Why won't Thais sit beside foreigners?

[wowpow]

Bangkok Post letters:

Do any of your readers get the same feeling as I do when they travel on the BTS and MRT systems. I find that Thai people are reluctant to sit next to foreigners on the transport system. The seat next to me is the last to be filled nine times out of ten. Sometimes people would rather stand than sit in the seat next to mine.

I shower many times a day. I wear deodorant and sometimes after-shave. I have even changed the smells to see if it was that, but I know it must go deeper than that. Are Thai people racist? I have watched the same happen to other foreigners so I know it is not just me.

Now it has become a game for me. I like to sit right in the middle of the seating and watch to see how long it is before the seats next to me are occupied. Does this happen to anyone else?

KEITH DIXON

[mikelele-old]

I don't think that the Thais are racist at all... Asians in general have a certain sensibility that is rather hard to explain. It has to do with respect and not disturbing you *a foreigner* and has much to do with our cultural self image. You also have to understand that while some Asian cultures can be proud, there is also a deep seated sensibility of meekness and subservience too, and this is evident in the more provincial people of some asian countries. The more western asians, or the city-dwellers are less likely to exhibit this cultural trait.

So really, it is more out of respect and meekness that they do not sit next to you. There is a kind of familiarity that asians share with one another - and to sit next to a foreigner who is a complete stranger would make them feel that they are being inappropriately familiar towards you, and in their eyes that is an action on their part that may appear to be too forward.

But I can almost guarantee that if you gestured to anyone of those people that the seat is available - they would sit next to you - or if not, you would probably get a huge grin, a wai and a gracious decline. Either way, no malice at all.

Mikelele: I could not agree more with your response. My experience was the same after living in Thailand for a period of time.

Mikelele: I could not agree more with your response. My experience was the same after living in Thailand for a period of time.I could not agree less. Thais are racist (based on my 16 years of living here). Another manifestation, mentioned in other threads, is that many Thais won't buy real estate where they know a Westerner has been the previous owner (or even tenant)

I've never heard that one, Homintern. I currently have a property on the market, and have sensed no reticence among Thais to come view it.

I also agree with Mikele's assessment of the seating thing. It is out of deference, not hate.

I also agree with Mikele's assessment of the seating thing. It is out of deference, not hate.Why infer that racism is based on hate? It is merely based on a dislike of people of a different race for all sorts of reasons. I, being a white middle-aged man, am inevitably a complete racist (and ageist too, apparently), and think Indians resident in the subcontinent have no regard for body odour, for example, and I avoid them where possible. It has nothing to do with hatred. It is, so I'm told, a racist attitude since it generalises about a group of people based solely on their ethnicity. I'm sure our latest resident politically-correct theoretician and young know-all, Cedric, will be able to tear himself away from reality television shows sufficiently long enough to confirm that that is what racism means

I've never heard that one, Homintern. I currently have a property on the market, and have sensed no reticence among Thais to come view it.I fall back on my favourite Bangkok commentator for that one (but I've seen it said elsewhere). In his column for 27/6/2004 Stickman, writing about why he won't buy property in Thailand, had this to say
There are definite perceptions amongst sectors of the Thai population about second hand places. A lot of Thais simply don't want to buy second hand, period. And the fact that a farang may have lived there is a negative perception to many Thais. Yeah, really! The superstitious nature of the locals also means that if one of any number of events happen, then suddenly your property is no longer somewhere they would buy.

[bucknaway]

I have not experienced any of that on the sky-train. I am very sensitive about my space and being touched in crowds... And on the sky-train and in the subway the Thai had no problem at all sitting next to me when other seats were available.


I remember it so clear because I love to tease my friend there and I was poking him in the side so that he would jump but no one would know I was doing anything to cause him to jump. He would poke me in return and I would jump because I am very ticklish. On several instances, a Thai person would sit next to me and end our fun... Sometimes a girl and sometimes a guy.

Also keep in mind that sometimes the people peek at me, children gaze/stare at me, girls get off the train and say something in Thai to me and in Phuket the girls pinch me as I walk by.... My friend teases me about the attention I get so I don't know how I fit into the equation.

Now with my gym progress... well... progressing as it is, I am excited and apprehensive to how I will be received in Thailand.

Also keep in mind that sometimes the people peek at me, children gaze/stare at me, girls get off the train and say something in Thai to me and in Phuket the girls pinch me as I walk by.... My friend teases me about the attention I get so I don't know how I fit into the equation.More racism I'm afraid bucky. But this time it's because they all know about your membership of the H List (since you're a black man)

I would suggest that actions or deeds or words directly or indirectly expressed against someone due to the colour of their skin is normally considered racist. However, it is also normally backed up by malisciousness borne from the culture in which individuals are raised, where fear or loathing or hatred of a group are the norm.

I have been in the company of some Thai people who, at different times, have expressed dislike for people who are black, (some) whites, people from other parts of Asia, from within Thailand, from different regions within Thailand and from specific countries (Japan, Germany and sometimes even dear olde' England, cripes!). It is sometimes hard to get a clear understanding of the reactions of Thai's to certain groups and when questioned the answer generally comes back as 'I just not like'.

