How LOS Has Changed My Life

[Dodger]

This being my ten year anniversary since discovering LOS, has caused me to reflect a bit about my life in general, e.g., what my life was like before Thailand, what itтАЩs like now, and the numerous changes that IтАЩve made over the past decade which have so dramatically altered my lifestyle.

I first came to Thailand to support a business project and didnтАЩt have a clue what Thailand was like, let alone the existence of places like Boyztown or Soi Twilight. I was housed at the Dusit Resort/Pattaya during my frequent visits and spent most of my time either attending meetings in Rayong where the project was located or wining and dining with Thai business associates in Bangkok on the weekends. I was 44 years old, recently separated from my wife after 17 years of torture and lived deep within the confines of a dark closet regarding my sexuality. Without any formal education (never attended high school) I had excelled in my career to the position of Corporate Vice President with a major fortune 100 company and went on to become an independent international management consultant тАУ which is the hat I wear today. With the exception of one gay interaction which occurred way back when I was in boy scouts, I had spent my entire life surrounded by bigots (including my immediate family), which left me harboring my feelings and aspirations deep inside.

My life back then was nothing more than a routine of responsibilities balanced between work and family тАУ both of which were sucking me dry. A demanding job which required a regular donation of blood, sweat and tears, and a wife who couldnтАЩt spend the money fast enough. Between Job and family there was nothing. I simply didnтАЩt exist. I was just a moving piece on a board swirling around in a spiraling cyclic existence with no light at the other end of the tunnel. Just getting up in the morning, remembering the knot that dad taught me so I can tie that ridiculous looking tie around my neck, put my Sony Walkman ear plugs in so I couldnтАЩt hear my wifeтАЩs nagging at the breakfast table, and trying not to run over that fucking Yorkshire Terrier my wife paid $1,000 for - getting out of the driveway.

My first discovery of Gay Thailand(and really myself) occurred one night when I had ventured from the Dusit to Pattayaland to take in the scene. Right in the mist of all the flashing neon gogo bar signs was my destiny. I didnтАЩt know it at the time, but the next few steps I would take would be the steps that altered my life тАУ forever. I navigated the sidewalks past dozens of scantily dress girls with my eyes fixed on one signтАжтАЭThai Boys Boys.тАЭ I can remember the rush of feelings I had that night as I walked up to the door not really knowing what I would find inside тАУ but had a feeling it was going to be specialтАжand special it was. Since I was young I always had a strong desire for Asian boys, although my exposure up until this point was limited to a few Chinese guys who lived in my neighborhood in Chicago and the occasional opportunity to find a gay magazine with a few pics тАУ but nothing like what I was about to experience. All I can tell you is that I never made it past the door manтАж555.

The boy (waiter) who opened the door, who was fully dressed by-the-way, stopped me cold in my tracksтАж.he was an absolute doll. The first thing he said to me wasтАжтАЭoh, you must be working nowтАЭ as he eyed my ridiculous looking dress clothes. Then came theтАжтАЭwhere you fromтАЭтАжтАЭhow long you here forтАЭтАжstuff. I couldnтАЩt hear a word he was saying and donтАЩt even remember answering him. I asked him if he wanted a drink тАУ he said yes тАУ I melted тАУ he put his hand on my leg тАУ I ordered a double shot (something I never did) and continued to melt тАУ he touched my leg again тАУ I forced a double shot on him тАУ and the next thing I remember we were back in my room at the Dusit. I unleashed 44 years of pent-up sexual frustration on that boy until I was left laying face-down on the wet sheets with my soul hovering 100 feet above me. I think I tipped him about 6,000 baht, thus the reason he looked like his soul was hovering up somewhere with mineтАж55555.

The next morning I found myself sitting around an oak table in the business center in Rayong listening to a dozen people chattering. I heard nothing. I faintly remember one of the engineers asking me if we should proceed or not - and I responded by telling him yes, not having the foggiest clue what we were to proceed with. I have no idea what he was asking for, and at that point could care less. The whole fucking business center could have collapsed to the ground that morning and I donтАЩt think it would have phased me. Not knowing what I do now after 10 years have passed тАУ that was the moment in time when my life would make its transition. Transition to what - IтАЩm still not entirely sure тАУ but transition it was.

I flew home a few weeks later and found myself sitting in another marriage counseling session with the princess and some wizard who was supposed to work miracles to justify her outrageous fees. As always, I sat there motionless on the puffy sofa listening to my wife ramble on about how I donтАЩt show her enough attention тАУI listen to my music too loud тАУ and speak openly about hating her mother. The wizard, as always, turned in her chair, stared long and deep in my eyes as if attempting to hypnotize me, took a deep breath, and started asking me these really deep and meaningful questions like; Now Vic, when Theresa says these things about you тАУ how does it make you feel. My response (after staring long and deep in the wizards eyes) тАжтАЭIt makes feel like an orange.тАЭ Then Theresa immediately bursts out withтАжтАЭsee, see, thatтАЩs what IтАЩm talking aboutтАЭтАжтАЭeverything is just a big joke to him.тАЭ And actually, she was right. The marriage was a joke. This highly paid wizard with her smeary lipstick and Gucci scarf was a joke. My mother-in-law who meddled in every aspect of our lives was a bigger joke,,,and that fucking dog of hers who would shit in my guitar case and bite my feet till she drew blood was the joke of the century. So I felt that the тАЬorangeтАЭ response was quite fitting, all things considered.

Two months later I divorced my wife, told her she could have everything, dragged my backpack out of the closet and hit the road. By-the-way, that backpack has been with me on every adventure since and has become my most precious belonging. After developing a strategy for launching my own career in the consulting field I resigned my position with the company, filled a dumpster with the business papers I had been surrounded by for years, and made a bee line back to Thailand for another double shot at Thai Boys Boys. I earn less money than before, no more private secretary or carte blanch expense account, but enough to render me as a free man - and now work 8 moths per year in the States and live 4 months per year in Thailand, and shortly, IтАЩll be transitioning to 6 months work тАУ 6 months of living.

Yes, I sold the farm, and along with it, the nagging wife, her mother who was spawned in hell, the job, the house, and that little $1,000 furry bastard too - all for the chance to live a life that I never even knew existed тАУ and have never turned back since.

ItтАЩs impossible to list all the things which have changed in my life since discovering gay Thailand тАУ as there simply is not one single thing that hasnтАЩt changed. Going to bed with guys who are half my age has created a more serious focus on physical conditioning. Before Thailand I would eat anything you put in front of meтАжbeer and pizza always doing the trick. Now I maintain a strict low carb-high protein diet, workout regularly, spend much more time in front of the mirror, and even massage my head thinking this will keep my hair from falling out too soonтАж555. I donтАЩt read business journals anymore, or for that fact, anything related to business unless it directly applies to the work I perform. All my conscious energy is directed on my life in ThailandтАжthe boysтАжthe sexтАжand yes, even those delusional love affairs which were components of my life which passed me by before finding Thailand.

The EndтАж( no, actually The Beginning).

Understanding that there has been a lot of hostility on our Board lately (must be the heat), and hope that IтАЩm not asking too much, but it would be great to hear how some of your lives have changed since your discovery of Thailand.

[catawampuscat]

Brilliant posting Dodger..
No surprise, as Dodger's trip reports are always packed full with drama and spice
and best of all, honesty and self awareness.
I really doubt that many posters will open up and reveal their inner thoughts/feelings while
the forum is still infested with trolls.
Smiles is a good example of a poster who is very frank and informative about his life and love, but with troll control being what it is, I don't know if he will continue.. alas, there are no real alternatives.

I admire Dodger for his efforts but fear he might regret what follows unless the moderators
moderate..

[Smiles]

" ... the next thing I remember we were back in my room at the Dusit. I unleashed 44 years of pent-up sexual frustration on that boy . . . The next morning I found myself sitting around an oak table in the business center in Rayong listening to a dozen people chattering.
I heard nothing ... "
That's one serious case of sperm buildup there Dodger. :headbang: Very happy that Thailand unclogged yer pores.

Great potential topic though. Let's hope your smile-inducing history encourages others to let loose on theirs . . . their story I mean, not their blockages: too wet and messy.
'The Orange' by the way ... very zen.

Your post is in fact what Sawatdee used to do best. Thanks for the story.

[bing]

Well Dodger found Thailand 10 years earlier than I. I was 54 when a retired sailor, well actually was 53 when he told me of Bangkok, and what a wild place it was. It took me a while to actually make the trip. I had been spending vacations in Europe and thought Amsterdam was great and loved Paris and even whored around in Kobllenz, Germany. Acapulco and the Condesa beach were part of my stomping grounds for many years and Mexico City had highlights in my memory bank for meeting young Mexicans. Brazil was probably my super favorite place. The beaches at Copacabana and the Ipanema were filled with willing hot boys and my sunning spot in front of the Palace Hotel had my ass imprinted on the chairs during the afternoons, almost as much like Rits chairs in more recent times in Pattaya. All I had when I arrived in Thailand was a 'Sparticus' map, and it was a primative one compared to the nice ones on line in this present time. I never made it out of Bangkok the first trip and enjoyed meeting Kamala, who ran Super A or some such place and did a dance with snakes. Seeing my first circle jerk with 30 boys, the shower show, the dance with the boys in paint that glowed in the black light, the candle dance and the big climax where the boys walk thru the audience joined at the hip, as one may say. I knew this was special and I wnated more. The boys bars where the boys would sit with you, and massage your arm as anothter held up the beer to your mouth so you did not even have to reach for it. Did Caesar have it any better? The next year I make to the Ambiance, in Boystown and met Jim (not madam Jim as he is now known) and Gordon when having breakfast. I asked Gordon how to get to this beach place called Jomtien. He pointed to a longhaired motorbike boy on the street outside and said the boy would make sure I got there. That motorbike boy was my personal transport for the rest of my stay. A quote from Gordon as well," Pattaya is the best place in the world for Gay guys." Nothing in my life has disabused me of his statement to this day. I keep an open mind and one day I may well find a more congenial spot, than here in (Camelot) Pattaya. Opps couln't resist the Camelot insertion. But until the time I do find that elusive place of perfection on this earth I will continue to spend some vacation time in Thailand. It may not have been as transforming event in my life, finding Thaiand, but it has caused a redirection of emphasis in what I like to do when on vacation. So while not life changing , it sure has pointed me in a differnt direction on the map, than before before finding Thailand

Thanks Dodger for an excellent contribution,it is like an oasis in the desert.

It is amazing you say you never attended high school,yet your writings are practically professional, obviously you educated yourself.

[Diec]

Well Dodger, I don't know if I would hire you for my company. Getting your dick off the night before an important meeting and you can't even think through the meeting? I remember my first gay encounter and was still able to function at work the next day. Poetic license I guess.

[Lunchtime O'Booze]

Been to there done that Dodger.

I mean literally...started out from the Dusit eons ago and haven't been the same since.

I think there a few countries on this planet which change people's lives but LOS is one ! :headbang: (good story !)

Thanks, Vic. Great stuff!

Just interested to know, why you got married in the first place. Are you gay or bisexual. I also wish you the best in the future, and I hope you can sustain the expensive lifestyle in Thailand. I just find it amusing that when you went to see a counseller, your ex wife was moaning about silly things like playing your sony walkman, and that you didn't come straight out with it that you are gay or bisexual.

It looks like quite a few of us may have followed the same path as Dodger and Bing: Get married, go through years, even decades, of quiet, repressed desperation, and finally accept what we are and be grateful for the pleasures of LOS.

тАЬGay or Bisexual?тАЭ may be irrelevant these days; just тАЬsexualтАЭ seems to be enough.

Why did so many of us over 50 get married in the first place? Because we were тАЬsupposed toтАЭ, in order to satisfy society and perhaps also to convince ourselves that we were straight. Tolerance for gays was at a much lower level 40 years ago. One simply did not make an announcement about non-standard sexuality. One either conformed or ended the relationship, and if lucky, wound up in a sexually uninhibited society such as Thailand.

And perhaps we married because we were keen on settling down, being part of a household, but we did not realize that deep within us, our nature dictated that our mate should be the same sex as us.

After 25 years of life together, my wifeтАЩs paranoia finally drove us apart and allowed me to rid myself of denial. My first trip to Soi Twilight was enough to remove any pretension of heterosexuality from my nature, enough to put me on a path with more obstacles and pitfalls than I could have imagined, yet at the same time I can not imagine any other way I would like to have spent these last 12 years.

[Impulse]

Nice post Dodger.
Thailand changed my life in a similar way.I came out in the early 80's when i was in my twenties.My boyfriend was about five years younger than me,a flight attendant who back then called me a chicken hawk,lol.We often had threesomes with both sexes.It was a wild time,around the time they started closing down the bath houses in New York city.The clubs were fun as were the summers at Fire island.
My boyfriend was a gold digger looking for a sugar daddy.I didn't want the relationship to end but the fighting was too intense.I didn't have much money either so the relationship ended.With the aids thing in full swing and no cure in sight,I curbed my sexual flings dramatically.Most of my friends were straight and really didnt care if i was gay,and frankly thought at the very least I was bi or straight.I had more sex with women in the nineties than men,not because I was pretending to be straight,I was enjoying myself.
Fast forward to seven years ago and the desire for offspring took over me.I married a beutiful girl from the Philippines.She younger than me and from a poor family,sound familiar? Well< I loved her and her family,and was planing to retire in Masbate with her.Like most fillipinos who come to America,they meet other women like themselves.Things going well until my real estate newsletter suggested buying property in Pattaya.i did,but found more than propert as being interesting there.
I realised I'm really atracted to the asian guys like Dodger's story.I'm sure it's a common thing.As much as I believe I was bisexual,I feel as I get older,I'm more gay.
So,long story short,we divorced.It was the hardest thing in my life hurting her like I did.Harder than my mother's death.I still love her but it was best for both of us.I took care of her and we still are friends.In fact last night we had dinner together as we still get together,don't care for her new boyfriend though. I don't understand how two people who are married can end up hating each other so much as most divorces end this way.
So Thailand made me realise who I am again.It had a big impact on my life.

тАЬGay or Bisexual?тАЭ may be irrelevant these days; just тАЬsexualтАЭ seems to be enough.
[X] Spot on. Gay identity politics belongs in the dustbin of history today.

http://29.media.tumblr.com/XlmSoxaXeqj7lqzoYrG1KkUao1_400.jpg

[X] For your kind attention:

Alan Helms, Young Man from the Provinces: A Gay Life Before Stonewall.

The summer after my junior year in 1958, I remained in New York doing test shots & putting together a modelling portfolio; otherwise, I spent my time exploring the gay world. It was such a different world, & now such a vanished one, that it's not easy to explain. Intensely secretive & hidden, it went on mostly at night behind the unmarked doors of bars & in apartments where the shades were always drawn. The 415 Bar on Amsterdam Avenue was typical: you walked in, saw a few locals talking with the bartender, & figured you'd made a mistake. But through an unmarked door in the back & down a flight of stairs, you entered a cavernous basement teeming with hundreds of gay men who were dancing & laughing & cruising & kissing & drinking & passing out in the johns. No wonder that during my two years with Dick I'd not had the slightest suspicion such a world existed. It was determined to remain as hidden as possible.

The men were too. Everyone I knew was more or less closeted & spent a lot of time in the workaday world passing for straight. Save for a few artists & hairdressers & decorators & dancers, we were all terrified of being found out. Gay men regularly married for the sake of appearances or inheritances & just as regularly committed suicide. If you heard that a gay man was seeing a shrink, it meant only one thing: he was trying desperately to "go straight", which sounded more like a road sign than a way of life. Parents routinely disowned & disinherited their gay sons or had them committed to mental hospitals where they were subjected to shock treatments & lobotomies & a popular therapy of the day called "aversion therapy": "by means of hypnotic suggestion and conditioning, the author has been able ... to create deep aversions in the male homosexual to the male body." How do you do that? "Suggestions of filth associated with the male genitalia of their partners were implanted in their subconscious and reinforced periodically during the hypnotic trance."

Psychiatrists published abominations like that with pride & impunity. In their view, which was mainstream America's view made professional & scientifically unassailable, homosexuality was an abnormality to be corrected at all costs; the most barbarous treatments were justified in the name of destroying such pernicious tendencies. There were gay men walking the streets of Manhattan in those days who had been rendered incapable of sex or had their memories obliterated by electricity. For some, it would take years to put their minds back together again; for others the effort was hopeless. Of all the enemies we had, psychiatrists were among the most dangerous. And our parents, of course. I never met anyone who was out to his parents; you had to be crazy to do such a thing.

David Bergman, ed. Gay American Autobiography: Writings from Whitman to Sedaris.
Madison: University of Wisconsin Press, 2003.

http://www.marriedgay.org/links.asp
http://www.marriedgay.org/bibliography.html

[krobbie]

Dodger, What a wonderful account. I was out and gay since my early teens, so my awakening came sooner.

I love your word usage and the graphics you conjure with those words. In all an entrancing read.

I have to say your descriptive passages made me smile broadly and even laugh, where you had meant such.

Uplifting reading. Thank you.

Krobbie

[cdnmatt]

Huh, interesting stories, and thanks for the thread for the Dodger. Interesting how the world changes as the generations tick by, eh? My mom had a couple high school friends who committed suicide over the same type of feelings as many of you posted. Back in those days, you simply weren't allowed to by gay. No ifs, ands, or buts, as society simply didn't allow for it. I grew up in a small red-neck town where you weren't allowed to be gay either, but I'm sure it was quite a bit different than what you guys went through.

Biggest life change for me though? Simple, I can actually enjoy life. There's no rat race, no transforming yourself into being as efficient & productive as you can, just to keep up with the Jones', so you can achieve -- whatever the hell people are looking to achieve (I don't think most people really know). I have yet to sense a hint of homophobia from anyone, so that's obviously a bonus.

I also love the nice, communal type living. We're out in a Thai style sub-burb, and I love it. It's old, but nice, and everyone around here has money so there's no losers floating around. It's really close quarters from one house to another though, and almost like a townhouse type thing, but actually houses instead. Some people hate nosy neighbors, but personally, I love it. I sit around and have beers with the neighbors, so far all good people, and nobody cares in the least that I'm in a gay relationship with a Thai who's younger than me. Lots of times, when they cook a big meal, they'll drop a plate of food off, and of course we return the favor.

Just things like that. I love it. Much better than the isolated West, where simply smiling at somebody gets you a weird and freaked out look at times.

Back in those days, you simply weren't allowed to by gay. No ifs, ands, or buts, as society simply didn't allow for it.

WHAT no BUTTS! OMG..goodbye cruel world. :hello1:

[Beachlover]

I have yet to sense a hint of homophobia from anyone, so that's obviously a bonus.

That's one major thing I found in Thailand.... made me keep coming back. Feels like a third or maybe fourth home now.


everyone around here has money so there's no losers floating around.

Hehehe... not a jab at your previous home is it?


I love it. I sit around and have beers with the neighbors, so far all good people, and nobody cares in the least that I'm in a gay relationship with a Thai who's younger than me. Lots of times, when they cook a big meal, they'll drop a plate of food off, and of course we return the favor.

That does sound nice. Are most of your neighbours Thai or farang? Any gay ones at all?

But I wonder if Kim's liking it there...

[Beachlover]

I realised I'm really atracted to the asian guys like Dodger's story.I'm sure it's a common thing.

I'm amazed it takes you guys 30, 40, 50 sometimes 60 years to discover this... You do know there's like a billion Asian guys on Earth right?

[Beachlover]

Wow, Dodger... Great post!

With all that background, now I know where the maniac inside you comes from LOL.

44 years of that?! How the fk did you manage live through 44 years of it?! 5 years would be like a life sentence for most people.

Someone should make a movie or comedy about your life. That middle bit with the nagging wife, yorkshire terrier, nightmare mother in law is hilarious. LIke a bad dream or something.

You're probably one of the happy stories. Imagine what life is like for the people who never made that 'transition'? Hey, what about the family friend (husband of Maureen - I forget the name) who was around when you unintentionally showed that explicit video of boy special? Do you think he's broken free of his 'matrix' and is running loose in Thailand now? Maybe you'll bump into him soon and he'll start bawling, "Oh, Vic... you changed my life... that snippet of video was divine intervention" LOL.

The next day, I wonder if your Thai colleagues were thinking... "He's completely out of it.... must've finally discovered the dirty side to Pattaya" hahaha...

I suppose "the farm" had more liabilities than it did assets.

----

I have a question I'm curious about... How did you explain this massive life transition (respectable, married... etc.) to your parents, other family and friends? What kind of reactions did you get?

[Impulse]

I'm amazed it takes you guys 30, 40, 50 sometimes 60 years to discover this... You do know there's like a billion Asian guys on Earth right?Right again beachlover.And with over a billion chinese,there must be 50 million gay chinese males running around. Like shooting fish in a barrel.
But Dodger is from Chicago,mostly Polish. Im from New York,mostly Jewish.

[danny99]

I am constantly amazed when discovering how many guys go through sexual deprivation for so many years before discovering freedom.

I grew up in the Australian suburbs, very working class, not sure what age I was the 1st time something happened but I had just turned 12 when starting high school and nothing that happened there from 1st day onwards surprised me very much, it all seemed normal! But I guess that was back in the days that everyone did it but no one talked about it. Still I am about the same age as those who have been talking about their discoveries in their 40's etc. God by then I was well into the thousands. You feel sorry for them when you think of all those tens of thousands of wasted nights! Or was it a wasted life? Or does most of the world just go to bed and dream, never daring to do anything? Reeks of Paranoia to me?

As a matter of interest my school years finished with 106 boys graduating at 17 years of age from my year. As far as my information goes only 4 finished up gay, isn't that the western world stat? [one of those 'became' gay was a virgin in every way back at school], all the others went on happily to a 'normal' hetro life irrespective of all of those years of groping, wanking and sucking!

To think of guys getting to 30,40 or 50 before being sex-free is scary!

[DamienZ]

Dodger thanks for a fantastic read!
Posts like these are good medicine as they come from the heart-and what a cool story! So glad you found your liberation in LOS. Briefly LOS has changed my life in that I know that there is a place where I can go to just unwind, hang out with dear friends, and have a good time with the most beautiful men/boys on the planet. Thailand has had a much deeper impact on me than I can spell out here on the board, but suffice it to say the time was ripe for me as well. You are a lucky man to spend half your time in LOS and half home. I aspire to that one day. I have followed many of your previous posts and I admire your style-it's refreshing in it's honesty. Please keep writing!

Warmest Regards
DZ :glasses7:

[Dodger]

I'd like to thank you all for your positive feedback.

CuteThaiBoy Wrote:


I just find it amusing that when you went to see a counseller, your ex wife was moaning about silly things like playing your sony walkman, and that you didn't come straight out with it that you are gay or bisexual.

I wasn't asking for a divorce because of my sexuality - I was asking for a divorce because she was driivng me crazy.

This won't be easy to explain, but after 17 years of marriage my wife knew all there was to know about me, including my open mindedness about sex and sexuality in general. For instance, my wife and I were sitting at a pool one afternoon and a very attractive couple stolled past us. The girl was wearing a white string bikini and the guy was wearing a pair of snug red speedos (TOO HOT). My wife glanced over at me with a grin on her face and said..."OK, keep your eyes in your head". I responded by saying..."nice ass." She said..."which one". I said "the girls too chinkly." She said..."there's your feminine side coming out again."

Now hold your hat on because this may jolt you: But I believe, and have always believed, that all human beings are born homosexual based on the fact that we (as humans) are comprised of both masculine and feminine genes since conception, and that evolving (meaning the change) of a persons sexuality throughout their life time is determined by this complex mix of genes and experience. In-other-words, all people have the capacity to desire having sex with someone of the same sex, although many, if not most, conceal this desire - even to themselves. Yes, I know that is a mind-blowing statement, but just a fact of nature the way I see it.

The word" Gay" does not exist within the Thai vocabulary and there's a very good reason for this. The Thais, or for that fact the Buddhist culture in general, do not feel the need for such classifications and subscribe more to the notion that people are people. As far as a persons sexual identiy or preference, this is the result of nature and can change with the winds as all things in nature do. I subscribe to this notion as well. The ballance of estrogen (feminine-self) and testesterone (masculine-self) is the primary driver here, although It's those environmental determinisms (ignorance of society and bigotry) that usually cause a persons boat to miss its course.

Thep has two good friends both of which work as gogo dancers and appear on face value as being closer to str8 than gay. These two boys have lived together for 2 years, share the same bed, and according to Thep enjoy a happy sexual relationship together. I asked him which of the two boys was passive and which was domninent in the relationship - because I simply couldn't detect this. He then told me each of their preferred roles, although went on to say that they will be breaking up soon because one of the boys was returning to his village to marry his girl friend. I then asked him how he could do this if in fact he were gay, and here's his response: First he laughed and said..."everybody is gay." Then he went on to say that the boy liked having sex with girls too and wanted to have children.

The point I'm trying to make here is that by not having rock-hard classifications like gay, str8, bisexual, etc., the Thais find it much easier to enjoy both - their masculine and femine desires - without near as much negative stigma as we experience in the West.

Personally, I have been aware of both my masculine and femine composition forever, had sex with girls when I was growing up, always had the hots for one boy or another although didn't act on it, enjoy only having sex with boys now, gravitate to boys of the feminine nature with me in the dominant role, although like to experience my feminine side sometimes too and can't wait for him to slide that that hot salami inside me. So, within the framework of western sexual classifications, where do I belong. Gay? No, not according to western societies definition of Gay, because I once had the desire to have sex with females. Am I Bisexual? No, not according to western societies definition, because I now have absolutely no desire to have sex with a woman and only desire having sex with males. What am I then? Well, I guess that only leaves one thing...maybe I'm just a Person...what a concept.

[Beachlover]

all the others went on happily to a 'normal' hetro life irrespective of all of those years of groping, wanking and sucking!

I think this path makes sense if you aren't too fussed each way... e.g. you're as passionate with a girl as you are with a boy.


To think of guys getting to 30,40 or 50 before being sex-free is scary!

Yep... I wince just thinking about it. And it's not as if one as at their sexual/physical peak at that age too (though I suppose this matters much less in Thailand).

[bao-bao]

Late to the party (again) but I also enjoyed your story, Dodger!

I've known there was something different about me (I prefer to say "special") as far back as I have memories - and that's back to age 3 or 4 - but, as many others, thought I was the only one and didn't know there was a name for it until sometime later when the epithets began flying thick and fast among other boys my age. I lived the life of quiet desperation many of us do, satisfying curiosity (amongst other portions of the anatomy) whenever possible. In fact, the first degree I earned was in the seduction of straight friends and acquaintances.

I didn't bow to the pressure to marry. In fact, I came out to my father in college when he insisted I "just hadn't met the right girl" and I (I'm ashamed to say) thoughtlessly blurted out "the right girl would have to have a dick". Fortunately, my family - and anyone else who really matters - have always accepted me as I am and I'm usually the one they trust most times for advice and support - especially over the past couple of decades that I've been sobered up - HA! I suppose I'm the exception rather than the rule, but it's a blessing I gladly accept and never take for granted.

The rumor that mai pen rai also applied to sexuality in most cases throughout the Land of Smiles made it a frequently fantacised-about Shangri-La. My first visit was an overwhelming experience as I learned that it was, for the most part, a truism.

I still have enough to learn when it comes to applying patience and tolerance in daily life, but my knowledge is certainly enhanced with every trip out among the wonderful people of Thailand.

Thanks again for your story.

[soi_toi]

Discovering Thailand has certainly be liberating for many, including myself, and a journey unto itself.

Thanks Dodger for taking us down memory lane.

[joe552]

Thanks to all who've written so openly and honestly about their journey. I'm not sure what effect LOS has had on me, but I know I feel more 'myself' when I'm there, than I do 'at home'.

