How much is enough

[vanek333]

Im a gay man that enjoys the company of Thai guys when on holiday, however Im at a lost as to the protocol of payment, someone tell me what is concided a fair payment for 1) A guy to come to your appartment for say 3-4 hours 2) A guy that stays the whole night, Im also a t a loss of how much the bar takes as it seems to differ at every establishment. I I where to entertain a guy for a few days, do I have to pay his employer?

1000 short time, 1600 over night ?

A little more for the good ones.

Slightly less if he's tacking the mick.

[dorayme]

Talk it over with the boy. In the current market 500 is enough for short time and 1,000 overnight. More if he satisfies.

Why spoil them.

[vanek333]

What about the bar, is it a done thing to pay the bar?

[cdnmatt]

What about the bar, is it a done thing to pay the bar?

If you take him for several days, yes, you have to pay the off fee each night. Well, at least the boy has to pay the off fee every night, or else he loses his job and/or doesn't get his bonus at the end of the month. So throw him an extra few hundred baht on the subsequent nights to cover the off fee.

[vanek333]

Thanks fellas
Been very helpful :happy7:

[Diec]

My suggestion when you off a boy for a few nights is to give him several extra hundred baht per day. The reason I say this is because the boy you off from the bar has many friends at the bar that will not be offed. By giving your new found boyfriend a few hundred extra baht per day he can now go back to the bar and give his friends who have not been offed some money and he will save face. It is very important that these boys do not lose face when it comes to their friends. With you giving extra money he will not have this problem. A nice gesture would be for you to off one of his friends and have a 3 way with them and you will really gain their respect. Remember, if we keep our lovely brown skinned lovers happy, they in turn keep us happy!! It is very important that we never let these boys lose face.

[vanek333]

Thank you, makes good sense
My suggestion when you off a boy for a few nights is to give him several extra hundred baht per day. The reason I say this is because the boy you off from the bar has many friends at the bar that will not be offed. By giving your new found boyfriend a few hundred extra baht per day he can now go back to the bar and give his friends who have not been offed some money and he will save face. It is very important that these boys do not lose face when it comes to their friends. With you giving extra money he will not have this problem. A nice gesture would be for you to off one of his friends and have a 3 way with them and you will really gain their respect. Remember, if we keep our lovely brown skinned lovers happy, they in turn keep us happy!! It is very important that we never let these boys lose face.

What about the bar, is it a done thing to pay the bar?

1 Paying the bar
You generally HAVE to pay the bar an "off fee" when taking a guy. Typically around 300 baht upwards.

2 Tips for your off
I note a small percentage of guys ask for more, even if you have paid above the average rate. When you refuse to pay more, those guys still ask for your phone number & often phone back one or two nights later when they want another "off". So the tip was enough, but they have learnt there is no harm in asking for more. Stick to your price.

A friend was paying in the 700~1000 range on a recent trip. All of the guys seemed keen to meet up with him again.

Some guys may think im a cheap skate, but if im offing a boy for more than 1 night , he gets 1000bht for every day he stays with me plus food and drink .

[bucknaway]

The way I see it, the way the economy is, that is 1000 baht more than he is getting if you picked a different guy. Besides he is able to say no if he is so inclined. If you feel its fair and he feels it is fair than who cares what we think? You shouldn't, that's for sure. :hello2:

Right, definitely, offer as little as possible, maybe start with an offer of 300 for overnights, let him beg for more. (!)

Come on guys, the figures suggested above are the same that have been in effect for the past ten years, but the cost of living certainly is a good deal higher than it was ten years ago. Using the present state of the economy as a rationale for trying to pay rock bottom service fees is probably somewhat lacking in the dignity which should be accorded even to commercial sex transactions. Sure, some of the boys are content to get 500-700 for an overnight, as opposed to getting nothing at all.