There is no 'loathing', there is no 'hatred' and there is no 'fear', perhaps because this is not the way the Lord Budha would wish them to act or think. So is a personal dislike in this situation racist?

Talking of being racist! Can I just say that as a believer in a free and open Europe, a true European (whatever that means), I do find the French annoying. I was in a cafe the other day (having a quiet decaf, grande, low fat, low sugar, iced vanilla latte, no cream on top please) when in trapes 4 early/mid twenties Frenchies, all good looking, all bronzed adonis' all as loud and brash and ignorant as you would expect of an English tourist on there annual two week vacation to Torre Molinos (or wherever). They proceeded to do the usual 'speak slowly' routine and click their fingers at the barrista for attention, point at half a dozen things on the menu without indicating what they wanted whilst 'talking' in raised voices which disturbed my English sensibilities. I was about to say that they were even more boorish and obnoxious than the Americans or the Ozzies, which of course they are, but at least the Americans and especially the Ozzies have a certain warmth and friendliness that makes them ever so much more likeable (Somebody still loves you Mr Sydney).

I seem to have lost my train of thought, so having nuthink more to say and probably having offended most of the board's readers, I will kiss you all goodnight xxx

My Thai friend always tell me that if he sits next to a farang, people will always assume that he's a money boy and if a sweet young female sits next to you, she might be assumed to be a call girl. So that's most probably the reason.
Anyway, it will be so much more comfortable to get 2 or 3 seats to yourself.....don't you agree? :cheers:

[cottmann]

I am a racist, too!
I would prefer not to sit next to a falang on the Skytrain or the MRT. I would definitely prefer to sit next to some cute young well-dressed Thai guy than next to an overweight, lightly-washed foreigner who has committed all the fashion faux pas identifed by Surfcrest.

I wholly agree with you about the French. But have you ever wondered why they go on and on and on and on and on untill your ears fall off or you chop their heads off. Well its because they have a very limited vocabulary and have to say every-thing ten times to make a point that you or I can do in one brief sentence. Take a look at a French dictionary it is very miserly and thin.
The other thing about the French is they tend to be tacky. They like to glue their sunglasses to the top of the head and flash the brand and they like very much over the top garish designer label cloths. All very new money, peasants that they all really are.

I dont hate the French, I dont have that much time to waist on them. Would I be considered racist?

"Stereotypes exist because there are people like that."

I rather agree with rustee--And find the obverse true: Seems every time a Thai, boy or girl, sits next to me in a sorng tau before long they smile and say, "Okay, I go...you?"

So far as ethnic dislikes, I'm willing to give anyone a chance; if I shunned people because of things like race or nationality I'd certainly be the poorer.
However; I do find vegetarians (I refuse to say, 'vegans') hard to stomach. They're as bad as religious fanatics: If they can't convert you they insult you or try to make you feel guilty for eating (delicious) animals. I don't do guilt--And that usually pisses them off.
If they think vegetables are so wonderful (Which they are.) why do they buy all this imitation-meat stuff?...Vegetable burgers or tofu (Ugh!) in the shape of steaks and chops? And tofutty! Oh, for christ sake!

[Surfcrest]

I tend to agree with Rustee as well.

Another concern may be that you might start speaking to them.
Having to speak back to you in English might make them feel uncomfortable, especially while in public.

Nice to see my favorite BFOC racist pal has't changed any.
Happy Songkran Colonel!

Surfcrest

[bucknaway]

I have been told by many Thai that they never like black but they like me... I think there tends to be something lost in their translation from thought to speech...

Hmmm, that is interesting, B.
I wonder if they are expressing their negative feelings towards Africans, and differentiating you as being an African American, as happens in a lot of countries.

[bucknaway]

That is possible. Many times the guys on gay.com tell me they like black guys and I told many that there are many black guys in Bangkok and tell them I heard of an area that has many black guys but they counter that they like American black and is easy to tell the difference...

[cottmann]

[quote="Edith"][color=darkblue]...However; I do find vegetarians (I refuse to say, 'vegans') hard to stomach...."

A whole new meaning to "eating vegetarian"?

[color=darkblue]...However; I do find vegetarians (I refuse to say, 'vegans') hard to stomach...."

A whole new meaning to "eating vegetarian"?

They're best braised in wine (To remove the cabbage taste & smell.) or follow any recipe for goose. may I suggest a nice Cassoulet D'Oie.

Which reminds me; a boy came begging while Num & I were sitting at an outdoor caf├й.
He said he needed, 'oie.'
All I could think of was, 'goose'--
So I goosed him...
and he was mad as hell!
"Now what!" I wondered.
Num told me he meant, 'petrol.'
Petrol!
I know goose is greasy but this was the first I'd heard Thai run their motorbikes on it.
They must need to clean their plugs & points quite often.
I num I once knew uses chicken fat (schmaltz) as a hair dressing.
I wonder what else they use it for?...
:sex: