize that these 2 airlines aren't selling seats that far in advance yet, but some test dates show that this is definitely an affordable option. Looks like around $100 USD RT... Ocean views prettier in one or the other cities? These are the few remaining questions for me.
I don't think low-cost carriers (LCCs) are accessible through most online booking sites. You have to go to their own website to book.

Ocean views definitely prettier in Phuket. Pattaya has sh*t views.


Pattaya--people go there for the boys and perhaps due to its proximity to Bangkok, which makes it an easy day trip.
Why a day trip? That doesn't make sense at all. If you do a day trip you're spending 3.5-4rs of that day in transit there and back and probably 8-10hrs on the ground there at most. Plus, if you're going there for gogo boys a day trip means you probably won't be taking one back to your loom.

An overnight trip makes sense, but a day trip isn't worth it.


There is nothing upscale about the gay nightlife in Phuket
I think he was talking about the place in general... beaches etc. I agree Pattaya nightlife is better. Not as good as Bangkok!

An overnight trip makes sense, but a day trip isn't worth it.

I personally wouldn't leave Bangkok at all if I were only going for one week and it was my first time there. There's plenty to do for a week and I don't find that much travel to be relaxing.

[chillnorth]

The OP indicates he's from SFO. No shortage of sea and scenery there. The reviews and viewpoints make a great read, but I agree with mlomker: Book but don't pre-pay a nice gay-friendly hotel near Silom for the entire stay and be prepared to check out and move on if you get bored in BKK or find another place more interesting once you're in-country. I spent months planning my first trip to Thailand years ago, admittedly part of the fun, but it was all out the window within two days. At the time of year you're visiting the only place you might run into hotel issues would be Chiang Mai, as it's just after the Loy Krathong festival and a lot of tourists hang on for a week or so. Nice city, but as reported it is not the Vegas of the North. For all of the negatives quoted by people who know it maybe too well, I do think a couple of nights in Pattaya (and a couple of days at Jomtien) would be in order just because there' s no place quite like it, for good and ill.

I think anyone who goes to Thailand on a first visit just for sex tourism is a dolt and a cultural heathen!

You see even if you go for the "right" reasons you will still make friends, so why limit yourself to go go bars in Pattaya or even Bangkok?

The flesh trade is the least exiting thing about Thailand, leave that to the breeders. You will find a sincere and lovely person "male" in almost every town you visit and he will be delighted that you are there. :love4:

[Beachlover]

personally wouldn't leave Bangkok at all if I were only going for one week and it was my first time there. There's plenty to do for a week and I don't find that much travel to be relaxing.
First trip to Thailand, you want to do the tropical paradise beach thing as well as the big Asian city thing... so for 1 week I'd do 3 days Phuket and 4 days Bangkok.

[Surfcrest]

Pattaya has sh*t views.


Have you even been to Pattaya?

Surfcrest

http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y69/Surfcrest/riohj721.jpg

http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y69/Surfcrest/2009/IMG_0704.jpg

[Brad the Impala]

Pattaya has sh*t views.


Have you even been to Pattaya?

Surfcrest

http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y69/Surfcrest/riohj721.jpg


Oh yeah, if you can get on the six inches of sand between the front row of deckchairs and the sea, you get a really good view of the bay!

[firecat69]

You are from SanFrancisco so beautiful views and beaches are available to you. You are coming for boys or culture or both Bangkok is your best bet on the first trip. It will be impossible for you to get bored in 7days. It is more likely you will tire yourself out just walking and of course night time activities.

I would definitely not recommend going to Phuket on the first trip. First it is at least 3 1/2 hours each way when you take into account driving to the airport, arriving at least an hour before your flight, flight time and then another 45 minutes driving time to Phuket.

If you want to go some place else check with your Bangkok Hotel and get Bell Transportation (I think) cheap and fast to Pattaya. 2 hours maximum door to door or hire a car for 1000-1200 baht. This could easily be a 1 or 2 night trip without a lot of wasted time in airports etc and of course always the chance your flight will be delayed and more wasted time.

Save Phuket and Chiang Mai for your next trip which I am sure you will make.