[Impulse]

The point I'm trying to make here is that by not having rock-hard classifications like gay, str8, bisexual, etc., the Thais find it much easier to enjoy both - their masculine and femine desires - without near as much negative stigma as we experience in the West.Thats so true!Too bad it's this way in the West.The only negative for gays in Thailand might be when you're lover decides to leave you to start a family of his own,without you.

[Diec]

Everyone in Thailand is gay!! What the Thais mostly want are Westerns over the age of 50 and have a thick shape.

Well I suppose the greatest effect that Thailand has had on my life is that I've had a Thai boyfriend for 13 years although I've been visiting Thailand for longer than that. I never went along the girlfriend and marriage route like some here so the gay side of Thailand wasn't such a shock as I had my first relationship when I was fifteen with a boy the same age that lasted six years. So I'd also been "out" for some time before visiting Thailand.

That first visit was twenty years ago with a gay friend. He was training to be a Air Traffic Controller and was very good at getting cheap flights so we'd travelled a lot in Europe as far as Turkey. Then he reckoned he could get us a flight as "crew" to Thailand and a stay at the Dusit Thani as well. He was only going for a few days but I was going to stay on and arrange my own flight home.

The Dusit Thani didn't work out but we ended up at the Asia which was the first of many stays there.

My friend was mainly interested in shopping and getting some cheap suits made. So I went off and did the tourist things like the Grand Palace etc. We met up again in the evening and travelled to Patpong for the first time. I'd got a copy "Spartacus" gay guide and there was an advert for the "Golden Cock" complete with a photograph of a guy who looked just my type along with the promise that "all our boys dance sexy as hell".

As soon as we entered all my friend's usual self assured charm and confidence deserted him and he was obviously uncomfortable. However I felt immediately at home and have enjoyed Go Go Bars ever since and the company of Go Go Boys. On that first occasion I "offed" a boy called "A" while my friend left in search of a Disco which some of the straight flight crew recommended. It was just an excuse though as the commercial gay scene was just not for him and he also never showed any sign of fancying Thai guys.

I didn't become a regular visitor to Thailand for a few more years but it's now my main holiday destination.

[paperboy]

sorry everyone iv e not been on for ages, work and friend in hospital
BUT

have a look here

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9TWIXXfU7ZA

[Beachlover]

Thanks to all who've written so openly and honestly about their journey. I'm not sure what effect LOS has had on me, but I know I feel more 'myself' when I'm there, than I do 'at home'.

Should be the other way around... you "feel yourself" more when you're at home right? Hahahaha

Dodger, I enjoyed your post. Thanks for sharing your story. Congratulations on breaking free and best of luck on continued success.
Despite the troll issues on this board one of the best things about the Internet is learning from other peopleтАЩs experiences. Something that was only possible by meeting face to face in the past. Your story was uplifting and anything that brings even a moment of that to someoneтАЩs day is worthwhile.

I am a long time lurker on this board and decided to finally тАЬcome outтАЭ as it were. I am celebrating 10 years of Thailand visits also and I thought that would be reason enough to add to this thread.

Thailand didnтАЩt change my life so much as enhance it. LOS has been wonderful for so many aspects for me. Over the 10 years of traveling I have fallen in and out of love with different aspects of it. My first trip was dizzying as is for so many. Then, like culture shock, certain realities and unpleasantries sobered me up. They were good learning experiences though and luckily with no harm done.

My scale is tipped far more toward great times and experiences than negatives on my trips there and hopefully those past lessons will help avoid future negative experiences. And by times and experiences that mostly means vertical ones. Thailand would certainly entice me for returns even without the horizontal ones. I have made great friends with some farangs who live there and they have enriched my life.

10 years do much to a personтАЩs life as your post indicates. I was in my late 30тАЩs on my first trip and full of energy and still in the game as it were. I have been through the only serious relationship of my life and am now single. I am at the penultimate year before turning 50 and donтАЩt turn heads anymore. IтАЩm still learning to deal with that but happy to be able to look at it with perspective.

One other reason I decided to start posting here is that I am returning to Thailand next month for the first time in two years so I will be posting some questions soon on some travel details IтАЩm hoping others can help with.

So thanks for the interesting post and sharing your story Dodger. I have seen your postings in the past and enjoyed them. IтАЩm looking forward to reading more.