Driving a hard bargain for the cost of a product may be fine, but doing the same for an intimate personal service just doesn't seem right. I guess it depends on your point of view. If you feel that buying sex equates with buying a product, then by all means it makes sense to pay as little as possible.

[bucknaway]

No one is stopping anyone from paying as much as their wallets can handle. Know what you can afford before you start throwing your money around.

I may spend freely but I would never tell anyone to waste their money as I do.

[Smiles]

1000 short time, 1600 over night ?
Above is about right, but add 300-400 off fee for the bar.

OPTIONAL: Add a few drinks for they guy IN the bar where you may want to chat for awhile (100-300 baht). Add a meal if you're in the mood and it's a given that he'll be hungry (about same as drinks). Add a tuk tuk or motorbike fare for the guy to get back home (50 baht).

1000 short time, 1600 over night ?Above is about right, but add 300-400 off fee for the bar.Have you started being unfaithful in your retirement Smiles?

Some guys may think im a cheap skate, but if im offing a boy for more than 1 night , he gets 1000bht for every day he stays with me plus food and drink .

If he knows that's what you pay AND he stays with you for several days, of course it must be enough.

Some guys may think im a cheap skate, but if im offing a boy for more than 1 night , he gets 1000bht for every day he stays with me plus food and drink .If he knows that's what you pay AND he stays with you for several days, of course it must be enough.Or he has no alternative source of greater income and has settled for second best.

I posted a reply to a similar question some moons ago Darl. The situation is the same:

Edit postReport this postReply with quoteRe: Boys tips
Author: paul2257 ┬╗ 03 Jan 2009, 11:55

Honies, I pay as follows:

Street trade in pattaya and phuket 500b

Street trade hanging around paradise centre after 3 am 200 - 300b

beach rd pattaya street trade after 3AM - 300b (I am NOT talking ladyboys)

street trade outside mike department sore after 4am - 300b

Street trade in BKK 500-600b

Street trade in BKK after 3am - 300-500b. Depends on location. For rough or military street trade I WILL pay more!

Go go/ bar boys in Sunee 800 - 1000b DEPENDING on performance. Less in low season.

Go go/ bar boys anywhere else in pattaya same same as above

I very rarely off in BKK go gos - but do have my favourites there, and they are NOT in Soi Twilight. Usually pay 1000b.

Go go/ bar boys in Phuket 1000-1200b - it is more expensive in go gos in phuket for some strange reason

I never do an overnighter

Depending on my location, I NEVER take back to my condo or hotel.

I NEVER turn on TV when in any room. I shower and get straight into it. i also dont make inane small talk

off em, or pick em up, fuck em and forget em!

taxi fares, noodles, drinks, karaoke, yaa ba, dead water buffaloes, hospital bills they can pay themselves, Honies.

[latintopxxx]

Thank you Paul 2257, finally a sensible/practical reply and tip...didn't know about mikes department store..will give it a try.

Tired of all the posters trying to justify inflated prices based on a misguided moral/guilt concept that because its prostitution you should pay more....makes no sense...boy is a commodity to be had for the maximum time at the lowest price.

My experience much the same as yours, street trade in Bkk, Pattaya and Phuket never more than 500 and have even had it for as low as 250(for 2 hours) ..after some bargaining...gave me immense pleasure to throughly fuck this boy for almost 2 hours for less than the price of a beer back home...

In BKK always go "shopping" on Rama IV outside the Pan Pacific....quality usually good to excellent and after 3am they are very eager to please.
Am always amazed how far I can push them, have this little ritual, get them to lift their T-shirt to check out the abs/body, grab their butts and if able to slip my hand down their...establish ownership before I agree to off them...and after the deed is done and we've showered and its time to pay invariably they will ask for a little extra, a tip, whatever...so I'll sit down crack a beer open and agree if they can make me come again...funny to watch them work up a sweat...especially if i have already come twice after the original session.... all for an extra 50baht

Definitely prefer street trade, go go boys have an inflated sense of self worth so I rarely off them from the bars....although I have had the good fortune to run into them after closing time and its amazing how fast the price drops at 3am when they've been on their feet all night and havent been offed...

I don't do overnights, cannot completely sleep/relax with a stranger in the same bed....but was recently in Phuket for 4 nights at the Sheraton laguna(at a conference) which is miles from anywhere (700baht one way into the gay area in Patong) so on the 1st night I picked up a street trade in the paradise complex and for 2000 plus meals he agreed to stay for the full period...what a pleasure...boy on demand..whenever I wanted....could hardly wait for the coffee/lunch breals to nip back to my room to have my balls emptied...made it difficult to concentrate knowing what was waiting back in the room.

I assume when you guys talk about street trade after 3am these are just the go go/host bar boys mostly trying out for one last shot? What's the quality like? More swarthy or downmarket? Or true boy next door types that are just trying to pick up extra cash after finishing their late night jobs as stockers and diswashers?? Can you provide some kind of rough breakdown, percentage wise of what to expect? I've never thought much about waiting around till that late because I'd rather get to it earlier in the evening so figure why wait five hours to get the same guy I could have for a bit more earlier? Have I been missing out? Health and cleanliness issues? Risky for STD or getting mugged?

Thanks for the information! This sort of thing is why we come here.

[latintopxxx]

STDs....u can't tell who has them...assume the worst...someone who hasn't showered or is swarthy is not necessarily putting me at greater risk.

I always use condoms...except for oral where the risk of the big A is minimal...at least for me as the active partner....everything else can be treated...and I get checked at least every three months and so far have been lucky in that only occasionally (once/year) do I test positive for a STD.

As for street trade, plenty available from 9pm onwards...don't have to wait until 2am...although 2am can be interesting as the boys are hungrier then and a better deal can be negotiated for prime beef.

I gravitate towards street trade as I enjoy the atmosphere and challenge...go go bar is too structured; best is when you encounter a prime go go on the street at 2am and have him for less than a quarter of the regular price...sweet!!

But are they recycled go go/host bar boys that can't make the cut or have been let out after closing, or are you talking about a lot of completely fresh faces? Any surprise factors to watch out for? Paul alluded to not bringing them back to the hotel or home...so where does this take place??

I'm totally ready to believe that there are Thai guys out there who are too shy to parade themselves in the go go bars lest their families find out, but would sneak around in the shadows on the street for some extra cash. I agree: sounds exciting and adventurous!

One more thing: how would you rate the overall quality of the sex with the street trade? I've always been put off by go go boy attitudes- they seem to think a lot of times that if they gain an off fee and extra drink sold for the owner they've pleased their 'real' boss. Also, the straight go go boys are common, I think, because the club owner just wants a pretty face to put out there for an inexperienced tourist to pick out and doesn't care about what happens so much afterwards.

off em, or pick em up, fuck em and forget em!.......boy is a commodity to be had for the maximum time at the lowest price

I guess it's useless to point out that the boys in question are human beings, so the best course of action, for me, is to block posters like this. In the past, when I suggested that posters like this should hire animals to fulfill their sexual needs, I was told that the remark was uncalled for. Really?

[latintopxxx]

Not sure what you mean by recycled gogo boys...they're all recycled..no fresh virgin meat on the stage...even the hot good looking ones don't get offed every day.

I prefer street trade as I can cut to the chase quicker..in a gogo bar you'r down 750 (drink+boy drink+off fee) before you've even stuck your cock up his arse!!
I really enjoy the fuck shows and don't mind the 250baht drink prices...don't like the mamasans trying to push boys onto me...and find most gogo boys insisting on a minimum of a 1000....totally nuts considering someone at a convenience store is on 6000/month.
In the gogo bar they must save face...whereas on the street...alone...they don't care about face...have fucked a few go go boy "tops" for less than a 3rd of the going rate.
Much rather catch a show or two...visit DJ station for a bit of eye candy...sometimes pick up a boy there...or on the way back to the hotel do some street shopping....enjoy the chase...negotiating a low price...and then getting my monies worth...always negotiate a set rate and time (2 hours) and ride them 'till my equipment gives up..

[latintopxxx]

bobsaigon....we don't share the same tastes...not into bestiality...OK?

As for rent boys being human....not even sure what you mean by this...I'm fucking them...after mutually agreeing on a price and time....not using them as human toilets.....guess your definition of human is how much money you pay him for his services.

Note that I'm not picking on the mentally incapacitated or desperate refugees, these are well dressed, well fed (usually very good bodies) guys who have chosen to do this for a living.

You get turned on by playing the big rich daddy who over pays..guilt compensation perhaps??....I get turned on by the opposite...good arse at a good price and if the boy pleases me I tip....

Me thinks I'm far more honest when it comes to what I do....

[Beachlover]

Christ...*vomits*

I don't think Latin means to be so crude, and I don't believe he's really that way toward boys in reality every time. He is approaching it from the exact opposite standpoint as these a lot of these Thai guys are- they aren't looking at us looking at anything other than picking up some cash, most of the time...even more so if they are street trade. It's an economic transaction and not much more. You can't argue that he's missed what's really going on, can you?

Bob's a complete gentleman and looks to do kindness unto others, as do I, SC, BL and others do whenever we have a chance. This late night stuff, street trade arena is a bit different and I don't think the same rules apply, which is why Latin's attitude comes across so different. (And Latin, I hope you are more magnanimous than you're letting on here!)

One thing we forget is that after the price is agreed to (and the 'it has to be 1000 to 2000 baht or it's not fair' price is pure MYTH) the transaction can be as mechanical as the two participants want it to be as long as it is consumated. If that means 'fuck em and pay em' then it is no more degrading than 'I'll let him fuck me, get paid and get the hell out of here!' which is what probably goes on in the minds of the boys more than any of us would like to admit.

I've already blocked Latin, so I did not see his responses....but I can imagine what tone they might have taken.

Jack is the voice of moderation here, and there may be some truth to the distinction made when talking about street trade.

Be that as it may, I've had enough. Made my point. Will retire from this thread now. Cheers.

[Impulse]

I prefer a bar boy,pay a bit more but I feel safer. Im staying near sunee now and have been getting up after the bars close and made the mistake of bringing back a bad one. he wanted to fight me yesterday because i refused him money. Gave him 200 baht to get rid of him,temporarily. Last night the host boi left early because the water went off and he wanted to shower.

[Shuee]

id generally agree with dorayme, here's what i find is always appreciated street guys no more than 500 ST, bar guys around 700 ST, no less than 1000 LT, of course if there is disregard on services agreed at the time, then less could be given on these reasons, some 'no want shower', cum & goes also adhere to this rule, & yes they do come back for more

[latintopxxx]

Crudeness plays no part, as the saying goes you catch more flies with honey than with vinegar, all my "bargaining" is done with a smile and a bit of banter; I certainly don't stand on the street corner arms askew screeching at the boys.

Point I'm making is that I know from personal experience that some of the rates quoted by the moral police are absurd, furthermore I don't buy into the concept that because its prostitution you somehow should feel obliged to pay more; I see mo difference between hiring someone to polish my floors or my balls!!

Others may beg to differ, and that is their prerogative, and no offense is taken, makes for lively debate, but please no climbing onto the moral high horse, totally incongruous.

Some carry on about "respect", what is one supposed to do? Take of my hat when I addess them? Address them as sir?

The respect I give them extends to the fact that I pay what was agreed if they supply an adequate service. Simple! If the service is sub-par I deduct an appropriate amount, tell them why and ask them to leave; in fact I'm doing all you tree hugging, cardigan wearing, do gooders a huge favour, training the rent boys to provide the agreed service.

Simply I turn the old saying around "no honey...no money" direct, to the point and very clear.

[cdnmatt]

I guess it all just depends on who you are, and your personality. If you're content in your own skin by bartering with humans for their own bodies at the lowest possible prices, and are capable of sleeping with yourself at night knowing that, then by all means, go for it. We all know this world is a pretty messed up place as is, so it hardly matters any.

I don't know why, but I don't think I could do it though. Chatting with some guy on the street, and saying, "What?!? $30 for your ass for two hours? No way, $18 max! Take it or leave it!". I'm sorry, but I just really can't see myself doing that. Really, I wouldn't be able to sleep with myself at night knowing I did that to my fellow human. Not to mention, if I did that, what would I think while lying on my death bed, taking my last breaths of air? "Damn, was I ever an asshole during this life. I royally screwed that up.". I don't want that.

To each their own though...

[latintopxxx]

The delta in our thought process is the fact that you equate prostitution with "wrong"!!! I have no guilt trips what so ever. Labour is labour, as I stated, I see no difference between polishing my floors or getting me off; its a service!

I'm a self employed contractor and due to the financial crisis have had to drop my rates in order to maintain my customer base, I'm still carrying out exactly the same function for 20% less, and my Asian customers were the very first to take advantage of the downturn to drive my rates down, even though most of them were not affected unlike my European customer base; certainly no one felt sorry for me or gave me a break, and frankly I don't expect them to; glad they gave me the opportunity to re-tender for the business; survival of the fittest!

cdnmat, would you still frequent a local family run restaurant knowing that 2 doors down there was an equally as good restaurant but 20% cheaper??

[cdnmatt]

No, this has nothing to do with prostitution. I've had some absolutely amazing times going to Sunnee every night, drinking, and picking up a prostitute, then doing it all over again the next day. Was great! No qualms about it at all. This has to do with treating your fellow human the way you'd like to be treated.

I'm self employed myself, and have been since I was 19. Contractor right now, but had a small company going for five years before, had my employees, clients flying me around North America, etc. I have to disagree with basically everything you said. Again, treat people the way you want to be treated. I take good care of my guys, and in return, they always take good care of me.

I might not be able to quantify the benefits of me going that extra mile, but it definitely pays off. For example, none of my clients will ever leave me, and I know that. I have their full trust and respect, making my job much easier, without any red tape. If I had a decent business proposal that was aligned with their interests, I bet the majority of them would be willing to go into it with me, simply because they know I'm a good guy, they like working with me, and they know I'm honest and fair. Or for another example, even after 4 years of selling my company, I still have customers searching me out on Google, Skype, Facebook, etc., looking to work with me again. Can you say the same for yourself? My guess is your clients would have no qualms in dropping you, because you've proved that you'd do the same to them.

Again, it all depends on how you look at it, and your personality. You seem to view things in a very linear fashion, where you simply want to get from point A or B as quickly as possible, for as cheap as possible. You don't seem to think of the implications, or side-benefits. If that makes you happy though, by all means, go for it. Just don't expect too many people to go out of their way for you.

[Beachlover]

I agree... I run a business and after much pain (I'm still learning) we've learnt to let go of the clients where the relationship is just take/push take/push take/push... They're not worth servicing. We made the mistake of taking on some of these last year in the midst of the horrible desert of work created by the GFC but funnily enough have since dropped most of them. They were the 20% of clients causing 80% of my headaches.

These are the clients who try to screw us on every dollar... try to bully us into doing more work than agreed... play poor... and do things on whim. You get to know of these clients in the industry after a while. They're continually switching suppliers... regular disputes and legal fights... they can never get a stable long term relationship with a supplier they're happy with. And their business performance suffers because of this. You have to wonder why they don't realise they are the problem and not everyone else and correct their bahaviour.

I guess they think "their way" works... despite the stress of battling with their suppliers and serious setbacks of continually switching... they think they're doing better than all the other mugs out there... always hunting for a better deal.

Then there are the clients who we have a fair and mutually beneficial relationship with. They've been with us for years. They get approached by suppliers who are cheaper and promise to be better but they choose to stay with us. They're happy to pay whatever we quote. We don't rip them off. They know they're getting good value. And we always go the extra mile to take care of them as long as it's commercially viable. They're relaxed and in control... their business is performing well.

Guys,

I'm not sure that the universe of Western dealings track tightly with those of the prostitution ones of our wonderful Land of Smiles. Seems oranges to apples here. I love both Matt and BL, but you're asking Latin to set aside the 'mask' he wears for dealing with street boys in Bangkok and Sunee and don a completely different one so he can digest how we deal with our Western business clients.

Isn't this a case where perhaps our sensibilities of the West are bleeding into our primal, somewhat decadent sexual lust ones of the East?

Is it fair to raise up Latin's sexual hunting moves to a Western business perspective?

JL

[latintopxxx]

In all fairness to Matt and BL (can't believe I'm saying this) I did open up this can of worms by mentioning my business challenges; guess I can conclude that we have diffderences in opinion where rent boys are concerned and thats probably a good thing as if we were all in agreement it would be a very McDonalds world out there...

In all fairness to Matt and BL (can't believe I'm saying this) I did open up this can of worms by mentioning my business challenges; guess I can conclude that we have diffderences in opinion where rent boys are concerned and thats probably a good thing as if we were all in agreement it would be a very McDonalds world out there...

OH....MC DONALD'S THAI BOYS...ahhhhhhh...don't get me started. Fry short or over, they are undeniably cute...

[giggsy]

cdnmat, would you still frequent a local family run restaurant knowing that 2 doors down there was an equally as good restaurant but 20% cheaper??

:sign3: I think I go with latintop on this.I never tip more then 8 inches unless they beg then sometimes I will give them the whole 12 inches..

[Diec]

I also run my own successful business. My clients simply adore me and would never think of changing to another company. I may not be the cheapest but my clients know they will get quality work. Now these prostitutes on the other hand, if they negotiate and accept 500 baht for a quickie, who is anyone to say other wise? Those little prostitutes make a pretty darn good living selling their ass. Now throw in a farang who sends them money on a monthly basis and they are set to go!

[giggsy]

I also run my own successful business.

Just phoned the UK and my sister says I have recieved a cheque for ┬г100 (4 weeks cold weather payments) who says you don't get something for nothing in this life.. :glasses7:

[Beachlover]

if we were all in agreement it would be a very McDonalds world out there...

Very true and I agree...

[Beachlover]

Just phoned the UK and my sister says I have recieved a cheque for ┬г100 (4 weeks cold weather payments) who says you don't get something for nothing in this life.. :glasses7:

http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/MoneyTaxAnd ... G_10018668 (http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/MoneyTaxAndBenefits/BenefitsTaxCreditsAndOtherSupport/Inretirement/DG_10018668)

Cold weather payments for low income earners?! That's absurd!

LOL... and you were in Thailand all this time. ROFL... bastard.

Well, it's warm and sunny where I am anyway. Only, I'm in an office 11 hrs a day.

Just phoned the UK and my sister says I have recieved a cheque for ┬г100 (4 weeks cold weather payments) who says you don't get something for nothing in this life.. :glasses7:

Didn't you mention something about the Fraud Squad at one point?

:protest: :protest: :protest: :protest:

[giggsy]

Just phoned the UK and my sister says I have recieved a cheque for ┬г100 (4 weeks cold weather payments) who says you don't get something for nothing in this life.. :glasses7:

Didn't you mention something about the Fraud Squad at one point?

:protest: :protest: :protest: :protest:

I know them all personally..Jack Reagan,George Carter,Frank Haskins,Copper Pheel. etc
But they are all a bit busy catching out MPs to bother with us in Thailand.