Oh yeah, if you can get on the six inches of sand between the front row of deckchairs and the sea, you get a really good view of the bay!

Or the sewage floating in the water Brad.

[Thai Dyed]

Oh yeah, if you can get on the six inches of sand between the front row of deckchairs and the sea, you get a really good view of the bay!

Did somebody put sand in your Vaseline again Brad?
Look, it's not the six inches of sand that brings people in droves to Pattaya. It's a different six inches. Maybe if you ask politely, Combat will help you. He's the resident expert on telling shit from Shinola... spends all his free time studying the molecular structure of both and even advised world leaders on the matter.

[attachment=0:2a9uu4fy]Combat teaches Bush.jpg[/attachment:2a9uu4fy]

shit from Shinola...



Whats Shinola? I only yesterday discoverd the most delicious almond butter spread with honey. Its heaven. All 38$ of the little jar. No palm oil in sight. Just almond.

Combat will help you. He's the resident expert on telling shit from Shinola...

For once in your tired life you have got it right. Shinola is something that you use to polish your fat bald head with and shit is what you spiel! :occasion9:

[Jellybean]

Hey Cedric IтАЩd never heard the expression, "shit from Shinola" before either and had to look it up. As I thought, it is American. The website тАЬThe Phrase FinderтАЭ said the following:

Meaning

Possessing poor judgment or knowledge.

Origin

Shinola was a brand of shoe polish previously manufactured in the USA. The alliteration and the fact that the two commodities in the phrase could possibly be confused is the derivation. The distinction is well made; only one of them would be good to apply to your shoes and only particularly dim people could be expected to muddle them up. Of course, outside America, most people don't know Shinola from anything at all, as they've never heard of it. Even in America it would probably not be widely remembered but for this phrase.

Of course, outside America, most people don't know Shinola from anything at all, as they've never heard of it. Even in America it would probably not be widely remembered but for this phrase.

You'd know what it was if you used it to polish your fat head as Thai Dyed does.... :occasion9:

[Jellybean]

I am sorry Combat, my post was not meant to support or endorse the comments made against you. I honestly had never heard that expression before and my reply was specifically meant for Cedric who appeared to be in the same position as me. A more experienced poster would probably have used the private message facility (something I have not used so far) to pass on the information to Cedric. You are a favourite poster of mine and I am sorry that my clumsy and ham-fisted post caused you any offence. I hope you will accept my apologies.

Don't worry - everything offends Combat.

What I am constantly amazed at is the inability for the ill informed, uninformed, ignorant and just plain stupid posters not being able to Google references they may not be familiar with.

[Beachlover]

Oh yeah, if you can get on the six inches of sand between the front row of deckchairs and the sea, you get a really good view of the bay!
I only went down and sat in the gay section of Jomtien Beach once or twice (felt uncomfortable there) but can't help thinking the gays chose the sh*t part of the beach to make their spot. I mean sure, it's nice having the trees behind and it's kind of separated from the straights but it seemed like a really thin and cramped section of the beach compared with the other side of the police box.


Did somebody put sand in your Vaseline again Brad?
Look, it's not the six inches of sand that brings people in droves to Pattaya. It's a different six inches.
Thai Dyed... the OP was asking specifically about beaches (amongst other things) and Brad was referring to beaches.

Did the doctor forget to put vaseline on the end of the probe before shoving it up your arse or did you get sand in your urethra again?

[Surfcrest]

I only went down and sat in the gay section of Jomtien Beach once or twice (felt uncomfortable there) but can't help thinking the gays chose the sh*t part of the beach to make their spot. I mean sure, it's nice having the trees behind and it's kind of separated from the straights but it seemed like a really thin and cramped section of the beach compared with the other side of the police box.


Who are the gays that you are referring to? Where the vendors (Whether they are gay or not) set up on the beach is decided for them, not the other way around. The chairs on the other side of the police box have the jet skis and the paragliders coming in and out of the beach area. The ocean in front of the Gay Section is supposed to be buoyed off for swimming only. As for the trees, it's prett easy to see (from the attached photo on the previous page) they run all along Jomtien and on both sides of the police box.

You seem to have a grea deal of opinions about Pattaya based on a very limited amount of exposure, wouldn't you think?

(felt uncomfortable there)

The other patrons didn't offer you a large enough tip? ;)

I spent my first week in Pattaya sitting down there but it does get old unless you like to read. On my last trip I just went to the water park instead. There are plenty of Russians in both places so it doesn't matter much.

[Brad the Impala]

I only went down and sat in the gay section of Jomtien Beach once or twice (felt uncomfortable there) but can't help thinking the gays chose the sh*t part of the beach to make their spot. I mean sure, it's nice having the trees behind and it's kind of separated from the straights but it seemed like a really thin and cramped section of the beach compared with the other side of the police box.


Who are the gays that you are referring to? Where the vendors (Whether they are gay or not) set up on the beach is decided for them, not the other way around. The chairs on the other side of the police box have the jet skis and the paragliders coming in and out of the beach area. The ocean in front of the Gay Section is supposed to be buoyed off for swimming only. As for the trees, it's prett easy to see (from the attached photo on the previous page) they run all along Jomtien and on both sides of the police box.


Which came first the vendors or the gay customers? I seem to remember that the area was known as a gay cruising area long before there were wall to wall deckchairs there. It was chosen for cruising because it was unobserved and away from the road, unlike the more picturesque sections of Jomtien(as were)

the more picturesque sections of Jomtien

There's an oxymoron for you.

[Surfcrest]

The vendors have been moved farther down from the police box over the years. The Gay Section (the flags) has moved with the vendors.
My historical recollection only goes back 20 years....I barely remember the old palapa unbrellas.

[quiet1]

[quote="Brad the Impala":skxybb4v]the more picturesque sections of Jomtien
There's an oxymoron for you.[/quote:skxybb4v]
Keeping in mind the timeline context -- "long before there were wall to wall deckchairs there" -- perhaps Jomtien Beach *was* picturesque?

[Beachlover]

(felt uncomfortable there)
The other patrons didn't offer you a large enough tip? ;)

I spent my first week in Pattaya sitting down there but it does get old unless you like to read.
Got hit on too much by the Thai boys and some of the farangs were being a bit creepy.

I tend like to use my time sitting on the beach to read so it was easier to just go down to the main part of Jomtien Beach for a few hours, though it's not quite as peaceful there.


Who are the gays that you are referring to? Where the vendors (Whether they are gay or not) set up on the beach is decided for them, not the other way around. The chairs on the other side of the police box have the jet skis and the paragliders coming in and out of the beach area. The ocean in front of the Gay Section is supposed to be buoyed off for swimming only. As for the trees, it's prett easy to see (from the attached photo on the previous page) they run all along Jomtien and on both sides of the police box.
I don't care who or how it was setup... it was infested with jellyfish when I was there so I wasn't keen on going in the water for more than a few seconds.

The trees do run along behind the beach on both sides but from memory, only the gay section has a large area shaded by a lot of trees behind the beach (actually the sand covers this area as well so you could say it's part of the beach), which is kind of nice. The main part of Jomtien Beach only has a single line of trees between it and the road.

[Surfcrest]

... it was infested with jellyfish when I was there so I wasn't keen on going in the water for more than a few seconds.


What I don't understand is that you say you've been to Pattaya twice and only once or twice to Jomtien (you can't remember).
I'm almost as amazed with how much knowledge you have of Pattaya as I am with you now at 3872 posts of this sort of rubbish.



RichLB, you make some interesting points, especially about the range/mix of farangs in Pattaya. I agree there are some good farangs there.

But no one can deny the farang population there contains many or most of the seediest, creepiest and most screwed up foreigners in Thailand.

[Beachlover]

What I don't understand is why you read my posts if you think they're rubbish. Most of my posts aren't about Pattaya, despite it being a fairly regular topic here.

No I don't remember exactly how many times I went and got a seat in the gay section of Jomtien Beach but it was only once or twice. Rest of the time I went to the main section of Jomtien Beach.